@@sienile Lol. Its so true that I have to pay that one. I've never understood the desire to take one of them out. Unnecessarily heavy. Unnecessarily loud. You don't ride a Harley you drive one and you can't lane split. If I have to deal with lining up in traffic, I'll stick to the safety cell of a car thanks.
When we are talking about launching from traffic lights, what you said is irrelevant to being better. To argue the point though, my bike can carry 2 but my GF prefers to ride her bike and with the right riding gear, you don't get wet when it rains.
I think this is the best way you can decide between the two options: If you are young and with no children, the RWD is an option you would like. Once you have kids and need to consider safety during snow and rain, plus fuel economy, the FWD option is one that you need.
@@Zalequez how did all of those people who lived in snowy climates ever survive before awd was ubiquitous? Seriously, unless you live in the arctic fwd is all 95% of people need
@@TH-camduude 90% of people on their 20s in finland drive rwd cars, me included. It's just fun to turn off esp and start driving 80kmh on snowy and curvy road and be afraid of dying any possible second. Mercedes and bmws are quite common in every other age class too. Rwds are not bad in the snow if you know what you are doing
Yeah, for example daily ability... like rwd cars are basically unusable in the winter if u want to get to school/work reliably..which is half of the year so 😂
The nature of FWD just makes it generally a bit more controllable in low-grip situations. Someone I know had an old Mégane, that would do excellently in the cold... On sport suspension and standard tyres.
This was like comparing a longboard and a skateboard clearly the skateboard is gonna be more fun to drive at the end of the day so that deserves a point
@@Cookie-fe7mn shit same here. Grew up skating and got a longboard when I was 16-17, rode for years and 10-20 miles a day for over a year. Always will take a decent longboard over a skateboard
Exactly. They give FWD 3 points in "trackability" and RWD just ONE additional point?.. What a joke! RWD regularly DESTROYS FWD at the track, almost every track, in almost every form of motorsport at said tracks.. But that equals a 3 vs 4 to these knuckleheads? Nearly a dead heat in the performance catagory?!? Hah! These jokesters are trying so hard not to upset their FWD fanbase.
@@WolfCommander Nope. Guess it's our own fault for watching donut media, and thinking it would make sense. It's not the most serious of car shows. But entertaining from time to time
bliglum no, I agree with it, just depends on what track you’re talking about, my focus st is pushing 400+ to the ground and fucking beats rwds dick in, I’ve yet to find a car put in Colorado that’s rwd that can beat me, straight or track, don’t matter, minus my friends 1,100hp hellcat, shit fucked my cooter
It's like mom trying to explain to you that the Prius is better than the 86 while standing in the Toyota dealership after you've saved up enough money, and told all your friends from school that you already know how to change the clutch, suspension and short shifter on the 86.
@@lazarnedeljkovic5615 lol bc i love this channel man, but yeah i get your point lol. Anyways not everyone can afford two cars specially now with rona going around. Speaking of which anyone got spare TP =P
if you said rwd has the benefit of having more weight and thus grip on the rear wheels, yeah. But if you're on an incline steep enough to _matter_ you _need_ the steering wheels to have as much grip as possible, even to the point of having near zero grip on the rear. You can mitigate having lost the rear in an fwd car. You can not mitigate having lost the front in a rwd.
@@oatmealenthusiast4330 honestly I don't care about drifting, while yes it looks cool it is detrimental to speed and ends up slowing the car down unless you are on unpaved roads.
Cameron Smith ueah it weighs like 200 pounds more but you want any usable power on the street awd is a must and your joking when you just said rwd beat awd In traction before haha 2 tires can’t beat 4 boy!
this one seems a little off, for starters I've replaced more cv's and transaxles then any rwd transmission parts on my cars, and i've owned more rwd cars. probably the most interesting comparison was an 02' mustang and my 01' continental. both had the 4.6L ford motor but the continental went through 4 cv joints and a transaxle @140k mi vs the mustang that was driven harder and still has the factory trans,diff and everything between @210k mi. Also, living in a snow state with a rwd is way more fun because every snow day is a drift day. i don't think this answer is as simple as we all want it to be.
Music Bass Channel no way fwd should be that close in customization, or tied in fix ability. I don’t know if you’ve ever worked on a fwd V6 car, but even something simple like a spark plug change as a total pain in the ass, since usually it involves removing the intake manifold, and then contorting your arm in all sorts of unnatural ways just to get to the back row...
@@Beybladeawsomeness the rover 75 which was originally designed to be rwd but the slung a transverse v6 in at the last minute. Spark plugs are almost impossible and the timing beltS replacement are probably one of the worst jobs ever.
Some fwd cars are a lot of fun. I love my rwd car, but i had a lot of fun with the corners in my integra back in the day. I never found awd that interesting though, its good its just not that exciting.
I'm honestly really surprised that they didn't mention the static friction in the corners. Friction is basically a resource in the corners. You only have so much of it. If you're "using" some of that friction to put power down to the road, you have less of it left over to keep your car pointed where you're steering
Maybe some people would argue that powering the front wheels gives you a kind of "thrust vectoring" on corners, the traction being pointed towards the corner while rwd pushes you straight to the outside. I still prefer rwd though.
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor vectoring should be handled by the steering if it's 2wd. The issue is that the "thrust vectoring" you're talking about actually uses up some of that friction resource I mentioned, leaving less to actually steer the car. If you are using the rear tires for all of your thrust then you can use all of the friction up front to turn
@@mikecurry6847 while I too prefer rwd, things are way more complex. For example, since rwd pushes you towards the outside of the corner, accelerating in a corner induces a force on the front steering wheels which increases their grip usage and brings them closer to their grip limit. In fact sometimes it happens that flooring the gas pedal in a rwd car on a corner gives you an understeer rather than an oversteer. Also, although you say that in fwd the front wheels use their grip more, sometimes it happens that the rear wheels in a rwd reach their grip limit sooner than the front ones do in a fwd, specially on slippery surfaces like gravel or wet pavement. That's because in these conditions the weight transfer is too low to benefit the rear wheels. In European and British touring car racing there have been cases of fwd cars winning championships against bmws and mercedes that are rwd. I guess it also depends on the power of the engine because I wouldn't send 400hp or more through the front wheels. I prefer rwd because nothing beats the fun of powersliding, and I totally dislike the score result on this video, but we have to admit that at least under 400hp (and most of us don't have cars that powerful) fwd cars can be as fast as rwd. But of course super sport cars like ferraris, Lamborghinis, corvettes, vipers, porsches etc and elite motorsports like formula one, top fuel dragsters etc are never gonna be fwd.
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor no it doesn't have to be some crazy car and it has nothing at all to do with weight transfer. Any car can take corners too fast. If you're trying to go as fast as possible, rwd is the way to go. Do you have any knowledge on this or are you just pulling it out of nowhere? This isn't an original idea, I didn't make it up. Google it
@@prezofthemoon9486 No, there was no Way the make a Light and Sporty AWD. The quattro was the Revolution with a Middiffertial and (Sorry im german and dont know The Englisch Word) a Hohlwelle.
three wheel drive on four wheeled cars is where its at, the real question is what wheel do you leave out the power? personally im a rear left, rear right, and front right wheel drive. the front left wheel is wack
BS scoring. How many extra parts? Tail shaft, diff. Both are super tough and not commonly prone to failure. Timing belt on RWD = painful. Timing belt on FWD = kill me now. Spark plugs on V6/V8 RWD = Easy as. Spark plugs on V6/V8 fwd = pain in the arse.
AWD is the best by far. The fastest car on the Nürburgring is the Aventador SVJ. Also, some FWD cars aren’t boring. Imagine buying a 90k Porsche Cayman, only to be beaten on track by a civic with a big wang and less power. Think about what you say before you say it.
I’m driving a Hellcat Charger as my daily, in Switzerland, where it often rains or snow... Meh, just be careful with the throttle and survive 🤷🏻♂️ If you can’t control your car then it doesn’t really belongs in your hands.
I agree with you, i have a rwd low power suzuki, due to its high center of gravity it slides a lot when it rains, but you just have to be careful, and nobody dies lol
I've owned all three drivetrains in various versions, and for me there's no comparison at all. FWD is cheap to make, but a catastrophe for maintenance because so much is stuffed into the engine compartment and lots of big angles the power has to navigate. AWD is great if you genuinely _need_ to put down more power than one pair of tires can manage... but for most drivers in most conditions, that's very, very rare. RWD is the easiest to maintain by far, and _when built well_ is excellent in the snow, far, far better than FWD or AWD for most drivers in most conditions. The problem is that RWD gets a bad rap for mostly American-designed cars that are RWD despite having 70/30-ish weight distribution. The "grip advantage" in poor conditions that FWD gets is _entirely_ based on that terrible weight distribution that so many people have just come to expect as 'inevitable'. Here's the basic problem: In FWD, you are sending power and control to the same place. If you need more power than your traction can put down, you definitionally have no control, and vice versa. However, since only the front wheels break free, and the rear wheels are more important for staying in an envelope of _recoverability,_ for an unskilled driver, this makes FWD sort of self-limiting (unless you don't listen to your tire expert and put the new tires on the front instead of the rear where they should be). In AWD, you are sending power to all four wheels, which _sounds_ great, and when you genuinely need maximum possible power to the ground, it is. But it also means that you inherit the problems of _both_ FWD _and_ RWD, which can make them unpredictable in the hands of an amateur when things get dicey. In RWD, you use one set of wheels to steer, and one set for power. It's the ideal, in my opinion (if we're talking about pure FWD, RWD, 50/50 AWD). I know, I know, Subaru fanboys will be upset, but here's the thing... the best winter car I ever owned was _not_ my Imprezza with perfect power distribution. I know, shocking, right? I was shocked too! On paper, 25% power to each wheel for four-wheel burnouts is _obviously_ the best. But in real life, nooooot so much. My favorite cars of all three power options (without fancy stuff to get in the way), and my experience with them in poor conditions is as follows: FWD: Nissan Sentra. This car could pretty much either go, or not go. If it couldn't go, it would very quickly get into trouble. Once you break the front tires free, the car starts to yaw with the camber of the road. Thrust steer can help with this _somewhat_ but ultimately it just felt like the rear was being dragged around like a useless lump. Throwing it around to play, it just... didn't. Like most FWD cars it suffered from crippling levels of understeer. With the handbrake I could get the rear to kick out a little, but not much. Really kind of boring, for all that it was zippy on dry ground. AWD: Subaru Imprezza. This car could go pretty much no matter what. It could leave several inches of ruts in the snow with the undercarriage components, literally still going while using the front bumper as a plow. Great, right? Well... I'd say "good". Here's the problem. If you're on level ground, it's practically miraculous. Up hills it's obviously the best option. But road camber? There were many times when I'd start up in extremely slick conditions with parked cars to my right, and as all four wheels would break free, I'd just slowly start sliding to the right along the slope of the road camber. Thrust steering isn't as much of an option as it is for FWD, because the rear has a tendency to kick out. So you either make it without side-swiping, or you don't, and have to creep out very slowly without losing grip. Playing with it in the snow was always a little bit disappointing. As long as I stayed on the power, I could retain control, but it always slid _waaaaay_ further sideways than I wished it would, and the counter-intuitive way in which it wanted _more_ power to thrust-steer into recovery, and taking your foot off the gas would just as counter-intuitively make it completely lose its rear-end and spin made it kind of unpredictable in the snow. Yeah, it could go... but like I always used to tell confused FWD car owners when insisting on putting a pair of new tires on the rear, "If you can't get enough traction to go, you also can't die. If you put the good tires on the front, and _can_ get going, only to spin out, that's much worse than just being stuck." This car _always_ had enough grip to get going... but is that always a good thing? I'm not so sure. RWD: Toyota MR2 (Mk 2). This was _the best_ winter car I ever owned. No, it couldn't go through snow deep enough to be half way up the bumper, but on normal streets, with crushed-down snow, or thinner layers after plowing, this car had the single quality that I think makes a well-balanced RWD car superior: predictability. Now, admittedly, I had some _very_ nice tires on it (I was a tire sales manager at the time, after all!): V-rated BFG KDWS all-season sports tires, big wide boys on the back (IIRC, 245/45R18, front 215/55R18), but this car never, ever got stuck. It also never slid sideways, or wandered due to road camber or side hills. It just did what I wanted it to do. If I wanted to stay planted, I'd keep the throttle mild and it'd track perfectly. If I wanted to do a slow, graceful snowy power-slide or drift, it was like it could read my mind. IIRC, it had about a 45/55 front/rear weight distribution, and when sideways, had zero tendency to change angle on its own. It didn't have the power to be a drift car, and it had _way_ too much grip with those tires; I could throw it around normal street corners at stoplights at 45 mph and not even a chirp from the tires, and highway onramps marked for 35, I could take at 90+ with no issue at all. When it did start to let go, it did so gracefully and predictably, giving me plenty of warning and never threatening to do anything scary or unpredictable. So, my take on the three pure-form drivetrains with no gizmos is: FWD is cheap, simple, and relatively safe, but not as good as the hype. AWD is expensive and could get an inexperienced driver into more trouble than they know how to handle (as evidenced by the number of SUVs I see in ditches in the winter). RWD is optimal... but only with a good weight distribution, either 50/50 or a bit heavier to the back, but since _most_ RWD cars still have more weight in the front, it gets a bad reputation not for where the power goes, but for the layout of the car. Mid-engine RWD is amazing! When you start to mix things up, though, I actually think a primarily RWD car that _can_ send power to the front wheels when required, with traction control, is better by far. My Volvo XC90 just never lost its footing. Never. Turns out, computers are really good at micro-adjustments to ensure wheels never spin, and never lose grip. That thing was just _planted,_ no exceptions, in the snow. My _worst_ ever winter car? A Chevy Prism. Auto trans, all kinds of ways for power to build up then release like a rubber band, to demolish grip, extremely poor weight distribution, underpowered... ugh. Oh, of course, my Suzuki Samurai, in 4-Low with hubs locked was a beast and a half... except for that time when the wind hit the rag top and flipped me around like a Hot Wheel being smacked by a toddler, heh. Nothing to do there but hold on and hope... and then effortlessly crawl up out of the snow-filled ditch when the dust had settled. xD
lol same here, I love 140, 240, 740, 940's. Normies who can't handle a car should go FWD. Nothing negative about FWD at all, but it doesn't mean RWD is bad either, and it's not my cup of tea so to speak. I have never been in an accident and I can always tell when the rear is about to lose grip.
I was thinking the same, I daily a completely gutted 2600lb volvo 240 with a welded diff through the northeastern winters in the US and have very little problems. Good tires make a bigger difference than any other factor.
not only that but he gave it a 4 "for representing some cool swaps" after he just went off on how bad they were in that category he did more then scuff this vid
@@_unknown.exe_4831 When he said they represent cool swaps, he was talking about the engines that come from the FWD cars. There's an insane amount of K-Swapped cars, because of the availability, how relatively easy they are to do, and the amount of boost they can take on stock internals. If you swap in a K24 with a K20 head, you can get to around 600whp on stock internals. Also Civics, there's a lot of engine swapped FWD Civics, that are still FWD, because they have a K or B-Series in them. A lot of people do convert Civics to AWD, but if you just look up on youtube "7 second fwd civic" you'll find a 2,000 HP, 7 second FWD civic, as well as many other very fast fwd Civics.
NaturalAthlete it’d be a 6 second car if it was rwd. I know it’d pick up some weight with a rwd swap, but 2,000 hp will get most any serious rwd drag car into the 6’s
To be fair, this was not the "coolest possible swaps" category, it was "customization". Generally speaking, *you can customize FWD car just as much as you can customize RWD one* with the aforementioned exception of being unable to put a huge RWD-designed engine in your FWD car without converting it to RWD. So it's totally fair that FWD gets 4 points vs RWD's 5.
Oversteered my 2nd S2K and nearly died. After a 6 year break I am tempted to get a 3rd, but am opting for a Type R instead because FWD and I’m still scared as hell after that reality check.
oversteering doesn’t mean your going to crash you need to learn how to handle it when it does happen. Fwds are not immune from oversteer, and it can actually happen pretty easily. I’ve run into oversteer more than understeer with my fwd
@@kirabey8946 jokes on you I survived and the tires were under warranty so they were replaced for free... Yeah I don't mess with wet pavement as much anymore
@@kirabey8946 This feels like a myth to me. It should actually be way more easier to get a hold of an oversteer for an unexperienced driver than it is to get out of an understeer. With over steer everyone's natural reaction is to turn the wheel the opposite way of the oversteer. Whenever a car points to either side too much a driver will always try to straighten it, it makes no sense to assume that inexperienced drivers would for some reason decide to keep steering in the direction of oversteer or just keep steering straight. Of course you can over do it and end up in the opposite ditch at high speeds but I feel that it extends your time on the road regardless if you mess it up or not and thats valuable time which can be used to slow down. Understeer however is the one that takes some knowledge. If you start sliding into the side or oncoming lane and your steering inputs do nothing, then well what do you do? There is no initial split second reaction/reflex that takes over and tries to straighten out the car as it is with the natural instinct to steer in the opposite direction of a ditch when oversteering. Irregardless, on a frozen over road none amount of drivers skill will help for either FWD or RWD once the car loses traction unless you have studs. Same if you drive on wet road with tyres that have almost no thread left.
I actually oversteered on wet pavement recently in my Fwd eclipse. I've only been driving a year, and I made it out with my mechanical arms damaged but no collision. I drifted like you said, side to side and landed in a ditch. Any tips on what to do in that situation with fwd? I know life isn't a movie, but let's be real this isn't going to stop me and I'd rather be informed so I can do better than die a failure.
rwd is better for car people. but actual car people is the minority here. For your average person fwd is "better" because it gets the job done for them.
Torque steer. Hmmm, haven't heard that name since the mid-2000s. Kinda fun trying to hold onto a homicidal maniac 2008 Mazdaspeed 3 with the boost turned way up. Haven't done that in a long time though, kinda miss it. Too bad. My Civic EP3 has enough mods to get rid of torque steer. People should try a nicely setup FWD car. It changes a lot of opinions. My best friend liked everything I did with my Civic except the steering rack; which he felt was too awkward for his tastes. It's a manual rack, so it requires more turns of the wheel for the same effect. The ideal front end bite point, where the tires are working at max, is 160° 🤣
@@AndrewGeierMelons currently saving up for a clean ep3 here in the UK which is rare sadly, and with the killer insurance prices that we get it's quite hard for a young person (I'm 19 in 2 months) but I cant wait to get one Ive driven a track spec one that a friend of mine has and it was an amazing car I've been in a stock ep3 too hopefully I can buy one in the upcoming months.
Ford Australia (before it folded) made the Ford Falcon, which is absolutely a great daily. Tows 5000 pounds, drifts easily (LSD models) , as reliable as any Toyota. Just don't ask how much fuel it guzzles.
Especially if it’s a V6 FWD... ...normally I do spark plugs on every car I get, not on either of those that I had... ...of course now I have a Miata, and the most open engine bay ever...
Seems pretty simple to me. RWD for motorsports and enthusiasts FWD for economy/budget enthusiasts AWD for power delivery and low grip situations like rallying Idk why it has to be a contest
As a casual video explaining both drivetrains, this was okay. But if youre watching this as an enthusiast, you want to rip your hair off. Not once has understeer been metionned (weight transfer has but there's nuance), not once has AWD engine mounting direction bias been mentioned, not once has it been mentioned why a RWD Sports car has better handling.... You're better than this guys.
how about fixability same points lol for rear having more space to fix it and front doesen't get broken in the first place. Rear is more fun and sporty but front is reliable and efficient.
this is kind of biased, to start of, the availability round, he didnt even mention the hand me downs or second hands, like the miata which i think is a big portion of the car community
yes, but then he would have to mention the handmedown fwd cars that blow the miata out of the water. And trust, there are many more FWD cheap bois for sale than RWD cheap bois.
@@vaughnaraos5055 What about the cheap RWD handmedowns that are so freaking prevalent and popular that specific makes are entire communities onto themselves? Before the Civic/Tegra bois start spouting off, Fox Body Mustangs have been the cheapest and easiest way to go stupid fast for 30 years. The money spent to make a FWD car fast, gets you crazy fast in dirt cheap Mustangs and Camaros. It's economy of scale, there were much fewer options when the Fox Body was being made that so many were built. It competed with the Camaro/Firebird and that's about it. When it came time for the sporty compacts, choices were so plentiful (and it was such a great time to be alive), so fewer of each were built. If you wanna go fast on the cheap, old tech is more bang for the buck. Sport compacts are my favorite type of car if we're going by being able to afford to buy it, but if you want a project that can be done on the cheap, fox body is where it's at by a long shot.
There a lot of front wheel drive models, but there are millions of light, medium and heavy duty trucks on the road, all using rear wheel/4 wheel drive. Not to mention plenty of Mustangs, Challengers, and other RWD models, and almost 100 years of mainly RWD vehicles before FWD became popular. *Maybe* only 12% of cars in 2020 are offered in strictly rear wheel drive, but in terms of cars that DRIVE using mainly the rear axle, (like a Ranger in 2WD), I'd imagine the numbers would show way more RWD
I think using the prices makes the rwd cars look to expensive, especially when smaller cars are a lot cheaper to make. I drive older cars from the 60s as much as newish cars and I gotta say when there's snow or rain rwd is a fun choice. But if its really that bad go drive in something that's 4x4 or awd. Also torque steer is an issue for fwd in some cars like impala ss or bigger engine cars. This is just my opinion that rwd does the job and it's fun.
Cameron Smith But he was very biased in how he talked about them. Fwd cars are a pain in the ass to turbo cause there’s not much room for the turbos and when you engine swap them 99% of the time they’re gonna end up rwd so thats points to rwd. Then when he talks about the civic type r he talks about one of the more expensive rwd cars around that price point when you can get a good condition c6 corvette zo6 for 10k cheaper than the civic and run 10secs faster around the nurburgring or a used radical sr8 for 55k which is literally a minute faster than the civic type r. Good luck finding a used civic type r for under 30k unless its got a salvage title.
@@buffkangaroodog the only issue I have with that comparison in the video is that he used its MSRP which everyone knows is impossible to buy one for. Honda comically underpriced it, the same way Chevrolet did the c8 which is very misleading. If he wasn't biased he would've used a more accurate price for the car or a different car entirely.
@@buffkangaroodog I'm not holding it against either, but saying "you could get one for that price" is untrue. The fact that he works for a car centered channel means he should be well aware that msrp is not a good metric to use for that car. Just trying to call out this guy's blatant bias.
Everyone will hate me for this, but let's go: 1_ Front wheel drive favors regenerative braking. The weight shift towards the front axle during braking means the front wheels can receive higher braking torque, permitting higher regeneration power, and higher energy efficiency. 2_ Steering or driving an axle makes it way more expensive to manufacture than an axle that is neither driven nor steered. However, driving the front wheels will cost only marginally more than just steering them, while driving the rear wheels through anything but a live axle will cost as much as or maybe more than a complete front wheel drive suspension. 3_ Rear wheel drive is only necessary when, due to the power level, it is critical to use the weight shift to the rear axle during acceleration in order to provide better traction. 4_ Torque steer is caused by driveline asymmetry and suspension geometry (when the traction makes the wheels toe in too much and then a minor weight shift chooses one side to runaway to); but depending on power level, when the asymmetry gets sorted out, the geometry doesn't need to; just look at Subaru cars.
@@buffkangaroodog that's just simply not true, RWD is completely dominant in racing (excluding mixed surface). There are very few legit racing teams that use FWD for a reason. You have better turn in and the oversteer is mitigated by the aero and driver's throttle control. I'm not an RWD fanboy or anything, I drive a fwd beater and want an awd car ideally but in the context on trackability there is no contest.
Cameron Smith the problem is that most of the fwd road cars are just not up to par to rwd road cars in terms of track performance. The fastest fwd around the ring is around 7:40, while rwds are pushing past the 6:50 mark, with cars like the mclaren senna expected to be even faster. History also proved that rwd can still win in low grip conditions, with lancia beating the awd quattro, Rwds are just statistically way better than fwd in terms of track performance and potential, which is why most top racing series, be it drag racing or f1, still uses rwd
@@buffkangaroodog yeah thats why the civic was a bad example for the video as most rwd car are on the upper end of cost. This video is about rwd vs awd and the question was trackability, therefore he should've been comparing more equal cars. Instead he fixated on a civic which have a really good price/performance but what does that say about the average car?
I will just say this. Imagine a Honda Civic customized to be rear wheel drive. now Imagine a Dodge Challenger Customized to be a front wheel drive. see? enough said.
I dunno man. When I was a mechanic, the rwds came in less often for repair, when they did it was small shit. The fwds all came in with issues pretty regularly. The rwds were also way better to work on. Then again it was general motors.
I think you could make the case that the difference is more prevalence than quality. Lots more fwd cars made (now) than rwd. Also, rwd cars tend to be more performance oriented, and so are driven less miles and have stronger components.
i think thats due to more fwd cars being more prevalent on the roads and someone with a rwd is probably more knowledgeable about their car and keeps up with maintenance.
Well when around 10% of cars are RWD and over 50% of cars are FWD.... then you'll obviously see more FWD with more issues. That is like saying "I dunno bro I see more iPhones needing repairs than I do Google Pixel 2"
Typically love their videos, but when he started off with saying he was going to be unbiased and then was completely biased. Like the last round he gave 5 whole points to rwd because it had little to no limitations but the fwd had a lot and you still gave it a 4? Okay my guy
Yes but you usually don't see that many different engine swaps in Fwd cars modding Rwd cars is usually easier, also you don't have to be a jerk about it
Ahh because everyone does engine swaps to bigger engines. I mean yes fwd is limited in engine swaps when it comes to putting big v8s into a car but some cars already have a fwd with a v8 configuration from factory.
@@karlnurm7437 well technically the only thing that limits fwd in the last category is engine swaps and I'd argue that its not that big of a limitation as not everybody is gonna be swapping in a v8 and that's its biggest limit.
You realise that if you take a test and get one wrong answer you can't get full marks, the fwd had a problem the rwd didn't so surprisingly fwd didn't get full marks and rwd did, they score not in comparison to each other but by comparing the pros and cons
Air-headed Aviator And he still gave front wheel drive more points for this one little nirbirgring win that the civic type R got after 100 years of being a flunkie to the RWDs lol it was very biased as if he wantd fwd to win so bad, economy and slightly better handling in the snow is literally the only thing fwd dominates, And honestly my Infiniti Q 50 got just about almost the same fuel economy my Avalon is getting
Keye Haze Two things, 1. The points for Trackability thanks to cars like the civic type R, but not limited to, are due to the fact that a FWD car can have class leading performance on the track, not just FWD class leading. Second, your Q50 and Avalon comparison aren’t a disqualifier for the actual history of econ performance of FWD vs RWD. But I see the problem here, y’all seem stuck in comparing FWD and RWD purely in sport merits vs that of, well, being a car.
Air-headed Aviator As an overall car from economic standpoint, and manufacturing I get it, but he literally Contradicted these points of the entire video,, and the fact he literally just compared the MR two to the Celica and literally said the MR two didn't have any disadvantages, he still gave fwd More points that should've been an even tie and even more points for the MR2 Proving that RWD can be economic/daily/fun, entire video was more of a "here's why FWD is better" rather than which is better. He literally handed the points to fwd for every single category, yes fwd can be OK at the track but overall rear wheel drive is the way to go for complete track balance undisputed in the fact he said there was a front wheel drive indy car in 1927 and couldn't even finish the damn race Should've automatically been less points in that category hands-down
"RWD cars COULD be built to be better dailys" I feel like you`re forgeting the 3 and 5 series as well as C and E class' of the world (not the AWD ones of course) Also, all wheel drive is best wheel drive
@@slooriginal1727 It`s all a matter of preferance really. To me the beauty of AWD is that with modern electronicly controlled setups you get the most versatility. You can (in theory at least) have the car be basicly FWD when driving around (haldex systems do this), behave like rwd cars in a sporty setting (I think it`s either BMW or mercedes, or both, that allow you to put the car into full RDW with the press of basicly a button), and than go into propor AWD as soon as an unwanted lack of grip is detected. Even older mechanical AWD systems were capable of providing skids, as well as the mad grip
@@chancewagner In america, sure. Here in the EU not so much but that`s more so because of their massive size, not that great fuel economy, and the fact you couldn`t confidently leave cargo in the bed while parked on the side of the road for fear that some a**hole would just grab your stuff and run for it, rather than the issue of the truck being RWD...
FWD grips around the turn faster than RWD. It can also hit the apex late and throttle all the way through, which also corrects itself at the same time. On paper, an FWD should be quicker on the track/back roads than an RWD. However, it really comes down the driver's skill.
@@xainte13 If you drive a V 8 RWD luxury car they are smoother. You haven't lived until you ride in a land yacht. That's one thing. If you are a race car driver you like that the rear end comes out. Better for cornering. It is a professonal prefence. Not so good for regular amateur drivers. That is another thing RWD does better. Also in the '80s they were better represented over present day.
@@doodlebob-t1t Autocross, Track day, really tight backroads, hauling ass on gravel roads. There's something seriously wrong if you can't have fun in fwd.
I find awd so boring. Its a good system, just no excitement. I did love my integra back in the day though. i like rwd and fwd if the fwd has a double wishbone. There is something special about a honda with double wishbone that has some konis and eibachs thrown in. Its just a blast to drive around corners.
The issue is the scoring metrics used, they are heavily based on ease of use versus performance... Using those same metrics would have a civic beating a Ferrari
Owning classic muscle cars, a balanced frc rwd, and an awesome Em1 I really think it all comes down to personal choice. My favorite car to drive was the em1 but you can’t beat drifting in a rwd.
Totally agree there since when could a FWD out perform in a towing situation? Put a 7x4 box trailer with a full load of dirt on a FWD and see what happens? But who buys a FWD and tows anything heavy anyway right. Pull your boat out the water with that. FWD 1 - RWD 4
lol I can imagine that. There is something about car enthusiasts and arguing.. Most can handle a car and use a wrench, but can't handle their emotions or use their words. :)
My former driving school teacher used to have a RWD BMW with 180 horse power under the hood, and I used to drive that car in very snowy or icy situations (I got my licence in January, so I pretty much learned how to drive mostly during winter… in Switzerland). I never understood why people say RWD is dangerous in wet or any slippery conditions. I never found it to be any more difficult to deal with than FWD.
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor I don't even't know what those are but my 20 year old RWD Ford with 210 hp doesn't have any electronic this/that controls and it's perfectly fine to drive in the wet. (It's Australia so we don't get the chance to try snow) If you're an idiot you could spin it out, but it's easy to recover and will never lose traction without warning. (Nor without a healthy dose of throttle)
Civic Calzone I have a AWD, it’s a Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT 8 WK2. It’s Fun as hell, with a few modes, it’s damn near 500HP and it’s from 2012. I bet it’s more powerful than some of your RWD cars. Also the Trackhawk I know would kick ass.
about engine swaps. all those rwd that he mentions got an engine that also belong on a rwd, but those fwd also got a rwd engine. rayabuza->rwd, LS->rwd, lambo v12->rwd or awd... what i mean is: there's a lot of different models of fwd engines that you can swap from fwd to fwd (and it will still be a fwd). maybe it's not that interesting or none of this would be cool, but you still can do great mods and upgrades with it.
I'll be honest, I think this video was kind of meaningless. I was actually surprised not one single category was expressly dominated by one type and also surprised they did not end up rated equally. A video like this would have been better if you highlighted exclusive advantages in my opinion. I dont feel like any concrete evidence was weighted strongly. For example, maintenance was over generalized and inaccurate. I dont think the additional components of a rwd make it more unreliable or prone to breaking than fwd. A drive shaft is just a tube that spins with simple connection points. Look at old jeeps and trucks with awd powertrains and their reliability is strongly praised or even considered superior. It just seemed wrong to me to look at maintenance when that is more a product of manufacturers than design choice.
RWD dominates 95% of racing classes, is physically the best way of running a fast car. It's where 90% of all sports cars lie. 4 points. There are a few fast fwd cars people have made so that's 3 I guess.
Ok so I don't know what force exactly this is(maybe entropy?) but when torque is applied, the longer or more complicated the system receiving the torque, the less torque that will actually net in the end.(not talking about the length of the lever applying toque, but the length of what's receiving torque) Like when using wrenches or impact guns to remove, tighten bolts, if you have a long extension it's harder to bust the bolts loose or tighten them than if you just have the socket right on the ratchet or with a shorter extension. Now applied to a drive shaft, if the engine is up front, and the car is FWD the axles are very short and not complicated. IE not alot of torque is lost in transfer from the transmission to the wheel. (Same thing really if you have mid engine RWD just flipped) but in a setup where it's front engine RWD, now we have this big long shaft between the source of torque and where it needs to be applied. This results in a loss of torque from the system. or another case, if you have too much torque(think big V8) you can actually torque the shaft so hard at the end by the motor, that the shaft will just snap from raw power, or if not the shaft the rear differential gear box. This problem can be fixed by having a shorter drive train. IE Front engine FWD or mid engine RWD. So it's not that one is really better for maintenance, just if you have a setup with a long drivetrain, it's just more likely to break. If we had cars that were rear engine FWD they would probably break difs and drive shafts too
@@Nub00005 I understand what you are saying, it is a valid point as I have seen an Audi break the drive shaft at the drag race. However, this is again a design issue more than a reliability issue or performance issue. I am unsure what the losses are between a front wheel drive or a rwd but they must be complex, especially since not all cars handle the same and not all engines deliver power the same way. In terms of efficiency, I am inclined to agree with you that both the inertia and energy transfer of a fwd is more efficient, but I believe that the development of rwd cars in general is designed to either negate these losses or provide benefits unique to rwd that compensate for them such as improved handeling and weight distribution.
@@ChesterTheSpider ideally, the fastest most efficient way to do it. Is what Tesla did and have 2 engines with 2 short drive trains powering all wheels. Also I'm not hating on RWD I like all cars
These other hosts are really good to watch when they don't try to be James or Nolan
Agreed
Exactly. When James couldn't make videos, there was one guy that just couldn't work his own way and it was very weird.
Jup agree, like him much more this way!
Have you noticed that all hosts have J in their names?
@@joematt18 James, Nolanj, Bartj
Did anyone else notice when he was scoring after the availability category he said fwd has some catching up to do when it had more points
You beat me to it by 58 mins.
Damn i was just about to say the samething
I noticed it too. So many flaws in this show.
Omg yes xD
He also messed up the very first category
He said “front wheel drive cars have some catching up to do” after he scored the first category.
Okay good im glad i wasnt the only one that caught that lol
I had to rewind it cuz I thought I heard it wrong. Lol but nope. He said it lmao
Man! Flubbed it! 🤦
I was so confused like what is points
@@the_ran_dumb_car_guy Same, haha
If you let your head talk FWD wins, if you let your heart talk RWD wins......
But if there is an AWD in the mix all bets are off
RWD just feels so good ❤️
@@AngryLad_80 not while driving
@@Manuel-zc7po you may hate it. but I personally love it
edit: You can't really drift an FWD ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
@@AngryLad_80 yea,but how often do u drift?
"I'm not launching at EVERY red light"
Really means.. "Sometimes a car is in front of me at a light so I can't launch"
That's why bikes are better Lol. You always get to the front and you can launch.
@@riccirohde3362 Unless gramps drove his Harley that day.
@@sienile Lol. Its so true that I have to pay that one. I've never understood the desire to take one of them out. Unnecessarily heavy. Unnecessarily loud. You don't ride a Harley you drive one and you can't lane split.
If I have to deal with lining up in traffic, I'll stick to the safety cell of a car thanks.
@@riccirohde3362 It's by drfault not better unless it can comftorably cary *atleast* 2 people and act as a shelter from rain
Which bikes fail to do
When we are talking about launching from traffic lights, what you said is irrelevant to being better.
To argue the point though, my bike can carry 2 but my GF prefers to ride her bike and with the right riding gear, you don't get wet when it rains.
"any engine into any car"
be right back, gonna hemi swap a peel p50
Might have to clearance it a bit
Gonna drive it on the roof then.
The car is like the size of the engine
@@sea_emperour346 Exactly. Which is why you'll gonna drive it like Mr. Bean, on the roof.
Jack pender I saw a video of russians putting two engines to power a lada. Some restructuring was needed but hey, you could definitely do this too.
Kinda reminds me of science garage. I miss science garage.
they should bring it back and do one about jet engines or something
Some say they learnt more from science garage than other courses
@@_generation_youth_x28
I sure did!
Why did they cancel science garage?
Yep
I think this is the best way you can decide between the two options:
If you are young and with no children, the RWD is an option you would like.
Once you have kids and need to consider safety during snow and rain, plus fuel economy, the FWD option is one that you need.
awd is what you need*
@@Zalequez how did all of those people who lived in snowy climates ever survive before awd was ubiquitous? Seriously, unless you live in the arctic fwd is all 95% of people need
@@TH-camduude fwd is what opps need '-' and i aint no opposition brodie thats all you
If youre young theres a 90% chance ur broke, i love RWD its just too expensive
@@TH-camduude 90% of people on their 20s in finland drive rwd cars, me included. It's just fun to turn off esp and start driving 80kmh on snowy and curvy road and be afraid of dying any possible second. Mercedes and bmws are quite common in every other age class too. Rwds are not bad in the snow if you know what you are doing
This was informative, but the point system seemed pretty arbitrary.
1 point each round would be nicer
Yeah, for example daily ability... like rwd cars are basically unusable in the winter if u want to get to school/work reliably..which is half of the year so 😂
KNIGHT FALL snow tires my dude
@@knightfall7534 I have a 99 Mustang with a 5 speed specifically for winter driving, way easier to control especially when taking a corner
The nature of FWD just makes it generally a bit more controllable in low-grip situations. Someone I know had an old Mégane, that would do excellently in the cold... On sport suspension and standard tyres.
AWD : "Perfectly balanced as all thing should be"
Maintenance, economy : lmao no
Except for maintenance cost.
And massive understeer compared to front wheel drive. But not as much as midship engine 🤷🏾♂️
And Wide angle u turn
The understeer tho
Best part is the Wrx sti has the knob that you can make more fwd or rwd or 50/50
"Letting the numbers do the talking."
*proceeds to personally rate every category*
Technically a Number 🤣
And then after saying fwd wins he says, so do you guys like fwd like me or rwd 😂
@@josephtinoco3292 No, he said "fwd, like me or rwd, like me" implying he likes both and doesn't have a bias towards either.
This was like comparing a longboard and a skateboard clearly the skateboard is gonna be more fun to drive at the end of the day so that deserves a point
I personally prefer to skate on longboards, and for me they're more fun just cuz they're so smooth for transit stuff, just me tho.
@@Cookie-fe7mn have you learned tricks for the skateboard?
@@monney21gaming58 yea I have, but idk, I just prefer cruising? It's hard to explain
@@Cookie-fe7mn shit same here. Grew up skating and got a longboard when I was 16-17, rode for years and 10-20 miles a day for over a year. Always will take a decent longboard over a skateboard
My thoughts exactly. We ain’t out here riding wrongboards unless you’re a kook or an absolute downhill bomber. Other than that. DO A KICKFLIP!!! 😂
"I let the numbers do the talking" - (The numbers I arbitrarilymake up)
That's what I'm saying. He can't say _"I'll let the numbers do the talking"_ when the numbers are opinion based.
I cant seem to understand their scoring system here. It makes no sense to me
Exactly. They give FWD 3 points in "trackability" and RWD just ONE additional point?.. What a joke! RWD regularly DESTROYS FWD at the track, almost every track, in almost every form of motorsport at said tracks.. But that equals a 3 vs 4 to these knuckleheads? Nearly a dead heat in the performance catagory?!? Hah! These jokesters are trying so hard not to upset their FWD fanbase.
@@WolfCommander Nope. Guess it's our own fault for watching donut media, and thinking it would make sense. It's not the most serious of car shows. But entertaining from time to time
bliglum no, I agree with it, just depends on what track you’re talking about, my focus st is pushing 400+ to the ground and fucking beats rwds dick in, I’ve yet to find a car put in Colorado that’s rwd that can beat me, straight or track, don’t matter, minus my friends 1,100hp hellcat, shit fucked my cooter
For once in a generation subie boys and evo boys agree on something. AWD goons lol
Roger Rinkavage fax
Roger Rinkavage
MR is where it’s at.
And jeeple
Landy squad!
jacob levy fax.
It's like mom trying to explain to you that the Prius is better than the 86 while standing in the Toyota dealership after you've saved up enough money, and told all your friends from school that you already know how to change the clutch, suspension and short shifter on the 86.
Star Killa its okay they make the same power😂
I mean if you think about it insurance premiums and driving during winter would be easier with a prius.
@@ML-fc3je why are you even on this channel?
@@lazarnedeljkovic5615 he isn't wrong you know. Insurance on a Prius is cheaper than a sports car. And fwd has better grip in snow ice or rain.
@@lazarnedeljkovic5615 lol bc i love this channel man, but yeah i get your point lol. Anyways not everyone can afford two cars specially now with rona going around. Speaking of which anyone got spare TP =P
Ryosuke Takahashi would also add that the RWD has the advantage on the uphill because it does not have the burden to power the car and also steer it.
Missufiringu shistamu is a rwd killer
if you said rwd has the benefit of having more weight and thus grip on the rear wheels, yeah. But if you're on an incline steep enough to _matter_ you _need_ the steering wheels to have as much grip as possible, even to the point of having near zero grip on the rear. You can mitigate having lost the rear in an fwd car. You can not mitigate having lost the front in a rwd.
Donut Media: FWD vs. RWD which is better
AWD: am I a joke to you
Allen Brylle Corpuz holy fuck it’s obvious
Yes you are a joke
Bruh, its the best of both put together
AWD is just a fusion of FWD and RWD
@@udontknowme1654 EXACTLY
You forgot one category:
Driftability
Kyparn they also forgot another category. Averagedriverdoesntcareability.
The only category that matters
@@oatmealenthusiast4330 honestly I don't care about drifting, while yes it looks cool it is detrimental to speed and ends up slowing the car down unless you are on unpaved roads.
And wheleabiliti #draglife
if someone use daily car for drifting, NO
*RWD dominates a class*
I’m going to have to give it to the fwds because they have two really cool cars in the class 🙄
Thats honda for ya
@@buffkangaroodog no, customizability
Cameron Smith I like how mad you all are haha my god and it’s even funnier when awd still beats rwd
Cameron Smith and modability
Cameron Smith ueah it weighs like 200 pounds more but you want any usable power on the street awd is a must and your joking when you just said rwd beat awd In traction before haha 2 tires can’t beat 4 boy!
this one seems a little off, for starters I've replaced more cv's and transaxles then any rwd transmission parts on my cars, and i've owned more rwd cars. probably the most interesting comparison was an 02' mustang and my 01' continental. both had the 4.6L ford motor but the continental went through 4 cv joints and a transaxle @140k mi vs the mustang that was driven harder and still has the factory trans,diff and everything between @210k mi. Also, living in a snow state with a rwd is way more fun because every snow day is a drift day. i don't think this answer is as simple as we all want it to be.
i mean snow day is drift day even for my camry
I dont know, for some reason I feel like they were really trying to find any reason to give fwd the win...
Agreed I feel that too
Music Bass Channel no way fwd should be that close in customization, or tied in fix ability.
I don’t know if you’ve ever worked on a fwd V6 car, but even something simple like a spark plug change as a total pain in the ass, since usually it involves removing the intake manifold, and then contorting your arm in all sorts of unnatural ways just to get to the back row...
@@Beybladeawsomeness the rover 75 which was originally designed to be rwd but the slung a transverse v6 in at the last minute. Spark plugs are almost impossible and the timing beltS replacement are probably one of the worst jobs ever.
This was the dumbest shit I ever watched. The points were way off. RWD won lol
Some fwd cars are a lot of fun. I love my rwd car, but i had a lot of fun with the corners in my integra back in the day. I never found awd that interesting though, its good its just not that exciting.
FWD for Practicality
RWD for Partying
AWD for PractiPartying
AWD for partying practically
AWD for practicing partying
AWD FOR PRAYING when you catch sliding in the corner
Awd is the mullet of drivetrains, business in the front, and party in the back
Never heard of RWD as being impractical.
“Which means FWD is our winner!” Me: woooaaahhhh ok, lets check these comments
yes same
Same
Same
Right, rear wheel drive will always be a more fun car
Same.
I'm honestly really surprised that they didn't mention the static friction in the corners. Friction is basically a resource in the corners. You only have so much of it. If you're "using" some of that friction to put power down to the road, you have less of it left over to keep your car pointed where you're steering
Maybe some people would argue that powering the front wheels gives you a kind of "thrust vectoring" on corners, the traction being pointed towards the corner while rwd pushes you straight to the outside. I still prefer rwd though.
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor vectoring should be handled by the steering if it's 2wd. The issue is that the "thrust vectoring" you're talking about actually uses up some of that friction resource I mentioned, leaving less to actually steer the car. If you are using the rear tires for all of your thrust then you can use all of the friction up front to turn
@@mikecurry6847 while I too prefer rwd, things are way more complex. For example, since rwd pushes you towards the outside of the corner, accelerating in a corner induces a force on the front steering wheels which increases their grip usage and brings them closer to their grip limit. In fact sometimes it happens that flooring the gas pedal in a rwd car on a corner gives you an understeer rather than an oversteer.
Also, although you say that in fwd the front wheels use their grip more, sometimes it happens that the rear wheels in a rwd reach their grip limit sooner than the front ones do in a fwd, specially on slippery surfaces like gravel or wet pavement. That's because in these conditions the weight transfer is too low to benefit the rear wheels.
In European and British touring car racing there have been cases of fwd cars winning championships against bmws and mercedes that are rwd. I guess it also depends on the power of the engine because I wouldn't send 400hp or more through the front wheels.
I prefer rwd because nothing beats the fun of powersliding, and I totally dislike the score result on this video, but we have to admit that at least under 400hp (and most of us don't have cars that powerful) fwd cars can be as fast as rwd.
But of course super sport cars like ferraris, Lamborghinis, corvettes, vipers, porsches etc and elite motorsports like formula one, top fuel dragsters etc are never gonna be fwd.
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor no it doesn't have to be some crazy car and it has nothing at all to do with weight transfer. Any car can take corners too fast. If you're trying to go as fast as possible, rwd is the way to go. Do you have any knowledge on this or are you just pulling it out of nowhere? This isn't an original idea, I didn't make it up. Google it
“You’d have problems with slippery surfaces in RWD”
Lancia Stratos and 037: *am I a joke to you?*
because the driver was trained for that and old rally cars are RWD due to less weight at that time.
Xalinsky nothing to do with weight it was illegal for many years
@@prezofthemoon9486 No, there was no Way the make a Light and Sporty AWD. The quattro was the Revolution with a Middiffertial and (Sorry im german and dont know The Englisch Word) a Hohlwelle.
And RWD cars with any tires that aren't track tires. There are even tires you can buy that are SPECIFICALLY meant for cold and snow and rain.
Just brake smoothly and you'll be okay.
I'm not gonna lie, I don't actually care about how good fwd cars are, rwd will always be my pick just for the fun and adrenaline
Civic type r tho
@Luis Bolanos that's a weak excuse for having a crap car. No hate on you bro
@@jacobbrown8538 having fun is a weak excuse? Lol
he's never tried putting silver trays on the backwheels and pull the ebrake , clearly
I feel that. FWD cars can be fun but when it comes to being loose and shit RWD definitely wins
The real answer is *single wheel drive*
what about non wheel drive cars? why did everyone forget about them
Busa bois unite
three wheel drive on four wheeled cars is where its at, the real question is what wheel do you leave out the power? personally im a rear left, rear right, and front right wheel drive. the front left wheel is wack
Chairhotdogchair i was thinking the same thing 😳
With an open differential, that’s possible🤣 Trust me!
The fact that RWD was physically easier to fix should’ve brought them up to at least a tie.
I was mind blown by the scoring on that, came off as biased to me. At that point I knew fwd was going to be his winner by the end of it
RWD is MILES easier to work on, after working on my mustang or my jeep, my parents minivan was a nightmare 😳
BS scoring. How many extra parts? Tail shaft, diff. Both are super tough and not commonly prone to failure.
Timing belt on RWD = painful.
Timing belt on FWD = kill me now.
Spark plugs on V6/V8 RWD = Easy as.
Spark plugs on V6/V8 fwd = pain in the arse.
@@Vermicious well, the clutch on the rwd is easier aswel
Jesus loves you
Donut Media: FWD VS RWD which is BEST?
AWD: I'm BOTH
Tesla Gang
@@Eduardo_Espinoza any car brand gang?
Average forza player be like:
*AWD Swap*
for real lol
Dead ass!
Always
Guilty as charged...
I actually try to keep the original drive train since rwd and fwd come with their own skills at driving
FWD: wins in the boring categories
RWD: wins in the fun categories
You see where I’m headed with this?
And AWD wins the extreme categories
Come to Europe and nobody drives a RWD car only FWD or AWD
@@blackdedem9478 Mercs and BMWs would like to differ.
Yet the boring categories are the one that matter the most to 90% of car owners huh.
AWD is the best by far. The fastest car on the Nürburgring is the Aventador SVJ. Also, some FWD cars aren’t boring. Imagine buying a 90k Porsche Cayman, only to be beaten on track by a civic with a big wang and less power. Think about what you say before you say it.
I just want to point out the Level of track records a rwd car has so the fact that it didn't get 5 points there is kinda bs
I feel like this show is just meant to trigger people 😂
Drew Pope it F-ing worked.
Ya my Prius is the best!
Lmfaoo.
all they want are your clicks and ad revenue.
Ikr he totally left out trucks and SUV out of the competition 😑
I’m driving a Hellcat Charger as my daily, in Switzerland, where it often rains or snow... Meh, just be careful with the throttle and survive 🤷🏻♂️ If you can’t control your car then it doesn’t really belongs in your hands.
I fully agree with you man
exactly, just don't do floor it every ten seconds and you'll be fine
I agree with you, i have a rwd low power suzuki, due to its high center of gravity it slides a lot when it rains, but you just have to be careful, and nobody dies lol
I got Snow tires in Detroit Michigan which is stuck in the wintery hell that is the great lakes region.
Michael Höflich yup agree
awd is unnecessary
Now I’m starting to think about a 6 wheeler (such as a g wagon ) having a middle wheel drive 😂
There is a company that makes a 6x4 Jeep but they don’t drive the rear axle. Doug demuro reviewed it
Right wheel drive where only the front and back right wheels work.
@@jonnydevlin7045 you mean 4x6
some trucks are like that
@@TheSuperBoyProject AWD cars already do this in turns. The outside wheels drive, so inside wheels are not limiting speed and traction.
I've owned all three drivetrains in various versions, and for me there's no comparison at all.
FWD is cheap to make, but a catastrophe for maintenance because so much is stuffed into the engine compartment and lots of big angles the power has to navigate.
AWD is great if you genuinely _need_ to put down more power than one pair of tires can manage... but for most drivers in most conditions, that's very, very rare.
RWD is the easiest to maintain by far, and _when built well_ is excellent in the snow, far, far better than FWD or AWD for most drivers in most conditions. The problem is that RWD gets a bad rap for mostly American-designed cars that are RWD despite having 70/30-ish weight distribution. The "grip advantage" in poor conditions that FWD gets is _entirely_ based on that terrible weight distribution that so many people have just come to expect as 'inevitable'.
Here's the basic problem: In FWD, you are sending power and control to the same place. If you need more power than your traction can put down, you definitionally have no control, and vice versa. However, since only the front wheels break free, and the rear wheels are more important for staying in an envelope of _recoverability,_ for an unskilled driver, this makes FWD sort of self-limiting (unless you don't listen to your tire expert and put the new tires on the front instead of the rear where they should be).
In AWD, you are sending power to all four wheels, which _sounds_ great, and when you genuinely need maximum possible power to the ground, it is. But it also means that you inherit the problems of _both_ FWD _and_ RWD, which can make them unpredictable in the hands of an amateur when things get dicey.
In RWD, you use one set of wheels to steer, and one set for power. It's the ideal, in my opinion (if we're talking about pure FWD, RWD, 50/50 AWD).
I know, I know, Subaru fanboys will be upset, but here's the thing... the best winter car I ever owned was _not_ my Imprezza with perfect power distribution. I know, shocking, right? I was shocked too! On paper, 25% power to each wheel for four-wheel burnouts is _obviously_ the best. But in real life, nooooot so much.
My favorite cars of all three power options (without fancy stuff to get in the way), and my experience with them in poor conditions is as follows:
FWD: Nissan Sentra. This car could pretty much either go, or not go. If it couldn't go, it would very quickly get into trouble. Once you break the front tires free, the car starts to yaw with the camber of the road. Thrust steer can help with this _somewhat_ but ultimately it just felt like the rear was being dragged around like a useless lump. Throwing it around to play, it just... didn't. Like most FWD cars it suffered from crippling levels of understeer. With the handbrake I could get the rear to kick out a little, but not much. Really kind of boring, for all that it was zippy on dry ground.
AWD: Subaru Imprezza. This car could go pretty much no matter what. It could leave several inches of ruts in the snow with the undercarriage components, literally still going while using the front bumper as a plow. Great, right? Well... I'd say "good". Here's the problem. If you're on level ground, it's practically miraculous. Up hills it's obviously the best option. But road camber? There were many times when I'd start up in extremely slick conditions with parked cars to my right, and as all four wheels would break free, I'd just slowly start sliding to the right along the slope of the road camber. Thrust steering isn't as much of an option as it is for FWD, because the rear has a tendency to kick out. So you either make it without side-swiping, or you don't, and have to creep out very slowly without losing grip. Playing with it in the snow was always a little bit disappointing. As long as I stayed on the power, I could retain control, but it always slid _waaaaay_ further sideways than I wished it would, and the counter-intuitive way in which it wanted _more_ power to thrust-steer into recovery, and taking your foot off the gas would just as counter-intuitively make it completely lose its rear-end and spin made it kind of unpredictable in the snow. Yeah, it could go... but like I always used to tell confused FWD car owners when insisting on putting a pair of new tires on the rear, "If you can't get enough traction to go, you also can't die. If you put the good tires on the front, and _can_ get going, only to spin out, that's much worse than just being stuck." This car _always_ had enough grip to get going... but is that always a good thing? I'm not so sure.
RWD: Toyota MR2 (Mk 2). This was _the best_ winter car I ever owned. No, it couldn't go through snow deep enough to be half way up the bumper, but on normal streets, with crushed-down snow, or thinner layers after plowing, this car had the single quality that I think makes a well-balanced RWD car superior: predictability. Now, admittedly, I had some _very_ nice tires on it (I was a tire sales manager at the time, after all!): V-rated BFG KDWS all-season sports tires, big wide boys on the back (IIRC, 245/45R18, front 215/55R18), but this car never, ever got stuck. It also never slid sideways, or wandered due to road camber or side hills. It just did what I wanted it to do. If I wanted to stay planted, I'd keep the throttle mild and it'd track perfectly. If I wanted to do a slow, graceful snowy power-slide or drift, it was like it could read my mind. IIRC, it had about a 45/55 front/rear weight distribution, and when sideways, had zero tendency to change angle on its own. It didn't have the power to be a drift car, and it had _way_ too much grip with those tires; I could throw it around normal street corners at stoplights at 45 mph and not even a chirp from the tires, and highway onramps marked for 35, I could take at 90+ with no issue at all. When it did start to let go, it did so gracefully and predictably, giving me plenty of warning and never threatening to do anything scary or unpredictable.
So, my take on the three pure-form drivetrains with no gizmos is: FWD is cheap, simple, and relatively safe, but not as good as the hype. AWD is expensive and could get an inexperienced driver into more trouble than they know how to handle (as evidenced by the number of SUVs I see in ditches in the winter). RWD is optimal... but only with a good weight distribution, either 50/50 or a bit heavier to the back, but since _most_ RWD cars still have more weight in the front, it gets a bad reputation not for where the power goes, but for the layout of the car. Mid-engine RWD is amazing!
When you start to mix things up, though, I actually think a primarily RWD car that _can_ send power to the front wheels when required, with traction control, is better by far. My Volvo XC90 just never lost its footing. Never. Turns out, computers are really good at micro-adjustments to ensure wheels never spin, and never lose grip. That thing was just _planted,_ no exceptions, in the snow.
My _worst_ ever winter car? A Chevy Prism. Auto trans, all kinds of ways for power to build up then release like a rubber band, to demolish grip, extremely poor weight distribution, underpowered... ugh.
Oh, of course, my Suzuki Samurai, in 4-Low with hubs locked was a beast and a half... except for that time when the wind hit the rag top and flipped me around like a Hot Wheel being smacked by a toddler, heh. Nothing to do there but hold on and hope... and then effortlessly crawl up out of the snow-filled ditch when the dust had settled. xD
You forgot the most important part "fun" you can have so much more fun in a RWD!!!
Chris Hartley low key....
Only place a fwd car can’t have “fun” is on a burnout pad
@@blakeschmid sick powerslide dude!
That’s the main reason why I’ll never prefer FWD over RWD; I currently drive a FWD Mazda and it’s just not nearly as fun as the RWD cars I’ve driven
Chris Hartley ever heard of maccas trays?
"rear wheel drive cars are bad in snow" me laughs in Volvo 240
some dude: "My celica is superior in the snow! It has all wheel drive!"
quiet kid with his dad's 86: haha car go sideways
Some dude on a subie: you cant just run anything on dirt
Someone else: haha Volvo go brroom
I literally drive my ‘15 mustang GT in the snow
lol same here, I love 140, 240, 740, 940's. Normies who can't handle a car should go FWD. Nothing negative about FWD at all, but it doesn't mean RWD is bad either, and it's not my cup of tea so to speak. I have never been in an accident and I can always tell when the rear is about to lose grip.
I was thinking the same, I daily a completely gutted 2600lb volvo 240 with a welded diff through the northeastern winters in the US and have very little problems. Good tires make a bigger difference than any other factor.
He really gave them a 4 in customization when he just said that the motor swaps on fwd cars were converted to Rwd...🤨 he scuffed this one bad.
You can turn a 350z into a Tesla
Donut: 🙉
not only that but he gave it a 4 "for representing some cool swaps" after he just went off on how bad they were in that category he did more then scuff this vid
@@_unknown.exe_4831 When he said they represent cool swaps, he was talking about the engines that come from the FWD cars. There's an insane amount of K-Swapped cars, because of the availability, how relatively easy they are to do, and the amount of boost they can take on stock internals. If you swap in a K24 with a K20 head, you can get to around 600whp on stock internals. Also Civics, there's a lot of engine swapped FWD Civics, that are still FWD, because they have a K or B-Series in them. A lot of people do convert Civics to AWD, but if you just look up on youtube "7 second fwd civic" you'll find a 2,000 HP, 7 second FWD civic, as well as many other very fast fwd Civics.
NaturalAthlete it’d be a 6 second car if it was rwd. I know it’d pick up some weight with a rwd swap, but 2,000 hp will get most any serious rwd drag car into the 6’s
To be fair, this was not the "coolest possible swaps" category, it was "customization". Generally speaking, *you can customize FWD car just as much as you can customize RWD one* with the aforementioned exception of being unable to put a huge RWD-designed engine in your FWD car without converting it to RWD. So it's totally fair that FWD gets 4 points vs RWD's 5.
I love how these videos explain the nuances clearly. That is honestly quite difficult to do properly.
I would call a 1 point difference “within the margin of error” and “a statistical tie.”
How are you verified
Lol dude your channel description-- the fact that you gotta explain--
I disagree
How the hell are you verified?
@@Ren_184 look at his description
“Rear wheel drive is bad in snow” Me: *Laughs in Canadian*
snow + RWD = most fun driving :D
Lol Same here, I'm Swedish and we love our RWD's in the snow. So much fun and never a problem! This guy talks bs :D
For common user it´s true, but no for real drivers, we love rwd everywhere and anytime :D
@RisoDHDetva Spittin straight Facts
So true 😂 i drive a 1996 gmc sierra rwd and it rides perfect in the snow
Next Episode:
*TURBOCHARGED VS SUPERCHARGED*
#spoolVSwhine
I suspect that this was partally explained in the B2B episode of the Twin turbo Dodge Demon.
@@arinb.756 Volvo XC90 does it. In fact all the new Volvo T6 trims have the Twin Charged 2.0L I4
ForgedCarbon twincharged only belongs in old rally cars.
@@arinb.756 fire gang like that one car on top gear
Oversteered my 2nd S2K and nearly died. After a 6 year break I am tempted to get a 3rd, but am opting for a Type R instead because FWD and I’m still scared as hell after that reality check.
oversteering doesn’t mean your going to crash you need to learn how to handle it when it does happen. Fwds are not immune from oversteer, and it can actually happen pretty easily. I’ve run into oversteer more than understeer with my fwd
@@arcanevoid9199ive never oversteered my fwd car even at cornering speeds above 100mph. I dont know man i just cant trust an rwd for that job😂
@@TrueTwinGamer depends what the car is and how it’s setup along with how it’s been driven. I’ve oversteered going less than 30mph in my fwd
did you take any safe driving lessons?
@@TrueTwinGamer ... do you want to? accelerate through a corner as hard as it can and suddenly release the throttle 🤭
14:19 that's an old Fiat 500, and the engine was originally in the back with RWD. The newer 500 has the engine in the front with FWD
Wanted to write the same thing, at least there's sombody else who knows that. 👍🏻
So this way rwd wins. Gg
"Do you want the power to the front? Or to the back?"
Me: why not both?
All wheel drive cars lose their power by the transmission.
@@terrybucklew6301 but can put their power to better use
@@terrybucklew6301 But gain it back in traction
@@_generation_youth_x28
It's only going good at standstill launch and off-road
How about neither
Once again : science garage
Shout-out to my man Bart
I'm going to choke bart
This is why he left 🤣
honestly both are so cool in their own rights and it truly depends on personal preference and circumstances
"Do you want your power from the front, or the back"
Most Subarus: porque no los dos?
Most Subarus: なぜ両方ではない？
😂
Most subarus: hĕãď ğä§kêt
logan production's 😂😂😂
@@skull_go_snap2596 ahahahahahahahahaha
"Rear wheel is bad in snow"
Me : *laughs in tropical climate*
Laughs in texas heat
tropics rains a lot though
South texas it doesn't rain that much
@@davidgarza6738 South Texas is subtropical though, actual tropical places like brazil Indonesia and the middle of africa rain a lot
I mean mostly in my town it is humid but when it rains it pores
I think the ability for rwd to oversteer when you peal out on wet roads is a big positive
Yeah but if youre not experienced, you will die.
@@kirabey8946 jokes on you I survived and the tires were under warranty so they were replaced for free... Yeah I don't mess with wet pavement as much anymore
@@Blowingmind good for you dude, be careful out there, life's not a movie/anime, there is no plot armor :D
@@kirabey8946 This feels like a myth to me. It should actually be way more easier to get a hold of an oversteer for an unexperienced driver than it is to get out of an understeer. With over steer everyone's natural reaction is to turn the wheel the opposite way of the oversteer. Whenever a car points to either side too much a driver will always try to straighten it, it makes no sense to assume that inexperienced drivers would for some reason decide to keep steering in the direction of oversteer or just keep steering straight. Of course you can over do it and end up in the opposite ditch at high speeds but I feel that it extends your time on the road regardless if you mess it up or not and thats valuable time which can be used to slow down.
Understeer however is the one that takes some knowledge. If you start sliding into the side or oncoming lane and your steering inputs do nothing, then well what do you do? There is no initial split second reaction/reflex that takes over and tries to straighten out the car as it is with the natural instinct to steer in the opposite direction of a ditch when oversteering.
Irregardless, on a frozen over road none amount of drivers skill will help for either FWD or RWD once the car loses traction unless you have studs. Same if you drive on wet road with tyres that have almost no thread left.
I actually oversteered on wet pavement recently in my Fwd eclipse. I've only been driving a year, and I made it out with my mechanical arms damaged but no collision. I drifted like you said, side to side and landed in a ditch. Any tips on what to do in that situation with fwd? I know life isn't a movie, but let's be real this isn't going to stop me and I'd rather be informed so I can do better than die a failure.
This gentleman has a lot of potential, it just need to relax a little bit more and make it more cozy for all of us 👍🏼🙏🏼 welcome to the donut family
AWD for me
If i wanted to choose between RWD and FWD. I would prefer RWD as they are way more fun then FWD
Than.
Haider Ali
The true answer is in the video: MR2
Exactly.
if only it were that easy. if you demand AWD, you kinda limit your options, especially when you have a budget to work in
I'd go RWD over AWD simply because it's more fun and not as heavy and expensive.
There are some valid points that he made, but that doesn't excuse the fact that you just said FWD > RWD
So if you drive backwards its basically the same thing.
@@trikelyfe6090 it would be like driving a car with monster truck steering if you do that xd
@@Killad_1 lol
Why are you butthurt? That's the truth, fwd is better, get over it.
rwd is better for car people. but actual car people is the minority here. For your average person fwd is "better" because it gets the job done for them.
I'm almost convinced this video is a meme. It has to be. Where's the mention of torque steer?
Torque steer is for poor people who cant afford newer cars.
Torque steer. Hmmm, haven't heard that name since the mid-2000s. Kinda fun trying to hold onto a homicidal maniac 2008 Mazdaspeed 3 with the boost turned way up. Haven't done that in a long time though, kinda miss it.
Too bad. My Civic EP3 has enough mods to get rid of torque steer. People should try a nicely setup FWD car. It changes a lot of opinions. My best friend liked everything I did with my Civic except the steering rack; which he felt was too awkward for his tastes. It's a manual rack, so it requires more turns of the wheel for the same effect. The ideal front end bite point, where the tires are working at max, is 160° 🤣
@@AndrewGeierMelons currently saving up for a clean ep3 here in the UK which is rare sadly, and with the killer insurance prices that we get it's quite hard for a young person (I'm 19 in 2 months) but I cant wait to get one Ive driven a track spec one that a friend of mine has and it was an amazing car I've been in a stock ep3 too hopefully I can buy one in the upcoming months.
that's the moment I was looking for
@@AndrewGeierMelons eyyyyy I currently drive an 08 speed3, the torque steer in my opinion is actually kinda fun haha
“No manufacturer is building rwd cars for daily use”
BMW: hol’up
Ford Australia (before it folded) made the Ford Falcon, which is absolutely a great daily. Tows 5000 pounds, drifts easily (LSD models) , as reliable as any Toyota. Just don't ask how much fuel it guzzles.
Toyota inova in indonesia is daily car cheap but they rwd. Jdm car many had rwd like nissan silvia
Fwd is a pain in the ass to wrench tho. And rwd is so much more fun to drive imo.
Rwd is super fun, especially an LS swapped A86 Corolla.
Especially if it’s a V6 FWD...
...normally I do spark plugs on every car I get, not on either of those that I had...
...of course now I have a Miata, and the most open engine bay ever...
SPEED EZ you never seen an old bmw 5 or 7 series with the smallest engine lol
4 banger fwd cars are so easy to work on though, at least the 90s hondas were lol
I drive a 97 civic and work on it myself. Dropped my buddys miatas rear diff and was like, "this is easy af" 😂
“Looks like fwd have some catching up to do” they’re in the lead??
Trying to convince me that his Yaris is cool
It does that on its own! #⬇️
Bruh
Rey Gunner ayo what you got on the yari? Tell me rn I don’t got one but the yari man how could you smh!
Y’all seen a Yaris gr?
Are you trying to say it isn’t?
Never realized front wheel drive was so common
4:40
FWD: 4 RWD: 2
"It looks like FWD has some catching up to do"
Charles Ramirez thought i was the only one to notice it lmao
Thank you I had to look way too long to find this
yeahitskimmel sameeeeee
Yes it’s wild production didn’t catch this
7:50 Same problem
Seems pretty simple to me.
RWD for motorsports and enthusiasts
FWD for economy/budget enthusiasts
AWD for power delivery and low grip situations like rallying
Idk why it has to be a contest
What about a Mazda mps that’s FWD
@@noahc4685 That was a test to see how far they could push FWD if I remember right
Yeah but it's fun to listen/talk about it 😬. I mean talking about anything related to engines and vehicles in general is fun but this is fun.
Jeez have you driven in winter
@@noahc4685 What about it?
The true winner? AWD w/ RWD bias and a "drift mode" or RWD mode that can defeat the front traction.
I know there's a couple of those out there.
Literally focus RS, AWD with drift mode that sends majority of power to rear
That’s gay. Imagine having a front diff lmao
Hell yeah, but they are rare or expensive 😔 r32 GTR (not sure) M8, M5, etc...
As a casual video explaining both drivetrains, this was okay.
But if youre watching this as an enthusiast, you want to rip your hair off. Not once has understeer been metionned (weight transfer has but there's nuance), not once has AWD engine mounting direction bias been mentioned, not once has it been mentioned why a RWD Sports car has better handling.... You're better than this guys.
Last section: Customizability
"oh man it's ooover!"
For representing with some crazy builds... 4 points for fwd.
"horsesh*t. utter horsesh*t."
For some crazy builds which are no longer FWD
how about fixability same points lol for rear having more space to fix it and front doesen't get broken in the first place. Rear is more fun and sporty but front is reliable and efficient.
FWD > yo momma
You are getting unreasonably mad at a TH-cam video
lol, the same FWD cars that were made into RWD too 🤣 😂😂😂 Even they didnt want them to be FWD!
this is kind of biased, to start of, the availability round, he didnt even mention the hand me downs or second hands, like the miata which i think is a big portion of the car community
yes, but then he would have to mention the handmedown fwd cars that blow the miata out of the water. And trust, there are many more FWD cheap bois for sale than RWD cheap bois.
@@vaughnaraos5055 wbu BMW E36 in my country i found a 325i for 2000$ Thats really good
@@vaughnaraos5055 What about the cheap RWD handmedowns that are so freaking prevalent and popular that specific makes are entire communities onto themselves? Before the Civic/Tegra bois start spouting off, Fox Body Mustangs have been the cheapest and easiest way to go stupid fast for 30 years. The money spent to make a FWD car fast, gets you crazy fast in dirt cheap Mustangs and Camaros.
It's economy of scale, there were much fewer options when the Fox Body was being made that so many were built. It competed with the Camaro/Firebird and that's about it. When it came time for the sporty compacts, choices were so plentiful (and it was such a great time to be alive), so fewer of each were built. If you wanna go fast on the cheap, old tech is more bang for the buck. Sport compacts are my favorite type of car if we're going by being able to afford to buy it, but if you want a project that can be done on the cheap, fox body is where it's at by a long shot.
There a lot of front wheel drive models, but there are millions of light, medium and heavy duty trucks on the road, all using rear wheel/4 wheel drive. Not to mention plenty of Mustangs, Challengers, and other RWD models, and almost 100 years of mainly RWD vehicles before FWD became popular. *Maybe* only 12% of cars in 2020 are offered in strictly rear wheel drive, but in terms of cars that DRIVE using mainly the rear axle, (like a Ranger in 2WD), I'd imagine the numbers would show way more RWD
@@exoiwnl e36 for 2000???? Cheapest in 100 miles of me is 4500
I think using the prices makes the rwd cars look to expensive, especially when smaller cars are a lot cheaper to make. I drive older cars from the 60s as much as newish cars and I gotta say when there's snow or rain rwd is a fun choice. But if its really that bad go drive in something that's 4x4 or awd. Also torque steer is an issue for fwd in some cars like impala ss or bigger engine cars. This is just my opinion that rwd does the job and it's fun.
Would of liked a fun-to-drive category. Good comparison in the customizability category though 😀
Exactly, add that and FWD doesn't stand a chance haha!
The FWD bias in the scoring hurt. Should’ve been RWD by at least two based on his analysis
Agreed. Definitely a bias in this video. And this coming from a non car guy with no preference
Cameron Smith But he was very biased in how he talked about them. Fwd cars are a pain in the ass to turbo cause there’s not much room for the turbos and when you engine swap them 99% of the time they’re gonna end up rwd so thats points to rwd. Then when he talks about the civic type r he talks about one of the more expensive rwd cars around that price point when you can get a good condition c6 corvette zo6 for 10k cheaper than the civic and run 10secs faster around the nurburgring or a used radical sr8 for 55k which is literally a minute faster than the civic type r. Good luck finding a used civic type r for under 30k unless its got a salvage title.
@@buffkangaroodog the only issue I have with that comparison in the video is that he used its MSRP which everyone knows is impossible to buy one for. Honda comically underpriced it, the same way Chevrolet did the c8 which is very misleading. If he wasn't biased he would've used a more accurate price for the car or a different car entirely.
yeap. Probably the first donut media video I've ever felt the need to thumbs down
@@buffkangaroodog I'm not holding it against either, but saying "you could get one for that price" is untrue. The fact that he works for a car centered channel means he should be well aware that msrp is not a good metric to use for that car. Just trying to call out this guy's blatant bias.
I drive my 2019 Challenger 392 Scat Pack all year round in Canada, have zero issues in the snow with snow tires.
Probably because it weighs 10,000 lbs
Well yeah boats aren't that bad in snow so its to be expected
PICAZHUU 🤣🤣🤣
Parker Johnson I love this comment soo much
lmao i watched a scat pack get stuck in 2cm of snow one time, and it was satisfying showing him what a shitbox with x drive can do
You missed a category, drifting lmao
faxs bro
But grip is faster but drifting is cooler.
@@theexperience6444 enjoyment>speed xD but you right
@@theexperience6444 you can go faster when drifting at 100 then gripping at 70
Drifting is for losers, top speed is the game
Everyone will hate me for this, but let's go:
1_ Front wheel drive favors regenerative braking. The weight shift towards the front axle during braking means the front wheels can receive higher braking torque, permitting higher regeneration power, and higher energy efficiency.
2_ Steering or driving an axle makes it way more expensive to manufacture than an axle that is neither driven nor steered. However, driving the front wheels will cost only marginally more than just steering them, while driving the rear wheels through anything but a live axle will cost as much as or maybe more than a complete front wheel drive suspension.
3_ Rear wheel drive is only necessary when, due to the power level, it is critical to use the weight shift to the rear axle during acceleration in order to provide better traction.
4_ Torque steer is caused by driveline asymmetry and suspension geometry (when the traction makes the wheels toe in too much and then a minor weight shift chooses one side to runaway to); but depending on power level, when the asymmetry gets sorted out, the geometry doesn't need to; just look at Subaru cars.
Trackability was off - RWD should've been 1 pt more gap, making overall a TIE!
@@buffkangaroodog that's just simply not true, RWD is completely dominant in racing (excluding mixed surface). There are very few legit racing teams that use FWD for a reason. You have better turn in and the oversteer is mitigated by the aero and driver's throttle control.
I'm not an RWD fanboy or anything, I drive a fwd beater and want an awd car ideally but in the context on trackability there is no contest.
Cameron Smith the problem is that most of the fwd road cars are just not up to par to rwd road cars in terms of track performance. The fastest fwd around the ring is around 7:40, while rwds are pushing past the 6:50 mark, with cars like the mclaren senna expected to be even faster. History also proved that rwd can still win in low grip conditions, with lancia beating the awd quattro, Rwds are just statistically way better than fwd in terms of track performance and potential, which is why most top racing series, be it drag racing or f1, still uses rwd
@@buffkangaroodog The category was for trackability not price!
Prius Master Race 😎
@@buffkangaroodog yeah thats why the civic was a bad example for the video as most rwd car are on the upper end of cost. This video is about rwd vs awd and the question was trackability, therefore he should've been comparing more equal cars. Instead he fixated on a civic which have a really good price/performance but what does that say about the average car?
I will just say this. Imagine a Honda Civic customized to be rear wheel drive. now Imagine a Dodge Challenger Customized to be a front wheel drive. see? enough said.
I would definitely drive a front wheel Challenger
What d y mean
Thats a fair point tbh
rwd civics exist and they're pretty epic
Let’s compare a 16K car vs a 36K car.
I dunno man. When I was a mechanic, the rwds came in less often for repair, when they did it was small shit. The fwds all came in with issues pretty regularly. The rwds were also way better to work on.
Then again it was general motors.
ya less moving parts
I think you could make the case that the difference is more prevalence than quality. Lots more fwd cars made (now) than rwd. Also, rwd cars tend to be more performance oriented, and so are driven less miles and have stronger components.
Maybe because nowadays, a lot of affordable cars use fwd than rwd.
i think thats due to more fwd cars being more prevalent on the roads and someone with a rwd is probably more knowledgeable about their car and keeps up with maintenance.
Well when around 10% of cars are RWD and over 50% of cars are FWD.... then you'll obviously see more FWD with more issues. That is like saying "I dunno bro I see more iPhones needing repairs than I do Google Pixel 2"
Im 3 minutes in and I already know FWD is gonna win because the history of this series and the points this dudes making. “Unbiased” my ass
This guy is so biased he pissed me of I think Donut fire him and get Nolan and James
@@coolcatcartergaming1586 agreed
Is this the same guy who made the Bugatti Vs koenigsegg video?
Typically love their videos, but when he started off with saying he was going to be unbiased and then was completely biased. Like the last round he gave 5 whole points to rwd because it had little to no limitations but the fwd had a lot and you still gave it a 4? Okay my guy
Yes but you usually don't see that many different engine swaps in Fwd cars modding Rwd cars is usually easier, also you don't have to be a jerk about it
Exactly, somethings similar happend in the mustang vs camaro one, the 90s generation
Ahh because everyone does engine swaps to bigger engines. I mean yes fwd is limited in engine swaps when it comes to putting big v8s into a car but some cars already have a fwd with a v8 configuration from factory.
@@karlnurm7437 well technically the only thing that limits fwd in the last category is engine swaps and I'd argue that its not that big of a limitation as not everybody is gonna be swapping in a v8 and that's its biggest limit.
You realise that if you take a test and get one wrong answer you can't get full marks, the fwd had a problem the rwd didn't so surprisingly fwd didn't get full marks and rwd did, they score not in comparison to each other but by comparing the pros and cons
Driving experience should be in the category ...
Incredibly subjective. Trackability is far more clear cut
Air-headed Aviator And he still gave front wheel drive more points for this one little nirbirgring win that the civic type R got after 100 years of being a flunkie to the RWDs lol it was very biased as if he wantd fwd to win so bad, economy and slightly better handling in the snow is literally the only thing fwd dominates, And honestly my Infiniti Q 50 got just about almost the same fuel economy my Avalon is getting
Keye Haze Two things, 1. The points for Trackability thanks to cars like the civic type R, but not limited to, are due to the fact that a FWD car can have class leading performance on the track, not just FWD class leading. Second, your Q50 and Avalon comparison aren’t a disqualifier for the actual history of econ performance of FWD vs RWD.
But I see the problem here, y’all seem stuck in comparing FWD and RWD purely in sport merits vs that of, well, being a car.
Air-headed Aviator As an overall car from economic standpoint, and manufacturing I get it, but he literally Contradicted these points of the entire video,, and the fact he literally just compared the MR two to the Celica and literally said the MR two didn't have any disadvantages, he still gave fwd More points that should've been an even tie and even more points for the MR2 Proving that RWD can be economic/daily/fun, entire video was more of a "here's why FWD is better" rather than which is better. He literally handed the points to fwd for every single category, yes fwd can be OK at the track but overall rear wheel drive is the way to go for complete track balance undisputed in the fact he said there was a front wheel drive indy car in 1927 and couldn't even finish the damn race Should've automatically been less points in that category hands-down
Fwd with power = torque steer and bad traction. Rwd with power = a back end with can be turned with the throttle and endless joy
"RWD cars COULD be built to be better dailys"
I feel like you`re forgeting the 3 and 5 series as well as C and E class' of the world (not the AWD ones of course)
Also, all wheel drive is best wheel drive
I think rwd are better they're just more fun awd and fwd are just for people that can't handle rwd or off-road
Not to mention trucks, 4 door trucks are one of the best dailys now.
@@slooriginal1727 It`s all a matter of preferance really. To me the beauty of AWD is that with modern electronicly controlled setups you get the most versatility. You can (in theory at least) have the car be basicly FWD when driving around (haldex systems do this), behave like rwd cars in a sporty setting (I think it`s either BMW or mercedes, or both, that allow you to put the car into full RDW with the press of basicly a button), and than go into propor AWD as soon as an unwanted lack of grip is detected. Even older mechanical AWD systems were capable of providing skids, as well as the mad grip
@@chancewagner In america, sure. Here in the EU not so much but that`s more so because of their massive size, not that great fuel economy, and the fact you couldn`t confidently leave cargo in the bed while parked on the side of the road for fear that some a**hole would just grab your stuff and run for it, rather than the issue of the truck being RWD...
Andre Anastacio I agree just not with the same cars I own a focus rs stage 3 and let me tell you that fucker is fun
FWD grips around the turn faster than RWD. It can also hit the apex late and throttle all the way through, which also corrects itself at the same time.
On paper, an FWD should be quicker on the track/back roads than an RWD. However, it really comes down the driver's skill.
If things like pickups and cars from the 80’s where factored in RWD would have won
What about 80's cars makes RWD better than FWD lmao
also, you misspelled *were*
@@xainte13 If you drive a V 8 RWD luxury car they are smoother. You haven't lived until you ride in a land yacht. That's one thing. If you are a race car driver you like that the rear end comes out. Better for cornering. It is a professonal prefence. Not so good for regular amateur drivers. That is another thing RWD does better. Also in the '80s they were better represented over present day.
Alex Christensen I think they are referring to the history and impact that the cars had
At the end of the day, it really depends on how people or manufacturers utilise it. Both of them can be super fun.
name one fun thing you can do with a front wheel drive car
@@doodlebob-t1t Reverse donuts
@@doodlebob-t1t Autocross, Track day, really tight backroads, hauling ass on gravel roads. There's something seriously wrong if you can't have fun in fwd.
@@alexgiovinazzo6511 name one of those things that a rwd cant do
@@SkilllessFlorid3r yeah because that looks so good
FWD for everyday driving
RWD for drifts and donuts
Yes
just do reverse donuts
@@yaboi-km2qn XD
@Jason V.lhruaizela how is it not true? I agree with his statement as I have both FWD cars and RWD cars
agreed
Loved this video. I drive a rear wheel drive car and everything you said especially about everyday drive ability fits 10/10
"RWD cars are also more expensive than FWD cars."
Me, who bought a Crown Vic, which is RWD, for $800: *X to Doubt*
New yes, used its pretty much even sooooo
@@JohnDoe-qz9ji Got an '04, bought it at an auction down in South Carolina.
Rwd is also cheaper in pickups lol
@@jaliscoyguerrero is there such a thing as a FWD pickup?
@@lordflick895 honda ridgeline even though it looks more like a minivan than a truck 😂
I usually like Donut’s videos but this lowkey triggered me. And i own a FWD Accord 💀. Prefer AWD then RWD
I find awd so boring. Its a good system, just no excitement. I did love my integra back in the day though.
i like rwd and fwd if the fwd has a double wishbone. There is something special about a honda with double wishbone that has some konis and eibachs thrown in. Its just a blast to drive around corners.
Lol “triggered”
@@violet_lilac i can agree with that for sure
The issue is the scoring metrics used, they are heavily based on ease of use versus performance...
Using those same metrics would have a civic beating a Ferrari
Owning classic muscle cars, a balanced frc rwd, and an awesome Em1 I really think it all comes down to personal choice. My favorite car to drive was the em1 but you can’t beat drifting in a rwd.
He is missing a category. Towing
Agreed. There should have been another category called something like usability that would have covered stuff like towing and off-road.
Idk personally I've never off roaded my civic or frs my truck or suv on the other hand hell yeah
@@chrisking7295 well it depends, fwd shine off-road especially in the case of rally. Its why most either choose awd or fwd over rwd
Most cars are fwd in th UK and trust me they tow fine it's just a car that's gotta be heavy enough and have enough torque
Totally agree there since when could a FWD out perform in a towing situation? Put a 7x4 box trailer with a full load of dirt on a FWD and see what happens? But who buys a FWD and tows anything heavy anyway right. Pull your boat out the water with that. FWD 1 - RWD 4
i once literally saw this same discussion turn into a brawl and fist-fighting
ever heard the tone wood debate from guitarists? lol
lol I can imagine that. There is something about car enthusiasts and arguing.. Most can handle a car and use a wrench, but can't handle their emotions or use their words. :)
Well who won?? Lol
@@agentstarkk RWD obviously
Lol
I just don’t like the power being delivered to the same wheels that are steering,... it’s just awkward and don’t feel right
Trorqe steer is fun at least
@@UnicornBuffalo lmao fun when ur sliding into a ditch, other cars, lamposts...
@@UnicornBuffalo lmao fun when ur sliding into a ditch, other cars, lamposts...
CR Smyth
Dude, Mustangs are rwd...
Yea
My former driving school teacher used to have a RWD BMW with 180 horse power under the hood, and I used to drive that car in very snowy or icy situations (I got my licence in January, so I pretty much learned how to drive mostly during winter… in Switzerland). I never understood why people say RWD is dangerous in wet or any slippery conditions. I never found it to be any more difficult to deal with than FWD.
Probably because that car had asr and esp
@@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor I don't even't know what those are but my 20 year old RWD Ford with 210 hp doesn't have any electronic this/that controls and it's perfectly fine to drive in the wet. (It's Australia so we don't get the chance to try snow) If you're an idiot you could spin it out, but it's easy to recover and will never lose traction without warning. (Nor without a healthy dose of throttle)
4:42 he said “front wheel drive”. He meant to say “rear wheel drive”
What about the extra +100 points for RWD for Doriftos. Takumi is sad.
FWD for small power cars, RWD for more powerful cars
Civic Calzone I have a AWD, it’s a Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT 8 WK2. It’s Fun as hell, with a few modes, it’s damn near 500HP and it’s from 2012. I bet it’s more powerful than some of your RWD cars. Also the Trackhawk I know would kick ass.
@@Seb318 do you post this comment everywhere? You must be very proud of your overpriced jeep 🤦♂️
GSXR Z06 clearly you have never driven a 330bhp Megane R26 or a UP GTI stage-2.
Erebos 6 bout the same as a Scat and I got it for 15k. All packages, well kept car. 150k miles.
@@Seb318 and it will get spanked by a Tesla
about engine swaps. all those rwd that he mentions got an engine that also belong on a rwd, but those fwd also got a rwd engine. rayabuza->rwd, LS->rwd, lambo v12->rwd or awd... what i mean is: there's a lot of different models of fwd engines that you can swap from fwd to fwd (and it will still be a fwd). maybe it's not that interesting or none of this would be cool, but you still can do great mods and upgrades with it.
I'll be honest, I think this video was kind of meaningless. I was actually surprised not one single category was expressly dominated by one type and also surprised they did not end up rated equally.
A video like this would have been better if you highlighted exclusive advantages in my opinion. I dont feel like any concrete evidence was weighted strongly. For example, maintenance was over generalized and inaccurate. I dont think the additional components of a rwd make it more unreliable or prone to breaking than fwd. A drive shaft is just a tube that spins with simple connection points. Look at old jeeps and trucks with awd powertrains and their reliability is strongly praised or even considered superior. It just seemed wrong to me to look at maintenance when that is more a product of manufacturers than design choice.
RWD dominates 95% of racing classes, is physically the best way of running a fast car. It's where 90% of all sports cars lie. 4 points.
There are a few fast fwd cars people have made so that's 3 I guess.
@@benrumsey6155 exactly. two points would have been fair since fwd are simply average.
Ok so I don't know what force exactly this is(maybe entropy?) but when torque is applied, the longer or more complicated the system receiving the torque, the less torque that will actually net in the end.(not talking about the length of the lever applying toque, but the length of what's receiving torque) Like when using wrenches or impact guns to remove, tighten bolts, if you have a long extension it's harder to bust the bolts loose or tighten them than if you just have the socket right on the ratchet or with a shorter extension. Now applied to a drive shaft, if the engine is up front, and the car is FWD the axles are very short and not complicated. IE not alot of torque is lost in transfer from the transmission to the wheel. (Same thing really if you have mid engine RWD just flipped) but in a setup where it's front engine RWD, now we have this big long shaft between the source of torque and where it needs to be applied. This results in a loss of torque from the system. or another case, if you have too much torque(think big V8) you can actually torque the shaft so hard at the end by the motor, that the shaft will just snap from raw power, or if not the shaft the rear differential gear box. This problem can be fixed by having a shorter drive train. IE Front engine FWD or mid engine RWD. So it's not that one is really better for maintenance, just if you have a setup with a long drivetrain, it's just more likely to break. If we had cars that were rear engine FWD they would probably break difs and drive shafts too
@@Nub00005 I understand what you are saying, it is a valid point as I have seen an Audi break the drive shaft at the drag race. However, this is again a design issue more than a reliability issue or performance issue. I am unsure what the losses are between a front wheel drive or a rwd but they must be complex, especially since not all cars handle the same and not all engines deliver power the same way.
In terms of efficiency, I am inclined to agree with you that both the inertia and energy transfer of a fwd is more efficient, but I believe that the development of rwd cars in general is designed to either negate these losses or provide benefits unique to rwd that compensate for them such as improved handeling and weight distribution.
@@ChesterTheSpider ideally, the fastest most efficient way to do it. Is what Tesla did and have 2 engines with 2 short drive trains powering all wheels. Also I'm not hating on RWD I like all cars
Cheapest car in the world..
Mitsubishi Mirage and Nissan Micra:
Am I joke to you?
How much do they cost?
Tata Nano
Nobody:
Not even Donut Media:
James May: GOOD NEWS! The Dacia Sandero. . .
Umm.. hes specifies US Market...th-cam.com/video/RG4yj8gorzQ/w-d-xo.html
@@jasonmapotts Yeah, and the Mirage hasn't been discontinued. Yet. It starts at $13k
There were no rules for this points system! 😂
"Do you wanna see an LS Datsun?"
*me who's always wanted a 2jz swapped 280z* "WELL NOW I DO"
Barra 260z for me