There are some people in my evangelical church who are clearly fake pretend Christians (i.e. causing damage with their witness as they aren't Christian), and there's no doubt God would end up condemning them if they didn't repent (they haven't), but almost everyone else in our church thinks they are Christian. If good-natured mature Christians can't diagnose that they are clearly fake and pretend, what hope does our church have really.
The church of God (as distinct from the church of man) is one. No exceptions - no qualifications. It IS TOTALLY UNITED - ONE. The first sentence I wrote IS the gospel. It’s all in there: - we know the world isn’t one - if the church of God is one there must be something that has caused it to become one - if it’s the church OF GOD it must be God who made it become one - if it’s God who made it become one it must be due to his character - instead his dominating people - since human beings don't freely choose to do right when dominated). But what about doctrinal differences? Don't they divide the church of God? No. Doctrinal differences are of two kinds - primary and secondary. A primary doctrinal difference is a belief - or a failure to believe something - which results in permanent failure in the area of conversion or sanctification. A secondary issue doesn’t have that effect. Persistent primary doctrinal failure is reason to treat those who have those beliefs as not family for as long as they persist in them. The church of God therefore remains one. But can’t disagreement over secondary issues cause a church to be divided? No. To become divided over secondary issues one or more people in a church must have failed in a primary way - in either doctrine or behaviour or both. What about personality differences? We shouldn’t act as if these are a big issue (even if they cause a lot of heat). If an issue can be resolved by getting two people to operate in different areas of ministry - if those who fell out operate faithfully in their separate areas - the issue cannot be major. It’s a secondary issue in the sense I defined it above - because it isn’t preventing those in disagreement from moving towards maturity. (Warning - the fact that someone in our church doesn’t get on even with EVERYONE - isn’t proof of their disobedience. They may be the only person truly committed to following Christ. God’s word is the standard for assessing people’s character - not the way in which their behaviour causes others offence). Senior pastors are therefore not required to be politicians. Politics is the business of people with competing interests - people using power to get their way. If a senior pastor has become a politician it tells him that his leadership isn’t flowing out of his character. Instead he is using the bible - and various strategies - to force people to do what he wants them to do - instead of relying on the Spirit. With those ideas in mind I ask - is ‘ecosystem’ the right word to use in relation to church? I wasn’t sure from listening to this whether ecosystem was being used to describe the various PRIORITIES of the church that must be kept in balance - or the various PEOPLE GROUPS of the church and their need to cooperate. Can I suggest that whichever it was that ecosystem isn’t the right word to use - as it implies that people are separate but cooperative - when the church is one. It's a bit like direct action - direct action says that it's aiming to treat people equally - but it begins with the assumption that the only way to get people to become one is to continue to divide them into groups. I have already explained above that the PEOPLE of the church of God are one. But don’t we have to admit that the limit of this unity is that people ACT AS ONE - but aren't in fact one? Isn’t that where the word ecosystem finds a place? No. The people of God are not one because they choose to act as one - it’s the other way round - the people of God act as one because they ARE one. How is that possible? It’s possible because when individuals walk by the Spirit - when they use their freedom to put on the new nature (Eph 4:22-24) which is an identity in which we are able to be united with God (the identity is loved child of God) - they access a divine nature which ALWAYS CAUSES THEM TO OBEY GOD - not just individually - but corporately. (Corporately in the sense that the person who is a toe in the body will be led by the Spirit to be a toe). Now let me comment on the other possible idea behind 'ecosystem' - the competing PRIORITIES of the church. The various priorities of the church OF GOD aren’t merely priorities - they are different parts of the COMPLETELY UNIFIED character of Jesus. Obedience to one part of Christ’s character is NEVER something which causes obedience to another part of Christ’s character to become impossible. It will only have this effect if instead of seeking to unite people with Jesus we are instead trying to get people to accept and act on a set of IDEAS about what is true - and then people respond according to the inclinations of their flesh. The senior pastor will only be going down this road if instead of believing IN Christ - he merely believes that what the bible says is true. The church that truly welcomes Christ (what that is I am about to explain) has a single shared priority - to see him honoured in his full character. People who are truly submitted to God won't behave as those with independent priorities. But how do we welcome Christ so that people operate truly as one? We must welcome God as Word. And we must welcome God as Spirit. Instead of having a list of priorities to champion the senior pastor has only the two above- with these having to be requirements met in his own life before he can successfully model these to the congregation. To welcome God’s word without welcoming his Spirit is Pharisaism - the older son (John 5:39). To welcome God’s Spirit without welcoming his word is liberalism - the younger son (John 14:15) We are all sinners - which means that we are each Pharisees or liberals - or both - in some measure. The result of not welcoming God as word is that a church is one - but not one in Christ. It is one in the most dominant elements of worldly culture. The result of not welcoming God as Spirit is that the senior minister - and the people - cannot 'see' the church. (The church is only one - and visible - in the Spirit). The senior minister sees the church instead as a group of people who are dividable into two further groups - those with the gift of teaching - and those with the gift of listening. In the word without Spirit church - even after people have heard the word - the senior pastor believes they must be TRAINED to cooperate. Trained to do everything. What instead is the godly church like? 1. The church is prepared for service by more than the gift of teaching (see Ephesians 4 - there is THE GIFT of apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor/teacher - as distinct from the OFFICE of apostle). 2. Leaders recognise that their people were BORN to be their part of the body (with only separation from God standing in the way of them being their part of the body). Almost everyone in the body knows how to be their part of the body better than the senior pastor! The senior pastor who understands this is more concerned with RECEIVING the church of God - so that the constant work of God in all the members of the church is not frustrated - instead of trying to 'build' the church.
So thankful for the heart and mind God has given Greg. Such a blessing to me over the years.
There are some people in my evangelical church who are clearly fake pretend Christians (i.e. causing damage with their witness as they aren't Christian), and there's no doubt God would end up condemning them if they didn't repent (they haven't), but almost everyone else in our church thinks they are Christian.
If good-natured mature Christians can't diagnose that they are clearly fake and pretend, what hope does our church have really.
What's this 'our tribe' ?
The church of God (as distinct from the church of man) is one. No exceptions - no qualifications. It IS TOTALLY UNITED - ONE.
The first sentence I wrote IS the gospel. It’s all in there:
- we know the world isn’t one
- if the church of God is one there must be something that has caused it to become one
- if it’s the church OF GOD it must be God who made it become one
- if it’s God who made it become one it must be due to his character - instead his dominating people - since human beings don't freely choose to do right when dominated).
But what about doctrinal differences? Don't they divide the church of God? No. Doctrinal differences are of two kinds - primary and secondary. A primary doctrinal difference is a belief - or a failure to believe something - which results in permanent failure in the area of conversion or sanctification. A secondary issue doesn’t have that effect. Persistent primary doctrinal failure is reason to treat those who have those beliefs as not family for as long as they persist in them. The church of God therefore remains one.
But can’t disagreement over secondary issues cause a church to be divided? No. To become divided over secondary issues one or more people in a church must have failed in a primary way - in either doctrine or behaviour or both.
What about personality differences? We shouldn’t act as if these are a big issue (even if they cause a lot of heat). If an issue can be resolved by getting two people to operate in different areas of ministry - if those who fell out operate faithfully in their separate areas - the issue cannot be major. It’s a secondary issue in the sense I defined it above - because it isn’t preventing those in disagreement from moving towards maturity. (Warning - the fact that someone in our church doesn’t get on even with EVERYONE - isn’t proof of their disobedience. They may be the only person truly committed to following Christ. God’s word is the standard for assessing people’s character - not the way in which their behaviour causes others offence).
Senior pastors are therefore not required to be politicians. Politics is the business of people with competing interests - people using power to get their way. If a senior pastor has become a politician it tells him that his leadership isn’t flowing out of his character. Instead he is using the bible - and various strategies - to force people to do what he wants them to do - instead of relying on the Spirit.
With those ideas in mind I ask - is ‘ecosystem’ the right word to use in relation to church? I wasn’t sure from listening to this whether ecosystem was being used to describe the various PRIORITIES of the church that must be kept in balance - or the various PEOPLE GROUPS of the church and their need to cooperate. Can I suggest that whichever it was that ecosystem isn’t the right word to use - as it implies that people are separate but cooperative - when the church is one. It's a bit like direct action - direct action says that it's aiming to treat people equally - but it begins with the assumption that the only way to get people to become one is to continue to divide them into groups.
I have already explained above that the PEOPLE of the church of God are one. But don’t we have to admit that the limit of this unity is that people ACT AS ONE - but aren't in fact one? Isn’t that where the word ecosystem finds a place? No. The people of God are not one because they choose to act as one - it’s the other way round - the people of God act as one because they ARE one. How is that possible? It’s possible because when individuals walk by the Spirit - when they use their freedom to put on the new nature (Eph 4:22-24) which is an identity in which we are able to be united with God (the identity is loved child of God) - they access a divine nature which ALWAYS CAUSES THEM TO OBEY GOD - not just individually - but corporately. (Corporately in the sense that the person who is a toe in the body will be led by the Spirit to be a toe).
Now let me comment on the other possible idea behind 'ecosystem' - the competing PRIORITIES of the church. The various priorities of the church OF GOD aren’t merely priorities - they are different parts of the COMPLETELY UNIFIED character of Jesus. Obedience to one part of Christ’s character is NEVER something which causes obedience to another part of Christ’s character to become impossible. It will only have this effect if instead of seeking to unite people with Jesus we are instead trying to get people to accept and act on a set of IDEAS about what is true - and then people respond according to the inclinations of their flesh. The senior pastor will only be going down this road if instead of believing IN Christ - he merely believes that what the bible says is true.
The church that truly welcomes Christ (what that is I am about to explain) has a single shared priority - to see him honoured in his full character. People who are truly submitted to God won't behave as those with independent priorities.
But how do we welcome Christ so that people operate truly as one?
We must welcome God as Word.
And we must welcome God as Spirit.
Instead of having a list of priorities to champion the senior pastor has only the two above- with these having to be requirements met in his own life before he can successfully model these to the congregation.
To welcome God’s word without welcoming his Spirit is Pharisaism - the older son (John 5:39).
To welcome God’s Spirit without welcoming his word is liberalism - the younger son (John 14:15)
We are all sinners - which means that we are each Pharisees or liberals - or both - in some measure.
The result of not welcoming God as word is that a church is one - but not one in Christ. It is one in the most dominant elements of worldly culture.
The result of not welcoming God as Spirit is that the senior minister - and the people - cannot 'see' the church. (The church is only one - and visible - in the Spirit). The senior minister sees the church instead as a group of people who are dividable into two further groups - those with the gift of teaching - and those with the gift of listening. In the word without Spirit church - even after people have heard the word - the senior pastor believes they must be TRAINED to cooperate. Trained to do everything.
What instead is the godly church like?
1. The church is prepared for service by more than the gift of teaching (see Ephesians 4 - there is THE GIFT of apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor/teacher - as distinct from the OFFICE of apostle).
2. Leaders recognise that their people were BORN to be their part of the body (with only separation from God standing in the way of them being their part of the body). Almost everyone in the body knows how to be their part of the body better than the senior pastor! The senior pastor who understands this is more concerned with RECEIVING the church of God - so that the constant work of God in all the members of the church is not frustrated - instead of trying to 'build' the church.