My single biggest gripe with these movies comes in Movie 3...well, aside from the fact that there is NOTHING about the Battle of the Five Armies in the book except Bilbo falling down and knocking himself out. I think you will know it too. Bilbo sneaks out of Erebor with the Arkenstone, and visits with Kings Bard and Thranduil. He offers them the Arkenstone to both of them as a way to prevent the bloodshed. He does the right thing, knowing it will cost him friends he holds more dear than his cozy little hole. In the book, Thranduil is more noble than his movie version. But he "looked at Bilbo with a new wonder. 'Bilbo Baggins!' he said. 'You are more worthy to wear the armour of elf-princes than many that have looked more comely in it.'" Now, Thranduil is a veteran of the War of Wrath. He fought under Fingolfin, he has known most of the most noble beings to ever grace Middle-Earth. And he is comparing Bilbo's selflessness and desire to do the right thing directly to them. It is absolutely so perfect, and shows the quality of his character---and the movie just ignores it.
You mentioned 5E and I wanted to ask if you've considered doing any D&D related videos this year because I love your video on Bards and would be down for more videos like it. For resources I recommend TH-camr Ginny Di, the video 'Defeat Your Demons with Dungeons & Dragons | FANDOM UNCOVERED', and the book 'Fifty Years of Dungeons & Dragons'. That last ones is especially helpful because it has some extremely insightful essays on how western fantasy approaches races.
In my mind, I'm Gandalf. The mighty wizard, fighter of Balrogs, layer of plans... but in my heart I know I'm Bilbo. Eater of snacks, taker of naps, and reader of books.
“I came from the end of bag, but no bag went over me. I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ring-winner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider.” - Bilbo Baggins
You know the Misty Mountains Cold song is a masterpiece when it's the first bit of original music used in the trailers, invoking the same feelings Bilbo experiences upon hearing it, and drawing us in to a familiar yet altogether more adventurous time in Middle-earth... As for the films as they turned out, they still feel like unfinished business.
1. Something that I’ve always found amusing is how LotR is so huge and influential that a lot of people retroactively think of The Hobbit as being a prequel to it, especially because of the film versions. A prequel is a story containing events that precede those of an existing work, and LotR was a sequel that came out years after The Hobbit. It very much reminds me of how the film Wrath of Khan is so ingrained in our pop culture consciousness that we think about the Star Trek TOS episode Space Seed in terms of its relationship to Wrath of Khan and not the other way around despite that film being a sequel to it. 2. On January 11th, 2019, Marisha Ray tweeted “’Why are D&D character backgrounds always so tragic?’ Because content happy people don’t feel the need to go out and HUNT DRAGONS.” One could say that creating a happy character who has no dramatic drive for anything is no fun (plus who doesn’t want to be a brooding sorcerer or whatever)! That being said, plenty of people get involved in activism because their morals are in check and they instinctively care about others (aka basic empathy). This reminds me of when in her book ‘Embrace Your Weird’, Felicia Day said that “In an age of glamorizing antiheroes and mocking anything earnest, it’s difficult not to feel dorky diving into emotions that are considered ‘saintly’…I don’t think two millennia of lessons about ‘good’ human qualities is worth throwing out because they’re slightly cringeworthy. If we’re able to picture ourselves as virtuous, amazing creatures rising above whatever base enemies are holding us back, we can overcome the toxic stuff.”
I am convinced the studio's demand to make three epic length movies from the fairly short book was a terrible idea. I much prefer the 80 minute animated Rankin Bass movie.
I enjoyed the hobbit trilogy. I went in knowing its an adaption but also that given the BTS drama that happened, PJ and crew always tried to stay true to tolkien's spirit. Most of my gripes come from what the studio forced. Otherwise I liked bilbo, but my fav was smaug. His portrayal as a psychpathic, intelligent character/person -ish was brilliant and nothing will ever take away from that
@@Jess_of_the_Shire have you seen the mocap behind the scenes? Ben Cumberbatch was having the time of his life crawling on all fours and being a dragon, and that energy translates to the film.
I'm absolutely not a fan of _The Hobbit_ film trilogy but I give credit to Martin Freeman's commitment to Bilbo in a production where it would have been easy to get lost amidst all the CGI and redundant characters.
Thank you for all your fantastically insightful video essays, Jess! You're a great ambassador for all things Tolkien. Whenever I need to hear a soothing yet inspiring voice that tells of the wonders of Middle-earth, I know just where to turn. Don't worry about your pace of production. I'm sure all of us here have the utmost respect for your process. Take care and have a great weekend!
Jess there are more than a few people on the Tube here who comment on Tolkien and his work, but your channel is my favorite because you tell the stories as eloquently as the person who wrote them. The other day I got to hear your telling of the village cook and the Faerie folk. It was magnificent I left a lengthy comment. With all that is going on in the world right now and the snow piling up, a good story is just what we need right now. I read The Hobbit when I was in the 6th grade.1966 I think. I loved it. Didn’t much care for the cartoon but enjoyed the movie and Freeman’s portrayal of Bilbo. Gonna look for your video on the cartoon now. Thanks for making this a good Hobbity day.
The hobbits are basically brits, who enjoy their gardens and simple pleasures and such. And being drawn from Hobbiton into a harsh, brutal world of strange people, war and tyranny is Tolkiens experience of WW1. Both Hobbit and LOTR are based on this, but with a different style of storytelling. Morgan Freeman has played Bilbo Baggins and Arthur Dent, both iconic underachievers that find themselves on the journey.
Love this video! In the beginning of the Rankin-Bass version of The Hobbit, both Bilbo and Gandalf vocalize part of Bilbo’s interior monologue about his “tookishness.” I always appreciated his wistfulness in this scene of the R-B Hobbit.
It would seem that Merry in LotR was the bilbo character- responsible sand trying to keep up with the world rushing on. pippin is an adolecent type who gets into trouble but it is merry who chooses to go along with the rohirim and his friendship and parting with theoden seems to fall into that same catagory.
Have you ever read the Tolkien pastiche novels of Dennis L. McKiernan? He wrote a couple dozen of them, with the original pair submitted to the Tolkien heirs as a continuation. When they rejected his offering he changed his creations a little bit and published them anyway. Many of the stories that Tolkien only hinted at were fleshed out into full novels by McKiernan. The first three published were known as *The Iron Tower Trilogy,* and were basically the Lord of the Rings re-told.
I only discovered this channel on Christmas Eve. Since then I've lost count of the number of videos I've watched. A happy, hobbity New Year to Jess and her viewers!😊
Which video of hers did you first discover? I remember the first video of hers that the TH-cam algorithm recommended to me was her reaction to Soviet LotR, which is hilarious to watch.
I love your treatment of Bilbo, truly one of my favorite characters. Maybe because the Hobbit was my first exposure to those characters. Can you maybe go into your opinion as to how much Gandalf knew about the Bagginses, and why he chose Bilbo and Frodo for such portentous missions? Why them? And why Hobbits?
I love the Hobbit movies. I don't care that that is unpopular, lol. I think you summed it up beautifully. The movies are prequels and action adventures. The book was a children's (I would argue YA) book that got adult sequels. I enjoy both for different reasons, and PJ made his changes from a place of respect for the canon.
The Jackson Hobbit movies have some really rough parts. I get why there are haters out there. Get it. I don't like the excessive silly parts myself (the barrel scene is so cringe). And yet...as you point out there are great parts too. The super cool scene looking back to the battle before Moria, where the king is beheaded, was amazing. You should review all the movies! .
Some of my favorite children's stories were ones that had deep lessons in them. One of my favorites was "The Phantom Tollbooth". A gift I am very, very sad to have lost is my father (who my mother divorced when I was 2) reading me "The Hobbit" on tape. He did it well, with different inflections and emphasis patterns for different characters.
I agree with you on all points. I think that The Hobbit as a children's movie, done with the production value of LotR, would have been a masterpiece. It was a missed opportunity, in my opinion, to be another way to introduce children to Tolkien's world, and let them later discover the more sophisticated themes of LotR, the Silmarillion, and all the rest. Another way to ensure that the love for Middle-Earth "goes ever on and on."
Poor PJ really got lost in the weeds with the new tech available and couldn't help but play with it. But the real enemy was time - a planned 2 film major blockbuster, that had to at least equal if not surpass his own previous achievement....and because of shenanigans with the studios, the original director Del Toro had to leave the project and PJ had to pick it up, with no time to do the careful setup work that he had for the first trilogy. Everything was rushed, too rushed. The poor man was also ill during the shoot, and then so overwhelmed, he shut down production for an entire day to try to figure out what he was doing. The over- reliance on CGI was in part because he had to make up the time somehow, and a green screen is easier and faster than building a set from scratch. The green screen got so overused, that Ian McClellan damn near had a breakdown. All in all, we got what we got, and lucky to get it... And it's far better than the other production courtesy of Mr Bezos... Having not seen War of the Rohrric yet, I reserve judgment.
@@Jess_of_the_Shire Yeah they planed on a duology but WB wanted a trilogy. Lindsay Ellis pointed out in her Hobbit videos how the cast and crew all looked absolutely exhausted in the BTS clips of film 3.
Although I very much enjoyed the films (both the LotR and, less so, The Hobbit), they do not hold a candle to the books. It's not just the different media; it's also the way Tolkien used the English language. The use of slightly archaic phrases (no-one today uses a phrase like "Child of the West") adds so much, in my opinion, anyway. If memory serves, the films (understandably) removed most such phrases. I'd also like to compliment Jess on her ability to weave a tale. Her use of rhetorical devices, like cadence, stress, and even music make for a very enjoyable experience. It's easy to get lost in the story she's telling, until the advert, anyway. Well done!
The language is an excellent observation! It makes sense that the most enjoyed scenes from the movies are the ones that borrow heavily from the book dialogue lol. Thank you so much for watching!
i loved them both but the hobbit found a deeper place in me. maybe it had something to do with your first love. thank you for feeding that place of hope within me that still says that all things are possible
I must agree: the whole point of Bilbo is his unconventional heroism. His heroism, when it is roused, is moral, not physical. That is very hard to transmit on film, particularly when the 'prequel' (it was never that), becomes a twisted kind of 'sequel'. They should have just left well alone, though there was too much money at stake for that - though that would have deprived us of Martin Freeman's Bilbo, which is the sole good thing about any of the cluster**** that was the Hobbit trilogy (yes, I'm still bitter at sitting through that ridiculous third part). Anyway, to try to turn Bilbo into some form of 'conventional' hero is to so spectacularly miss the point that they'd have been better off re-writing the whole thing with a new character called Tilto or somesuch.
Seeing as you are branching out a little from Tolkien (the Dune videos come to mind), I was wondering whether you are planning on making some videos on the His Dark Materials Trilogy by Philip Pullman. I have only just finished The Golden Compass, and man, it is so so good.
There are plenty of children's stories that are perfectly acceptable to older audiences, e.g. Wallace and gromit, the earlier harry potter books. I still, as a 50+ year old enjoy reading the hobbit, it is relaxing, you do imagine yourself walking in Bilbo's shoes.
for all of Frodo's quest, i really think Bilbo is the greatest of hobbits. A scholar, traveller and able to be friends with elves and dwarves equally. Kind to the poor and happy to burst stuffed shirts. Freeman was very good but he does is frustrated blustering which i never imagined book bilbo doing the parting between bilbo and thorin is one of my favorite exchanges in all of tolkien's work. at long last thorin understands and respects bilbo and bilbo understabnds and forgives thorin his harsh words.
Bilbo Baggins is one of my favorite characters and while I am happy that The Hobbit was made into a movie by Peter Jackson, I’ll still say the book is better by far (I loved his take on Lord of the Rings much more). I agree a hundred percent and have said something similar to friends many times about Children’s Literature being much more clever in its simplicity than many people give it credit for. I am always bothered by those who scoff at the idea that a child’s tale could bring you adult wisdom. When I read A.A. Milne’s House at Pooh Corner I swore the author meant those books for adults as much as toddlers.
I've only watched to Hobbit movies yet, and quite enjoyed them. Bilbo was delightful indeed, and so was the humor! My biggest problem with them is, why must Thorin and his nephews die? I was not expecting major character death in the resolution of a children's story. Especially Kili, I did not see it coming that the love story would turn so tragic, and for what? Even in LOTR, which is meant to be adult and much darker, nearly everyone survives and gets a happy ending, and the love stories end happy. Thgouh, to be honest, I am partially just salty about Tolkien killing off some of my favorite chararcters. I became very attached to Thorin, just like I became very attached to Boromir in LOTR. And for both of them, once they waver from the right path, it's game over. No chance for redemption, they must die. Yes, one could argue "but it's a heroic sacrifice, that's redemption, blah blah", but after watching ATLA and Zuko's redemption arc, I have higher standards for that. Meanwhile, some of the hobbits get plot armor, even if they mostly stumble through their stories. Don't get me wrong, I wish well for our small fellas, but don't the bigger fellas deserve some grace too? I am just shaken and sad.
I enjoy the Hobbit films but I can easily see the problems. I admit, it might be because I know all the drama behind the scenes. And I think they are trying to tell 2 stories, the hobbit and a "prequel " to Lord of the Rings. Trying to get you more attached to the characters. But I also see Bilbo as someone who came home from more than an adventure and needed to deal with all the death. And he did this by telling his story, but he had to do it in such a way as to make it acceptable to other Hobbits. Specifically, children because the children would listen to him without dismissing him. The way the Fellowship changes tone, from Bilbo writing it to Frodo writing it. I think 2 people with ptsd and guilt came home and told others about it in different ways. Bilbo took years to write down his story, telling people the story over and over and it's edited. Frodo took the red book and had to get it all out. Now, having said all this, I agree with you that the hobbit is a great children's book, and it doesn't need to be anything more. Bilbo is a great everyman character.
With his long wooden pipe fuzzy, woolly toes he lives in a hobbit-hole and everybody knows him Bilbo! Bilbo! Bilbo Baggins He's only three feet tall...
@@Jess_of_the_Shire Indeed! GirlNextGondor talked about it a little in her video 'From Mordor to Metal: Tolkien's Legacy in Modern Music' if you're at all interested. The last two chapters in that video before the conclusion are definitely my favorites.
Watch the Hobbit: Tolkein Edit (search term) it is by far the better telling of the tale and focuses on Bilbo and removes the other superfluous stuff. Cuts all 3 movies down to 4 hr 29m and well worth watching in one sitting.
The Hobbity thing is that there is a very fine film buried in a large bloated overblown pseudo epic. And the basic problem is the reverse of that of LOTR. In the latter, PJ said his express purpose was to strip the narrative of anything that distracted from the core tale of Frodo and the Ring. This left most of the other characters lightly limned, some of them almost criminally diminished and some excised altogether (Bombabil not a problem here). So, as monumental as LOTR already was, it is actually too short and could easily have been expanded in order to properly motivate follow and provide eucatastophies for the many main characters. The Hobbit as filmed has the opposite problem. As you note the source is essentially a picaresque trek by an unimportant mediocre middle-class middle-aged fellow whose character growth is mostly by accident or at need. The movies tried to make his tale the Hero's Quest and added to this the apparent requirement that the other main characters be fleshed out, adding where it seemed necessary (no, Tauriel was NOT necessary). So we see that he might well have recognized his prior error but then made the reverse in the sequel. Which means that, were all that fluff and tack=on to be removed, the story would again be the simple picaresque trek but with the one added element necessary to link to the prior films: the notion of the Ring's importance being amplified as the film does do. I have seen fan cuts of about four hours total that tell the story admirably without doing other than simply snipping excess length. I do wish PJ would consider returning and doing this.
The Hobbit movies has some good parts, like Martin Freeman. But they have a lot of bad things too, like overlong action sequences (Misty Mountain chase and the barrel ride comes to mind). I prefer them on DVD, because then I can fast forward the boring parts.
No matter your feelings about The Hobbit Trilogy, Martin Freeman utterly OWNED his role as Bilbo Baggins! Now that it was mentioned that Gollum (in the OG The Hobbit book) had given the Ring away after simply being bested by Bilbo in riddles, it would've been fascinating to see what Tolkien would've done with the story of LOTR (& the greater universe of Arda) had he stuck to the original version of the narrative. If the Ring were to be just that (a ring) then what would have Sauron used as his world-dominating weapon? Considering how Tolkien lived until 1973, it's possible he might have had Sauron (in this alternative timeline) use a weapon akin to the atom bomb used by the US in 1945, as its clear the horrors of the world wars echo in his stories.
For me, , Martin Freeman was the only redeeming quality of the film adaptation. He looked to be having a great time in every scene, whereas everyone else acted as though they had wandered on to the set and were waiting to wander back off it.
Spot on. The production was hell and the films were an absolute mess, but Martin Freeman did his best. Did he overplay Bilbo at times? Imo yes, but he still seemed to understand the heart of the character. The films would've done better to focus more on him instead of needless subplots given he's THE HOBBIT in question.
Based on the behind the scenes, it seems like everyone that worked on these movies had a lot of love for the story. Freeman may have just been the one where it shows through, not encumbered by overdone writing, CGI and makeup
@@Jess_of_the_Shire He's a great physical actor and interjected a lot of wonderful reactions throughout. I'm especially fond of his *OH SHIT OH SHIT OH SHIT* reactions to Smaug moving and waking up while he's trying to be stealthy.
Use code SHIRE for 51% Off Any Yearly Subscription to World Anvil: www.worldanvil.com/?c=JessoftheShire
My single biggest gripe with these movies comes in Movie 3...well, aside from the fact that there is NOTHING about the Battle of the Five Armies in the book except Bilbo falling down and knocking himself out. I think you will know it too. Bilbo sneaks out of Erebor with the Arkenstone, and visits with Kings Bard and Thranduil. He offers them the Arkenstone to both of them as a way to prevent the bloodshed. He does the right thing, knowing it will cost him friends he holds more dear than his cozy little hole. In the book, Thranduil is more noble than his movie version. But he "looked at Bilbo with a new wonder. 'Bilbo Baggins!' he said. 'You are more worthy to wear the armour of elf-princes than many that have looked more comely in it.'"
Now, Thranduil is a veteran of the War of Wrath. He fought under Fingolfin, he has known most of the most noble beings to ever grace Middle-Earth. And he is comparing Bilbo's selflessness and desire to do the right thing directly to them. It is absolutely so perfect, and shows the quality of his character---and the movie just ignores it.
You mentioned 5E and I wanted to ask if you've considered doing any D&D related videos this year because I love your video on Bards and would be down for more videos like it. For resources I recommend TH-camr Ginny Di, the video 'Defeat Your Demons with Dungeons & Dragons | FANDOM UNCOVERED', and the book 'Fifty Years of Dungeons & Dragons'. That last ones is especially helpful because it has some extremely insightful essays on how western fantasy approaches races.
In my mind, I'm Gandalf. The mighty wizard, fighter of Balrogs, layer of plans... but in my heart I know I'm Bilbo. Eater of snacks, taker of naps, and reader of books.
And that is a glorious thing in itself!
“I came from the end of bag, but no bag went over me. I am the friend of bears and the guest of eagles. I am Ring-winner and Luckwearer; and I am Barrel-rider.”
- Bilbo Baggins
You know the Misty Mountains Cold song is a masterpiece when it's the first bit of original music used in the trailers, invoking the same feelings Bilbo experiences upon hearing it, and drawing us in to a familiar yet altogether more adventurous time in Middle-earth...
As for the films as they turned out, they still feel like unfinished business.
I'm snowed in, perfect timing for a cozy Jess video! ❄️ 💙
The streets where I live are drenched in salt.
I hope you're able to stay safe and warm!
@@Jess_of_the_Shire I second this.
@@Jess_of_the_Shire We're safe, warm, and enjoying the snow. Thanks!
1. Something that I’ve always found amusing is how LotR is so huge and influential that a lot of people retroactively think of The Hobbit as being a prequel to it, especially because of the film versions. A prequel is a story containing events that precede those of an existing work, and LotR was a sequel that came out years after The Hobbit. It very much reminds me of how the film Wrath of Khan is so ingrained in our pop culture consciousness that we think about the Star Trek TOS episode Space Seed in terms of its relationship to Wrath of Khan and not the other way around despite that film being a sequel to it.
2. On January 11th, 2019, Marisha Ray tweeted “’Why are D&D character backgrounds always so tragic?’ Because content happy people don’t feel the need to go out and HUNT DRAGONS.” One could say that creating a happy character who has no dramatic drive for anything is no fun (plus who doesn’t want to be a brooding sorcerer or whatever)! That being said, plenty of people get involved in activism because their morals are in check and they instinctively care about others (aka basic empathy). This reminds me of when in her book ‘Embrace Your Weird’, Felicia Day said that “In an age of glamorizing antiheroes and mocking anything earnest, it’s difficult not to feel dorky diving into emotions that are considered ‘saintly’…I don’t think two millennia of lessons about ‘good’ human qualities is worth throwing out because they’re slightly cringeworthy. If we’re able to picture ourselves as virtuous, amazing creatures rising above whatever base enemies are holding us back, we can overcome the toxic stuff.”
In my humble opinion, Thorin's delivery at his death scene in the Rankin Bass version is stunning.
I am convinced the studio's demand to make three epic length movies from the fairly short book was a terrible idea. I much prefer the 80 minute animated Rankin Bass movie.
Sadly I have to agree.
Your appreciation for Tolkien's work is infectious.
Thank you for creating this content and bringing us along on your journey.
You're too kind! Thank you for watching!
I enjoyed the hobbit trilogy. I went in knowing its an adaption but also that given the BTS drama that happened, PJ and crew always tried to stay true to tolkien's spirit. Most of my gripes come from what the studio forced. Otherwise I liked bilbo, but my fav was smaug. His portrayal as a psychpathic, intelligent character/person -ish was brilliant and nothing will ever take away from that
The first scene of Smaug is one of the best parts of the movies. He's so emotive, despite being CGI!
@@Jess_of_the_Shire Smaug is easily my favorite part of that trilogy! The design, menace, and gravitas are definitely a sight to behold.
@@Jess_of_the_Shire have you seen the mocap behind the scenes? Ben Cumberbatch was having the time of his life crawling on all fours and being a dragon, and that energy translates to the film.
@@marieroberts5664 He reportedly visited a zoo to study the behavior and body language of actual reptiles.
I'm absolutely not a fan of _The Hobbit_ film trilogy but I give credit to Martin Freeman's commitment to Bilbo in a production where it would have been easy to get lost amidst all the CGI and redundant characters.
Martin Freeman's Bilbo is just the same guy Martin Freeman always plays.
Perfect video for a snowy day
10:04 No shame shame!! Goosebumps every time. Its peak cinema, in that i Feel what the Dearves are singing and i also miss home with them.
Thank you for all your fantastically insightful video essays, Jess! You're a great ambassador for all things Tolkien. Whenever I need to hear a soothing yet inspiring voice that tells of the wonders of Middle-earth, I know just where to turn. Don't worry about your pace of production. I'm sure all of us here have the utmost respect for your process. Take care and have a great weekend!
Jess there are more than a few people on the Tube here who comment on Tolkien and his work, but your channel is my favorite because you tell the stories as eloquently as the person who wrote them. The other day I got to hear your telling of the village cook and the Faerie folk. It was magnificent I left a lengthy comment. With all that is going on in the world right now and the snow piling up, a good story is just what we need right now. I read The Hobbit when I was in the 6th grade.1966 I think. I loved it. Didn’t much care for the cartoon but enjoyed the movie and Freeman’s portrayal of Bilbo. Gonna look for your video on the cartoon now. Thanks for making this a good Hobbity day.
I'm so glad you've been finding comfort in my videos! It's lovely having you as part of our little community, and a joy to share stories with you
Your coverage of Tolkien is some of the most refreshing content on YT.
Be well this year, and take your time!
We will happily be patient for you Jess.
The hobbits are basically brits, who enjoy their gardens and simple pleasures and such. And being drawn from Hobbiton into a harsh, brutal world of strange people, war and tyranny is Tolkiens experience of WW1. Both Hobbit and LOTR are based on this, but with a different style of storytelling. Morgan Freeman has played Bilbo Baggins and Arthur Dent, both iconic underachievers that find themselves on the journey.
Love this video! In the beginning of the Rankin-Bass version of The Hobbit, both Bilbo and Gandalf vocalize part of Bilbo’s interior monologue about his “tookishness.” I always appreciated his wistfulness in this scene of the R-B Hobbit.
It would seem that Merry in LotR was the bilbo character- responsible sand trying to keep up with the world rushing on. pippin is an adolecent type who gets into trouble but it is merry who chooses to go along with the rohirim and his friendship and parting with theoden seems to fall into that same catagory.
Oh happy day, a new cozy Jess of the Shire video!
Have you ever read the Tolkien pastiche novels of Dennis L. McKiernan? He wrote a couple dozen of them, with the original pair submitted to the Tolkien heirs as a continuation. When they rejected his offering he changed his creations a little bit and published them anyway. Many of the stories that Tolkien only hinted at were fleshed out into full novels by McKiernan. The first three published were known as *The Iron Tower Trilogy,* and were basically the Lord of the Rings re-told.
I only discovered this channel on Christmas Eve. Since then I've lost count of the number of videos I've watched. A happy, hobbity New Year to Jess and her viewers!😊
Welcome to the channel! It's lovely to have you here
Which video of hers did you first discover? I remember the first video of hers that the TH-cam algorithm recommended to me was her reaction to Soviet LotR, which is hilarious to watch.
Now we need book v movie gollum
I love your treatment of Bilbo, truly one of my favorite characters. Maybe because the Hobbit was my first exposure to those characters. Can you maybe go into your opinion as to how much Gandalf knew about the Bagginses, and why he chose Bilbo and Frodo for such portentous missions? Why them? And why Hobbits?
I love the Hobbit movies. I don't care that that is unpopular, lol. I think you summed it up beautifully. The movies are prequels and action adventures. The book was a children's (I would argue YA) book that got adult sequels. I enjoy both for different reasons, and PJ made his changes from a place of respect for the canon.
The Jackson Hobbit movies have some really rough parts. I get why there are haters out there. Get it. I don't like the excessive silly parts myself (the barrel scene is so cringe). And yet...as you point out there are great parts too. The super cool scene looking back to the battle before Moria, where the king is beheaded, was amazing. You should review all the movies! .
Some of my favorite children's stories were ones that had deep lessons in them. One of my favorites was "The Phantom Tollbooth". A gift I am very, very sad to have lost is my father (who my mother divorced when I was 2) reading me "The Hobbit" on tape. He did it well, with different inflections and emphasis patterns for different characters.
Thank you Jess. I appreciate it.
I agree with you on all points. I think that The Hobbit as a children's movie, done with the production value of LotR, would have been a masterpiece. It was a missed opportunity, in my opinion, to be another way to introduce children to Tolkien's world, and let them later discover the more sophisticated themes of LotR, the Silmarillion, and all the rest. Another way to ensure that the love for Middle-Earth "goes ever on and on."
Poor PJ really got lost in the weeds with the new tech available and couldn't help but play with it.
But the real enemy was time - a planned 2 film major blockbuster, that had to at least equal if not surpass his own previous achievement....and because of shenanigans with the studios, the original director Del Toro had to leave the project and PJ had to pick it up, with no time to do the careful setup work that he had for the first trilogy.
Everything was rushed, too rushed. The poor man was also ill during the shoot, and then so overwhelmed, he shut down production for an entire day to try to figure out what he was doing. The over- reliance on CGI was in part because he had to make up the time somehow, and a green screen is easier and faster than building a set from scratch. The green screen got so overused, that Ian McClellan damn near had a breakdown.
All in all, we got what we got, and lucky to get it...
And it's far better than the other production courtesy of Mr Bezos...
Having not seen War of the Rohrric yet, I reserve judgment.
wanted to leave a quick thank you for this content, Jess. always calming and uplifting presentations.
Thank you so much for watching!
The movies had beautiful scenes and awful hours. It's like... like butter scraped over too much bread.
Perfectly put!
@@Jess_of_the_Shire Yeah they planed on a duology but WB wanted a trilogy. Lindsay Ellis pointed out in her Hobbit videos how the cast and crew all looked absolutely exhausted in the BTS clips of film 3.
I see The Inklings behind you on the shelves. Have you ever explored this group of men (I could look it up, I suppose) in previous posts?
Nicely done, always look forward to your videos.
I will never be a Hobit movie hater. Love is all i Choose in my Heart, it is my choice after all.
Although I very much enjoyed the films (both the LotR and, less so, The Hobbit), they do not hold a candle to the books. It's not just the different media; it's also the way Tolkien used the English language. The use of slightly archaic phrases (no-one today uses a phrase like "Child of the West") adds so much, in my opinion, anyway. If memory serves, the films (understandably) removed most such phrases.
I'd also like to compliment Jess on her ability to weave a tale. Her use of rhetorical devices, like cadence, stress, and even music make for a very enjoyable experience. It's easy to get lost in the story she's telling, until the advert, anyway. Well done!
The language is an excellent observation! It makes sense that the most enjoyed scenes from the movies are the ones that borrow heavily from the book dialogue lol. Thank you so much for watching!
@@Jess_of_the_Shire So not the barrel scene then 🙃?
A prequel that came with its own Bilbo Baggage.
Yes. Please take care of yourself. It is important and so are .
Hiii! I'm early today😁I really enjoy your content and you're doing great 👍sending love from a girl who nerd outs to your videos😊
i loved them both but the hobbit found a deeper place in me. maybe it had something to do with your first love. thank you for feeding that place of hope within me that still says that all things are possible
I must agree: the whole point of Bilbo is his unconventional heroism. His heroism, when it is roused, is moral, not physical. That is very hard to transmit on film, particularly when the 'prequel' (it was never that), becomes a twisted kind of 'sequel'. They should have just left well alone, though there was too much money at stake for that - though that would have deprived us of Martin Freeman's Bilbo, which is the sole good thing about any of the cluster**** that was the Hobbit trilogy (yes, I'm still bitter at sitting through that ridiculous third part). Anyway, to try to turn Bilbo into some form of 'conventional' hero is to so spectacularly miss the point that they'd have been better off re-writing the whole thing with a new character called Tilto or somesuch.
Diagetically Bilbo's memoir was written before Bilbo or most of the characters knew the meaning nor the fullness of the war they prefigure
Seeing as you are branching out a little from Tolkien (the Dune videos come to mind), I was wondering whether you are planning on making some videos on the His Dark Materials Trilogy by Philip Pullman. I have only just finished The Golden Compass, and man, it is so so good.
There are plenty of children's stories that are perfectly acceptable to older audiences, e.g. Wallace and gromit, the earlier harry potter books. I still, as a 50+ year old enjoy reading the hobbit, it is relaxing, you do imagine yourself walking in Bilbo's shoes.
for all of Frodo's quest, i really think Bilbo is the greatest of hobbits. A scholar, traveller and able to be friends with elves and dwarves equally.
Kind to the poor and happy to burst stuffed shirts.
Freeman was very good but he does is frustrated blustering which i never imagined book bilbo doing
the parting between bilbo and thorin is one of my favorite exchanges in all of tolkien's work. at long last thorin understands and respects bilbo and bilbo understabnds and forgives thorin his harsh words.
Bilbo Baggins is one of my favorite characters and while I am happy that The Hobbit was made into a movie by Peter Jackson, I’ll still say the book is better by far (I loved his take on Lord of the Rings much more). I agree a hundred percent and have said something similar to friends many times about Children’s Literature being much more clever in its simplicity than many people give it credit for. I am always bothered by those who scoff at the idea that a child’s tale could bring you adult wisdom. When I read A.A. Milne’s House at Pooh Corner I swore the author meant those books for adults as much as toddlers.
I've always been curious about the first edition of The Hobbit book
It is a available now, called "The Hobbit, facsimile edition"
17 actually. 11 for ROTK alone.
At a young age? Those movies only just came out!
The Hobbit movies were a hot mess with a few nice scenes, however what really killed it for me, even in the fan edits it just how toxic Thorin is.
I love the hobbit book and i allso like the hobbit movies 😺😺😺
I've only watched to Hobbit movies yet, and quite enjoyed them. Bilbo was delightful indeed, and so was the humor! My biggest problem with them is, why must Thorin and his nephews die? I was not expecting major character death in the resolution of a children's story. Especially Kili, I did not see it coming that the love story would turn so tragic, and for what? Even in LOTR, which is meant to be adult and much darker, nearly everyone survives and gets a happy ending, and the love stories end happy.
Thgouh, to be honest, I am partially just salty about Tolkien killing off some of my favorite chararcters. I became very attached to Thorin, just like I became very attached to Boromir in LOTR. And for both of them, once they waver from the right path, it's game over. No chance for redemption, they must die. Yes, one could argue "but it's a heroic sacrifice, that's redemption, blah blah", but after watching ATLA and Zuko's redemption arc, I have higher standards for that. Meanwhile, some of the hobbits get plot armor, even if they mostly stumble through their stories. Don't get me wrong, I wish well for our small fellas, but don't the bigger fellas deserve some grace too? I am just shaken and sad.
Have you made any videos about the animated Hobbit? It's not perfect but I adore that adaptation.
I enjoy the Hobbit films but I can easily see the problems. I admit, it might be because I know all the drama behind the scenes. And I think they are trying to tell 2 stories, the hobbit and a "prequel " to Lord of the Rings. Trying to get you more attached to the characters. But I also see Bilbo as someone who came home from more than an adventure and needed to deal with all the death. And he did this by telling his story, but he had to do it in such a way as to make it acceptable to other Hobbits. Specifically, children because the children would listen to him without dismissing him. The way the Fellowship changes tone, from Bilbo writing it to Frodo writing it. I think 2 people with ptsd and guilt came home and told others about it in different ways. Bilbo took years to write down his story, telling people the story over and over and it's edited. Frodo took the red book and had to get it all out.
Now, having said all this, I agree with you that the hobbit is a great children's book, and it doesn't need to be anything more. Bilbo is a great everyman character.
loved the vid, wanna read the hobbit again
If The Hobbit came out as is without LOTR before it, it would be adored. It is still Middle Earth. It's still great.
not withstanding the Old Took, Bilbo, book and movie , was THE Hobbit!
Jess, have you seen Leonard Nimoy's song about Bilbo?
It's a classic!
With his long wooden pipe
fuzzy, woolly toes
he lives in a hobbit-hole and everybody knows him
Bilbo! Bilbo! Bilbo Baggins
He's only three feet tall...
@@Jess_of_the_Shire Indeed! GirlNextGondor talked about it a little in her video 'From Mordor to Metal: Tolkien's Legacy in Modern Music' if you're at all interested. The last two chapters in that video before the conclusion are definitely my favorites.
Watch the Hobbit: Tolkein Edit (search term) it is by far the better telling of the tale and focuses on Bilbo and removes the other superfluous stuff. Cuts all 3 movies down to 4 hr 29m and well worth watching in one sitting.
M4's Book Edition fanedit is even better imo, as it even uses high quality CGI on top of re-editing.
Could you do a deep dive into the changes to the Hobbit? Thanks
A 1/14th share would affect my credit score!
The Hobbity thing is that there is a very fine film buried in a large bloated overblown pseudo epic. And the basic problem is the reverse of that of LOTR. In the latter, PJ said his express purpose was to strip the narrative of anything that distracted from the core tale of Frodo and the Ring. This left most of the other characters lightly limned, some of them almost criminally diminished and some excised altogether (Bombabil not a problem here). So, as monumental as LOTR already was, it is actually too short and could easily have been expanded in order to properly motivate follow and provide eucatastophies for the many main characters.
The Hobbit as filmed has the opposite problem. As you note the source is essentially a picaresque trek by an unimportant mediocre middle-class middle-aged fellow whose character growth is mostly by accident or at need. The movies tried to make his tale the Hero's Quest and added to this the apparent requirement that the other main characters be fleshed out, adding where it seemed necessary (no, Tauriel was NOT necessary). So we see that he might well have recognized his prior error but then made the reverse in the sequel. Which means that, were all that fluff and tack=on to be removed, the story would again be the simple picaresque trek but with the one added element necessary to link to the prior films: the notion of the Ring's importance being amplified as the film does do. I have seen fan cuts of about four hours total that tell the story admirably without doing other than simply snipping excess length. I do wish PJ would consider returning and doing this.
I always thought Martin Short would jave made for a pretty good Bilbo Baggins.
How gorgeous 😊
The Hobbit movies has some good parts, like Martin Freeman. But they have a lot of bad things too, like overlong action sequences (Misty Mountain chase and the barrel ride comes to mind). I prefer them on DVD, because then I can fast forward the boring parts.
Fingolfin. The video, one day...😅😊
Yay!
The best part of the Hobbit movies is Balin. Balin carries that movie on his back and then some.
He absolutely kills it. Such a loveable character!
@@Jess_of_the_Shire He's a good dude.
Fine, I will only like, but not comment, next time you upload 8 hour long videos in a row. That'll teach you.
HAPPY 2025! Elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo!
I’ll stick with the “children’s book.”
No matter your feelings about The Hobbit Trilogy, Martin Freeman utterly OWNED his role as Bilbo Baggins! Now that it was mentioned that Gollum (in the OG The Hobbit book) had given the Ring away after simply being bested by Bilbo in riddles, it would've been fascinating to see what Tolkien would've done with the story of LOTR (& the greater universe of Arda) had he stuck to the original version of the narrative. If the Ring were to be just that (a ring) then what would have Sauron used as his world-dominating weapon? Considering how Tolkien lived until 1973, it's possible he might have had Sauron (in this alternative timeline) use a weapon akin to the atom bomb used by the US in 1945, as its clear the horrors of the world wars echo in his stories.
Bro missed the memo that Tolkien was very anti-allegory, and therefore would not have used a direct equivelant to represent "the Bomb".
@LordVader1094 'akin to the bomb' not 'allegorical to the bomb.'
the books
In the movies, Bilbo completes his character arc…by the end of Film 1… It’s awful.
For me, , Martin Freeman was the only redeeming quality of the film adaptation. He looked to be having a great time in every scene, whereas everyone else acted as though they had wandered on to the set and were waiting to wander back off it.
Spot on. The production was hell and the films were an absolute mess, but Martin Freeman did his best. Did he overplay Bilbo at times? Imo yes, but he still seemed to understand the heart of the character. The films would've done better to focus more on him instead of needless subplots given he's THE HOBBIT in question.
Based on the behind the scenes, it seems like everyone that worked on these movies had a lot of love for the story. Freeman may have just been the one where it shows through, not encumbered by overdone writing, CGI and makeup
@@Jess_of_the_Shire He's a great physical actor and interjected a lot of wonderful reactions throughout. I'm especially fond of his *OH SHIT OH SHIT OH SHIT* reactions to Smaug moving and waking up while he's trying to be stealthy.
You look like a German maid with that hair very beautiful.