Please, give a big like for these pilots, all the Atlanta controllers (I'm sure Ground, other Tower, Approach and Departure controllers also worked together to clear the airspace for Brickyard) and all the pilots who waited patiently. Aviation is awesome! *Great job, guys!!*
In my opinion the controller was not being rude he's just trying to figure out how I move an aircraft in distress through some of the busiest airspace on the planet without it hitting somebody else., once I get it done if you look at the time stamp at 5:07 and listen to it he gives the duty fire chief the information he needs and also let him know when I have updated information you will be the first to know.
VASAviation - That was some scary shit! Great job by those guys working the problem under severe difficulty. Hope the NTSB investigates fully and makes recommendations to prevent recurrence. No one needs an AC behaving like that on them.
May I give a shoutout to all you pilots here. Your unbelievable extensive training kicks in and we civilians totally trust you. So many potentially fatal accidents waiting to happen have been averted due to your professionalism. THANK YOU!!!❤️
@@larsfreeburg1535 Trim runaway is something I don't want to hear at all. Trim has more pitch authority than the elevators so if you have a trim runaway you are either lucky enough that your CG is in a good spot or you are done as soon as you reach a certain point. Even pushing will not let you descend as you can see in the video. It's like driving a car with a stuck throttle where the throttle is stronger than your brake and even with the brake all the way pushed you are accelerating. Scary.
@@FluppiLP He also stated to the other pilot over the freq, that he didn't have time to do the "QRH" Quick Reference Handbook. That's the book that has all of your emergency procedure checklists, I'm not sure why you wouldn't use it?
Hi all, I was one of the six passengers on that flight that day. I am an avid follower of this channel and have studied a lot of incidents. Couldn’t believe that it happened to me and I knew something was wrong the second we took off. I thank the pilots that day that saved my life. They looked absolutely exhausted and in shock when they came out of the cockpit. I shook both of their hands and I wish I can contact them again to tell them how much I appreciate how amazing they were. It was definitely the scariest thing I’ve ever experienced.
So very glad that you're alive to comment on this. Being an aviation buff is not necessarily a good thing for a passenger in an emergency like this. Kudos to the flight crew & ATC. 👍🏼
John O'Brien not sure why he said 6 souls on board because there were 6 of us passengers and 2 attendants and 2 pilots! Maybe was too engaged in flying the plane and just said passengers instead? Definitely 6 of us passengers though.
DrKate L. Completely agree.. the other passengers seemed to not know what was going on and wasn’t as worried as I was for sure... not until we landed and was explained the situation. Ignorance is bliss in this case for sure
Its called taking control of the frequency, fire vehicles are the last priority to him. He wants his frequency silent for the emergency traffic. Once that is resolved he can then talk to the fire vehicles.
bbd308 Tower letting Fire chief know that the emergency required immediate and continuous communication and tower did not have bandwidth for communication with fire units at that time. Not a jerk. Doing a difficult job and doing it well.
As an E175 pilot who just read a company safety alert regarding this flight, all I can say is, great job guys. It cannot be overstated how close they came to disaster. A pitch trim runaway is one of the worst things you can be faced with in a plane. I was given a simulated one in the simulator just weeks ago. It is so scary because you just react like this is a wind change or something and you push against it. It takes a moment to realize, no this isn't normal and I have to do the memory item. This particular thing is insidious, but fast. I like to think I'm fast, but it still took over 3 seconds for me to recognize it was happening. Give it another second or two and it would have been unflyable in my case. This incident was apparently the result of damaged wiring shorting out. The first part of the checklist is to press autopilot/trim disconnect on the yolk. The corresponding wire was among the damaged. This prevented them from stopping it early enough to prevent the more serious situation they ran into. The next part of the memory item calls to disable the pitch trim system completely. Precious seconds could have been lost fumbling for buttons that are colloquially known in the industry as "dust collectors" because you never use them. For anyone who's freaked out about flying on E175s after this, I can tell you this issue is being worked on industry wide and extra inspections and measures have been put in place to prevent this from happening again. This incident is why I hate the saying, "These airplanes basically fly themselves." You can tell by the voice that these pilots were in an adrenaline pounding fight for their lives. All a computer can do is follow programming; it is not invested in self preservation or yours. So next time you're fuming and ready to hit someone because you didn't get upgraded or the food wasn't good, just remember to thank your flight crew for a safe flight.
@@Mostlyharmless1985 Then you need a very skilled coder that can write a program that evolves itself over time. It also needs to check against something to see if this new "evolving" is preferred when flying a plane. You're just loopy if you think this is possible. A computer doesn't solve a problem, a human does.
@@Mostlyharmless1985 If I'm very kind towards the technology of self driving cars, it is at best a flawed tech. It doesn't really replace drivers so far. And an automated car is not even close to an automated airplane. Bad analogy.
@Advocatus Diaboli Yes, I've learned that certain conditions will result in a stall. Not surprised, but it was awful to hear and I wasn't surprised at it.
For those wondering what a trim runaway is. It’s when you’re trimming the aircraft up or down and stop at your desired spot but it continues up or down. So for this instance if they departed and they were trimming up once he stopped trimming the aircraft continues to trim up. Which is obviously a serious problem.
@@thextrmntr What is trim? Trim is adjustment made that manages the aerodynamic forces on the aircraft control surfaces so that the plane maintains the set attitude without any control input. That adjustment is supposed to make it far easier for a pilot to control the plane
I think the Fire Chief took the "don't call me again" statement as intended. Nobody took anything personal. It was all about getting that a/c down safe. The end result was the great teamwork between the Crew, the Tower, Fire staff and by the grace of God. So there!
Yup. As a firefighter, I know most fire chiefs know what it’s like when a bunch of people are calling you on the radio while you’re busy. Sometimes you just have to tell people to be quiet. I’m sure he understood
I thought " don't call me again " is the phraseology used on aviation radio to halt incoming transmission from a single radio. Even though it sounds rude, I thought that was just a common phrase used. Anyone correct me on this?
I think anyone who has worked a tower during emergencies has told people to stop calling them and everyone gets it, most people have the awareness to realize what’s happening
EinkOLED yes we have been trained to deal with this situation but the situation can get to a point where it’s impossible to recover. I have seen it first hand. You have seconds to react and it’s worse with the autopilot on bc you may miss the runway until the plane yells at you bc you’re not flying. If this happens at altitude then you can recover bc you have time but nose up runaway on take off, you better be on your A game!
At 4:42 you can hear a female voice in the background asking someone if they were certified for flying a E175 Apparently how they found the Delta2304 crew who chimed in at 6:54 to offer assistance
It's a nice thought, ATL is main hub for Delta who also flies E175. Someone can help and give hints incase the crew in trouble haven't thought about that solution.
Ya. You can imagine every other pilot on frequency shuddering at the thought of having to face what this crew did. Of course, all pilots are trained to handle it and probably could if they had to, but that doesn't mean anyone *wants* to.
I‘ve got goosebumps hearing those three others saying „nice job“. Everyone knew how dangerous this situation was and what a heck of a good job those pilots and ATC (and ground etc.) did! Awesome job, everyone!
The tower heard "We've got a trim runaway" as "We need to return right away", then pretty much got no information except "We're in a stalling situation" and the radar visual that they were spiralling up for about five minutes. I can't imagine how they felt not knowing what was going on beyond that. Everybody did an amazing job with this one. I'm glad it ended well.
That's the way emegencies go, often. Rule 1: FLY THE PLANE. Rule 2: FLY THE PLANE. Far down on the list is communicating. Once you have spare cycles, THEN you tell ATC what's up. In the meantime, you've declared an emergency, they know it, they are supposed to clear everything out of your way everywhere. Hard to do at the busiest airport in the country but it's their duty. So ATC's constant prattle was no doubt just annoying the flight crew, which rightfully mostly ignored the guy for a while.
@@frotoe9289 The order is Aviate, Navigate, Communicate. Step one, make sure you're not crashing. Step two, make sure you're not crashing *into* anything. Step three, tell those chucklefucks on the ground how brown your seat became.
I have that tail number in my logbook. Such a weird feeling. These guys did an amazing job. Putting the aircraft in that steep right turn probably saved their lives by preventing a nose-high stall. It's something we're taught to do in the simulators but it's an entirely different animal when your life is on the line.
Can't get my head around how the steep turn helps? My brain is telling me you'd just end up stalling the inside wing if you are slow and nose high. Could you fill me in?
GreenCrim I think we all connect stalls mainly with low or no power settings. This wasn’t the case here though. Since the jet could generate a very big amount of thrust I would think that a high bank turn could keep the nose lower and help to gain speed without worsening the stall or leading to a spin. Also just guessing here though..
Let's take a moment to acknowledge the engineering that went into a system that can fail, get switched over to the FO, and start functioning again. The redundancies have redundancies!
Ysalomet A failure in the trim system. It’s electrically controlled. On the E175 it’s all fly-by-wire, so basically either a software glitch or a circuit blowout or a lost contact.
You should check out the ATC recordings from JAL123, and Alaska Airlines 261. 261 stripped the jack screw, they were also fighting pitch issues. Both flights crashed. But prime examples of quality pilots doing absolutely everything in their power to save the plane.
@@pnaylor666 I've listened to audio from flights that have crashed and I'll tell you, it's not something i would search out or care to listen to ever again. Hearing someone's final moments when they know their fate is horrific.
VASAviation, great job on the detail for this one! The blue circles around the other planes and the detail to the emergency vehicles on 10 didn't go unnoticed or unappreciated! Great work!
As a pilot, I too was SO impressed with the ability of the pilots to diagnose and fix the issue and land safely. I hate to say it, but many other airlines may not have had the same outcome. The FAA does a great job ensuring training is #1 for emergencies and using Cockpit Management to figure out the problem and do what is right for the plane, not for the ego of the captain. Well done Brickyard.
You could hear the stress in the pilots' voice there. Great job by all. Flight control issues are absolutely terrifying! I'll be curious to hear what the cause of this was.
You could tell how exhausted they were even after they regained control by their voices. Just those few minutes of, in reality, fighting for their lives took the liveliness out of them. And then the relief in their voices when they got down really got me. I hope somebody took them out and bought them a few rounds that night for a job well done.
Knowing Republic, a more likely scenario would have been a drug test and a call from scheduling telling them a new airplane was on the way and asking if they were still ready to fly to New York.
Well, of course they'd be exhausted. They were fighting against a mechanical failure with all their might. Takes a loooooot of strength to deal with trim runaway.
The ATC was absolutely incredible. Some really tough decisions about managing the amount and type of communications he was having in every direction. I loved that as soon as he heard them struggling to keep control he immediately stopped talking directly to them and started moving others around.
WOW... fantastic job done by the crew. It takes a long time for a crew to recover mentally from an emergency like this. I do hope they are getting the rest and recovery they deserve.
The delta pilot asking that question I believe was also done to determine how serious the issue was. You could tell once they said they were too busy it made atc even more aware of how quickly they needed to land including them closing another runway down in case it was needed. Sometimes a simple question reveals a lot of answers.
This crew did an amazing job. Often you don't have time for the QRH and have to rely on system knowledge to recover the aircraft back to a controllable state. Sounds like thats what they did.
Apparently in this case it took both of their strength just to keep the yoke forward, and they physically _couldn't_ reach for the QRH without risking a loss of control.
This would definitely be up on my list of scariest in flight problems to have. I fly the CRJ and we have memory items for it, but all that does is stop it from getting worse. It is still a frightening prospect. It's like you're driving around a parking lot with the gas pedal floored and the steering wheel stuck in a left turn and if you crash into anything, you die. Just unreal. Really awesome they were able to salvage it.
@@behindthen0thing525 MenTour Pilot channel has a good video about runaway trim that really cuts through the internet bs. That guy corrected a lot of my misconceptions about this stuff. You're right in that other comment, TH-cam comments aren't the best place for accurate info lol.
It's hard to think of the alternative if they hadn't been able to rectify the problem to get down on the ground. Flying until the fuel was exhausted and then the crash--makes me get the shakes just thinking about it.
One of the most impressive recoveries I've heard on your channel, amazing flying! Well done! ATC did really well too, they may not have been sure exactly what was going on but didn't bother the pilots too much sorting that out, let them get on with trying to fly the plane and moved the other aircraft around them. Great job guys (or girls!) and one of the scariest situations I can imagine - good that Embrader put a direct mode into the E175 so they could trim it out eventually!
I am always surprised to the lack of knowledge from ATC, regarding emergencies. ATC asked what the situation was, that can wait since you can assume the pilots are busy working out what ever problem they have. Then they inform him they have a runaway trim, yet he tells them to stop climb and start descending, and keeps bother them with more calls. Just clear the traffic out of the way and the pilot will contact you when ready.
That was awful. Here’s ATC telling them 4000, etc and I’m sure the pilots are all “if this thing lets us, we’re trying!” Awful to be the ATC and just have to watch and advise as they can.
It just goes to show that in aviation, when an emergency happens it is all hands, everyone steps up their game and tries to pitch in to help regardless of affiliations. Good job to one and all. @VASAviation, another nice job to you my friend,
I’m also typed on the 175. Pitch trim runaway is no joke, and even if everything is done perfectly it’s still a handful. Those steep turns undoubtedly saved their lives. Phenomenal job by this crew
WAUW, that was some great example of everybody staying professional and calm with great short communications as needed. Incredible job under the most stressed and dangerous situations so it seemed. Thank you for this video VASA.
I think one of the worst things you could hear over coms as an ATC is trim runaway followed by stall situation. I couldn’t imagine what everyone involved in the coms must have felt. Great job to everyone involved, including the engineering done to have a redundancy plan in place.
Years ago I had a pitch trim runaway, nose down. Happened inside the FAF on an ILS. Had I not been hand flying and disengaged the AP at minimums I would not be here today. Turned out to be a nearly 30 year old relay that failed. Scary when it takes 2 people pulling as hard as they can to raise the nose and recover.
Hey Victor! Juan Browne of the Blancolirio Channel on TH-cam gave you a shout-out when he did a video on this Brickyard Embraer runaway trim issue. (He started recording it on the 14th but I think it was actually posted yesterday or today when he got done with his research.) Sweet!
Great job pilots. Captain's trim switch wire chafed and shorted. We practiced this exact scenario now in the simulators. Smart that he gained the altitude then rolled into right 360 to lower nose.
This was a very intense video. After I watched it the 1st time, I came to read all the comments in order to understand the situation. Then, I came back and re-watched it several times. I can hear in the ATC background of others making calls on this. That's when I connected the Delta pilot's words when he said ground asked him to contact Brickyard.... I thought the ATC was rude but a comment from Arnold Sherrill helped me to see it differently... Kudos to the pilots, all of ATC and the fire department.
Man my pulse went up just hearing their calls. You know when you hear that tone they are BUSY and loaded up with alarms going off and lights flashing. Pure hell.
When I was at McGuire AFB in the mid 70s, a C-141 was doing T&Gs, MAs. After one of the touch and goes, they were rolling down the runway and the nose went up sharply. The AC looked at the CP who looked at him, asking WTH are you doing? Neither one pulled the yoke back and they realized they had a pitch/trim runaway. Emergency call to McGuire tower, and they spiraled up to ~ 5K feet before they could get the nose down. They had feet pressing on the CP's yoke and the AC and FE were both trying to shove the yoke down. They managed to get it level and RTB without crashing. It was an all-Reserve flight crew and in usual fashion, the active duty guys said they caused it. This was circa 1974 or so. A week later another 141 had the same issue and the crew managed to abort. The planes were grounded for inspection, which discovered a wire in the yoke had the insulation worn off. The entire 141 fleet was then grounded for inspection/repair.
Aviation is so inspiring. The teamwork in these positive videos it’s a motivating factor for me to try to provide harmony in my workplace. I hope to join the aviation community soon. That’s a bucket list item. Great job guys and girls.
It's crazy to think this was caused by the captain's trim switch being reinstalled upside down. Trimming is second nature for us pilots so I don't blame him for not realizing that was the cause
I saw the transcript of an aircraft that had to land with the nosegear up. Needless to say, a certain four letter F-word was used quite a number of times... But like these pilots, they did a great job and got the aircraft down safely, and on the center line at that, was also quite an impressive piece of flying.
I followed this live out of my home airport, it scared the shit out of me. Those pilots are amazing. I was about to head to bed then I got the emergency declaration as a notification.
Yeah. I agree. They were fighting for their lives. Last thing they have the ability to do is open a book and dig for a procedure. I'm still amazed that these types of things aren't memory items. Or maybe it is and they were jammed up trying to control ig. I've not flown the E170 etc. Just crazy. Jammed or unresponsive controls can give you tunnel vision and you become slow to do the immediate action items... Immediately.
I think it is great for a fellow aviator to help out but you also must keep in mind that it could be a distraction to the crew fighting for there lives literally ...so I think you have to remain cautious about disturbing them but also you might tell them something which contradicts what they are currently doing or have been trained to do so you got to be careful
"we can't pitch down" My heart jumped at that one.... Brickyard almost became a Boneyard :( Could they have done a light nose stall? Or would that be too risky?
Stalling a swept wing aircraft is deadly as it is hard to recover from due to the nature of the swept wing. The centre of pressure moves forward during the Stall which increases the pitch up tendency and makes the situation worse. With a T-tail configuration this leads to 'deep stall' which is (pretty much) unrecoverable because the elevator has no authority anymore due to turbulent air coming from the wings. Source: student Atpl pilot
@Dotar Sojat Where did I say it's a T-tail aircraft? I'm just giving some extra info about aircraft that do have them and their even worse Stall characteristics.
Back when I flew the E145 we had a crew experience this at O’Hare. Early 2000’s I believe. They got the plane under control by slowing down below 200 kts. I believe they had such a high pitch attitude they had to do the 45 degree wing over to unload the wing several times. Scary ride for sure. Kudos to these pilots just like those guys years ago for figuring it out successfully!
Turns out it wasn’t a THS runaway, but the AME/MO’s reinstalled the captains side stab trim switch upside down after inspecting it due to some issues on the previous legs. crazy how that muscle memory will get you.
Also that unintelligible bit toward the end with the delta pilot was “did you go through the QRH?” The QRH is the quick reference handbook, and its a series of emergency checklists to help troubleshoot issues with the plane.
One of the scariest flight videos I've seen, the pilots did a great job in making sure they were able to land safely. I don't think the local controller initially understood the severity or the actual nature of the emergency initially. Nonetheless, great team work in making sure the airplane landed safely.
These pilots were very calm for what they had to deal with in front of them. It’s crazy to me how calm these and other pilots are when faced with possible certain death. These pilots go through so much training for situations just like this. Great job to these pilots getting everyone on the ground safe.
"these" pilots if trained properly would not even contemplate death (albeit one of the 3 things humans fear), from the correct training your only thought is not to forget to hit the brakes on the runway.
Commendable job by the pilots and everyone coordinating very well. High Pressure situation, it's easy to panic but even more important to keep your cool. This was a very scary situation and could have easily been a disaster.
Max pilot here. First off, kudos to the pilots! Absolutely fantastic job! Although the Max has obviously had it’s difficulties, both crashes were in essence a stab trim runaway. Now, I’m not going to get into the politics of these two Max crashes but instead remind people that the Max, as well as all 737’s (and 727’s) ever made have two big trim wheels that spin when the trim motors are engaged. A 737 pilot, once recognizing a trim runaway simply has to reach down and grab said wheel and stop the runaway as the system is designed so a pilot’s hand can overpower the trim motors. It simply seems that all aircraft should have the ability to viscerally realize the trim is trimming (nothing like seeing two big spinning wheels) and of course being able to stop the trim and also be able to manually trim the jet with those same wheels. Can someone explain how the system works on the E170 series?
It trims and does its thing. There's no wheel or manual notice of what it's doing. The only thing you'll see is the indication in your peripheral vision. If the system fails, like it did here, the runaway stops where it did, and there's no way to retrim, as there is no manual trim wheel. After this it became standard to have a full nose up trim runaway scenario in the recurrent. It sucks, but once in landing configuration is manageable
“We’re in a stalling situation... agh” 😳😳😳 horrible to hear. Could hear how bad it was in pilot’s voices in their initial comms. Regarding runways, in a situation like this when pilots are clearly in a very difficult situation I would favour ATC telling them the runway and not asking them what they want loading them with options “will vector your for runway 10R - confirm?” then the pilots can give a yes/no answer ( depending what immediate return runway they had set up etc). Separately, ARFF comms on these videos always seem to contain a lot of words but not a lot of info passed... Delta pilot where it went... was asking the pilots if they’d run the QRH (quick reaction handbook). The pilot then said no time as fighting with the plane. Wow!
It's not up to the controller. His job is to give the pilot pretty much anything he needs and list the options. In an emergency ATC will never tell you what to do. That makes them culpable should something go wrong in the end.
Brian White correct to a degree: but initially a simple yes or no answer to one runway is easier for the pilots to deal with rather than giving lots of options. If “unable” that runway then can expand. Especially at Atlanta where all the runways are in the same orientation so it’s not a factor for wind. And in an emergency if the pilots were heading towards high ground for example, the ATC wouldn’t recommend changing heading or give options, they would TELL the pilots to make a turn.
I was sitting at my desk clapping that everyone made it safely on the ground. When they were in that stall, you could hear the stress in the pilot's voice. Just wow!! Great flight crew
“We can’t pitch down, sir” - definitely on a workload with too many questions from ATC, no? He said that in such a way that sounded like “give me a minute”
One reason I always offer to every ATC person that they can come fly with me any time. I think getting them in the plane to see what we see can help them do the job and manage the emergency better. It always bugs me when the pilot says they are in a stall situation and ATC keeps asking what they can do to help, souls on board and fuel. Pick your timing man! I have taken 3 ATC controllers up over the past 10 years and they all felt they learned a ton, as did I. Makes everyone better at their job. If any ATC controller every wants to go up with me and live in the Southeast US, let me know.
This is the busiest airport in the world we are speaking of. Some information on what we can expect the pilots to do is necessary so we can protect the flight path. Sorry if it inconveniences the pilot for a couple seconds for information to prevent them from having a midair.
@@rfiorini Perhaps you should go listen on the other side as well? When we get hounded by supervisors to ask for information as they're standing behind us waiting to call it in for emergency service response or when 15 other aircraft are on frequency all headed in the direction of the emergency, information is mandatory. There's no perfect time to ask for it during an emergency.
Excellent and quick turnaround on this incident. Kudos to the successful efforts of the pilots and calm ATC. From the speed data, it looks like the pilots brought speed well up as they shot up thru the atmo - presume that's to try to prevent stall at higher pitch. imho, I'm not convinced the audio lines up with the sim at times, as the ATC seems oblivious to their actual altitude (and that they were still ascending).
![[REAL ATC] Brickyard E170 BOTH ENGINES FAILED enroute | Diverts to Nashville!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bCkdZq4nfYE/mqdefault.jpg)
![[REAL ATC] Brickyard E170 BOTH ENGINES FAILED enroute | Diverts to Nashville!](/img/tr.png)
![[REAL ATC] American B757 has COMPLETE RADIO FAILURE out of Kennedy!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Wcq6KipBOro/mqdefault.jpg)
![[REAL ATC] MD-80 DELTA CRASH at La Guardia Airport](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/biDnVJ6EqA8/mqdefault.jpg)
Please, give a big like for these pilots, all the Atlanta controllers (I'm sure Ground, other Tower, Approach and Departure controllers also worked together to clear the airspace for Brickyard) and all the pilots who waited patiently. Aviation is awesome! *Great job, guys!!*
In my opinion the controller was not being rude he's just trying to figure out how I move an aircraft in distress through some of the busiest airspace on the planet without it hitting somebody else., once I get it done if you look at the time stamp at 5:07 and listen to it he gives the duty fire chief the information he needs and also let him know when I have updated information you will be the first to know.
VASAviation - That was some scary shit! Great job by those guys working the problem under severe difficulty. Hope the NTSB investigates fully and makes recommendations to prevent recurrence. No one needs an AC behaving like that on them.
May I give a shoutout to all you pilots here. Your unbelievable extensive training kicks in and we civilians totally trust you. So many potentially fatal accidents waiting to happen have been averted due to your professionalism.
THANK YOU!!!❤️
Watching the numbers terrified me. Great job, all.
Great job to the pilots and everyone involved!
Someone should by each of them a set of new underwear. They're going to need them. 😳
4439: Which runway?
ATC: All of them. I'll give you runways that aren't even at this airport. I'll fly in runways from Spain.
LMFAOOO
ATC: You're cleared for any runway.
Al Haynes: *nervous laugh* You wanna be particular and make it a runway, huh?
Ill run outside with a can of spray paint and paint any number you would like! If you want runway 42069 ill make that happen!!
"Agh" is very high up the list of what I do not like to hear from a pilot
When we stop swearing, it's effin serious!
We’re in a flat spin would be something I wouldn’t want to here on center
@@larsfreeburg1535 Trim runaway is something I don't want to hear at all.
Trim has more pitch authority than the elevators so if you have a trim runaway you are either lucky enough that your CG is in a good spot or you are done as soon as you reach a certain point. Even pushing will not let you descend as you can see in the video.
It's like driving a car with a stuck throttle where the throttle is stronger than your brake and even with the brake all the way pushed you are accelerating. Scary.
@@FluppiLP He also stated to the other pilot over the freq, that he didn't have time to do the "QRH" Quick Reference Handbook. That's the book that has all of your emergency procedure checklists, I'm not sure why you wouldn't use it?
@@chrisstromberg6527 - I would assume he needed both hands on the yoke to keep her in the air
Hi all, I was one of the six passengers on that flight that day. I am an avid follower of this channel and have studied a lot of incidents. Couldn’t believe that it happened to me and I knew something was wrong the second we took off. I thank the pilots that day that saved my life. They looked absolutely exhausted and in shock when they came out of the cockpit. I shook both of their hands and I wish I can contact them again to tell them how much I appreciate how amazing they were. It was definitely the scariest thing I’ve ever experienced.
man, they surely had a nasty situation, happy to have everyone down safely!
So very glad that you're alive to comment on this. Being an aviation buff is not necessarily a good thing for a passenger in an emergency like this. Kudos to the flight crew & ATC. 👍🏼
Between the two pilots, and 2-3 flight attendants, were you the only passenger??
John O'Brien not sure why he said 6 souls on board because there were 6 of us passengers and 2 attendants and 2 pilots! Maybe was too engaged in flying the plane and just said passengers instead? Definitely 6 of us passengers though.
DrKate L. Completely agree.. the other passengers seemed to not know what was going on and wasn’t as worried as I was for sure... not until we landed and was explained the situation. Ignorance is bliss in this case for sure
Fire chief : I'm ready :)
Tower : Don't call me again
Fire chief : :(
Tower = Jerk.
Its called taking control of the frequency, fire vehicles are the last priority to him. He wants his frequency silent for the emergency traffic. Once that is resolved he can then talk to the fire vehicles.
bbd308 Tower letting Fire chief know that the emergency required immediate and continuous communication and tower did not have bandwidth for communication with fire units at that time. Not a jerk. Doing a difficult job and doing it well.
Tower to Fire Chief: Don't call me again.
Fire Chief to himself: Well... he's off my Christmas list!
@@bbd308You'd think. Poor fire chief was basically told to STFU
As an E175 pilot who just read a company safety alert regarding this flight, all I can say is, great job guys. It cannot be overstated how close they came to disaster. A pitch trim runaway is one of the worst things you can be faced with in a plane. I was given a simulated one in the simulator just weeks ago. It is so scary because you just react like this is a wind change or something and you push against it. It takes a moment to realize, no this isn't normal and I have to do the memory item. This particular thing is insidious, but fast. I like to think I'm fast, but it still took over 3 seconds for me to recognize it was happening. Give it another second or two and it would have been unflyable in my case. This incident was apparently the result of damaged wiring shorting out. The first part of the checklist is to press autopilot/trim disconnect on the yolk. The corresponding wire was among the damaged. This prevented them from stopping it early enough to prevent the more serious situation they ran into. The next part of the memory item calls to disable the pitch trim system completely. Precious seconds could have been lost fumbling for buttons that are colloquially known in the industry as "dust collectors" because you never use them. For anyone who's freaked out about flying on E175s after this, I can tell you this issue is being worked on industry wide and extra inspections and measures have been put in place to prevent this from happening again. This incident is why I hate the saying, "These airplanes basically fly themselves." You can tell by the voice that these pilots were in an adrenaline pounding fight for their lives. All a computer can do is follow programming; it is not invested in self preservation or yours. So next time you're fuming and ready to hit someone because you didn't get upgraded or the food wasn't good, just remember to thank your flight crew for a safe flight.
The only thing i took from this is that we need to program aircraft computers to have a self-preservation instinct.
Mostlyharmless1985
Ya, let me know when that will happen.
@@Mostlyharmless1985 Then you need a very skilled coder that can write a program that evolves itself over time. It also needs to check against something to see if this new "evolving" is preferred when flying a plane. You're just loopy if you think this is possible.
A computer doesn't solve a problem, a human does.
Niklas Stenhall what did you think self driving cars are?
@@Mostlyharmless1985 If I'm very kind towards the technology of self driving cars, it is at best a flawed tech. It doesn't really replace drivers so far. And an automated car is not even close to an automated airplane. Bad analogy.
Heart sank at "... stalling situation...agh!" Great recovery.
We'd be offering condolences if that "agh" was "shit".....
Same here. And then to watch their airspeed drop 40 kts in just a few seconds.... I know they made it down safely and it still turns my stomach over.
When he said "agh!" I thought this video was gonna take a terrible turn.
@Advocatus Diaboli Yes, I've learned that certain conditions will result in a stall. Not surprised, but it was awful to hear and I wasn't surprised at it.
Shades of AS261 listening to that.
For those wondering what a trim runaway is. It’s when you’re trimming the aircraft up or down and stop at your desired spot but it continues up or down. So for this instance if they departed and they were trimming up once he stopped trimming the aircraft continues to trim up. Which is obviously a serious problem.
Thank You. I was going to ask that question.
what is trim?
@@thextrmntr to set the horizontal stabilizer or other control surfaces like ailerons or the vertical stabilizer to a certain positoon
@@thextrmntr What is trim? Trim is adjustment made that manages the aerodynamic forces on the aircraft control surfaces so that the plane maintains the set attitude without any control input. That adjustment is supposed to make it far easier for a pilot to control the plane
WOW imagine that, Boeing is not the only plane this happens to IMAGINE:
I think the Fire Chief took the "don't call me again" statement as intended. Nobody took anything personal. It was all about getting that a/c down safe. The end result was the great teamwork between the Crew, the Tower, Fire staff and by the grace of God. So there!
Yup. As a firefighter, I know most fire chiefs know what it’s like when a bunch of people are calling you on the radio while you’re busy. Sometimes you just have to tell people to be quiet. I’m sure he understood
An alternate way would have been "... just standby i'll call when i have more info".
I thought " don't call me again " is the phraseology used on aviation radio to halt incoming transmission from a single radio. Even though it sounds rude, I thought that was just a common phrase used. Anyone correct me on this?
I think anyone who has worked a tower during emergencies has told people to stop calling them and everyone gets it, most people have the awareness to realize what’s happening
Of course it’s not personal. It’s typical language used on radio.
Pitch trim runaway is my worst nightmare. I’d rather lose an engine than have any flight control issues. 🥵. I fly the 170/175 too
EinkOLED yes we have been trained to deal with this situation but the situation can get to a point where it’s impossible to recover. I have seen it first hand. You have seconds to react and it’s worse with the autopilot on bc you may miss the runway until the plane yells at you bc you’re not flying. If this happens at altitude then you can recover bc you have time but nose up runaway on take off, you better be on your A game!
LOVE hearing all the FS experts out there who "trained" for this(and every other real world emergency) in their easy chair. Means alot...
@EinkOLED Lol a "stalling situation" sounds like a nightmare to me, regardless of training or not. You can hear the frustration in their voices.
Simmers
If you can fly fs you can fly a real plane no problem
At 4:42 you can hear a female voice in the background asking someone if they were certified for flying a E175
Apparently how they found the Delta2304 crew who chimed in at 6:54 to offer assistance
Great find.
thanks, didn't hear that
It's a nice thought, ATL is main hub for Delta who also flies E175. Someone can help and give hints incase the crew in trouble haven't thought about that solution.
Great to hear the “nice job guys” after.
No doubt, they have a hell ride.
Ya. You can imagine every other pilot on frequency shuddering at the thought of having to face what this crew did. Of course, all pilots are trained to handle it and probably could if they had to, but that doesn't mean anyone *wants* to.
Or even could
I‘ve got goosebumps hearing those three others saying „nice job“. Everyone knew how dangerous this situation was and what a heck of a good job those pilots and ATC (and ground etc.) did!
Awesome job, everyone!
The tower heard "We've got a trim runaway" as "We need to return right away", then pretty much got no information except "We're in a stalling situation" and the radar visual that they were spiralling up for about five minutes. I can't imagine how they felt not knowing what was going on beyond that.
Everybody did an amazing job with this one. I'm glad it ended well.
That's the way emegencies go, often. Rule 1: FLY THE PLANE. Rule 2: FLY THE PLANE. Far down on the list is communicating. Once you have spare cycles, THEN you tell ATC what's up. In the meantime, you've declared an emergency, they know it, they are supposed to clear everything out of your way everywhere. Hard to do at the busiest airport in the country but it's their duty. So ATC's constant prattle was no doubt just annoying the flight crew, which rightfully mostly ignored the guy for a while.
@@frotoe9289 They hardly annoyed the flight crew lol... They are perfectly aware of their duties and that they respond when they can.
@@frotoe9289 The order is Aviate, Navigate, Communicate. Step one, make sure you're not crashing. Step two, make sure you're not crashing *into* anything. Step three, tell those chucklefucks on the ground how brown your seat became.
@@hauntedshadowslegacy2826 that’s an interesting yet accurate way to explain it
I have that tail number in my logbook. Such a weird feeling. These guys did an amazing job. Putting the aircraft in that steep right turn probably saved their lives by preventing a nose-high stall. It's something we're taught to do in the simulators but it's an entirely different animal when your life is on the line.
Yeah. Great thinking! Kudos to the CA for thinking of that in a surprise, very high stress situation.
Can't get my head around how the steep turn helps? My brain is telling me you'd just end up stalling the inside wing if you are slow and nose high. Could you fill me in?
@@GreenCrim A steep turn causes the nose to fall. The lower you keep the nose the more speed you can maintain or gain.
do the e175s have electronic trim or hydraulic trim?
GreenCrim I think we all connect stalls mainly with low or no power settings. This wasn’t the case here though. Since the jet could generate a very big amount of thrust I would think that a high bank turn could keep the nose lower and help to gain speed without worsening the stall or leading to a spin. Also just guessing here though..
Let's take a moment to acknowledge the engineering that went into a system that can fail, get switched over to the FO, and start functioning again. The redundancies have redundancies!
@@peterwmdavis It's easy to detect a runaway trim in the 737, the trim wheel is noisy and can be grabbed by both pilots.
What would cause a trim runaway?
Ysalomet A failure in the trim system. It’s electrically controlled. On the E175 it’s all fly-by-wire, so basically either a software glitch or a circuit blowout or a lost contact.
@@Ysalomet Usually false sensor readings or air data computer software bugs
@tie oneon No, they moved to the alternate.
Something about the pilots voice choked me up, dude was fighting for their lives.
@1:45 so scary
He sounded on the edge of frightened. I would have been.
You should check out the ATC recordings from JAL123, and Alaska Airlines 261. 261 stripped the jack screw, they were also fighting pitch issues. Both flights crashed. But prime examples of quality pilots doing absolutely everything in their power to save the plane.
They were amazingly calm. That’s how you handle it. Don’t panic.
@@pnaylor666 I've listened to audio from flights that have crashed and I'll tell you, it's not something i would search out or care to listen to ever again. Hearing someone's final moments when they know their fate is horrific.
In case anyone was wondering what happened, Mentor Pilot just released a great video on this flight!
VASAviation, great job on the detail for this one! The blue circles around the other planes and the detail to the emergency vehicles on 10 didn't go unnoticed or unappreciated! Great work!
Hey, thanks!
As a pilot, I too was SO impressed with the ability of the pilots to diagnose and fix the issue and land safely. I hate to say it, but many other airlines may not have had the same outcome. The FAA does a great job ensuring training is #1 for emergencies and using Cockpit Management to figure out the problem and do what is right for the plane, not for the ego of the captain. Well done Brickyard.
You could hear the stress in the pilots' voice there. Great job by all. Flight control issues are absolutely terrifying! I'll be curious to hear what the cause of this was.
As simple as a stuck switch to a complex software issue.
I would bet on the stuck switch.
You would be wrong.
You could tell how exhausted they were even after they regained control by their voices. Just those few minutes of, in reality, fighting for their lives took the liveliness out of them. And then the relief in their voices when they got down really got me. I hope somebody took them out and bought them a few rounds that night for a job well done.
Knowing Republic, a more likely scenario would have been a drug test and a call from scheduling telling them a new airplane was on the way and asking if they were still ready to fly to New York.
@@lukegerst2382 lol, that's so spot on it depresses me.
Well, of course they'd be exhausted. They were fighting against a mechanical failure with all their might. Takes a loooooot of strength to deal with trim runaway.
@@hauntedshadowslegacy2826 yeah. That's pretty much what I said. Thanks for the clarification.
The ATC was absolutely incredible. Some really tough decisions about managing the amount and type of communications he was having in every direction. I loved that as soon as he heard them struggling to keep control he immediately stopped talking directly to them and started moving others around.
WOW... fantastic job done by the crew. It takes a long time for a crew to recover mentally from an emergency like this. I do hope they are getting the rest and recovery they deserve.
The delta pilot asking that question I believe was also done to determine how serious the issue was. You could tell once they said they were too busy it made atc even more aware of how quickly they needed to land including them closing another runway down in case it was needed. Sometimes a simple question reveals a lot of answers.
This crew did an amazing job. Often you don't have time for the QRH and have to rely on system knowledge to recover the aircraft back to a controllable state. Sounds like thats what they did.
Yup that's why pitch trim and roll trim runaways are almost always memory items as I'm sure you know. Amazing job by these guys!
It likely took both of them to push down enough.
Apparently in this case it took both of their strength just to keep the yoke forward, and they physically _couldn't_ reach for the QRH without risking a loss of control.
Back to a controllable state...that was deep!
This would definitely be up on my list of scariest in flight problems to have. I fly the CRJ and we have memory items for it, but all that does is stop it from getting worse. It is still a frightening prospect. It's like you're driving around a parking lot with the gas pedal floored and the steering wheel stuck in a left turn and if you crash into anything, you die. Just unreal. Really awesome they were able to salvage it.
You don't have manual trim?
@@behindthen0thing525 no its electric (crj mechanic) driven by 2 channels (1/2)
Cool
@@behindthen0thing525 MenTour Pilot channel has a good video about runaway trim that really cuts through the internet bs. That guy corrected a lot of my misconceptions about this stuff. You're right in that other comment, TH-cam comments aren't the best place for accurate info lol.
There was also a disaster where once it got stuck in the upper position cuz the jack screw stripped out, everyone died as it plummeted to the ocean
This is super scary. Glad everyone got out of that situation unharmed
It's hard to think of the alternative if they hadn't been able to rectify the problem to get down on the ground. Flying until the fuel was exhausted and then the crash--makes me get the shakes just thinking about it.
Stuff like this warms the heart - to hear everyone chiming in and helping. Kudos to all
involved👍🏼.
One of the most impressive recoveries I've heard on your channel, amazing flying! Well done! ATC did really well too, they may not have been sure exactly what was going on but didn't bother the pilots too much sorting that out, let them get on with trying to fly the plane and moved the other aircraft around them. Great job guys (or girls!) and one of the scariest situations I can imagine - good that Embrader put a direct mode into the E175 so they could trim it out eventually!
That was a scary couple of minutes for everyone involved; pilots and ATC handled it like pros. Somebody better buy these guys a drink!
Bring them a change of pants too
I am always surprised to the lack of knowledge from ATC, regarding emergencies. ATC asked what the situation was, that can wait since you can assume the pilots are busy working out what ever problem they have. Then they inform him they have a runaway trim, yet he tells them to stop climb and start descending, and keeps bother them with more calls. Just clear the traffic out of the way and the pilot will contact you when ready.
Nothing scares me more than flight control issues. Glad these guys handled it and got it back in the ground.
Watching their Flight Level numbers rising so quickly was pretty nerve wracking. KUDOS to those pilots. Cooler heads prevailed.
That was awful. Here’s ATC telling them 4000, etc and I’m sure the pilots are all “if this thing lets us, we’re trying!” Awful to be the ATC and just have to watch and advise as they can.
Aviate, Navigate, Communicate...
They were too busy saving the aircraft to answer.
Yeah, there were times when the ATC should have queried them less. These pilots had their hands full.
@@Inkling777 atc knows they might be to busy to respond but they have to try an continue to evolve the strategy with the pilot.
@@Inkling777 I thought the comment was made in reference to the ATC telling the fire chief to not call back. ?
Pilots most definitely flew the plane first and did the rest afterwards.
Pilot in command's first job is to never give up. Thanks for saving the flight, all of you.
It just goes to show that in aviation, when an emergency happens it is all hands, everyone steps up their game and tries to pitch in to help regardless of affiliations. Good job to one and all. @VASAviation, another nice job to you my friend,
I had a trim runaway in my Tomahawk last week. Bloody terrifying. Glad these guys dealt with it well.
Well you need to slap your right hand for doing it.
Or left if sitting on right seat. 🤣
SmokingSpitfire a Piper Tomahawk?
Fancy Tomahawk... you must have the upgraded model that came with a flight director and auto throttle? ;)
my piper cherokee has electric trim and a two way autopilot its not uncommon
Ethan Higgins It is in a tomahawk, i was a cfi in one.
I’m also typed on the 175. Pitch trim runaway is no joke, and even if everything is done perfectly it’s still a handful. Those steep turns undoubtedly saved their lives. Phenomenal job by this crew
You know you really stepped in it when other pros are giving you props when you get thru it.
WAUW, that was some great example of everybody staying professional and calm with great short communications as needed. Incredible job under the most stressed and dangerous situations so it seemed. Thank you for this video VASA.
Thank you for watching
Wow this is an extremely serious situation. You can hear it in the pilot’s voice.
I think one of the worst things you could hear over coms as an ATC is trim runaway followed by stall situation. I couldn’t imagine what everyone involved in the coms must have felt. Great job to everyone involved, including the engineering done to have a redundancy plan in place.
Years ago I had a pitch trim runaway, nose down. Happened inside the FAF on an ILS. Had I not been hand flying and disengaged the AP at minimums I would not be here today. Turned out to be a nearly 30 year old relay that failed. Scary when it takes 2 people pulling as hard as they can to raise the nose and recover.
That sounds scary
Hey Victor! Juan Browne of the Blancolirio Channel on TH-cam gave you a shout-out when he did a video on this Brickyard Embraer runaway trim issue. (He started recording it on the 14th but I think it was actually posted yesterday or today when he got done with his research.)
Sweet!
Super quick quality upload as always! Was watching this one on my phone as it happened!
Thank you!!
Great job by all the professionals working on this. Also great job @VASAviation for the great visuals combined with the ATC. Thanks for sharing.
Great job pilots. Captain's trim switch wire chafed and shorted. We practiced this exact scenario now in the simulators. Smart that he gained the altitude then rolled into right 360 to lower nose.
Wow!! Scary!! Well done to all involved!! You have my utmost admiration!!
Kudos to the Tower and Approach controllers in keeping one of the busiest skies clear for this emergency.
This was a very intense video. After I watched it the 1st time, I came to read all the comments in order to understand the situation. Then, I came back and re-watched it several times. I can hear in the ATC background of others making calls on this. That's when I connected the Delta pilot's words when he said ground asked him to contact Brickyard.... I thought the ATC was rude but a comment from Arnold Sherrill helped me to see it differently... Kudos to the pilots, all of ATC and the fire department.
Man my pulse went up just hearing their calls. You know when you hear that tone they are BUSY and loaded up with alarms going off and lights flashing. Pure hell.
When I was at McGuire AFB in the mid 70s, a C-141 was doing T&Gs, MAs. After one of the touch and goes, they were rolling down the runway and the nose went up sharply. The AC looked at the CP who looked at him, asking WTH are you doing? Neither one pulled the yoke back and they realized they had a pitch/trim runaway. Emergency call to McGuire tower, and they spiraled up to ~ 5K feet before they could get the nose down. They had feet pressing on the CP's yoke and the AC and FE were both trying to shove the yoke down. They managed to get it level and RTB without crashing. It was an all-Reserve flight crew and in usual fashion, the active duty guys said they caused it. This was circa 1974 or so.
A week later another 141 had the same issue and the crew managed to abort. The planes were grounded for inspection, which discovered a wire in the yoke had the insulation worn off. The entire 141 fleet was then grounded for inspection/repair.
Chilling! To be rolling and then “who’s driving this bus?!?”
9E Pilot- That was amazing you guys. So very happy your all ok.
Controller and emergency crew- you rock!!!!
Aviate, navigate, communicate... perfect job!
Nice work by the crew and ATC. Professionals at their best.
Aviation is so inspiring. The teamwork in these positive videos it’s a motivating factor for me to try to provide harmony in my workplace. I hope to join the aviation community soon. That’s a bucket list item. Great job guys and girls.
Pilot: "we can't pitch down"
ATC: "descend and maintain 2000"
...bruh
I'm drooling with an utter admiration to every unit sounded in this recording with their sense of professionalism under such intense situations.
It's crazy to think this was caused by the captain's trim switch being reinstalled upside down. Trimming is second nature for us pilots so I don't blame him for not realizing that was the cause
That was freaking scary. Amazing job by the crew to go through their own troubleshooting to recover. Wow.
I bet the CVR had some heart thumping recorded on it.
I would love to hear the cvr on this
I saw the transcript of an aircraft that had to land with the nosegear up. Needless to say, a certain four letter F-word was used quite a number of times... But like these pilots, they did a great job and got the aircraft down safely, and on the center line at that, was also quite an impressive piece of flying.
These videos choke me up hearing people fight for their lives and the controllers valiantly trying to help them.
I followed this live out of my home airport, it scared the shit out of me. Those pilots are amazing. I was about to head to bed then I got the emergency declaration as a notification.
How did you get this a notification?
came here after watching mentour's video on this incident.. the trim switch is attached up side down on the captain's side...
Nice to hear another pilot come on and offer any help they can.
Yeah. I agree. They were fighting for their lives. Last thing they have the ability to do is open a book and dig for a procedure. I'm still amazed that these types of things aren't memory items. Or maybe it is and they were jammed up trying to control ig. I've not flown the E170 etc. Just crazy.
Jammed or unresponsive controls can give you tunnel vision and you become slow to do the immediate action items... Immediately.
I think it is great for a fellow aviator to help out but you also must keep in mind that it could be a distraction to the crew fighting for there lives literally ...so I think you have to remain cautious about disturbing them but also you might tell them something which contradicts what they are currently doing or have been trained to do so you got to be careful
@@taffyhomwe463 They were asked by ATC to come on and offer help. They did what they could without getting in the way.
@Dotar Sojat Look at 6:59 . DAL2304 "Ground sent me over."
@Dotar Sojat | Jon Selman was an ATC controller that was looking for help and found Delta pilot. Search [CTRL - F Jon Selman] and read his comments
Wow had me sitting on the edge of my seat as I watched the video. Well done pilots thank goodness for your training.
"we can't pitch down"
My heart jumped at that one....
Brickyard almost became a Boneyard :(
Could they have done a light nose stall? Or would that be too risky?
A stall at that altitude and with severe control problems? Might as well play russian roulette
@@makecba agreed
Stalling a swept wing aircraft is deadly as it is hard to recover from due to the nature of the swept wing. The centre of pressure moves forward during the Stall which increases the pitch up tendency and makes the situation worse.
With a T-tail configuration this leads to 'deep stall' which is (pretty much) unrecoverable because the elevator has no authority anymore due to turbulent air coming from the wings.
Source: student Atpl pilot
I think the problem is they couldn't configure the aircraft to recover so it would likely be a continuous or cyclical stall into the dirt.
@Dotar Sojat Where did I say it's a T-tail aircraft? I'm just giving some extra info about aircraft that do have them and their even worse Stall characteristics.
amazing how calm these guys are. bravo!
Some flying skills right there awsome job by the pilots getting the e175 back on the ground safely nice job guys well done
Back when I flew the E145 we had a crew experience this at O’Hare. Early 2000’s I believe. They got the plane under control by slowing down below 200 kts. I believe they had such a high pitch attitude they had to do the 45 degree wing over to unload the wing several times. Scary ride for sure. Kudos to these pilots just like those guys years ago for figuring it out successfully!
@VASAviation: How about the Amsterdam 'hijack' on Nov 5th, 19:00 local time?
Amsterdam hijack...lol...Good joke that one...
@@ChrisCokeRobinson The swat team didn't like the joke...
Good job, kudos to the crew, ATC and everyone involved. None panicked and did exactly what they had to do. Aircraft in one piece and nobody got hurt.
So glad they made it back down safely.
Turns out it wasn’t a THS runaway, but the AME/MO’s reinstalled the captains side stab trim switch upside down after inspecting it due to some issues on the previous legs.
crazy how that muscle memory will get you.
Badass job getting on the ground safely, fellas! Way to go Brickyard!
Also that unintelligible bit toward the end with the delta pilot was “did you go through the QRH?” The QRH is the quick reference handbook, and its a series of emergency checklists to help troubleshoot issues with the plane.
Heard that too.
One of the scariest flight videos I've seen, the pilots did a great job in making sure they were able to land safely. I don't think the local controller initially understood the severity or the actual nature of the emergency initially. Nonetheless, great team work in making sure the airplane landed safely.
These pilots were very calm for what they had to deal with in front of them. It’s crazy to me how calm these and other pilots are when faced with possible certain death. These pilots go through so much training for situations just like this. Great job to these pilots getting everyone on the ground safe.
"these" pilots if trained properly would not even contemplate death (albeit one of the 3 things humans fear), from the correct training your only thought is not to forget to hit the brakes on the runway.
Commendable job by the pilots and everyone coordinating very well. High Pressure situation, it's easy to panic but even more important to keep your cool. This was a very scary situation and could have easily been a disaster.
My heart races when I watch these. These pilots are AMAZING!
GOOD JOB GUYS!! indeed
That was hard to listen to. So glad they landed safe! Major props to the pilots!
Max pilot here. First off, kudos to the pilots! Absolutely fantastic job! Although the Max has obviously had it’s difficulties, both crashes were in essence a stab trim runaway. Now, I’m not going to get into the politics of these two Max crashes but instead remind people that the Max, as well as all 737’s (and 727’s) ever made have two big trim wheels that spin when the trim motors are engaged. A 737 pilot, once recognizing a trim runaway simply has to reach down and grab said wheel and stop the runaway as the system is designed so a pilot’s hand can overpower the trim motors. It simply seems that all aircraft should have the ability to viscerally realize the trim is trimming (nothing like seeing two big spinning wheels) and of course being able to stop the trim and also be able to manually trim the jet with those same wheels. Can someone explain how the system works on the E170 series?
It trims and does its thing. There's no wheel or manual notice of what it's doing. The only thing you'll see is the indication in your peripheral vision.
If the system fails, like it did here, the runaway stops where it did, and there's no way to retrim, as there is no manual trim wheel.
After this it became standard to have a full nose up trim runaway scenario in the recurrent. It sucks, but once in landing configuration is manageable
“We’re in a stalling situation... agh” 😳😳😳 horrible to hear. Could hear how bad it was in pilot’s voices in their initial comms.
Regarding runways, in a situation like this when pilots are clearly in a very difficult situation I would favour ATC telling them the runway and not asking them what they want loading them with options “will vector your for runway 10R - confirm?” then the pilots can give a yes/no answer ( depending what immediate return runway they had set up etc).
Separately, ARFF comms on these videos always seem to contain a lot of words but not a lot of info passed...
Delta pilot where it went... was asking the pilots if they’d run the QRH (quick reaction handbook). The pilot then said no time as fighting with the plane. Wow!
It's not up to the controller. His job is to give the pilot pretty much anything he needs and list the options. In an emergency ATC will never tell you what to do. That makes them culpable should something go wrong in the end.
"I can give you teterboro?"
"Unable"
It could be so quick and easy...
@@Atlessa "we may end up in the Hudson"
Brian White correct to a degree: but initially a simple yes or no answer to one runway is easier for the pilots to deal with rather than giving lots of options. If “unable” that runway then can expand. Especially at Atlanta where all the runways are in the same orientation so it’s not a factor for wind.
And in an emergency if the pilots were heading towards high ground for example, the ATC wouldn’t recommend changing heading or give options, they would TELL the pilots to make a turn.
VASA, thanks for putting this together. We can all learn from this situation.
My pleasure
I sure hope the tower never has a fire !!!
Hahahahah, IKR? Lol. :-P
This is scary. Very impressive pilots and ATC. You guys are the best.
9:50 - I think they just wanted to stop the plane and take a breath lol they were taking that 360 degree check whether they needed it or not
Hearing the "nice job guys" at the end got me PUMPED UP
"What would you like us to do?" "Got a seatcushion extractor handy . . ?"
I was sitting at my desk clapping that everyone made it safely on the ground. When they were in that stall, you could hear the stress in the pilot's voice. Just wow!! Great flight crew
Fire chief thinking he’s about to pull a Superman move but was told don’t call me again lol 😂
lol, talk about having your balloon burst
Radio silence is gold - they would know that and understand.
classic ambo ❤️
Well that was intense to say the least. I bet you it meant a whole lot for other pilots to have said 'Good job'
“We can’t pitch down, sir” - definitely on a workload with too many questions from ATC, no? He said that in such a way that sounded like “give me a minute”
One reason I always offer to every ATC person that they can come fly with me any time. I think getting them in the plane to see what we see can help them do the job and manage the emergency better. It always bugs me when the pilot says they are in a stall situation and ATC keeps asking what they can do to help, souls on board and fuel. Pick your timing man! I have taken 3 ATC controllers up over the past 10 years and they all felt they learned a ton, as did I. Makes everyone better at their job. If any ATC controller every wants to go up with me and live in the Southeast US, let me know.
This is the busiest airport in the world we are speaking of. Some information on what we can expect the pilots to do is necessary so we can protect the flight path. Sorry if it inconveniences the pilot for a couple seconds for information to prevent them from having a midair.
@@rfiorini Actually, I think it should be mandatory for their training as an ATC.
@Kerrymti, I couldnt agree more. As a pilot, it is always clear which ATC are pilots or not.
@@rfiorini Perhaps you should go listen on the other side as well? When we get hounded by supervisors to ask for information as they're standing behind us waiting to call it in for emergency service response or when 15 other aircraft are on frequency all headed in the direction of the emergency, information is mandatory. There's no perfect time to ask for it during an emergency.
To quote Capt. Vanderburgh: :Free drinks in First Class". Actual event long ago, moving all pax forward saved the aircraft.
I feel you, Fire Chief. I feel you. 😞
Jesus I lost it when he said in a stalling situation. Amazing job by the pilots and the controllers. They are truly our angels on the ground
Here is Mentour Pilot's breakdown of this flight from a pilot's perspective.
th-cam.com/video/iMMQ6-OfnL0/w-d-xo.html
Good job guys. Listening to this, had my adrenaline flowing. Glad it resolved.
AVIATE-navigate-communicate. Executed perfectly here. Nice job to pilots and ATC. 6 lives saved.
Excellent and quick turnaround on this incident. Kudos to the successful efforts of the pilots and calm ATC. From the speed data, it looks like the pilots brought speed well up as they shot up thru the atmo - presume that's to try to prevent stall at higher pitch.
imho, I'm not convinced the audio lines up with the sim at times, as the ATC seems oblivious to their actual altitude (and that they were still ascending).