@@Americansikkunt That type will be anything or do anything to elevate themselves above you , it'a a power play not a conviction , that was part of the message of the movie , like that way to "sophistication" through consumption
@@mirko1989 what’s the difference between REAL SJWs? They both virtue signal for status points…. They both don’t really care or have stakes in whatever they pretend to….
My fav chapter in the book is when he goes on a beach side vacation with his girlfriend. Pages of beautifully written descriptions of the beauty of the sky and ocean. Wonderful words about his romance with his girl. The chapter ends with Patrick walking the beach alone and he decides to eat a dead jellyfish. Sums up the whole book.
His routine reminds me of some of these ASMR overconsumption influencers with 20 types of each skin care product perfectly organized in drawers. Or the people who move food from one container to another so their fridge can be aesthetic. This has aged like fine wine.
Yeah even working class people act like that these days due to social media. They'll try to hide all flaws (unless they're trendy), post pictures of unusual/expensive products they own to look cool and loudly declare their support of causes they couldn't give a shit about. I really hate the modern world.
19:24 And when the rich tourist class seeks the most real, gritty, authentic back area, they're shocked when it's not civilized and horrified when there's real danger. e.g. Everest mountain climbing should never offer any real danger. Those are fake corpses, right? The darkest pits of the backstreets at night should be charming and exhilarating, never dangerous or deadly. Nothing bad can happen in this experimental submarine that visits the Titanic, it's an experience of a lifetime!
@@m420-nd1ifI get your sentiment, but saying that backstreets simply are not dangerous in most countries is objectively untrue. Backstreets can be somewhat identified as arteries for local gangs to traffic or pedal their goods. I have been in unlit backstreets where stabbings and murders have previously occurred in western countries, and have been stalked, and threatened in them as well. Have also walked past backstreets in India where visible child slavery rings have been displaying their wares. Chains and all. To be fair the idea that backstreets are only for evil doing is also false, as they are used by everyone, especially those from lower socio economic classes. It's not exclusively one or the other, however it's easy to imagine that they can be viewed through an "exhilarating" lens by the cloistered upper class
The thing about learning and understanding the world is it is a constant process. You don't just understand something - you can understand it more and more, the deeper you dive in it.
I just watched this movie this past weekend, and I’m throughly confused why the “Alpha” or “Sigma” men’s movement insist on using Patrick Bateman as their idol. Patrick Bateman is one of the most insecure characters I’ve seen. He literally tells his fiancé, “I want to fit in!!!” when she correctly points out that he hates his job and the people he works with. The fact that Bateman losses his sh!t when another coworker’s card is better than his just adds to the insecurity that festers inside Patrick Bateman.
He's a real cool guy and he's a hero of mine Travis, Rhinehart, rolled into one cute son Less than zero, a grotesque nightmare Subtly disturbing like normal behaviour
@@curiositycloset2359 How? The whole idea of these “alpha” or “sigma” bros is that they don’t follow anyone and f**k those who conform. Yet, they idolize Patrick Bateman, a guy who does nothing but follow trends for no reason other than they are popular. He literally admits to his fiancé, “I want to fit in”. Further proving that money doesn’t solve the issue of a severe lack of character.
Because, they share his insecurities. He, like them, wants to fit in, wants to be successful, want to be PERCEIVED as being successful and part of the in-group, even if he doesn't actually share the in-group's values. They're all a bunch of insecure children who think they're wearing the mask of an authoritative, powerful individual who can surf the waves of culture and social acceptability while also thinking they're better than everyone else under the mask.
Bateman acting up feels like Neo waking up in the capsule, and at the moment he tries to reach for the membrane he just wakes up back in the matrix emptier, more unhinged and increasingly nihilistic. That was a picture of Cosette above his toilet wasn’t it?
Another amazing analysis. Huge fan of American Psycho and I think it keeps aging like fine wine. While it could often be considered bizarre, funny and over the top back when it came out, it grows more and more real and frightening as time goes by.
Bateman gets emotional when talking about Whitney Houston as he identifies "The Greatest Love Of All" being about his own lonely narcissisim. The movie is endlessly rewatchable, every scene is a banger.
American Psycho: to this day the only book I've ever bought (out of 400+) that came wrapped in plastic, denying any would-be reader a sneak peak before purchase.
Ηey, peanut butter soup with smoked duck sounds awesome! And what's wrong with salmon, raspberry and guacamole? The point is not that the food is garbage, but that it's needlessly curated and consumed by people who do not appreciate its finesse. Other than that, spot on!
Hey! At 2:47 it is the unforgettable late great Hungarian actor Péter Haumann! Had to check on this: the scene is from a 1977 Hungarian TV film "A bosszú" aka The Revenge which adapted one story from within the book Notes from Underground. Nice research for this v essay!
The most disturbing point that I saw was that his punishment continually eluded him, even when he sought it, and it came down to his own identity being disrurbingly threatened, even before and after his deeds
I allways had this feeling that bale took inspiration from data from star trek. The way he speeks sounds very similur. Or the way he acts is like when data trys to hard to act human in the show. Very simular.
"when everything is commodified reality itself can decay." its like when art is commodified.. it loses it's inherent value and becomes a corrupt version of itself
I actually disagree. I think this movie is deep enough to have multiple layers of meaning. For instance whether or not he killed anyone is an interesting and meaning question, but there is a deeper meaning as well that it actually doesnt matter if he did. The world doesnt care
Bateman lacks the redemption that Raskolnikov experienced; perhaps the realization of his own inhumanity drives him to madness. He seems to hope that his crimes will make him stand out amid the nihilism of his Yuppie colleagues, yet he blends seamlessly into their corporate inhumanity. Bateman is somewhat aware of the absurdity of his situation, a clarity that emerges during his moments of mental breakdown. As he struggles to maintain the social mask he has worn for so long, the resulting tension ultimately drives him to madness.
Probably the best video of yours ive seen. Im also a big fan of notes from underground but although ive seen the film and read the book of american psycho I never quite managed to marry the two together. Really good example and i think the intro from notes from underground are useful here where Dostoyevski says that the underground man is a necessary output of the social system that exists. You also use the word hyperreal which i take as you tipping your hat to the work of Baudrillard who argues that the mass production society encourages people to live what is nearly all a simulation of what might be considered a real life. That the original, true ground of what is aimed at is replaced in peoples minds with a particularly attractive map. The classic example is doing things in your spare time that make you look happy and fulfilled when you post them on social media but which are actually boring or miserable when you actually do them. Or living in a house that LOOKS cosy and twee in photographs from outside but which are cold and dismal to live in. As you noted in the video, the aim of marketing is not to teach people what to want, but how to want.
This is a brilliant and insightful piece. I've always loved this movie, having seen it at the cinema in my youthful days, I read the book because I wanted to know more ( back then, I thought, I wanted to know the gory details, but know I realise I was looking for the meaning behind the book). So thank you for creating this x 💚 Loving your work Brother x
Dostoyevsky's frequently hilarious, yeah. He's brilliant at portraying people being nuts and takes a lot of (acknowledged) inspiration from the also very funny Gogol.
I read the book fairly recently (That was an experience) and it definitely affected how I look at the film. One thing that stuck out to me was book Patrick’s commentary on people not understanding him. Failing to “capture his essence” as he says at one point. Movie Patrick’s 2nd plea to his lawyer feels like a desperate desire to be seen, which of course doesn’t happen and he’s left with the knowledge that he could do all these atrocious acts, announce it, but have no one really bring him to task. Therefore, meaningless.
Great video! ..TEXT MENTIONED include, -FYODOR DOSTOEVSKY: CRIME and PUNISHMENT -Nikolai Chernyshevsky: What Is to Be Done? - THE TOURIST by DEAN MACCANNELL.. A NEW THEORY OF THE LEISURE CLASS WITH A NEW INTRODUCTION - Notes from underground by Fyodor Dostoevsky -AMERICAN PYCHO BY BRETT EASTON ELLIS
I just finally watched this movie after hearing about it for so many years and it just hit me that he doesn't care about the art he just looks at himself in the picture and not the actual artwork 6:10
I think his taste in art and music are entirely performative. He likely believes having a passion for the arts makes him seem more human, so he's adopted it as a part of his mask.
I thought the real estate agent at the end was his handler. I’m thinking that his father knew how his son Patrick was. Patrick was his sole heir. I think the old man figured his son only deletes insignificant people and lowlifes. He assigned certain individuals to keep Patrick from totally crashing out thus bringing down the Bateman empire with him. Just my opinion.
I suspect there's no definitive answer, that the author intentionally made the resolution-or lack thereof-ambiguous, to leave us adrift, mirroring Patrick's state of mind at the conclusion. You can put forward compelling arguments both for and against the veracity of Patrick's murderous acts, but ultimately, this will lead you nowhere because all we are made privy to is events from the perspective of an unreliable narrator.
Here’s my read. We spend our lives told that what is inside is what really matters. Inside Bateman is a psychopath but on the outside he isn’t. He doesn’t kill anyone. He supports charity. So really, is the surface more important? If that isn’t a comment on the 80s, what is?
no such thing as the conception of any abstractions that is the 'pathys' & any Personality disorder... especially the abstraction of 'Personality' itself.
The food scene reminded me of the weird deconstruction that was Nouvelle cuisine. Raspberry coulis, reimagining and deconstructed a Philly roll. Thought he was poking on the ‘refinined to base ingredients’ that contemporary chefs were playing with. I’m surprise didn’t see a veloute chicken aspic.
I always think of US being such a privileged society that just run into driving the world at it's feet. It's like children who don' even realize that they are the peak rich people of the poverty class that run on the suffering of the dominated countries but live into such a poverty that question even poverty patterns into itself and don't see the REAL poverty and desperation of the general population of the world.
Countries suffering are their own faults. Several poor countries have resources but consistently allow themselves to be sold some versions of equity for all.
OH SNAP also a track off Information Society's iconic, cheeseball cyberpunk album, Think, is played in the club scene. Of course another track from that album, Mirrorshades (a personal favorite), starts with a half-spoken "Here are a few notes from the underground, load them at your pleasure." I was halfway through the first sentence when i realized what i was doing. Of course i can't resist spreading my unironic (if not un-alloyed) love of cheeseball cyberpunk and cyberpunk as a style or aesthetic, but i also can't skip a chance to bring it up as the foundation for a real philosophy, a new Cynicism. We were done a better deal by Gibson than they had been by Antisthenes. I'm not being referential enough to products and trivialities for this to actually be a joke, or to be an effective one. They looked over their shoulder for an 'exit' sign.
What so great about this is that it depicts the number one misconception about narcissism so accurately.... that he "simply is not there" Most people think narcissism is having a huge ego and being self obsessed. While it does appear this way on the outside, what's really going on internally is a lack of a true self entirely. These people essentially got stuck in their psychological development somewhere around the age of 3, maybe a little higher, and never build a healthy sense of who they are. This leaves them constantly trying to fill the void with external feedback, otherwise known as narcissistic supply. When this coincides with psychopathy, you get something like a Patrick Bateman. Truly terrifying! Sadly, we actually promote these people in this society, both in business and government. The rate of mental illness in positions of power is almost an order of magnitude higher than in the general population. We need to form something like a Turing test for these conditions and have some way to keep them out of power... Potentially, we could use language model AI because language is the best window into their minds. This will be tricky, as there will obviously be resistance from those who already wield such power, but we must find a way! They're already causing so much damage to society, people, the planet, and just life in general.
@Nylon_riot while I did really enjoy that show, I can't remember a whole ton about it... I think it was more focused on psychopathic traits than narcissistic ones. In the case of narcissism, it's something created at a very young age by an abusive parent, often the mother. They essentially rob the child of having any chance of developing a healthy self image. It's actually quite sad when you think about it. Being a true narcissist would be incredibly painful. While it isn't really possible to empathize with them (as normal people can't really even imagine this condition in any real way), I think we should still sympathize and think strategically how to integrate them into society. In the right situation, they can actually be good people in many regards. I think professor Sam Vaknin is a great example of this. He has revolutionized the study of narcissism while being a "recovered" one himself. Watch him in interviews and it's quite interesting to know his past and see just how well he's adapted
i was a huge fan of the book so when ive heard the movie was being made, i was skeptical. how were they gonna be able to adapt such a huge book? and who was going to play patrick? one of my favorite parts of the movies is the easter egg inside patrick's drawer, the "secret sketch book". those crude drawing are some of the scenes from the book that...lets just say im fine with them being left out. i mean, Palm Springs? yikes.... i was kind of disappointed the movie didnt include the 4-ways (at some point 6) phonecall where they are picking what club they were gonna go that night. that chapter was freaking delirious. another thing i didnt like was the chainsaw chase scene, always felt forced. the rest of the movie is just splendid
Great call back! I'm surprised you didn't add a little George Price and Century of the self commentary. Next is fight Club, a modern re-imagination of Walden!
The novel explores the complexities of status, wealth, revolution against materialistic show of wealth, etc. but ultimately it explored how human circumstances beyond control influence their paths, lives and their abilities to change/grow/be redeemed in the eyes of society. Those who have means to change and grow choose not to or don't want to as there is no benefit to losing their status/power. Superficiality of the wealthy doesn't matter if they benefit directly from it. Just like the Yuppies.
"Cuz the underground man don't think like the rest of society. Erry body else is just fumble-fucking their way through life and never asking the big questions. But for our boy, dat shit's the Dank. And if that's the way you wanna roll, you gotta open your eyes so wide to the world around you that it hurts. If you can do that, you're playing a whole other game, B. Dat pain when you're beefin' with reality and git yo shit wrecked creates consciousness." -THUG NOTES
The yuppie montage has a digitally placed photo of Ronald Reagan inserted - it is not in the original footage. In addition, although It may be easy to conflate Reagan's limited government philosophy with emerging neocon psychopathy - they were quite distinct from one another.
@@stefanjohnsson5661 One of them wants limited government and the other wants endless expansionist government and total power over the individual. The first neocons larped as conservatives, now they larp as liberals. I am kind of stunned you don't know this.
@@rahkuaschountI didn’t say there wasn’t a difference. I would argue that Reaganomics was the beginning of the Christian right and the trickel down economy that conservatives use to get poor people to vote against their own interests.
@@stefanjohnsson5661 What you are describing is called the Deep State or the "blob", and is now firmly entrenched in left-wing liberal politics. They're shapeshifters.
Congrats for noticing! 💪😎✌️Writing is writing, yet some storytelling techniques differ from others. And in their subtlety, sometimes certain aspects and thematic underpinnings can be lost. Direction and Reflection are both key. 🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨
I think another interesting exploration into this film is its distinctly pre-9/11 view of American society. We were so insulated by our privilege that the idea of actual substantial retribution at the hands of those we had used and disposed of for decades that the very notion of accountability had all but vanished from the minds of most urban professionals. (Also, thanks for teaching me something I never would have thought to look up: the acronym at the root of yuppy!)
i don't know why, but i've always known it came from young urban professional... certainly, it was from the media i consumed because my parents are not native english speakers
Go to buyraycon.com/bauer for 20-50% off site-wide. Brought to you by Raycon.
Glad to see you getting sponsors, keep up the good work, Jared!
Consume. No ethical social commentary under capitalism, amirite?
Raycon, really? The lowest quality earphones you can get. Stay away from people who promote this crap.
I would only be seen with Sony equipment on my head. Nice, very nice.
That moral hygiene point is universal among finance bros , they will ruin 1000 families and then lecture a guy on a street for saying a slur .
And tankies!!!!
It's about the facade. The modern American way.
That confuses me. Were yuppies SJWs?
@@Americansikkunt That type will be anything or do anything to elevate themselves above you , it'a a power play not a conviction , that was part of the message of the movie , like that way to "sophistication" through consumption
@@mirko1989 what’s the difference between REAL SJWs?
They both virtue signal for status points….
They both don’t really care or have stakes in whatever they pretend to….
My fav chapter in the book is when he goes on a beach side vacation with his girlfriend. Pages of beautifully written descriptions of the beauty of the sky and ocean. Wonderful words about his romance with his girl. The chapter ends with Patrick walking the beach alone and he decides to eat a dead jellyfish. Sums up the whole book.
part of the palm springs arc?
the fact that this movie has completely been co opted by the people its making fun of is legit the most perfect thing to happen to it
Same thing applies to the Matrix
His routine reminds me of some of these ASMR overconsumption influencers with 20 types of each skin care product perfectly organized in drawers. Or the people who move food from one container to another so their fridge can be aesthetic. This has aged like fine wine.
Hey dont lump a dude with ocd who likes his groceries symmetrical in with all those guys
Morons of today are the laughing stock before even being born... as it has been from the beginning of times...
Yeah even working class people act like that these days due to social media. They'll try to hide all flaws (unless they're trendy), post pictures of unusual/expensive products they own to look cool and loudly declare their support of causes they couldn't give a shit about. I really hate the modern world.
@jrojala prohectung what exactly? A disorder i acknowledged having? Lol
I would like to watch this, but I can't. I have to return some videotapes!
I have to go to the dry cleaners to wash some sheets I accidently poured wine onto...🙄
💀💀💀💀💀
I’m waiting for Paul Allen’s analysis video.
@@gast9374 dont forget to re-wind!
remember to wash your hands while wearing gloves
19:24
And when the rich tourist class seeks the most real, gritty, authentic back area, they're shocked when it's not civilized and horrified when there's real danger.
e.g. Everest mountain climbing should never offer any real danger. Those are fake corpses, right?
The darkest pits of the backstreets at night should be charming and exhilarating, never dangerous or deadly.
Nothing bad can happen in this experimental submarine that visits the Titanic, it's an experience of a lifetime!
Backstreets are not dangerous in most countries.... that sounds american
@@m420-nd1ifI get your sentiment, but saying that backstreets simply are not dangerous in most countries is objectively untrue. Backstreets can be somewhat identified as arteries for local gangs to traffic or pedal their goods.
I have been in unlit backstreets where stabbings and murders have previously occurred in western countries, and have been stalked, and threatened in them as well. Have also walked past backstreets in India where visible child slavery rings have been displaying their wares. Chains and all.
To be fair the idea that backstreets are only for evil doing is also false, as they are used by everyone, especially those from lower socio economic classes.
It's not exclusively one or the other, however it's easy to imagine that they can be viewed through an "exhilarating" lens by the cloistered upper class
@@m420-nd1if Naivety or utter stupidity?
I personally think being turned into red toothpaste in a microsecond is an experience of a lifetime!
Let’s see if Paul Allen finally understands American Psycho 24 years later.
Oh my god, he even has a watermark
we'll ask him when he comes back from london
i was today years old when i learned 'yuppie' meant something other than pretentious ostentatious vacuous a-hole.
Youth urban hippie?
@@Watch-0w1Young urban professional
oh, it still means that...
YUPPIE = young upwardly mobile urban Professional. Two yuppies with no kids were DINKS. Double income no kids
The advertising in the video really takes the message to another level lol
ikr
capitalism owns us all in the end
gotta keep the lights on. we're all slaves!!!!
Why did we all listen to Jared for all those years at Wisecrack when he didn't understand any film he's seen until recently smh?
He means he unlocked a new meaning
those title really seem a bit click-baity...
Cause he’s a god damn angel that’s why
The thing about learning and understanding the world is it is a constant process.
You don't just understand something - you can understand it more and more, the deeper you dive in it.
lmao
I just watched this movie this past weekend, and I’m throughly confused why the “Alpha” or “Sigma” men’s movement insist on using Patrick Bateman as their idol. Patrick Bateman is one of the most insecure characters I’ve seen. He literally tells his fiancé, “I want to fit in!!!” when she correctly points out that he hates his job and the people he works with. The fact that Bateman losses his sh!t when another coworker’s card is better than his just adds to the insecurity that festers inside Patrick Bateman.
He's a real cool guy and he's a hero of mine
Travis, Rhinehart, rolled into one cute son
Less than zero, a grotesque nightmare
Subtly disturbing like normal behaviour
I think you're missing the point.
@@curiositycloset2359 How? The whole idea of these “alpha” or “sigma” bros is that they don’t follow anyone and f**k those who conform. Yet, they idolize Patrick Bateman, a guy who does nothing but follow trends for no reason other than they are popular. He literally admits to his fiancé, “I want to fit in”. Further proving that money doesn’t solve the issue of a severe lack of character.
Because, they share his insecurities. He, like them, wants to fit in, wants to be successful, want to be PERCEIVED as being successful and part of the in-group, even if he doesn't actually share the in-group's values.
They're all a bunch of insecure children who think they're wearing the mask of an authoritative, powerful individual who can surf the waves of culture and social acceptability while also thinking they're better than everyone else under the mask.
@@TheGoIsWin21 lol no.
Jared's takes on film and books are just a treat
Bateman acting up feels like Neo waking up in the capsule, and at the moment he tries to reach for the membrane he just wakes up back in the matrix emptier, more unhinged and increasingly nihilistic.
That was a picture of Cosette above his toilet wasn’t it?
Another amazing analysis. Huge fan of American Psycho and I think it keeps aging like fine wine. While it could often be considered bizarre, funny and over the top back when it came out, it grows more and more real and frightening as time goes by.
Our collective apathy keeps this film relevant generation to generation .
imagine a Glamorama series
He was reciting the music reviews verbatim
Holy shit that makes perfect sense, I never thought about that!
Bateman gets emotional when talking about Whitney Houston as he identifies "The Greatest Love Of All" being about his own lonely narcissisim. The movie is endlessly rewatchable, every scene is a banger.
the idea of a yuppie even knowing what hard work looks and feels like and being able to in fact work hard is the best joke of this entire segment.
The call to the lawyer is some of the best acting out there.
American Psycho: to this day the only book I've ever bought (out of 400+) that came wrapped in plastic, denying any would-be reader a sneak peak before purchase.
The way you describe things and back them up with sources and new talking points is truly incredible. Amazing video(s)!
Ηey, peanut butter soup with smoked duck sounds awesome! And what's wrong with salmon, raspberry and guacamole? The point is not that the food is garbage, but that it's needlessly curated and consumed by people who do not appreciate its finesse.
Other than that, spot on!
You should try the sea-urchin ceviche.
Agree with you. They are taking the dish for granted and only ordering them to appear refined.
I just caught the “mashed squash” for the first time 😂
So good to hear you speak about literature and philosophical takes again.
My key takeaway from the novel: Evian. Evian water takes away any impurities from last night’s excess. Evian. Evian water.
Just found this channel less than a week ago and I’m becoming a big fan.
There should be a spiritual sequel starring an influencer who embodies the same kind of degeneracy as Bateman
oh africa, brave africa- it was a laugh riot
Crazy just opened TH-cam and was given a gift
Hey! At 2:47 it is the unforgettable late great Hungarian actor Péter Haumann! Had to check on this: the scene is from a 1977 Hungarian TV film "A bosszú" aka The Revenge which adapted one story from within the book Notes from Underground. Nice research for this v essay!
he plays a psychopath perfectly. be careful folks, theyre more common than you might think.
What I recall most about the book is pages of clothing description. It was so mind numbing I yearned for the violence
The most disturbing point that I saw was that his punishment continually eluded him, even when he sought it, and it came down to his own identity being disrurbingly threatened, even before and after his deeds
I allways had this feeling that bale took inspiration from data from star trek. The way he speeks sounds very similur. Or the way he acts is like when data trys to hard to act human in the show. Very simular.
Sitting at a lakeside bench with your laptop and your dog. That’s all I need.
Yoo!! What Went Wrong podcast! I love them!! So glad to see some recognition for their work.
This movie is so layered that 24 years later we're still finding new gems
This feels much like old school wisecrack...I didn't realize how much I missed this...
NO No No just enough with the past was better BS
"when everything is commodified reality itself can decay." its like when art is commodified.. it loses it's inherent value and becomes a corrupt version of itself
Outstanding, as always! This movie reminds me of Eliot's The Waste Land.
This movie is so misunderstood by its own audience it makes me question religions with canon scriptures
I actually disagree. I think this movie is deep enough to have multiple layers of meaning.
For instance whether or not he killed anyone is an interesting and meaning question, but there is a deeper meaning as well that it actually doesnt matter if he did. The world doesnt care
This is healthy questioning
@@trequor yes but I'm guessing what OP meant by "its own audience" is "guys who think bateman is cool"
@@synmad3638 I dont think those guys watched the movie or know the context of the Bateman memes.
@@synmad3638the "literally me" crowd.
The ad part was a good homage for the opening scene of American Psycho.
Bateman lacks the redemption that Raskolnikov experienced; perhaps the realization of his own inhumanity drives him to madness. He seems to hope that his crimes will make him stand out amid the nihilism of his Yuppie colleagues, yet he blends seamlessly into their corporate inhumanity. Bateman is somewhat aware of the absurdity of his situation, a clarity that emerges during his moments of mental breakdown. As he struggles to maintain the social mask he has worn for so long, the resulting tension ultimately drives him to madness.
'inhumanity' no such thing... you're too superficial.
Excellent breakdown, thank you.
Such neat analysis. Thanks ❤
First time on your channel - this was a great breakdown. Good stuff, I'll be back.
Probably the best video of yours ive seen. Im also a big fan of notes from underground but although ive seen the film and read the book of american psycho I never quite managed to marry the two together. Really good example and i think the intro from notes from underground are useful here where Dostoyevski says that the underground man is a necessary output of the social system that exists. You also use the word hyperreal which i take as you tipping your hat to the work of Baudrillard who argues that the mass production society encourages people to live what is nearly all a simulation of what might be considered a real life. That the original, true ground of what is aimed at is replaced in peoples minds with a particularly attractive map. The classic example is doing things in your spare time that make you look happy and fulfilled when you post them on social media but which are actually boring or miserable when you actually do them. Or living in a house that LOOKS cosy and twee in photographs from outside but which are cold and dismal to live in. As you noted in the video, the aim of marketing is not to teach people what to want, but how to want.
Bret Easton Ellis indicated that Bateman emerged from his sense of dislocation in NYC.
In Bateman’s world nothing has intrinsic value, only instrumental value.
This is a brilliant and insightful piece. I've always loved this movie, having seen it at the cinema in my youthful days, I read the book because I wanted to know more ( back then, I thought, I wanted to know the gory details, but know I realise I was looking for the meaning behind the book).
So thank you for creating this x 💚
Loving your work Brother x
Dostoyevsky's frequently hilarious, yeah. He's brilliant at portraying people being nuts and takes a lot of (acknowledged) inspiration from the also very funny Gogol.
Hated him in shaft. Thats how good i felt he played his character.
I have had this on my mind lately a lot.
Great video to great need!
Great work on this one!
I read the book fairly recently (That was an experience) and it definitely affected how I look at the film. One thing that stuck out to me was book Patrick’s commentary on people not understanding him. Failing to “capture his essence” as he says at one point. Movie Patrick’s 2nd plea to his lawyer feels like a desperate desire to be seen, which of course doesn’t happen and he’s left with the knowledge that he could do all these atrocious acts, announce it, but have no one really bring him to task. Therefore, meaningless.
wasn't he lying about his father owning the company? he also said he was a CEO as she leaves this info on his answering machine
Great video!
..TEXT MENTIONED include,
-FYODOR DOSTOEVSKY: CRIME and PUNISHMENT
-Nikolai Chernyshevsky:
What Is to Be Done?
- THE TOURIST by DEAN MACCANNELL.. A NEW THEORY OF THE LEISURE CLASS WITH A NEW INTRODUCTION
- Notes from underground by Fyodor Dostoevsky
-AMERICAN PYCHO
BY BRETT EASTON ELLIS
I just finally watched this movie after hearing about it for so many years and it just hit me that he doesn't care about the art he just looks at himself in the picture and not the actual artwork 6:10
Yeah, his true passion is returning video tapes.
This is happening right now in California
And it’s Les Miserables!! Such great details
I think his taste in art and music are entirely performative. He likely believes having a passion for the arts makes him seem more human, so he's adopted it as a part of his mask.
Very nice deep dive! Thank you for this!
I thought the real estate agent at the end was his handler. I’m thinking that his father knew how his son Patrick was. Patrick was his sole heir. I think the old man figured his son only deletes insignificant people and lowlifes. He assigned certain individuals to keep Patrick from totally crashing out thus bringing down the Bateman empire with him. Just my opinion.
Hmmmmm, interesting. He's not the sole heir though, Sean from "the rules of attraction" is his little brother.
@@jakeshockley2735 Okay. ✅
I suspect there's no definitive answer, that the author intentionally made the resolution-or lack thereof-ambiguous, to leave us adrift, mirroring Patrick's state of mind at the conclusion.
You can put forward compelling arguments both for and against the veracity of Patrick's murderous acts, but ultimately, this will lead you nowhere because all we are made privy to is events from the perspective of an unreliable narrator.
Here’s my read. We spend our lives told that what is inside is what really matters. Inside Bateman is a psychopath but on the outside he isn’t. He doesn’t kill anyone. He supports charity. So really, is the surface more important? If that isn’t a comment on the 80s, what is?
no such thing as the conception of any abstractions that is the 'pathys' & any Personality disorder... especially the abstraction of 'Personality' itself.
"i am simply not there"
Patrick didn’t kill Paul Allen, he killed a VP who was mistaken for Paul Allen but never corrected anyone.
lmao sheesh
Say whaaahhhh????
I always thought of this film as a smug apathetic rich man falling into schizophrenia.
The food scene reminded me of the weird deconstruction that was Nouvelle cuisine. Raspberry coulis, reimagining and deconstructed a Philly roll. Thought he was poking on the ‘refinined to base ingredients’ that contemporary chefs were playing with. I’m surprise didn’t see a veloute chicken aspic.
I always think of US being such a privileged society that just run into driving the world at it's feet. It's like children who don' even realize that they are the peak rich people of the poverty class that run on the suffering of the dominated countries but live into such a poverty that question even poverty patterns into itself and don't see the REAL poverty and desperation of the general population of the world.
Countries suffering are their own faults. Several poor countries have resources but consistently allow themselves to be sold some versions of equity for all.
Your expression of thoughts renders them no less intelligible,
It's crazy to think the movie "The Rules of Attraction" is a continuation of the Bateman family
Why is that "crazy"?
OH SNAP also a track off Information Society's iconic, cheeseball cyberpunk album, Think, is played in the club scene. Of course another track from that album, Mirrorshades (a personal favorite), starts with a half-spoken "Here are a few notes from the underground, load them at your pleasure." I was halfway through the first sentence when i realized what i was doing. Of course i can't resist spreading my unironic (if not un-alloyed) love of cheeseball cyberpunk and cyberpunk as a style or aesthetic, but i also can't skip a chance to bring it up as the foundation for a real philosophy, a new Cynicism. We were done a better deal by Gibson than they had been by Antisthenes. I'm not being referential enough to products and trivialities for this to actually be a joke, or to be an effective one. They looked over their shoulder for an 'exit' sign.
What so great about this is that it depicts the number one misconception about narcissism so accurately.... that he "simply is not there"
Most people think narcissism is having a huge ego and being self obsessed.
While it does appear this way on the outside, what's really going on internally is a lack of a true self entirely.
These people essentially got stuck in their psychological development somewhere around the age of 3, maybe a little higher, and never build a healthy sense of who they are.
This leaves them constantly trying to fill the void with external feedback, otherwise known as narcissistic supply.
When this coincides with psychopathy, you get something like a Patrick Bateman.
Truly terrifying!
Sadly, we actually promote these people in this society, both in business and government.
The rate of mental illness in positions of power is almost an order of magnitude higher than in the general population.
We need to form something like a Turing test for these conditions and have some way to keep them out of power...
Potentially, we could use language model AI because language is the best window into their minds.
This will be tricky, as there will obviously be resistance from those who already wield such power, but we must find a way!
They're already causing so much damage to society, people, the planet, and just life in general.
The TV show Dexter is the perfect analogy for how narcissistists are created and operate.
@Nylon_riot while I did really enjoy that show, I can't remember a whole ton about it...
I think it was more focused on psychopathic traits than narcissistic ones.
In the case of narcissism, it's something created at a very young age by an abusive parent, often the mother.
They essentially rob the child of having any chance of developing a healthy self image.
It's actually quite sad when you think about it.
Being a true narcissist would be incredibly painful.
While it isn't really possible to empathize with them (as normal people can't really even imagine this condition in any real way), I think we should still sympathize and think strategically how to integrate them into society.
In the right situation, they can actually be good people in many regards.
I think professor Sam Vaknin is a great example of this.
He has revolutionized the study of narcissism while being a "recovered" one himself.
Watch him in interviews and it's quite interesting to know his past and see just how well he's adapted
One of the best TH-cam comments, put it in the hall
I really love this new series of what most ppl missed. I’d love to see memento and machinist
i was a huge fan of the book so when ive heard the movie was being made, i was skeptical. how were they gonna be able to adapt such a huge book? and who was going to play patrick? one of my favorite parts of the movies is the easter egg inside patrick's drawer, the "secret sketch book". those crude drawing are some of the scenes from the book that...lets just say im fine with them being left out. i mean, Palm Springs? yikes....
i was kind of disappointed the movie didnt include the 4-ways (at some point 6) phonecall where they are picking what club they were gonna go that night. that chapter was freaking delirious.
another thing i didnt like was the chainsaw chase scene, always felt forced.
the rest of the movie is just splendid
Great call back! I'm surprised you didn't add a little George Price and Century of the self commentary.
Next is fight Club, a modern re-imagination of Walden!
just something I noticed recently-- in the scene at the end at the bar there is a bottle of knob creek bourbon. this came out in 1992
the Underground quote in the beginning is like a key to understanding the book.
I had no idea the book opens with a quote from Dostoevsky, that's an excellent detail!
6:14 was there a significance to his reflection over the picture from "Les Miserables"? Something like he was miserable inside?
Les Miserables is all over the place in the book. Probably homage.
The novel explores the complexities of status, wealth, revolution against materialistic show of wealth, etc. but ultimately it explored how human circumstances beyond control influence their paths, lives and their abilities to change/grow/be redeemed in the eyes of society. Those who have means to change and grow choose not to or don't want to as there is no benefit to losing their status/power. Superficiality of the wealthy doesn't matter if they benefit directly from it. Just like the Yuppies.
"Cuz the underground man don't think like the rest of society. Erry body else is just fumble-fucking their way through life and never asking the big questions. But for our boy, dat shit's the Dank. And if that's the way you wanna roll, you gotta open your eyes so wide to the world around you that it hurts. If you can do that, you're playing a whole other game, B. Dat pain when you're beefin' with reality and git yo shit wrecked creates consciousness." -THUG NOTES
Epically good series
@@blackedmirror5073 Modern Wisecrack would probably get a brain hemorrhage if somebody presented the concept of Thug Notes to them today.
@CountCocofang are you saying wisecrack is stupid now
@CountCocofang are you saying wisecrack is stupid now
@CountCocofang are you saying wisecrack is stupid now
Sort of a "Crime Without Punishment" story.
I never made the connection between Dostoyevsky and this movie, even though I love both. Thank you!
I missed how absurd those meals were 😂😂😂
This is my favorite movie of all time
I understood from the beginning. Bro is literally me
Keep calm and seek therapy.
Damn it Jared I believed you knew things years ago and now you gone and had a change of perspective!
This has been a great series!
unreal analysis would love to hear more of your thoughts on the hyperreal in media
The yuppie montage has a digitally placed photo of Ronald Reagan inserted - it is not in the original footage. In addition, although It may be easy to conflate Reagan's limited government philosophy with emerging neocon psychopathy - they were quite distinct from one another.
How are they distinct for one another?
@@stefanjohnsson5661 One of them wants limited government and the other wants endless expansionist government and total power over the individual. The first neocons larped as conservatives, now they larp as liberals. I am kind of stunned you don't know this.
@@rahkuaschountI didn’t say there wasn’t a difference. I would argue that Reaganomics was the beginning of the Christian right and the trickel down economy that conservatives use to get poor people to vote against their own interests.
@@stefanjohnsson5661 What you are describing is called the Deep State or the "blob", and is now firmly entrenched in left-wing liberal politics. They're shapeshifters.
American Psycho reminds me of the Bob Slocum character from Joseph Heller's Something Happened.
Congrats for noticing! 💪😎✌️Writing is writing, yet some storytelling techniques differ from others. And in their subtlety, sometimes certain aspects and thematic underpinnings can be lost. Direction and Reflection are both key.
🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨
Amazing essay! I have been wanting to read the book with this sense of criticality
Can you do a video analyzing the Chomsky-Foucault debate, and give your thoughts on their positions?
He is a Alien pretending to be a human!
I finally understand this concept, thanks to you!
13:34 not just an interpretation; Albert Speer said as much in his autobiography
I just realized how much i’ve missed cinema podcasts from jared😢
Thank you, very interesting view of the movie ❤🎉
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I was watching this movie last night, and clearly Paul Allen’s business card is the best of the bunch 😂 I love that scene.
Let's see Paul Allen's card
I think another interesting exploration into this film is its distinctly pre-9/11 view of American society. We were so insulated by our privilege that the idea of actual substantial retribution at the hands of those we had used and disposed of for decades that the very notion of accountability had all but vanished from the minds of most urban professionals. (Also, thanks for teaching me something I never would have thought to look up: the acronym at the root of yuppy!)
i don't know why, but i've always known it came from young urban professional... certainly, it was from the media i consumed because my parents are not native english speakers
"What is to be done" was one of Lenin's favourite books.
I see you found your comb! 😆
May be the entire movie was a crazy hallucination