Thanks for Watching! Find a link to all of my "Must Have", Favorite Tools HERE!! www.amazon.com/shop/chickanic?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_aipsfshop_aipsfchickanic_9ERPFPBNGQ924P8NS63B
You can also just test these by unscrewing them from the float bowl, reconnecting them to the wiring on the mower, and turning the key to the on position to see if it pulls the plunger down.
Or, once you remove the solenoid, you can just grab the plunger and move it in and out to see if it sticks. If it sticks in any position, or you push it in and it does not return to the fully extended position, then the plunger is froze up, or binding. Once i verify the plunger is not froze up, then I connect it to my 12V battery charger with two small leads and see if the plunger will energize.
I have a B and S 19.5 hp Model 31q677 and replaced the starter, solenoid and coil and now it turns over and will run with some starter fluid but isn’t getting any gas. Is it possibly the carburetor cut off causing the problem? Where do I find your reply? Thanks
A long time ago you demonstrated a little way to pull start lawnmowers. I use it, I'm a 67 years old, I saw my neighbor, who is older having difficulty starting a mower. So your method to the rescue. Pulling the slack out of the recoil, then pull, and at the same time push the mower forward! Vavoom started right up. He was pleased, and I gave the credit to YOU! ❤
One of the best Nikki videos I’ve seen, we’ve all watched just about everyone on TH-cam, if I had a nickel for every time I’ve dealt with a Nikki carb I’d be a millionaire! Thanks Bre for this, always love your videos!
This is the first time I've seen your video. How refreshing it was to watch you. Just plain easy to understand conversation and demonstration. I will be watching the rest of your videos. Great tips. I learned a lot. Thank you
I love your channel. I've been turning wrenches 30 years & every once in a while I'll have something stump me or have forgotten. Than maybe a day or two later or possibly a year I'll think did I check that. Sometimes I'm not sure how to test on these newer engines, carbs & governors. I'll look up your channel & see what I need to do. So far you haven't failed me yet & I always get them going. Also it's very helpful learning where to order parts. The shop in town will tell you they can't order part because they don't have a part listing. You'll leave mower, carb etc with them to try to find parts. Than go back a couple days later & they tell you you need to order a new engine because parts are no longer available. The only way to fix is order a new crate engine that had been updated. Than they charge you $200 check & advise & never even touched it. I call bs & flat refuse to go to any shop where I live. They don't have experience & get all cocky & just plain rude. There's times I just wanna drag them smart-ass kids over the counter & drag them outside. Ugh!!!
Thank you so much for this tip. I inherited another non-running riding mower (JD L105) from a neighbor that otherwise looked to be in good shape and decided it would be.a good project for my 19 year old son to get his hands dirty with. It wasn't starting at all. Spark was fine, but spraying starter fluid into the carb or even directly into the cylinder didn't work. Compression was fine. Before getting to the carb we popped the valve cover and found the valves completely out of adjustment with one rocker completely pointing 90 degrees in the wrong direction! We adjusted the valves properly and the engine was able to start but was running very rough with the choke open. Closing the choke smoothed it out somewhat but it still ran really lousy. Ordered the kit you recommended, disassembled and sprayed out the carb, and replaced only the large gasket and the two o-rings (one on the fuel inlet on top of the float bowl and one on the main jet), as well as the needle valve attached to the float. Put it all back together and it starts right up and runs perfectly! It was a good learning experience for my son -- I figured since he is going for mechanical engineering he better get a handle on these things ;-) Thanks again.
Thanks! Briggs with Nikki carburetor. I did everything right, shut fuel off ran the gas out, and went to start it this year and it flooded out. When I took the carburetor apart the jet fell out and I had no idea where it went. Also thanks for the tip about the o ring on the fuel uptake base causing the flooding issue. I replaced it with a nitrite o ring from Harbor Freight and I'm back in business! Thanks again!
I don't understand why these places just don't stock full-range o'ring kits in different styles from AC on down to oil and fuel resistant ones then you'll have the part you need when you need it at a super low price
Invaluable info about the Nikki carb. Who would have known these secrets that are crucial for fixing a huge percentage of Briggs engines??? Thanks, Chichanic!!
I'm a retired auto mechanic the seat for the needle valve is plastic so if the seat gets worn then you have to replace the whole entire seat that big plastic assembly was an eagle valve goes into would need to be replaced you have a nice day really enjoy your videos
I just paid $61 for a rebuild kit yesterday and only used half of what was included. What a joke. Wish I would have found your post before my purchase. Thank you for what you do Miss!!
Thank you so much, my fuel shut off switch just decided to keep falling out. So using your info I decided to eliminate it entirely by screwing in a bolt then using JB Weld so it never leaks again. There was no sense in replacing the carb with another junk carb when it runs fine now. I'm just going to use the manual fuel shut off now, simple & cheap. 4years ago the flywheel on my 2008 Cub Cadet 1046XL cracked & separated. New flywheels were more than $200 bucks so I JB Welded it too, still works fine, JB Weld is amazing stuff!
Need to also check it plugged into the engine harness, should have 12 volts on the red wire. Can be checked with a volt/ohm meter or a cheap test light.
Great video very good information thanks for sharing it have a blessed day. I left my lawnmower sitting all winter and when I tried to start it it wouldn't start after a long time I found out that the coil had quit working. These tips help alot thanks again have a blessed day
Hard to get parts right now? Everyone is having that problem. If you can't get Briggs parts, it's serious. Often you can simply use gumout. I've fixed more briggs carbs with nothing more than gumout and compressed air. Just make sure you don't blow your parts away.
Greetings Chickanic You seem to have missed out on the one point which I need most! What is the proper direction to put the jet back in? I dont know when you posted this nor do I know if you are still receiving comments to this page?? Love your lessons! I have actually learned a lot more from your videos than from all the others I have watched.
Thank you for all your help. There are some great channels on here, but, overall, I have found yours to be the most helpful and easy to understand. I’m a big fan.
I really enjoy your videos. Thank you for the info on the nikki rebuild kit. Worst carb design I have seen in 40 years. JD Zero Turn not flooding anymore...THANKS from SC
The same thing happens in the automobile industry with different manufacturers using the same parts. I once needed a replacement throttle position sensor. While looking online, I noticed that the same sensor was used in several different cars, but guess what the prices were? From $22 up to believe it or not-$150! This part is made by a large Japanese company. The exact same part numbers etc., but depending where you bought it, whether genuine dealer part or aftermarket store, the price variation was out of this world. Just recently I had to get a MAP sensor, same thing, they were priced up to $50, I got one for $25 just by checking what other cars were using the same part. So it looks like it pays to look around in the small engine market as well. Thanks for the video Chickanic, you always have good info. Cheers from Australia.
Since leaving auto mechanics and returning to lawn equipment, where it all started for me, I have come to detest Nikki carbs. We didn't have near the problems with the old style all metal carbs of yesteryear. Thanks for the info for sure.
My Troy-Bilt 15.5hp rider was misfiring like crazy. Bought a new carb. It ran smoother but was still missing. Fiddled with it to no end. Took my old carb apart. And looky there... the piston was all gummed up. Took it out, worked it and cleaned until it freed back up. Bought that gasket kit and did the mini rebuild. Runs like an absolute champion again and my dumb self was about to give it away and spent $4,000 on a zero turn. This video saved my ass.... and $4,000. I just wish I would have seen it 6 days ago. Sigh... I hate small engines.
I just can't tell you how much I appreciate and enjoy your posts Ma'am. Great stuff and beats anything that's ever come out of Hollywood: entertaining, informative and has helped my get all my power toys running again without depleting my meager savings. Thanks mucho- Yuda Best Miss Chikanick!
Before they put electic fuel shutoffs on carbs they used a brass "screw, bolt, whatever it's called" to hold the float bowl on. When I had one that the fancy electic unit got damaged, I pulled one of the old fasioned "screws" off another carb I had and ... never looked back! No leak, no shutoff to go bad! New and improved be damned!
I have to say that I am very impressed with you and your knowledge, skills and willingness to share not just the why it's broken and how to fix it but ways to get the right parts and for the least money. This is about my tenth video of yours and I would like to hear some of how you got started in this work and who or how did you learn so much?
I love learning about all the parts & your explanations of how, why and why not etc… is excellently explained. Added bonus is your voice and delivery isn’t grating nor distracting~ really helps me stay focused on content. Gotta say your voice would sound good as a DJ/radio . 👍
I needed to watch, as I bought a used riding mower and can't seem to get it running. I will check that fuel shut off solenoid. Thanks so much. Great video. Great Info. 😊
Thanks for the tip. Might come in pretty handy. That fuel shut off solenoid failed after about a year on my new Husq mower. Funny, I have messed around with small engines for 60 years and we never had to have fuel shut off solenoid, ever! So, I ground the tip off the plunger and away we went. Just to be sure I don't fill the CC with gas, I put a shut off valve in the fuel line. I "usually" remember to shut it, but I have had no problems since I did that. I suspect there are a lot of them modified in this manner. I know, you can't recommend it.
I was fighting with one of these earlier today. As soon as the owner said he put a new carb on, I cringed. I'm glad he kept the original. I was able to clean and rebuild it and get it to work. He got one cut off of the aftermarket and it never ran again.
Could not, for the life of me, get the new primary jet to pop in place inside the new transfer tube that came in the kit I purchased. Very frustrating. Had to use the old transfer tube with the new jet and o ring. Passed a pressure test. I wish you had taken the time to show that procedure and show if that primary jet is suppose to be flush with the tube. Thank you, you're the best!
You can buy the O rings for the jets individually in bulk online. I had a seal company in Texas manufacture me 1000 of them made out of Super Viton so they last longer. I think individual cost was around 1.25 per O ring but I have seen them in standard viton for as cheap as 80 cents each. You can also purchase the fuel inlet O rings as well individually in bulk. I got out of rebuilding any Nikki carburetors, unfortunately even when the parts cost are not a factor they just seem to never be perfect once they are gunked up bad, even with ultra sonic cleaner. Briggs now sales a (Walbro copy) replacement upgrade carb that’s manufactured by Ruxing which is a China manufacturer. They do have flaws but are 100 times batter than the NIKKI junk.
There's a company called The O-ring Store that would have the correct o-rings. I have bought replacement o-rings for my garden hose quick connects. They are not expensive.
Hi.A lot of us have figured out these tricks.but my question is sometimes the carb is too far gone and needs replacing.so up here we go with the A/M as the cost is dirt cheap versus OEM.Wee take our chances.Ex.that carb costs close too 300.00 cdn. from Briggs and freaks the costomer out.The prices in Canada almost exceed the value of the engine.You get my drift.You are doing great info vids keep up the good work
You are right. There are 100s of videos on rebuilding Nikki carbs for lawn mowers, and I'm about 40 into the play list, and not a single one shows how to replace the choke lever spring. Any advice would be great.
Great video, thanks!! Ya pretty much all aftermarket carbs are junk, thanks for the video, mine will run until it floods then I pull the fuel line off the pump & it runs until it starves. Tried the cleaners, still floods. Guess I gotta get into the carb......
Good video! Back when I was still active,if the cust would swear on a stack of bibles that,he ,was the sole operator of the unit,I would unscrew the solenoid on carb, and,replace it with a honda bowl nut. no more sticking plungers! Also,if you take the mn jet o-ring to a car parts store,who has an assortment of metric o-rings,you can get that o-ring. FYI.
You're right about Eliminator performance he shows how to fix parts like you are here instead of replacing them , and yes I tested 9volt batteries like that for a long time till I figured out hey there is a tester for that.
I purchased a Kohler 2275701-S this morning on line for just under $40.00. The price has gone up a bit in two years. Of course that price includes about ten dollars or so in shipping & handling charges. Good Video. I’m hoping to bring one of the Intek engines back to life real soon. It was overfueling to the point of hydrostatic locking the engine. Initially I thought there was a cam problem but I adjusted the valves and discovered that it was working correctly. Then I removed the spark plug…
I had this fuel cutoff solenoid die in the middle of mowing on my 48" tractor - the solenoid went open circuit and the engine stopped. I hacked the plunger so I could finish mowing and thankfully my local small engine shop had a replacement on the shelf!
On my 24hp (vertical shaft) Kohler I had a amount of white plastic pieces in the elbow of the fuel inlet. When I flushed the system I found several more. I have a stainless steel final fuel filter on the line. I purchased the unit, (Cub Cadet Z-Force L 48) new, so the carb had never been off. It was bad enough the engine only ran at about 40% RPM. I ended up using an O-Ring on the fuel bowl and had to replace the inlet needle and seat. A silicon will swell up if exposed to any petroleum product, so the best choice to me was the cheap old Butyl Rubber one. So far no leaks after 3 years. I still have no idea where the plastic came from. I am a experienced tool maker and mechanical engineer, and I do have a lot of experience with O-Rings. My best tool for O-Rings is a very old button hook. It never catches or tears them. Love your videos! Thanks you for taking the time to do them. Smiles!
Realize this is an older video but I just watched it. Several years ago my neighbor blew the engine on his older Murray tractor with a Briggs Intek. I grabbed a bunch of parts from it for my Nikki Intek MTD/Briggs Intek tractor, one of which was, lo & behold, a Walbro carb. Sure enough, the Briggs parts listing shows both a Walbro & a Nikki. So I swapped his Walbro for my Nikki & have had fewer problems with the Walbro, in fact none. Most folks don't know that an aftermarket Walbro (don't think an OEM is available anymore) is readily available online for under $15-$20. I agree, aftermarket can be iffy but not always. Anyway, the Walbro # is LMT 5-4993 As Chickanic warns, check to make sure the fuel hose barb lines up for your model.
Awesome videos Chicanic, only just discovered you, very informative, great tips too, and you make it seem so easy:) Got a few questions! So I had to take the bowl off as it was full of varnish goo (after I removed the solenoid, also not working, at he bottom of the bowl goo came out), upon further visual inspection noted build up on a port so took it apart and blew carb cleaner through all ports. Gaskets appear to be in good condition! Float spring works! Reassemble. Give it a few cranks (with choke) and still will not fire, check the bowl and bone dry! Check fuel line and free flow fuel from tank and filter! Fill carb manually and fired right up but as soon as the fuel in the carb ran out it cut out. Remove solenoid and bowl is dry! Which way should that jet be facing when reinstalling? If I placed it in backwards would it stop fuel from filling bowl?? What else could be the issue! Please help and thank you for what you do, keep up the great work. DIY as much as you can Matt
you just saved me bucks. therefore, you're cool. the battery trick works like a charm. Your tips also helped me diagnosis other carb issues. Very nice.
You MIGHT need to use right polarity of + and _ when checking the solenoid so switch the wires to be sure its not clicking. The small 9V battery will protect from too much current when testing also so totally safe to do. Only other point is the Solenoid is made for 12V so might NOT work with less voltage when testing, so be aware of that. might be better to get 2 wires from 12v battery to be sure.
Awesome ! I've been active on youtube for about a year a now and I only have gained 21 subscribers by far ... But my channel revolves around electric fans radios and other , but I'm happy to see a woman with a drew driver in her hand , not too many of those out there , keep up the good work! 😃👍👍
Lol. The best fix for a Nikki carb is to find the nearest trash can, and deposit it there. Make sure there is a bag in the can so you don't have to touch it again. An aftermarket carb is cheaper than a gasket for a Nikki (if it is even available), and most of the time they run better too.
i found this video very interesting ,,the kohler hack is good to know , i have dealt with a few of these nikkei carbs and they are very reliable for the most part ,,the steel bowl Walbro carb used on the older briggs is always having issues especially with rust caused by the steel bowl drawing moisture during storage
Great info. I've ran into o ring problems with these before. One of my hacks for the inlet o ring is to salvage a section of the old gasket that goes between the body and the white part. There is a round section that is just right to make a suitable replacement.
My Ariens 42 lawn tractor with a Briggs 18.5 hydro locked and flooded the whole engine without me knowing it until I went to start it a few months after I used it last. Found it broke the camshaft to I’m not happy with Briggs and obvious why I use to have a hard time to get it to turn over when I turn the key so sure the cylinder was full of fuel. Ariens never put a fuel shut off on the mower but I figured they must have had something to stop the fuel from doing this.
Question: which way does the jet face in the tube??? Does the o-ring seal against the plastic, or inside the brass tube? This is my current headache at work, I inherited the job because the tech who had it assigned went off on a “family emergency” trip several weeks ago and never came back…. THANK YOU FOR ANY ADVICE AND FOR ALL YOUR GREAT VIDEOS!!!
Bre - a suggestion if I may. Would you consider doing a piece on carburetors? Not just the maintenance which you have already done for specific models, but somewhat like a dive into the top 5 or 10 carbs used in 2-cycle applications. As I deep dive into the carbs used on my 2-cycle equipment, I find the carb on my Ryobi blower, is seemingly used on Sears, MTD, Echo, and a plethora of other blowers and trimmers, and they all seem to have different model numbers but look similar enough to nearly be the same. Walbro? It's hard to know if I'm being lead astray by the "net" as to what fits what. I find trying to find rebuild kits for specific units absolutely mind blowing, and the case is even worse with Sears as they use their own specific part numbers only searchable from within Sears. I found a rebuild kit for my Ryobi blower carb and it seemingly fits, I kid you not, over 50+ some odd carbs that obviously must have common parts. I've just found trying to find specific parts for specific carbs very frustrating.
Yeah, I ordered this kit, got it in today and it doesn't even resemble the parts needed for the nikki carb. No O-ring for jet and no O-ring for fuel inlet. Same exact number you quote. Going to have to return it. Should have just ordered a carburetor. thanks a lot.
Great video…I’ll take a closer look at my buddies lawn tractor…it’s flooding out like crazy. Also, that’s a great tip for testing the solenoid. I use my power probe to test them…anyone who works on equipment should invest in one. They make diagnosis so much easier
Big Bill it likely has a pinched O ring around the circular part of the plastic (2 piece bowl gasket?) provided the carb was pressure tested and passed ok. We use silicone spray when we install this O ring to avoid any pinching during reassembly.
hello, I could use your expertise on my riding mower craftsman 19 hp Briggs & Stration mod. 33R877 it had a Nikki carb. but a friend busted the idle air screw off and tried to drill it out. so I got a cheap replacement carb from Amazon. put it on got it running but it surged and popped a lot. when trying to idle the governor was slapping back and forth like crazy trying to stay running. If I applied the choke manually the engine would smooth out and the rpm's would go up. So I ordered another carb I installed the next carb. started it up. It didn't do much better almost the same thing again if the choke was applied manually it would smooth out. thought of maybe drilling out the jets but I got another carb and instaled it. this time I thought maybe it started okay and moved the throttle to Idle and bingo the idle purr but now when i move the throttle to high rev's it goes up runs a bit and then starts sputtering and the governor is moving but not as bad as before. when I manually apply the choke the engine boggs down i have to let the choke go and the engine pops and i get black smoke from the exhaust so now this tells me I running rich I move the governor towards the driver seat and the engine smooths up the rpms goes up. so what do you think ? the valve lash is okay... do you think I need to reset the governor?
Great video! My first Gravely zero turn had a dual barrel Nikki carb. Most aggravating carb I've ever dealt with. I put a BRAND NEW carb on it and it still wouldn't run right. Great info about the new kit too. I'll keep that in mind when I make my next purchase.
Okay I just found your channel and I love the meticulous nature of the way you explain each issue! I am learning so much about engines I don't even own. I do own a pressure washing company and will be visiting frequently for tips and tricks on fixing my Simpsons. Thanks!
I agree, jet fell out and I don't know if the small end goes in first or the larger end. She fiddled with the jet a few seconds but never showed which end went into the carb first
is there a way to check what parts are needed from the other brand when we know the B&S part numbers? I have two B&G engines on my wood chipper. one 208cc and one 420 cc with a double action starter (electric and manual start)
I usually put a little grease on that jet to hold it and put it back in. My question is the inlet o ring does it go on the white piece first or the metal carb first.
A year later ... But ... The wire to the fart stopper is pretty suspect too, as it runs over the top of the engine. The symtoms also mimic a bad coil. We have the toro LX 420 That only ran on full choke & the fuel filter wasn't fillig up. After foolig with it ... I got it to run .. but now it farts ...
I've rebuilt a couple of these and those (0-rings) were the problem. One of the tell tail gimmies, is gas in the crankcase, oil level was way up the dipstick and smelled like gas.
Great video even though you didn't share which way the Jet goes in. I would imagine little o-ring side first since the o-ring holds it in. I have a question that maybe you can answer maybe not. I am trying to find out if my 2019 John Deere X380 Lawn Tractors Carburetor ( It's a 23hp Kawasaki Model #FR691V engine). My question is the metal shaft or pin that slides through the bottom carburetor body under the Bowl and the holes in the Float, Is it removable to remove the Float? I have taken quite a Few apart and the shaft just slides out, This seems Different. And don't want to break it a New Carb, is $375 oem! You do a Great Job, and would appreciate your help? Thank You Michael
So inflation definitely hit these rebuild kits but I'm gonna go ahead and order this kit and see if it solves my problem, because my main jet definitely does NOT sit properly in the tube. Also the float bowl gasket itself that I have is clearly stretched and I don't think is sealing properly either. THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO!
That damn tiny O ring has been hell on me for years, I even broke out and old creepy crawlers mold kit to modify into making it myself some success but failure in the end. Tiny specific ones especially. Thanks just subbed.
that shut thing in the bottom of the carb bowl is for is to stop the engine from back firing if engine is going at full govenor if you cut the engine to an idle count to 10 then shut it off it should stop the back firing or most of it when you shut it off you can get rid of that carb shut off by taking a carb off a push mower use a shorter bowl and the bolt off the bottom then remove the wire and by pass the shut off cut engine to idle before count to 10 then shut off that will stop most of the back firing
I have the Nikki 593197 carburetor, I've rebuilt it and bought another replacement carburetor. However I'm still having surge problems after a short period of time with either carburetor. As in less than 10 hours time. This goes to a poulan pro 20VA46 . Is there an alternate carburetor I can purchase that is better? Thank you I really enjoy your channel and subscribe you've helped me considerably.
I just rebuilt my Nikki carb on an old craftsman 2000. Solved gas leaking into oil. But when I put back on I noticed it now surges at low idle only. Runs fine once I throttle up. Carb is clean. I’m wondering if the throttle spring got stretched or is there another possible issue I should look for?
I have a 20 year old Wheelhouse 5500 generator with a Briggs & Stratton 10hp engine on it. It starts up on first pull, but runs best on half choke. On full run it hesitate just a little. The carburetor is a Nikki model 204412-0142E1. I have taken it apart and tried to clean it but it didn't fix the problem. Will this o-ring work on this carburator, and what else would you suggest?
Thanks for Watching! Find a link to all of my "Must Have", Favorite Tools HERE!! www.amazon.com/shop/chickanic?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_aipsfshop_aipsfchickanic_9ERPFPBNGQ924P8NS63B
You can also just test these by unscrewing them from the float bowl, reconnecting them to the wiring on the mower, and turning the key to the on position to see if it pulls the plunger down.
Thanks for saving me the trouble of having to find a 9-volt battery. Your suggestion is much simpler. 😊
Just did this today won’t pull it down unless you slightly touch it. Then it hold down well. I’ll try some penetrating oil in the morning. 🤞
Good info
Or, once you remove the solenoid, you can just grab the plunger and move it in and out to see if it sticks. If it sticks in any position, or you push it in and it does not return to the fully extended position, then the plunger is froze up, or binding. Once i verify the plunger is not froze up, then I connect it to my 12V battery charger with two small leads and see if the plunger will energize.
I have a B and S 19.5 hp
Model 31q677 and replaced the starter, solenoid and coil and now it turns over and will run with some starter fluid but isn’t getting any gas. Is it possibly the carburetor cut off causing the problem? Where do I find your reply? Thanks
Isn't it amazing when someone actually wants to do something good how easy it is Thanks Kohler for such a kit.
The more I watch this young lady's videos, the more I like her. Clear and consise videos too!
A long time ago you demonstrated a little way to pull start lawnmowers. I use it, I'm a 67 years old, I saw my neighbor, who is older having difficulty starting a mower. So your method to the rescue. Pulling the slack out of the recoil, then pull, and at the same time push the mower forward! Vavoom started right up. He was pleased, and I gave the credit to YOU! ❤
You're the prettiest mechanic I ever seen
One of the best Nikki videos I’ve seen, we’ve all watched just about everyone on TH-cam, if I had a nickel for every time I’ve dealt with a Nikki carb I’d be a millionaire! Thanks Bre for this, always love your videos!
Went to your shop this week and you fixed me up with new jet and o-ring. Mower is working great! No more surging! Thanks so much!
Yay!
Would you share the shop number
I fix really old engines
This is the first time I've seen your video. How refreshing it was to watch you. Just plain easy to understand conversation and demonstration. I will be watching the rest of your videos. Great tips. I learned a lot. Thank you
I love your channel. I've been turning wrenches 30 years & every once in a while I'll have something stump me or have forgotten. Than maybe a day or two later or possibly a year I'll think did I check that. Sometimes I'm not sure how to test on these newer engines, carbs & governors. I'll look up your channel & see what I need to do. So far you haven't failed me yet & I always get them going. Also it's very helpful learning where to order parts. The shop in town will tell you they can't order part because they don't have a part listing. You'll leave mower, carb etc with them to try to find parts. Than go back a couple days later & they tell you you need to order a new engine because parts are no longer available. The only way to fix is order a new crate engine that had been updated. Than they charge you $200 check & advise & never even touched it. I call bs & flat refuse to go to any shop where I live. They don't have experience & get all cocky & just plain rude. There's times I just wanna drag them smart-ass kids over the counter & drag them outside. Ugh!!!
Thank you so much for this tip. I inherited another non-running riding mower (JD L105) from a neighbor that otherwise looked to be in good shape and decided it would be.a good project for my 19 year old son to get his hands dirty with. It wasn't starting at all. Spark was fine, but spraying starter fluid into the carb or even directly into the cylinder didn't work. Compression was fine. Before getting to the carb we popped the valve cover and found the valves completely out of adjustment with one rocker completely pointing 90 degrees in the wrong direction! We adjusted the valves properly and the engine was able to start but was running very rough with the choke open. Closing the choke smoothed it out somewhat but it still ran really lousy. Ordered the kit you recommended, disassembled and sprayed out the carb, and replaced only the large gasket and the two o-rings (one on the fuel inlet on top of the float bowl and one on the main jet), as well as the needle valve attached to the float. Put it all back together and it starts right up and runs perfectly! It was a good learning experience for my son -- I figured since he is going for mechanical engineering he better get a handle on these things ;-) Thanks again.
I'd put a bolt in the hole,.......and put a 1/4 inch shut off valve in,.....problem solved.
But always great video's.
Thanks! Briggs with Nikki carburetor. I did everything right, shut fuel off ran the gas out, and went to start it this year and it flooded out. When I took the carburetor apart the jet fell out and I had no idea where it went. Also thanks for the tip about the o ring on the fuel uptake base causing the flooding issue. I replaced it with a nitrite o ring from Harbor Freight and I'm back in business! Thanks again!
I don't understand why these places just don't stock full-range o'ring kits in different styles from AC on down to oil and fuel resistant ones then you'll have the part you need when you need it at a super low price
Invaluable info about the Nikki carb. Who would have known these secrets that are crucial for fixing a huge percentage of Briggs engines??? Thanks, Chichanic!!
I'm a retired auto mechanic the seat for the needle valve is plastic so if the seat gets worn then you have to replace the whole entire seat that big plastic assembly was an eagle valve goes into would need to be replaced you have a nice day really enjoy your videos
I just paid $61 for a rebuild kit yesterday and only used half of what was included. What a joke. Wish I would have found your post before my purchase. Thank you for what you do Miss!!
Thank you so much, my fuel shut off switch just decided to keep falling out. So using your info I decided to eliminate it entirely by screwing in a bolt then using JB Weld so it never leaks again. There was no sense in replacing the carb with another junk carb when it runs fine now. I'm just going to use the manual fuel shut off now, simple & cheap. 4years ago the flywheel on my 2008 Cub Cadet 1046XL cracked & separated. New flywheels were more than $200 bucks so I JB Welded it too, still works fine, JB Weld is amazing stuff!
Need to also check it plugged into the engine harness, should have 12 volts on the red wire. Can be checked with a volt/ohm meter or a cheap test light.
Great video very good information thanks for sharing it have a blessed day. I left my lawnmower sitting all winter and when I tried to start it it wouldn't start after a long time I found out that the coil had quit working. These tips help alot thanks again have a blessed day
I have always tested 9v batteries with my tongue 👅.. gets me energized!!
Shocking
@realoldgeekster Sounds like you're a die hard!
Are you positive on that
No negative comments please.
This is great to know. I do wish Briggs would be more sympathetic to the consumers when it comes to repairing and replacing carbs. Thank you.
Hard to get parts right now? Everyone is having that problem. If you can't get Briggs parts, it's serious.
Often you can simply use gumout. I've fixed more briggs carbs with nothing more than gumout and compressed air. Just make sure you don't blow your parts away.
Greetings Chickanic You seem to have missed out on the one point which I need most! What is the proper direction to put the jet back in? I dont know when you posted this nor do I know if you are still receiving comments to this page?? Love your lessons! I have actually learned a lot more from your videos than from all the others I have watched.
Thank you for all your help. There are some great channels on here, but, overall, I have found yours to be the most helpful and easy to understand. I’m a big fan.
I really enjoy your videos. Thank you for the info on the nikki rebuild kit. Worst carb design I have seen in 40 years. JD Zero Turn not flooding anymore...THANKS from SC
The same thing happens in the automobile industry with different manufacturers using the same parts. I once needed a replacement throttle position sensor. While looking online, I noticed that the same sensor was used in several different cars, but guess what the prices were? From $22 up to believe it or not-$150! This part is made by a large Japanese company. The exact same part numbers etc., but depending where you bought it, whether genuine dealer part or aftermarket store, the price variation was out of this world. Just recently I had to get a MAP sensor, same thing, they were priced up to $50, I got one for $25 just by checking what other cars were using the same part.
So it looks like it pays to look around in the small engine market as well. Thanks for the video Chickanic, you always have good info. Cheers from Australia.
Since leaving auto mechanics and returning to lawn equipment, where it all started for me, I have come to detest Nikki carbs. We didn't have near the problems with the old style all metal carbs of yesteryear. Thanks for the info for sure.
I bought an O ring kit that has a variety of sizes in it. Cheap, and useful. Harbor Freight.
My Troy-Bilt 15.5hp rider was misfiring like crazy. Bought a new carb. It ran smoother but was still missing. Fiddled with it to no end. Took my old carb apart. And looky there... the piston was all gummed up. Took it out, worked it and cleaned until it freed back up. Bought that gasket kit and did the mini rebuild. Runs like an absolute champion again and my dumb self was about to give it away and spent $4,000 on a zero turn.
This video saved my ass.... and $4,000. I just wish I would have seen it 6 days ago. Sigh... I hate small engines.
I just can't tell you how much I appreciate and enjoy your posts Ma'am. Great stuff and beats anything that's ever come out of Hollywood: entertaining, informative and has helped my get all my power toys running again without depleting my meager savings. Thanks mucho- Yuda Best Miss Chikanick!
You said it right, you will save me a ton of money. The Nikki I took apart looks to have a worn o ring.Thank You
Before they put electic fuel shutoffs on carbs they used a brass "screw, bolt, whatever it's called" to hold the float bowl on. When I had one that the fancy electic unit got damaged, I pulled one of the old fasioned "screws" off another carb I had and ... never looked back! No leak, no shutoff to go bad! New and improved be damned!
I have to say that I am very impressed with you and your knowledge, skills and willingness to share not just the why it's broken and how to fix it but ways to get the right parts and for the least money. This is about my tenth video of yours and I would like to hear some of how you got started in this work and who or how did you learn so much?
I love learning about all the parts & your explanations of how, why and why not etc… is excellently explained. Added bonus is your voice and delivery isn’t grating nor distracting~ really helps me stay focused on content. Gotta say your voice would sound good as a DJ/radio . 👍
I needed to watch, as I bought a used riding mower and can't seem to get it running. I will check that fuel shut off solenoid. Thanks so much. Great video. Great Info. 😊
Just got a mower with a nikki and the Kohler kit solved all my problems Thanks
Thanks for the tip. Might come in pretty handy. That fuel shut off solenoid failed after about a year on my new Husq mower. Funny, I have messed around with small engines for 60 years and we never had to have fuel shut off solenoid, ever! So, I ground the tip off the plunger and away we went. Just to be sure I don't fill the CC with gas, I put a shut off valve in the fuel line. I "usually" remember to shut it, but I have had no problems since I did that. I suspect there are a lot of them modified in this manner. I know, you can't recommend it.
I was fighting with one of these earlier today. As soon as the owner said he put a new carb on, I cringed. I'm glad he kept the original. I was able to clean and rebuild it and get it to work. He got one cut off of the aftermarket and it never ran again.
Could not, for the life of me, get the new primary jet to pop in place inside the new transfer tube that came in the kit I purchased. Very frustrating. Had to use the old transfer tube with the new jet and o ring. Passed a pressure test. I wish you had taken the time to show that procedure and show if that primary jet is suppose to be flush with the tube. Thank you, you're the best!
You can buy the O rings for the jets individually in bulk online. I had a seal company in Texas manufacture me 1000 of them made out of Super Viton so they last longer. I think individual cost was around 1.25 per O ring but I have seen them in standard viton for as cheap as 80 cents each. You can also purchase the fuel inlet O rings as well individually in bulk. I got out of rebuilding any Nikki carburetors, unfortunately even when the parts cost are not a factor they just seem to never be perfect once they are gunked up bad, even with ultra sonic cleaner. Briggs now sales a (Walbro copy) replacement upgrade carb that’s manufactured by Ruxing which is a China manufacturer. They do have flaws but are 100 times batter than the NIKKI junk.
There's a company called The O-ring Store that would have the correct o-rings. I have bought replacement o-rings for my garden hose quick connects. They are not expensive.
@@briantayes2418 I used them for a hard to find O ring for my home inlet water pressure control valve.
Do you know the model #?
I wish I had this Kohler part number a year ago... This info you provide is very valuable,... Thank you
Not just a beautiful woman but so smart too.
And so humble too.
Thank you so much beautiful!!
Hi.A lot of us have figured out these tricks.but my question is sometimes the carb is too far gone and needs replacing.so up here we go with the A/M as the cost is dirt cheap versus OEM.Wee take our chances.Ex.that carb costs close too 300.00 cdn. from Briggs and freaks the costomer out.The prices in Canada almost exceed the value of the engine.You get my drift.You are doing great info vids keep up the good work
I have had great results with aftermarket carburetors (cheap Chinese carbs). Plug and play. $20-$40 bucks vs $60-$120, no brainer.
Moo pop pop
Great video.😊 i have just recently replaced my carb because it was surging. New carb surging as well.
You are right. There are 100s of videos on rebuilding Nikki carbs for lawn mowers, and I'm about 40 into the play list, and not a single one shows how to replace the choke lever spring. Any advice would be great.
Great video, thanks!! Ya pretty much all aftermarket carbs are junk, thanks for the video, mine will run until it floods then I pull the fuel line off the pump & it runs until it starves. Tried the cleaners, still floods. Guess I gotta get into the carb......
Good video! Back when I was still active,if the cust would swear on a stack of bibles that,he ,was the sole operator of the unit,I would unscrew the solenoid on carb, and,replace it with a honda bowl nut. no more sticking plungers! Also,if you take the mn jet o-ring to a car parts store,who has an assortment of metric o-rings,you can get that o-ring. FYI.
Why change the bowl nut? Just cut the plunger stem off with a pair of side cutters.
THANK YOU SO MUCH for that tip about the Kohler carb rebuild kit for the Nikki CRAP carburetors!!!! That was a fantastic find!!!!
You're right about Eliminator performance he shows how to fix parts like you are here instead of replacing them , and yes I tested 9volt batteries like that for a long time till I figured out hey there is a tester for that.
I purchased a Kohler 2275701-S this morning on line for just under $40.00. The price has gone up a bit in two years. Of course that price includes about ten dollars or so in shipping & handling charges. Good Video. I’m hoping to bring one of the Intek engines back to life real soon. It was overfueling to the point of hydrostatic locking the engine. Initially I thought there was a cam problem but I adjusted the valves and discovered that it was working correctly. Then I removed the spark plug…
I just bought one today on ebay for 20.00
I had this fuel cutoff solenoid die in the middle of mowing on my 48" tractor - the solenoid went open circuit and the engine stopped. I hacked the plunger so I could finish mowing and thankfully my local small engine shop had a replacement on the shelf!
On my 24hp (vertical shaft) Kohler I had a amount of white plastic pieces in the elbow of the fuel inlet. When I flushed the system I found several more. I have a stainless steel final fuel filter on the line. I purchased the unit, (Cub Cadet Z-Force L 48) new, so the carb had never been off. It was bad enough the engine only ran at about 40% RPM.
I ended up using an O-Ring on the fuel bowl and had to replace the inlet needle and seat. A silicon will swell up if exposed to any petroleum product, so the best choice to me was the cheap old Butyl Rubber one. So far no leaks after 3 years. I still have no idea where the plastic came from.
I am a experienced tool maker and mechanical engineer, and I do have a lot of experience with O-Rings. My best tool for O-Rings is a very old button hook. It never catches or tears them.
Love your videos! Thanks you for taking the time to do them.
Smiles!
Realize this is an older video but I just watched it. Several years ago my neighbor blew the engine on his older Murray tractor with a Briggs Intek. I grabbed a bunch of parts from it for my Nikki Intek MTD/Briggs Intek tractor, one of which was, lo & behold, a Walbro carb. Sure enough, the Briggs parts listing shows both a Walbro & a Nikki. So I swapped his Walbro for my Nikki & have had fewer problems with the Walbro, in fact none. Most folks don't know that an aftermarket Walbro (don't think an OEM is available anymore) is readily available online for under $15-$20. I agree, aftermarket can be iffy but not always. Anyway, the Walbro # is LMT 5-4993 As Chickanic warns, check to make sure the fuel hose barb lines up for your model.
Thanks for the shout-out Chickanic!
Thanks for making awesome content!! Love your videos!
Z246 husqv I have the issue of it flooding itself what do you think I should do
Excellent,excellent video.Your way of explaining and teaching your knowledge is appreciate.Good luck and keep the good work,from Puerto Rico.
Thanks. I replaced my junk carb with ebay last fall. It runs but not well. Gonna pop this in, and see how she does.
Awesome videos Chicanic, only just discovered you, very informative, great tips too, and you make it seem so easy:)
Got a few questions!
So I had to take the bowl off as it was full of varnish goo (after I removed the solenoid, also not working, at he bottom of the bowl goo came out), upon further visual inspection noted build up on a port so took it apart and blew carb cleaner through all ports. Gaskets appear to be in good condition! Float spring works!
Reassemble. Give it a few cranks (with choke) and still will not fire, check the bowl and bone dry! Check fuel line and free flow fuel from tank and filter!
Fill carb manually and fired right up but as soon as the fuel in the carb ran out it cut out. Remove solenoid and bowl is dry!
Which way should that jet be facing when reinstalling? If I placed it in backwards would it stop fuel from filling bowl??
What else could be the issue!
Please help and thank you for what you do, keep up the great work.
DIY as much as you can Matt
Thank you Bre for the information you were right and I was wrong. You make a great info videos and now youe #1 fan.
you just saved me bucks. therefore, you're cool. the battery trick works like a charm. Your tips also helped me diagnosis other carb issues. Very nice.
You MIGHT need to use right polarity of + and _ when checking the solenoid so switch the wires to be sure its not clicking. The small 9V battery will protect from too much current when testing also so totally safe to do. Only other point is the Solenoid is made for 12V so might NOT work with less voltage when testing, so be aware of that. might be better to get 2 wires from 12v battery to be sure.
Awesome ! I've been active on youtube for about a year a now and I only have gained 21 subscribers by far ... But my channel revolves around electric fans radios and other , but I'm happy to see a woman with a drew driver in her hand , not too many of those out there , keep up the good work! 😃👍👍
Lol. The best fix for a Nikki carb is to find the nearest trash can, and deposit it there. Make sure there is a bag in the can so you don't have to touch it again. An aftermarket carb is cheaper than a gasket for a Nikki (if it is even available), and most of the time they run better too.
I agree 100 percent. The aftermarket carbs suck.
i found this video very interesting ,,the kohler hack is good to know , i have dealt with a few of these nikkei carbs and they are very reliable for the most part ,,the steel bowl Walbro carb used on the older briggs is always having issues especially with rust caused by the steel bowl drawing moisture during storage
Great info. I've ran into o ring problems with these before. One of my hacks for the inlet o ring is to salvage a section of the old gasket that goes between the body and the white part. There is a round section that is just right to make a suitable replacement.
Thank you for being a good teacher you Steve a donyboy73 doctor are extremely helpful people on you tube regard Garry from Australia cheers 😊
Wow thanks for that information about the gasket set for nikki as I need one for my mower and didn't realise that kohler done the same, cheers
My Ariens 42 lawn tractor with a Briggs 18.5 hydro locked and flooded the whole engine without me knowing it until I went to start it a few months after I used it last. Found it broke the camshaft to I’m not happy with Briggs and obvious why I use to have a hard time to get it to turn over when I turn the key so sure the cylinder was full of fuel. Ariens never put a fuel shut off on the mower but I figured they must have had something to stop the fuel from doing this.
Thank You M'am!! Now I know where that little 'jet' fell out of!! Thank you X a Million!
Julio Rodriguez
Thanks for Nikki tip my cub cadet flooded engine and into crankcase will rebuild carb and see if this gets me running again
Good video Chick, do new carbs with parts bag including hose,clamps,etc, is the bowl gasket need to be installed?
Or is it an extra one?
When I like a TH-camr I let all the ads play for them instead of skipping!
Question: which way does the jet face in the tube??? Does the o-ring seal against the plastic, or inside the brass tube? This is my current headache at work, I inherited the job because the tech who had it assigned went off on a “family emergency” trip several weeks ago and never came back…. THANK YOU FOR ANY ADVICE AND FOR ALL YOUR GREAT VIDEOS!!!
I saw in another video that you drop the jet in the tube with the o-ring side facing down. I just finished this job and it worked.
Bre - a suggestion if I may. Would you consider doing a piece on carburetors? Not just the maintenance which you have already done for specific models, but somewhat like a dive into the top 5 or 10 carbs used in 2-cycle applications. As I deep dive into the carbs used on my 2-cycle equipment, I find the carb on my Ryobi blower, is seemingly used on Sears, MTD, Echo, and a plethora of other blowers and trimmers, and they all seem to have different model numbers but look similar enough to nearly be the same. Walbro? It's hard to know if I'm being lead astray by the "net" as to what fits what. I find trying to find rebuild kits for specific units absolutely mind blowing, and the case is even worse with Sears as they use their own specific part numbers only searchable from within Sears. I found a rebuild kit for my Ryobi blower carb and it seemingly fits, I kid you not, over 50+ some odd carbs that obviously must have common parts. I've just found trying to find specific parts for specific carbs very frustrating.
Yeah, I ordered this kit, got it in today and it doesn't even resemble the parts needed for the nikki carb. No O-ring for jet and no O-ring for fuel inlet. Same exact number you quote. Going to have to return it. Should have just ordered a carburetor. thanks a lot.
Easy solution to the solenoid valve, snip the plunger and reduce the throttle to zero before shutting off the mower.
Thank you! Gas flooded my smapper Briggs and Stratton engine this winter. Learning the hard way. Bummer.
Great video…I’ll take a closer look at my buddies lawn tractor…it’s flooding out like crazy. Also, that’s a great tip for testing the solenoid. I use my power probe to test them…anyone who works on equipment should invest in one. They make diagnosis so much easier
bill harbor freight sells a stethascope for a couple dollars where using it you can hear the shut off solenoid clear if its working or not
Big Bill it likely has a pinched O ring around the circular part of the plastic (2 piece bowl gasket?) provided the carb was pressure tested and passed ok. We use silicone spray when we install this O ring to avoid any pinching during reassembly.
Thanks for the tips guys... I'm going to look at it today.
hello, I could use your expertise on my riding mower craftsman 19 hp Briggs & Stration mod. 33R877 it had a Nikki carb. but a friend busted the idle air screw off and tried to drill it out.
so I got a cheap replacement carb from Amazon. put it on got it running but it surged and popped a lot. when trying to idle the governor was slapping back and forth like crazy trying to stay running. If I applied the choke manually the engine would smooth out and the rpm's would go up. So I ordered another carb I installed the next carb.
started it up. It didn't do much better almost the same thing again if the choke was applied
manually it would smooth out. thought of maybe drilling out the jets but I got another carb and instaled it. this time I thought maybe it started okay and moved the throttle to Idle and bingo the idle purr but now when i move the throttle to high rev's it goes up runs a bit and then starts sputtering and the governor is moving but not as bad as before. when I manually apply the choke the engine boggs down i have to let the choke go and the engine pops and i get black smoke from the exhaust so now this tells me I running rich I move the governor towards the driver seat and the engine smooths up the rpms goes up.
so what do you think ? the valve lash is okay... do you think I need to reset the governor?
Great video! My first Gravely zero turn had a dual barrel Nikki carb. Most aggravating carb I've ever dealt with. I put a BRAND NEW carb on it and it still wouldn't run right. Great info about the new kit too. I'll keep that in mind when I make my next purchase.
I have a part number for that small o ring by itself and we always stock it.
We get them thru Kawasaki.
care to share?
Great I just save a lot. I have watched a lot of videos but this is the only one that really works for me. Thank you so much!
Okay I just found your channel and I love the meticulous nature of the way you explain each issue! I am learning so much about engines I don't even own. I do own a pressure washing company and will be visiting frequently for tips and tricks on fixing my Simpsons. Thanks!
Glad I found you , You just saved me money I like that. gonna watch as many video's of your as i can . Thanks
I agree, jet fell out and I don't know if the small end goes in first or the larger end. She fiddled with the jet a few seconds but never showed which end went into the carb first
is there a way to check what parts are needed from the other brand when we know the B&S part numbers? I have two B&G engines on my wood chipper. one 208cc and one 420 cc with a double action starter (electric and manual start)
I usually put a little grease on that jet to hold it and put it back in. My question is the inlet o ring does it go on the white piece first or the metal carb first.
When they flood I sock oring in brake fluid and it gets really tight and seals good
A year later ... But ... The wire to the fart stopper is pretty suspect too, as it runs over the top of the engine. The symtoms also mimic a bad coil. We have the toro LX 420 That only ran on full choke & the fuel filter wasn't fillig up. After foolig with it ... I got it to run .. but now it farts ...
I've rebuilt a couple of these and those (0-rings) were the problem. One of the tell tail gimmies, is gas in the crankcase, oil level was way up the dipstick and smelled like gas.
This is great news! I am in need of the jet now. I will order this kit ASAP!😊
Great video even though you didn't share which way the Jet goes in. I would imagine little o-ring side first since the o-ring holds it in. I have a question that maybe you can answer maybe not. I am trying to find out if my 2019 John Deere X380 Lawn Tractors Carburetor ( It's a 23hp Kawasaki Model #FR691V engine). My question is the metal shaft or pin that slides through the bottom carburetor body under the Bowl and the holes in the Float, Is it removable to remove the Float? I have taken quite a Few apart and the shaft just slides out, This seems Different. And don't want to break it a New Carb, is $375 oem! You do a Great Job, and would appreciate your help?
Thank You
Michael
So inflation definitely hit these rebuild kits but I'm gonna go ahead and order this kit and see if it solves my problem, because my main jet definitely does NOT sit properly in the tube. Also the float bowl gasket itself that I have is clearly stretched and I don't think is sealing properly either. THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO!
That damn tiny O ring has been hell on me for years, I even broke out and old creepy crawlers mold kit to modify into making it myself some success but failure in the end. Tiny specific ones especially. Thanks just subbed.
that shut thing in the bottom of the carb bowl is for is to stop the engine from back firing if engine is going at full govenor if you cut the engine to an idle count to 10 then shut it off it should stop the back firing or most of it when you shut it off you can get rid of that carb shut off by taking a carb off a push mower use a shorter bowl and the bolt off the bottom then remove the wire and by pass the shut off cut engine to idle before count to 10 then shut off that will stop most of the back firing
i mean use the carb off push mower for parts you need
Just want to say thank you, you saved my sanity and answered a pile of questions in a short video! Lol
I have the Nikki 593197 carburetor, I've rebuilt it and bought another replacement carburetor. However I'm still having surge problems after a short period of time with either carburetor. As in less than 10 hours time. This goes to a poulan pro 20VA46 . Is there an alternate carburetor I can purchase that is better? Thank you I really enjoy your channel and subscribe you've helped me considerably.
As soon as you brought out that 9v battery my tongue started tingling 😛 Ugh, it's Still Buzzing
Very valuable info, thanks much. Will help many. Some things in this I didn't know .
I just rebuilt my Nikki carb on an old craftsman 2000. Solved gas leaking into oil. But when I put back on I noticed it now surges at low idle only. Runs fine once I throttle up. Carb is clean. I’m wondering if the throttle spring got stretched or is there another possible issue I should look for?
I have a 20 year old Wheelhouse 5500 generator with a Briggs & Stratton 10hp engine on it. It starts up on first pull, but runs best on half choke. On full run it hesitate just a little. The carburetor is a Nikki model 204412-0142E1. I have taken it apart and tried to clean it but it didn't fix the problem. Will this o-ring work on this carburator, and what else would you suggest?