@@oOOoOphidian I understand that too, but there's been more than a few times where he completely misses some big shady things they did and only sees it when he (sometimes) rewinds the footage. The biggest indicators to me are when they click the mini map and land directly onto a unit coming by; Or when they want to attack the base but look ahead at everything for a few seconds or a-moving directly to an enemy on a map. He's wondered many times if these map hacks have certain features but It's also very easy to see what features these map hacks contain with a brief Google search (being able to see buildings/upgrades in progress and cloaked/burrowed units) and there's many people willing to dish out big amounts of money for them...There's even auto build to play the game for you in these "map hack" programs.. makes no sense to me why people want that.
And there you've cut to the heart of the matter. Maphacks aren't as useful in the late game because any opponent who makes it that far is almost certainly more skilled than you and at that point they've got enough counter-intel that the maphack isn't much of an advantage anymore. They'll just beat you down slowly. I watched the tempo of this game slowly slide from Harstem to Serral almost in sync with Harstem's gas reserves.
That's honestly the problem with the zerg race. They keep nerfing the units and people who can't scout so cleanly suffer and complain that the race is weak. When they should have been nerfing the vision because that's what puts serral ahead of everyone else.
@@ghosthamster6521 Terran's late game vision is equally as strong as Zerg, perhaps even more so since they can just drop scans wherever they want and they will have enough OCs to be able to do that almost constantly. Not to mention sensor towers.
@@ElVid serral is good enough that i would believe him doing it early and borrow ling scouts knowing harstem can see all and therefore thinks he isnt scouted ;D serral is the one player who i am waiting for to use nydus worms to transport workers to safety and to enemy corner bases to steal as much mineral from there side off the map (it's a 400ish mineral investment to set a nydus and a hatchery, after that moving workers through cost very little time and with some decent vision moving all the drones back into the nydus if need be should be easy. make 2 nydus if it's sniped too easily ^^
@@Erebus2075 if serral would play terran he'd play two dozen orbitals just to scan a base and send in tons of mules to deprive the opponent of minerals and gas.
@@exeggcutebenedict I think he got a few more on purpose. Zerg Players do that sometimes if they know there is no killing move coming, but its just harrass
Please do an interview with Serral so you two can discuss about this game, and how he felt about it. I would love to have your shared inputs on that one.
It really is impossible to overstate just how good Serral is. Even with full vision it never felt like Harstem was in control. The multitasking is just too much
@@Macantor13 yeah I think you nailed it a multitasking disparity and ability to prioritize on the Fly made up for the gap of having basically perfect vision
this is consistent with how sc2 works. the worse player will only win on information asymetry and the better player will win on mechanics, so every minute that passes by, serral's chance of winning goes up. maphack lets you beat worse players because that info asymmetry is gone but doesnt help much against better players. this is true for every hacker that has played the game
@@luxon4 not only does it allow you to be worst players but it's also going to give you an edge to 8 players that are better than you are but not enough to overcome such a huge disparity
Harstem according to aligulac is #34 in the world, which by itself is crazy good and better than 99% of StarCraft players. But Serrall is in a totally different league which is so weird to think about how one could be that much better in a game that is known and has constraints.
Even knowing Serral is the best ever, I still don't think I quite appreciated his overwhelming skill until I saw this. Watching his side of the minimap, theres constantly multiple swarms moving around. I cant comprehend how hes able to be in multiple places at once like this and keep track of it all so flawlessly, all while responding to Harstems every move and microing individual units. Bow down to the GOAT!
i remember heromarine on one of his streams one time saying something along the lines of maphacks aren't enough to beat someone like serral and it's very cool to actually see that being tested.
Only way I can think of would be to pick a cheese as soon as possible, based on his very first choices. Proxy where you know his overlord will not see, marine rush when very greedy, etc.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 This doesn't work, I can already tell you the "very first choices" Serral makes ahead of time. I can tell you that in ZvP he will 16 hatch (17 hatch on third if pylon blocked), take an 18 gas, 17 pool, make 2 queens when the pool finishes and 1 pair of lings to prevent a pylon block at the third, which he will take at ~32 supply after lingspeed. He will make a third queen and if he sees no chrono on the gateway he will have 4 lings and he'll go up to 8 lings against double chrono on the gateway. There is no cheese that beats this. Also "marine rush when very greedy", what does that even mean. I can also tell you what exactly he will do against terran. You also can't "proxy where you know his overlord will not see" because you don't know where he will move his overlords ahead of time.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 The thing is that Serral usually plays his games pretty safe vs. cheeses - the theoretical counter to the way Serral plays is to be greedy vs. him and try to beat him in the lategame because you can usually pretty safely bet that Serral isn't going to be cheesing you so you don't need to spend resources being safe vs. cheeses.. but that's only in theory - for that strategy to work you need to actually be at a comparable skill level as him in the lategame (which people just aren't), otherwise the difference in skill level will still overshadow having a build order advantage.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 I still think it wouldn't work against Serral because he knows exactly when to scout where, what to look for, and he does it every single time. Like, even if his overlord doesn't see the proxy he can still tell (or at least assume & prepare) by the stuff he does not see in your base. And he never seems to play that greedy.
Five seconds later: "Dear Harstem, today I played aginst someone I'm pretty sure is a map hacker. Please look at this replay and tell me if you find something strange." *submits to harstem hunts hackers
Harstem finally understands how Maru feels vs late-game Serral. Sensor towers and missile turrets everywhere, Orbital Command map-hacks, and the burrow-boys still cause you to have bad trades. Serral's just on another level.
I think no fog of war is a great way to train. You should be ready to counter everything theoretically perfectly. Harstem seemed to find he didn’t know how to build a perfect late stage army, and overall did not have much of a plan that countered his opponent. Playing the wary parts of the game over and over and losing late game constantly should make you realize you need to learn how to play the late game differently. Maybe more gates and tech switches? He never used his mineral bank, so he certainly could afford another ten gates late game. Trade your ground army as cost effectively as you can, then tech switch to a mobile ground force.
@@JFox4587 The problem of that training is that it poorly translate to not hacked games cause you will not have that smooth early with perfect tech info meaning that you will never set late game in the same situation as the hacked training. The only utility it has it to highlight weakpoints in late game but it will not help iron them out anyway (you cannot train late game army control effectively when you map hack cause you start moving way earlier than normal with hack on as Harstem pointed out during the video)
@@LorisEnsatzuken ya im not saying exclusively train this way, just that if you cant win late game without fog, you know you don't understand late game. either you dont understand army compositions, or you dont understand positioning, or you can blame macro, but i dont think that is the case cuz they are just banking so its not like you have to hurry up and spend ur money effectively. ' just saying it's a good way to train your late game, but you shouldn't do it a lot obviously cuz you have to be used to playing with fog.
This was very fun to watch. Imagine trading vs a protoss like that, when he sees everything and you dont. Impossible! EDIT: Now i think Serral should send this replay to Harstem, and complain it might be a hacker :D
GG Harstem. I think this really trains the game theory and rhythm of rotations from Serral. Also think that surprisingly you still needed lots of detectors despite having maphacks.
Serral is just GOAT. When you are the best, everyone watch your games, everyone tries to play like you, everyone tries to counter you and you still win most games. That is insane
It's just incredible how serral controls his units, you can see the map how everything moves and the captain can't be bothered with every little movement, he had to choose were to keep his attention and Serral really capitalize on that. incredible player
Thats a great idea for sc2 Videos. Also props to serral for playing these kinds of games. I also think about his games against uthermal with the hp disadvantage on units
This is a perfect example of "metadata" vs "data." It's like two different games. You're playing with your eyes and he's playing with an assembled model of expectations based on what he knows of your game state and goals.
It's so wild the difference in multitasking. Serral plays like he's in archon mode. There's like, two dudes in there simultanenously, it doesn't make sense.
Unironically a good experiment. I’ve often wondered how much map hacking truly helps-unless the player learns how to properly integrate map hacking in their strategy it could easily become a liability. Especially with the inherent tilt factor of losing while hacking 😂😂
It keeps you pretty safe from cheese, like proxy rax and cannon rush. It basically guarantees you will live until the mid game. Now, with the pros, that is a pretty short time, but imagine bronze through platinum.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 Maphack won't save Silver, probably not even Gold, from cannon rush. The problem is, a good cannon rusher sends 2 or even 3 probes. Metal league player fixates on the first one, fights with it, triumphantly kills a cannon: there are 5 cannons elsewhere by then. It doesn't matter that the player could see them: they don't have time to look, or skill to handle multiple threats.
i used a map hack once in wings of liberty. honestly as a new player it didnt help much, but what it did help with was learning what timing to expect or what pattern typically indicated a drop or advancing units or expansions. anytime i saw something that WOULD have been crazy beneficial to know through the map hacks i quietly resigned the game and just took it as a learning opportunity (kind of like a "what went wrong" in replay, but live. the one I had (only for 3 games or so) used coloured squares to indicate structures or unit types. i could set it so medivacs or drop units as white squares, bases as red squares, etc. so to answer your questions (unless map hacks have developed in the last 10 years) you cannot see burrowed units with map hacks, i think it is essentially what removal of fog of war would show, but only on the minimap.
You should get some friends to play 3 games vs eachother, then only in 1 or 2 of the 3 matches get them to use the maphack mod. Then you have the job of finding which game someone was using the maphack mod. Prove to us your maphack detective skills.
Sure, Serral knew Harstem had full vision but seeing such dominance is still insane. That's the difference between being an elite player and being the best
I think the funniest part was muscle memorey taking over and harstem throwing arround revelations left and right. DUDE you have maphacks you can see the army the whole time
reminds me to a comment from winter years ago, "the difference in skill level between you guys(viewers who haven´t touch the game in 10 years) and me is about the same difference between me and Serral"
Before watching, I thought an irl hacker actually matched up against Serral! Little did I know, it was actually pre-agreed... _with one of the best Protoss players in Europe_ (currently ranked #34 Worldwide and #16 amongst non-Koreans according to Aligulac). Serral is *terrifying.* 💀
Serral's early queen position was perfect and deflected all the oracles. Past a certain point, the creep and overlord spread essentially is Serral's maphack so you can't even find paths to surprise him. Would love to see you do this vs Clem with a blink timing and see how much stronger it is when you know exactly where to blink :P
I don't comment much but I've been watching for years and this video really prompted me to tell you how much I love your content. Hilarious. Keep up the great work Captain o7
Bro it feels like the infestors are the ones feedbacking the Templar the entire time this game, also the value he gets out of the lings and infestors, and the map control he gets with the broods and corrupters is somehow still mindblowing, he just gets every perfect trade and preserves every unit, makes no mistakes, forces every single unit movement and always has every unit sufficiently in position, actual GOAT status!
yeah true, altho I think on a second or third try harstem would maybe get better trades when he gets more used to it and might engage in better positions where serrals army is far away from
Fair play for Harstem for uploading this video. Can we all take a moment to appreciate that Serral just beat a 6.5k professional Toss player with maphacks...
Esto me gusta, y bastante porque es una Prueba Controlada, es decir se tiene un jugador profesional y del otro lado un creador de Contenido, por ende es una prueba controlada, no como en otros casos que usan trampas de manera ilícita. Buen Video
I have a tournament concept : a team tournament, where in every team encounter, each team chose one member that is gonna have maphacks. They take turns in 1v1 as BO7 or something, and at any point, a team can try to remove the maphack of an oppenent, but they get only one try per encounter. This means the maphacker player has to hide his mapchack and other member must try to detect the maphacker. Their could often have 1v1 with both players maphacking also that could be fun.
Dear Harstem, This is a fantastic video! Easily in the top 10 favorite videos of yours. Is there anyway you can make this a regular thing once the world-cup has ended? I'm sure it'd be fun to watch you play others too, like Reynor, Clem, and MaxPax etc.
I recomend to give it a try. Only Serral makes it work like that. Other pros and normals like me (lower Master level) cant do this against a Protoss death ball.
GG. I like you explored this concept. This is just proof of how good the very top 10 players are. You are way above the norm but Serral is just a machine.
insanely fun to watch. One of the most back and forth PvZ games I've seen. I actually, think zerg is a bit overtuned. The speed of some of their units are slightly too high.
If you struggle late game as protoss. if you plan your sim city, well, build gateways near the last three planned nodes to block and path for easier cannons and defense, and navigation.. THis will make protoss late game easier to trade, and you can sac your main base since you ahve more production elsewhere, but don't go crazy its just for effective pathing/mazing, to protect and isolate your fresher rss nodes, because your income is what will atleast take you to the end... Protoss is sometimes a lot slower. or you can just expand with the gateway wall, and couple gateway... THis would be helpful... and give more tactical time for your movement of your army.. or alternative use some supply and defensive mother ship with cloak and recall.... Even when you saw the ling run bys you struggled, it seemed from a lack of a plan and your cannon placement has too much space, mix in a gateway, shield an cannon in a block you can create a really tanky wall, or you creating a pathing maze itself nad warp in a unit this forces less untis attacking your strcutures because they attempt to navigate and attack differently its okay effective.. meh.. but yeah walling wit hcannons and shields can be helpful... rss
In this mod, you have maphacks, but your units like tempests have vision. Which means they can shot beyond their normal vision range so even more advantage.
Would be awesome to see a game where Serral doesn't know you're maphacking that way he's not as cautious and plays normally. And maybe you're trying not to get caught somehow. Would be a great representation of a maphacker of the ladder (maybe play causal so you don't steal ladder points amd get Blizzard angry)
Now you have to do some kind of maphack roulette video where one person tries really hard to hide the fact that they have map hacks and you have to pick them out
So your youtube comment coaching for today is: 1. You have maphack, why are you scouting? Play way to greedy, you can see what he is doing, no need to be afraid of anything. 2. The lategame army should be just enough Tempest to 1 shot just about anything (spore, infestor, corruptor, bl, viper,...). Then just a-move so to continously poke him down from max range and defend them while they do it. Also put an observer close enough forward and some around you on obs mode to spot for the infestors.
![[LIVE] BABYMONSTER(베이비몬스터) - DRIP | 두시탈출 컬투쇼](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/UG05pxLGwzc/mqdefault.jpg)
if harstem were analyzing this replay he would say "clearly not a hacker, they didn't respond at all to something on the minimap"
which horror game is your profile pic from?
@@Yannis-ms4vl It's actually from your mom's sex tape.
@@oOOoOphidian it's so frustrating when he says that and it's an obvious cheater (Don't like term Map Hacks as that makes it sound cool to do)
@@jaya3582 I get it because he wants to have a lot of proof before sending something off to blizzard, but yeah it is a little frustrating
@@oOOoOphidian I understand that too, but there's been more than a few times where he completely misses some big shady things they did and only sees it when he (sometimes) rewinds the footage. The biggest indicators to me are when they click the mini map and land directly onto a unit coming by; Or when they want to attack the base but look ahead at everything for a few seconds or a-moving directly to an enemy on a map.
He's wondered many times if these map hacks have certain features but It's also very easy to see what features these map hacks contain with a brief Google search (being able to see buildings/upgrades in progress and cloaked/burrowed units) and there's many people willing to dish out big amounts of money for them...There's even auto build to play the game for you in these "map hack" programs.. makes no sense to me why people want that.
Serral's scouting and anticipation skills are so strong that it's like he has maphacks anyway, so this seems fair.
yep 😂
And there you've cut to the heart of the matter. Maphacks aren't as useful in the late game because any opponent who makes it that far is almost certainly more skilled than you and at that point they've got enough counter-intel that the maphack isn't much of an advantage anymore. They'll just beat you down slowly. I watched the tempo of this game slowly slide from Harstem to Serral almost in sync with Harstem's gas reserves.
That's honestly the problem with the zerg race. They keep nerfing the units and people who can't scout so cleanly suffer and complain that the race is weak. When they should have been nerfing the vision because that's what puts serral ahead of everyone else.
He knows everything that you can possibly be doing..
@@ghosthamster6521 Terran's late game vision is equally as strong as Zerg, perhaps even more so since they can just drop scans wherever they want and they will have enough OCs to be able to do that almost constantly. Not to mention sensor towers.
Serral: “can you see burrowed units?”
Harstem: “no”
Serral: gets infestors and lurkers.
Harstem: surprised Pikachu face. 😂😂😂😂
i wonder at what point he already researched burrow
@@ElVid serral is good enough that i would believe him doing it early and borrow ling scouts knowing harstem can see all and therefore thinks he isnt scouted ;D
serral is the one player who i am waiting for to use nydus worms to transport workers to safety and to enemy corner bases to steal as much mineral from there side off the map (it's a 400ish mineral investment to set a nydus and a hatchery, after that moving workers through cost very little time and with some decent vision moving all the drones back into the nydus if need be should be easy. make 2 nydus if it's sniped too easily ^^
@@Erebus2075 if serral would play terran he'd play two dozen orbitals just to scan a base and send in tons of mules to deprive the opponent of minerals and gas.
He can still SEE the burrowed units when they are burrowed without detection but, his units can't interact with them without detection.
do you need detection?
so nice of him to ask.
Getting 4 drones with 3 Oracles and maphack just on 3rd dive speaks a lot about Serral
@@exeggcutebenedict I think he got a few more on purpose. Zerg Players do that sometimes if they know there is no killing move coming, but its just harrass
Please do an interview with Serral so you two can discuss about this game, and how he felt about it. I would love to have your shared inputs on that one.
yes I need that
It really is impossible to overstate just how good Serral is. Even with full vision it never felt like Harstem was in control. The multitasking is just too much
@@Macantor13 yeah I think you nailed it a multitasking disparity and ability to prioritize on the Fly made up for the gap of having basically perfect vision
this is consistent with how sc2 works. the worse player will only win on information asymetry and the better player will win on mechanics, so every minute that passes by, serral's chance of winning goes up. maphack lets you beat worse players because that info asymmetry is gone but doesnt help much against better players. this is true for every hacker that has played the game
@@luxon4 not only does it allow you to be worst players but it's also going to give you an edge to 8 players that are better than you are but not enough to overcome such a huge disparity
Harstem according to aligulac is #34 in the world, which by itself is crazy good and better than 99% of StarCraft players. But Serrall is in a totally different league which is so weird to think about how one could be that much better in a game that is known and has constraints.
a reminder thou Serral did know about the map vision
this is so good, it is like watching a high level game being cast and played at the same time.
LOL my thoughts exaxlty
Even knowing Serral is the best ever, I still don't think I quite appreciated his overwhelming skill until I saw this. Watching his side of the minimap, theres constantly multiple swarms moving around. I cant comprehend how hes able to be in multiple places at once like this and keep track of it all so flawlessly, all while responding to Harstems every move and microing individual units. Bow down to the GOAT!
i remember heromarine on one of his streams one time saying something along the lines of maphacks aren't enough to beat someone like serral and it's very cool to actually see that being tested.
Only way I can think of would be to pick a cheese as soon as possible, based on his very first choices. Proxy where you know his overlord will not see, marine rush when very greedy, etc.
Like knowing you are about to get punched in the face but to slow to do anything about it
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 This doesn't work, I can already tell you the "very first choices" Serral makes ahead of time. I can tell you that in ZvP he will 16 hatch (17 hatch on third if pylon blocked), take an 18 gas, 17 pool, make 2 queens when the pool finishes and 1 pair of lings to prevent a pylon block at the third, which he will take at ~32 supply after lingspeed. He will make a third queen and if he sees no chrono on the gateway he will have 4 lings and he'll go up to 8 lings against double chrono on the gateway.
There is no cheese that beats this.
Also "marine rush when very greedy", what does that even mean. I can also tell you what exactly he will do against terran. You also can't "proxy where you know his overlord will not see" because you don't know where he will move his overlords ahead of time.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 The thing is that Serral usually plays his games pretty safe vs. cheeses - the theoretical counter to the way Serral plays is to be greedy vs. him and try to beat him in the lategame because you can usually pretty safely bet that Serral isn't going to be cheesing you so you don't need to spend resources being safe vs. cheeses.. but that's only in theory - for that strategy to work you need to actually be at a comparable skill level as him in the lategame (which people just aren't), otherwise the difference in skill level will still overshadow having a build order advantage.
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 I still think it wouldn't work against Serral because he knows exactly when to scout where, what to look for, and he does it every single time. Like, even if his overlord doesn't see the proxy he can still tell (or at least assume & prepare) by the stuff he does not see in your base. And he never seems to play that greedy.
Wow, we asked, and he delivered. Thanks, captain.
32:20 interceptors coming back from being recalled on other side of map
Loollll
good eyes, interesting, i wonder if you had nexuses all over the map, could you recall a carrier all over the map and have interceptors doing laps?
Let's gooo. Serral vs Harstem, my two favorite players.
4:15: "How do map hackers lose games?"
33:28: "I guess he's just better than me."
he said "guess we about to find out" to be fair
@@strammerdetlef that takes away from the funniness of the post, though
@@hinney827 kinda
Five seconds later: "Dear Harstem, today I played aginst someone I'm pretty sure is a map hacker. Please look at this replay and tell me if you find something strange."
*submits to harstem hunts hackers
Harstem finally understands how Maru feels vs late-game Serral.
Sensor towers and missile turrets everywhere, Orbital Command map-hacks, and the burrow-boys still cause you to have bad trades. Serral's just on another level.
This is really good practice for Serral cause now I'm at the same level of toss pros
- Oh crap!
I would have loved to hear a convo between you two about this game. Just to get impressions about how this could be used to help people train.
I think no fog of war is a great way to train. You should be ready to counter everything theoretically perfectly. Harstem seemed to find he didn’t know how to build a perfect late stage army, and overall did not have much of a plan that countered his opponent. Playing the wary parts of the game over and over and losing late game constantly should make you realize you need to learn how to play the late game differently. Maybe more gates and tech switches? He never used his mineral bank, so he certainly could afford another ten gates late game. Trade your ground army as cost effectively as you can, then tech switch to a mobile ground force.
@@JFox4587 The problem of that training is that it poorly translate to not hacked games cause you will not have that smooth early with perfect tech info meaning that you will never set late game in the same situation as the hacked training.
The only utility it has it to highlight weakpoints in late game but it will not help iron them out anyway (you cannot train late game army control effectively when you map hack cause you start moving way earlier than normal with hack on as Harstem pointed out during the video)
@@LorisEnsatzuken ya im not saying exclusively train this way, just that if you cant win late game without fog, you know you don't understand late game. either you dont understand army compositions, or you dont understand positioning, or you can blame macro, but i dont think that is the case cuz they are just banking so its not like you have to hurry up and spend ur money effectively. '
just saying it's a good way to train your late game, but you shouldn't do it a lot obviously cuz you have to be used to playing with fog.
This was very fun to watch.
Imagine trading vs a protoss like that, when he sees everything and you dont. Impossible!
EDIT: Now i think Serral should send this replay to Harstem, and complain it might be a hacker :D
lmao that would be hilarious
GG Harstem. I think this really trains the game theory and rhythm of rotations from Serral. Also think that surprisingly you still needed lots of detectors despite having maphacks.
Serral, for the 50th time this game:
***Sighs***
"Ohhh myy..."
I really wish you popped in in a call with him and get his perspective of what the game felt like
yeah me 2
Serral is just GOAT. When you are the best, everyone watch your games, everyone tries to play like you, everyone tries to counter you and you still win most games. That is insane
It's just incredible how serral controls his units, you can see the map how everything moves and the captain can't be bothered with every little movement, he had to choose were to keep his attention and Serral really capitalize on that. incredible player
4:16 "How do maphackers lose games?"
continues to lose the game
In fairness he did say "I guess we are about to find out"
@@juansaldana7976 he knew it's coming
26:40 "Y'know i feel less stressed right now. I am much more confident. All decisions were made so ahead of time that...
Thats a great idea for sc2 Videos. Also props to serral for playing these kinds of games. I also think about his games against uthermal with the hp disadvantage on units
It's hard to comprehend just how good serral is. He is Pro++
Harstem you allowed Serral to use his overwhelming Cuteness towards his victory and your defeat.
"He might just be better than me" Harstem humor ftw
This Serral guy is a guy to keep your eyes on. He might be going somewhere in the SC2 scene!
might
32:10 interceptor recall and how they fly back over the whole map (arriving 10 sec later)
Fun video. I think in a Bo7 you would win. I bet it takes time to adjust to the new information from map hacks. Very impressive win from Serral!
I'm one of the (probably dozens) of people to suggest this exact video on your other "map hack versus pro"
So glad to see it come out
This is a perfect example of "metadata" vs "data." It's like two different games. You're playing with your eyes and he's playing with an assembled model of expectations based on what he knows of your game state and goals.
"Good sir, we don't want to fight you quite yet." Had me dying rofl.
One of the few ways Serral can get a challenge anymore: have the opponent literally cheat xD
Basically how Reynor trains before big events... --> Against an archon team of Grandmasters. The multitask and apm goes up to an inhuman level.
Serral is not human. Holy cow
This is what I was waiting for!
It's so wild the difference in multitasking. Serral plays like he's in archon mode. There's like, two dudes in there simultanenously, it doesn't make sense.
Unironically a good experiment.
I’ve often wondered how much map hacking truly helps-unless the player learns how to properly integrate map hacking in their strategy it could easily become a liability. Especially with the inherent tilt factor of losing while hacking 😂😂
It keeps you pretty safe from cheese, like proxy rax and cannon rush. It basically guarantees you will live until the mid game. Now, with the pros, that is a pretty short time, but imagine bronze through platinum.
yeah and esp when the other player even KNOWS u have full vision. and that players name is serral lol
@@asbjrnfossmo1589 Maphack won't save Silver, probably not even Gold, from cannon rush. The problem is, a good cannon rusher sends 2 or even 3 probes. Metal league player fixates on the first one, fights with it, triumphantly kills a cannon: there are 5 cannons elsewhere by then. It doesn't matter that the player could see them: they don't have time to look, or skill to handle multiple threats.
You can tell Serral is ramping up his training for the upcoming season of who wants to be a grandmaster
What?!? No "creatures of the sea"?
Harstem has been hacked!
i used a map hack once in wings of liberty. honestly as a new player it didnt help much, but what it did help with was learning what timing to expect or what pattern typically indicated a drop or advancing units or expansions. anytime i saw something that WOULD have been crazy beneficial to know through the map hacks i quietly resigned the game and just took it as a learning opportunity (kind of like a "what went wrong" in replay, but live. the one I had (only for 3 games or so) used coloured squares to indicate structures or unit types. i could set it so medivacs or drop units as white squares, bases as red squares, etc. so to answer your questions (unless map hacks have developed in the last 10 years) you cannot see burrowed units with map hacks, i think it is essentially what removal of fog of war would show, but only on the minimap.
"How does he get that?! I HAVE MAP HACKS!" hahahaha
At 14min game time. Insane to see Serral play against the legendary Harstem using maphacks and at least breaking even.
This is the best pilot episode of "Is Serral imba or do I suck"
hahaha! I would love to see Lowko's reaction if he casts this game.
You should get some friends to play 3 games vs eachother, then only in 1 or 2 of the 3 matches get them to use the maphack mod. Then you have the job of finding which game someone was using the maphack mod. Prove to us your maphack detective skills.
Sure, Serral knew Harstem had full vision but seeing such dominance is still insane.
That's the difference between being an elite player and being the best
I think the funniest part was muscle memorey taking over and harstem throwing arround revelations left and right. DUDE you have maphacks you can see the army the whole time
lol true but often it was to reveal the cloaked units tbf
@@strammerdetlef Yea later in the game it was, i meant early on when he started to have oracles
Alternative title: Praising serral for half an hour strait while forgetting how to play normal starcraft II
32:10 Interceptors got recalled to the bottom base and then had to fly back to their carriers. I didn't know such a thing was possible!
reminds me to a comment from winter years ago, "the difference in skill level between you guys(viewers who haven´t touch the game in 10 years) and me is about the same difference between me and Serral"
Fun to watch. I like the comment "How do map hackers lose games?" Well... I love how you stopped yourself there.
32:42 it comes down to you losing high templar and archons to lings
yeah was not his best game guess he needs to get used to have full vision first
1:15 Lmao small price to pay indeed 😂
Before watching, I thought an irl hacker actually matched up against Serral!
Little did I know, it was actually pre-agreed... _with one of the best Protoss players in Europe_ (currently ranked #34 Worldwide and #16 amongst non-Koreans according to Aligulac).
Serral is *terrifying.* 💀
WOW! This is absolutely insane! Good Game Harstem!! OMG no idea how he STILL beat you. He's a monster...
the timing of "Do you need detection" is like a Rosetta Stone for us Zerg players holy f*ng shucks
Good one Serral allowing this! Super interesting test @Harstem , nice one
Serral's early queen position was perfect and deflected all the oracles. Past a certain point, the creep and overlord spread essentially is Serral's maphack so you can't even find paths to surprise him. Would love to see you do this vs Clem with a blink timing and see how much stronger it is when you know exactly where to blink :P
I love the constant revelations on the corruptors. He might be used to it.
so nice of the GOAT harstem to give this up and coming "serral" guy a shoutout
I don't comment much but I've been watching for years and this video really prompted me to tell you how much I love your content. Hilarious. Keep up the great work Captain o7
Really interesting format, Harstem 👍🏻
WHo is next from champions on a queue to play against you with map hack?
Bro it feels like the infestors are the ones feedbacking the Templar the entire time this game, also the value he gets out of the lings and infestors, and the map control he gets with the broods and corrupters is somehow still mindblowing, he just gets every perfect trade and preserves every unit, makes no mistakes, forces every single unit movement and always has every unit sufficiently in position, actual GOAT status!
yeah true, altho I think on a second or third try harstem would maybe get better trades when he gets more used to it and might engage in better positions where serrals army is far away from
Your lighting is impeccable.
Fair play for Harstem for uploading this video. Can we all take a moment to appreciate that Serral just beat a 6.5k professional Toss player with maphacks...
Esto me gusta, y bastante porque es una Prueba Controlada, es decir se tiene un jugador profesional y del otro lado un creador de Contenido, por ende es una prueba controlada, no como en otros casos que usan trampas de manera ilícita.
Buen Video
Serral was just wondering incredible. Really on a other level
"How does he get that? I've got maphacks!"
- Harstem, 2024
Sick game, well played both. More fun to watch too
Props to Harstem for posting this game. Serral is a god.
I have a tournament concept : a team tournament, where in every team encounter, each team chose one member that is gonna have maphacks. They take turns in 1v1 as BO7 or something, and at any point, a team can try to remove the maphack of an oppenent, but they get only one try per encounter.
This means the maphacker player has to hide his mapchack and other member must try to detect the maphacker. Their could often have 1v1 with both players maphacking also that could be fun.
Theres just no beating him.....hes too strong....too fast....he cant be nerfed. Thats why hes the GOAT.
Next has gotta be the interview video
WOW!!!!!!! I was thinking just a week ago
.. the captn vs serral...but the captn has map hacks... A dream came true
haha i love you harstrem you always have this hidden humor in every word you say
Nice game i hope that you can use this in practice and maybe get your revenge soon enough
Harstem makes me chuckle
Dear Harstem,
This is a fantastic video! Easily in the top 10 favorite videos of yours. Is there anyway you can make this a regular thing once the world-cup has ended? I'm sure it'd be fun to watch you play others too, like Reynor, Clem, and MaxPax etc.
Late game Zerg army with vipers and infestors looks borderline invincible, ngl
I recomend to give it a try. Only Serral makes it work like that. Other pros and normals like me (lower Master level) cant do this against a Protoss death ball.
Harstem: "I have been winning.." end quote
GG. I like you explored this concept. This is just proof of how good the very top 10 players are. You are way above the norm but Serral is just a machine.
Awesome, I have been looking forward to this video so much :D
when you can finally clearly see everything all you end up seeing is there is nothing you can do
love it when protoss players make use of canons, shows me they understand how to play the faction. its always good to defend an expo from harass
Great 1 :) Nice practice for Serral aswell, as you say :)
I think this Serral guy is going to go places in the Pro StarCraft 2 scene.
insanely fun to watch. One of the most back and forth PvZ games I've seen. I actually, think zerg is a bit overtuned. The speed of some of their units are slightly too high.
This was a good showcase at how hecking good Serral is
Aint no wayy, love to see the video actually happend!
If you struggle late game as protoss. if you plan your sim city, well, build gateways near the last three planned nodes to block and path for easier cannons and defense, and navigation.. THis will make protoss late game easier to trade, and you can sac your main base since you ahve more production elsewhere, but don't go crazy its just for effective pathing/mazing, to protect and isolate your fresher rss nodes, because your income is what will atleast take you to the end... Protoss is sometimes a lot slower. or you can just expand with the gateway wall, and couple gateway... THis would be helpful... and give more tactical time for your movement of your army.. or alternative use some supply and defensive mother ship with cloak and recall.... Even when you saw the ling run bys you struggled, it seemed from a lack of a plan and your cannon placement has too much space, mix in a gateway, shield an cannon in a block you can create a really tanky wall, or you creating a pathing maze itself nad warp in a unit this forces less untis attacking your strcutures because they attempt to navigate and attack differently its okay effective.. meh.. but yeah walling wit hcannons and shields can be helpful... rss
Harstem : "ok so today i'm gonna use a maphack so i can see everything"
Serral : --.--
15:58 : "OH I CANT SEE !!!"
In this mod, you have maphacks, but your units like tempests have vision. Which means they can shot beyond their normal vision range so even more advantage.
12:00 Serral fungal interceptors and Harstem land a storm on them.
lol
Seeing Clem try this mod would be cool that guy has the apm for some crazy plays i assume
Would be awesome to see a game where Serral doesn't know you're maphacking that way he's not as cautious and plays normally. And maybe you're trying not to get caught somehow. Would be a great representation of a maphacker of the ladder (maybe play causal so you don't steal ladder points amd get Blizzard angry)
I feel like maps vs serral just removes the illusion that you have a chance
Now you have to do some kind of maphack roulette video where one person tries really hard to hide the fact that they have map hacks and you have to pick them out
So your youtube comment coaching for today is:
1. You have maphack, why are you scouting? Play way to greedy, you can see what he is doing, no need to be afraid of anything.
2. The lategame army should be just enough Tempest to 1 shot just about anything (spore, infestor, corruptor, bl, viper,...). Then just a-move so to continously poke him down from max range and defend them while they do it.
Also put an observer close enough forward and some around you on obs mode to spot for the infestors.