The warp pipe room and the fact that they cut the trips back and forth in chapter 4 from 5 to 3 is already a win for me. Who cares if its 30 fps at this point they freakin toned down the backtracking so at this point i dont give a crap its already enough for me. One thing i hated in ttyd was the backtracking.
Im not going to defend nintendo slicing the fps in half. Its stupid and shouldn't have happened. However, its really annoying to have people say that the game is going to be bad simply because of that one change.
I haven't seen anybody say it's outright bad, (then again, I'm not in any Nintendo-focused circles, they tend to be biased imo,) but I have seen the sentiment that it'll be worse than the original. I think that's a fair viewpoint, and an important distinction.
Bullshit. You need perfectly timed attacks here. Else you will not go on plaing because you are dead. This is not a toddler`s game like "Paper Mario Origami King" which plays itself. This i a REAL game. A game which contains a lot of user´s input. And input of a user is typically measured in ms (frames/second). Worse frames/second = worse input.
@@SmartZero-f8e yeah you gotta have frame perfect input for all those extremely precise action commands the game DOESN'T HAVE. Heck it's even come out that a lot of the timing windows for these things has been increased so it won't be harder to input at all. Do some research for once in your life
i guarantee that its 30fps just to make it look better on the switch 2 when they release it at 60fps to generate more dumb hype💀 mark my fucking words, they will hype 60fps when that shit is announced
I guess it's probably worth waiting until the game comes out to jump to any conclusions, but something that really stuck out to me was the parallels the TTYD remake seems to have with the BIS remake five years ago (geez, it doesn't feel like it's been that long). Both are remakes of the most beloved games in their respective series, both were 60 fps reaction-based games that got cut down to 30 fps, and both have caught some criticism of their new graphics and music being redone to be in line with the more recent games in the series (though, to be fair, TTYD has gotten less of this so far). There are definitely differences in circumstances there, but the parallels between the two stuck out to me. The difference is, the BIS remake is almost universally considered to be mediocre or even bad, and receives a ton of criticism for its poor performance. And it *actually killed* the series (R.I.P. Alphadream...). Now, I've only played the remake, and I still thought it was a good game and had fun with it. And I certainly don't think that the TTYD remake will be all bad. It just feels like a bit of a double standard to so aggressively support flaws that are the result of outright laziness in a game made by a thriving studio, while bashing similar flaws in a game made by a studio on the brink of death.
@@AkameGaKillfan777 I’m aware of this. After some consideration, I’ve concluded that they simply chose to prioritize graphics over frame rate (or general game feel for that matter). I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad approach, and I definitely enjoyed my playthrough of the remake, but I do think the game would’ve been slightly better if it would’ve somewhat more accurately replicated the game feel of the original. Some of the changes they made to the core gameplay experience were just odd. This comment was from a month ago, before the game came out, and I hadn’t given the debate much thought yet. My opinions have changed somewhat since then. I think 30 fps is definitely a noticeable downgrade, but it was likely a hard decision made by the devs in order to achieve a balance that they thought best.
@@Dman25 That's all right, I'm just sick of people who don't know a thing about game development accuse devs of being lazy when they know absolutely nothing about what went on behind the scenes.
You've earned a sub from me, it is so rare to see someone in the gaming community who has common sense and isn't afraid to call Nintendo out on their BS!
I think the framerate being halved is complete bogus. But unfortunately I think I will still be buying it because my GameCube recently crapped out on me (the disc reader is broken or something) so this is the alternative. Or I guess I could just buy another GameCube. Call me a consumer all you want, you’d probably be right. But I am still getting it. I think 30 FPS on a 20 year old game is BS tho.
Not everyone can tell a immediate difference between 30fps and 60fps. No most people won`t be able to notice a difference between 30 fps and 60 fps at least for a RPG like this. Like yes when you compare them side by side there is a clear difference but actually playing it in the moment? The average person won`t notice a difference or at least much of one. Why don`t you wanna buy a product? Just for the FPS change despite all the changes? Sounds pretty dumb tbh. And the "other product they don`t want" is a actually not great game and isn`t the direction the fans want unlike TTYD. So buying TTYD on Switch is a good thing and is something people want. It doesn`t even run like ass really. Like they aren`t holding their legacy hostage they are remastering their legacy game. Is it a worse experience then the original game? Many reviewers and stuff from the game says otherwise, only negative is the FPS change. I do get the FPS complaint though I really do but it isn`t that big of a deal as you make it out to be. No? The timing of your actions won`t really be hurt or affected much. It will still have the same pacing and battles will still be the same. Considering how great the remake looks and seems to be....wanting to get it despite one issue does sound like a heathy consumer product relationship. Eh....nah this is how the open market works. How is buying a good remaster conditioning? Nah this doesn`t make it objectively worse to play, it revovles around meticulous timing button imputs but the fps cap doesn`t make the pacing that much different or slower. So is it a reasonable complaint? Not really tbh. Like did he even play the game? This isn`t much of a gameplay problem. From what we`ve seen it isn`t a red flag or makes the game objectively worse, it still looks and runs fine with the timing. Lower Frame rates don`t always make gameplay worse as it isn`t always noticable in games or will always affect gameplay pacing that much and that applies to this RPG especially. So no this really isn`t a huge problem. Again one issue doesn`t outweigh all the improvements so it isn`t a objectively worse experience. It`s not their fault the average person won`t notice the difference without comparing them lmao. I mean Oragami King requires percise timing too...
Somehow I'm reminded of how the switch can run the OG game no probs via emulation, which needs more power than running natively mind you. Just lower the fidelity until you hit 60, in the worst case it would look like a remaster and play infinitely better. but we aren't the devs, nintendo is. watch fans make a 60fps mod for the remake because nintendo couldn't be bothered.
I can get the argument from people that they'd be fine with 30fps (like other recent Paper Mario games) as long as it's smooth and consistent in exchange for the much higher fidelity visuals if they think the visuals are a worthwhile and sufficient trade (it doesn't even bother me personally, although if I had to choose I'd prioritize 60fps over fancier visuals, especially since the OG's artstyle was already great visually and didn't NEED the upgrade that much). 30fps can be plenty fine for games and I've played plenty of 30fps games that don't really suffer because of it. But people who are saying "99% of people cannot tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps" are MAJOR COPING and that's a load of BULLCRAP. That's a flat-out lie, if you can't tell the difference between 30 and 60, particularly if you're someone who actually plays video games, then I think that's an issue with you and your eyes or something, because the difference is night and day, you can see it instantly. Even child me who had never played a video game except Wii Sports before could tell the difference between seeing Mario Galaxy running at 60fps on my Wii when I got it for the first time and how it looked in the 30fps videos I'd see online. It's not like comparing 60 and 120fps where the difference is more slight and not as noticeable (if someone told me some 120fps footage was 60fps I'd believe them unless I see a direct comparison), because it's not, it's COMPLETELY different. Not to mention the elephant in the room that the ORIGINAL GAME RAN AT 60fps on original hardware, that is objectively a direct downgrade no matter how you put it and that makes it much more sour than if it was a new game that was 30fps, even if you think they made other improvements such that they counterbalance said downgrade. I also had a short back-and-forth with someone on TH-cam who insisted to me that the original Gamecube version was 30fps on real hardware and that it's only 60fps on Dolphin emulator, claiming that when he played it on Dolphin he "noticed instantly" and that the 60fps felt weird because it wasn't how the game originally worked. He's dead wrong, it was always 60 on real hardware, and yet after I corrected him he still insisted it was 30fps and was incapable of surpassing that on original hardware. So that's a thing too, some people are apparently even gaslighting about the original game.
This isn´t your ordinary graphics-game...it´s a processor-driven game. You can have shiny graphics...but een the most-powerful GPU won´t help you here, when classic RPG are eating up your cpu-time instead.
@@AkameGaKillfan777 You are that Fire Emblem 3H glazer. Not surprised to find you here glazing Nintendo and 30fps. Is there anything you're correct about?
Are you an actual PM fan? Most of the people complaining about this aren’t even actual fans of series. Origami King also ran 30fps on switch. It’s really not that big of a deal.
If I'm being honest, I don't care about the 30 vs 60 FPS debate cuz frankly I see both as acceptable so long as they're consistent to me 60 FPS is what the target for performance should be, while 30 is acceptable so long as it keeps to that consistently, lower than that or when the FPS dips is when I start to have problems, 30 is the minimum of what is acceptable and if it goes below then I concede it is a bad issue is it a shame the TTYD remake isn't 60 FPS, yeah, but is is the absolute end of the world that completely ruins the game? NO. if it were 30 with frequent performance dips then I'd be upset but from what's been shown its a pretty consistent 30 with few if any drops, again it would be better at 60 but I'm not gonna lose sleep over it being 30
This is probably some small part of why they finally jumped on Yuzu after it being active for so long. Granted, that's a theory. You know what isn't a theory? Nintendo appears to be doing everything in their power to make me save up for a Steamdeck over buying their next console.
Nintendo just took down a Pokémon Mystery Dungeon D&D project by sending a DMCA to some guy on TH-cam with only like 1000 subs. God, I fucking hate them.
@@bracken8782 It was called PMD&D. I'm struggling to find the one that was taken down. I found a Tumblr page that might be it, but what I Heard was taken down was a PDF.
Idc if a game runs 60 or 30 fps I don’t even notice the quality drop until a bug happens(I’m looking at you redfall) if it runs as 30 and it plays well I’m satisfied. As long as it runs well I’m happy
@@shotpack8374 same, like id get if paper mario was an online competitive game where even the slightest drop in frames constantly matters, but like, its a turn based rpg where the enemies attacks are the same each time they use them
@@leontriestoartI’m a PC gamer through and through and for me having less than 60 FPS always feels like an inferior experience. In multiplayer it’s crucial to have 60+ and in singleplayer it’s just painful and can only be tolerated when you’re trying to run a demanding game on an old rig.
Listen, if you care about frame rates and actually notice it, that is YOUR problem, I do NOT care, that really sucks for you that you’ll let that make you not play a great game, the graphics got a COMPLETE overhaul and the switch is TINY, that makes sense Garry’s mod stuff still sucks tho
This isn't a matter of laziness, or Nintendo under some conspiracy of Nintendo trying to do the bare minimum because of the belief they could get away with it. I'm not a fan of many of the decisions Nintendo has made. I've criticized them a great deal within the past few years. Even so, framing your position (no pun intended) as such is just tinfoil hat nonsense. If the game was made to run at 30 FPS, then it was optimized specifically for 30 FPS. It isn't like they took the original game, ported it over, and halved the frame rate. If that was the case, I would definitely see this point of view. As harshly critical as people were of The Origami King (it was largely justified in my opinion), nobody complained that it was 30 FPS. That's because it was optimized to work at 30 FPS, the same way this game is. The reason why people object now is because this is a remake of a previous game, so there is something else that it can be compared to in someone's mind. But that original game worked on a completely different engine with 60 FPS in mind. This is not to downplay frame rates in general as no big deal. What I'm saying is that while frame rates are a big factor, how a game uses its frame rate, and what is used for, are also of significance. A game could run at a million frames per second, but that wouldn't save it if the game wasn't properly designed around it. So obviously frame rates aren't the be all end all. The slower frame rate clearly isn't holding the game back from a visual perspective. It looks beautiful and the animation is as smooth as freshly stirred honey butter. But what about from a gameplay perspective? Would it affect the gameplay? It probably would affect your ability to do superguards properly, if the game were just ported over without the new FPS in mind, but that isn't what was done. As easily as I can say this wasn't a decision of laziness, I can also say that it wasn't a decision made arbitrarily, either. This whole discussion really just comes off as “If you aren't as furious about this as I am, you're a delusional boot-licking fanboy.” And while that's morally reprehensible, I would understand if this was coming from a child. But it isn't coming from a child. It's coming from a grown man. A grown man that's acting like a child. I don't know how active your father was in your house, but men aren't supposed to act this way. What if your mother saw this video? Did you ever think of that? You want to make your own mother cry seeing that her son has sunk to such a low level of moral character? I don't think you do. Just think about it.
13:40 You said bloodborne is easier when played on emulator. But its on PS4, and there is no working emulator for PS4. Also you say that when will sony bring bloodborne to pc, that means you cannot play it on pc right now. Right?
How do these people not realize that by saying “oh it has to be 30fps because the graphics are better” you’re unintentionally saying the nintendo switch is no more powerful than the gamecube basically. If after 20 year and 2 new consoles (3 if u include the wii u), you cant get better visuals at the SAME performance as before…thats sad.
Except the GameCube couldn't do anything better than 480i or 480p, and several effects. Even Hedgehog Engine 2 as much as people like to bash it, has effects Hedgehog Engine 1 doesn't and is more stable.
I think the funniest part about this is that they could have included a "performance mode" that used the original textures with 60fps. But noooooo. Gotta have high rez textures on a device that can barely run them in a game that relies on QTE's for its battle system. I'll be playing TTYD on my retroid pocket 4 pro, thank you very much.
what? why does the qte part matter? if the frame rate was inconsitent, yeah, but you can expect an attack from an enemy to have the exact same timing each time.
@@leontriestoart You clearly don't understand how framerates work. More frames means your inputs are more responsive. This is why rhythm games run at 60fps. It's simply more difficult to time things at 30fps because there is more input lag. Even if things have the same timing each time.
@@Patrick-bn5rp bro the timing is going to be exactly the same each time a goomba head bonks you, in a game like this if 30fps means you can't time your inputs consistently then idk what to tell you 😭
@@Patrick-bn5rp also rhythm games are like, actually hard and usually need way more precision than your average paper Mario game. Plus you're going to be having way more inputs and it's way more unpredictable than basic enemy attacks that require 1 button press and are extremely easy to memorize the timing
@@leontriestoart Why are you justifying a 60 dollar rerelease of a 20 year old game running at half the frames of the original product? Do you actually hear yourself? Think about that for just a minute. You are paying for a version of the game that runs worse than it did 20 years ago. Actually what is wrong with you? The game was designed with 60fps in mind. Now the game no longer runs at 60fps. There isn't even a graphics setting to MAKE it render at 60fps in exchange for losing a little fidelity. I guess you just buy up whatever slop they put out. Consume product and then get excited for next product.
That's the reason why Nintendo toke down the mods in gmod? This is stupid. No wonder why everybody hates this company, and they're still people defends this. Why?!
@@megaman37456 Seriously? Gary should investigate harder next time unless he wants a boy cries wolf situation on his hands in case something DOES happen next time.
😂 I'm disappointed in the 30fps but I'm still getting it. Personally i feel like the 30 fps that would be even worse will have to be Metroid Prime 4 because thats a shooter. So I'm hoping that title gets pushed back to the switch 2
Yeah, because a GameCube doesn't equal a switch. They don't just iterate on the stuff they had each time. There are certain effects that the GameCube is good at that they found little to no need for, so they removed it for the Switch. For instance, 1 thing the Switch can do better than a modern P.C. is a thing called ASTC texture decoding, which allows textures to be extremely compressed, then decompressed on the fly.
@@iaqh Yeah, but they'd get even more sales if they put their games on PC. And PC isn't all about performance. It's about options. You can choose to use an old PC or choose to get the top of the line.
nintendo makes good games, period. they make amazing games. but what's going on with ttyd?... why 30fps? is there really no performance scraps to have it run 60fps? reasoning behind copyright takedowns is because fair use doesnt exist in japan.
So I have never cared for 30 vs 60fps but to me that wasn't ever the issue here. It's the fact that it ran better on a older console and now it's being sold at a higher price for worse performance. The manipulation is clear. Nintendo sucks for this as well as other shitty practices. They deserve the hate. I don't care about the frame rate it's the resale forcing that's the real issue.
generally for most games 30fps to 60 fps is not massive enough difference to discount everything else the game might do right. When it comes to TTYD specifically the halved frame rate is more impactful than most other games due to super guarding, since it is frame perfect (i believe) the remake will have to effectively make it 2x easier to perform reducing difficulty significantly, how much this changes the progression of the remake is left to be seen, but even if the game is worse for it, in this circumstance I personally don't mind unless the drop off is massive (i.e. 9/10 - 5/10 or lower level difference) due to the quality of the original game being a 9.9/10 already, which even for a remake, is a unrealistic expectation to have (i always expect 6/10 i.e. 'Good' for any game I play, to not under or overshoot potential satisfaction with a game, though that is just me). although I do agree that most people won't notice and/or care about a 30fps to 60fps difference either way. For the casual player, why would they care about frame rate in the first place, if it is smooth (as in not freezes, stutters, or micro stutter) 30 typically would be good enough for them. and for any players with varying visual impairment, even if they do care, they most likely will not notice much of a difference anyways (judging on personal experience, I wear glasses with slightly impaired vision without them, and I can't even notice a difference with a side by side comparison despite being super into games pretty much my whole life. only time I notice a difference is if one of them has a inconsistent frame rate like with 360 Unleashed vs. PS3 Unleashed). The only people who this would be a significant problem for are hardcore fans without visual impairments, which is ultimately a minority of almost any player base. All that being said, them not having 60fps is still a disappointment, just not a big enough problem to discredit everything else this remake is doing right.
At least Sony/MFST try push their to high framerates, quality, and resolution. They will never push that for Nintendo games, because they will never make a pricey console. (understandably and sadly)
Watch a TH-cam video comparing 30 and 60 fps. Make sure your settings are set to 60 fps. If you still can’t tell the difference, then something’s seriously wrong.
(I should mention that while I tried to stay as objective as possible in my post, I am still biased) I disagree with a lot of things. A lot of your arguments are based on the assumption that the devs of the TTYD Remake badly optimised the game. I don't think it's really fair to make such bold accusations, especially as we basically know nothing about the developing process of the game. With the limited hardware power of the Switch you have to make certain choices and compromise. For example, maybe the graphics they had in mind didn't allow for 60 fps, meaning they prioritized the graphics. And comparing graphics of the remake to different games and flat out saying one looks worse and therefore should be running at least as good is not really objective either as you again assume things. Something looking more demanding is not always more demanding. There could be a lot more going on in the background than we might think. If you want to criticize the decision to make this game 60 fps then that's fine, but using this chance to shit on Nintendo, without properly understanding the nuances of the situation is just unfair towards them in my opinion. Furthermore it feels weird that you only thought to include only one side of the argument, being the "Nintendo fanboys", without acknowledging the toxicity of the other side. Claiming that all the people defending the game or the frame rate are blind followers of Nintendo is a bit misleading, when this could very well be retaliation to the toxicity of the other side of the argument, being the people who are unsatisfied with the downgrade in fps or an attempt to maximize the game's sales (not that this is a good thing). The conclusion people are defending the frame rate -> they are blind followers and the reason Nintendo gets away with everything is simply too rash. And I'm not saying that one side is better than the other. The toxicity on both sides is insufferable. In conclusion it feels like you used this situation to trash on Nintendo, instead of having a more objective view (btw I'm not the biggest fan of Nintendo and their policies either). If you find any contradictions in my post please tell me in the reply section. Thank you for reading
Goddamn I'm having serious Tales of Symphonia remastered PTSD. Like It's going to run better than Symphonia sure but 60 fps with higher resolution would have been way better unless Nintendo doesn't want Skyward Sword remaster situation again.
Advocating to buy product we don't want so we get more product we don't want... To be fair, that's generally been the mindset for fans of Pikmin for goddamn yonks.
Nintendo: We hate Emulators and made a previously GameCube game that was 60 to 30 Anyone with common sense: And you still wonder why people rather emulate your games!?
@@RavenGamingOverLord So just you and the vast minority of Nintendo fanboys? Fanboys here meaning people who will defend Nintendo no matter what shitty thing they do, that doesn't make you a fan, it makes you look stupid.
Man even my 10 year old self could tell between games at 30 fps and games at 60. I didn't have a name for it, but I classified them between the ones that "have stutter" and the ones that "don't have stutter". Corporate shills think the human being is stupid
Personally, I don’t really care about the frame rate as long as it’s consistent. Paper Mario is not a game where I need precision inputs down to 1/60th of a second. For some games being limited to 30fps can really hurt but I don’t think this is one of them.
I hate how every time Nintendo FINALLY does something people have been begging for, there's a catch. Oh, you want a new Star Fox? Take this one with a horrid and gimmicky control scheme, hit or miss level design, mediocre graphics...etc etc. Worst part is when it doesn't sell, they always and I mean always take the wrong lessons away from it. "I guess people just don't want Star Fox"
That's why we as the consumer should vote with our wallets if we want Nintendo to stop thair bs the only thing we can do other than complain about it is just not buy a single Nintendo product that being games merchandise etc
This reminds me of the Tales of Symphonia Remaster debacle, where the framerate, across all consoles iirc, was sliced from 60 to 30 as well. If the original, for both games, was 30, and they kept it for the new release, it would be lazy, yes, but one could go past it. If you're bringing an old game, tweaked out a bit, to a new, more powerful console, I don't see how you can't maintain the framerate. I'm a Xenoblade fan and Xeno 3 absolutely makes my Switch cry, so I know it's capable of running more powerful games than freaking Pong, yet for Pokemon and this, it seems like Nintendo is kinda scared of pushing their hardware to its limit and provide bold experiences for certain IPs.
For Tales of Symphonia, this isn’t the 1st or the 2nd or even the 3rd time it’s been 30FPS, it’s the 4th time. Tell me you don’t know about this series without telling me you don’t know about this series
Don’t understand people who claim they can’t distinguish 30 from 60. Point about movies is valid, they get a Soap Opera feel and it changes the tonality. It’s distracting. I wonder if animosity towards people who want better frames stems from stigma towards competitive games. It could also be physical. There was a study using flicking lights that suggested some people don’t have the visual cortex to distinguish the difference. Just wait for this to be emulated and run it at a higher frames
Here's my stance on this whole framerate debate. If TTYD was a turn based rpg in the same style like the original Final Fantasy 7, where all you do is pick an attack and your character does said attack, then 60fps for me is not necessary. Hell, Final Fantasy 7's battle mode runs at 15fps, and people still love that game. However, TTYD also features action commands requiring button imputs at the right time of your attacks. That alone can be affected by a lower framerate.
What makes this even worse is the fact that the Super Mario RPG remake was both a significant graphical upgrade from the original AND ran at 60fps like the original, there is no excuse for the TTYD remake not to also run at 60. Also not only can most people tell the difference between 30 and 60fps, most people can tell the difference between 50 and 60fps, if you watch a video of the PAL version of the original TTYD (which runs at 50fps) vs the NTSC version (runs at 60fps), anyone with eyes will quickly notice that the PAL version runs significantly slower, to the point where it is unplayable for anyone used to the NTSC version.
You compare Square Enix to a much smaller company like Intelligent Systems. Of course Super Mario RPG runs 60 with a big company like Square behind it. That's why Mario Wonder runs at 60. Because it's by Nintendo EPD and made without deadlines. I'm almost certain TTYD had to be finished before the new console release relatively soon and they were prioritizing having no framedrops. Because what's worse that having 30 FPS in an RPG? Framedrops in an RPG. Not saying it's good but it's a thing they had to do for reasons we don't know.
1. the PAL version does not run 50 FPS on default, it has a 50 FPS option true but that's not a mandatory thing you can always go with 60 hz 2. The 50hz version was in no shape optimized and was only thrown in, the remake however was built with 30 fps in mind, does the footage on youtube look slower? No it doesn't 3. Luigi's Mansion 30 ran at 30 fps too and nobody made a fuss over it, like a majority of switch games. a higher framerate doesn't mean that a game will play better, there's a few remakes like the 64 zelda ones that people stay away from even if they run 60 fps instead of 23 4. this game's a REMAKE it's REMADE in an new engine with new assets, new lighting and a lot more frames of animation, even the GC did struggle on the large masses of NPCs and they had to put them into really low poly mode, the original Paper mario sacrificed quality, the remake sacrifices some FPS but will run mostly stable except for the mass NPC sections where it might does minor dips. 5. the switch is a hybrid console and nintendo even underclocked some parts of it to make it not overheat or use up too much power.
@ashleyblack7419 I know all this already actually, I'm European myself so I'm perfectly aware of the 60hz mode in the original game, I just mentioned the 50hz version because it is noticeably slower than 60. I actually don't disagree with the rest of what you said though, the framerate is only a minor issue and the game still looks great otherwise and as a SM64 speedrunner I'm fully aware that framerate has nothing to do with the speed of the game but rather how fluid the animations are. I do think the lower framerate is more of an issue than some people trying to brush it under the rug are making it out to be though and it will impact the gameplay in some ways like with superguarding, although admittedly it isn't a major problem and I agree that it's not a deal breaker by any means or worth tearing the whole game down over.
@@tessaPMpro Glad you're reasonable, your original comment sounded a little spiteful. I mean I'm slowly getting into Majora's mask randomizers which also leads to learning quite a lot of speedrun tricks. I'm pretty sure the difference will be more lenient than strict, like having 2 frames instead of 1.5. Still is presumably hard to pull off a superguard. DK64 was specifically built around lag and took measures to make it less noticeable too I guess the devs will know how to cover it up here too. Many people usually assume PAL games only run 50hz so I wasn't sure you were aware, which is why I wasn't sure you knew. I'm pretty excited for the game ngl ^^"
@ashleyblack7419 yeah I know I came across as a bit aggressive in my original comment so forgive me, I was pretty badly hungover that day so I wasn't in the best headspace when I made that comment lol. I'm still as hyped for the remake as anyone else!
Yep. That situation infuriated me to be honest. Nintendo fans will literally eat up almost everything the company releases, regardless of whether blatantly shitty business decisions directly affect a game’s quality or not. They’ll just settle for it and pretend that it’s all good. The 3D Mario games deserved a better homage.
@@Probably_JENOVA My god Nintendo fans eat literally anything these days A barebones console with paid online(P2P so no servers btw) and missing services/features from 2 generations ago? that's 'objectively' better according to Nintendo fanboys and if you like the older consoles better thats just 'nostalgia' Also remember those people licking all the Wii U ports saying how new innovative they were like we didn't get them 7 years before 🤣
Nintendo fans are worse than Sony fans. God Miyamoto could shit on their mom and they'd ask for another. And their rebuttals are either completely unrelated or wrong. "As long as pretty colors dance on the screen, you should thank them for the kick in the balls"
imo i feel sony fanboys are worse than nintendo fanboys, nintendo just takes up in the ass with downgrades and straight up broken games for full price while still worshiping nintendo but at least they are quiet most the time, meanwhile sony fanboys screetch all over internet being, toxic af, and if they game flops they create twitter spaces as their safespace and blame xbox for some reason that their game floped
The only reason I'm even buying this remake besides to show that old paper mario is better, is simply this: Gonna wait for a 60 FPS mod to drop, then put it on my modded Switch, problem solved.
I'm gonna be honest here, I hate that people make such as massive deal about the FPS drop and belittle other people if it doesn't bother them. While adjusting to 30 FPS might take me a bit of time, it's never really mattered to me much. Call me blind or not a real gamer all you want, but I played Bowser's Inside Story several times prior to its remake, and I literally wasn't bothered whatsoever by its framerate being dropped. In fact, I didn't even know it was 30 FPS until other people told me. If someone is genuinely not bothered by the FPS drop and can still enjoy the remake despite it, you can't tell them they're wrong. Everyone's experience is different. You don't know how something feels to someone else because you aren't them. Also, you do realize that the game industry has been plagued for years by a graphical arms race that continues to skyrocket the price of production and that's a big reason why many large gaming corporations have to use blatantly predatory monetization tactics such as lootboxes and excessive microtransactions, right? I'd much rather support a company that's wiling to ease up on things so they don't have to do that kind of disgusting crap.
this isnt even like tales of symphonia where all the recent ports are based on the ps2 version whitch is weaker then the gamecube so it being 30 fps was excusable. the switch is way more powerful then a gamecube.
It literally did… a movie runs on 24fps idiot. Do you complain about stutters? Lol this is a slow turn based game. Why would they sacrifice battery life for a higher fps when it literally is a 2D side scroller game
for real, i think they should just have an option for their future games to run in "performance" mode that has worse graphics but a higher frame rate and an "graphics" mode that has better graphics and worse framerate cuz i feel like this opinion it too devicive. literally half the ppl want 60 and the other half dont care bout 60.
The gmod thing aside(cause I never heard of it until watching this video🤷🏿♂️), the Nintendo defense squad, who are defending Paper Mario The Thousand Year Door being 30fps, are literally condoning Nintendo getting more money, for a lesser product🤦🏿♂️
I have to point out that Taki udon just posted a video proving that the switch hardware is plenty capable of 4k, so there is literally no excuse for 30 fps in 2024
@AkameGaKillfan777 it's been awhile since I watched his video on it, but it was a modded switch running Linux and I believe it was just a little overclock. If you want you can search TH-cam with Taki udon 4k switch and it should be the first video.
The guy talking about getting paper Mario we dont want has nothing to do with the fps its to do with the type of game it is. New paper Mario and old paper Mario are two very different gams
I think it would've been great if they added the original game with a stable 60 FPS as a de-facto performance option. (From what I've heard about the original, it targeted 60 FPS, but it would dip occasionally during more intensive moments, at least on original hardware.) I have never played _Thousand-Year Door_ before, so I appreciate that it's being remade for the Switch, and I'm looking forward to playing it. But the fact that it is half the framerate is still a letdown. I can probably get used to the timing during battles, but the 30 FPS criticism is still valid.
I do notice a difference, but imo it's such a good game that people should still try it out. It sucks that people are already thinking of pirating it when good sales of this could fix the series, and that the next console could possibly fix these issues if it is backwards compatible, but whatever.
I capped games of my ex at 30 fps using RivaTunerSS without her knowing and she kept complaining something is wrong with her games and she was getting motion sickness while she was playing. Superior cinematic experience guys.
I play a game called For Honor a 3d fighting mid evil game for years on the Xbox One and when I got my Series X the difference in the frame rate was just night and day.
I don't really mind 30fps for a game like TTYD. It's an RPG. For me, if it's not an ultra competitive shooter or fighting games, 60fps isn't a necessity.
The fact that the remake has plenty of QoL updates (like multiple trouble tasks at once and much snappier party swap to name the ones I could immediately think of) just makes the 30 fps cap all the more sucky If we got it at 60 fps, this would be the best version beyond the shadow of a doubt. Only time will tell if that will still happen, but the 30 fps does leave a very bad taste in a lot of our mouths Me personally, I'll wait for a full feature set of this remake to come out and then decide from there
Because it's literally not a texture mod and the Switch a console with a chip from 2015. 11 years after TTYDs launch. Even Gamecube to Wii wasn't a huge jump. Especially since the Gamecube was a power house and aside from the disk size ahead.
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat While the toxic PC pirates harass and insult anyone for owning a console, I can see why there's a lot of people out there that absolutely despise PC Fanboys and I'm saying this as a steamdeck owner of my own.
How about you talk about all the pc master race fanboys who have caused multiple problems due to stuff like gta 6 not getting a pc release at launch? Your daddy pyro cynical legit broke his PS5 on stream because of that. Many pc master race people have been caught lying about upcoming games (like saying gta 6 is going to run at 30fps on ps5, with no sources, and every pc master race person instantly took it as fact), and have done much more, but you refuse to cover any of that..... I wonder why....
@@AkameGaKillfan777 And this translates to Nintendo (The triple-A, long standing, very much not just a small group of people, is their own publisher and producer) not being able to have good performance and good visuals because? Edit: might I add, not even making new content other than more faithful localization.
Nintendo's legal team works infinitely harder than their dev teams lmao
The warp pipe room and the fact that they cut the trips back and forth in chapter 4 from 5 to 3 is already a win for me. Who cares if its 30 fps at this point they freakin toned down the backtracking so at this point i dont give a crap its already enough for me. One thing i hated in ttyd was the backtracking.
Im not going to defend nintendo slicing the fps in half. Its stupid and shouldn't have happened. However, its really annoying to have people say that the game is going to be bad simply because of that one change.
I haven't seen anybody say it's outright bad, (then again, I'm not in any Nintendo-focused circles, they tend to be biased imo,) but I have seen the sentiment that it'll be worse than the original. I think that's a fair viewpoint, and an important distinction.
@@bigfatstewie8333 Have you not read a single comment on this video?
Its a fucking rpg.
Frame rate could matter less
Bullshit. You need perfectly timed attacks here. Else you will not go on plaing because you are dead. This is not a toddler`s game like "Paper Mario Origami King" which plays itself. This i a REAL game.
A game which contains a lot of user´s input. And input of a user is typically measured in ms (frames/second). Worse frames/second = worse input.
@@SmartZero-f8e yeah you gotta have frame perfect input for all those extremely precise action commands the game DOESN'T HAVE. Heck it's even come out that a lot of the timing windows for these things has been increased so it won't be harder to input at all. Do some research for once in your life
@@TopTrunks If you can't hit 99% of the action commands, that's a skill issue
@@SmartZero-f8e Uh… hello? Paper Mario on N64 ran at 30 fps and also required timed attacks. Poor argument.
@@Matt-eh2dy And it was a worse game than ttyd because of it.
i guarantee that its 30fps just to make it look better on the switch 2 when they release it at 60fps to generate more dumb hype💀 mark my fucking words, they will hype 60fps when that shit is announced
A conspiracy I can get behind
Imagine complaining about the difference between a 30 fps over at 60 fps and complaining That game is bad now without even playing the game 😂
I love Nintendo games!! Drop in fps sucks but I loooove paper Mario 😫
I guess it's probably worth waiting until the game comes out to jump to any conclusions, but something that really stuck out to me was the parallels the TTYD remake seems to have with the BIS remake five years ago (geez, it doesn't feel like it's been that long). Both are remakes of the most beloved games in their respective series, both were 60 fps reaction-based games that got cut down to 30 fps, and both have caught some criticism of their new graphics and music being redone to be in line with the more recent games in the series (though, to be fair, TTYD has gotten less of this so far). There are definitely differences in circumstances there, but the parallels between the two stuck out to me. The difference is, the BIS remake is almost universally considered to be mediocre or even bad, and receives a ton of criticism for its poor performance. And it *actually killed* the series (R.I.P. Alphadream...). Now, I've only played the remake, and I still thought it was a good game and had fun with it. And I certainly don't think that the TTYD remake will be all bad. It just feels like a bit of a double standard to so aggressively support flaws that are the result of outright laziness in a game made by a thriving studio, while bashing similar flaws in a game made by a studio on the brink of death.
Because this isn't laziness, and you have 0 proof that it was
@@AkameGaKillfan777 I’m aware of this. After some consideration, I’ve concluded that they simply chose to prioritize graphics over frame rate (or general game feel for that matter). I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad approach, and I definitely enjoyed my playthrough of the remake, but I do think the game would’ve been slightly better if it would’ve somewhat more accurately replicated the game feel of the original. Some of the changes they made to the core gameplay experience were just odd. This comment was from a month ago, before the game came out, and I hadn’t given the debate much thought yet. My opinions have changed somewhat since then. I think 30 fps is definitely a noticeable downgrade, but it was likely a hard decision made by the devs in order to achieve a balance that they thought best.
@@Dman25 That's all right, I'm just sick of people who don't know a thing about game development accuse devs of being lazy when they know absolutely nothing about what went on behind the scenes.
@@AkameGaKillfan777 Yeah, I’m trying to sort of understand that side of games, as I’m interested in becoming a game dev myself.
For a game with timed hits, this is a bad idea.
Who really cares
@@RavenGamingOverLord How's that boot tasting?
@@RavenGamingOverLord Literally anyone with a properly functioning brain.
@@megaman37456 Okay and?
@@bigfatstewie8333 I’m not really doing any of that though. Anyway I just going right back to playing Risk of Rain or hollow knight
Look, I love Nintendo, but even I can tell that this is stupid.
please make merch that says toodles
they also changed some of the dialog in the game
Demake lol
You've earned a sub from me, it is so rare to see someone in the gaming community who has common sense and isn't afraid to call Nintendo out on their BS!
I think the framerate being halved is complete bogus. But unfortunately I think I will still be buying it because my GameCube recently crapped out on me (the disc reader is broken or something) so this is the alternative. Or I guess I could just buy another GameCube.
Call me a consumer all you want, you’d probably be right. But I am still getting it. I think 30 FPS on a 20 year old game is BS tho.
Buy a wii thier really cheap now adays and run gamecube games
I honestly don't care that it's 30fps.
Not everyone can tell a immediate difference between 30fps and 60fps.
No most people won`t be able to notice a difference between 30 fps and 60 fps at least for a RPG like this. Like yes when you compare them side by side there is a clear difference but actually playing it in the moment? The average person won`t notice a difference or at least much of one.
Why don`t you wanna buy a product? Just for the FPS change despite all the changes? Sounds pretty dumb tbh. And the "other product they don`t want" is a actually not great game and isn`t the direction the fans want unlike TTYD. So buying TTYD on Switch is a good thing and is something people want. It doesn`t even run like ass really.
Like they aren`t holding their legacy hostage they are remastering their legacy game.
Is it a worse experience then the original game? Many reviewers and stuff from the game says otherwise, only negative is the FPS change.
I do get the FPS complaint though I really do but it isn`t that big of a deal as you make it out to be.
No? The timing of your actions won`t really be hurt or affected much. It will still have the same pacing and battles will still be the same.
Considering how great the remake looks and seems to be....wanting to get it despite one issue does sound like a heathy consumer product relationship.
Eh....nah this is how the open market works.
How is buying a good remaster conditioning?
Nah this doesn`t make it objectively worse to play, it revovles around meticulous timing button imputs but the fps cap doesn`t make the pacing that much different or slower. So is it a reasonable complaint? Not really tbh. Like did he even play the game?
This isn`t much of a gameplay problem.
From what we`ve seen it isn`t a red flag or makes the game objectively worse, it still looks and runs fine with the timing.
Lower Frame rates don`t always make gameplay worse as it isn`t always noticable in games or will always affect gameplay pacing that much and that applies to this RPG especially.
So no this really isn`t a huge problem.
Again one issue doesn`t outweigh all the improvements so it isn`t a objectively worse experience.
It`s not their fault the average person won`t notice the difference without comparing them lmao.
I mean Oragami King requires percise timing too...
Not everybody is as dumb as you...😂
Somehow I'm reminded of how the switch can run the OG game no probs via emulation, which needs more power than running natively mind you. Just lower the fidelity until you hit 60, in the worst case it would look like a remaster and play infinitely better. but we aren't the devs, nintendo is. watch fans make a 60fps mod for the remake because nintendo couldn't be bothered.
No one gives a simgle fuck about fps, you can't even see a difference, and it's a turn based rpg, fps has 0 impact
If nobody gave a single fuck, there wouldn't be a controversy.
"Yuwu have unrealistic expectations for wanting a game to run at 60FPS in 2024!"
20yr old game: [ran 60FPS]
It also had the resolution of a potato 20 years ago what’s your point
@@haydenbush8518 It is 2024, 60FPS is standard, specially for a 20yr old game :3
@@ZuluZizo You should probably look at the original again, because the framerate is a LOT less consistent than the remake
Can't wait for Harmans defense video, i'm sure he has one. "Nintendo is the best again"
I can get the argument from people that they'd be fine with 30fps (like other recent Paper Mario games) as long as it's smooth and consistent in exchange for the much higher fidelity visuals if they think the visuals are a worthwhile and sufficient trade (it doesn't even bother me personally, although if I had to choose I'd prioritize 60fps over fancier visuals, especially since the OG's artstyle was already great visually and didn't NEED the upgrade that much). 30fps can be plenty fine for games and I've played plenty of 30fps games that don't really suffer because of it.
But people who are saying "99% of people cannot tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps" are MAJOR COPING and that's a load of BULLCRAP. That's a flat-out lie, if you can't tell the difference between 30 and 60, particularly if you're someone who actually plays video games, then I think that's an issue with you and your eyes or something, because the difference is night and day, you can see it instantly. Even child me who had never played a video game except Wii Sports before could tell the difference between seeing Mario Galaxy running at 60fps on my Wii when I got it for the first time and how it looked in the 30fps videos I'd see online. It's not like comparing 60 and 120fps where the difference is more slight and not as noticeable (if someone told me some 120fps footage was 60fps I'd believe them unless I see a direct comparison), because it's not, it's COMPLETELY different. Not to mention the elephant in the room that the ORIGINAL GAME RAN AT 60fps on original hardware, that is objectively a direct downgrade no matter how you put it and that makes it much more sour than if it was a new game that was 30fps, even if you think they made other improvements such that they counterbalance said downgrade.
I also had a short back-and-forth with someone on TH-cam who insisted to me that the original Gamecube version was 30fps on real hardware and that it's only 60fps on Dolphin emulator, claiming that when he played it on Dolphin he "noticed instantly" and that the 60fps felt weird because it wasn't how the game originally worked. He's dead wrong, it was always 60 on real hardware, and yet after I corrected him he still insisted it was 30fps and was incapable of surpassing that on original hardware. So that's a thing too, some people are apparently even gaslighting about the original game.
It’s not even close to a “night and day” difference. 😭
@@Matt-eh2dy Yes it is moron. Higher frame rate objectively makes the gameplay better in all games.
I just don’t get this. Odyssey and Metroid prime remaster was 60fps l can’t imagine this should be harder to run.
This isn´t your ordinary graphics-game...it´s a processor-driven game. You can have shiny graphics...but een the most-powerful GPU won´t help you here, when classic RPG are eating up your cpu-time instead.
Odyssey has simple textures and effects, and Metroid Prime Remastered barely has any graphical improvements, while cutting out certain effects
@@AkameGaKillfan777 You are that Fire Emblem 3H glazer. Not surprised to find you here glazing Nintendo and 30fps. Is there anything you're correct about?
@@saxoncook Learn what glazer means and come back, Alpha
@@AkameGaKillfan777 Look up the slang definition.
Are you an actual PM fan?
Most of the people complaining about this aren’t even actual fans of series.
Origami King also ran 30fps on switch. It’s really not that big of a deal.
I like 60 fps not just for gameplay but also for the smooth animations.
@@Prodzick Like the completely static title screen image and partners with almost 0 expressions or reactions to game events? Lmao
@@AkameGaKillfan777 Yes 🗿
If I'm being honest, I don't care about the 30 vs 60 FPS debate cuz frankly I see both as acceptable so long as they're consistent
to me 60 FPS is what the target for performance should be, while 30 is acceptable so long as it keeps to that consistently, lower than that or when the FPS dips is when I start to have problems, 30 is the minimum of what is acceptable and if it goes below then I concede it is a bad issue
is it a shame the TTYD remake isn't 60 FPS, yeah, but is is the absolute end of the world that completely ruins the game? NO. if it were 30 with frequent performance dips then I'd be upset but from what's been shown its a pretty consistent 30 with few if any drops, again it would be better at 60 but I'm not gonna lose sleep over it being 30
This is probably some small part of why they finally jumped on Yuzu after it being active for so long. Granted, that's a theory. You know what isn't a theory? Nintendo appears to be doing everything in their power to make me save up for a Steamdeck over buying their next console.
Nintendo just took down a Pokémon Mystery Dungeon D&D project by sending a DMCA to some guy on TH-cam with only like 1000 subs. God, I fucking hate them.
*they what.*
@@bracken8782 It's one of the most creative Pokémon projects I've seen, it's fucked up.
@@TheAbsol7448 is there anywhere I can find it or is it nuked off the face of the internet?
@@bracken8782 It was called PMD&D. I'm struggling to find the one that was taken down. I found a Tumblr page that might be it, but what I Heard was taken down was a PDF.
Can you tell me name of the project to see if I can find it.
It you excuse me, I have a strange urge to emulate some Nintendo games.
"99% of gamers won't even notice the difference"
The 1% that does notice: *insert Chad meme*
Idc if a game runs 60 or 30 fps I don’t even notice the quality drop until a bug happens(I’m looking at you redfall) if it runs as 30 and it plays well I’m satisfied. As long as it runs well I’m happy
@@shotpack8374 same, like id get if paper mario was an online competitive game where even the slightest drop in frames constantly matters, but like, its a turn based rpg where the enemies attacks are the same each time they use them
@@leontriestoartI’m a PC gamer through and through and for me having less than 60 FPS always feels like an inferior experience. In multiplayer it’s crucial to have 60+ and in singleplayer it’s just painful and can only be tolerated when you’re trying to run a demanding game on an old rig.
@@Chasodey why though, does it look bad to you or is does it like feel unresponsive or something
@@leontriestoart It's both. It looks choppier and clunkier and it feels less responsible especially in camera movement
Well, when the game releases, I'll dump it to Ryujinx and remove the 30 fps cap.
It would be hilarious if the game is framerate dependent.
Ninty fucked up big time then.
It'd be better if you didn't support them at all.
@@oystersoup3434 nah we need to show them what we want from Paper Mario
@@Wesmoen It looks like exacly that is the case. SInce it was also the case with Paper Mario TTYD in original version!
@@Jdudec367i’ll be emulating and pirating
Listen, if you care about frame rates and actually notice it, that is YOUR problem, I do NOT care, that really sucks for you that you’ll let that make you not play a great game, the graphics got a COMPLETE overhaul and the switch is TINY, that makes sense
Garry’s mod stuff still sucks tho
My boy Joe freeing me from bordem ❤
I can tell the obvious difference between 50 and 60 fps. Lol soon as it sips my antenna go up.
This isn't a matter of laziness, or Nintendo under some conspiracy of Nintendo trying to do the bare minimum because of the belief they could get away with it. I'm not a fan of many of the decisions Nintendo has made. I've criticized them a great deal within the past few years. Even so, framing your position (no pun intended) as such is just tinfoil hat nonsense.
If the game was made to run at 30 FPS, then it was optimized specifically for 30 FPS. It isn't like they took the original game, ported it over, and halved the frame rate. If that was the case, I would definitely see this point of view. As harshly critical as people were of The Origami King (it was largely justified in my opinion), nobody complained that it was 30 FPS. That's because it was optimized to work at 30 FPS, the same way this game is. The reason why people object now is because this is a remake of a previous game, so there is something else that it can be compared to in someone's mind. But that original game worked on a completely different engine with 60 FPS in mind.
This is not to downplay frame rates in general as no big deal. What I'm saying is that while frame rates are a big factor, how a game uses its frame rate, and what is used for, are also of significance. A game could run at a million frames per second, but that wouldn't save it if the game wasn't properly designed around it. So obviously frame rates aren't the be all end all. The slower frame rate clearly isn't holding the game back from a visual perspective. It looks beautiful and the animation is as smooth as freshly stirred honey butter. But what about from a gameplay perspective? Would it affect the gameplay? It probably would affect your ability to do superguards properly, if the game were just ported over without the new FPS in mind, but that isn't what was done. As easily as I can say this wasn't a decision of laziness, I can also say that it wasn't a decision made arbitrarily, either.
This whole discussion really just comes off as “If you aren't as furious about this as I am, you're a delusional boot-licking fanboy.” And while that's morally reprehensible, I would understand if this was coming from a child. But it isn't coming from a child. It's coming from a grown man. A grown man that's acting like a child. I don't know how active your father was in your house, but men aren't supposed to act this way. What if your mother saw this video? Did you ever think of that? You want to make your own mother cry seeing that her son has sunk to such a low level of moral character? I don't think you do. Just think about it.
13:40 You said bloodborne is easier when played on emulator. But its on PS4, and there is no working emulator for PS4.
Also you say that when will sony bring bloodborne to pc, that means you cannot play it on pc right now. Right?
How do these people not realize that by saying “oh it has to be 30fps because the graphics are better” you’re unintentionally saying the nintendo switch is no more powerful than the gamecube basically. If after 20 year and 2 new consoles (3 if u include the wii u), you cant get better visuals at the SAME performance as before…thats sad.
You ain't lying
People forget that there are more graphically intense Switch games that run at 60fps.
Except the GameCube couldn't do anything better than 480i or 480p, and several effects.
Even Hedgehog Engine 2 as much as people like to bash it, has effects Hedgehog Engine 1 doesn't and is more stable.
They cry so much and then you know what happens? They keep buying. Is it really that hard to just not buy the game?
Actually Nintendo did a three'fer. Gary's mod take down, 30 fps, AND the stupid censorship of some goombas talking to Goombella.
Gary's mod was taken down by a troll, and Goombella is 0.001% of the game's whole dialogue
@@AkameGaKillfan777 Doesn't matter if it is 1% or 00001%. It is the principle. Censorship is censorship.
@@CaptToilet Which this isn't
@@AkameGaKillfan777 They changed the dialog completely from the original release. and it completely loses its meaning now. How is that not censorship?
@@CaptToilet ONE CONVERSATION was slightly altered. There are EIGHT MORE FUCKING CHAPTERS that we haven't seen.
I think the funniest part about this is that they could have included a "performance mode" that used the original textures with 60fps. But noooooo. Gotta have high rez textures on a device that can barely run them in a game that relies on QTE's for its battle system. I'll be playing TTYD on my retroid pocket 4 pro, thank you very much.
what? why does the qte part matter? if the frame rate was inconsitent, yeah, but you can expect an attack from an enemy to have the exact same timing each time.
@@leontriestoart You clearly don't understand how framerates work. More frames means your inputs are more responsive. This is why rhythm games run at 60fps. It's simply more difficult to time things at 30fps because there is more input lag. Even if things have the same timing each time.
@@Patrick-bn5rp bro the timing is going to be exactly the same each time a goomba head bonks you, in a game like this if 30fps means you can't time your inputs consistently then idk what to tell you 😭
@@Patrick-bn5rp also rhythm games are like, actually hard and usually need way more precision than your average paper Mario game. Plus you're going to be having way more inputs and it's way more unpredictable than basic enemy attacks that require 1 button press and are extremely easy to memorize the timing
@@leontriestoart Why are you justifying a 60 dollar rerelease of a 20 year old game running at half the frames of the original product? Do you actually hear yourself? Think about that for just a minute. You are paying for a version of the game that runs worse than it did 20 years ago.
Actually what is wrong with you? The game was designed with 60fps in mind. Now the game no longer runs at 60fps. There isn't even a graphics setting to MAKE it render at 60fps in exchange for losing a little fidelity. I guess you just buy up whatever slop they put out. Consume product and then get excited for next product.
That's the reason why Nintendo toke down the mods in gmod? This is stupid. No wonder why everybody hates this company, and they're still people defends this. Why?!
Ok silly
It was a DMCA troll, not Nintendo. Even Gary walked back his initial statement of it being officially from Nintendo.
@@megaman37456 Seriously? Gary should investigate harder next time unless he wants a boy cries wolf situation on his hands in case something DOES happen next time.
@@dinar8749 To be fair the Troll masked his IP to look like Nintendo, meaning only a seriously close look would reveal it was a fake.
@@RavenGamingOverLord shut up
😂 I'm disappointed in the 30fps but I'm still getting it.
Personally i feel like the 30 fps that would be even worse will have to be Metroid Prime 4 because thats a shooter. So I'm hoping that title gets pushed back to the switch 2
They had to completely remake most of Metroid prime for the switch because the switch couldn't run graphical effects the GameCube could do
Yeah, because a GameCube doesn't equal a switch. They don't just iterate on the stuff they had each time. There are certain effects that the GameCube is good at that they found little to no need for, so they removed it for the Switch. For instance, 1 thing the Switch can do better than a modern P.C. is a thing called ASTC texture decoding, which allows textures to be extremely compressed, then decompressed on the fly.
Nintendo is whack. It would be a dream if they just started putting their games on PC too. They'd make so much money.
I would buy all my old GBA games again at the drop of a hat
As awesome at it would be, but realistically, they probably won't.
They'd probably rather go bankrupt instead of porting their games to PC.
@@Nando75549 I'd love to see them go bankrupt and then getting acquired by someone like valve lol
@@iaqh Yeah, but they'd get even more sales if they put their games on PC. And PC isn't all about performance. It's about options. You can choose to use an old PC or choose to get the top of the line.
They would still find an excuse to cap the framerate lol
nintendo makes good games, period. they make amazing games. but what's going on with ttyd?... why 30fps? is there really no performance scraps to have it run 60fps?
reasoning behind copyright takedowns is because fair use doesnt exist in japan.
I know fair use doesn't exist in Japan but they are trying to inforce their laws onto everyone else
That game is not a limited time like 3d all stars i hope. Because if so this is bull shit.
So I have never cared for 30 vs 60fps but to me that wasn't ever the issue here. It's the fact that it ran better on a older console and now it's being sold at a higher price for worse performance. The manipulation is clear. Nintendo sucks for this as well as other shitty practices. They deserve the hate. I don't care about the frame rate it's the resale forcing that's the real issue.
If they were gonna give us half the performance they should have at least charged us half the amount too
generally for most games 30fps to 60 fps is not massive enough difference to discount everything else the game might do right. When it comes to TTYD specifically the halved frame rate is more impactful than most other games due to super guarding, since it is frame perfect (i believe) the remake will have to effectively make it 2x easier to perform reducing difficulty significantly, how much this changes the progression of the remake is left to be seen, but even if the game is worse for it, in this circumstance I personally don't mind unless the drop off is massive (i.e. 9/10 - 5/10 or lower level difference) due to the quality of the original game being a 9.9/10 already, which even for a remake, is a unrealistic expectation to have (i always expect 6/10 i.e. 'Good' for any game I play, to not under or overshoot potential satisfaction with a game, though that is just me).
although I do agree that most people won't notice and/or care about a 30fps to 60fps difference either way. For the casual player, why would they care about frame rate in the first place, if it is smooth (as in not freezes, stutters, or micro stutter) 30 typically would be good enough for them. and for any players with varying visual impairment, even if they do care, they most likely will not notice much of a difference anyways (judging on personal experience, I wear glasses with slightly impaired vision without them, and I can't even notice a difference with a side by side comparison despite being super into games pretty much my whole life. only time I notice a difference is if one of them has a inconsistent frame rate like with 360 Unleashed vs. PS3 Unleashed). The only people who this would be a significant problem for are hardcore fans without visual impairments, which is ultimately a minority of almost any player base.
All that being said, them not having 60fps is still a disappointment, just not a big enough problem to discredit everything else this remake is doing right.
At least Sony/MFST try push their to high framerates, quality, and resolution.
They will never push that for Nintendo games, because they will never make a pricey console. (understandably and sadly)
Nothing new from Nintendo. Twilight Princess and Wind Waker ran better on GC than the Wii U as well.
Bro I can't tell difference between 30 and 60, pc players just complain too damn much about something that really doesn't matter.
Watch a TH-cam video comparing 30 and 60 fps. Make sure your settings are set to 60 fps.
If you still can’t tell the difference, then something’s seriously wrong.
Toxic PC pirates these days no respect
Need I remind these people: the Super Mario RPG remake came out last year and that targets 60fps with arguably more complex graphics.
You cannot be serious
(I should mention that while I tried to stay as objective as possible in my post, I am still biased)
I disagree with a lot of things.
A lot of your arguments are based on the assumption that the devs of the TTYD Remake badly optimised the game. I don't think it's really fair to make such bold accusations, especially as we basically know nothing about the developing process of the game. With the limited hardware power of the Switch you have to make certain choices and compromise.
For example, maybe the graphics they had in mind didn't allow for 60 fps, meaning they prioritized the graphics. And comparing graphics of the remake to different games and flat out saying one looks worse and therefore should be running at least as good is not really objective either as you again assume things. Something looking more demanding is not always more demanding. There could be a lot more going on in the background than we might think.
If you want to criticize the decision to make this game 60 fps then that's fine, but using this chance to shit on Nintendo, without properly understanding the nuances of the situation is just unfair towards them in my opinion.
Furthermore it feels weird that you only thought to include only one side of the argument, being the "Nintendo fanboys", without acknowledging the toxicity of the other side. Claiming that all the people defending the game or the frame rate are blind followers of Nintendo is a bit misleading, when this could very well be retaliation to the toxicity of the other side of the argument, being the people who are unsatisfied with the downgrade in fps or an attempt to maximize the game's sales (not that this is a good thing).
The conclusion people are defending the frame rate -> they are blind followers and the reason Nintendo gets away with everything is simply too rash.
And I'm not saying that one side is better than the other. The toxicity on both sides is insufferable.
In conclusion it feels like you used this situation to trash on Nintendo, instead of having a more objective view (btw I'm not the biggest fan of Nintendo and their policies either).
If you find any contradictions in my post please tell me in the reply section.
Thank you for reading
I agree with everything you said!
Nobody being this aggressive towards developers would be able to make a better remake of the game if they tried
Goddamn I'm having serious Tales of Symphonia remastered PTSD. Like It's going to run better than Symphonia sure but 60 fps with higher resolution would have been way better unless Nintendo doesn't want Skyward Sword remaster situation again.
Advocating to buy product we don't want so we get more product we don't want...
To be fair, that's generally been the mindset for fans of Pikmin for goddamn yonks.
Nintendo: We hate Emulators and made a previously GameCube game that was 60 to 30
Anyone with common sense: And you still wonder why people rather emulate your games!?
Nice joke
@@RavenGamingOverLord It's not a joke, it's a factual statement.
@@megaman37456 I don’t care what you say. It’s a joke to me and everyone else who doesn’t care about what you guys think
@@RavenGamingOverLord so you admit being a troll whose life is a joke lmfao.
@@RavenGamingOverLord So just you and the vast minority of Nintendo fanboys?
Fanboys here meaning people who will defend Nintendo no matter what shitty thing they do, that doesn't make you a fan, it makes you look stupid.
Man even my 10 year old self could tell between games at 30 fps and games at 60. I didn't have a name for it, but I classified them between the ones that "have stutter" and the ones that "don't have stutter". Corporate shills think the human being is stupid
Your 10 year-old self was half-wrong
Personally, I don’t really care about the frame rate as long as it’s consistent. Paper Mario is not a game where I need precision inputs down to 1/60th of a second. For some games being limited to 30fps can really hurt but I don’t think this is one of them.
I hate how every time Nintendo FINALLY does something people have been begging for, there's a catch. Oh, you want a new Star Fox? Take this one with a horrid and gimmicky control scheme, hit or miss level design, mediocre graphics...etc etc. Worst part is when it doesn't sell, they always and I mean always take the wrong lessons away from it. "I guess people just don't want Star Fox"
That's why we as the consumer should vote with our wallets if we want Nintendo to stop thair bs the only thing we can do other than complain about it is just not buy a single Nintendo product that being games merchandise etc
This reminds me of the Tales of Symphonia Remaster debacle, where the framerate, across all consoles iirc, was sliced from 60 to 30 as well.
If the original, for both games, was 30, and they kept it for the new release, it would be lazy, yes, but one could go past it. If you're bringing an old game, tweaked out a bit, to a new, more powerful console, I don't see how you can't maintain the framerate. I'm a Xenoblade fan and Xeno 3 absolutely makes my Switch cry, so I know it's capable of running more powerful games than freaking Pong, yet for Pokemon and this, it seems like Nintendo is kinda scared of pushing their hardware to its limit and provide bold experiences for certain IPs.
For Tales of Symphonia, this isn’t the 1st or the 2nd or even the 3rd time it’s been 30FPS, it’s the 4th time. Tell me you don’t know about this series without telling me you don’t know about this series
Don’t understand people who claim they can’t distinguish 30 from 60. Point about movies is valid, they get a Soap Opera feel and it changes the tonality. It’s distracting.
I wonder if animosity towards people who want better frames stems from stigma towards competitive games. It could also be physical.
There was a study using flicking lights that suggested some people don’t have the visual cortex to distinguish the difference.
Just wait for this to be emulated and run it at a higher frames
The game's out and I'm still waiting for it.
Here's my stance on this whole framerate debate. If TTYD was a turn based rpg in the same style like the original Final Fantasy 7, where all you do is pick an attack and your character does said attack, then 60fps for me is not necessary. Hell, Final Fantasy 7's battle mode runs at 15fps, and people still love that game. However, TTYD also features action commands requiring button imputs at the right time of your attacks. That alone can be affected by a lower framerate.
@@dreadnaught2448 Good thing it isn't then
i would just change the color of the assets and mario to gario in garry's mod
What makes this even worse is the fact that the Super Mario RPG remake was both a significant graphical upgrade from the original AND ran at 60fps like the original, there is no excuse for the TTYD remake not to also run at 60. Also not only can most people tell the difference between 30 and 60fps, most people can tell the difference between 50 and 60fps, if you watch a video of the PAL version of the original TTYD (which runs at 50fps) vs the NTSC version (runs at 60fps), anyone with eyes will quickly notice that the PAL version runs significantly slower, to the point where it is unplayable for anyone used to the NTSC version.
You compare Square Enix to a much smaller company like Intelligent Systems. Of course Super Mario RPG runs 60 with a big company like Square behind it. That's why Mario Wonder runs at 60. Because it's by Nintendo EPD and made without deadlines. I'm almost certain TTYD had to be finished before the new console release relatively soon and they were prioritizing having no framedrops. Because what's worse that having 30 FPS in an RPG? Framedrops in an RPG. Not saying it's good but it's a thing they had to do for reasons we don't know.
1. the PAL version does not run 50 FPS on default, it has a 50 FPS option true but that's not a mandatory thing you can always go with 60 hz
2. The 50hz version was in no shape optimized and was only thrown in, the remake however was built with 30 fps in mind, does the footage on youtube look slower? No it doesn't
3. Luigi's Mansion 30 ran at 30 fps too and nobody made a fuss over it, like a majority of switch games. a higher framerate doesn't mean that a game will play better, there's a few remakes like the 64 zelda ones that people stay away from even if they run 60 fps instead of 23
4. this game's a REMAKE it's REMADE in an new engine with new assets, new lighting and a lot more frames of animation, even the GC did struggle on the large masses of NPCs and they had to put them into really low poly mode, the original Paper mario sacrificed quality, the remake sacrifices some FPS but will run mostly stable except for the mass NPC sections where it might does minor dips.
5. the switch is a hybrid console and nintendo even underclocked some parts of it to make it not overheat or use up too much power.
@ashleyblack7419 I know all this already actually, I'm European myself so I'm perfectly aware of the 60hz mode in the original game, I just mentioned the 50hz version because it is noticeably slower than 60. I actually don't disagree with the rest of what you said though, the framerate is only a minor issue and the game still looks great otherwise and as a SM64 speedrunner I'm fully aware that framerate has nothing to do with the speed of the game but rather how fluid the animations are. I do think the lower framerate is more of an issue than some people trying to brush it under the rug are making it out to be though and it will impact the gameplay in some ways like with superguarding, although admittedly it isn't a major problem and I agree that it's not a deal breaker by any means or worth tearing the whole game down over.
@@tessaPMpro Glad you're reasonable, your original comment sounded a little spiteful.
I mean I'm slowly getting into Majora's mask randomizers which also leads to learning quite a lot of speedrun tricks.
I'm pretty sure the difference will be more lenient than strict, like having 2 frames instead of 1.5. Still is presumably hard to pull off a superguard.
DK64 was specifically built around lag and took measures to make it less noticeable too I guess the devs will know how to cover it up here too.
Many people usually assume PAL games only run 50hz so I wasn't sure you were aware, which is why I wasn't sure you knew.
I'm pretty excited for the game ngl ^^"
@ashleyblack7419 yeah I know I came across as a bit aggressive in my original comment so forgive me, I was pretty badly hungover that day so I wasn't in the best headspace when I made that comment lol. I'm still as hyped for the remake as anyone else!
this comment section is so sweaty
remember when Nintendo made a crappy 3D all stars collection with EMULATED versions of the games and people still got it 🤣
Yep. That situation infuriated me to be honest. Nintendo fans will literally eat up almost everything the company releases, regardless of whether blatantly shitty business decisions directly affect a game’s quality or not. They’ll just settle for it and pretend that it’s all good. The 3D Mario games deserved a better homage.
Okay
@@Probably_JENOVA My god Nintendo fans eat literally anything these days
A barebones console with paid online(P2P so no servers btw) and missing services/features from 2 generations ago? that's 'objectively' better according to Nintendo fanboys and if you like the older consoles better thats just 'nostalgia'
Also remember those people licking all the Wii U ports saying how new innovative they were like we didn't get them 7 years before 🤣
@@ross3695_basedhax Okay silly
I enjoyed it
Nintendo fans are worse than Sony fans. God Miyamoto could shit on their mom and they'd ask for another. And their rebuttals are either completely unrelated or wrong. "As long as pretty colors dance on the screen, you should thank them for the kick in the balls"
I couldn't agree more. Sony fanboys are basically the Apple fans of gaming but Nintendo fans are even more cultish and bootlicky.
Nintendo fanboys are the biggest cucks in the gaming industry. Worse than sony fanboys, worse than xbox fanboys, worse than pc elitists.
imo i feel sony fanboys are worse than nintendo fanboys, nintendo just takes up in the ass with downgrades and straight up broken games for full price while still worshiping nintendo but at least they are quiet most the time, meanwhile sony fanboys screetch all over internet being, toxic af, and if they game flops they create twitter spaces as their safespace and blame xbox for some reason that their game floped
Idk man the ponies are runner ups of best bootlickers when it comes to defending their favorite company too. The big 3 are sucking pp lately.
@@Noscopenoproblem
A pretty accurate description, ngl.
Not this 30fps is better then 60fps argument again. Because this is tiresome.
I don’t really care either way
@@RavenGamingOverLord Then why do you keep making replies instead of moving on with your day?
@@bigfatstewie8333 Ok and why do you feel the need to reply to my comments foolish person?
@@RavenGamingOverLord You definitely care you're posting on every single negative nintendo comment.
The only reason I'm even buying this remake besides to show that old paper mario is better, is simply this: Gonna wait for a 60 FPS mod to drop, then put it on my modded Switch, problem solved.
Nintendo fanboys is really cod fanboys with a mask on.
What?
Except Nintendo doesn’t lay off their employees and overwork them like Activision does so this is just a dishonest comparison.
It'll be good. Dont let this drop hopes. Paper mario is back to its prime
I'm gonna be honest here, I hate that people make such as massive deal about the FPS drop and belittle other people if it doesn't bother them. While adjusting to 30 FPS might take me a bit of time, it's never really mattered to me much. Call me blind or not a real gamer all you want, but I played Bowser's Inside Story several times prior to its remake, and I literally wasn't bothered whatsoever by its framerate being dropped. In fact, I didn't even know it was 30 FPS until other people told me. If someone is genuinely not bothered by the FPS drop and can still enjoy the remake despite it, you can't tell them they're wrong. Everyone's experience is different. You don't know how something feels to someone else because you aren't them.
Also, you do realize that the game industry has been plagued for years by a graphical arms race that continues to skyrocket the price of production and that's a big reason why many large gaming corporations have to use blatantly predatory monetization tactics such as lootboxes and excessive microtransactions, right? I'd much rather support a company that's wiling to ease up on things so they don't have to do that kind of disgusting crap.
this isnt even like tales of symphonia where all the recent ports are based on the ps2 version whitch is weaker then the gamecube so it being 30 fps was excusable.
the switch is way more powerful then a gamecube.
that moment when you love both pc and nintendo games
"Origami King played perfectly at 30"
Did it, though?
Yes
It literally did… a movie runs on 24fps idiot. Do you complain about stutters? Lol this is a slow turn based game. Why would they sacrifice battery life for a higher fps when it literally is a 2D side scroller game
Yes
Yeah it did. The game ran very smooth
yeah? did you experience frame drops or something?
for real,
i think they should just have an option for their future games to run in "performance" mode that has worse graphics but a higher frame rate and an "graphics" mode that has better graphics and worse framerate cuz i feel like this opinion it too devicive. literally half the ppl want 60 and the other half dont care bout 60.
The gmod thing aside(cause I never heard of it until watching this video🤷🏿♂️), the Nintendo defense squad, who are defending Paper Mario The Thousand Year Door being 30fps, are literally condoning Nintendo getting more money, for a lesser product🤦🏿♂️
I have to point out that Taki udon just posted a video proving that the switch hardware is plenty capable of 4k, so there is literally no excuse for 30 fps in 2024
@@swankypants1185 On the tablet itself with 0 hardware modifications, or drawbacks like overheating or a shortened battery life?
@AkameGaKillfan777 it's been awhile since I watched his video on it, but it was a modded switch running Linux and I believe it was just a little overclock. If you want you can search TH-cam with Taki udon 4k switch and it should be the first video.
"i don't want to"
ya know what, fair
The guy talking about getting paper Mario we dont want has nothing to do with the fps its to do with the type of game it is. New paper Mario and old paper Mario are two very different gams
Ttyd is big about frame timing in perfect guards. Also, the price will be 60 despite this.
I think it would've been great if they added the original game with a stable 60 FPS as a de-facto performance option. (From what I've heard about the original, it targeted 60 FPS, but it would dip occasionally during more intensive moments, at least on original hardware.)
I have never played _Thousand-Year Door_ before, so I appreciate that it's being remade for the Switch, and I'm looking forward to playing it. But the fact that it is half the framerate is still a letdown. I can probably get used to the timing during battles, but the 30 FPS criticism is still valid.
Gary himself
I do notice a difference, but imo it's such a good game that people should still try it out.
It sucks that people are already thinking of pirating it when good sales of this could fix the series, and that the next console could possibly fix these issues if it is backwards compatible, but whatever.
I listened to you for 30 seconds and can tell yojr whole life is you complaining on websites good luck witb the channel.
I capped games of my ex at 30 fps using RivaTunerSS without her knowing and she kept complaining something is wrong with her games and she was getting motion sickness while she was playing. Superior cinematic experience guys.
i never really notice the difference in fps. so the thousand year door will most likely look the same to me as the original one.
I play a game called For Honor a 3d fighting mid evil game for years on the Xbox One and when I got my Series X the difference in the frame rate was just night and day.
I don't really mind 30fps for a game like TTYD. It's an RPG. For me, if it's not an ultra competitive shooter or fighting games, 60fps isn't a necessity.
15:30 OMG I AM FRIENDS WITH HIM!!!! I KNOW HIM, I DIDNT THINK HE WOULD MAKE IT INTO ONE OF THESE VIDEOS!!
I play all consoles mainly PlayStation and honestly, 60FPS hurts my eyes so I actually see this as an improvement.
The fact that the remake has plenty of QoL updates (like multiple trouble tasks at once and much snappier party swap to name the ones I could immediately think of) just makes the 30 fps cap all the more sucky
If we got it at 60 fps, this would be the best version beyond the shadow of a doubt. Only time will tell if that will still happen, but the 30 fps does leave a very bad taste in a lot of our mouths
Me personally, I'll wait for a full feature set of this remake to come out and then decide from there
switch glitching trying to run a game with a texture mod from 2001
the switch: kill me
nintendo: later
Because it's literally not a texture mod and the Switch a console with a chip from 2015. 11 years after TTYDs launch. Even Gamecube to Wii wasn't a huge jump. Especially since the Gamecube was a power house and aside from the disk size ahead.
Everything is always ok when Nintendo does it for some reason
Nintendogs defending their daddy just like Sony ponies and Xbots lol
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat While the toxic PC pirates harass and insult anyone for owning a console, I can see why there's a lot of people out there that absolutely despise PC Fanboys and I'm saying this as a steamdeck owner of my own.
Exactly. Sick of nintendo fans defending bad frame rate and graphics.
@@dinar8749 game has good graphics, and fuck 60 fps
@@arzfan29 Nah fuck 30fps and people like you who defend it.
The ps4 can emulated now? I thought that the last gen of consoles couldn't be emulated yet still.
How about you talk about all the pc master race fanboys who have caused multiple problems due to stuff like gta 6 not getting a pc release at launch? Your daddy pyro cynical legit broke his PS5 on stream because of that.
Many pc master race people have been caught lying about upcoming games (like saying gta 6 is going to run at 30fps on ps5, with no sources, and every pc master race person instantly took it as fact), and have done much more, but you refuse to cover any of that..... I wonder why....
Reminder that Bug Fables runs at 60 fps
Bug Fables is pretty good. Not as good as the original ttyd, but it's still good.
Reminder that Bug Fables actually has simple design effects
@@AkameGaKillfan777 reminder that Bug Fables has significantly less staff + budget (+ possibly less experience) than Nintendo
@@DakkaNah2619 And as a result significantly less scope and content
@@AkameGaKillfan777 And this translates to Nintendo (The triple-A, long standing, very much not just a small group of people, is their own publisher and producer) not being able to have good performance and good visuals because?
Edit: might I add, not even making new content other than more faithful localization.
This whole debacle is the reason why i gave up on Nintendo and the switch in general.
Proof that FPS effects gameplay.
Speed running certain games require 200+ fps to perform techniques not possible at lower frames.
Why is that? Hmmmm…
Spoken just like someone who has never played the series
@@AkameGaKillfan777 what series? I didn’t mention any series.