Really surprised about your advice. Especially the part where you said the best way to be in the zone is to take 60 milligrams of adderall along with a blue m30. Never thought of mixing the two together but i’ll have to try it out. Thanks Traplord!!
"[A] ceramics teacher announced on opening day that he was dividing the class into two groups. All those on the left side of the studio, he said, would be graded solely on the quantity of work they produced, all those on the right solely on its quality. His procedure was simple: on the final day of class he would bring in his bathroom scales and weigh the work of the “quantity” group: fifty pound of pots rated an “A”, forty pounds a “B”, and so on. Those being graded on “quality”, however, needed to produce only one pot - albeit a perfect one - to get an “A”. Well, came grading time and a curious fact emerged: the works of highest quality were all produced by the group being graded for quantity. It seems that while the “quantity” group was busily churning out piles of work - and learning from their mistakes - the “quality” group had sat theorizing about perfection, and in the end had little more to show for their efforts than grandiose theories and a pile of dead clay."
I remember one time Toph was talking about Jmook's game play and he said that Jmook is probably the best player at "looking at the screen". He clarified saying that Jmook waits until the last possible second to pick a move and reacts to what the other player is doing, and that's why he is so fast.
This unironically made me a better melee player immediately. People always talk about being present and playing mindfully, but waiting until the very last moment to commit and make decisions is truly a direct path to this state. A great insight, well done!
Not gonna lie Traplord your advice is where I've found more success. I play link and Link has so many options that it is super overwhelming. So for awhile I tried coming up with optimal game plans and setups only to find that it doesn't really work at the high level. It's one's focus and decision making speed that I think is key to thriving at melee. A lot like what you said in this vid. Thank you for reaffirming for me that I'm on the right path to improvement
Mango is a great example of the "speed" "in the zone" style of play. He doesn't play optimally in a lot of spots, and his combo game with fox is way behind the optimized chains that people like Cody and Leffen do. Mango just forces his will on people, and makes them play his game, which is running at you with overwhelming speed and power. His decision making is usually on point, and his execution is top notch. Even without optimized combo chains or perfect spacing, mango can delete stocks just by making a few right choices at warp speed.
this needs more views. I've always seen it this way and thought very hard on it without putting it into words. I'm going to send this video whenever I need to express these concepts 👍
this is fantastic. you heard me vent/complain about how azel always has the edge on me bc he's reacting faster or something. while that may be true, he was also employing this strategy you were talking about. i started implementing it more recently & it really works. i tend to overthink & plan too much and it ends up working against me, a lot of the time i can just wait just a little bit more and an opening just appears, and sometimes it's more educated guesswork than a real reaction
Ive always relied heavily on setplay to cover options and make decisions. If you prioritize stage control and get good at setting up favorable/familiar situations/interactions, you can have answers for every decision tree in that situation. Some of the examples you made of making faster decisions like doing an unsafe multishine isnt necessarily making a real decision, its having a good/consistent option to throw out when you dont have a more decisive option. Theres nothing wrong with having those as tools, but they dont add up to a competent playstyle. They're more for filling the holes you have in your game. More patient players can, and will pick you apart if your entire game is made up of quick actions and speedy button presses. Although I disagree with you, Im glad content like this is being produced and getting people to think deeper about the game and discuss more
Absolutely great advice that I needed to hear as a fox main who often resorts to spamming fastfall ariels after awhile, also sick combos for background footage. I think I'll have to watch this video a couple more times to instill the message but thank you so much.
I play like this all the time, but when I clicked I expected this video to be about the actual "zone". Personally, I can tell the difference between this and what I experience when I'm entering the zone, in which my body decides to completely take over and my brain decides to make me feel like a god among men. What you are describing seems to be more like a weaker version of applied option knowledge and intuition. It's really hard to describe the difference for me, because I assumed it'd be the same for others ^^'
This concept also works really well for ultimate players. I play fox and I want to overwhelm them with buttons. However I wait to press the button until I see what the opponent does to know which button would be the best to extend my advantage state. While doing this tho I really focus on what buttons WILL get me punished so I know not to press those for sure
@@Marcus-uz1mr was literally abt to comment sumn similar. this guy prolly gets much more out of it with fox especially, bc his ability to get more out of it with a faster chr is greater. but I'm sure chr specific tech can also help. who do you play?
@@Marcus-uz1mr I think slower characters benefit from it as well but faster characters do benefit more. For example, if your playing Gannon and your about to land on somebody. Your intention may be to land with an attack. However while your falling you notice they shield. If your super close to them the option you shouldn’t do is forward air because you’ll likely get shield grabbed or another punish. Nair is pretty safe and has 2 hits in case they drop shield on the first one. Side b with grab out of the shield. So just in the few frames it took for your opponent to run up shield while your were in the air your options risk reward changed immensely. You don’t need to pick the best option, just not the worse one. If you would have thrown out forward air with out waiting to see what the opponent did you would have gotten punished. If you waited and reacted to shield you could have picked an option the wouldn’t have gotten punished or punished as hard
@@liamm113 i play seph/diddy atm! i think i have a general idea of how it apply this with diddy since he's pretty fluid, but seph feels a lot more linear/commital. im gonna try what op said in his reply to me but instead of replacing ganon fair with nair, i think ill replace seph fair with empty hop on reaction
It’s good advice but it’s only applicable to people that are comfortable in their movement. For the rest us getting stuck in dash it’s all about the cheese 🧀 😎
Where does patient play fit into this? Is the decision to be patient and to for example dash dance for a while also one the many as quick as possible decisions you should make?
Patience is exactly what he's advocating, but it shouldn't be taken to mean that you should be passive. Adding in a bit of dash dancing as a timing mixup or to bait an action from your opponent is part of waiting until the last moment to commit to a decision, but how long and how far you dash dance is dictated by the necessity of the situation and not by an arbitrary need to "be patient." If your dash dance doesn't feel threatening to the opponent, then it isn't properly backed by punishing attacks. It is one of those many quick as possible options
I feel like this is not true this is a very body playstyle type. there are multiple top pros in melee who grind interactions over and over again for example armada leffen ibdw all lab monsters and yeah this can work i hear mango talk about not thinking im his games but everyones different and this mindset isnt a catch all.
@@yungtraplord8553 i think the second half of the video was very good and useful i just didnt like the implication that labbing is a waist of time when labbing is very useful imo
@@wearbroom it's not useful if you don't have a solid foundation of game understanding. This video was targeted at mediocre players, not people who know what they're doing.
I actually think they are not exclusive strategies. Grinding interactions is important because it fills out the “black boxes” in your knowledge so that you are aware of the answers to different situations. If you don’t understand a particular interaction, no matter how present you are you won’t have the answer and it will cause a “break” in your flow
@@wearbroom he didn't imply labbing is a waste. If it's all you do, and you never integrate that muscle memory or practice into a flow state, you're an insect in human form.
but the best players are one of the most motivated to improve. sounds like your projecting and biased. horrible take, see ya, no need to finish the video.
great video! however you are a dick in melee online >:O
Really surprised about your advice. Especially the part where you said the best way to be in the zone is to take 60 milligrams of adderall along with a blue m30. Never thought of mixing the two together but i’ll have to try it out. Thanks Traplord!!
u gotta be up all nite up off x too
"[A] ceramics teacher announced on opening day that he was dividing the class into two groups. All those on the left side of the studio, he said, would be graded solely on the quantity of work they produced, all those on the right solely on its quality. His procedure was simple: on the final day of class he would bring in his bathroom scales and weigh the work of the “quantity” group: fifty pound of pots rated an “A”, forty pounds a “B”, and so on. Those being graded on “quality”, however, needed to produce only one pot - albeit a perfect one - to get an “A”. Well, came grading time and a curious fact emerged: the works of highest quality were all produced by the group being graded for quantity. It seems that while the “quantity” group was busily churning out piles of work - and learning from their mistakes - the “quality” group had sat theorizing about perfection, and in the end had little more to show for their efforts than grandiose theories and a pile of dead clay."
I remember one time Toph was talking about Jmook's game play and he said that Jmook is probably the best player at "looking at the screen". He clarified saying that Jmook waits until the last possible second to pick a move and reacts to what the other player is doing, and that's why he is so fast.
Yeah Ibdw said that at summit too
In my HEMA club, we call this “fencing with eyes open”. Same concept, except in contact sports it’s even harder because you’re getting hit by things.
It's good to hear that other people have also explained this. I haven't watched tournaments in a year or so, so i never noticed this
@@yungtraplord8553 why not?
This unironically made me a better melee player immediately. People always talk about being present and playing mindfully, but waiting until the very last moment to commit and make decisions is truly a direct path to this state. A great insight, well done!
I'm so glad you saw immediate results :D
I love the Nujabes PFP
@@alejandrobermudez104 Thanks man, I see you are a man of culture
I've never played melee but this was very satisfying and entertaining to watch
Not gonna lie Traplord your advice is where I've found more success. I play link and Link has so many options that it is super overwhelming. So for awhile I tried coming up with optimal game plans and setups only to find that it doesn't really work at the high level.
It's one's focus and decision making speed that I think is key to thriving at melee. A lot like what you said in this vid. Thank you for reaffirming for me that I'm on the right path to improvement
No problem redx I would love to see you win with Link you've always had a great tournament mentality and I'm sure you'll be winning things soon enough
Mango is a great example of the "speed" "in the zone" style of play. He doesn't play optimally in a lot of spots, and his combo game with fox is way behind the optimized chains that people like Cody and Leffen do. Mango just forces his will on people, and makes them play his game, which is running at you with overwhelming speed and power. His decision making is usually on point, and his execution is top notch. Even without optimized combo chains or perfect spacing, mango can delete stocks just by making a few right choices at warp speed.
You’re right on the money with this. I’ve been arriving at the same conclusion recently but this video verbalizes it just right! Awesome video
this needs more views. I've always seen it this way and thought very hard on it without putting it into words. I'm going to send this video whenever I need to express these concepts 👍
Your shield drop example blew my mind! Thanks for such an interesting video.
This is actually exactly how I try and play, so its good to hear that it's good from someone else
this is fantastic. you heard me vent/complain about how azel always has the edge on me bc he's reacting faster or something. while that may be true, he was also employing this strategy you were talking about. i started implementing it more recently & it really works. i tend to overthink & plan too much and it ends up working against me, a lot of the time i can just wait just a little bit more and an opening just appears, and sometimes it's more educated guesswork than a real reaction
Ive always relied heavily on setplay to cover options and make decisions. If you prioritize stage control and get good at setting up favorable/familiar situations/interactions, you can have answers for every decision tree in that situation.
Some of the examples you made of making faster decisions like doing an unsafe multishine isnt necessarily making a real decision, its having a good/consistent option to throw out when you dont have a more decisive option.
Theres nothing wrong with having those as tools, but they dont add up to a competent playstyle. They're more for filling the holes you have in your game.
More patient players can, and will pick you apart if your entire game is made up of quick actions and speedy button presses.
Although I disagree with you, Im glad content like this is being produced and getting people to think deeper about the game and discuss more
Absolutely great advice that I needed to hear as a fox main who often resorts to spamming fastfall ariels after awhile, also sick combos for background footage. I think I'll have to watch this video a couple more times to instill the message but thank you so much.
the most badass thing you've ever posted
Rad vid, am a firm believer of the ZONE and speed over quality
I play like this all the time, but when I clicked I expected this video to be about the actual "zone". Personally, I can tell the difference between this and what I experience when I'm entering the zone, in which my body decides to completely take over and my brain decides to make me feel like a god among men. What you are describing seems to be more like a weaker version of applied option knowledge and intuition. It's really hard to describe the difference for me, because I assumed it'd be the same for others ^^'
that's beast bro
This concept also works really well for ultimate players. I play fox and I want to overwhelm them with buttons. However I wait to press the button until I see what the opponent does to know which button would be the best to extend my advantage state. While doing this tho I really focus on what buttons WILL get me punished so I know not to press those for sure
do you think it applies to slower characters as well? wanna start doing this but not sure if it'll work/benefit my character
@@Marcus-uz1mr was literally abt to comment sumn similar. this guy prolly gets much more out of it with fox especially, bc his ability to get more out of it with a faster chr is greater. but I'm sure chr specific tech can also help. who do you play?
@@Marcus-uz1mr I think slower characters benefit from it as well but faster characters do benefit more. For example, if your playing Gannon and your about to land on somebody. Your intention may be to land with an attack. However while your falling you notice they shield. If your super close to them the option you shouldn’t do is forward air because you’ll likely get shield grabbed or another punish. Nair is pretty safe and has 2 hits in case they drop shield on the first one. Side b with grab out of the shield. So just in the few frames it took for your opponent to run up shield while your were in the air your options risk reward changed immensely. You don’t need to pick the best option, just not the worse one. If you would have thrown out forward air with out waiting to see what the opponent did you would have gotten punished. If you waited and reacted to shield you could have picked an option the wouldn’t have gotten punished or punished as hard
@@JaCrispySSB ooh thanks for the detailed reply! i think i know how to approach this concept better now. much appreciated
@@liamm113 i play seph/diddy atm! i think i have a general idea of how it apply this with diddy since he's pretty fluid, but seph feels a lot more linear/commital. im gonna try what op said in his reply to me but instead of replacing ganon fair with nair, i think ill replace seph fair with empty hop on reaction
This is my favorite combo video :)
This is the gospel of truth
Great mentality video! Some times I catch myself trying to play good and just becoming worse. At those points I just try to play and think faster!
This is really solid advice, and the gameplay is fire too
Honestly thought I was listening to ginger at first haha
now I wont overshoot dair mindlessly ill shoot a laser or double jump back
What usually get me playing well is just to start playing as fast as I can
fantastic video
Damn he really made all those people ragequit right after the combo ended
Nah he probably used Clippi to sort thru his replays and stitch them together
@@bobpie7 yeah ik lol
More Melee educational content please 🙏
I hit my first double shine with falco today, and in order to do it i felt my eyes glaze over and I dropped 30 iq points
This is a good conversation
Bro is teaching me how to hit consecutive black flashes 😂😂
good shit traplord
It’s good advice but it’s only applicable to people that are comfortable in their movement. For the rest us getting stuck in dash it’s all about the cheese 🧀 😎
I miss my wife
This makes sense, but what I don't understand is, "How does one make faster decisions?"
Thank you Traplord, very cool!
Where does patient play fit into this? Is the decision to be patient and to for example dash dance for a while also one the many as quick as possible decisions you should make?
Patience is exactly what he's advocating, but it shouldn't be taken to mean that you should be passive. Adding in a bit of dash dancing as a timing mixup or to bait an action from your opponent is part of waiting until the last moment to commit to a decision, but how long and how far you dash dance is dictated by the necessity of the situation and not by an arbitrary need to "be patient." If your dash dance doesn't feel threatening to the opponent, then it isn't properly backed by punishing attacks. It is one of those many quick as possible options
I guess you apply this philosophy to your rhetoric practice as well.
Thank you Traplord 🔥
how to play in the zone: play good players
I'm confused; make decisions quickly but make decisions as late as possible?
I feel like this is not true this is a very body playstyle type. there are multiple top pros in melee who grind interactions over and over again for example armada leffen ibdw all lab monsters and yeah this can work i hear mango talk about not thinking im his games but everyones different and this mindset isnt a catch all.
That's fair, I just don't think it makes sense to take that approach until you're already quite good at the game
@@yungtraplord8553 i think the second half of the video was very good and useful i just didnt like the implication that labbing is a waist of time when labbing is very useful imo
@@wearbroom it's not useful if you don't have a solid foundation of game understanding. This video was targeted at mediocre players, not people who know what they're doing.
I actually think they are not exclusive strategies. Grinding interactions is important because it fills out the “black boxes” in your knowledge so that you are aware of the answers to different situations. If you don’t understand a particular interaction, no matter how present you are you won’t have the answer and it will cause a “break” in your flow
@@wearbroom he didn't imply labbing is a waste. If it's all you do, and you never integrate that muscle memory or practice into a flow state, you're an insect in human form.
love this!!
Fucking sick, thanks
great vid
so the solution is just to wait until the last possible moment?
Me as a puff player taking notes
Be fast lol
good video
Duuuuuuh whut???
Lol no way am I listening to some gold 1 falcon player
top 50 omegalul
Meaningless.
but the best players are one of the most motivated to improve. sounds like your projecting and biased. horrible take, see ya, no need to finish the video.
Lmao how can you call a video bad without finishing it? You’re one to call someone “biased and projecting” lol your insecurity is showing
@@HerpIHazDerpies failed attempt at trolling, don't interact
found the dunkey fan
One of the more pathetic comments i've seen.
Why do you think his video would be better if he talked about motivation
Advice I've never heard b4, tbh.. but it sounds legit so Imma try it and come back to tell u the results Old Freepeasant
Trap lord this was some advice thanks man