It's a cost savings thing. The tech needed for cooled seats is far greater in both cost and packaging than heated seats. Heated seats use cheap little metal coils that can be put into both cloth and leather material seats. Cooled seats use little fan assemblies (usually 3 or 4) along with a module and wiring that basically require perforated leather in order for them to function correctly, not to mention a seat that has the size and material thickness to accommodate them. Yes they're an excellent feature but people barely put their money into this segment of car let alone ones that are loaded with features. You can get them in the top trim GLI and GTI but most of the enthusiast crowd flocks towards the more base trims without cooled seats for the weight and cost savings.
I live in NYC and our summers are brutal also. Routinely 90 degrees +, with very high humidity. Cooled seats are very welcome even in the Northeast as well.
I don't know, if I had an RS7 (I think that's what it was), I am pretty sure I would look for straight sections to pass Hondas as well. The road engineers didn't have RS7's in mind when they were thinking about how long the passing section needed to be. haha
Honda pedant checking in here. Jack said “FL5 generation Civic.” FL5 is the chassis code specific the Type R. This is the 11th Generation Civic and the chassis code for the sedan is FE1. So this is an FE1 Civic Si in Honda speak.
@@jackholmes8105 good that someone pointed it out. The confusion comes up a lot during live Q&A sessions. Mark often assumes that when someone asks about the FL5, they’re referring to the entire 11th-gen Civic lineup, when it’s just about the Type R model specifically.
We need more like this. Simple, lighter, well engineered drivers cars. Enough with the overly complicated super heavy SUV’s. I have a Golf GTI and a 718 Cayman. Both manual. Both enough tech but not too much. Perfect.
We may want, even crave for simple, light, well-engineered driver cars, but we're unfortunately a tiny minority, because everyone else has this strange fetish of cosplaying as rugged outdoors individuals and contractors who need 4WD (never mind they don't switch tires for winter), seating for a gazillion passengers (while being single-occupancy for 99% of the time), truck beds that are used twice a month (to carry items that a hatch can handle), and towing capacity that's used once a year.
@@kc510 Great combo. My Cayman is the base motor but with all the nice interior options and all the GTS dynamic goodies. It’s perfect for me. The 4.0 sounds a bit nicer but you never get out of 2nd gear on the road. With mine, I can actually use all the gears and it’s still much quicker that the on paper stats suggest. I really don’t have to lift in a corner. Just set it up, brake (sometimes!), turn in, balance on the throttle and squirt it through the apex. How many cars can make to whoop and laugh out loud mid corner? That’s the whole point for me. It’s marvelous.
My 2015 Civic Si has 157,000 miles and climbing. When I went to buy I was also considering a GTI or Focus ST as well. I ultimately picked the civic because even though it was the slowest, the running costs and reliability were top priorities, and I’m very happy with my purchase. Honda reliability is no joke!
Facts I said the same when I coulda got a 340i x drive or the 20’ si coupe now it definitely has had its small issues but overall amazing car nd sounds great ppl always say that even a police officer told me to launch froma. Dig to hear it 😂
From what I'm understanding, that's not quite the case with the newest generation. I've read more often than you'd expect that the 1.5L is not doing well at all.
Any bets on how many two row SUVs he's had to drive And make a video about in the past week? This actually doesn't feel like that many more than normal.
Picked up a 2025 si last Friday and couldn’t be more pleased with the car. Upgrading from a base model 1994 Chevy pickup with 5 speed MT so it seems like a rocket ship to me. Watched savagegeese’s review of the 2022 si and decided I’d get one when dealers stopped adding ‘market adjustments’
Although Honda has made it really affordable, dealerships in the US have made sure its not. I wanted to purchase one and a dealer asked $8k over MSRP. When I said no, I was asked how much I am willing to pay over MSRP. With this sort of culture, people cannot afford affordable manual transmission sports cars anymore. Extremely disappointing.
I just told my dealer I wouldn't pay MSRP and they gave it to me with a bunch of extras at MSRP... Negotiating isn't hard anymore. It ended up being 6k under asking.
@@RavnHood Negotiating the price with dealerships in North Carolina in 2023 was very difficult. If your case was recent, glad to hear that and I hope things are changing.
Thanks a bunch. Seriously! You guys helped influence me to buy the ‘23 Si that I drive everyday. I’m not an enthusiast by any stretch of the imagination, but; I am a well above average driver. As a middle aged guy who gets bored easily…I can honestly say that this is my favorite car I have ever owned. Having said all that, I am thinking strongly about going the Acura route next time and getting more power. With just over 28k on the odometer on this Honda, I think I can hold out a couple years to make the Acura deal happen. Thanks again for all the reviews. I truly appreciate all the technical data and deadpan humor, keep killing it.
Seconded. My '23 Si purchase very much influenced by this channel- middle aged guy with track experience. I'm going to stick with the Si though as I have 2 tuitions to front LOL
The people who try to argue why the SI exists when the hybrid is "faster" are not car enthusiasts and would never actually make the decision to purchase an SI.
truth hurts, huh? ^ Si used to be popular with the 20-something honda tuner crowd. Now all the new ones I basically never see, seem to be driven by people that look like you!
@@louKushhthey are an enthusiast car. But they are a car that need so much fixed by the aftermarket it's not worth it. I owned one for a year and it left such a bad taste in my mouth I won't buy another Honda again ever. The handling was great, the engine and interior NVH was just awful. The engine tuning is so bad it makes the MT more annoying than enjoyable. Rattles for days on the interior. Mine had the binding steering issues also which there is a TSB for but no recall. 2nd gear would grind on downshifts sometimes unless you hit 3rd then 2nd. I miss the handling and that it held its value so well but that's about it. Just not a very well thought out car imo and felt super rushed.
I have a 22 SI. Really enjoy it for what it is. Fun. Gas saver. Cheap maintenance. Manual transmission. The 2 weak spots of the past 2 Hondas I have had is the infotainment software sorely needs a refresh, and the back up camera needs better resolution, especially in low lighting.
Awesome to see Jakob and Yuri on SG. The Straight Pipes and Savage Geese are both fantastic. Your reviews are always thorough and entertaining. Thanks guys !
I LOVE how the si sedan looks over the ctr hatch. I just wish these had 40/50 more horsepower. The si has had 200 hp for like 20 years now, and the competition has just left it behind.
@@a.bishop615ehhhhh not quite. Cheaper in some cases but not by much. And a mk8 Gti is no slouch, even if you can’t get it with a manual. The si is only about 200lbs lighter than something like a GTI, but at a substantial hp and torque disadvantage. That manual is special though. Easily the best in class.
I loved my 9th gen SI, in some ways it was even better than my current Mk7 Golf R. The K24 is a more exciting engine than the EA888 even if it makes way less power and the transmission was so much sweeter in the Honda, I could shift that thing three times in the time it takes to make one shift in the golf, and thats not even an exaggeration.
@@AhYesIndeedItsFunTimehe talking bout engine performance its the same as a 2016 si -2025 same exact engine no added hp or nun which is a shame yes hes right
At 850$/month for 7.49% APR, that's far from the 3 new Civic Si I owned pre Y2K by at least 500$/month (that's in Canada). With tax here, it totals at 48k-ish, which is insane for young drivers.
The Civic Si simply does not exist anywhere near MSRP (at least in Southern California). After looking for a month in August 2024, the best I could do was find a dealer who claimed they had one that "should be here tomorrow" and it was mine for a $5000 markup plus $600 for required VIN etching. After walking out, I bought an Integra Aspec with the 6MT for under MSRP. Integra's are easy to find at or below MSRP because everyone says "just buy the Civic Si". Free market economics in action, isn't it great?!
I absolutely love the fact that you did this on the Natchez Trace Trail! I've driven parts of that many times while I lived in Nashville and it's a beautiful drive. Saw my first McLaren on that road. I owned a 1987 Civic Si, 2013 Si, and 2018 Civic Si (Stinger GT2 AWD, Evo X since then) and am anxious to get back into a manual Honda. Still can't wrap my head around the cost difference between the Si and Type R though. Thanks for all the insight during this production and the memories it brought back! I "raced" an Augusta on that road in a non-stock 2005 Tiburon...was NOT a race, but the ride and I spoke at an exit and we both enjoyed it. Beautiful drive if you ever have time to do any part of it . . . Franklin, TN to Natchez, Misssssissssssippppppppiiiiiiiiii.
I bought an 8th gen new in 2009 and loved it. In 2023 I thought I'd like to get a new Si as a daily. Honda dealers killed that idea - charging markup still, asking for non-refundable deposits without being able to test drive. I ended up with a Jetta GLI and have been pretty happy with it.
@@ShadowBend Pretty sure the 11th gen chassis is tuned way better for handling as well. Still wanna try an 8th gen though but they're rare in my area😕.
@@ShadowBend To be fair, paint still isn't their forte. My 9th gen's hood is just caked with paint chips😥. Even to this day, I still see and hear paint problems on the new models.
"essentially no 4-door, sporty manual cars left on the market" GLI GTI WRX Mazda3 Hatch Corolla GR This is the best time to be a budget-minded car enthusiast. Why don't car reviewers see that?
I was driving a 2024 honda civic sport hatchback (6 speed manual) which I bought in January of this year, with only ten miles. Yesterday I went in to the dealer for my second oil change and instead of changing the oil, I ended up changing the car too. I drove out with a 2025 S.i. This thing is amazing!
Finally got to test drive a 2024 civic si and it was nice, great shifter, great seats I really liked it. Then went to the VW dealer and took a test drive in a GTI. Well I feel like they both handled the same, however the GTI had more adjustments for suspension (in the model I drove) (had the leather seats) that felt really nice...cool and heated front seats. Wasn't a fan of the touch buttons but I undertand that is fixed in 2025. What I did notice was the quickest of the GTI 0-60 and a little beyond :) The GTI I feel would leave the Si at the starting line if that is important to anyone. The 2025 comes with more HP so guessing it will be even quicker/faster. I want a new daily and hopefully and test drive the 2025 and then make my decission. Can't wait for you to get a GTI and do a review would value your opinion.
I may be way off base as I havent done any research. But the 1.5L keeps me away. For lite modding it just seems weak. I know the GR has a tiny motor but it was built to be quick.
I have a 24 Si, and it is exactly as described. A really great manual commuter with all the practicality for daily life, including rear facing child seats and all the baby gear we need for a weekend away. The more I drive it, the more I enjoy the handling and sporty tuning.
My favorite car guys doing what they do best....And, I am sure Jack is wishing they would put that BMW B58 engine in the Honda. Would of been better if You guys made Mark come along for the drive as well. That would of been priceless. And, Jakub looking all so serious..
as for the power, these engines are extremely easy to go higher. my stock civic sedan (FC1, 6MT) has 225hp/340nm with no mods, just a tune. It is running 98octane (Netherlands) though. Had a rolling race with the hybrid on a freeway entrance, suffice it to say, he got gapped. The hybrid is not fast, at all. Do not remap the CVT though....just dont.
@@singular9 It is basically a Type-R engine with a babyturbo. So yeah, they have big possibilities. I did look for that Accord. But they're not sold here in Europe. So even if you manage to get one, finding a mechanic is impossible. Or parts. It was my first pick though, had I the choice, they are nice cars. Have fun with it. I might throw on a different intercooler and downpipe and get 250 out of it. But I'd call it quits there :)
1:08 - This is not FL5 platform, it's FE. Some might think it's the same, but not many know that FL5 body uses different steel grade even to similar looking FL4 hatchback
Thank you for this; the car does look roomy (okay, Yuri is no giant, but heck, he's sitting behind Jakob, who is at least as "silverback" as Jack). The car does seem like a great package (and the best part is that it is cheaper than most anything else out there that retains sporting pretensions). And it seems quite fun. More SG/SP hook ups, please!
Thank you for this timely review. I'm on my third VW (an Arteon) and the warranty only has a year and change left ( 2019 was the last year of the six year bumper to bumper). Since VW is STILL not selling the electric van here I've been considering another car. The GLI and this Civic have been the two I'm considering. This review has convinced me to knock the Civic out of contention. I despise the black wheel trend and dislike the black mirrors enough to kick it to the curb. I love driving my Arteon but I know that out of warranty costs are going to be prohibitive (I've owned out of warranty VW's). Nothing has gone wrong with it so far and I'm knocking on wood for that to continue. A lot of this is down to the local dealers and the Hyundai, Honda, and Kia dealerships around here have substandard service departments. The local VW dealership does have a decent service department. I probably should have bought the last of the Malibu's with the 3.6 and been done with it but here we are.
I agree on VW service costs. I have a 2018 GTI and the scheduled maintenance is expensive. I do my own oil changes now that it's out of warranty and that has more than cut the cost of oil changes in half, but I'll pay the dealer for the DSG service and brake fluid service. I will do the Haldex and spark plugs myself next time.
While you may say “it’s not fast”, I would counter it’s fast enough. You can take it to the edge and in theory, not die or destroy the car due to it not being a monster.
I disagree. It is actually slow. A 0-60 of 6.6 seconds is worse than an elantra N or a Jetta GLI. It's even slower than an F-150. There is nothing sporty about slow. And if your argument is cornering, then I'd rather have a RWD BRZ/86, miata, or WRX.
30k + taxes and fees and interest is 700$ a month. Welcome to corporate greed baby! Of course idiots in comments blame it on inflation, but they forget that capitalism is supposed to make things cheaper the longer you make them, such as electronics for example.
Right the Days for cheap Cars worth buying Are Absolutely GONE 🇺🇸, Don't see it getting better the longer we have this Money burning Administration in Control, It's getting rather INSANE.
Great review! Will consider this when my Mazda 3 6MT lease ends next year. I live in the Nashville suburbs and recognize the Natchez Trace Pkwy….nice. It is federally patrolled so that Audi would be impounded and driver ticketed close to $1000 if caught at that speed and passing recklessly on the double yellow lines.
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You guys are on Natchez trace. Love that road but it is risky to drive slightly above the limit there.
I'm so glad they offer a manual still. I hope we see another 10+ years of manuals on the Si and the Type R. Great car overall and videos with manuals are just more fun.
This car is plenty quick enough for what it is. People should start appreciating that cars like this exist. If you want to give up driving engagement and character for slightly faster 0-60, then I don’t think you really understand what driving joy is. Just go buy a prius or camry at that point. I’m so thankful to Honda that this car still exists in this day and age.
Nope, won't buy a L15 Engine ever. I wanted a Si back in 2023 and tried to find one but with no luck due to shortage of them at the time. Thank goodness for that, after many and I mean many reports of head gasket failures in the L15 engines. I chose to not buy a 11th Gen Si. I wish that the Type-R's were not $15k over MSRP then that would have been my first option, but Honda being Honda made it so. I choose to buy a used 10th Gen Accord 2.0t to get a proper K20C powered Sedan. Not disappointed in the slightest. I would steer clear of any L15 engines, no matter what. They are seriously flawed due to it being a eco engine with a Turbo.
Accord has been bigger than an ES350 since 2018. The Civic has been within 2% of the size of a camry for a while. The corolla and mazda3 are the only true compacts.
It’s worth noting how well these civics handle. My friend has a 2022 Si that we just had at tail of the dragon. It absolutely carved those corners and we were flying through there. Granted he upgraded the terrible all seasons to Indy 500 summer tires. That limited slip diff in these things rips you out of corners
Straight pipes are allergic to specific comparisons and comments. “It’s a good entry level Honda manual”. …What? Jack coming in clutch and actually comparing it to the gli.
This car takes about 2 seconds from the time you put your foot down before it reacts (independently of RPM or "driving mode"). It's a manual that feels sluggish as an auto. Why is no one talking about this?
It does not feel expensive inside. It feels just about where every car in its class and price-point feel. Honda did not "un-shitbox" the compact economy car with all that thin and cheap plastic, everywhere.
we're now at 30k before fees and taxes for a tiny, 200 horsepower Honda Civic with a stick shift... So let's say after taxes/fees, 34k out the door. Let's assume great credit, approved for a basic 60 month loan at 8 percent interest. Most people right now are broke, so no down payment. That brings you to basically $700 a month, BEFORE INSURANCE, for a HONDA CIVIC. Not a luxury car, not an Accord, a 200 horsepower, stick shift Honda CIVIC. Who is this affordable for? Someone making 6 figures?
I work in an engineering firm and most of us are driving normal boring cars like this while all making six figures many are just driving old trucks or older sporty cars. The ones who drive expensive vehicles are either in debt or doing "financing". Which means legally stealing peoples money.
Yep, I’m mid 6 figure and it’s my daily driver. I had an S60 recharge which was fast but too boring. This is much more engaging and cheaper to maintain. Plus in 5 years it’ll be worth more than my old S60.
I would argue that broke people without a down payment have no business walking into a Honda dealership and financing a brand new Civic SI. They should be either, using public transportation, buying cheap used cars or buying lower trim econo cars like the cheapest Corolla or Nissan Sentra they can find.
Brings back memories of HS, crammed in the back seat of my buddy’s SI, freezing bc he’s chain smoking with the window down in winter, trying to find a party to hit up.
The Recipe for 300 HP Si: Cold air intake system High-performance downpipe and front pipe Front mount intercooler kit Drop-in turbocharger upgrade Tuning solution like Hondata or KTuner Clutch kit (for manual transaxles) Optional (nice to have/might need) Flex-fuel kit😊😊😊
These cars love ethanol and it's a great way to add power. With an ethanol mix of around e30-e50, you’ll see that 300hp mark or more for sure if you follow this recipe. THAT’S THE LIST. WELCOME TO THE 300HP CLUB! 😊
3 dudes crammed in a Honda is the average Civic experience
😂
That's nothing. One of my best highschool memories is routinely having 5-6 people in an '89 Accord LXi hatchback.
@@thatoneotherotherguy Now *that's* the civic experience.
That and dual 12” subwoofers rattling your intestines
@@thatoneotherotherguyIn HS we got 11 in a Vega
In Mexico the "Civic Si" is sold as the "Civic Yes" and comes standard with a Manuel.
The rest of the world isn't going to take american pricing and thus has to offer standard features to even remotely move units.
NOVA = no no nogo
😂
I hope Manuel is a cool person ;)
@@singular9 i think it went right over your head or r/woosh or whatever they kids say nowadays
Roughly 50% of the country lives where cooled seats are more useful than heated seats. Wish I could get THAT option!
Yes please.
It's a cost savings thing. The tech needed for cooled seats is far greater in both cost and packaging than heated seats. Heated seats use cheap little metal coils that can be put into both cloth and leather material seats. Cooled seats use little fan assemblies (usually 3 or 4) along with a module and wiring that basically require perforated leather in order for them to function correctly, not to mention a seat that has the size and material thickness to accommodate them. Yes they're an excellent feature but people barely put their money into this segment of car let alone ones that are loaded with features. You can get them in the top trim GLI and GTI but most of the enthusiast crowd flocks towards the more base trims without cooled seats for the weight and cost savings.
Yes, but the seat heaters double as a takeout warmer.
To be fair, cloth seats generally do not need seat coolers, even in 95F + 80% humidity weather that we get so often in Virginia
I live in NYC and our summers are brutal also. Routinely 90 degrees +, with very high humidity. Cooled seats are very welcome even in the Northeast as well.
That overtake across the solid double yellow screams typical audi driver LOL
Plot twist that was Mark
I don't know, if I had an RS7 (I think that's what it was), I am pretty sure I would look for straight sections to pass Hondas as well. The road engineers didn't have RS7's in mind when they were thinking about how long the passing section needed to be. haha
@@viper306m😂 most probably
Do you drive a Prius mr wong...or..a camry Le? You sound like a angry prius driver who hates German car drivers.
@@bxp1696And you sound like the typical douche Audi driver.
Having an Audi tailing you really close for no damn reason is an authentic experience
lol
So true. They ride my but when I’m in my old Wrangler, but they pull up beside me when I’m in my even older 911
to be fair, they gotta make up for the monthly payments so doing this will at least make them feel good about their financial situation.
Honda pedant checking in here. Jack said “FL5 generation Civic.” FL5 is the chassis code specific the Type R. This is the 11th Generation Civic and the chassis code for the sedan is FE1. So this is an FE1 Civic Si in Honda speak.
Boy, I hope someone got fired for that blunder.
Whoops. All the 4 cylinders blend together in my brain
The pedantry checks out
@@deviouslaw thank you for knowing what it means.
@@jackholmes8105 good that someone pointed it out. The confusion comes up a lot during live Q&A sessions. Mark often assumes that when someone asks about the FL5, they’re referring to the entire 11th-gen Civic lineup, when it’s just about the Type R model specifically.
We need more like this. Simple, lighter, well engineered drivers cars. Enough with the overly complicated super heavy SUV’s. I have a Golf GTI and a 718 Cayman. Both manual. Both enough tech but not too much. Perfect.
We may want, even crave for simple, light, well-engineered driver cars, but we're unfortunately a tiny minority, because everyone else has this strange fetish of cosplaying as rugged outdoors individuals and contractors who need 4WD (never mind they don't switch tires for winter), seating for a gazillion passengers (while being single-occupancy for 99% of the time), truck beds that are used twice a month (to carry items that a hatch can handle), and towing capacity that's used once a year.
I have a GTI and GR86. Both manual. But I wanted a Cayman lol cheers
@@benzzoy You couldn’t be more correct.
@@kc510 Great combo. My Cayman is the base motor but with all the nice interior options and all the GTS dynamic goodies. It’s perfect for me. The 4.0 sounds a bit nicer but you never get out of 2nd gear on the road. With mine, I can actually use all the gears and it’s still much quicker that the on paper stats suggest. I really don’t have to lift in a corner. Just set it up, brake (sometimes!), turn in, balance on the throttle and squirt it through the apex. How many cars can make to whoop and laugh out loud mid corner? That’s the whole point for me. It’s marvelous.
I have an STi, and my sentiment is the same.
My 2015 Civic Si has 157,000 miles and climbing. When I went to buy I was also considering a GTI or Focus ST as well. I ultimately picked the civic because even though it was the slowest, the running costs and reliability were top priorities, and I’m very happy with my purchase. Honda reliability is no joke!
Facts I said the same when I coulda got a 340i x drive or the 20’ si coupe now it definitely has had its small issues but overall amazing car nd sounds great ppl always say that even a police officer told me to launch froma. Dig to hear it 😂
My 2015 has 160k too. I top love the low maintenance costs, natural aspirating K24, and really nice interior. Hoping to get it to 300k!
That's why I only will buy Honda or Toyota
From what I'm understanding, that's not quite the case with the newest generation. I've read more often than you'd expect that the 1.5L is not doing well at all.
@@vtecbrown u will dont hope as long as u replace partd that are needed u straight
"..so you don't have to drive your car into oncoming traffic"
You feeling OK, Jack?
Any bets on how many two row SUVs he's had to drive And make a video about in the past week? This actually doesn't feel like that many more than normal.
Thats how I feel when I drive a Toyota or Lexus.
Depression is what this channel lives on.
Probably malnutrition. I heard that as you get older, your body has more difficulty absorbing Vitamin 8.
@@Dowlphin vitamin b58 😂
Picked up a 2025 si last Friday and couldn’t be more pleased with the car. Upgrading from a base model 1994 Chevy pickup with 5 speed MT so it seems like a rocket ship to me. Watched savagegeese’s review of the 2022 si and decided I’d get one when dealers stopped adding ‘market adjustments’
I was trying to get one in 22 but decided to keep my old Mazda because the dealer was adding an ADM. Might be time to go see if my dealer still sucks.
Were you able to get it by msrp?
@@kosta2177 msrp and no forced add ons
@@kosta2177 yes!
You could of kept your truck for workload
Still waiting at Hattie B's Hot Chicken for Mark to show up
If you want the orignal, go to Prince's.
Congrats on surviving the ride with Jack, you guys looked very concerned.
The collab I never knew I needed
As a long time straight pipes fan, i cant believe it took me this long to find this video, love you guys✌️
@@4dscdriveroriginal doesn't mean better. Especially in this case
Although Honda has made it really affordable, dealerships in the US have made sure its not. I wanted to purchase one and a dealer asked $8k over MSRP. When I said no, I was asked how much I am willing to pay over MSRP. With this sort of culture, people cannot afford affordable manual transmission sports cars anymore. Extremely disappointing.
One of the reasons why I am looking at a Subaru BRZ, Honda is full of themselves where I am.
Same reason I ended up with an Integra. The loaded Integra I bought was cheaper than the SI with the $5000 of dealer add ons and mark ups.
I just told my dealer I wouldn't pay MSRP and they gave it to me with a bunch of extras at MSRP... Negotiating isn't hard anymore. It ended up being 6k under asking.
@@RavnHood Negotiating the price with dealerships in North Carolina in 2023 was very difficult. If your case was recent, glad to hear that and I hope things are changing.
@@ChadHargis How are you liking it so far? I got to drive a Base model and it felt terrible to drive in the corners
Thanks a bunch. Seriously! You guys helped influence me to buy the ‘23 Si that I drive everyday. I’m not an enthusiast by any stretch of the imagination, but; I am a well above average driver. As a middle aged guy who gets bored easily…I can honestly say that this is my favorite car I have ever owned. Having said all that, I am thinking strongly about going the Acura route next time and getting more power. With just over 28k on the odometer on this Honda, I think I can hold out a couple years to make the Acura deal happen. Thanks again for all the reviews. I truly appreciate all the technical data and deadpan humor, keep killing it.
Seconded. My '23 Si purchase very much influenced by this channel- middle aged guy with track experience. I'm going to stick with the Si though as I have 2 tuitions to front LOL
Acura is where its at. Only foreign car Id buy again
The people who try to argue why the SI exists when the hybrid is "faster" are not car enthusiasts and would never actually make the decision to purchase an SI.
the last Si "enthusiasts" purchased, was the coupe.
this is a teacher's car.
@@louKushhthis is in the running for dumbest comment I’ve read under this vid.
truth hurts, huh? ^
Si used to be popular with the 20-something honda tuner crowd. Now all the new ones I basically never see, seem to be driven by people that look like you!
@@louKushhwhy be such a douchebag?
@@louKushhthey are an enthusiast car. But they are a car that need so much fixed by the aftermarket it's not worth it. I owned one for a year and it left such a bad taste in my mouth I won't buy another Honda again ever. The handling was great, the engine and interior NVH was just awful. The engine tuning is so bad it makes the MT more annoying than enjoyable. Rattles for days on the interior. Mine had the binding steering issues also which there is a TSB for but no recall. 2nd gear would grind on downshifts sometimes unless you hit 3rd then 2nd. I miss the handling and that it held its value so well but that's about it. Just not a very well thought out car imo and felt super rushed.
whoever that was behind them during the drive was really on their ass god damn
I have a 22 SI. Really enjoy it for what it is. Fun. Gas saver. Cheap maintenance. Manual transmission.
The 2 weak spots of the past 2 Hondas I have had is the infotainment software sorely needs a refresh, and the back up camera needs better resolution, especially in low lighting.
30K + taxes for shitbox interior and a screen. WOOOOOW GOOD VALUE INDEED
@singular9 wtf u watching this video lol.
@@singular9all you do is leave hate comments on car channels bro you must be broke and carless
@@singular9 shitbox interior? Best interior in its class by far. Better than a lot of luxury as well. WTF you smoking?
not shitbox anymore doofus. This car should have more power though @@singular9
Audi driver passing on double yellow. Typical.
And I say that as a recent Audi buyer, lol.
As a TN resident, this is just a normal day in the state!
As a BMW owner, I’d probably have done the same.
@@NomadJedi goes without saying.
Awesome to see Jakob and Yuri on SG. The Straight Pipes and Savage Geese are both fantastic. Your reviews are always thorough and entertaining. Thanks guys !
Love seeing these channels working together. Two of my favorites!!
ive had 3 Si civics and they were are great cars! my 05 had 400k miles when I sold it.
Wowww I know u took care of that!! I respect that
Yuri doesn't look happy in the back seat at all 😂
Horsepower and torque!!
Another informative and fun production. Good to see some Canadian collaboration. Really enjoyed it. Well done and keep up the good work, Jack.
I'm so glad this car exists!!!
I have a '22 Blazing Orange Pearl, and the car is amazing! You can't imagine how many compliments I get! This thing is a blast!
I LOVE how the si sedan looks over the ctr hatch. I just wish these had 40/50 more horsepower. The si has had 200 hp for like 20 years now, and the competition has just left it behind.
It’s also lighter, handles better, and costs less than the competition.
yep I never even considered it with less than 240hp for how much $$
That’s great but not achievable. It simply would cost a lot more the more power you put into it and no longer become a cheap sports car
@@a.bishop615ehhhhh not quite. Cheaper in some cases but not by much. And a mk8 Gti is no slouch, even if you can’t get it with a manual. The si is only about 200lbs lighter than something like a GTI, but at a substantial hp and torque disadvantage.
That manual is special though. Easily the best in class.
you mean, it looks like a regular civic? that's the part you love?
That Si should be 25k out the door. These corporations are insane.
Those corporations still have to pay for gas guzzler credits
As a 9th gen owner, I like the 11th gen, but DAMN that price tag makes me shed a tear.
No changes in 10 years and still charges more because you know....a bit more glue for "rigidity" costs thousands.
At $29,950, this is actually cheaper factoring in inflation than my 2000 Civic Si was at $17,545 MSRP + destination. (Would be ~$32k now).
I loved my 9th gen SI, in some ways it was even better than my current Mk7 Golf R. The K24 is a more exciting engine than the EA888 even if it makes way less power and the transmission was so much sweeter in the Honda, I could shift that thing three times in the time it takes to make one shift in the golf, and thats not even an exaggeration.
@@singular9 are you high? they did a major change to the entire body and interior with the 11th gen
@@AhYesIndeedItsFunTimehe talking bout engine performance its the same as a 2016 si -2025 same exact engine no added hp or nun which is a shame yes hes right
I like it when you guys collab with straight pipes! great review! like the new Si
Was waiting for SG to release this video for a long time. No other review channel does it in such a good technical aspect. Props to you guys.
I have a 2020 SI Coupe. Great car, zero issues over the last 5 years, great resale, avg 36 miles per gallon.
the last real Si
I just bought a 2025 Mazda 3 manual trans and it's amazing so far. Don't overlook comparing the 2!
While I’m still more partial to the 8th and 9th gen Si’s and their NA engines, I really love the way this one looks.
I had an 8th gen Si and I’m itching to build a Miata with a k20/24 so bad to get that feeling back.
I liked that final thoughts transition
Love the straight pipe invite
At 850$/month for 7.49% APR, that's far from the 3 new Civic Si I owned pre Y2K by at least 500$/month (that's in Canada). With tax here, it totals at 48k-ish, which is insane for young drivers.
Wouldnt call 500 affordable for most anyone today
@@gordocarbo "far from the 3 new Civic Si I owned pre Y2K by at least 500$/month", that means they were 500$/month cheaper.
Great to meet you at the event Jack
Great to see all three of you together...
The Civic Si simply does not exist anywhere near MSRP (at least in Southern California). After looking for a month in August 2024, the best I could do was find a dealer who claimed they had one that "should be here tomorrow" and it was mine for a $5000 markup plus $600 for required VIN etching. After walking out, I bought an Integra Aspec with the 6MT for under MSRP. Integra's are easy to find at or below MSRP because everyone says "just buy the Civic Si". Free market economics in action, isn't it great?!
I absolutely love the fact that you did this on the Natchez Trace Trail! I've driven parts of that many times while I lived in Nashville and it's a beautiful drive. Saw my first McLaren on that road. I owned a 1987 Civic Si, 2013 Si, and 2018 Civic Si (Stinger GT2 AWD, Evo X since then) and am anxious to get back into a manual Honda. Still can't wrap my head around the cost difference between the Si and Type R though. Thanks for all the insight during this production and the memories it brought back! I "raced" an Augusta on that road in a non-stock 2005 Tiburon...was NOT a race, but the ride and I spoke at an exit and we both enjoyed it. Beautiful drive if you ever have time to do any part of it . . . Franklin, TN to Natchez, Misssssissssssippppppppiiiiiiiiii.
The Trail seems even more beautiful when riding a motorcycle.
Was NOT expecting the Jacob and Yuri Collab 🤘🤘🤘
I had no idea Yuri's last name was Collab. Interesting.
@@mediocreman2confirmed
when you said Canadians, I knew it was gonna be the Straightpipes. I love that channel. Excellent!
I bought an 8th gen new in 2009 and loved it. In 2023 I thought I'd like to get a new Si as a daily. Honda dealers killed that idea - charging markup still, asking for non-refundable deposits without being able to test drive. I ended up with a Jetta GLI and have been pretty happy with it.
8th gen is likely faster anywho
@@tealchief I'm sure the old K20 was slower in a straight line, it had such little torque. But the engine sound above 6k RPM was glorious.
@@ShadowBend Pretty sure the 11th gen chassis is tuned way better for handling as well. Still wanna try an 8th gen though but they're rare in my area😕.
@@dillo2916 The other issue with 8th gens was the paint quality. Mine was mostly OK but some had horrible peeling issues.
@@ShadowBend To be fair, paint still isn't their forte. My 9th gen's hood is just caked with paint chips😥. Even to this day, I still see and hear paint problems on the new models.
"essentially no 4-door, sporty manual cars left on the market"
GLI
GTI
WRX
Mazda3 Hatch
Corolla GR
This is the best time to be a budget-minded car enthusiast. Why don't car reviewers see that?
GTI Manual is dead after this year and the list is bound to shrink in the coming years
Heated seats. About fucking time.
Thought the 2019 had it
I was driving a 2024 honda civic sport hatchback (6 speed manual) which I bought in January of this year, with only ten miles. Yesterday I went in to the dealer for my second oil change and instead of changing the oil, I ended up changing the car too. I drove out with a 2025 S.i. This thing is amazing!
I would love for this to be my next car. Not interested in starting up new car payments, though.
Finally got to test drive a 2024 civic si and it was nice, great shifter, great seats I really liked it. Then went to the VW dealer and took a test drive in a GTI. Well I feel like they both handled the same, however the GTI had more adjustments for suspension (in the model I drove) (had the leather seats) that felt really nice...cool and heated front seats. Wasn't a fan of the touch buttons but I undertand that is fixed in 2025. What I did notice was the quickest of the GTI 0-60 and a little beyond :) The GTI I feel would leave the Si at the starting line if that is important to anyone. The 2025 comes with more HP so guessing it will be even quicker/faster. I want a new daily and hopefully and test drive the 2025 and then make my decission. Can't wait for you to get a GTI and do a review would value your opinion.
MK8 GTI is where is at. Far better car than any current gen Civic.
I never knew I needed this crossover. Two of my all-time favorite automotive channels mashed into one?! WE NEED MORE OF THIS!!
This!
I may be way off base as I havent done any research. But the 1.5L keeps me away. For lite modding it just seems weak. I know the GR has a tiny motor but it was built to be quick.
Huge shoutout to all the Si buyers keeping this model alive! Long live Manuel/Manuela.
I have a 24 Si, and it is exactly as described. A really great manual commuter with all the practicality for daily life, including rear facing child seats and all the baby gear we need for a weekend away. The more I drive it, the more I enjoy the handling and sporty tuning.
How is the ride on rough pavement?
@@NonVerba-v3flivable. But try to avoid it
Hearing jack talk about something other than a Porsche is a delight 😊
My favorite car guys doing what they do best....And, I am sure Jack is wishing they would put that BMW B58 engine in the Honda. Would of been better if You guys made Mark come along for the drive as well. That would of been priceless. And, Jakub looking all so serious..
Who else misses the Screaming 2L at 8400 or 2.4L at 7400....
My D16 sounds better then this car
love the collab with StraightPipes!
as for the power, these engines are extremely easy to go higher. my stock civic sedan (FC1, 6MT) has 225hp/340nm with no mods, just a tune. It is running 98octane (Netherlands) though.
Had a rolling race with the hybrid on a freeway entrance, suffice it to say, he got gapped. The hybrid is not fast, at all.
Do not remap the CVT though....just dont.
370lbft and 310hp out of my accord 2.0 lol. Love the aftermarket.
@@singular9 It is basically a Type-R engine with a babyturbo. So yeah, they have big possibilities.
I did look for that Accord. But they're not sold here in Europe. So even if you manage to get one, finding a mechanic is impossible. Or parts.
It was my first pick though, had I the choice, they are nice cars. Have fun with it. I might throw on a different intercooler and downpipe and get 250 out of it. But I'd call it quits there :)
if you mean 98 RON that equals 93 octane U.S.
@@chappy3669 Yes, thats what it's running.
1:08 - This is not FL5 platform, it's FE. Some might think it's the same, but not many know that FL5 body uses different steel grade even to similar looking FL4 hatchback
The 1.5T is an insult to the SI when a hybrid trim has more power.
I wouldn’t care so much about the power figure not improving in 15+ years if it reved higher and didn’t sound like shit doing so
@@trevorhsu6357 Word, the low 6600 rpm limit is criminal for the legacy of all Civic SI models
@@therealpickleahoyMy non VTec d16 revs higher then this
Thank you for this; the car does look roomy (okay, Yuri is no giant, but heck, he's sitting behind Jakob, who is at least as "silverback" as Jack). The car does seem like a great package (and the best part is that it is cheaper than most anything else out there that retains sporting pretensions). And it seems quite fun.
More SG/SP hook ups, please!
3 percent more rigid..Woahhhhhhh! Amazing!
I was thinking the same. Usually it’s 10-20% more
Thank you for this timely review.
I'm on my third VW (an Arteon) and the warranty only has a year and change left ( 2019 was the last year of the six year bumper to bumper). Since VW is STILL not selling the electric van here I've been considering another car. The GLI and this Civic have been the two I'm considering. This review has convinced me to knock the Civic out of contention. I despise the black wheel trend and dislike the black mirrors enough to kick it to the curb.
I love driving my Arteon but I know that out of warranty costs are going to be prohibitive (I've owned out of warranty VW's). Nothing has gone wrong with it so far and I'm knocking on wood for that to continue. A lot of this is down to the local dealers and the Hyundai, Honda, and Kia dealerships around here have substandard service departments. The local VW dealership does have a decent service department. I probably should have bought the last of the Malibu's with the 3.6 and been done with it but here we are.
It's not anywhere near a compact car, though. It's huge!
Not really
@@sammydavis991 yes really
If you think a Civic is huge you’ve not been around large sedans is all I’ll say.
@@AJ56that doesn’t mean that modern cars haven’t gotten huge. Because they have
Enthusiasts will find anything to complain about
I'm so glad they held onto the rev hang. It's become synonymous with Honda's modern manual transmission experience. Legendary.
Sarcasm? That and the crazy amount of throttle lag.
Backseat is the only place Yuri (he/him) should be in.
I agree on VW service costs. I have a 2018 GTI and the scheduled maintenance is expensive. I do my own oil changes now that it's out of warranty and that has more than cut the cost of oil changes in half, but I'll pay the dealer for the DSG service and brake fluid service.
I will do the Haldex and spark plugs myself next time.
Nothing else in its class with a manual... "Am I a joke to you?" - WRX
I was thinking about this too haha. AWD versus the Si and GLI being FWD, but from a size and price standpoint, the WRX is definitely competition
@@g60corrado91 Even the BRZ blows this out of the water, and cheaper!
the kia forte Gt still has a manual and the N line had a stick until 2022
Kia Forte is discontinued and didn't have a manual option for the last 2 model years. @@eugene44569
@@eugene44569The forte has been discontinued and like you said the n-line lost the manual...
I just wish the engine were 2.0 instead of a tiny 1.5. Ideally 500cc per cylinder.
Love the collab with THE StraightPipes! 🙌 Yuri saying “I’m not a bad passenger” was the feels and shoutout for all rear seat passengers everywhere🫡
While you may say “it’s not fast”, I would counter it’s fast enough. You can take it to the edge and in theory, not die or destroy the car due to it not being a monster.
If your argument that its fast enough, then any car with 200hp is fun enough.
@@singular9fast =/= fun
@@singular9 Anything with almost any horsepower *can be* fun enough, but there's a lot more that goes into it than the HP number.
@@singular9 Not quite. It depends on the personality of the car. The SI for its demographic is near perfect.
I disagree. It is actually slow. A 0-60 of 6.6 seconds is worse than an elantra N or a Jetta GLI. It's even slower than an F-150. There is nothing sporty about slow. And if your argument is cornering, then I'd rather have a RWD BRZ/86, miata, or WRX.
Good on you guys for giving the lesser review channels a bone here and there.
We're at the point now where +$30K is "affordable"...
Where have you been? It's been this way for 4 years
30k + taxes and fees and interest is 700$ a month.
Welcome to corporate greed baby!
Of course idiots in comments blame it on inflation, but they forget that capitalism is supposed to make things cheaper the longer you make them, such as electronics for example.
Yeah, with inflation this is essentially exactly where the 2000 Civic Si was priced ($17,545), actually a few grand cheaper.
Right the Days for cheap Cars worth buying Are Absolutely GONE 🇺🇸, Don't see it getting better the longer we have this Money burning Administration in Control, It's getting rather INSANE.
Someone regrets all those Cs in high school now. 😂
1:14 My Man is playing GAS GAS GAS 😳, Now that’s a man of culture 😏
RECALLS!!!!
Great review! Will consider this when my Mazda 3 6MT lease ends next year.
I live in the Nashville suburbs and recognize the Natchez Trace Pkwy….nice. It is federally patrolled so that Audi would be impounded and driver ticketed close to $1000 if caught at that speed and passing recklessly on the double yellow lines.
You guys are on Natchez trace. Love that road but it is risky to drive slightly above the limit there.
Yeah, the $1000 federal speeding tickets are a good motivation to chill.
Always good to see a cameo! The SI is legendary
I'm glad that Honda still makes a car like this and still puts a relatively decent effort into it.
It takes zero effort to make the Si. Its a base civic, 2 different front seats, and a manual transmission they have been using for decades.
@@singular9you’re high
@@juelz4516He’s not the 1.5t is trash in the Si
I'm so glad they offer a manual still. I hope we see another 10+ years of manuals on the Si and the Type R. Great car overall and videos with manuals are just more fun.
whats the music at 3:20? It sounds ver good!
This car is plenty quick enough for what it is. People should start appreciating that cars like this exist. If you want to give up driving engagement and character for slightly faster 0-60, then I don’t think you really understand what driving joy is. Just go buy a prius or camry at that point. I’m so thankful to Honda that this car still exists in this day and age.
I like everything but the 1.5 liter 200hp bc I'm a grown man, so I wouldn't buy a new car with a baby engine for $30k+
You guys keep doing better and better with music choice. I feel like it’d be worth saddling up and getting an Elantra N over this.
Nope, won't buy a L15 Engine ever. I wanted a Si back in 2023 and tried to find one but with no luck due to shortage of them at the time. Thank goodness for that, after many and I mean many reports of head gasket failures in the L15 engines. I chose to not buy a 11th Gen Si. I wish that the Type-R's were not $15k over MSRP then that would have been my first option, but Honda being Honda made it so. I choose to buy a used 10th Gen Accord 2.0t to get a proper K20C powered Sedan. Not disappointed in the slightest. I would steer clear of any L15 engines, no matter what. They are seriously flawed due to it being a eco engine with a Turbo.
No way ive literally just the past few days been researching this car and hoping yall would do a review
Thank you!
That’s a nice Accord! Love the Accord, a midsized car.
Accord has been bigger than an ES350 since 2018.
The Civic has been within 2% of the size of a camry for a while.
The corolla and mazda3 are the only true compacts.
It’s worth noting how well these civics handle. My friend has a 2022 Si that we just had at tail of the dragon. It absolutely carved those corners and we were flying through there. Granted he upgraded the terrible all seasons to Indy 500 summer tires. That limited slip diff in these things rips you out of corners
Straight pipes are allergic to specific comparisons and comments. “It’s a good entry level Honda manual”. …What? Jack coming in clutch and actually comparing it to the gli.
This car takes about 2 seconds from the time you put your foot down before it reacts (independently of RPM or "driving mode"). It's a manual that feels sluggish as an auto. Why is no one talking about this?
Honda finally gave the Accord rear air vents. Now it’s time for the Civic.
Its okay they will add them next year, call it a revolutionary upgrade, and charge you 500$.
No, the spoiled kiddys in the back don't need air vents, adding another $20 and 2lbs to the car.
@singular9 well aren't ya a lovely certified Honda hater 😢
The Accord has had rear air vents for a long time now. What are you talking about?
They get them in Europe spec Civics, of course we're the red headed step children so no soup for us.
It does not feel expensive inside. It feels just about where every car in its class and price-point feel. Honda did not "un-shitbox" the compact economy car with all that thin and cheap plastic, everywhere.
And the thin seats
Should have been based on the hatchback from its launch back in 22
As soon as you said "with some Canadians" it made my day
we're now at 30k before fees and taxes for a tiny, 200 horsepower Honda Civic with a stick shift...
So let's say after taxes/fees, 34k out the door. Let's assume great credit, approved for a basic 60 month loan at 8 percent interest.
Most people right now are broke, so no down payment. That brings you to basically $700 a month, BEFORE INSURANCE, for a HONDA CIVIC.
Not a luxury car, not an Accord, a 200 horsepower, stick shift Honda CIVIC. Who is this affordable for? Someone making 6 figures?
Agree. 2002 I financed a new truck 502 a mo .I was making good money but hardly seemed worth it
I work in an engineering firm and most of us are driving normal boring cars like this while all making six figures many are just driving old trucks or older sporty cars.
The ones who drive expensive vehicles are either in debt or doing "financing". Which means legally stealing peoples money.
Yep, I’m mid 6 figure and it’s my daily driver. I had an S60 recharge which was fast but too boring. This is much more engaging and cheaper to maintain. Plus in 5 years it’ll be worth more than my old S60.
I would argue that broke people without a down payment have no business walking into a Honda dealership and financing a brand new Civic SI. They should be either, using public transportation, buying cheap used cars or buying lower trim econo cars like the cheapest Corolla or Nissan Sentra they can find.
Love the crossover with TSP guys.
Brings back memories of HS, crammed in the back seat of my buddy’s SI, freezing bc he’s chain smoking with the window down in winter, trying to find a party to hit up.
😂
These cars, in person, are enormous. I could stack two of MR-S convertibles with the top down and I don't think it would be as tall as the roof line.
99-00 still the best generation.
The Recipe for 300 HP Si:
Cold air intake system
High-performance downpipe and front pipe
Front mount intercooler kit
Drop-in turbocharger upgrade
Tuning solution like Hondata or KTuner
Clutch kit (for manual transaxles)
Optional (nice to have/might need)
Flex-fuel kit😊😊😊
These cars love ethanol and it's a great way to add power. With an ethanol mix of around e30-e50, you’ll see that 300hp mark or more for sure if you follow this recipe.
THAT’S THE LIST. WELCOME TO THE 300HP CLUB! 😊
The cross over with straight pipes is chefs kiss