I think this is excellent. Fergal Keane is a class act. Some comments say it is biased , but I think he is just re-appraising some of the things he would have been taught as an Irish catholic .
I see that there are various opinions of this documentary. However, as an American with Irish ancestry on my father's side this documentary series offers a pretty fascinating insight into the more distant aspects of Irish history for me which I knew little to nothing about. If anyone can recommend other Irish documentaries that are high quality I would be happy to know about them. Thanks!
Lynette Komidar Yes there is something very invigorating about researching one's roots and then drawing one's own conclusion. I also have Norwegian, German and Polish blood too. I have yet to watch those documentaries! ;)
+John Henry Sheridan , Just type in Ireland and you'll get a slew of videos.. This series makes the English seem benign.. I started this one thimking It was about the events from the "Book of Invasions''.. There are a great number of books on the subject as well..
An excellent posting for the education of any one outside of Ireland on the truth of the oppression of the forces of Great Britain. However, we now stand a nation, a republic, a EU member and all is well.
The Conquest of Ireland arguably wasn’t fully completed until the Act of Union in 1800 when the Kingdom of Ireland (after centuries of constitutional and regime changes) was forcibly merged into the British state (though our civil service and courts remained separate, and we retained our legislative representatives). Those representatives forced to sit in London instead of Dublin, but went back to Ireland in 1919 and declared independence in a reconstituted Irish Parliament (copying the Hungarian walkout of the Austrian parliament in the 1860s). European history is very complicated
It is worth noting this is from BBC Northern Ireland, so any perceived bias is pro-British rather than pro-English (which is somewhat refreshing given the reflexive anti-British bias of all sources outside the UK). Unionists are no less legitimately Irish than republicans
@@conlaiarla when's the next Crusade Sir? My blade is thirsty for some blood, I'm Irish (among a handful of other things) by blood and Viking by belief and blood as well from what I've been told. The Irish part of my heritage comes from Dublin before my family relocated here to America in 1803, that much I do know for sure from the paperwork that's been passed down to me. Back to topic tho, my blade is still thirsty so I'm eager to quench it's thirst and quell my bloodlust
@@galoglaich3281 I did not mean that they were primitive, but that there was almost no state, barely a feudal one. British plans destroyed what was unique and fascinating about Ireland. Perhaps you can rebuild that some day 🍀
@@Crafty_Spirit It was a clan based society ,but before the norman invasion there was also over kingdoms , provincial kingdoms and high kings ,there was the brehon laws.At this time it was mostly clans due the desruption caused by invasions however previous to that there were kingdoms and they were people like brian boru and his grandson muirteach who could be considered kings of ireland not just high king which was more of an honorary position. As regards rebuilding decentralised structures like that,its badly needed the republic of ireland is becoming hugely dublin centric to the detriment of smaller cities and rural areas.
@@galoglaich3281 Thanks mate. I'm from Switzerland and visited Ireland around 5 years ago. Lovely atmosphere and people, and Dublin is a fun place. But I believe you instantely that it's too centralised. What bothers me personally most is that though the nature is beautiful, it is a far cry from what it was. I really miss forests and landscapes untouched by human hands. Many people imagine Switzerland to be beautiful, but it's the same shit: everything is too cultivated, there is barely real wildlife left.
@@Crafty_Spirit small world i have a sister and two nephews in switzerland i have been over a few times.The forests are beautiful over there ,but that doesn't mean there is anything in it,its called empty forest syndrome.They are more forests than ireland and more natural,but one thing i notice when ever i go over there , the landscape looks like a giant golf course very manicured.
thank you so much one of my ancestors is Edmond Ironside the second... to listen to the history and to go through the timeline.. bless you for your work
I agree to some extent. No sooner had the Normans conquered the Saxons, were they out conquering Ireland next. There was no time for assimilation, and the French speaking Normans were not at all English or vice versa, at this time. In going to Ireland, they may have taken some conquered English subjects with them to serve as footmen, but it was a “Norman” invasion of Ireland, not an “English” one. It would take a few hundred years before the line between the ruling Norman elite and the common English subjects would become blurred and the Normans did the exact same thing with the Irish. In fact the Normans were very good at this everywhere they went it seems. After a few hundred years the Normans in both Ireland and England faded away into a class of nobility, as opposed to separate ppl, from their subjects. By this time the situation just involved into a more black and white view of England occupying Ireland, though the reality is more complicated. I find that most historians writing or talking about the Norman invasion of Ireland, very quickly go from referring to them as Normans, to referring to them as English which tends to be confusing for casual learners. As I’ve said, the transformation of Normans into English was a more gradual and complicated process, than is usually acknowledged, and it was happening simultaneously with the “old” Normans who originally came to Ireland under Strongbow.
Since they had a weapon, peoples have conquered each other, going from conquered to conquerors and vice versa many times throughout history, but at some point the ax is buried. The only ones that do not stop conquering are religions.
So the normans "set up grand houses on the best land" and established settlements in the population centres and Ireland "was transformed" and then the expert says with a straght face that "the most characteristically Irish traits are English..." whoa! then they list Parliament and some other INSTITUTIONS (not traits) ... can't hardly tell this is from BBC/Ulster ...
Ever hear of ''Northern Ireland, Ulster''.? I believe the plantation began with James I.. It certainly was at it's worst under Oliver Cromwell.. The monarchs did not promote the plantation, They conducted it.. Protestants, mainly Scots were given land in Ireland.. Land that was stolen from the native Irish Catholics and some Norman Irish.. Effects?, the subjugation of Catholic Ireland.. The effects are still being felt today and will be as long as there is an English presence in Ireland.. Murder, mayhem, disenfranchisement, attempted genocide, etc... .
basically it was an attempt at putting from england and scotland loyal to the british throne (i.e. planting them) in the north of ireland but that killing hundreds if not thousands of native irish and stealing their lands (a form of ethnic ethnic cleansing if you like.). This was spearheaded by the infamous Oliver Cromwell who very famously stated "to hell or to Connaught." basically meaning that "you can either die or relocate "
Can someone please tell me the soundtrack to this series. In particular the tune at the opening. They play throughout. It's strings at the beginning and again for the chorus with drums in between. I can't get it out of my head.
It's a version of 'the morning dew' The Chieftains do a couple of great versions of it. One live on stage in black and white, and another on a recorded album
Did you know that Muslims saved the Irish from starvation? In 1845, the Great Famine began in Ireland, killing more than a million people. Ottoman sultan Abdul-Mejid announced his intention to send 10,000 pounds sterling to Irish farmers, but Queen Victoria asked him to send only 1,000 pounds, since she sent 2000 herself. Sultan did just that, but secretly sent 3 more vessels with food. Despite the obstacles in the form of English ships, the then "flotilla of freedom" reached the port and brought food. (Note that in 1845, 10,000 pounds cost about 800,000 pounds or $ 1,683,280. On the other hand, the queen donated about 160,000 pounds, or $ 3,6656). In gratitude, the Irish people are very sympathetic to the Turks, especially in Drogheda. According to one of the versions, it is in gratitude that a crescent moon and a star appeared on the Droghed's coat of arms.
The little-known story of how Turkey was one of the only countries to come to the aid of Ireland during the Great Hunger will be the focus of a movie, “Famine.”Famine” is scheduled for release later this year and is written and directed by Omer Sarikaya, along with Tipperary-born screenwriter Norina Mackey. Sarikaya fell in love with this story, which was mentioned by Joyce in "Ulysses," "Even the Grand Turk sent us his piastres. But the Sassenach tried to starve the nation at home while the land was full of crops that the British hyenas bought and sold in Rio de Janeiro."
Basically. The irony. Ireland was seen to be pulling away from Rome’s way of doing things so they pushed for an invasion. Later when England, Wales and Scotland pulled away from Rome they pushed for an invasion of Great Britain. It’s a complex history. And VERY ironic.
Wow, almost completely ignored Edward and Robert Bruce. How close to changing history, if the Irish Kings hadn't been fighting among themselves, and well the famine too.
There's ony so much you can put into a documentary like this and even then you're not going everything 100% right. You also need to bear in mind that research also changes over time.
I think documentaries have no borders, seeing so many Irishman commenting here about their resentment towards the English, i do feel that’s a bit narrow minded, it is not like they glorified their invasion in the video, it is a good documentary
This is a great doc so far but I feel I must point this out incase it is confusing anybody. It is incorrect to call it a “Norman Empire”. The Normans were more like adventurers, who went out to go carve out personal kingdoms/dukedoms etc, for themselves and were not doing so for a greater Norman empire. These independent Norman realms were almost as likely to go to war with each other, as they were with anybody else. It was not an empire with a capitol and an emperor, who administered it. The Duke in Normandy had no say in what the Normans in Italy were doing for instance. They were making their own kingdom down there and answered to nobody back home. Just as the Gauls(random comparison) never had an empire, neither did the Normans. The Normans certainly did understand warfare though, and were a very marshal and warlike people who were extremely expert in military concerns. Their were just too many independent minded Normans for them ever to tolerate being part of any empire. Norman or not.
"...where there are Irish there's bound to be fighting and when there's no fighting it's Ireland no more! ...where there are Irish there's memory undying, and when we forget, it's Ireland no more! ...where there are Irish there's loving and fighting, and when we stop either, it's Ireland no more" R.Kipling
Rented this from the library. Keane keeps talking over the experts at times and others just cuts the clip to have the last word. While there is some clearly an English slant, there seems to be an even larger pro-Ulster slant. In modern times Ulster seems to be more and more culturally disconnected to Ireland at least as a modern consciousness. This is a good jumping point for actual and further research or at least to get a very loose outline. The etching illustrator really knocked it out of the park. The music kinda sucks in some places and feels disconnected. Keane comes across as a tool.
@wexfordindy what exactly are you trying to refute? lol ? Wexford didn't have a viking influence for about 300 years ?? Calling it an English city is disingenuous
For a Canadian anything historical would be interesting! We don't even study our own history (except the history of bad treatment of our First Nations people). We study US history, lol.
Okay fine but you can't just mix the Anglo-Saxons and the Normans, yeah there was a weird time of intermarriage but let's be real, these people doing the conquering are Normans. Englishmen did not have any type of power at this time, not until the Hundred Years' War.
@MrNorthernSol there's a lot of this "not English but Norman" going on here ... it was well after the Norman invasion and the troops were English and Welsh and the regime imposed was much more tyrannical than anything the English had to accept - so it's a distinction without a difference - if you're telling a history of Ireland (not a history of England) - which is what this (BBC) series misleadingly purports to be.
MrNorthernSol - not according to your opponent here - who said it was legal to murder an Irishman under the Norman occupation? But I’m no expert for sure. Interesting argument and I’m very familiar with British air brushing of history so it would pay you and your countrymen to acknowledge a few things in passing.
@MrNorthernSol erm it is @thedirtyfecker of course. Great that you acknowledge your history - of course it isn't all bad or even mostly bad, but the way you go on i had you pegged with the Japanese as refusing to own up to past crimes. The way i see it (from Australia - Anglo Irish ancestors so a foot in both camps, so to speak) is from the Irish point of view all invaders and oppressors are kinda the same - and for you to say that the AngloSaxons weren't really there as part of the Norman invasion is missing the point - the Anglo has been the common denominator of much of their misery over the years (is it 800 ? is that too much for you? it isn't your history to critique...). To play the "victim mentality" card is just playing to type as the heartless, cruel Englander - it does you or your country no favours. Best to buck up, stiff up lip etc and just own up to the brutal, systematic, legalistic, greedy, callous actions of your governments, businesses and aristocracy of the past. You'll never win this one and nor should you - it's a disgrace and a shame on the country of England and the UK. You might be right about the Protestant/Catholic thing and you're better informed than me on the specifics of the history - but you're making a distinction without a difference when it comes to the Norman/Anglo thing in my opinion. The problem is you think the Irish people on this comment thread should honour the history of England when what they (and I) are doing is honouring the history of Ireland, which was the stated topic of this flawed BBC series (made by BBC Ulster).
@MrNorthernSol have to admit i'm appalled by the violence of the Irish civil strife in the early 20th century and i'm not a student of their history - but for better or worse the Brits did run much of the world for many years and they (those people at the time - not modern Brits) will be judged for their actions. I'm reading much at present about the Irish migrations to Victoria in the mid-19th century and the social conditions of Catholics on the island, as brought about by British policy, is stunning in its depravity. There is a Disney Land version of Irish victim/history that no doubt you are very aware of, however there's Disney Land history for every country and there's plenty of gauzy Brits who tell themselves soothing lies about their country. I've been interested in doing the Ancestry.com thing this year and it tells me that 65pc of my background is from Munster ... so i'm keen to learn more about this part of the world - the balance is Scottish and English so it behooves me to try and stay even handed. Reading this comment thread has been more balanced than watching the BBC series, i would say. All the best.
The rule that always works in all relationships throughout the ages. In this short video we consider a story that happened in a very interesting time - in times of the Virgin Queen Elizabeth I, whose exceptional reign has been called The Golden Age of England: th-cam.com/video/VgD-o6GMv90/w-d-xo.html
Anyone with a good knowledge of Irish history can see how this video has been edited by showing simply snaps of statements being made by Irish historians. It is like a Ladybird book of Irish history or a tabloid newspaper providing quotes totally out of context. The part where they refer to the Irish being naked and throwing stones is taken completely out of context and with supporting explanation of who is giving the account or even Irish tactics or any information at all for that matter. It is just two snippets of a mans sentence. The whole series is like that. Most of these 'accounts' were given by Gerald of Wales who didn't even arrive in Ireland until 11 years later and his book makes very amusing reading to anyone who actually goes to the bother of learning their history instead of watching TH-cam :) The idea of being 'naked' should be taken in a Norman context. Being bare chested would be considered to be naked and without wearing mail or armour. Warriors went barefoot in order to maintain balance and grip during combat. Not because they never seen a slippery leather shoe before! Anyone who thinks Irish men did not wear clothes has obviously never sampled our weather. What a joke!
@MrNorthernSol Every scene is selectively edited by answering particular questions without giving them context. The whole thing is spliced together to tell a particular story in a particular way. If you knew your history well you would see that a mile off. But then, you probably have a biased agenda of your own don't you? I could spot that a mile off too...
@MrNorthernSol You sound like a child. "I certainly beat you"? I didn't engage with you because you want a bigoted argument. No bigotry here, just accurate commentary. Have a nice day.
Yes they are. I have only had two dogs my whole life because they live very long because we take very good care of our pets so when they pass away we cremate them and have the ashes placed in wooden boxes. Those boxes are going in the dirt with me.
OSTARAEB4 Well, I don't find that insulting at all. Dogs are awesome and much better than people. I would find it insulting to be buried next to a strange person.
5:20 "The crucial difference was, the people he went to were the most organized military power, in the medieval west". Surely that title would go to the Holy Roman Empire?
At that time Normans was main power in western Europe. Also they were very dangerous for Byzantines also. They destroyed Roman Empire (Byzantine Empire) in Italy.
@MrNorthernSol True.. The Holy Roman Empire is the successor to/evolution of the Roman Empire.. It ruled the royal houses of Europe.. In a way it still does.. Read your history.. A Roman emperor created the Holy Roman Church and made it one with the Roman Empire..
@MrNorthernSol Didn't say that.. Henry VIII took care of that problem and his daughters and James I made it into a disaster.. Look at how it continued to control Europe until very recent times.. Remember the Crusades, extermination of the Cathars, and the Inquisition,? All compliments of the Holy Roman Church..
Bman Chu I disagree. I am of considerable import and I give a considerable shit. It is clear that somebody of precisely no import is providing no shit, in which case his giving/failing to give a shit is of no consequence.
Actually no! This BBC documentary has been selectively edited to portray facts in the most acceptable way for the British public. Diarmaid Mc Murough did not invite the Normans to Ireland. He hired them as mercenaries. Their price was land and the city of Wexford. However, as the mission got underway, with the original goal being to put Diarmuid back into power in Leinster, the Normans decided to continue and seize power in Ireland for themselves. As soon as they had taken Wexford and Waterford they moved on Dublin and Diarmuid madea deal with the Norse of Dublin who he he took submission from. When the Normans heard this they attacked Dublin anyway and took the city. After that the Normans were just on full conquest. Henry the 2 was not welcomed to Ireland as portrayed in this video. He took the submission of Irish kings who were not kitted out to fight his army of over 4,000 men. Submission was common politics and never lasted long in Irish politics. It is a far more complicated story than how it is portrayed here and this video is the most biased and clearly selectively edited piece of shit I have ever seen.
Vc my Linage comes from the Norman invasion of Ireland in 1300 AD , some king of Dublin (forget the persons name)invited the Normans to help overthrow a rival king , and gain loyalty from said king, and that's that period of history, filled with dynastic rivalries ectara (my view of this will be different from the status quo) the Normans brought over better methods of education, stone castles, a new class system, strengthened Catholicism in Ireland but really over time those Normans would integrate in Irish society, like I don't understand those people who say its a negative thing, of course it caused all these problems generations later, blah blah, to them I say its 2019 were in better society how about you stop dwelling on things that happened in the past, (its a bit weird for me) , anyway I like Poms and Irish people, I wish they'd get over their abusive relation ship with each other move on ands come to each others aid in times of need
www.sceala.com/phpBB2/irish-forums-25331.html A good review of this very 'show' from a Irish person who unlike Keane actually studied history and does not write for pay
*Question/Comment for those whom studied Irish History:* (From the perspective of an individual with a Degree/Major in: Journalism, Sociology, and *History.* Very Irish, of Kerry and Cork lineage, USA born and educated, University of Memphis, and currently Post Grad Ancient History studies, Yale University) *Why does this Host, noticeably go out of his way to stress his points in defense of Dermot and the King of England?* ...and it is clear there is an unmistakable attitude, noticably arrogant at several points thus far, and I gather his attitude has a disdain towards some Irish position, while clearly pro-English/British position. Now, I am of the mind that "Victims remain Victims as long as they think of themselves as a Victim, continue to carry negative feelings/anger/pain "baggage" towards their Abuser(s), and only truly are Free of Abuse, Victim Status, and able to fully live their Life Journey with positive experiences and achieving desires when they Apply Conscious Thoughts towards a Higher Minded Thoughts, releasing the energies around the subject, and establishing a level of Indifference towards their Abuser. (The opposite of love is not hate, hate has emotion/negative energies that affect those whom carry it. Indifference is a state of Balance and Harmony in this perspective, neither wishing one negative nor positive, rather absent of energies on the subject. It is from this position One is able to truly forgive and release the feelings/emotions and realize a higher level of self, a clarity and wellbeing. The healthy achievement that a Trained Therapist works toward with Patient/Victims of Abuse, which would routinely be those whom have experienced abuse due to interaction with an individual of Narcissist Personality Disorder. All Abusers are Narcissists, period. (That Sociology, focus in SocialPsychology, Degree) With this in mind, I remain curious with the Host's message, meaning that of his attitude and points he stresses. *As a result, I find it difficult to accept his interpretation as thorough, Scientific Minded (non-biased), or with authenticity.* On the subject of the Irish running naked into battle, it had zero to do with their socioeconomic status, rather it was an Ancient practice of the Irish, Scotts, and likely a pre-Irish possibly Basque or Celtic tradition. Possibly due to a pre-Christian belief, and most definitely to Intimidate and Off-balance their foes. This was routinely accompanied by Body Painting, usually Red, and blowing Horns or in the case of Irish/Scotts likely a Reeded Horn accompanied by a Bagpipe. It was War Practice, very much like that of many of the USA Native American Tribes. We were Tribes for many years and regardless of the Practice a of the Roman, Anglo/Saxon/Mormon/Viking taught Peoples of England, it is certain the Irish, Scotts, Pics, and Welsh were practicing their own traditions. It scared the Hell out of the Romans, and that's why the built that wall in Northern England. This info from my own studies and it is more authentic and accurate. The Irish need not fell unworthy, rather The Irish need to feel worthy and learn the "Universal Law of Attraction" That's our 🔑 to achieving the Desired. (Quantum Physics) Release the old thoughts, find balance, and focus on the desired. We intelligent know right from wrong, what was stolen, what abuse is, *but that is best realized as a diagnosing, and move forward focusing on the desired.*
Well I've seen this now, an must say, we aren't taught this in English schools - I suppose theres no time for it, as even the dark-ages are ignored, an that's when England was created. Still, the settlers were a bit heavy-handed in the south. I suppose it was jungle to them.
Great series. Thanks so much for posting this.
I think it’s awesome! ❤
All these etchings. So, so well-executed and striking. Good one, BBC.
He was my tutor at college, he designed loads of Irish stamps too. David Rooney
And RTE, it's a co production.
The shores, beaches, banks, ports, harbors, anchors, docks, parkings, and sidelines are all magestic
Great stuff Fergal, I’m watching part 3 after work later this evening! Always loved history.
Thanks Mister Victory
I think this is excellent. Fergal Keane is a class act. Some comments say it is biased , but I think he is just re-appraising some of the things he would have been taught as an Irish catholic .
Bollock, it's a BBC programme
It's a co production with RTE, Ireland''s national TV broadcaster.
Outstanding video
I see that there are various opinions of this documentary. However, as an American with Irish ancestry on my father's side this documentary series offers a pretty fascinating insight into the more distant aspects of Irish history for me which I knew little to nothing about.
If anyone can recommend other Irish documentaries that are high quality I would be happy to know about them. Thanks!
+John Henry Sheridan For me too John. Will be watching many more and coming to my own conclusion
Lynette Komidar Yes there is something very invigorating about researching one's roots and then drawing one's own conclusion. I also have Norwegian, German and Polish blood too. I have yet to watch those documentaries! ;)
me as well, for as an Englishman I knew none of this was going on. PS: sir walter Raleigh founded the 1st English colony in America in 1585.
+John Henry Sheridan , Just type in Ireland and you'll get a slew of videos.. This series makes the English seem benign.. I started this one thimking It was about the events from the "Book of Invasions''.. There are a great number of books on the subject as well..
Thanks Robin!
An excellent posting for the education of any one outside of Ireland on the truth of the oppression of the forces of Great Britain. However, we now stand a nation, a republic, a EU member and all is well.
Thank you .
The Conquest of Ireland arguably wasn’t fully completed until the Act of Union in 1800 when the Kingdom of Ireland (after centuries of constitutional and regime changes) was forcibly merged into the British state (though our civil service and courts remained separate, and we retained our legislative representatives). Those representatives forced to sit in London instead of Dublin, but went back to Ireland in 1919 and declared independence in a reconstituted Irish Parliament (copying the Hungarian walkout of the Austrian parliament in the 1860s).
European history is very complicated
Excellent drawings....thank you.
This composition on 30.47 is a Pertinent1 theme song surely? ...
Simon Schama's A History of Britain explains what Robert the Bruce's brother Edward did in Ireland.
It is worth noting this is from BBC Northern Ireland, so any perceived bias is pro-British rather than pro-English (which is somewhat refreshing given the reflexive anti-British bias of all sources outside the UK). Unionists are no less legitimately Irish than republicans
Nothing pro British about bbcni anymore, don’t kid yourself !! And fergal is hardly hardline unionist, lol
co-produced with RTE dude.
@@royfrancey6058 Fergal's irish from Cork.
That's patently rubbish. The Unionists themselves identify as British but you know better ?
@@conlaiarla when's the next Crusade Sir? My blade is thirsty for some blood, I'm Irish (among a handful of other things) by blood and Viking by belief and blood as well from what I've been told. The Irish part of my heritage comes from Dublin before my family relocated here to America in 1803, that much I do know for sure from the paperwork that's been passed down to me. Back to topic tho, my blade is still thirsty so I'm eager to quench it's thirst and quell my bloodlust
So Norman/English Henry was welcomed into Ireland in 12th century ...... i'll be googling that, thank you very much BBC ....
@MrNorthernSol yup ... and Henry finished the looting operation some time later. Gotta hand it to the English (ok Normans too)
The English are pretty fastinating for invaders. I’m enjoying learning all this history. Thank you for posting the series. 🩷🛡️❤️
YES and they stayed 700 years before we kicked them out..Dermot openeed the door. Look up Ferns in County Wexford... I live 10 mins away from Ferns.
32:55 The Irish were living in the 15th century like the Indoeuropeans around 1500 BC? Crazy... and fascinating
Crafty No they were not,this is all probritish propaganda
@@galoglaich3281 I did not mean that they were primitive, but that there was almost no state, barely a feudal one. British plans destroyed what was unique and fascinating about Ireland. Perhaps you can rebuild that some day 🍀
@@Crafty_Spirit It was a clan based society ,but before the norman invasion there was also over kingdoms , provincial kingdoms and high kings ,there was the brehon laws.At this time it was mostly clans due the desruption caused by invasions however previous to that there were kingdoms and they were people like brian boru and his grandson muirteach who could be considered kings of ireland not just high king which was more of an honorary position.
As regards rebuilding decentralised structures like that,its badly needed the republic of ireland is becoming hugely dublin centric to the detriment of smaller cities and rural areas.
@@galoglaich3281 Thanks mate. I'm from Switzerland and visited Ireland around 5 years ago. Lovely atmosphere and people, and Dublin is a fun place. But I believe you instantely that it's too centralised.
What bothers me personally most is that though the nature is beautiful, it is a far cry from what it was. I really miss forests and landscapes untouched by human hands. Many people imagine Switzerland to be beautiful, but it's the same shit: everything is too cultivated, there is barely real wildlife left.
@@Crafty_Spirit small world i have a sister and two nephews in switzerland i have been over a few times.The forests are beautiful over there ,but that doesn't mean there is anything in it,its called empty forest syndrome.They are more forests than ireland and more natural,but one thing i notice when ever i go over there , the landscape looks like a giant golf course very manicured.
thank you so much one of my ancestors is Edmond Ironside the second... to listen to the history and to go through the timeline.. bless you for your work
I think its a little unfair to regard the early Normans as just English as the English were conquered by them also
I agree to some extent. No sooner had the Normans conquered the Saxons, were they out conquering Ireland next. There was no time for assimilation, and the French speaking Normans were not at all English or vice versa, at this time.
In going to Ireland, they may have taken some conquered English subjects with them to serve as footmen, but it was a “Norman” invasion of Ireland, not an “English” one.
It would take a few hundred years before the line between the ruling Norman elite and the common English subjects would become blurred and the Normans did the exact same thing with the Irish. In fact the Normans were very good at this everywhere they went it seems.
After a few hundred years the Normans in both Ireland and England faded away into a class of nobility, as opposed to separate ppl, from their subjects.
By this time the situation just involved into a more black and white view of England occupying Ireland, though the reality is more complicated.
I find that most historians writing or talking about the Norman invasion of Ireland, very quickly go from referring to them as Normans, to referring to them as English which tends to be confusing for casual learners.
As I’ve said, the transformation of Normans into English was a more gradual and complicated process, than is usually acknowledged, and it was happening simultaneously with the “old” Normans who originally came to Ireland under Strongbow.
Since they had a weapon, peoples have conquered each other, going from conquered to conquerors and vice versa many times throughout history, but at some point the ax is buried. The only ones that do not stop conquering are religions.
So the normans "set up grand houses on the best land" and established settlements in the population centres and Ireland "was transformed" and then the expert says with a straght face that "the most characteristically Irish traits are English..." whoa! then they list Parliament and some other INSTITUTIONS (not traits) ... can't hardly tell this is from BBC/Ulster ...
seonin traitors...
Hhhh
@blue skies "Bheatha" means "life" ?
@@Bigglesworthicus "seonin" ?
Pretty propagandist, but what do you expect of BBC...
Can anyone tell me what the music is in the opening? (Not the Russian Hurdy-Gurdy Uzh...) but this particular recording with the drums etc.Thanks!
What were the plantations of Ireland? Which English monarchs promoted the plantations in Ireland? What effects did this process have on the Irish?
Ever hear of ''Northern Ireland, Ulster''.? I believe the plantation began with James I.. It certainly was at it's worst under Oliver Cromwell.. The monarchs did not promote the plantation, They conducted it.. Protestants, mainly Scots were given land in Ireland.. Land that was stolen from the native Irish Catholics and some Norman Irish.. Effects?, the subjugation of Catholic Ireland.. The effects are still being felt today and will be as long as there is an English presence in Ireland.. Murder, mayhem, disenfranchisement, attempted genocide, etc... .
basically it was an attempt at putting from england and scotland loyal to the british throne (i.e. planting them) in the north of ireland but that killing hundreds if not thousands of native irish and stealing their lands (a form of ethnic ethnic cleansing
if you like.). This was spearheaded by the infamous Oliver Cromwell who very famously stated "to hell or to Connaught." basically meaning that "you can either die or relocate "
the plantations occured all over Ireland.
I need to find part 1, first.
th-cam.com/video/Jb11KxSGQpk/w-d-xo.html
Can someone please tell me the soundtrack to this series. In particular the tune at the opening. They play throughout. It's strings at the beginning and again for the chorus with drums in between.
I can't get it out of my head.
th-cam.com/video/_DX08nQows0/w-d-xo.html
Thanks, but do you know this particular version? With that drum etc
I have to do this for homework
30:50 what is this tune? Please? anyone?
wish I knew, would also like to know who made the woodcut prints
'The Morning Dew', in an arrangement similar but not identical to the one on 'The Chieftains 4'
What is that tune that plays in the prologue before title credits?
th-cam.com/video/_DX08nQows0/w-d-xo.html
Very recommendable
unusual stories
Can anyone tell me what the song at 30:55 might be?
It's a version of 'the morning dew' The Chieftains do a couple of great versions of it. One live on stage in black and white, and another on a recorded album
Did you know that Muslims saved the Irish from starvation?
In 1845, the Great Famine began in Ireland, killing more than a million people. Ottoman sultan Abdul-Mejid announced his intention to send 10,000 pounds sterling to Irish farmers, but Queen Victoria asked him to send only 1,000 pounds, since she sent 2000 herself. Sultan did just that, but secretly sent 3 more vessels with food. Despite the obstacles in the form of English ships, the then "flotilla of freedom" reached the port and brought food.
(Note that in 1845, 10,000 pounds cost about 800,000 pounds or $ 1,683,280. On the other hand, the queen donated about 160,000 pounds, or $ 3,6656).
In gratitude, the Irish people are very sympathetic to the Turks, especially in Drogheda. According to one of the versions, it is in gratitude that a crescent moon and a star appeared on the Droghed's coat of arms.
The little-known story of how Turkey was one of the only countries to come to the aid of Ireland during the Great Hunger will be the focus of a movie, “Famine.”Famine” is scheduled for release later this year and is written and directed by Omer Sarikaya, along with Tipperary-born screenwriter Norina Mackey.
Sarikaya fell in love with this story, which was mentioned by Joyce in "Ulysses," "Even the Grand Turk sent us his piastres. But the Sassenach tried to starve the nation at home while the land was full of crops that the British hyenas bought and sold in Rio de Janeiro."
Did you know that the Turks named a street after Bobby Sands.? It dead-ends at the British embassy..
Honestly I never knew about that. Fascinating. And I did wonder before how Drogheda got their Eastern-looking crest.
Holy shit. Nobody tells you that.
Do unto others before they do unto you?
Never goes away !
Too cynical to be useful - great way to start a blood feud - ask the Mafia.
Hilarious captions: County Carry, Monster rebels.
Any chance your in Ireland bro?
Who else had to watch this for history class?
Free Ireland! Free Scotland!Free Wales! Free World!!! Crush UK!!!
i say that's awfully extreme
I'm finding the comments even more interesting than this videod documentary.
So Henry II colluded with the Pope to extend Romes Catholic empire into Ireland
Basically. The irony. Ireland was seen to be pulling away from Rome’s way of doing things so they pushed for an invasion. Later when England, Wales and Scotland pulled away from Rome they pushed for an invasion of Great Britain. It’s a complex history. And VERY ironic.
Wow, almost completely ignored Edward and Robert Bruce. How close to changing history, if the Irish Kings hadn't been fighting among themselves, and well the famine too.
There's ony so much you can put into a documentary like this and even then you're not going everything 100% right. You also need to bear in mind that research also changes over time.
Famine? That happened long after.
Agree serious omission - if Edward Bruce had not died in Ulster Irish Identity would have been different - ask Sean Duffy of Trinity College Dublin.
@@noodlyappendage6729 There's been more than one Famine in Ireland under British rule hence why the one in 1845 was the "Great Famine"
BBC'S story of Ireland, their story, presented by their irishman,
I think documentaries have no borders, seeing so many Irishman commenting here about their resentment towards the English, i do feel that’s a bit narrow minded, it is not like they glorified their invasion in the video, it is a good documentary
Get used to it the English are despised the world over I’m Scottish my mum was Irish ☘️ NEVER BRITISH
@@carolinelees8561 You're British.
@@benerdick_cumberbiatch Nope I write in my forums white Scottish bc it’s allowed . I also hold one passport an IRISH ONE .
@@carolinelees8561 🤠
This is a great doc so far but I feel I must point this out incase it is confusing anybody.
It is incorrect to call it a “Norman Empire”.
The Normans were more like adventurers, who went out to go carve out personal kingdoms/dukedoms etc, for themselves and were not doing so for a greater Norman empire.
These independent Norman realms were almost as likely to go to war with each other, as they were with anybody else.
It was not an empire with a capitol and an emperor, who administered it. The Duke in Normandy had no say in what the Normans in Italy were doing for instance. They were making their own kingdom down there and answered to nobody back home.
Just as the Gauls(random comparison) never had an empire, neither did the Normans.
The Normans certainly did understand warfare though, and were a very marshal and warlike people who were extremely expert in military concerns.
Their were just too many independent minded Normans for them ever to tolerate being part of any empire. Norman or not.
Good to see them not blaming the English for everything
"...where there are Irish there's bound to be fighting and when there's no fighting it's Ireland no more!
...where there are Irish there's memory undying, and when we forget, it's Ireland no more!
...where there are Irish there's loving and fighting, and when we stop either, it's Ireland no more" R.Kipling
The same man that called Ireland (a pernicious little bitch of a country)
Rented this from the library. Keane keeps talking over the experts at times and others just cuts the clip to have the last word. While there is some clearly an English slant, there seems to be an even larger pro-Ulster slant. In modern times Ulster seems to be more and more culturally disconnected to Ireland at least as a modern consciousness. This is a good jumping point for actual and further research or at least to get a very loose outline. The etching illustrator really knocked it out of the park. The music kinda sucks in some places and feels disconnected. Keane comes across as a tool.
18:25 - 18:35 - Sounds like practically every priest I’ve ever known...
right good then, idn't it?
" Waterford for all intents and purposes is an English city " Vikings never set foot in Ireland ? I'm confused...
REALLY? Best check your history. Have you ever been to Ireland. ?
@wexfordindy what exactly are you trying to refute? lol ? Wexford didn't have a viking influence for about 300 years ?? Calling it an English city is disingenuous
@@uninteresting1212 I agree...100%
👍👍.
4:15
(Dermot's father was) "murdered and buried with a dead dog. A humiliating mark of disrespect."
I think the murder was disrespectful enough.
For a Canadian anything historical would be interesting! We don't even study our own history (except the history of bad treatment of our First Nations people). We study US history, lol.
Good luck, we'll see how you survive -20...
phuck ewe , Don't forget their diamonds..
..you've been watching too much Star Trek.
Watch brave new world by William Crawley, Ulster’s connection to Canada,
Don't know what rock you've been living under, but as a Canadian, Canadian history was extensively covered during my junior high school years.
Europe's mightiest empire? normans were all divided not a one nation
Okay fine but you can't just mix the Anglo-Saxons and the Normans, yeah there was a weird time of intermarriage but let's be real, these people doing the conquering are Normans. Englishmen did not have any type of power at this time, not until the Hundred Years' War.
@MrNorthernSol there's a lot of this "not English but Norman" going on here ... it was well after the Norman invasion and the troops were English and Welsh and the regime imposed was much more tyrannical than anything the English had to accept - so it's a distinction without a difference - if you're telling a history of Ireland (not a history of England) - which is what this (BBC) series misleadingly purports to be.
MrNorthernSol - not according to your opponent here - who said it was legal to murder an Irishman under the Norman occupation? But I’m no expert for sure. Interesting argument and I’m very familiar with British air brushing of history so it would pay you and your countrymen to acknowledge a few things in passing.
@MrNorthernSol erm it is @thedirtyfecker of course. Great that you acknowledge your history - of course it isn't all bad or even mostly bad, but the way you go on i had you pegged with the Japanese as refusing to own up to past crimes. The way i see it (from Australia - Anglo Irish ancestors so a foot in both camps, so to speak) is from the Irish point of view all invaders and oppressors are kinda the same - and for you to say that the AngloSaxons weren't really there as part of the Norman invasion is missing the point - the Anglo has been the common denominator of much of their misery over the years (is it 800 ? is that too much for you? it isn't your history to critique...). To play the "victim mentality" card is just playing to type as the heartless, cruel Englander - it does you or your country no favours. Best to buck up, stiff up lip etc and just own up to the brutal, systematic, legalistic, greedy, callous actions of your governments, businesses and aristocracy of the past. You'll never win this one and nor should you - it's a disgrace and a shame on the country of England and the UK. You might be right about the Protestant/Catholic thing and you're better informed than me on the specifics of the history - but you're making a distinction without a difference when it comes to the Norman/Anglo thing in my opinion. The problem is you think the Irish people on this comment thread should honour the history of England when what they (and I) are doing is honouring the history of Ireland, which was the stated topic of this flawed BBC series (made by BBC Ulster).
@MrNorthernSol have to admit i'm appalled by the violence of the Irish civil strife in the early 20th century and i'm not a student of their history - but for better or worse the Brits did run much of the world for many years and they (those people at the time - not modern Brits) will be judged for their actions. I'm reading much at present about the Irish migrations to Victoria in the mid-19th century and the social conditions of Catholics on the island, as brought about by British policy, is stunning in its depravity. There is a Disney Land version of Irish victim/history that no doubt you are very aware of, however there's Disney Land history for every country and there's plenty of gauzy Brits who tell themselves soothing lies about their country. I've been interested in doing the Ancestry.com thing this year and it tells me that 65pc of my background is from Munster ... so i'm keen to learn more about this part of the world - the balance is Scottish and English so it behooves me to try and stay even handed. Reading this comment thread has been more balanced than watching the BBC series, i would say. All the best.
@MrNorthernSol ok thanks
16:22 - an said by an Irishman !!
The rule that always works in all relationships throughout the ages. In this short video we consider a story that happened in a very interesting time - in times of the Virgin Queen Elizabeth I, whose exceptional reign has been called The Golden Age of England: th-cam.com/video/VgD-o6GMv90/w-d-xo.html
Tóg go réidh é! Ní raibh gnéas acu le chéile, ach ag pógadh 🙄.
this docu is so english-biased it hurts!
What do you mean? Where? How? I don't disagree, just wonder what you base your statement upon.
a little but not too much. tho I guess the clearings were meant create farmland at any cost.
seems just modern PC biased to me
Anyone with a good knowledge of Irish history can see how this video has been edited by showing simply snaps of statements being made by Irish historians. It is like a Ladybird book of Irish history or a tabloid newspaper providing quotes totally out of context. The part where they refer to the Irish being naked and throwing stones is taken completely out of context and with supporting explanation of who is giving the account or even Irish tactics or any information at all for that matter. It is just two snippets of a mans sentence. The whole series is like that. Most of these 'accounts' were given by Gerald of Wales who didn't even arrive in Ireland until 11 years later and his book makes very amusing reading to anyone who actually goes to the bother of learning their history instead of watching TH-cam :) The idea of being 'naked' should be taken in a Norman context. Being bare chested would be considered to be naked and without wearing mail or armour. Warriors went barefoot in order to maintain balance and grip during combat. Not because they never seen a slippery leather shoe before! Anyone who thinks Irish men did not wear clothes has obviously never sampled our weather. What a joke!
Jack Beanstalk Nope, just informed.
This is not a good and accurate documentary about Ireland.
I'm curious as to why you think so?
@MrNorthernSol Every scene is selectively edited by answering particular questions without giving them context. The whole thing is spliced together to tell a particular story in a particular way. If you knew your history well you would see that a mile off. But then, you probably have a biased agenda of your own don't you? I could spot that a mile off too...
@MrNorthernSol You answered my question :) Toodle pip...
@MrNorthernSol Too late. You beat me to it buddy. :)
@MrNorthernSol You sound like a child. "I certainly beat you"? I didn't engage with you because you want a bigoted argument. No bigotry here, just accurate commentary. Have a nice day.
Why is it humiliating to be buried with a dead dog? When did animals become so low?? Especially dogs. They are very special creatures.
Yes they are. I have only had two dogs my whole life because they live very long because we take very good care of our pets so when they pass away we cremate them and have the ashes placed in wooden boxes. Those boxes are going in the dirt with me.
Bman Chu How do you feel about communism?
Bman Chu This is true but I think some socialism is good. We need more of it in America.
+Heaven is a dirt nap -To be buried with a dead dog is considered a high insult in Irish culture.
OSTARAEB4 Well, I don't find that insulting at all. Dogs are awesome and much better than people. I would find it insulting to be buried next to a strange person.
Free Ireland
5:20 "The crucial difference was, the people he went to were the most organized military power, in the medieval west".
Surely that title would go to the Holy Roman Empire?
The Roman Empire was dead by then..
Yep. the normans were the top dogs back then.
At that time Normans was main power in western Europe. Also they were very dangerous for Byzantines also. They destroyed Roman Empire (Byzantine Empire) in Italy.
@MrNorthernSol True.. The Holy Roman Empire is the successor to/evolution of the Roman Empire.. It ruled the royal houses of Europe.. In a way it still does.. Read your history.. A Roman emperor created the Holy Roman Church and made it one with the Roman Empire..
@MrNorthernSol Didn't say that.. Henry VIII took care of that problem and his daughters and James I made it into a disaster.. Look at how it continued to control Europe until very recent times.. Remember the Crusades, extermination of the Cathars, and the Inquisition,? All compliments of the Holy Roman Church..
16:10 17:30
i hardly think the irish had no armor and only threw stones during this time period
"Throw the potatoes!"
Thomas de Clare my ancestors burnt his castle down its foundations are below quin abbey
+Nicholas McNamara Ta ionadh orm go bhfuil se fior! GRMA gur duairt tu rud eigin ina thaobh e.
+Bman Chu Liar. I give a considerable shit.
So do I
Bman Chu I disagree. I am of considerable import and I give a considerable shit.
It is clear that somebody of precisely no import is providing no shit, in which case his giving/failing to give a shit is of no consequence.
Bman Chu Your opinion on MY import is of no consequence as is not the issue. Stop trying to change the subject.
BBC and ireland? Automatic thumbs down without viewing.
BBC and RTE--- not just the BBC
@@julianbond9933 Correct except rte has zero class.
So an Irish king invited the anglo-northmen into Ireland - I see, so not just a blatant invasion. [i'll remember that]
One king did to defeat the high king of Ireland at the time.
Actually no! This BBC documentary has been selectively edited to portray facts in the most acceptable way for the British public. Diarmaid Mc Murough did not invite the Normans to Ireland. He hired them as mercenaries. Their price was land and the city of Wexford. However, as the mission got underway, with the original goal being to put Diarmuid back into power in Leinster, the Normans decided to continue and seize power in Ireland for themselves. As soon as they had taken Wexford and Waterford they moved on Dublin and Diarmuid madea deal with the Norse of Dublin who he he took submission from. When the Normans heard this they attacked Dublin anyway and took the city. After that the Normans were just on full conquest. Henry the 2 was not welcomed to Ireland as portrayed in this video. He took the submission of Irish kings who were not kitted out to fight his army of over 4,000 men. Submission was common politics and never lasted long in Irish politics. It is a far more complicated story than how it is portrayed here and this video is the most biased and clearly selectively edited piece of shit I have ever seen.
thedirtyfecker
Vc my Linage comes from the Norman invasion of Ireland in 1300 AD , some king of Dublin (forget the persons name)invited the Normans to help overthrow a rival king , and gain loyalty from said king, and that's that period of history, filled with dynastic rivalries ectara (my view of this will be different from the status quo) the Normans brought over better methods of education, stone castles, a new class system, strengthened Catholicism in Ireland but really over time those Normans would integrate in Irish society, like I don't understand those people who say its a negative thing, of course it caused all these problems generations later, blah blah, to them I say its 2019 were in better society how about you stop dwelling on things that happened in the past, (its a bit weird for me) , anyway I like Poms and Irish people, I wish they'd get over their abusive relation ship with each other move on ands come to each others aid in times of need
@@michaellavings3579 the norman invasion of ireland was actually from around 1169 to 1171.
Relate that to Palastine today
www.sceala.com/phpBB2/irish-forums-25331.html
A good review of this very 'show' from a Irish person who unlike Keane actually studied history and does not write for pay
What stopped RTE making their own History of Ireland ? Or wouldn't that give enough scope for incessant whining ?
The history of Ireland by the BBC 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ffs
Where's the RTE version ? I'm sure it would be far superior to this..?
*Question/Comment for those whom studied Irish History:*
(From the perspective of an individual with a Degree/Major in: Journalism, Sociology, and *History.* Very Irish, of Kerry and Cork lineage, USA born and educated, University of Memphis, and currently Post Grad Ancient History studies, Yale University)
*Why does this Host, noticeably go out of his way to stress his points in defense of Dermot and the King of England?* ...and it is clear there is an unmistakable attitude, noticably arrogant at several points thus far, and I gather his attitude has a disdain towards some Irish position, while clearly pro-English/British position.
Now, I am of the mind that "Victims remain Victims as long as they think of themselves as a Victim, continue to carry negative feelings/anger/pain "baggage" towards their Abuser(s), and only truly are Free of Abuse, Victim Status, and able to fully live their Life Journey with positive experiences and achieving desires when they Apply Conscious Thoughts towards a Higher Minded Thoughts, releasing the energies around the subject, and establishing a level of Indifference towards their Abuser. (The opposite of love is not hate, hate has emotion/negative energies that affect those whom carry it. Indifference is a state of Balance and Harmony in this perspective, neither wishing one negative nor positive, rather absent of energies on the subject.
It is from this position One is able to truly forgive and release the feelings/emotions and realize a higher level of self, a clarity and wellbeing. The healthy achievement that a Trained Therapist works toward with Patient/Victims of Abuse, which would routinely be those whom have experienced abuse due to interaction with an individual of Narcissist Personality Disorder. All Abusers are Narcissists, period.
(That Sociology, focus in SocialPsychology, Degree)
With this in mind, I remain curious with the Host's message, meaning that of his attitude and points he stresses.
*As a result, I find it difficult to accept his interpretation as thorough, Scientific Minded (non-biased), or with authenticity.*
On the subject of the Irish running naked into battle, it had zero to do with their socioeconomic status, rather it was an Ancient practice of the Irish, Scotts, and likely a pre-Irish possibly Basque or Celtic tradition. Possibly due to a pre-Christian belief, and most definitely to Intimidate and Off-balance their foes.
This was routinely accompanied by Body Painting, usually Red, and blowing Horns or in the case of Irish/Scotts likely a Reeded Horn accompanied by a Bagpipe.
It was War Practice, very much like that of many of the USA Native American Tribes.
We were Tribes for many years and regardless of the Practice a of the Roman, Anglo/Saxon/Mormon/Viking taught Peoples of England, it is certain the Irish, Scotts, Pics, and Welsh were practicing their own traditions.
It scared the Hell out of the Romans, and that's why the built that wall in Northern England.
This info from my own studies and it is more authentic and accurate.
The Irish need not fell unworthy, rather The Irish need to feel worthy and learn the "Universal Law of Attraction"
That's our 🔑 to achieving the Desired. (Quantum Physics)
Release the old thoughts, find balance, and focus on the desired.
We intelligent know right from wrong, what was stolen, what abuse is, *but that is best realized as a diagnosing, and move forward focusing on the desired.*
Sorry ! Lost the Will to Live halfway through...
Well I've seen this now, an must say, we aren't taught this in English schools - I suppose theres no time for it, as even the dark-ages are ignored, an that's when England was created. Still, the settlers were a bit heavy-handed in the south. I suppose it was jungle to them.
Fuck off
🤨😠
Total crap
Bigoted nonsense.