Top tip. If you should find yourself in the unfortunate position of having snapped the pull through having realised too late you've used flannelette for a gpmg, leaving half a pull through complete with oversized flanellete jammed in the barrel - do not try the 'obvious solution' of trying to fix the problem while simultaneously destroying the evidence, of pouring lighter fuel down the barrel and trying to burn the excess flannelette . This does not work and in my unhappy experience just results in you getting charged.
We in German Air Force had a tool set ( MES 2 - Kiste ) in the gun storage room with an adapter to screw on the barrel instead of a flash hider, what could be connected to a standard grease gun to force broken cleaning stuff out of the barrel. Worked like a charm. There was also a nifty 3- piece adapter for the MG- barrel.
Comming from what we got issued with the AUG this looks like a lot of stuff with (as you said) a bit unpractical loking size and pouch.🤔 The cleaing kit of the AUG is/was housed in the buttstock in the little compartement below the fire control group. 1 oil bottle (no idea what was in it, but it worked both to clean and lubricate, but it didn't smell like Ballistol) 1 pull-through with a threaded end, to thread on it: 1 surprisingly durable plastic loop for patches, 1 plastic brush and 1 brass brush. That's it. No tools needed and it did the job pretty well. We did a ot of cleaning, as we used a lot of blanks and the rifles were checked for being properly clean each time. (this often would decide when your weekend started) People always claimed the blanks gunk up the guns way more than live ammo. And to a certain degree i have to agree. What absolutely strikes me is the mentioned use of abrasives. That was an absolute Nogo here, absolutely prohibited. Anything that could harm the black outside coating of the gun, or scratch anything would have resulted in punishment. (It was okay to get the coating scratched while crawling or any other propper training. As long as not purposefully damaged. But outside of that, seen as almost the worst you could do)
Australian Army used CLP as made by the Break-Free company. Later on they moved to CLP made by Nyco of France ( probably because lithgow was sold to France). Can be found under Nyco 127.
I saw a guy in Kosovo take the dust cover off his K, dipped his bootlace in some engine oil, got a dipstick from an engine, pushed the bootlace through the bore and that was it. I remember watching that man with envy.
Interesting comparison between this and the Australian experience with the M16 kit issued for the F88. 1: Scotch bright = CHARGE... Although issued in the ration pack, if said abrasive touched a weapon component, arses would be kicked. 2: No issued oil bottle ever retains it contents. 3: Pull through - although a wire rope pull through was initially issued with the F88 it was quickly replaced with the M16 kit. LORE is, that people poked their eyes out with it. 4: Shiny Muzzle Crown - horrendous things are done with cleaning rods in order to achieve this malarkey... 5: Flats in the cleaning rods - now that is a brilliant addition. 6: Cloth - 4x2 is still the widest issue in the ADF, despite both 45x45 roll and individual .22 patches being in the system. Every country despite similar origins and practises, has its own take on things.
Like the "paint" brush part of the kit. We used shaving brushes we bought at the PX. Last act of cleaning was to put a few drops of oil on them and brush over all the exposed metal thus putting a very light coat of oil on them for turning in to the arms room. We were in Hawaii at Schofield Barracks so it was a high humidity area. We also took 6" lengths of wire coat hangers and used a hammer to smash the ends flat. We would then use these to scrape carbon out of the hard to reach nooks and crannies. We carried most of our stuff in the issue cleaning kit case , but it usually went into the velcro closed pocket on the ALICE pack flap. Other than the cleaning rod sections, the brushes, and double end toothbrush issued, we made or bought most stuff. I had a full size spray bottle, one of those you buy at the store in cleaning supplies for about a dollar, filled with oil(CLP) when I was an M60 gunner.
If you look at photos from Iraq and Afghanistan British lads very often have a decorators paint brush stuffed in the loops of their MOLLE/PALs vest. Its not for putting oil on its for removing fine particulate dust from the weapon in dry/hot conditions. As little oil as possible being the norm. Its common to leave weapons in the sun after cleaning to let them "sweat" excess oil out in the heat so they can be wiped down again.
@@timwilliamanderson Ah you see old chap you are allowed to use solvents as well. We just went at it dry as stuff like GT85 or WD was forbidden. It adds up and you soon get a rattly piece of crap that is out of spec.
@@timwilliamanderson Its not that either. You have to remember the British forces had National Service until the 60s and vast numbers of soldiers sitting on their backside with nothing to do right up until the end of the cold war. Cleaning stuff to death was make busy work. Its an attitude that has been hard to stamp out and its senior NCOs responsible for it to this day. Highly polished black boots were still the norm for working dress until 2003 for instance. Why though? just to fuck people about and keep them busy, that was why.
meanwhile on the other side of the channel, the froggies proscribed the use of abrasives, and the only wire brush in the rifle kit was the bore brush, but you got a couple spares and the cleaning kit was in a pouch that attach to your rifle belt
How the other side of the pond lived. Interesting the US Army's M-16A1 kit came in a belt mounted pouch with a full cleaning rod segmented and the segments would go adrift. Geoff Who notes there was the odd bloke in large cleaning sessions who would force an M-60 7.62 cleaning rod into the chamber and then apply a hammer or field equivalent.
I had 2 issued. 1st one was apparently a late 80's one is a green plastic box - twice the size of the old SLR 'tabacco' tin one and the second one (exactly like this one) was mid 90's. I've still got this one with the scotchbrite pads and material patches. I rarely used a pull-through as I *ahem* "borrowed" some extra cleaning rod lengths
I remember we originally got sponge swabs in the kits, similar to the ones you see in hospitals handy for corners, basically disposable but never any replacements. The original oil bottles were even worse than the one you showed, looked like a disposable eye wash bottle, always splitting & even harder to fill!
Had that kit in TA (RGJ) 2005 ish, almost always ended up in RH ammo pouch too, bought myself a hoppes 5.56 boresnake to keep in smock pocket with the combi tool, a couple of guys had small pouches tailored for the combi tool to sit on the webbing belt in front of the LH ammo pouch but I never got around to that.
The christmas tree's a later edition too. The ones I used didn't have the brass disc to stop you shoving the whole thing down the chamber. Yes it did happen, yes it was a lumpy jumper, and yes it wasn't her first attempt.
VERY Interesting! The 'official' cleaning kits that came with the M14 and M16s I was issued in the Marine Corps were simply a steel cleaning rod, folding handle, bore brush and cleaning patch attachment with oil bottle that fit in a small sleeve. The whole lot fit neatly into the holes in the buttstock. Until I finally bought a pull-through Bore Snake, I thought a solid rod was THE modern way to clean the bore. Now the pull-through is all I use. Story of abusive cleaning: In 1975 at Marine Corps OCS, when we were preparing for our final Battalion Commander's inspection, my platoon's Sergeant Instructor dropped by with an electric drill and had someone assemble a cleaning rod with bore brush...
_“(T)hose familiar with AR-15/M-16 cleaning kits will will recognize this…”_ Most will, anyways… Coast Guard’s budget is a hot rock and 2 potatoes (a small one and a medium one), we had to clean that with the thin side of a regular brush.
Used to transfer all the bits commonly used into our own smaller waterproof containers and leave the wallet behind, also replaced the oil bottle with small spray bottle purchased from travel section at boots and carry separately. A single section of cleaning rod attached to pull through allows it to drop through a manky barrel far more easily.
interesting to see how the British army conceive cleaning, especially the use of abrasives and brute force by comparison, since the MAS 49, the French rifle kit consisted of an oil bottle, brush, bore brush, pull through, chamber brush, extractor/screwdriver tool, and a ruptured case extractor. the use of abrasives was strictly prohibited, cleaning of the bolt face had to be done with a wooden pick that you made during basic and the chamber brush is nylon (at least for my kit, which is dated '59). it also contains a spare firing pin and extractor, for the MAS 49/56 you also got 2 spare springs for the grenade collar. the kit came in a leather pouch that was conceived to be slid on the rifle belt. for the FAMAS the kit contents remained mostly the same, but the pouch changed to nylon and gained straps at the back to fit on the suspenders the MAT 49 also had a similar kit, which came with: oil bottle, cleaning rod, jag, bore brush, chamber brush, clearing rod, loading tool, also the MAT 49 cleaning kit pouch had a wire loop to attach to the rear hook on the suspender
Comparing that to the old USGI kit in the small nylon bag... it seems overly big and bulky, and not offering much if anything for it... and adding that brass to the American style chamber brush likely just adds a bunch of cost for machined brass, meaning you're much less likely to get them replaced when worn out/destroyed/lost... Also complete opposite... American kits contain absolutely NO abrasives. Then troops end up scrubbing bolt tails with their chamber brush... which the finish on bolt tails can be considered sacrificial. Haha.
@@karood-dog3584 That's the worst cop out answer I hate. It sounds great, but it doesn't happen so easy. 'We want more ammo to train and we're willing to pay for it ourselves!' = 'A good supply sgt can get you all the ammo you want!' (No, they can't, and at 12 cents per round, soldiers would be more than willing. And this is the US Army, where there's a LOT of ammo used in training.) Look at Germany. 2017 a study found their air force was incapable of conducting combat operations. They cut funding so badly that they didn't have enough personnel or working equipment.
Its 45 by 45mm bloke or one blue square off the flannelette. I was issued that style of cleaning kit back in 03 around 05 -06 the army bought out a little black pouch with spray oil bottle and a better pull though. Around in 2014 - 2015 the military bought out a pretty decent universal cleaning kit. You now get issued a cleaning kit that can clean the SA80 , GPMG , shotgun ect. However still a bit of scorthbright a combi tool and a pull though can get the job done.
I remember when the L85 first came out , it cost half the price to produce than the L1a1 SLR. Five years later the cost of each rifle was 10 times the cost for each L85 compared to the L1a1. Some L85 rifles were sent back to factory 21 times for modifications. I saw the sterling ball pup rifle at their Dagenham factory, and was a great design, which today , no one knows about.
Sterling knocked that up to prove the L85 project was an infringement of their intellectual property and a weapon they owned the production rights to. L85s never cost that much. L1A1s were actually quite pricey by the standards of the day. The biggest cost of the L85 was sighting systems, which would have been the same no matter which weapon was adopted.
I picked up one of those HK L47A1 cleaning kits brand new a couple of years ago. Yes it's huge, but it comes with so much empty space. It comes with an oil bottle (Spray) but it has room for three. It comes with one hard brush and one soft brush, but it has room for one more of each. One cleaning rod with four extensions, but it has room for two rods and three more extensions... I imagine they're leaving room for you to augment the kit yourself, which is great for a civilian like me, but to a soldier this must feel like a lot of wasted space.
soldiers WILL augment their kits with personal additions, it's not a matter of if, but a matter of when. leaving some space is smart of them on that point
@@quentintin1 No. The extra space is for the two other types of lube issued for specific climates. I should know having carried one for quite a few years.
In America and in the army it's called a bore snake rather than a pull through...I was issued an Otis cleaning kit while deployed in Iraq in 03 before that we had old school kits with steel cleaning rods cause we hate our rifling apparently
Mid 2000's, we had that kit. Never seen a muzzle cover in the wild, and we had a pretty rubbish sponge on a stick. I also supplemented my cleaning kit when I could away with it.
Oooooo, that "worst oil-bottle ever" was the upgraded and improved version !! The original one (that I ever saw) was about 3" long and 3/4" diameter, and very flimsy. Didn't hold much oil, was hard to fill and had a lifetime of less than a week on exercise before splitting along the blow-moulding marks. The SLR oil-bottle was also small, but at least it didn't self-destruct. In the kit you showed, I think the brush was also the upgraded version (everyone used shaving-brushes instead of the awful issued brush) and the chamber brush was also a different design. I don't recall having a brush for the gas-plug, or the bronze scrubbing-brush thing either (we used old toothbrushes instead). Regarding how it was carried, there was a need for oil, pull-through, flannelette, scotchbrite, chamber-brush and combi-tool so that would get rolled up in a plastic bag and stuffed in an ammo-pouch while the rest of the junk, plus flannelette and reserve oil-bottle, would go in a utility-pouch without the tool-roll.
So much bulk and so many tools but not all that much actual capability, interesting, half of those things are things I would prefer to ditch if allowed to. In the FDF our cleaning kit included a small oil bottle, a segmented cleaning rod, a barrel brush tip and a tip you could roll cotton around and a sight adjustment tool. No copper brushes or anything like that, all the scrubbing was to be done with a cotton rag. That package fit quite nicely anywhere.
These kits came in with the A2 I believe. I had the sliding t piece on my A1 and later got the looped rod once we got the A2. The brush you hadn't seen was indeed for the gas block. I use to use the rods and barrel brush to clean the barrel then pull through after to get the crap you generated out with flannelette. The oil bottle was indeed pants. I ended up getting my own bottle which actually sealed 🤣. Trying to get replacement brushes off the armoury or Q man was a ball ache.
I couldn't put a definitive date on the kit, but the christmas tree had the brass flange added to stop it being pushed too far into the breech, the gas piston brush, paint brush (there was a thinner one issued previously with thick nylon bristles) and the round ended handle rather than the clanky pivoting handle all came out some time around the 2000's. there was also a star profiled sponge on a stick for cleaning debris from the breech after going at it with the christmas tree but it was a worthless piece of crap. a lot of those pieces were expense items so you could easily replace the wire brushes, etc.
For SLR(FN FAL),all we got was a pull through,bottle of oil,and sight adjust tool,pointy bit on pull through to scrape carbon off.Got grief for using plastic abrasive cloths and something called Genolite for the carbon.
They never allowed my father anything handheld that banged, but he was still using up an aquired stock of 4 by 2s in the late 60s. Later he improved on the ex-panzer binoculars by buying an expensive pair.
I notice you can't put the bore brush on the cleaning rod...that would be far too handy lol...I am more familiar with the SLR cleaning kits which came in a small plastic box..I don't think we got a bore brush, just a pull through with Jag..I seem to recall the LMG and GPMG cleaning kit had a jointed rod and bore brush, and these were guarded jealously by the gunners least they go walk about...Worst barrel abuse I saw was somebody getting a patch study in the barrel when the pull through snapped..Turns out the "patch" was actually cut from an issue wool blanket!
That's the kit that was issued from the late 90s to around 2010. Its basically the A2 kit, at the A2 upgrade and A3 it was changed to the new one. There were a lot of A1 kits still kicking around in the late 90s especially for cadets.
@Gareth Fairclough yeah those were the 1st batch of the new ones I think before they shifted to the larger ones with MTP pattern that were universal. To be honest as nice as the new kits are I think they're a bit big, I actually like these original kits as once you take the multi tool out(and the crappy lollipop sponge) they're easier to carry and tuck away in your kit.
@Gareth Fairclough Very true, wasn't till i spent some time with the guys from the small arms school I was able to confidently say what was trash and what wasn't and qualified enough myself to be in the club where nobody pulls you up. I usually kept two seperate kits, one with full original equipment, usually for teaching, and my own one that had a few substitutions like spray bottles of oil and cleaning solution and the better rods and tools for when actually being able to get the job done mattered.
Very interesting. I like this kind of stuff. More stuff in it than we got for the Canadian C-7 kit. Though ours initially fit into the butt of the rifle, so it had to be more compact...
My experience of the kit aas to: Step 1: See if you can snaffle a spare combi tool, leave one in your kit the other goes into an arm pocket for clearing jams Step 2: ignore all the bore cleaning tools, get a boresnake. Step 3: Discard the shitty oil bottle and replace with a spray bottle Step 4: Keep your brush and snaffle more scotch brite Step 5: Think about keeping the bore rods for removing a stuck case then ignore them anyway Step 6: Ignore or throw away the rest
I can be found “geeking out” in my work place trying to identify special tools for weapons which mostly have gone the way of the dodo. I usually identify the item and use pretty well but i get stumped sometimes.
They don't seem to care as long as it's shiny. There's a note in the L85A2 manual, however, that abrasives should not be used on coated parts and the coatings should not be removed. Apparently this is routinely ignored.
The biggest problem is the ban on solvents. Which is a bit rich as the first thing a REME workshop does with a knackered weapon is to put it in a big solvent bath to clean it. The battle school in Brecon has solvent baths as well (weapons stay wet so long on that course they rust). HK did very loudly point out that nearly all the weapons received for upgrade were wildly out of spec due to scotchbrite being used rather than solvents.
I can just about smell this video 🤔😂 but it's been many years since I picked up a pull through. Trying to tear the patches off the roll with oily hands was always fun. Good reason for carrying a swiss army knife or similar.
Ephemera (nerery by any other name) is cool. (Says the person who has a semi-rare BAR cleaning kit designed to fit a BAR mag pouch, and a hihgly rare USMC M-14 cleaning kit meant for belt carry..)
In the Canadian army we had metal tubs filled with varsol solvent to clean rifles after range days. We also used steel wool. Even as a 17 year old recruit I questioned why no one in the army had figured out Hoppes #9. Of course there is a big difference in the level of cleanliness of a fire arm required for it to be functional and reliable, and the level expected by the QM for returning them to stores or the CSM for kit inspections. We also used Break Free by the gallon, and it was what we kept in our oil bottles.
The first SA80 oil-bottle design I saw was about 3" x 3/4" and had a short, pointy nozzle rather than any sort of brush. Alternatively, the SLR bottle had a plastic(?) rod in the lid which could put a drip of oil where you wanted it -- maybe that is what you were issued to replace the useless original SA80 ones? I vaguely recall that the big green bottle seen in the video was superficially related to the GPMG oil bottle, but it was much better to the ridiculous, self-destructing, original one.
The cleaning rods used to bind and get stuck together. Having nice oily hands it was a massive ball ache to get them apart again unless you had yet another combi tool handy. British service rifles get completely buggered from over cleaning, I would not trust a magazine in a guard room weapons locker either as they get loaded and unloaded twice a day, 365 days a year. Completely buggered. I would not trust the rounds to stay in one piece either.
For a universal cleaning kit for both my rifle and pistol. I use the M16 cleaning kit system over the years. The steel cleaning rods are adaptable to American commercial bore brush threads, so the American public can buy or use M16 universal cleaning kits. Inside my cleaning kits I have included dental tools and stainless steel bore brushes and nylon ones from 5.56, 9mm, 30 Cal, and .45. For a CLP or Cleaning Lubricant Protection. I have gotten away from the US military approved Break Free. It's fucking garbage! Since 2005 and my combat deployment to Iraq from 2006-08. I have been using Shooter's Choice FP-10 because it's a pure lubricant and has carbon cutting properties and can withstand temperatures above 500 degrees and not make carbon build up. This was a problem when I was a young machinegunner on the M-60 and as an auto rifleman on the M249 SAW. On machineguns over firing using Break Free would build up carbon in the chamber causing it not to fully lock, chamber, and fire. Big problem! Break Free requires to brush out and wipe after 500 rounds on machineguns. FP-10 keeps running after 2-3 times when firing in combat. Used in in Iraq during the first contact in Iraq near Safwan and Basra in the Spring of 2007. After returning to base with no casualties and over a 100 to 200 rounds fired, no malfunctions, FP-10 worked good. Summer 2007 hot as fuck on convoy security on Route Tampa got contact and rolled through with no casualties. My M-2s and 240s had no problems cycling to return fire during IED ambushes. I even still had FP-10 for my next unit for 2008 for Tal Afar, Mosul, and Sadr City in Baghdad. This stuff works for every weapon system for combat. I still use it today.
Awful lot of things just for rifle cleaning......when I served with a H&K G3 in our country's national guard, we just had a little 3 piece container consisting of a oil bottle, and the pull string to which you could attach the thing with cloth to pull through your barrel. Other than that we were just given ample supply of oil and old rags lol......and honestly it was enough , so I dont see logically why you need all of this stuff here.
The G3 is noticeably more simple to run than any of the AR18 derived weapons. Mainly you have no gas parts to bother with on the G3. I would also hazard a guess that standards were simplified somewhat with a NG unit and certain tasks such as zeroing weapons and sight adjustment were something only senior NCOs were given the tools for.
I've found that the bottles vape stores use for their fluids are absolutely leak proof, and they're easy to find online. They come in different shapes as well. Got a long skinny one in my AR's stock. Highly recommend
You never used the scotch brite on the external parts of the weapon, you only ever used it on the gas parts. Anyone who was caught using the scotch bright on anything other than the gas parts would get their balls chewed.
The number of rifles where this was clearly done though rather puts the lie to that :) There was one in the press lately of some soldier posing with his rifle, with the finish on the barrel and flash suppressor almost completely removed...
Only difference to what I was issued would be pre cut and wrapped pull thru patches and the most useless breach shaped sponge on cardboard stick that was shagged the second it same the cleaning kit nevermind the rifle, we used the back end of the stick more than the sponge
Top tip. If you should find yourself in the unfortunate position of having snapped the pull through having realised too late you've used flannelette for a gpmg, leaving half a pull through complete with oversized flanellete jammed in the barrel - do not try the 'obvious solution' of trying to fix the problem while simultaneously destroying the evidence, of pouring lighter fuel down the barrel and trying to burn the excess flannelette . This does not work and in my unhappy experience just results in you getting charged.
We in German Air Force had a tool set ( MES 2 - Kiste ) in the gun storage room with an adapter to screw on the barrel instead of a flash hider, what could be connected to a standard grease gun to force broken cleaning stuff out of the barrel. Worked like a charm. There was also a nifty 3- piece adapter for the MG- barrel.
Comming from what we got issued with the AUG this looks like a lot of stuff with (as you said) a bit unpractical loking size and pouch.🤔 The cleaing kit of the AUG is/was housed in the buttstock in the little compartement below the fire control group. 1 oil bottle (no idea what was in it, but it worked both to clean and lubricate, but it didn't smell like Ballistol) 1 pull-through with a threaded end, to thread on it: 1 surprisingly durable plastic loop for patches, 1 plastic brush and 1 brass brush. That's it. No tools needed and it did the job pretty well.
We did a ot of cleaning, as we used a lot of blanks and the rifles were checked for being properly clean each time. (this often would decide when your weekend started) People always claimed the blanks gunk up the guns way more than live ammo. And to a certain degree i have to agree.
What absolutely strikes me is the mentioned use of abrasives. That was an absolute Nogo here, absolutely prohibited. Anything that could harm the black outside coating of the gun, or scratch anything would have resulted in punishment. (It was okay to get the coating scratched while crawling or any other propper training. As long as not purposefully damaged. But outside of that, seen as almost the worst you could do)
Australian Army used CLP as made by the Break-Free company. Later on they moved to CLP made by Nyco of France ( probably because lithgow was sold to France). Can be found under Nyco 127.
That’s the same as the kit I used from 2006-2010. However that was in the RAF and they only let us pretend to fight once/twice a year.
The proper gun "nerdery" is why I enjoy this channel.
I saw a guy in Kosovo take the dust cover off his K, dipped his bootlace in some engine oil, got a dipstick from an engine, pushed the bootlace through the bore and that was it. I remember watching that man with envy.
Interesting comparison between this and the Australian experience with the M16 kit issued for the F88.
1: Scotch bright = CHARGE... Although issued in the ration pack, if said abrasive touched a weapon component, arses would be kicked.
2: No issued oil bottle ever retains it contents.
3: Pull through - although a wire rope pull through was initially issued with the F88 it was quickly replaced with the M16 kit. LORE is, that people poked their eyes out with it.
4: Shiny Muzzle Crown - horrendous things are done with cleaning rods in order to achieve this malarkey...
5: Flats in the cleaning rods - now that is a brilliant addition.
6: Cloth - 4x2 is still the widest issue in the ADF, despite both 45x45 roll and individual .22 patches being in the system.
Every country despite similar origins and practises, has its own take on things.
4:07 For the gas block iirc
Aah, quite likely. There wasn't anything in the original kit specifically for that.
@@BlokeontheRange true, later addition, in the second issue kit.
Like the "paint" brush part of the kit. We used shaving brushes we bought at the PX. Last act of cleaning was to put a few drops of oil on them and brush over all the exposed metal thus putting a very light coat of oil on them for turning in to the arms room. We were in Hawaii at Schofield Barracks so it was a high humidity area. We also took 6" lengths of wire coat hangers and used a hammer to smash the ends flat. We would then use these to scrape carbon out of the hard to reach nooks and crannies.
We carried most of our stuff in the issue cleaning kit case , but it usually went into the velcro closed pocket on the ALICE pack flap. Other than the cleaning rod sections, the brushes, and double end toothbrush issued, we made or bought most stuff. I had a full size spray bottle, one of those you buy at the store in cleaning supplies for about a dollar, filled with oil(CLP) when I was an M60 gunner.
If you look at photos from Iraq and Afghanistan British lads very often have a decorators paint brush stuffed in the loops of their MOLLE/PALs vest. Its not for putting oil on its for removing fine particulate dust from the weapon in dry/hot conditions. As little oil as possible being the norm. Its common to leave weapons in the sun after cleaning to let them "sweat" excess oil out in the heat so they can be wiped down again.
Scotch Brite and a wire Brush, best ways of cleaning any precision made piece of equipment.
To be fair as long as you don’t go full hog on stuff we use it in the machine shop to clean precision All the time
@@timwilliamanderson Ah you see old chap you are allowed to use solvents as well. We just went at it dry as stuff like GT85 or WD was forbidden. It adds up and you soon get a rattly piece of crap that is out of spec.
@@zoiders i’ve also seen what we call malicious compliance
Like oh, clean this thing
Proceeds to scrub it until it’s damaged
@@timwilliamanderson Its not that either. You have to remember the British forces had National Service until the 60s and vast numbers of soldiers sitting on their backside with nothing to do right up until the end of the cold war. Cleaning stuff to death was make busy work. Its an attitude that has been hard to stamp out and its senior NCOs responsible for it to this day. Highly polished black boots were still the norm for working dress until 2003 for instance. Why though? just to fuck people about and keep them busy, that was why.
meanwhile on the other side of the channel, the froggies proscribed the use of abrasives, and the only wire brush in the rifle kit was the bore brush, but you got a couple spares and the cleaning kit was in a pouch that attach to your rifle belt
How the other side of the pond lived. Interesting the US Army's M-16A1 kit came in a belt mounted pouch with a full cleaning rod segmented and the segments would go adrift. Geoff Who notes there was the odd bloke in large cleaning sessions who would force an M-60 7.62 cleaning rod into the chamber and then apply a hammer or field equivalent.
I had 2 issued. 1st one was apparently a late 80's one is a green plastic box - twice the size of the old SLR 'tabacco' tin one and the second one (exactly like this one) was mid 90's.
I've still got this one with the scotchbrite pads and material patches. I rarely used a pull-through as I *ahem* "borrowed" some extra cleaning rod lengths
I remember we originally got sponge swabs in the kits, similar to the ones you see in hospitals handy for corners, basically disposable but never any replacements. The original oil bottles were even worse than the one you showed, looked like a disposable eye wash bottle, always splitting & even harder to fill!
They are all hiding in a corner of the stores
Yes, next to the hundreds of rolls of flannelette you got issued 6 squares at a time! Lol🙄😆
And you'd sometimes get them with the poxy spray lid!
Had that kit in TA (RGJ) 2005 ish, almost always ended up in RH ammo pouch too, bought myself a hoppes 5.56 boresnake to keep in smock pocket with the combi tool, a couple of guys had small pouches tailored for the combi tool to sit on the webbing belt in front of the LH ammo pouch but I never got around to that.
The christmas tree's a later edition too. The ones I used didn't have the brass disc to stop you shoving the whole thing down the chamber.
Yes it did happen, yes it was a lumpy jumper, and yes it wasn't her first attempt.
"Lumpy jumper"?
@@robertl6196 Seems to be Squaddie for female...
@@robertl6196 Im guessing as an American "lumpy jumper"is. a jumper is a shirt and the lumpy part is her tits.
@@sqike001ton Jumper is sweater... But the Devil's dumplings part is correct.
Ah. Casual sexism. How refreshing in the year 2021. You throbber.
I still find pull-throughs to be a worthwhile cleaning tool. I have bore snakes in all my PG's.
"Brute force and ignorance" The conscript's way.
Well that wouldn't apply to British Army now would it as we don't have a conscript Army we are a professional volunteer military
VERY Interesting! The 'official' cleaning kits that came with the M14 and M16s I was issued in the Marine Corps were simply a steel cleaning rod, folding handle, bore brush and cleaning patch attachment with oil bottle that fit in a small sleeve. The whole lot fit neatly into the holes in the buttstock.
Until I finally bought a pull-through Bore Snake, I thought a solid rod was THE modern way to clean the bore. Now the pull-through is all I use.
Story of abusive cleaning: In 1975 at Marine Corps OCS, when we were preparing for our final Battalion Commander's inspection, my platoon's Sergeant Instructor dropped by with an electric drill and had someone assemble a cleaning rod with bore brush...
_“(T)hose familiar with AR-15/M-16 cleaning kits will will recognize this…”_
Most will, anyways… Coast Guard’s budget is a hot rock and 2 potatoes (a small one and a medium one), we had to clean that with the thin side of a regular brush.
Used to transfer all the bits commonly used into our own smaller waterproof containers and leave the wallet behind, also replaced the oil bottle with small spray bottle purchased from travel section at boots and carry separately.
A single section of cleaning rod attached to pull through allows it to drop through a manky barrel far more easily.
interesting to see how the British army conceive cleaning, especially the use of abrasives and brute force
by comparison, since the MAS 49, the French rifle kit consisted of an oil bottle, brush, bore brush, pull through, chamber brush, extractor/screwdriver tool, and a ruptured case extractor.
the use of abrasives was strictly prohibited, cleaning of the bolt face had to be done with a wooden pick that you made during basic and the chamber brush is nylon (at least for my kit, which is dated '59). it also contains a spare firing pin and extractor, for the MAS 49/56 you also got 2 spare springs for the grenade collar. the kit came in a leather pouch that was conceived to be slid on the rifle belt. for the FAMAS the kit contents remained mostly the same, but the pouch changed to nylon and gained straps at the back to fit on the suspenders
the MAT 49 also had a similar kit, which came with: oil bottle, cleaning rod, jag, bore brush, chamber brush, clearing rod, loading tool, also the MAT 49 cleaning kit pouch had a wire loop to attach to the rear hook on the suspender
Comparing that to the old USGI kit in the small nylon bag... it seems overly big and bulky, and not offering much if anything for it... and adding that brass to the American style chamber brush likely just adds a bunch of cost for machined brass, meaning you're much less likely to get them replaced when worn out/destroyed/lost...
Also complete opposite... American kits contain absolutely NO abrasives. Then troops end up scrubbing bolt tails with their chamber brush... which the finish on bolt tails can be considered sacrificial. Haha.
brushes are "expense items" providing your armourers and stores are up to speed there should be no problem exchanging them as often as needed
@@karood-dog3584 That's the worst cop out answer I hate. It sounds great, but it doesn't happen so easy. 'We want more ammo to train and we're willing to pay for it ourselves!' = 'A good supply sgt can get you all the ammo you want!' (No, they can't, and at 12 cents per round, soldiers would be more than willing. And this is the US Army, where there's a LOT of ammo used in training.)
Look at Germany. 2017 a study found their air force was incapable of conducting combat operations. They cut funding so badly that they didn't have enough personnel or working equipment.
Its 45 by 45mm bloke or one blue square off the flannelette. I was issued that style of cleaning kit back in 03 around 05 -06 the army bought out a little black pouch with spray oil bottle and a better pull though. Around in 2014 - 2015 the military bought out a pretty decent universal cleaning kit. You now get issued a cleaning kit that can clean the SA80 , GPMG , shotgun ect. However still a bit of scorthbright a combi tool and a pull though can get the job done.
Top tip for the flannelet, use 1.5 patches. It’s harder to pull but cleans it in one.
I remember when the L85 first came out , it cost half the price to produce than the L1a1 SLR.
Five years later the cost of each rifle was 10 times the cost for each L85 compared to the L1a1.
Some L85 rifles were sent back to factory 21 times for modifications.
I saw the sterling ball pup rifle at their Dagenham factory, and was a great design, which today , no one knows about.
*Bullpup
The Sterling mock up is common knowledge.
Sterling knocked that up to prove the L85 project was an infringement of their intellectual property and a weapon they owned the production rights to. L85s never cost that much. L1A1s were actually quite pricey by the standards of the day. The biggest cost of the L85 was sighting systems, which would have been the same no matter which weapon was adopted.
I picked up one of those HK L47A1 cleaning kits brand new a couple of years ago. Yes it's huge, but it comes with so much empty space. It comes with an oil bottle (Spray) but it has room for three. It comes with one hard brush and one soft brush, but it has room for one more of each. One cleaning rod with four extensions, but it has room for two rods and three more extensions... I imagine they're leaving room for you to augment the kit yourself, which is great for a civilian like me, but to a soldier this must feel like a lot of wasted space.
The spaces are for other lubes, namely the thick graphite stuff for arctic conditions.
soldiers WILL augment their kits with personal additions, it's not a matter of if, but a matter of when. leaving some space is smart of them on that point
@@quentintin1 No. The extra space is for the two other types of lube issued for specific climates. I should know having carried one for quite a few years.
You could also do a video on the stg57 cleaning kit. I find it's quite well made and of very good quality
In America and in the army it's called a bore snake rather than a pull through...I was issued an Otis cleaning kit while deployed in Iraq in 03 before that we had old school kits with steel cleaning rods cause we hate our rifling apparently
Mid 2000's, we had that kit. Never seen a muzzle cover in the wild, and we had a pretty rubbish sponge on a stick. I also supplemented my cleaning kit when I could away with it.
Oooooo, that "worst oil-bottle ever" was the upgraded and improved version !! The original one (that I ever saw) was about 3" long and 3/4" diameter, and very flimsy. Didn't hold much oil, was hard to fill and had a lifetime of less than a week on exercise before splitting along the blow-moulding marks. The SLR oil-bottle was also small, but at least it didn't self-destruct. In the kit you showed, I think the brush was also the upgraded version (everyone used shaving-brushes instead of the awful issued brush) and the chamber brush was also a different design. I don't recall having a brush for the gas-plug, or the bronze scrubbing-brush thing either (we used old toothbrushes instead). Regarding how it was carried, there was a need for oil, pull-through, flannelette, scotchbrite, chamber-brush and combi-tool so that would get rolled up in a plastic bag and stuffed in an ammo-pouch while the rest of the junk, plus flannelette and reserve oil-bottle, would go in a utility-pouch without the tool-roll.
So much bulk and so many tools but not all that much actual capability, interesting, half of those things are things I would prefer to ditch if allowed to.
In the FDF our cleaning kit included a small oil bottle, a segmented cleaning rod, a barrel brush tip and a tip you could roll cotton around and a sight adjustment tool. No copper brushes or anything like that, all the scrubbing was to be done with a cotton rag. That package fit quite nicely anywhere.
These kits came in with the A2 I believe. I had the sliding t piece on my A1 and later got the looped rod once we got the A2. The brush you hadn't seen was indeed for the gas block. I use to use the rods and barrel brush to clean the barrel then pull through after to get the crap you generated out with flannelette.
The oil bottle was indeed pants. I ended up getting my own bottle which actually sealed 🤣.
Trying to get replacement brushes off the armoury or Q man was a ball ache.
Got to be the only full kit I've ever seen! Combi tools always missing 🤣🤣
I couldn't put a definitive date on the kit, but the christmas tree had the brass flange added to stop it being pushed too far into the breech, the gas piston brush, paint brush (there was a thinner one issued previously with thick nylon bristles) and the round ended handle rather than the clanky pivoting handle all came out some time around the 2000's. there was also a star profiled sponge on a stick for cleaning debris from the breech after going at it with the christmas tree but it was a worthless piece of crap. a lot of those pieces were expense items so you could easily replace the wire brushes, etc.
You could also get the sponge on a stick through medical supplies as it was used to feed water to dehydrated people
For SLR(FN FAL),all we got was a pull through,bottle of oil,and sight adjust tool,pointy bit on pull through to scrape carbon off.Got grief for using plastic abrasive cloths and something called Genolite for the carbon.
It's amazing how much smaller the old American M16 cleaning kit is over this and in the states we call pull through "bore snakes"
I was issued this in 2002 ! Your right those oil bottles were horrible!
We always called the pull through brushes "Bore Snakes" in the US
That often happens with certain products. Afaik, boreSnake is a registered trademark from Hoppe's. Deonymes like Q-Tip instead of cotton bud.
@@onpsxmember The term bore snake for pull throughs existed way before Hoppe's product became popular though.
Wow both you and forgotten weapons both explaining your video schedule today. Been watching both for years without noticing some of these patterns.
Used genolite on the gas part for SLR AND SA80 get caught and you were on a charge. The first brush correct for gas parts, looks like mk1 cleaning kit
What a nice find. Love that kind of kit.
what you call the chamber brush is actually for cleaning the gas piston, barrel and breech brush was simply called the Christmas Tree!
For a followup, do a video on an AK cleaning kit with its capsule container...
I'm glad I don't have to carry that cleaning kit, much preferred the SLR/SMG kit which was about the size of a cigarette packet and could fit anywhere
Takes me back.
They never allowed my father anything handheld that banged, but he was still using up an aquired stock of 4 by 2s in the late 60s.
Later he improved on the ex-panzer binoculars by buying an expensive pair.
I notice you can't put the bore brush on the cleaning rod...that would be far too handy lol...I am more familiar with the SLR cleaning kits which came in a small plastic box..I don't think we got a bore brush, just a pull through with Jag..I seem to recall the LMG and GPMG cleaning kit had a jointed rod and bore brush, and these were guarded jealously by the gunners least they go walk about...Worst barrel abuse I saw was somebody getting a patch study in the barrel when the pull through snapped..Turns out the "patch" was actually cut from an issue wool blanket!
That's the kit that was issued from the late 90s to around 2010. Its basically the A2 kit, at the A2 upgrade and A3 it was changed to the new one. There were a lot of A1 kits still kicking around in the late 90s especially for cadets.
@Gareth Fairclough yeah those were the 1st batch of the new ones I think before they shifted to the larger ones with MTP pattern that were universal.
To be honest as nice as the new kits are I think they're a bit big, I actually like these original kits as once you take the multi tool out(and the crappy lollipop sponge) they're easier to carry and tuck away in your kit.
@Gareth Fairclough Very true, wasn't till i spent some time with the guys from the small arms school I was able to confidently say what was trash and what wasn't and qualified enough myself to be in the club where nobody pulls you up.
I usually kept two seperate kits, one with full original equipment, usually for teaching, and my own one that had a few substitutions like spray bottles of oil and cleaning solution and the better rods and tools for when actually being able to get the job done mattered.
You have reminded me of just what an irritatingly large amount of space that kit took up compared to the much slimmer box for the SLR cleaning kit.
Very interesting. I like this kind of stuff. More stuff in it than we got for the Canadian C-7 kit. Though ours initially fit into the butt of the rifle, so it had to be more compact...
We had this 2007-2011
His cleaning kits got more in it than most
Squaddies 😂
My experience of the kit aas to:
Step 1: See if you can snaffle a spare combi tool, leave one in your kit the other goes into an arm pocket for clearing jams
Step 2: ignore all the bore cleaning tools, get a boresnake.
Step 3: Discard the shitty oil bottle and replace with a spray bottle
Step 4: Keep your brush and snaffle more scotch brite
Step 5: Think about keeping the bore rods for removing a stuck case then ignore them anyway
Step 6: Ignore or throw away the rest
ਬਹੁਤ ਵਧੀਆ ਲੱਗੀ ਇਹ ਕਲੀਨੀਂਗ ਕਿੱਟ ਵੀਰੇ ਧੰਨਵਾਦ।
First thing we did was bin this thing, we used half an issue towel and a paintbrush instead.
Even the cleaning kit is bereaucratic, my God
Care to explain how that's the case? Because it includes many pieces and is organized? If so, why is that a negative?
@@KI.765 It's a joke.
@@dragonstormdipro1013 no jokes a loud!!1!
It never folded right...ever, I'll move this thing to here and it'll be better...nope. Used to fuck with my chi!
I can be found “geeking out” in my work place trying to identify special tools for weapons which mostly have gone the way of the dodo. I usually identify the item and use pretty well but i get stumped sometimes.
Has there ever been any discussion on whether the fact that abrasives are used to clean leads to accelerated degradation?
They don't seem to care as long as it's shiny. There's a note in the L85A2 manual, however, that abrasives should not be used on coated parts and the coatings should not be removed. Apparently this is routinely ignored.
Scotchbrite has now been banned, and it is not a token effort, you cant order it! Someone in SASC has finally realised that shinny isnt desirable!
@@Blackguineapig took them long enough!
The biggest problem is the ban on solvents. Which is a bit rich as the first thing a REME workshop does with a knackered weapon is to put it in a big solvent bath to clean it. The battle school in Brecon has solvent baths as well (weapons stay wet so long on that course they rust). HK did very loudly point out that nearly all the weapons received for upgrade were wildly out of spec due to scotchbrite being used rather than solvents.
Do you use pull throughs or rods for your own rifles?
I use a boresnake for post shoot light cleaning/oiling and a rod for anything serious.
That is a gas cynder brush and the other is the chamber brush
Happy new year too all nerdtastice video🎉🎉🎉
Feeling very Nerdery this January 1st, 2021
Yeah watching 13 minutes of a video on a cleaning kit for something I will probably never have is pretty nerdy come to think of it
soooo clean
Cool piece of marginalia.
I can just about smell this video 🤔😂 but it's been many years since I picked up a pull through. Trying to tear the patches off the roll with oily hands was always fun. Good reason for carrying a swiss army knife or similar.
Most of the time a pull through in the US is called a bore snake.
Bore snake is a brand name.
Ephemera (nerery by any other name) is cool. (Says the person who has a semi-rare BAR cleaning kit designed to fit a BAR mag pouch, and a hihgly rare USMC M-14 cleaning kit meant for belt carry..)
So the MOD don’t issue carbon solvents just oil ? You can’t remove carbon with oil not properly anyway
In the Canadian army we had metal tubs filled with varsol solvent to clean rifles after range days. We also used steel wool. Even as a 17 year old recruit I questioned why no one in the army had figured out Hoppes #9. Of course there is a big difference in the level of cleanliness of a fire arm required for it to be functional and reliable, and the level expected by the QM for returning them to stores or the CSM for kit inspections. We also used Break Free by the gallon, and it was what we kept in our oil bottles.
Thats a later kit, the original oil bottle had a metal 'dabber' rather than the brush.
The first SA80 oil-bottle design I saw was about 3" x 3/4" and had a short, pointy nozzle rather than any sort of brush. Alternatively, the SLR bottle had a plastic(?) rod in the lid which could put a drip of oil where you wanted it -- maybe that is what you were issued to replace the useless original SA80 ones? I vaguely recall that the big green bottle seen in the video was superficially related to the GPMG oil bottle, but it was much better to the ridiculous, self-destructing, original one.
Can do the whole thing with just a piece of scotch brite and a boot lace
This video was good cleaning fun
does anyone know what the oil used on the sa80 is called ?
Can nerdery be turned into a legitimate word? I like it.
Very interesting...and bulky.
The cleaning rods used to bind and get stuck together. Having nice oily hands it was a massive ball ache to get them apart again unless you had yet another combi tool handy. British service rifles get completely buggered from over cleaning, I would not trust a magazine in a guard room weapons locker either as they get loaded and unloaded twice a day, 365 days a year. Completely buggered. I would not trust the rounds to stay in one piece either.
can I borrow your combi tool mate....?!
For a universal cleaning kit for both my rifle and pistol. I use the M16 cleaning kit system over the years. The steel cleaning rods are adaptable to American commercial bore brush threads, so the American public can buy or use M16 universal cleaning kits. Inside my cleaning kits I have included dental tools and stainless steel bore brushes and nylon ones from 5.56, 9mm, 30 Cal, and .45. For a CLP or Cleaning Lubricant Protection. I have gotten away from the US military approved Break Free. It's fucking garbage! Since 2005 and my combat deployment to Iraq from 2006-08. I have been using Shooter's Choice FP-10 because it's a pure lubricant and has carbon cutting properties and can withstand temperatures above 500 degrees and not make carbon build up. This was a problem when I was a young machinegunner on the M-60 and as an auto rifleman on the M249 SAW. On machineguns over firing using Break Free would build up carbon in the chamber causing it not to fully lock, chamber, and fire. Big problem! Break Free requires to brush out and wipe after 500 rounds on machineguns. FP-10 keeps running after 2-3 times when firing in combat. Used in in Iraq during the first contact in Iraq near Safwan and Basra in the Spring of 2007. After returning to base with no casualties and over a 100 to 200 rounds fired, no malfunctions, FP-10 worked good. Summer 2007 hot as fuck on convoy security on Route Tampa got contact and rolled through with no casualties. My M-2s and 240s had no problems cycling to return fire during IED ambushes. I even still had FP-10 for my next unit for 2008 for Tal Afar, Mosul, and Sadr City in Baghdad. This stuff works for every weapon system for combat. I still use it today.
I remember this from the cadets XD
Flannelette
Awful lot of things just for rifle cleaning......when I served with a H&K G3 in our country's national guard, we just had a little 3 piece container consisting of a oil bottle, and the pull string to which you could attach the thing with cloth to pull through your barrel. Other than that we were just given ample supply of oil and old rags lol......and honestly it was enough , so I dont see logically why you need all of this stuff here.
The G3 is noticeably more simple to run than any of the AR18 derived weapons. Mainly you have no gas parts to bother with on the G3. I would also hazard a guess that standards were simplified somewhat with a NG unit and certain tasks such as zeroing weapons and sight adjustment were something only senior NCOs were given the tools for.
“Comment “
Wow that bottle looks disastrous. It'll leak everytime you walk even a little. Better cover it with a paper.
Oh yeah, they are utterly terrible and leaked all over the place...
@@BlokeontheRange Compared to the AK cleaning kit, this kit looks horrendous
I've found that the bottles vape stores use for their fluids are absolutely leak proof, and they're easy to find online. They come in different shapes as well. Got a long skinny one in my AR's stock.
Highly recommend
AK cleaning=pissing on it, then a quick shake!
You never used the scotch brite on the external parts of the weapon, you only ever used it on the gas parts. Anyone who was caught using the scotch bright on anything other than the gas parts would get their balls chewed.
The number of rifles where this was clearly done though rather puts the lie to that :) There was one in the press lately of some soldier posing with his rifle, with the finish on the barrel and flash suppressor almost completely removed...
botr!
Obligatory Viewer Engagement Comment
The only useful part of a SA80
They never cleaned them. They break after a magazine.
For real. In cadets, I got an ex-service L85A1 (modified to R-only) and a 30 round mag: it fired at most 12 of those 30 sucessfully.
Only difference to what I was issued would be pre cut and wrapped pull thru patches and the most useless breach shaped sponge on cardboard stick that was shagged the second it same the cleaning kit nevermind the rifle, we used the back end of the stick more than the sponge