Hide Glue! - Primitive Adhesive from the 1700's
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 พ.ค. 2022
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Bones, cartilage, beaks and hooves work well for a carpenter's glue, sometimes as a composite material if thickened with very fine, talc-like sawdust.
What about ones own hair? Colored glue? Add some starch to make it extra sticky?
Now THAT is interesting….
If you use beaks and hooves remember to remove the horn. That's made of keratin not collagen and won't dissolve, you're after the tendons inside not the outer layer..
Speaking of composite material. If you strip out a hole for a screw, slice some slivers of wood and coat in wood glue. Stick the slivers in the hole and drive the screw in. Avoid putting a lot of load on the hole (heh) until it's set.
Once set, the screw will be grabbing the wood slivers that are now permanently bonded with the wood around it on top of the glue shmeared in the cavity.
@@loganosmolinski4446 The combination of gelatin and keratin hydrolysates is what makes it work so well in things like cabinetry and furniture.
I know that the video was on hide glue but the joinery at the end made me think of those smelly pots cooking for glue and I wanted to mention it.
That and to feed the algorithm! Gotta have that engagement to go viral.
An obscure (to most) fact regarding hide glue: within the surprisingly devoted and well-developed subculture of primitive bow- and arrow-making, hide glue is invariably considered THE material for making bows backed with sinew, rawhide, snakeskin, and many other traditional materials. It is also warned that hide glue invariably STINKS like all hell, so you'd better make it outside, in containers that you don't need anymore!
It's also the standard glue in the making of wooden stringed instruments; because it's reversible.
If your hide glue stinks. It has gone bad.
@@SuperHeadgeek No, the entire *cooking process* smells bad: this is documented fact.
@@SuperHeadgeek Hide glue smells like holy hell regardless
Now this the kind of videos in talking about! Not only doi care historically about this as a living historian but I'm also a hand tool woodworker! Love it just friggin love it!
I've seen rawhide in a bag at Lowes and woodcrafter's specifically for this purpose.
Matthias Wandel should make a video testing the strength of hide glue. He could even test if beer added to the glue makes it stronger than water!
Finally someone did this. as a person in interest in old books and leather wrapped items, adhesives of old are a subject not explored a lot unfortunately.
Many woodworkers still use it around the world
I've used hide glue to repair a musical instrument. Was recommended it by a luthier. So, it's still made and used.
Hide glue is still in use today, especially by antique restorers. Wood By Wright did a series of comparitive tests with modern synthetic glues, and homemade and commercial hide glues held their own, even outperforming certain modern glues in certain applications.
The only real downside I know of is that it tends to dry out too much and get brittle in our modern, heated houses.
Rabbit skin glue is great for priming a canvas or oil painting.
Shhhhhhh! Baumgartner is gonna come after you, lol
@@snitcheyes411 Every one knows the best thing for a painting is to varnish then smoke heavily around it.
@@andrewdriver3318 fond memories of the cigarettes and turpentine era of painting. How anyone survived in those powder keg studios is beyond me.
Later on: "As we can see, the rabbit skin glue that bound the paint layer to the canvas has become brittle, causing it to fail spectacularly. Therefore, I must now do an adhesive impregnation on this painting." XD
Any resemblance with other existing videos would be purely coincidental, of course ^^
Unfortunately, most modern homes have a too low relative humidity for hide glue, so it tends to get too dry and therefore brittle.
"Adding small beer to strengthen the glue...." :- Obviously just an excuse for an afternoon bevvie in the workshop.
LOL... that is exacting what I was thinking!
Wow! That's so fascinating to see the predecessor to the modern glue we have today! Funny to think that glue used in classrooms around the world developed from this!
That's the brilliant thing about Townsends. So much of what you see, you're like, oh, that's the same as what we do now.
Why do you think Elmer's glue has a picture of a cow on the label?
I would argue that this beig non toxic, renewable, and easily made at home is far superior to the modern versions.
Have watched cabinetmakers and restorers use hide glue on many videos but it's great to see the process from the beginning. Thank you!
Always an interesting thing to see the things we take for granted today (adhesives) and how they were made in days gone by. There are still people who use Hide Glue, especially antique furniture restoration. (Thomas Johnson Antique Furniture Restoration in Gorham, Maine comes to mind.) I first learned about the process for making hide glue from a presentation done by Roland Warzecha about how Norse shields were made.
Used heated "horse glue" in my woodwork class back in the 1960s, did a great job once you got the timing down. Tended to crystalize if it cooled down too much.
As a child i watched my mom take a grain of cooked rice to seal an envelope she placed to mail her sister
My mother made paste from flour and water… it always worked great.
Hide glue was and still is an excellent glue for fine woodworking . It’s one shortcoming is the lack of water resistance. Not sure when fine veneer work first appeared but certainly by the 18th century. Lack of water resistance was no problem as fine furniture would not be left out in the weather. Protected from water it was used in the early days of wooden aircraft construction before resorcinol glue came on the scene.
I have a cast iron pot with a smaller inner pot that was enamilized that acted as a double boiler for hide glue. Water in the outer pot keeps the glue and water from scorching. If scorched then glue is no good.
They would take the glue squeezed out from the joints and put it back into the glue pot to reconstitute. Great thing about hide glue is it's reversible. So old antique furniture can have some heat applied to the joints, softening up the glue and disassemble it for repairs.
I was watching someone repair vintage guitars and they would drill a small hole under one of the pearl inlays where the neck meets the body then put a small needle hooked up to a steamer. After a little while the neck would come right off. It’s too bad most modern guitars use modern wood glue where that’s impossible and much harder to fix.
@@wormhole331 Hide glue has been the luthiers friend for centuries.
I remember my Grandpa using this stuff to repair furniture ... and this would be in the early '60s. Not such a long time ago. The glue was a very dark brown. In its solid form it was dark and hard, reminiscent of traditional toffee.
A couple companies sell it in liquid form today, "Old Brown Glue" and "Titebond, Hide Glue". There are a few woodworking retailers that still sells the powder and flake form and you mix it yourself like in the olden days. It's still a favorite among luthiers, furniture restorers and various conservitors.
Wonderful hands-on tutorial! You guys are all so knowledgeable. Well done, Brandon!
BTW, in classical oil painting, a basecoat of a particular kind of gesso that was made from rabbit skin glue + white marble dust and a few other things (I forget the rest of the ingredients) was often used. This method is still taught in some schools. Now, because of clever, multifaceted Brandon, I guess I have a bit better idea as to how that would work.
Very cool!
I did not know that. Interesting. Cheers, Rose!
@@dwaynewladyka577 I once met an artist who painted in oils and who was trying very hard to use the same techniques as the great masters used, but for his modern paintings. I wouldn't have known about the old style gesso if not for him.
Cheers Dwayne!
As an informed modern woodworker who chooses to use only hand tools and the techniques (of the West) that were perfected by the 18th century, I can attest that hide glue is still considered to be a very desirable adhesive of choice.
I’ve heard of glue being made from rabbit skin using this process. It was also used for book binding and anyplace a really fine glue was required.
Used for attaching arrowheads, fletches and nocks to shafts.
And mixed with marble dust to create gesso for priming canvas.
Used for sizing in oil painting
Rabbits being very common food items and only the best young fur for lining might as well make glue and save the cowhide for useful leather ☺️
It's a hare thicker.
Try this glue yourself by getting some unflavored gelatin. The recipes I found also use glycerin and 1/4 of the liquid being vinegar to act as a preservative.
This reminds me a lot of the Portable Soup video. Cool video!
IMPORTANT SAFETY TIP: If you are going to use the dog bone rawhide chewies (from say a pet supply store or your local market) BE SURE to first soak the rawhide bone in a 25 percent solution of bleach to water. Typically there are a LOT of nasty organisms on this stuff (especially if the source is China) that will absolutely give you a raging infection should you manage to get it into a scratch or cut of any type. A friend of mine was using it to make some small rawhide items and got one of these infections and very nearly lost the hand. It's easy to do: soak, rinse and soak again, then rinse and it's ready to use.
But are these rawhide not already bleached? As part of the process?
To make glue? How did the organisms survive the boiling?
@@Mark-nh2hs The rawhide is never sorted properly after it is prepared. It basically gets shipped on a boat, sits loose in a warehouse, and often times doesn't even have packaging and can be done exposed to all sorts of nasty.
@@winterishere440 that's what I was thinking I'm smelling BS. Seeing your boiling the stuff that would kill majority of all bacteria
@@infernaldaedra wouldn't it be bad to give it to dogs then? I mean, this is someting we're using for GLUE. and that we plan to boil. So if you're worried about glue having pathogens in it, your dog's mouth is going to come into much closer contact with you than your glue probably is..
Reminded me of art college in the 70s. I'd make my own stretchers from wood and trim with quarter beading. Then stretch canvas over it - I remember getting free scraps of canvas from a local sail maker's workshop. And then I'd make the rabbit skin size, though not from scratch - from small bags of dried 'crystalline' size which smelled awful! Made up the size with water over heat and painted it warm onto the canvas. When it dried the canvas was as tight as a drum. Perfect to paint upon.
Really enjoyed this vid, tfs and thanks for bringing back memories!
Good Work Brandon! The key ingredient to a lot of these products seems to be 'patience.'
Not only do I learn something new but this channel helps me forget the craziness of todays world.
Thanks!
Craziness is almost an understandment these days. If I could I'd be happy to give up this world and be a middle age Shepard.
I think a little nutmeg would bind up that glue a bit better.
If this had been a Jon video, pretty sure nutmeg would have been at least at least mentioned , if not actually used.
These episodes by Brandon are the best! Keep them coming!
I agree. The video in which he was metal working with no narration was classic; just the sounds of the nature and the blacksmith working his trade!
And its great at sticking leather protection pads onto metal. Such as onto steel clamps to limit damaging the surface of wood.
Hide glue is still in wide spread use by musical instrument makers and repair shops. It has certain characteristics that are unique and desired for a variety of applications. It is very strong but can still be "undone" by applying heat - some times in combination with moisture - without destroying the wood. Squeeze-out is easily cleaned up, since it is water soluble.
Some people read books some people watch movies some people play video games. I watch townsends to escape from reality. Seriously this is my favorite channel because eventually when technology just go up in flames or at least our infrastructure goes upp I hopefully at least know how to make a couple of things to make my life more convenient
There was also a very strong casein-based glue ('cheese glue'), known to artists since the 14th-15th century: it involved sour milk and lime, among other things, iirc. Supposedly, some old painting panels have been seen, where the wood is rotted out, but the glue is still intact...
Very very informative. I've always wanted to learn how to make this. It's amazing what you can do and make from bone and hide.
christopher schwarz always talks about the weakness of the old glues as a benefit: when the glue gives way before the wood does you are left with repairable item, unlike with modern glues that make the joints so strong, that the wood breaks before the joint and you are left with a broken piece of furniture
Used to build harpsichords in the Italian fashion years ago and used rabbit glue in some of the construction to build in traditional methods.
Thanks for posting this video. I watch a man from Maine on TH-cam who restores furniture and he's all the time using hide glue to repair loose joints. I always wondered how it was made, so now I know. Maybe you can do a more lengthier video in the future describing how various other glues are made from other animals hides and parts, and what those glues are used for. That would be interesting !!
Fish glue, especially the swim bladder glue, is what was used to make composite horse bows.
I'm glued to this video.
Really enjoy these videos, keep them coming!
I use hide glue often in my work. The advantage of it being sticky is it holds pieces together during the assembly. Regular PVA wood glues don't become tacky for a good bit of time, which allows pieces to slip out of place as the clamps are applied.
Old recipe for glue . Gelatin melted in a little water . Add vinegar and glycerin thin with a little water to suit your needs . Used for the past 450 years in shoemaking , furniture making and book binding in England and no doubt the rest of Europe too .
This is easily the best series on the channel. The rest are great too but more than anything the old world craftsmanship done without synthetic materials is my passion and a large reason I came to the channel in the first place.
Please keep making more of these videos.
That is what I learned in elementary school back in the 1970s and I still occasionally make some.
Run glue run! Run and hide glue!
Some claim hide glue isn't as strong as modern urethane glues, but in reality the wood with break before the glue lets go - and beyond that it doesn't matter how "strong" the glue is.
Hide glue (unlike modern glues) is actually reversable. This is the reason antique restorers use it.
If you glue something up wrong, or something just didn't do right - just dampen it and apply heat the glue will gel up and allow you to separate the pieces (it will take longer the more it cures). Also, unlike modern glues, when you have to reglue an old part that has separated - you don't have to scrape ALL the old glue off. The new hot hide glue will melt the old hide glue and they will just combine to glue the joint up again.
With dealing with modern glues, you have to get all old modern glue off (or at least as much as you can) and expose fresh wood. This is because modern glue will not grab onto dried modern glue. This is often why a person will glue up a chair leg that came off, and a few months later it's falling off again.
Wondering, did they actually make it from leather? Seems like they wouldn't want to waste the leather.
I know modern method uses horns, hooves, and joints.
Also - you mention some saying they added beer to strengthen the glue. I would very strongly recommend not doing this as alcohol with crystalize hide glue and cause it to lose strength.
I've made glue from deer hide scrapings and trimmings. Takes quite a while, but the end result is worth the effort. Thank you for a very clear and logical video. Be well and at peace.
Really enjoyed that, thanks Brandon!
Could you guys some day make a video about beekeeping in the 1700s? 🐝
In the 1700s, the Age of Enlightenment and scientific discovery, bees were finally studied and classified properly.
Traditional oil paintings use rabbit hide glue to size the canvas and make it oil proof prior to adding gesso, which is traditionally ALSO made from rabbit hide glue and forms the white background you apply paint too
Yay! More Brandon! Thanks for the glue lesson!
Thanks for a fascinating video. I love the variety of subjects you guys do. Keep up the good work please you are making a lot of people happy, sane, and learning.
Yo hide glue is SUPER useful if you do near anything that involves glue. Rabbit glue, fish glue, horse obviously.
If you’re a hunter or otherwise find yourself throwing away these animal parts, make glue and tell everybody you know, I bet you’ll have a taker.
I was glued to this video. Great presentation.
So interesting! I like woodworking as well as barbecue. Cooking low and slow releases the collagen in the same way giving the meat a wonderful moisture and mouth feel.
you guys are about to break the 2M Subscriber mark! congratulations 🎉
I use hide scrapings from brain-tanning. You can also use hooves or sinew
"An animal has enough brains to preserve its own skin."
I have heard it as "God gave each animal just enough brains to tan it's own hide"
Made a batch of hide glue for some historical pieces.
Really enjoying these videos. Thank you
what a great historical tutorial. I have often wondered how glue was made before commercial glue was available.
What do you do with the left over glue?
Do you leave it in the small container and add water & heat if it dries a bit? Do you dehydrate it on cloth again to get the chips then reheat it when glue is needed?
I always thought it was odd as a kid when, in the book Animal Farm, the big workhorse gets sent to the glue factory for his "retirement".
Now I find it a darkly comic way to forecast my own future retirement.
Animal Farm was a very dark, cynical parody of human society. I never thought of it as a children's book.
@@daniellebarker7667 in the UK it used to be pretty much required reading for schoolkids...
@@Vandal_Savage I homeschooled my kids and I did have them read it along with several other of Kurt Vonnegut Jr's books, and George Orwell, but not until they were secondary school age.
What a great video! Being a student of the 18th century I always enjoy the videos, but being a traditional woodworker, this one was definitely a favorite!!
Love this series of non food household staples!
Yeah, it's really cool to see this other side of it. Recipes are always fun and all, but there's something uniquely interesting about seeing the historical process behind the kind of things we take for granted.
No matter what the day has been like, it's always a positive to watch Jon, Brandon, Ryan and the team demonstrating these skills.
Hi Brandon! Great subject and demonstrations! Thank you
Wonderful, just might have to make some thanks for sharing
Thoroughly enjoyed that, you are really getting good Brandon, more please!
Absolutely love Brandon's videos! You all put such craftsmanship into your content!
We still use hide glue every day in guitar repair. Its resettable nature makes it perfect for easily reparable instruments. Plus, the joints are weaker than the wood, meaning humidity warping is likely to break a joint rather than the wood itself.
this channel gets better and better
This feels like something I would watch on PBS after an episode of New Yankee Workshop in the early 90s when I was 8.
Loved this! This is great information that I've never heard before.
There's that term again. "small beer"
The stories of sending an old horse to the glue factory ring true, and this is the result. Thanks for the video. Jon
For bookbinding, I prefer wheat paste over hide glues. It is easier to make, but more importantly, is that it is less brittle when dry, is clearer and doesn’t attract bugs as much as hide glues.
Swim bladder glue is ALSO used for making stringed instruments.
It's been so long since I have watched. Miss this community.
What a cool episode; thanks.
Great video guys, thank you.
1750 Fish was used patented in Britain
Fish yes in 1750.
Nice video! Especially like the Traditional Hornpipes in background.
I have a bag of rabbit skin glue from a leather shop and heat it up in a jam jar on top of a tealight stove (the kind that holds a teapot warm). It takes about 20 min until it's usable and when it starts to steam I take it off.
It does smell only slightly like leather or pork rind, so I much prefer it over strong smelling modern glues and even cook it in my living area. I like to use it for stuff like bird houses or insect hotels or anything animal related, since its absolut non toxic. It hold up pretty well and I could even compost a rotten birdhouse if I wanted to, thats cool.
Just don't make to much of it, since it starts to mold after a few days. (One could probably dry it back to it's flaky form, but I always forgot.) Since it's only mold and skin, I stick my jam jar in the recycling and don't have to scrape it off.
Fascinating! Thanks for this vid!
Great video! All cows, pigs, donkeys, mules, horses, and other animal skin had to go somewhere. Elmer the bull is to glue as Elsie the cow is to milk. Elementary school just got weird.
Furniture restorers, art conservators, and instrument makers will still use hide glue. It helps that you can just buy it off the shelf these days.
Excellent!! Presentation!! 👍
very concise and informative, thanks
Nice to see you again thank you for this knowledge , we may need it soon.
Another banger 🤘great video as usual
Very interesting. In the lapidary trade we sometimes use shellac chips for making a adhesive.
N would like to see how to make soap and talk of different ways, something I been wanting to do myself for yrs now
Another really great glue can be made from pine pitch. Primitive living practitioners would boil it in water and take the rosin out and mix it with carbon and dung to create one heck of an epoxy and a flexible glue if fat is added. I've been working with making portable soup a lot lately and I got curious about calligraphy and that led to me finding a way to make a pen out of Bamboo which I have a lot of. Then I moved on to how do I make ink. There's an ink called Sumi ink and it is made from lamp black and hide glue. Yes, it stinks so they add perfume to deal with that. This creates a dry ink that you wet as you need it so it's easier travel with.
I really likes this kind of historical instruction videos.
Nice video. The toothpick was an interesting choice of utensil to get it out of the skillet
I love this and will have to try it. Thank you for the video
Fascinating
I love things like this !
I recently discovered twosetviolin on TH-cam. Through them I discovered Olaf the violin maker who is a luthier in Australia. I've watched several of his video and he still uses a traditional hide glue from the 18thcentury. Additionally he uses a 18th century varnish recipe as well. I find it interesting that shortly after seeing his videos and thinking about you because of the time period his recipes come from you come out with this video. Since you didn't mention instrument making in your list of uses for hide glue, I thought it worth mentioning that not only was it used in the 18th century but it is still used by luthiers today repairing these beautiful antique instruments.
It seems to me that the reason luthiers still use hide glue is because for repairs you need to be able to separate the face or back of the instrument; so you need a glue that is strong enough to hold together but not so strong that it becomes a single piece that can't be separated.
I too was put to mind of Twosetviolin. Olaf is amazing.
Very interesting, I enjoy history and how things are made and done. Hyde glue don't look that hard to make after watching you do it. Thank you and God bless 🙏
I’ve wanted to see how that’s done for years! Very cool!
Thank you for sharing this Informative technique
In my line of work we use hide glue for glue chipping glass...I'd love to try and make my own now!