90 Day Fiancé - (Mike & Natalie #69) - Cheating - Therapist Reaction
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ส.ค. 2021
- Dr. Kirk Honda, couples therapist, reacts to 90 Day Fiancé - Mike and Natalie. Includes clips from 90 Day Fiancé, Happily Ever After?
Therapist reaction to the reality television.
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#90DayFiancé #90Day #MikeandNatalie - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I'll take relationship advice from Jovi the day he stops flirting with strippers in front of his wife...
Exactly..dont judge unless be judged
The cast when a woman breaks up with someone and goes on one date with someone else 6 months later: 🤭😵💫😩😡😧🤬😑😱
Meanwhile when fucking angela was cheating on Michael being still in a relationship with him nobody said shit
@@mariq_1701 She was "Nooow-she-ay-tid"!
@@thedudeabides5695 OMG LOL
@@mariq_1701 I wouldn't even look in Angela's direction for fear of becoming a target - but yeah good point. They are all ridiculous, they need to worry about all their own little relationships.
I really am bothered how Natalie was treated during this tell all. They vilified her and made Mike the victim. They just weren’t a good fit from the start. Nobody has to be the “bad guy”.
She just wants to be left alone
she deserved to be treated that way. She did worst to Mike and if he was such a bad guy, why did she wanted to marry him so much? yeah, she needed that permanent resident card...
Agreed
What you wish for others will hit you first. Karma is a vicious witch.
Mimi Laure typical xenophobic thought, but you don’t sound to be fluent in english either.. do you put americans on pedestals?
"He didn't _look_ gay" 🤦♂️
Classic Jovi stupid thing to say lol
That *really* annoyed me. Even accounting for how stupid he is at the best of times, That was too much.
Because it is never possible to tell that someone is gay.Must be really hard for the gay community who can NEVER tell if a potential love interest might be gay.Unless of course, they sometimes can and you are trying way too hard here
@@gideonbrown2366 um no they arent. U cant tell what everyone likes. I dont participate in any of the pride stuff and dont talk about it. One of my teachers was and I didnt know for years thought he was straight. Sometimes u can but not every single time. Pretty sure Natalie would straight up say she was dating someone. I would.
@@gideonbrown2366 That loud sound was The Point roaring past over your head.
Omg, when people break up they might start new relationships? What? 😂 This show is something else, sometimes. Totally agree with Dr. Honda, when the relationship is ended, you're free to do what you want.
She should have gone back to her country. She was here contingent upon her being married to an American. I guess TLC or some company has provided her with a work visa.
I guess the issue here was that they didn't tell each other clearly "We're breaking up, it's over", she only said "I'm leaving" while moving out. Usually you would take it as the end of relationship but she already came to US to marry him after she gave him engagement ring back, it's kinda difficult to understand this couple :-D
@@pinkivy93 “Go back to your country” much? Lol, only in America can you hear such nonesense. And England. Two sides of the same coin.
@@crimson3sky This is my county of origin. I did not marry someone, walk out after 6 months and go square across the country after I gained entry. You are being racist. Let’s not do that here.
Natalie was lying and idk why. Why did she feel the need to lie? Is she stringing Mike along so she can stay in the US? Otherwise, there was no need for her to lie
bullies always finds something negative about you, this is just plain bullying
I remember thinking that too. Everyone gaining up on Natalie while she barely responds.
She enjoyed her secret of living Florida with Mike's bank card.
What happened to the girl that wanted a baby and was so religious from the Ukraine?
Not Jovi thinking he is the moral compass now 😂🥴 my guyyyy
Also, watching that whole scene was BRUTAL. When people break up, including divorce, they need to have these conversations, ideally before facing such a public forum. So awful, devastating. Who needs a Julia or jovi monkey jumping on your back in what is already a super difficult moment?
"We were on a break!" - Ross from Friends.
Mike seems like he doesn't know what he truly wants. But going along with the majority about your own life isn't always the best bet. Also Julia needs to worry about her own life. If Natalie doesn't want to go back to her country that's her right. It doesn't mean she didn't love Mike, it means she came to America to spend time with her husband who had more commitment to work than she could handle.
What happened to Mike's uncle, who apparently lived on the property (in the barn...?)
Natalie shooed him off, right? Wonder where he went...
Don't forget that this is Natalie's 3rd marriage and within each marriage she has tried to get her husbands to come to America every time. Not that Natalie didn't love and enjoy Mike, but she knew where he lived and what he did for work. Something about Natalie is so off...
@@cassieg4874 who cares...a lot of people are married multiple times. Natalie wanted children and and ex husband's didn't. that's why they broke up
@@pinkpugginz There is nothing wrong with being married multiple times. If it didn't work out it didn't work or if other things happened. My point is that with every marriage, she tried to get them to come to America. She is better off trying to get a job here and going through the other types of visa's instead of marriage after marriage. Obviously with covid now, things are different when it comes to getting over here but she might have had better luck coming over for a job or continuation of education. The things that are dug up by the U.S when it comes to immigration is intense and detailed. They look at everything especially if you have married someone before who might have been a US citizen or have certain privileges here in the U.S.
@@cassieg4874 there was no where in this show were they said anything about her getting her ex husbands to move to America
For people who are saying she needs to go back to her county - do you realize the committment that an immigrant makes when they leave their home country to start over in an entirely different country? They leave everything behind to come here and to start a new life. To just tell them, ok now you need to go back since the marriage didnt work out, is just totally unfair and unrealistic. So now because the marriage didnt work out, the American doesnt need to up and move their life because they are in their home country but the individual who immigrated here must up and move their whole life once again.
They don’t because Americans have the mindset and they are morally and ethically correct and others aren’t. Besides this sense of economic power that makes any outsider less worth it.
As someone who moved countrys for their SO, i actually disagree. I had to gave up everything aswell but the moment it didnt workout anymore i left the country again. I came for that person and not to parasite my way into her country.
Sure the people should have the chance to stay, but i would not say he needs to stay married to her so she can stay in the states.
But each their own.
Mike wasn’t anything more than a doorway for her, for someone like Julia who has been accused of being a scammer relentlessly it’s a but personal.
xenophobia and assholes. I'm SICK of hearing people talk like this about immigrants
@@Larserus just because you decided to leave the country doesn’t mean Natalie has to as well. Calling her a parasite is not cool or right.
Everyone on this show knows that bringing someone on the K1 Visa means you are financially responsible for the person coming over for 10 years even if the relationship doesn't last
That's true unless they get a job.
You just have to pay public assistance if they qualify for it
That's only if they're on government assistance. They'll have to lay that money back.
K9 lol
I didn't know that
This whole tell all just made me so frustrated and sad.. Angela acts like garbage and hey "that's just Angela" but no one could perceive that Natalie had actual clinical depression from this shitty relationship...
But I guess it's obvious, Angela is American and Natalie isn't..
Yep
It's the way of things. We killed Jesus. The village goes with the person with social status almost every time. Mike's mom is a white supremacist. Mike is messed behind it. Have a good life Natalie.
Everyone is scared of Angela. No one said anything DURING her freakout. They all defended her actions AFTER she left. Natalie is an easier target to gang up on.
I don't think the credit card being active would be strange to these people if she were American. They're separated but legally married. They still don't wish ill on one another. It's not strange for couples to take time do split their finances. He brought her to America, it didn't work out, that doesn't mean he wants her homeless? It also REALLY bothers me that Mike always gangs up on her with other people around. Like when she asks how he feels, he never says anything but if his mom or other cast members start bashing he always participates.
Yeah it’s really not hard to call up the bank and turn off the card. If it’s in his name obviously that takes two seconds, but if it’s in her name, then it can be done too. There’s a reason he’s choosing not to. I think a major piece of this is legally he is financially responsible for her for 10 years…or indefinitely…can’t remember.
Why does Jovi think he's caught Natalie cheating?!! Clearly if she went out with him and Yara she didn't consider it to be a secret?! Also who cares if she's dating or not?! Certainly Jovi shouldn't as he is MARRIED AND FLIRTS WITH STRIPERS IN FRONT OF HIS WIFE!!! Jovi is the last person to comment on anyone's marriage or divorce!
yeah he goes to the strip club all the time and he thinks he "caught"her
I’m glad he exposed that bish. If it wasn’t a big deal she would honestly answered the question about dating. But she lied. If she wasn’t taking money from Mike and was in the process of divorce no one would care. But now she looks like a scammer / user that she is
@@OksanaOksana1 wow!
Not so much caught cheating as caught in a lie.
@@OksanaOksana1 It was her gay makeup artist that she went out to dinner with and Mike was also seeing other people and had certain explicit content leaked while they were separated.
The cast ganging up on Natalie was disgusting and extremely triggering to me personally. It represents the worst of humanity to demonize others.
I agree, the behavior we’ve seen from her is not uncommon in relationships, why is everyone acting like she’s treated mike the way angela treats michael? As if their relationship is perfect and nobody fights? Even if it were, what gives them the right to criticize her? Just because their relationship didn’t work out after marriage doesn’t mean it was only because of the green card. I am most disappointed and disgusted by julia though, and i think nobody said anything about angela’s god awful verbal abuse towards michael because, as sad as it is, she is the american in the relationship.
@@chupachups2236 All great points. I think it is a potentially a combination of Mike's attitude, Natalie's kookiness, and Natalie being the foreigner/woman that made the cast feel like they could attack her. This idea that she should be punished - cut off financially and sent back to Ukraine. Like what? She made major sacrifices for Mike, he doesn't see it at all. Being stuck in that house on a hill alone all day without a car (they only had that one car Mike took to work) sounds like literal hell on earth. If Mike was a good guy he wouldn't allow such vicious attacks on a woman he claims to have loved, yet alone participate.
Yara threatening to go back to Ukraine I think is smart on her part and shields her from certain types of attacks.
I'm now beginning to think Julia is total pick me. Relationships are so so personal and you never know what affection two ppl shared and what went on behind closed doors. It is totally unreasonable to take such a harsh stance. Her relationship could've easily not worked out also. Would she want others shouting "go back to Russia"? Seriously. And then saying Mike needs a woman to cook him steak every night? What? Just seems like pick me/mean girl behavior tbh.
@G S exactly, I feel so bad for natalie, the comments under her instagram page are appalling. She’s either really strong or doesn’t care, and I actually really respect her for putting up with so much bs. I hope she gets support she needs, though, it’s really unfair for her):
My ex-husband helped me financially for a bit after we separated because I’d been a stay-at-home mom and had no skills, which is akin to Natalie’s position. I’m slightly annoyed that Mike seems to be leveraging that against her
Oh but according to her she is a high class high IQ journalist and he is a drunken oaf.
Yeah I mean that's why alimony was invented. BUT something that everyone is ignoring is that she is getting paid to be on the show.. so she's not completely dependent on him
wow I can't believe he did that. most men kick the SAHM out with nothing
@@politicaltroll8920 he does have an alcohol problem
@@pinkpugginz Yeah, we’re still good friends and we were so young at the time. We got divorced when things were starting to get bad, but we didn’t hate each other yet lol
Notice how all the toxic people are piling on Natalie. Jovi? Tiffany? Angela? Andrei? Elizabeth? Julia? These people need to worry about their own terrible relationships.
She’s not hanged up on. She’s being called out.
Isn't Mike now responsible for.Natalie.financially for up to ten years? I thought that was the arrangement each couple had to agree to in order to sponsor someone.
It's not cut and dry. There are many variables.
Maybe lawyers have forums like in Reddit or something. Would be an interesting topic for immigration lawyers to discuss openly so the public knows what to expect before getting into trouble lol
No, we are not financially responsible for our spouse. We are responsible for any debt they accumulate if they can’t repay it. It’s not like it’s our job is to pay their lifestyle because we sponsor our SO’s.
When Kalani discussed divorce with the lawyer he explained that the law changed from 10 years to indefinitely. This is the case even if they divorce.
@@SteffLowe things have changed.
This Jovi is a toxic person. Is not his place to go and spill things from other people and attack them like he is superior. His relationship is a mess and he is a bitter boy. Ewww!
You're breath is toxic 🤣
@@picho5553 I mean she's not wrong.
If I were in Natalie's position I would also lie and say I weren't seeing people, solely to not hurt Mike any further and avoid "digging the knife in deeper" so to speak by implying that I'm moving on and doing fine. I wouldn't want to humiliate mike on live TV by making it seem like my life is great and he is still clinging to the relationship. If Mike had said he was seeing other people, i wonder if Natalie's answer would have been different.
I don't think lying about whether or not you're seeing other people is necessarily nefarious when you've already broken up. Especially since that information can further hurt the people who are in a messy divorce/breakup and probably still mourning the relationship's end.
You're a nice person.
Lies don't help. What helps is gentle honesty. Like...been out on a couple of dates nothing significant......helps convey moving on without the "hey yah I'm out evry night new guy screwing my brains out" stuff. My late husband promised to keep many things intact because I was going to get my masters degree when we separated....it was all part of the separation agreement settled with lawyers. 3 months into school I was served with divorce papers and a letter severing the separation extras like car insurance, medical benefits etc. He had already proposed to another woman before we even sold our home. So he was lying the entire legal separation negotiations. It didn't ease anything....
They ganged up on Natalie. Mike finds his strength when other talk or disrespects, Natalie, The Group all shouted at Natalie and Mike did not defend her. Trish was disrespectful to Natalie and Mike doubled-teamed Natalie with his mom.
Colt did this, too.
It's really sickening
Yea, cause she's a manipulative liar.
100%. If Mike was a decent human he wouldn’t relish in others attacking her.
@@GS-xs3we Have your eyes checked.
I think it's gross that these other folks seem to think that no matter how miserable someone is, a k1 somehow means that you MUST remain with them. And if you don't, then you MUST go back from whence you came. Natalie isn't cargo. Even if she cheated, she's not obligated to remain with him. The 10 year thing sucks but so does the financial part of the institution of marriage in general.
I’m someone who is involved in the visa process with my husband. The K-1 visa is specifically for someone who will marry within the 90 days of entering the USA once you marry you have to go through adjustment of status. That is when the couple goes to the immigration office and present that you are living together and have an ongoing relationship. If immigration does not see that they are living together, the foreigner spouse can be deported. There are special circumstances when they allow them to stay in the USA
@@Michelle_sal that shouldn't tie someone to someone else for life if a relationship doesn't work. It's ridiculous to hang citizenship on who you're in a relationship with. What if they're being abused? Otherwise the k1 is just glorified trafficking.
has it not changed to the rest of his life? I thought it was no longer 10 yrs but forever... that is what they said about Tiffany and Ronald.
@@ElayaHell oh idk but man this system is fucked up
@@eriskalli I am pretty sure its for life now because that is what they said about Ronald and why Tiffany's dad backed out of sponsoring him...
Mike was really cut off his emotions. This relationship is dead and he kept implying that she would get through her emotions and come back, what in the world makes you think that's possible when you have no contact with her, she lives in a different state and you don't seem to want to get back together, not that i would want them to, but wow to me it seemed like he had forgotten everything that happened. Like it was just a pause, but Natalie left and clearly said this was over.
Right, he doesn’t seem to understand social cues or to have any experience with serious relationships because he always acts like nothing really matters , i think he would take her back if she wanted to comeback, its pretty sad.
@@fortunesmilesuponme he would accept her back, to punish her some more. It's wild.
@@princesstelevision67 oh, this would totally happen if she came back. It would be the ring thing all over again
I think he is simply love blind and has been living in hope and expecting her to come back, thats why he has been ok paying and supporting her and now it's dawning on him that she is dating and open to new people he is pissed.
@@princesstelevision67 people who like Control will take you back so they can do the leaving. 👍
Mike is legally responsible for Natalie for 10 years! Why are all the Russian/Ukrainian women ganging up against Natalie?
Seriously. Mike didnt cancel the paperwork when it was clear that he was done after he visited in the Ukraine.
He legally has to pay her bills and give her money to sustain herself.
Cutting her off financially can have him end up in legal hot water.
It isn't so cut and dry. There are many variables.
They're not doing Mike any favours either. They signed the same affadavit and should know blocking the card will force her to sue. It's been six months, deal with it like adults.
Michael can still pull the Affidavit of Support. Jonathan did.
@@jola381 If that were true, then the AOS would have no meaning.
It is also possible that when she said "I'm not going to scream..." regarding the divorce, maybe Mike is saying that hoping that she would come back, and that Natalie is at the point where she's ready to let go and not play into that game.
I think she took it as a threat. Mike seems like the type who wants her to break down sobbing and crying "no, not a divorce. I'll be good. We can make it work. Please don't leave me"
@@nyxnecrodragon4256 You explained it better than I did. That's what I meant! It seems like, in their won ways, they want the other to chase and beg. Familiarity breeds contempt happening right in front of us...
@@nyxnecrodragon4256 It is a threat because a divorce puts her immigration and financial position in a bad position. It's not just about the relationship.
@@belladonnabudgets7362 Dr. Kirk's "Jump-In-The-Pool" analogy is spot-on! When asked if they were over, they BOTH waited for the other to answer 1st!
Watching people gang up on Natalie who can't defend herself in English well is so hard to watch. She isn't a bad person. I can tell she had good intentions but I can also see that Mike is just fine with everyone trying to bully her back into a relationship she isn't happy in.
Yes mike liked when his mother puts her down too..which was hard for natally
In my opinion, it wasn't a real relationship. Mike didn't like Natalie after he visited her in her country and she didn't like him but when she got her visa they probably saw a way to pay off his debt which he talked about the first season. They always look like they were acting to me. Even in the finale Mike tried to look sad but I don't know what Natilie was trying pull off. She needs to start off at square one with those acting lessons. Hopefully next season they get some ' real' couples.
All those couples with their own disfunction should stay 🤫 quiet. Paaalease.
That’s the problem, they’re just trying to keep the heat off themselves.
It's probably part of their contract to bring up certain talking points at the "tell all". Everyone has something to say. They are being paid to participate.
@@niklet9246 you are right. I get caught in the drama.
@@Yolduranduran Me too! :-)
Why in the world was everyone attacking Natalie. How is she the bad guy here? Trying to have a relationship with Mike is like having a relationship with a brick wall. She is acting completely reasonably
Why she married him if he is so bad? The answer is obvious she used him, this makes her worse than him
@@OksanaOksana1 why did he marry her if she is so bad?
@@OksanaOksana1 why did he bring her to America if he couldn't forgive her and wouldn't work on things?
Because she saw where he lived and begged him to marry her, then ditched him. Her apologies were empty and she admitted as much during production interviews.
@@ifjc7216 Rewatching these two it’s pretty clear she was in the drivers seat the whole time and was pushing things at a faster pace than he was comfortable with. I still fault him for bringing her over tho.
Why is everybody attacking her because she had a date? A Witchhunt on TV😭
Maybe Julia and Natalie had conversations privately like with Yara? That’s why she said “you forgot” and “we discussed this.” I think they all speak the same language?
Also I’ve read the actual money Natalie is spending from Mike accounts is the TLC earnings they got. Which I mean she’s entitled to.
The way they all ganged up on her and even people online think Mike is a victim is so frustrating! 🤯🥴🥴🥴
He absolutely is the victim of this psycho.
Natalie had Mike's credit card so he knows exactly where she was by the charges.
Julia called Natalie two-faced, probably about her not wanting Mike to have female friends, or believing that a man and woman could be just friends (she stated this in a previous tell-all). I think Natalie said she went through therapy about that and she worked through her issues around that topic.
Julia is insecure and hateful lol. she has old world sexist attitudes behaviors and internalized misogyny
Thank you. I don’t understand why people tend to forget the things she says.
This tell all screamed fake/ exaggeration to me as if the cast is saying crazy stuff just to keep the show interesting and to stay on the payroll...
I'm so triggered by this. So a woman can't have male friends now? Jovi needs to STFU especially given he pays more attention to strippers than his wife....in front of his wife. I feel the septics in this particular episode are just tearing into Natalie and the foreign partners are following suit to placate their other half.
There is a weird Russia vs. Ukraine undertone to some of these cat fights. Wut up with that?
Exactly! but Julia is a piece of shit for stopping Brandon seeing his female friend? Wtf..
She stopped talking to him for having female friends sooooo
@@neshisquirrel032 the idea was how two faced these people are, Julia is a piece of shit but Mike is a victim for doing the exact same thing. I wonder what the obvious difference between these two might be hmmm (want three guesses?)
but didnt the last tell all involve Natalie getting mad because Mike slept on a female friend's couch when visiting to attend the friend's wedding? And her saying that men and women cant just be friends?
Mike is certainly not being honest about not dating. He had a gf after the breakup with Natalie who released revenge porn of Mike
that's awful. as if he wouldn't already have major traumas.
it wasn't revenge porn it was a blogger who Mike contacted and sent a naked selfish with it all hanging out
@@pinkpugginz I was trying to keep it vague. There's a video of him pleasuring himself out there, which thankfully, I haven't seen
Wow
Part of bringing someone to the US is being financially responsible for them. When you apply for the K1 Visa you as the American have to agree to be responsible for the immigrant. Mike knew and signed up for it. I think he’s financially responsible for her for 10 years.
From Kalani’s video, the responsibility is longer than 10 years
Yeah, they changed it from 10 years, he's responsible for her for the rest of her life now.
Nah you just have to pay back whatever public aid they collect. The idea of “high class” Natalie on welfare gives me a chuckle. She would die of shame.
I believe it has been changed to 15yrs. Not the rest of her life. Either way..once he divorces her he is no,longer responsible for her. He
Aid for her bills for six months and delayed the divorce because he was hoping ( like a fool ) that she would come back to him. Obviously he is not on Social Media has Natalie was sighted out and about Miami with a particular man who I believe is the one who traveled with her to New Orleans. As she is a liar..she was basically using Mike ( as she did from the beginning) to pay all her bills while leading him into thinking there was a chance of reconciliation. That is why she glared at Jovi when he brought up this man. Natalie ought Mike would never hear about it. She is despicable, a liar, manipulative and seems to think her beauty is such that she can twist any man around her little finger. Personally..her character makes her look hideous. Perhaps she has fooled lots of you but I remember everything about her and her two previous marriages. Word on the street is that she has signed up for 90 Day Single Life so she will NOT be returning to her country. Whether they have started filming that and she is getting paid is another story. If Mike cuts off his bank card then she'd better hope her new man supports her until then. She used Mike to get her green card and we all knew once she got it..she would leave him and look for someone with more money. So said..so done. Trisha was right from the beginning and Mike is a fool for living in hope that Natalie would ever go back to him. Personally...they both deserve each other.
@@michellemichougraham198 they were married in WA state. She is entitled to spousal support. Mike is a grown up. He entered this relationship with his eyes open. I do not see her as any of the things you are saying. Mike can do his own research on his partner, he’s not a kid.
I really hate this notion that 2 people whose sexualities line up cannot be friends, they have to be sexually and/or romantically attracted to each other and act on it 🙄
Yeah but to fly with this guy from Florida, stay in a hotel together in New Orleans and double date with a married couple? She should just come clean but she wants that bank card and desperately doesn’t want divorce proceedings before she gets her residency status.
Natalie doesn't believe that men and women can be friends.
@@lavinder11 that was Julia who said that; not Natalie right? And I have traveled with a platonic friend of opposite sex with absolutely nothing happening; Ppl have narrow lives if one can't envision having that type of relationship
@@monchiquita25 Natalie said that about Mike's female friends in their 1st season and she agreed with Julia when she said that at the last tell all. That's why Julia called her two faced.
She addressed that she worked on that limiting belief with a therapist. Therefore, your premise is not valid at it was addressed by the perpetrator through therapy.
Maybe it's just me but when Natalie said 'If you think you can find someone better than me, I will pray for you' I did not take that as a compliment. I took it as an insult. She she was the best woman he could get and he lost her. Just my opinion.
I agree with you there. Her superior attitude stinks
I feel like this scene is super triggering tbh like Natalie really didn’t do anything wrong. Her and Mike broke up after having a terrible relationship and it’s scary to see how everyone things she shouldn’t be able to break up with him and date other people. There’s the argument about her going back to the Ukraine and obviously she will have to eventually but it’s so weird how these Americans (and Julia lol) have the perspective that if their foreign partner breaks up with them they should immediately evacuate the country.
right lol I moved in with a partner in another city. we broke up and I moved to another place across town. logic says this is totally fine. why would you force someone to leave the country because they broke up I don't understand
Yes! Yes!! 💯 agree
It’s hard to watch someone be completely gaslighted like this. I don’t know if I can watch de. Honda’s reactions of these types of videos anymore. It feels too uncomfortable
I think Natalie’s therapist told her not to react so strongly to defend herself on this TV show against Mike. It’s clearly mentally draining for her and in this tell all she’s just given up with defending her reputation.
Natalie may not have her green card yet, which is why she doesn't want Mike to divorce her because that would mean going back to Ukraine. Also, I think that's why they haven't filed for divorce yet because they both had an agreement to do so after she has her green card and can legally work.
yes
Your videos are super helpful for learning to navigate relationships. Thank you so much for making these. 😊
it kills me how people think they can judge each other on shows like this. i as a viewer cannot pretend i don't get amusement and entertainment from the conflict, but i don't use it to sit on my high horse because i have problems of my own. we have watched ALL of these couples showing their asses at some point and i dont understand how they don't approach every other person with grace and understanding considering this
100% agree. Can’t believe how rude and disrespectful they all are to each other. Just so much judgement.
They're not on the show because they're wise, gracious people. That wouldn't be entertaining at all.
Mike is financially responsible for 10yrs. regardless if he divorces her. Unless he didn't file the Affadivit of Support with a Change of Status.
Thats only if she gets her green card, I don’t remember if she ever did get it.
@@FabiolaMacabre That why I said if he actually filed for the status change.
@@carolhern if I remember correctly from when My husband an I applied for mine(not a k1 but I’m assuming it’s similar cause marriage) , you apply for the change of status AFTER you get your green card. Im confused by your reply tbh 😅. I just wonder if she did get her green card cause if she did ,then she should be working already and she’d be fine until she has to renew the status of her temp two year green card to a permanent status (10 yrs). I went thru it a few years ago too so idk if rules have changed since.
Edit: I checked because I wasn’t sure and you’re right, there is one change of status you apply for at the beginning as well as the affidavit, the other change of status comes after when you get the permanent green card or the citizenship, I don’t remember which 😅.
@@FabiolaMacabre You apply for a change of status after you get married. With that an Affidavit of Support is included stating that sponsor is financially responsible for 10 yrs or until the immigrant has completed at least 40 quarters of work. But you are correct, that applies once the immigrant is granted the green card. Many times, because of the cost of filing and lawyer fees (you don't need a lawyer, but many hire one) the couple generally waits some time before filing for a green card after the marriage. So I am not clear if Mike actually submitted the change or not. I would assume so. Knowing Natalie can't work yet, I think it's a dick move to just financially cut her off. At least give her a budget and come up with a compromise that until some time after employment he will cut her off. But again, this is what a divorce lawyer is for. Natalie can also get a divorce lawyer, and ask in the settlement that Mike pay the lawyer fees as well as provide some alimony for 2-3yrs until her immigration proceedings are concluded.
@@carolhern Why should she get 2-3 years of Alimony? She didnt even stay with him that long. Dont you usually have to be married for several years before you can alimony? Also its not entirely unfair since he has been paying for her life for 6 months. He probably paid for her move to florida, apartment, clothes, food, everything. Her trip to see Yara and Jovi was probably paid for by him. And we know he has a lot of debt. So its not entirely unfair for him to say no more. It would be nicer if he offered to pay to fly her home or another country where she can legally work and support herself. But she left him so why should he have to pay for years?
If I had to guess, TLC probably told some of the cast mates to hone in on Natalie to stir up drama. Especially since Natalie is an easy target to trigger. They’ve done it before in the past 🤷♀️
I think the "scream" thing is a translation error of something in her native language. I haven't learned Russian since I was 14, so I don't remember much. However, as a language teacher I know mirror translating an expression in your native language is common. It's what's often weird to me about native English speakers. They always seem to assume that the foreigner is saying what they mean. A lot of people speak English very poorly and the errors may not be the obvious ones.
Yeah I took it to mean more like "I won't object"
People constantly conflate divorce and separation. Heuristics and biases are an ever present threat to reality, clear thinking and progress. I wish like the times table, we could all rattle off a list of different cognitive distortions we all have so we could recognize them in ourselves and others. It would help beyond measure.
Wholeheartedly agree. Most people hate when it's pointed out to them because it's a threat to their ego. Being right/comfortable in their own minds is more important to them than accountability, charitability, and the truth. It is the ROOT, and until humans change their nature, it's the way it will be, sadly.
@@k.d.2589 I can relate to that sentiment. Sometimes I feel like Spencer’s Reid from a Criminal Minds bc I know so many random facts, and use them to analogize seemingly unrelated things but actually share a underlying principle or pattern that i use to solve a problem or clarify something. I graduated from psych on the deans list so I have all that knowledge too plus what I’ve learned from Honda, and now I feel like I have a lot of mental clarity yet no one cares to hear any of it. And I think you hit the nail in the head, fragile ego. I am young and female and come from families where children are seen and not hear (same with women) and they still treat me in that category. I just stay silent at family functions, even at my engagement party no one asked how we got engaged, how we met etc. How sad tho hey? They are so wrapped up in their own lives and threatened to give me attention for even a day. I wish they’d study Honda’s videos they would open up worlds.
Cognitive dissonance is one of my favourites but confirmation bias and hindsight bias are definitely in my top ten. Everyone should also know defence mechanisms and personality study. There’s so much information out there but it’s hard to force yourself to constant learn and throw away ideas you’ve based your life on. Not even talking about something big like religion… it’s crazy but we need the knowledge in one side and the emotional side like Honda talks about it. It’s so hard to find it alone in this world.
@@deannabanman243 I'm so glad you shared this with me. I feel like I've finally met someone who understands the importance of having an open-minded and charitable view of life - through our own various ways of processing (rational or not) and engaging with the world around us. It sounds like the environment you grew up in was not so, and yet you grew to be better. That is inspiring. I have similar experiences, although not so blatant with the gender roles and more so with stature.
I understand your frustration as well. I studied psychology to be able to deal with people better, as my people skills were abysmal and what seemed entirely illogical to me was normal to others (ASD). I came to the same conclusion you did about learning unhelpful thinking styles and cognitive distortions. Unfortunately, I also know that education alone doesn't cut it. People here learn about logical fallacies in school yet continue to unabashedly use them to "one up" people in arguments to protect their ego/reputation. Only rarely do people deviate.
Edit: I forgot to mention that I think it's important not to give up on others entirely. As you mentioned, it can get very lonely being one of the few who can see all of the inconsistencies and unhelpful behaviours. I learned to be warm and welcoming when I have the energy to try to point people in the right direction. Honey catches more flies and all that. It gets better results than stewing in silence. c:
Mike made Natalie gravel for every morsel of attention.
Why would she stay in Washington? She doesn't really know anyone except Mike & his Mom who rode her like Seabiscuit & clearly despised her.
If she had an opportunity to go to Florida, it would be crazy for her not to take it.
She said she joined a Ukranian meet-up group where she met this guy friend, which would be perfectly logical considering she's from Ukrain.
She asks this guy friend if he would go with her to New Orleans because she didn't want to go by herself.
Again, makes perfect sense that a single woman, unfamiliar to the country & traveling so far would ask a male friend to go with her to feel safe.
In fact, I would think it very unwise for her not to.
"Jovi, were they behaving as a couple? Were they affectionate with each other?"
"Well no, I didn't see anything like that...nothing to suggest they were more than friends openly, but because I entertain every free chance I get at the strip club, and I know what I do behind Yara's back, I know there is no way possible for a guy & girl to be just friends.
And because I am the master of healthy relationships, I feel I have the right to place judgement & condemn her for such dispicable behavior!
Mike, why haven't you filed for divorce yet from this little harlot?"
Julia's attacks against Natalie seem to be more personal. Is there a feud between them outside the show? I don't understand her level of nastiness against her.
Actually, I don't understand how the entire bunch gangs up on Natalie like bullies.
Seems so unfounded.
It would be difficult to express & defend yourself clearly when english isn't your first language.
Natalie speaks english well enough to get by everyday, but not well enough under pressure of attack from everyone. I think that's part of why she shuts down verbally. She's misunderstood & it frustrates her.
Mike needs a dominant woman like his mom who will kick him in the a$$ & drag his feelings out of him when he's pouting.
Natalie needs someone to do the same for her.
....and they lived happily ever after.
The End
@@anneliakinde intriguing idea!
@@anneliakinde Interesting....I wonder? Good thought!
Damn doc, this is the first time you've gotten all your assumptions wrong - lol!!
Dr Honda, could you make a video about avoidant attachment style? I have just realized that I am an avoidant and don't know how to change that . How do you shift to secure attachment style?
he has many episodes on that topic
join the patreon and listen to lots of his talks about this
Mike was still hoping she would come back. Paying her bills and said she would “get things out of her system”. How many times does this guy have to burn his hand on a hot stove?
I also appreciate Yara’s imitation of Natalie’s awkward giggle-non-answer.
I know! He’s such a sweetheart. I do feel for him! 😔
He strikes me as the type that would want her to come back so he can so the leaving.
Thats why I've said when she left with the gf she really said nothing definitive other than I need a break. He needs clear facts.
@@ifjc7216 he's just mad he got dumped and didn't get the honor of kicking her on the street
@@brittneylyntalks are you high?? Omg he's horrible
I think Mike was holding out for her to come back since she said she “wanted a break.” And after hearing she was with a guy, it felt like a betrayal to him and he feels there is now no hope that she will come back
@@Beemmeupz yeah, I don’t know why he would hold out for her. I guess he really did love her and just didn’t really want to call it quits completely. I did hear he actually did go on some dates but I don’t know if it’s true
@@moraewe they showed him with new girl..n he had his mothers back ..never natalies
*Does anyone know what he says at the beginning of his videos? He says **_____** listeners, but that word before listeners is foreign to me.*
I had no clue either before I saw quoatation od that in comments :-)
Why did the doc not address Mike's comment about the antidepressants
It’s really hard to watch Natalie and Mike. Mike has been disrespectful to her all along with his mom, he treated Natalie emotionlessly. Seems to me he has serious attachment issues. If Mike treated her with 1/10 niceness he gave to his mom, they might still work. I can see Natalie is a highly emotional drama Queen but the same time, how much emotional support she receives from Mike to keep feeling love and happiness?
Mike’s “whatever” constant rolling eyes face is just disgusting. He never listens. A mature person should be able to self reflect and it’s can’t be always assuming 100% the other party’s fault.
I think you did very well on this analysis. You are saying something no one is saying, and are being pretty objective.
Poor Mike he’s like a deer stuck in front of headlights. It’s so easy to have Natalie.. it’s just so hard for someone that doesn’t talk! I swear if I could just make him talk he would be with her right now happy. He needs to take the lead and stop being a child behind a muted wall. He needs to command and lead and engage and persuade. Natalie loves Mike and he can’t see the path he needs to take. Oh well. I guess it must be timing or idk.
Nobody is concerned for natalie suddenly stopping her anti-depressants?
Am I literally the only person that caught the "if you think you can find a better woman than me"?!?!
Avoidants avoid everything to the point that they forgot they have broken up and relationship cannot repair itself magically. Mike was so closed off emotionally and hurt Natalie very badly, especially while siding with his mom against her. The damage could have been repaired sure, but it would take a lot of listening and compromising from both sides. Natalie has tried it, because she really loved him also her immigrant life depended on it so we all saw, she did her best. I doubt that she had tried that hard with her previous marriages because no one deserves to stay in an abusive household and eventually she left. Mike might be paying her credit card because of the earnings coming from the show but whatever they want and need, unless they learn to express it freely, they can not find happiness in life. Your needs matter, your wants matter. Mike and Natalie were both scared to be vulnerable hence the fights and constant push backs ended their fragile interest in each other. They could have come up with a solution to ending their marriage that could benefit both of them but again, Mike avoids everything emotional and expects everything to get better on its own magically. It wasn't magic, Natalie tried realllllyyy really hard to keep things together emotionally but it takes two to tango. When she checked out, that's why the relationship was over because Mike has done non of the emotional work. Hence his surprise... Ugh...
Talk about looking 2-faced… Julia knows first hand how it feels to have everyone gang up on you … “who pays for you, how you get your $”… really Julia… you know that we know that she knows that you know what the laws are “legally” that she can’t work so no matter who Natalie is or isn’t sleeping with doesn’t matter, they’re not together anymore … that’s even the point and also how dare you
Thats why Julia is upset. Because she has to deal with lots of people asking if she is in the US for just a green card. If she is using Brandon. Then she sees Natalie who couldnt say she loved Mike, who got married because of fear of becoming illegal, and then later left and went to Florida. He paid for her move, her apartment, her everything for the last 6 months to live on the opposite side of the country and Natalie acts like she is just entitled to that. If it doesnt work out it makes sense to go back to where you are from, can legally work and support yourself, have friends and family. Why would she move to Florida a completely new place. It does give off a vibe that she wasnt there for Mike. And its understandable that since Julia has to deal with people always questioning her about it that she would be upset seeing other people who appear to be using men to get into the country.
I can’t wait to start sentences with, “I find myself on an island all by myself with this one but…” I hope my seemingly bizarre and outlandish ideas hit different.
I think with a K-1 Visa, Mike is legally required to support her while she’s in the country whether they’re separated or not.
They have very short marriage and after divorce she will not able to get a permanent Green Card. Only through domestic violence or remarried ASAP. "If a marriage occurred more than 2 years prior to green card approval, the US Green Card is permanent. "
Not true.
@@cloo6984 Unless they get divorced, yeah!
She said if you can find a better woman than me I will pray for you. That is not a compliment that's her still trying to put him down. 😐
well said!
So nice to hear Dr Honda being so accepting of LGBTQ couples from back in the day to now, wouldn't expect anything less from him!
Why is everyone ganging up on Natalie? Not saying she is perfect but Mike is behaving like he is perfect and all the others with a glass ceiling also pretending they are perfect 🙄🙄
Maybe because she lies? 🤔
They didn't watch the scenes where it was Mike and his mom who treated Natalie poorly, and I guess in her social media she posted content like "look how happy I am in Florida", so they might see her as a gold digger who used poor loving husband and had fun paid with his money.
Also, I guess her odd mannerism, especially smiling when you would expect her to be sad, doesn't help her in this situation.
@@melomankapl8756 I think a lot of people don't realize how much free shit even slightly famous people get just for showing up, especially if they're conventionally attractive women. It would be very, very easy for Natalie to hang out in Miami for months for the price of a Subway sandwich. She doesn't have to spend Mike's money. There's plenty of other people willing to spend money on her, no sex necessary. Hotel rooms, food, entertainment, clothing, makeup, surgery, whatever. Just show up and look expensive.
@@princesstelevision67 lmao-you’re so goddamn stupid. She doesn’t need to spend his money? They literally both said she uses his card dummy.
@@paulap4675 how sad your life must be. I'll pray for you.
Why are they all hating on Natalie so much? Obvs both were contributing to a relationship that wasn’t working, and arguably never suited and arguably he’s toxic or at least never present for some poor woman stuck solo in the woods of a foreign country. But for everyone to jump on her so much I felt super uncomfortable - unnecessary and potentially group bullying. Imagine her being there getting slammed by everyone (by the same people saying ‘oh that’s just angela’ and accepting her behaviour - WTF!!)
Isn't Mike responsible for Natalie for next years under the K-1 Visa program whether they are together or not? That's what has been said on other 90 Day Fiancé episodes. TIFFANY was told that, why isn't she piping up?
Eh, Natalie made some weird remark of "If you think you can find a woman better woman than me, I will only pray for you". That didn't sound like a kind statement. That sounded like "You think you can do better than me?"
I think Mike is super confused…. Mainly because Natalie never answers a question with a straight answer!! I really don’t get the support Dr H has for her but maybe I’m missing something 🤔
I agree. I don't get it either.
I feel the same. It confuses me too, she seems so spiteful! She knows he’s avoidant but she does little to draw him and I think that’s because she is not focused on Mike, just getting her own needs met.
I think he mostly gets triggered by Mike because of traumas associated with avoidant people, maybe his family member was avoidant. I’m really triggered by Natalie because my mother acts a lot like Natalie and she’s ukranian too. I’m not team Mike but I find him way less abusive than natalie
@@OksanaOksana1 do you understand Nat’s mom? She’s an enigma to me and I don’t know where it comes from. She seems blinded to reality. She wants rose colored kool aid lenses for everything
OMG thank you for saying that!
I'm sitting here watching this and know I have seen the same kind of scheming played out with some of my guy-friends. And here is Kirk trying to find every sort of way to paint angelic Goldielocks as sincere.
I feel for Mike. The poor guy is obviously suffering and really needs therapy. I hope he receives help.
Amen.
I dont feel that bad for him. he has all the time and money in the world to pursue therapy
He refused therapy on the show. He's also just not a good person based on how he condones bullying Natalie. Save your well wishes for those who treat others with kindness.
Mike was foolish enough to think Natalie would still want to be married. If she’s been gone for 6 months in FL, she can pay for herself. She can get a job, or go back to the Ukraine. It is wrong for her to walk out, string Mike along and expect him to finance her “freedom”.
NOOOOO I CAUGHT UP ALREADY?!
These people need to get off their high horse. They always criticize each other as if they’re role models for the perfect relationship.
Michael is just Mikey from Recess
🤣🤣🤣
No, :( I like recess
Mikey Blumberg from Recess was a very emotionally intelligent character.
@@jaimelubin6497 😂 so not this guy then.
@@ifjc7216 Ha! Definitely not. I'm trying to think of a Recess character with a similar emotional profile to Mike... but every one that comes to mind has far more empathy.
Natalie said at the time she tried to convince Mike for therapy that she had gone to therapy before and it had helped her. So she probably meant that when she was talking to Julia. 🙂
On one hand I see what Dr Honda is saying about a marriage not just being what the govt says/a piece of paper. On the other hand, I've been with a couple guys who said they "only had to finish the paperwork", yet went back to their wives. 😩 So I will only date legally divorced men now.
If it was just a piece of paper, people wouldnt make such a big deal about it.Its a common fallacy, soccer is 'just a piece of rubber', love is just 'chemicals' and so on.
Is that last sentence a typo or a Freudian slip? Lol
@@cloo6984 it was a I was tired and mistyped. Lol. Fixed it!
Nathaly talked with the therapist about he was unfaithfull with his Best friens(before she came to the Us
Am I both attached and avoidant??
The cast makes immigrants look bad by ganging up on Natalie. Instead stepping back and seeing the relationship for what it is, they are pushing this manipulative immigrant narrative pretty hard. Doing this to her just gives other people further justification to treat the other cast members like that.
Kirk, she has to watch what she says so she doesn’t blow her chance of a green card
She was using his creditcard. Of course she didnt say that it was over.
How is it fair that he pays for her? She only had emotions when he said he will block his bank card. Natalie is being attacked bc of her wrong doing-she is guilty. She's so beautiful but her personality is crap. And Natalie said IF you can find someone better than me, means she thinks she is some sort of gem and he can't find anyone better. Third divorce is coming her way...
at least she is entitled to half of the TLC money. also mike agreed to financially support her when he got her over here on k1 visa.
Yea I understand that-but I don't think its fair. Like I had a marriage that didn't work out, and I sponsored it. However, thank goodness I dont have to financially support him, he was a lazy bum! In the same manner, I feel bad for many men who go through divorce and have to pay a ridiculous amount of child support to the mother of the child who are entitled and dont deserve it. Guess life can be unfair...
@@noo8446 wait, you're mad that some men have to pay child support? To help support the kids they helped make? Because you don't think their exes are entitled to financial help with their children?
@@princesstelevision67 men will support their children regardless, I know ppl who do much more than just child support
@@noo8446 Some men support their children, but so many men don't support their kids that there are government agencies whose entire task is to make sure that they do. It's a big problem. Mothers deal with enough stigma while doing the lion's share of child raising. Why would you want to add to that?
Mike is done. LET'S GO, KING
Story with Mike's Father?
Mike was going along with other people lol i really hate this guy 😂😂
Both of them have issues. Their communication is terrible. Why they didn’t discuss about moving to Seattle before getting married. They haven’t been clear about their divorce. She didn’t even tell her mom about their separation 🤦♀️
One thing I will say is strange is that Mike seems to take her potentially dating someone as an attack on him. It's like he expected her to come back. I think he has every right to remove her access to the card and file for divorce but what was he waiting? She really shouldn't have had access to his card.
The other cast members make it seem like Natalie is completely free loading off of Mike. But they didn’t factor in the money that both her and Mike get for being on 90 day. Maybe they didn’t mention it because technically if she doesn’t have her work visa yet, she can’t accept payment for being on 90day. I’m guessing the money they earn from being on the show gets deposited into Mike’s bank account (technically only paying Mike since she can’t legally accept payment on her K1 visa) and after payment, the couples get to spend or divide the money however they choose. So yes, maybe Mike is technically paying her bills, but she did contribute to earning some of the money in his bank account. They might not get paid a lot, but a couple thousand dollars per episode at 17episodes this season; even after taxes is a little chunk of change. And some of that money can go towards supporting Natalie while they are separated and she can’t legally work.
(I’m no lawyer haha, I’m just guessing what the legalities may be regarding getting paid from 90day while on a K1)
I thought with the k1 visa unless she goes back mike is financial responsible for her for years?
Yes, used to be 10 years, Trump changed to lifetime, not sure what’s happening now. Also Mike owners Natalie half of the TLC earnings, so I don’t understand people’s nasty comments either.
No..no..no.. Look it up.
Isnt Mike financially responsible for her for a certain numbers of years for bringing her into the country, even if they divorce?
Im not sure how it works but they're always talking about having or being a qualified sponsor in order to get the Visa approved.
Tiffany had to ask her father to sponsor Ronald, Kalani's father sponsors Asuelu, for example.
I can only assume Mike is responsible for Natalie, even after they divorce.
Not necessarily. There are many variables.
Natalie wanted a child and was upset that Mike was not religious. She gets to the states, she wants big city, to be an actress, a celebrity, a TH-cam cooking channel and moved to Florida on Mike's dime. Does not tell her mom she is divorcing AGAIN until the tell all.
THERE IS STILL MUCH HERE TO REACT TO
They’re both acting shady but divorce and K-1 status is trickier than just a divorce I guess
i NEED someone to stand up for natalie jesus
If Natalie is using the damn ATM card then he can trace the purchases. It's all BS.
Wow, this tell-all made me feel so badly for Natalie, with everyone ganging up on her. It was like a weird "pack" mentality. She literally couldn't say anything without someone jumping down her throat and acting like they know her true intentions. I wonder if what's also at issue is the fact that she is an intelligent, strong willed woman and while Mike is more passive. There's definitely sexist undertones here.
Actually on the last episode it was kinda odd because she got her stuff but there wasn't an like look we are done. I think Mike even said something like he didn't know if they were broken up for good... He didn't file so seems like there some communication going on
So what if Mike is paying for Natalie's living expenses? That's not a scandal, he is legally obligated as her K1 sponsor to support her for ten years.