13:15 Right! Real "Burn in" seems to happen when the pads wear out and change over time from human sweat and oils and general wear and tear alters them over time, which then changes the sound. Judging from how much headphone sound can change when changing pads this seems the most likely. Also, people get used to certain sound signatures over time, the headphone itself is not being burned in but burning in the listener's brain.
Hey there, long comment but all out of appreciation: I love the scientific and intelligent perspective you bring to hifi reviews, comparisons, and tests. By far the best reviewer for the intellectual hifi enthusiast. One thing though... As a professional classical musician I am obligated to bring up that the word "Scherzo" is pronounced [scare-tso] (not skurzo). It's an Italian musical form. I know it's in the name of one of your regularly referenced pieces from the Star Wars soundtrack, and I wouldn't want you turning away any pretentious elitist classical music nerds (like myself) who dismiss the high quality content you provide just because of a mispronunciation. That'll bring my enjoyment of your videos from 99.9% to a full 100%. Keep doing what you're doing. Also, I bought the hi-x55 off your review and they've made my professional production MUCH easier. I'm looking to get a contrasting pair of warm open back headphones for beautiful pleasure listening to classical/soundtracks (something with clear, pronounced, but not mushy, bass). Any suggestions?
(I have an ADI-2 DAC that I listen and produce through, as well as a vintage McIntosh amp that has a low impedance headphone port that I use to shake things up a bit)
Lol, thanks for the correction. I'll try to implement it in the future--though I can't promise I'll succeed. As for an open-back, warm headphone: consider the Base Audio G12; it has a very resounding bass for an open back, good detail, and a balanced sound signature. The one problem is the earpads; you'll need to invest in the Grado G-cush earpads, which have a marginal effect on the sound (decreases the bass slightly). If you do buy the G-cush earpads, don't go for the cheap knockoff; I did that originally and they were sub-par. Another option is the Sivga Phoenix. I think the G12 is probably a little clearer than the Phoenix, and the G12 is a little more neutral overall. The Phoenix also suffers for earpad issues, but you can't swap them. If you can find it, the HD579 is an excellent open-back headphone. The bass is elevated, though sub-bass and mid-bass meld. The mids are robust and forward, and treble is well-controlled and fairly neutral. If you want the planar route, then I think the M1570 is a great option. It has a balanced sound signature, wide soundstage, above-average detail, excellent treble extension without harshness. They're pretty big and cumbersome. Personally, I think the G12 is my favorite option out of all of these. The sound is pretty unique and I love supporting small companies. The earpads are the biggest problem, unfortunately, and if you dislike Grado earpads, then this headphone is not for you.
@@NoThemeReviews I agree the Sivga pads are a bit of an issue, and there didn’t seem to be any space for anything thicker than the stock pad. I wound up trying the pad that came on my Fostex TH909. They were thick enough that my ear didn’t hit the driver grill, but thin enough to fit. It doesn’t look pretty, but they don’t fall off and don’t seem to affect the sound.
Great video highlighting the problems with supposed burn in. Personally, I ALMOST never have found any difference in headphones over time due to burn in - I say almost because one stands out in my mind and that’s the Sennheiser HD 700, which out of the box brand new FOR THE FIRST FEW MINUTES or so sounded very harsh to me but then suddenly it seemed to “settle” into what I consistently hear now. I had never experienced that before and don’t recall ever hearing that since, and I’ve owned over 100 headphones (not even counting in-ears), so I tend to think it is GENERALLY not a real thing, but even when it is, I suspect it literally is a matter of something physical which literally settles into stasis within a few minutes rather than some magic that happens over tens or even hundreds of hours - that’s my experience. 🤗
That’s odd. I would think that something like this would be performed at the build site using selected sources, etc. Then the consumer gets the product as it will/should be. Unless it’s a tactic to counter those who are unimpressed at first listen?
I think so. No wonder companies don’t tell you what the changes from burn in will be. Dac Clark says the sound “settles down”-which means nothing. It’s almost as if they’re acknowledging their headphones sound weird but begging you not to judge them.
Next time if I buy new headphones, I shall use the burn-in statement as a deal-breaker to eliminate a company from my purchase list, unless there is new scientific proof on this. . . . hmm I can only find 3 companies which explicitly do not insist that headphones need burn in: 1. Sennheiser - en-au.sennheiser.com/what-is-sennheisers-stance-on-burn-in-theory#:~:text=At%20Sennheiser%20we%20do%20not,moment%20they%20are%20plugged%20in. 2. taotronics - blog.taotronics.com/headphones/burn-in-headphones/ 3. beyerdynamic - support.beyerdynamic.com/hc/en-us/articles/201875262-Do-I-need-to-burn-in-my-headphones-#:~:text=It%20is%20not%20absolutely%20necessary%20to%20burn%20in%20headphones.&text=Even%20without%20a%20burning%20in,bit%20softer%20in%20the%20highs. Welp, I guess the list is too short for my liking >
@@Raterex Unfortunately, none of them actually say that burn-in is myth. It is tiresome to find companies refusing to simply make a definitive statement against burn-in. There's absolutely no evidence of the type of changes audiofools keep blathering about--but somehow we're expected to keep an open mind.
My DC A2C are soooooo amazing - especially for Metal and Death Metal. Paired with my RME ADI-2 FS DAC and Garage1217 Projector Ember 2 amp with a Ken-Rad Tube, it's a literal dream.
Great video, and you hit the nail on the head. Your "sound memory" is super short, so unless you listen to something specific, note how it specifically sounds, burn in, and then note how the exact same passage(s) sound (like you did) then all these burn in impressions are bunk, because that's all they are - impressions. It is MUCH more likely that YOU are getting used to the sound of the headphones rather than the sound coming out of the headphones is changing.
@@NoThemeReviews Hell, it happens to me sometimes when I put on a set of headphones I haven't used in a while. Just today I put on my Dekoni Blues after not using them for a couple weeks and thought, gee, these sound a little muddy and dull, but then after two or three songs I was digging them again, just like I remembered. I think your ears/brain adjusts to what you are hearing more than people admit.
@@redstang5150 I think you hit the nail on the head. I own the open back model of the AEON X. I really like it for listening to female vocals or acoustic music. If I go on an extended spree of listening to such music and then switch to my LCD-2 the difference in sound is immediate, and then to put on the HD-600 same thing, and in fact it takes a bit of time to listen to them before re-discovering, sort of, what it was I really enjoy about the HD-600. Of course the same thing occurs with all of my somewhat smaller collection of cans. I've never personally bought into the ideas of "burn in" or the belief in ridiculously expensive cables. Upgrades are fine to me if done out of need, i.e. getting a longer or more durable cable. This other stuff IMO is snake oil. There's just no way that 100-200 hours of "burn-in" time is going to up the bass to the level of the LCD-2, it's mainly a period of learning a new product and it's qualities. And the notion that a $500 cable will transform a headphone to the next level? LOL Puh-lease!
I noticed a burn in effect on my HD800s. In the beginning the highs were very metallic for me, it was so extreme that I sometimes had the feeling to taste metal. But since I liked a lot about the headphones, I started with eq. But this has made the soundstage smaller. So I did without eq and only used the HD800s for selected music. After a few days I could hear everything with the HD800s and the metallic sound was gone. I'm not saying that the HD800s need a burn in, it is very likely that my ears have used the dark headphones like the HD-6XX and NightHawk to keep the burn in process.
I spoke to a Neumann engineer and they all said that modern speaker designs at least for the high end market, don't really need a burn/break-in. He straight up said that burn in was required only on poorly made products decades ago. I believe that they even published research on their website for all to read a few years back. Claiming that a speaker or headphone is designed to be burned it, makes absolutely zero sense if you think about it. Why design it that way when you don't have to? What is the point? It doesn't make sense to the point where I have to believe in a conspiracy to force people to get used to the headphones past their returning point. I am sorry to all those who still believe in burn in. But I prefer to believe the folks who not only tested it to the highest level, but also made it repeatable and published their finding for free online.
Okay, I have the Sendy Aiva, These were pretty harsh in the top end. Almost unbearable. I did burn them in for a few days. I did not use it in those days. It did become less harsh. But what is burn-in. I just think pushing the drivers a lot to make the movement better of the driver and form them a bit. I did do it far over my normal listening level. So lvl 44 on my aune normal to max listening level. So I burned in about 50% more.. so around lvl 66. It worked for me.
why does your voice cadence sound off in this video...like you sped it up. It sounds weird. I have watch many of your reviews and this one does'nt sound like your usual tone.. Very choppy and clipped sounding...
Try the A2C with an RME ADI-2 FS DAC feeding a Garage1217 Projector Ember 2 amp with a Ken-Rad Tube - it will completely change how you see these headphones.
Focal is another company that seems to believe heavily in burn in. In my experience with their headphones the only thing that improved over time was the seal of the pads on my head, which of course made a difference in sound. Regardless, their headphones sound good to my ears right out of the box, so it is unlikely that they are using burn in as an excuse for anything.
I bought the denon d7200 after watching reviews and your review is spot on how they sound, and they sound wonderful, thanks I wanted to ask if these aeon 2 closed an upgrade over them, so i can save some money for upgrade
I don’t think so. The Aeons are a very dark sounding headphone with narrow soundstage and aren’t particularly detailed or clear. You can tune some of that with the DCA tuning pads, but it’s all trial and error. DCA gets far too much hype, much like Audeze.
Psychological burning (expectation bias ?) is way more evident than the (almost) bullshit one. But some drivers might need some burning depending on how they are made. I'm pretty sure the companies know well about psychoburning, it's just a shame that they do not advertise it. It would me more honest.
After following the recommendation of the Hifiman HE-400i manual of 150 hours of break-in, I definitely don't believe in break-in. There was no difference at all from before.
I don't have any plans to do that, but if Apos or someone else sends me the RT, I'll be happy to review it. Of course, if the RT is exactly the same as the original Aeon, then I likely would not have a favorable opinion of it.
@@NoThemeReviews what I’ve heard is that the RT closed definitely is improved over the original closed but not quite to the level of the 2 - but at $499 it makes it a serious consideration for me.
I liked my aeon opens pretty much immediately. I would imagine that the drivers to “burn in” and possibly move better after? Maybe? But I don’t think there is a real audible difference. Maybe, just maybe if anything the speed and decay may change slightly as the drivers burn in but I doubt that would even be very much noticeable. I think that brain burn in is real because you’ll adjust and learn to like a certain FR as you listen more to a headphone. Then when you switch to another headphone for a while then back to one, it’ll appear to sound different for a little bit as you readjust. But I’ve never really believed in actual driver burn in. That’s my 2 cents
Ahh...I know how to change the bias of ppl who keep saying that burn in makes their headphones soo much better...Just make sure that they cannot take off their headphones during the 100 hours burn in (i.e. eat, sleep, going about the day's tasks). Let's see if they still love their headphones after that. ;)
From a mechanical perspective it's conceivable that there could be a "stretching" of the mylar in a planar for example, after x amount of time and then it's at "operably stretched" this may or may not have any perceptible change to sound... Of course, if burn in is true then that also means that your driver's are constantly degrading and if under 100 hours supposedly changes the sound noticably then that also means every 100 hours they will sound different (potentially).... So what then, in 600 hours they are loose and uncontrolled sounding?!? Lolol I do believe there is a very rapid "break in"with some types of drivers. Maybe as rapidly as a few minutes even..I don't believe after let's say 30 minutes of listening, anything is going to drastically change though.
@@NoThemeReviews Dang, you just missed them on Amazon for $60 off two weeks ago! I used Keepa website to track it. Hopefully they’ll go on sale again. I’ll eagerly wait for your review!
A ton: M1070, M1570, Pheonix, X55, Avantone Planar, original pre-fazor LCD-2, MDR-MA100 and MA900, Focal Elex, Base Audio G12, Rane RH-2, Gold Planar GL1000, Hifiman HE5se, T1 and T5p 2nd Gens, DT880, DT770, Marshall Monitor, Meze 99 Classic, X2HR, HR5 and HR5C, L2, M1 Mk2, HD6xx, HD579, NDH20, S4 and S4R...it's a very long list.
@@NoThemeReviews it doesn’t seem you have heard many or liked many headphones 🤪 I’m surprised a little at the Marshall Monitor mention, I wanted to like those and I did like them “okay enough” but they faded away for me
I found that typical music playing at 30%+ level have no noticeable change even burning in even after days. It only works when you are running a series of combination of hard sine sweeps and and pink noise. If you can’t hear your headphone 1-2 rooms away while running this burn in with sine sweep, you are probably not burning it in hard enough. I burned in a Ether CX recently. I did a very similar test of what you did in this video, listen to it for a few hours to get an impression (of what I don’t like) then started to run these hard burn in. After a few days, I had a listen, with no noticeable change, so I turned up the volume more. After a few more days, (around 100 hours) I took a listen, yep! There’s the change. Bass was definitely elevated, sound stage increased. They are not dramatic, but enough to make me not hate the headphone. So before you write off on burning in, I’d modify the experiment with harder series of sound designed to stretch the membranes and with volume much higher than you are currently think your headphone can handle. Rule of thumb: If you can sleep while you are burning in the headphone in another room in the open, you are not burning it in at all. th-cam.com/video/xUxQ3O7h69M/w-d-xo.html This one works pretty well for me.
Can you make a video comparing sivga phoenix with various other headphones in that price range including the nighthawks. I need your opinion!!! (I already saw the unboxing btw) :3
There is no burn-in, there is only our brain adjusting to the sound of headphones, the only "burn-in" that changes the sound are the pads that over time adjust to the shape of our heads and thus making perfect seal for optimized listening. Simple proof, put new original foamies on Porta Pros (which didn't had their foamies changed for i.e. a year), they will immediately change sound.
I saw it, but he only uses 2 AKG headphones, not 6 - like No Theme Reviews suggests. Did Till talk about the pads being exactly the same on both headphones? (I don't remember him mentioning it, but that was a long time ago). I think the main reason No Theme Reviews suggests using 6 headphones - is that there might be slight sonic differences between the different batches of the same headphones.
Yup, that's correct. I just pulled 6 out of thin air, but the idea is exactly as you suggest: to control for small sound variances among units. I think Tyll's video is worth considering, if for nothing else than another perspective.
@@NoThemeReviews It was a joke, but I wanted to say that I have an aeon, and the sound has changed over time, now they have more mids than when I bought new ones. This is immediately noticeable, since all this time I compared with Grado. Naturally, I did not take measurements, I just feel it.
Burn in is, from an engineering standpoint, complete and utter nonsense. Might as well start drinking audio enhancement water and wearing silver audio enhancing socks -.-
awesome! been waiting for this video since i saw your community post referencing burn-in
where's the community post?
@@annelouisemendoza394 th-cam.com/users/postUgwFaMpG1QhAMtoe4ah4AaABCQ
13:15 Right! Real "Burn in" seems to happen when the pads wear out and change over time from human sweat and oils and general wear and tear alters them over time, which then changes the sound. Judging from how much headphone sound can change when changing pads this seems the most likely. Also, people get used to certain sound signatures over time, the headphone itself is not being burned in but burning in the listener's brain.
What does “burning in the listener’s brain” mean?
Such a good idea for a video -- and well stated conclusions and caveats to those conclusions. Bravo.
Hey there, long comment but all out of appreciation:
I love the scientific and intelligent perspective you bring to hifi reviews, comparisons, and tests. By far the best reviewer for the intellectual hifi enthusiast. One thing though...
As a professional classical musician I am obligated to bring up that the word "Scherzo" is pronounced [scare-tso] (not skurzo). It's an Italian musical form. I know it's in the name of one of your regularly referenced pieces from the Star Wars soundtrack, and I wouldn't want you turning away any pretentious elitist classical music nerds (like myself) who dismiss the high quality content you provide just because of a mispronunciation. That'll bring my enjoyment of your videos from 99.9% to a full 100%.
Keep doing what you're doing. Also, I bought the hi-x55 off your review and they've made my professional production MUCH easier. I'm looking to get a contrasting pair of warm open back headphones for beautiful pleasure listening to classical/soundtracks (something with clear, pronounced, but not mushy, bass). Any suggestions?
(I have an ADI-2 DAC that I listen and produce through, as well as a vintage McIntosh amp that has a low impedance headphone port that I use to shake things up a bit)
Lol, thanks for the correction. I'll try to implement it in the future--though I can't promise I'll succeed. As for an open-back, warm headphone: consider the Base Audio G12; it has a very resounding bass for an open back, good detail, and a balanced sound signature. The one problem is the earpads; you'll need to invest in the Grado G-cush earpads, which have a marginal effect on the sound (decreases the bass slightly). If you do buy the G-cush earpads, don't go for the cheap knockoff; I did that originally and they were sub-par.
Another option is the Sivga Phoenix. I think the G12 is probably a little clearer than the Phoenix, and the G12 is a little more neutral overall. The Phoenix also suffers for earpad issues, but you can't swap them.
If you can find it, the HD579 is an excellent open-back headphone. The bass is elevated, though sub-bass and mid-bass meld. The mids are robust and forward, and treble is well-controlled and fairly neutral.
If you want the planar route, then I think the M1570 is a great option. It has a balanced sound signature, wide soundstage, above-average detail, excellent treble extension without harshness. They're pretty big and cumbersome.
Personally, I think the G12 is my favorite option out of all of these. The sound is pretty unique and I love supporting small companies. The earpads are the biggest problem, unfortunately, and if you dislike Grado earpads, then this headphone is not for you.
@@NoThemeReviews Thanks so much for the quick response. Again, your attention to honesty is astounding and appreciated!
@@NoThemeReviews I agree the Sivga pads are a bit of an issue, and there didn’t seem to be any space for anything thicker than the stock pad. I wound up trying the pad that came on my Fostex TH909. They were thick enough that my ear didn’t hit the driver grill, but thin enough to fit. It doesn’t look pretty, but they don’t fall off and don’t seem to affect the sound.
Great video highlighting the problems with supposed burn in. Personally, I ALMOST never have found any difference in headphones over time due to burn in - I say almost because one stands out in my mind and that’s the Sennheiser HD 700, which out of the box brand new FOR THE FIRST FEW MINUTES or so sounded very harsh to me but then suddenly it seemed to “settle” into what I consistently hear now.
I had never experienced that before and don’t recall ever hearing that since, and I’ve owned over 100 headphones (not even counting in-ears), so I tend to think it is GENERALLY not a real thing, but even when it is, I suspect it literally is a matter of something physical which literally settles into stasis within a few minutes rather than some magic that happens over tens or even hundreds of hours - that’s my experience. 🤗
That’s odd. I would think that something like this would be performed at the build site using selected sources, etc. Then the consumer gets the product as it will/should be. Unless it’s a tactic to counter those who are unimpressed at first listen?
I think so. No wonder companies don’t tell you what the changes from burn in will be. Dac Clark says the sound “settles down”-which means nothing. It’s almost as if they’re acknowledging their headphones sound weird but begging you not to judge them.
Next time if I buy new headphones, I shall use the burn-in statement as a deal-breaker to eliminate a company from my purchase list, unless there is new scientific proof on this.
.
.
.
hmm I can only find 3 companies which explicitly do not insist that headphones need burn in:
1. Sennheiser - en-au.sennheiser.com/what-is-sennheisers-stance-on-burn-in-theory#:~:text=At%20Sennheiser%20we%20do%20not,moment%20they%20are%20plugged%20in.
2. taotronics - blog.taotronics.com/headphones/burn-in-headphones/
3. beyerdynamic - support.beyerdynamic.com/hc/en-us/articles/201875262-Do-I-need-to-burn-in-my-headphones-#:~:text=It%20is%20not%20absolutely%20necessary%20to%20burn%20in%20headphones.&text=Even%20without%20a%20burning%20in,bit%20softer%20in%20the%20highs.
Welp, I guess the list is too short for my liking >
@@Raterex Unfortunately, none of them actually say that burn-in is myth. It is tiresome to find companies refusing to simply make a definitive statement against burn-in. There's absolutely no evidence of the type of changes audiofools keep blathering about--but somehow we're expected to keep an open mind.
My DC A2C are soooooo amazing - especially for Metal and Death Metal. Paired with my RME ADI-2 FS DAC and Garage1217 Projector Ember 2 amp with a Ken-Rad Tube, it's a literal dream.
Great video, and you hit the nail on the head. Your "sound memory" is super short, so unless you listen to something specific, note how it specifically sounds, burn in, and then note how the exact same passage(s) sound (like you did) then all these burn in impressions are bunk, because that's all they are - impressions. It is MUCH more likely that YOU are getting used to the sound of the headphones rather than the sound coming out of the headphones is changing.
Yes!
@@NoThemeReviews Hell, it happens to me sometimes when I put on a set of headphones I haven't used in a while. Just today I put on my Dekoni Blues after not using them for a couple weeks and thought, gee, these sound a little muddy and dull, but then after two or three songs I was digging them again, just like I remembered. I think your ears/brain adjusts to what you are hearing more than people admit.
@@redstang5150 I think you hit the nail on the head. I own the open back model of the AEON X. I really like it for listening to female vocals or acoustic music. If I go on an extended spree of listening to such music and then switch to my LCD-2 the difference in sound is immediate, and then to put on the HD-600 same thing, and in fact it takes a bit of time to listen to them before re-discovering, sort of, what it was I really enjoy about the HD-600. Of course the same thing occurs with all of my somewhat smaller collection of cans. I've never personally bought into the ideas of "burn in" or the belief in ridiculously expensive cables. Upgrades are fine to me if done out of need, i.e. getting a longer or more durable cable. This other stuff IMO is snake oil. There's just no way that 100-200 hours of "burn-in" time is going to up the bass to the level of the LCD-2, it's mainly a period of learning a new product and it's qualities. And the notion that a $500 cable will transform a headphone to the next level? LOL Puh-lease!
I love when cable companies offer a “burn in” service. That one is always good for a laugh. 🤦🏼♂️
It's the same with vacuum tube sellers. They'll cryo the tubes for $5 a piece.
I noticed a burn in effect on my HD800s. In the beginning the highs were very metallic for me, it was so extreme that I sometimes had the feeling to taste metal. But since I liked a lot about the headphones, I started with eq. But this has made the soundstage smaller. So I did without eq and only used the HD800s for selected music. After a few days I could hear everything with the HD800s and the metallic sound was gone. I'm not saying that the HD800s need a burn in, it is very likely that my ears have used the dark headphones like the HD-6XX and NightHawk to keep the burn in process.
When you will start reviewing 1more triple driver over-ear? I got them recently and I'm quite impressed!!
I spoke to a Neumann engineer and they all said that modern speaker designs at least for the high end market, don't really need a burn/break-in. He straight up said that burn in was required only on poorly made products decades ago. I believe that they even published research on their website for all to read a few years back.
Claiming that a speaker or headphone is designed to be burned it, makes absolutely zero sense if you think about it.
Why design it that way when you don't have to? What is the point?
It doesn't make sense to the point where I have to believe in a conspiracy to force people to get used to the headphones past their returning point.
I am sorry to all those who still believe in burn in. But I prefer to believe the folks who not only tested it to the highest level, but also made it repeatable and published their finding for free online.
Okay, I have the Sendy Aiva, These were pretty harsh in the top end. Almost unbearable. I did burn them in for a few days. I did not use it in those days. It did become less harsh.
But what is burn-in. I just think pushing the drivers a lot to make the movement better of the driver and form them a bit. I did do it far over my normal listening level. So lvl 44 on my aune normal to max listening level. So I burned in about 50% more.. so around lvl 66. It worked for me.
why does your voice cadence sound off in this video...like you sped it up. It sounds weird. I have watch many of your reviews and this one does'nt sound like your usual tone.. Very choppy and clipped sounding...
robots overtaking us
Good question. It could be Adobe Audition. It sounded fine when I edited the track. Maybe Audition screwed up the render.
I think you need to burn in the video for a bit longer. Try playing it four more times on half speed. Then, it will sound normal.
Try the A2C with an RME ADI-2 FS DAC feeding a Garage1217 Projector Ember 2 amp with a Ken-Rad Tube - it will completely change how you see these headphones.
Lol why should he? I bet many cheaper headphones sound better than A2C on that setup.
Focal is another company that seems to believe heavily in burn in. In my experience with their headphones the only thing that improved over time was the seal of the pads on my head, which of course made a difference in sound. Regardless, their headphones sound good to my ears right out of the box, so it is unlikely that they are using burn in as an excuse for anything.
Great video I was wondering what budget non harsh, non fatiguing, detail retrieval closed back headphones you recommend
Austrian Audio hi-x55
@@CharlieCalottaReacts Thank you so much
thanks for info
I bought the denon d7200 after watching reviews and your review is spot on how they sound, and they sound wonderful, thanks
I wanted to ask if these aeon 2 closed an upgrade over them, so i can save some money for upgrade
I don’t think so. The Aeons are a very dark sounding headphone with narrow soundstage and aren’t particularly detailed or clear. You can tune some of that with the DCA tuning pads, but it’s all trial and error. DCA gets far too much hype, much like Audeze.
@@NoThemeReviews so what can be my next upgrade from d7200? Ether c flow? What about them
Psychological burning (expectation bias ?) is way more evident than the (almost) bullshit one. But some drivers might need some burning depending on how they are made. I'm pretty sure the companies know well about psychoburning, it's just a shame that they do not advertise it. It would me more honest.
The rule of thumb of burn-in is typically 1 day more than the return window.
Lol, yes.
sad but it works
After following the recommendation of the Hifiman HE-400i manual of 150 hours of break-in, I definitely don't believe in break-in. There was no difference at all from before.
Would love to hear your take on the DCA Aeon Closed X
Great reviews! Just saw the Closed RT on the Dan Clark website and wondering if you are planning a review or comparison of that more affordable model.
I don't have any plans to do that, but if Apos or someone else sends me the RT, I'll be happy to review it. Of course, if the RT is exactly the same as the original Aeon, then I likely would not have a favorable opinion of it.
@@NoThemeReviews what I’ve heard is that the RT closed definitely is improved over the original closed but not quite to the level of the 2 - but at $499 it makes it a serious consideration for me.
Dont forget the review of the Cayin IHA6 Amp
I liked my aeon opens pretty much immediately. I would imagine that the drivers to “burn in” and possibly move better after? Maybe? But I don’t think there is a real audible difference. Maybe, just maybe if anything the speed and decay may change slightly as the drivers burn in but I doubt that would even be very much noticeable. I think that brain burn in is real because you’ll adjust and learn to like a certain FR as you listen more to a headphone. Then when you switch to another headphone for a while then back to one, it’ll appear to sound different for a little bit as you readjust. But I’ve never really believed in actual driver burn in.
That’s my 2 cents
When will you review that RebelAmp?
Ahh...I know how to change the bias of ppl who keep saying that burn in makes their headphones soo much better...Just make sure that they cannot take off their headphones during the 100 hours burn in (i.e. eat, sleep, going about the day's tasks). Let's see if they still love their headphones after that. ;)
From a mechanical perspective it's conceivable that there could be a "stretching" of the mylar in a planar for example, after x amount of time and then it's at "operably stretched" this may or may not have any perceptible change to sound... Of course, if burn in is true then that also means that your driver's are constantly degrading and if under 100 hours supposedly changes the sound noticably then that also means every 100 hours they will sound different (potentially).... So what then, in 600 hours they are loose and uncontrolled sounding?!? Lolol
I do believe there is a very rapid "break in"with some types of drivers. Maybe as rapidly as a few minutes even..I don't believe after let's say 30 minutes of listening, anything is going to drastically change though.
Any chance you can give the Sennheiser HD 599 a proper review? Thanks!
I've been trying to find an affordable 599, but it's impossible at this point.
@@NoThemeReviews Dang, you just missed them on Amazon for $60 off two weeks ago! I used Keepa website to track it. Hopefully they’ll go on sale again. I’ll eagerly wait for your review!
What headphones do you actually like?
A ton: M1070, M1570, Pheonix, X55, Avantone Planar, original pre-fazor LCD-2, MDR-MA100 and MA900, Focal Elex, Base Audio G12, Rane RH-2, Gold Planar GL1000, Hifiman HE5se, T1 and T5p 2nd Gens, DT880, DT770, Marshall Monitor, Meze 99 Classic, X2HR, HR5 and HR5C, L2, M1 Mk2, HD6xx, HD579, NDH20, S4 and S4R...it's a very long list.
@@NoThemeReviews it doesn’t seem you have heard many or liked many headphones 🤪 I’m surprised a little at the Marshall Monitor mention, I wanted to like those and I did like them “okay enough” but they faded away for me
I found that typical music playing at 30%+ level have no noticeable change even burning in even after days. It only works when you are running a series of combination of hard sine sweeps and and pink noise. If you can’t hear your headphone 1-2 rooms away while running this burn in with sine sweep, you are probably not burning it in hard enough.
I burned in a Ether CX recently. I did a very similar test of what you did in this video, listen to it for a few hours to get an impression (of what I don’t like) then started to run these hard burn in. After a few days, I had a listen, with no noticeable change, so I turned up the volume more. After a few more days, (around 100 hours) I took a listen, yep! There’s the change. Bass was definitely elevated, sound stage increased. They are not dramatic, but enough to make me not hate the headphone.
So before you write off on burning in, I’d modify the experiment with harder series of sound designed to stretch the membranes and with volume much higher than you are currently think your headphone can handle. Rule of thumb: If you can sleep while you are burning in the headphone in another room in the open, you are not burning it in at all.
th-cam.com/video/xUxQ3O7h69M/w-d-xo.html
This one works pretty well for me.
I use this decibel meter :-)
Can you make a video comparing sivga phoenix with various other headphones in that price range including the nighthawks. I need your opinion!!! (I already saw the unboxing btw) :3
That's a long list of headphones. It's a lot easier if you just ask me a specific question.
@@NoThemeReviews how does the phoenix stack up against the nighthawks, dt880 and the sundara?
There is no burn-in, there is only our brain adjusting to the sound of headphones, the only "burn-in" that changes the sound are the pads that over time adjust to the shape of our heads and thus making perfect seal for optimized listening.
Simple proof, put new original foamies on Porta Pros (which didn't had their foamies changed for i.e. a year), they will immediately change sound.
burn in only applies to your brain. getting used to the sound signature of a headphone supposedly improves the experience
I think burn-in is real, but NOT the way most audiophile thinks.
This was a masterclass on burn in, thank you. Too bad people believe in these myths!
u know this is a joke when a known audio company writes : the sound will “stabAlize”....WTF?! No one can take them seriously after that..😂😂😂
Goes to show they ship unstable sound.
Tyll from Innerfidelity did an A/B comparison on this and I recommend you watch the video.
I saw it, but he only uses 2 AKG headphones, not 6 - like No Theme Reviews suggests. Did Till talk about the pads being exactly the same on both headphones? (I don't remember him mentioning it, but that was a long time ago). I think the main reason No Theme Reviews suggests using 6 headphones - is that there might be slight sonic differences between the different batches of the same headphones.
Yup, that's correct. I just pulled 6 out of thin air, but the idea is exactly as you suggest: to control for small sound variances among units. I think Tyll's video is worth considering, if for nothing else than another perspective.
Don't worry...You have better headphones to listen to for 4 days.
...as I replied before ☕
I think you just convinced me to NOT purchase this headphone...
Seems like an underwhelming headphone for such an overwhelming price...
Obvious flaw of this test, you just don’t have the golden ears that all head-fiers have bro. You never will.😂
I know. Sadly, my ears are normal.
All this time you tried very hard to break or at least scratch the headphones. After you, you definitely don't need to buy secondhand. Scary to watch.
I have no idea what you’re talking about.
@@NoThemeReviews It was a joke, but I wanted to say that I have an aeon, and the sound has changed over time, now they have more mids than when I bought new ones. This is immediately noticeable, since all this time I compared with Grado. Naturally, I did not take measurements, I just feel it.
Burn in is, from an engineering standpoint, complete and utter nonsense. Might as well start drinking audio enhancement water and wearing silver audio enhancing socks -.-
Audioquest might sell both such products.
If the "Burn-In" doesn't work, they'll tell you to change the cable.
Lol. Yes, some will.
but then you'll need to burn-in the cable...
@@redstang5150 Yes, but you must also make sure to burn-in your dac and amp. A ceremonial dance also elevates treble.
@@NoThemeReviews I paid Dell for the option to have them burn-in my new PC before they sent it to me. It ran 10-15% faster right out of the box.