I have a 1999 Rem. 700 never ever fired and I got it to fire after switching from the safety to fire TWICE!! in about 20 trys indoors at 70 degrees. Very scary! Thanks for your video sir and thanks Remington NOT!!!!
I am now 70 years old. When I was 17 my parents bought me a used .22/.250 Model 700 for Christmas. I had only fired it a few times when I took it to a friends hunting camp in northern PA on a early summer day. Sitting in a lawn chair I decided to fire it at their spring pond about 100 yards away down the hill (safe backdrop). I stood up and chambered another round and the rifle fired. I was sure I did not hit the trigger with my finger. I did not even consider the possibility that the trigger had design/manufacturing problems. A reputable manufacturer like Remington would simply not do that. I fortunately missed my foot but did blast dirt and stone in my eye which luckily did no damage but hurt badly from the blow. For fifty years I blamed myself that somehow I had touched that trigger. Now I am sure that was not the case. Since then I have probably only fired 50 rounds through the gun. So fifty years later Remington is still having trigger problems? If there are trigger problems the firearm should not be on the market! Remington should remove their management. They should give engineers the lead in producing firearms, not bean-counters and marketeers. They should listen to the people on the production lines that warned of problems. I replaced my trigger with a Timney trigger. This episode destroyed my faith in Remington, a formerly great name. It's not coming back.
David, USED GUNS become “ for sale” for a reason. The older Remington 700’s are fine rifles AND HAVE ADJUSTABLE TRIGGERS. A competent gunsmith can adjust your trigger to a safe & reliable pull weight. Grease or lubricants containing paraffin can gum up your trigger. A thorough degreasing & professional trigger adjustment should solve your problem provided nothing is broken.
@@diogenes5381 YOU ARE WRONG! These Rem model 700 . . . . some had problems right out of the box BRAND NEW. I purchased mine brand new, and while sighting it in with a scope in the very first box of shells it fired without touching the trigger. I purchased this rifle in 1970, and at only 15 years old, my father did not believe that I had not touched the trigger. I never used the rifle again. Even at that age I understood the HUGE liability. Fast forward about a year, and it happened to my father as well. At this point it may have had perhaps 400 rounds fired through it. always cleaned after shooting it. Trigger never adjusted or lubed. After multiple attempts to get Remington to address the problem, they refused to admit that the weapon had any problem. Had they have maned up in 1971 lives would have been saved. I have owned well over a hundred guns in my 69 years. But that was the very last Remington. The corporate heads of Remington belong in prison!
UPDATE: 20 Apr 2014 (cont.) 11 Apr 2014 - Received following e-mail from Remington representative: "It was a pleasure talking with you yesterday. I wanted to forward you a copy of the recall notice and press release that was recently released. Again, I would like to thank you very much for helping us. Without your rifle we might not have been able to identify this issue. Today we have all benefited from your efforts. I will be back in touch soon."
@@twentyfifthdui4717 The earlier problems you referenced were with the “Walker” triggers, which were installed on REM 700’s from inception until 2006. After 2006, REM 700’s were manufactured with the X-Mark Pro triggers, which is what this video is about.
True, but in 2004 an executive from Remington sent a memo to Remington production calling them out for releasing subpar products. 2 years later in 2006 the xmp trigger was responsible for the death of Justin Stringer. Remington proved they are more interesting in the dollar than the human lives.
JimmyDickens1, I want to thank you for your efforts, you've certainly done a great job of demonstrating the issue that has plagued these otherwise excellent rifles since their inception. I'm a former sniper and have been in the process of building a nice long range rifle for home use. We have a fair amount of property so long range shooting at home is not a problem. Nonetheless, the Remington 700 has been on the table for the basis of my project until I became aware of this issue, then my choices have been moving to Savage 110's and their follow up guns. Again, thank you for your efforts and demand for the truth in this problem. We gun folks have had enough bad press in the media for some time and so it's gratifying to see one of our numbers pushing for safety in our hobby as you have clearly demonstrated. God bless you and your efforts.
Rick - Thank you for the kind words. They are greatly appreciated. And thank you for your service. Have fun with your build and enjoy the fruits of your labor.
During our last graded night shoot for U.S.Army Sniper School, one of the Sniper students on the line fired his weapon after the Instructor called "Range Hot" but before the targets (held by other students in the firing pit) came up. The Soldier told the Instructors he had just taken the rifle off safe and it fired on it's own, but they felt he had negligently pulled the trigger. He was dropped from the course with just a few days left in training. We will never know if he got a raw deal or not, but this video makes you think. I know with both my issued M-24 (Iraq deployment 2004-2005) and my own custom built Remington 700 based sniper rifle (Speedco .308, heavy fluted barrel, McMillian stock, IOR Valdata scope), I would NEVER trust the safety on them. Better to keep the chamber EMPTY until you have a target in mind. SSG U.S.Army (Ret), Infantry / Sniper, multiple tours
SSG - Thanks for the comments. Sucks to be the soldier who was dropped. More than likely not his fault, yet he paid the price for it.Thank you for your service!!
Thank you for your service. I feel bad for the ND guy. Thanks for your input on the 700s. I grew up all 700 and out of my dads 20 rifles 8 safetys fail. Just a feathers worth of side pressure on the trigger and flick the safety off and boom, just feel the trigger before touching the safety boom, close the bolt and boom open the bolt and boom i've seen it. I see you still luv ur 700s. That muscle memory right? What trigger did you use on ur build what pull weight? I would luv to spend a week a the range with you. I'll bet you rifles are sweet shooters and it would be humbling to have some 1 out shoot me make me feel like lil baby shooter again:). Than maybe you could help me rap my head around the whole changing zero on your scope for every shot?? 30 years of AK bear and moose hunting with leupold m8 4x/ Rem700 .458wm with 350gn pills with 100 yard zero and good old Kentucky windage to much muscle memory for me to change now. I would like to try your new fangled adjust on the fly scopes. Oh and moose and bears dont shoot back:) that often:0 I have fired untold rounds learned not to flinch years ago but now i find myself flinching closing the bolt, switching the safety off. Just the more i think about it the more flinchy i get. I hunt alone covered in moose piss making moose noises I have to have a round in so a good hunting season i load and unload many times. I'm looking for best trigger to replace mine. "The Remington lottery"" Win and you might shoot a battle buddy a foot or dear god your kid:( THANKS AGAIN FOR YOUR SERVICE. keep your primers and powder dry.... Ho ya wait what is a primer again what do they look like do you remember? LOLOOLOLOL
I don't want that rifle. It is a valuable lesson to all, never point a firearm in the direction of anything you don't intend to kill. This issue dates back sixty plus years. A lot of manufacturers would have fixed this.
TH-camrs - Many have been curious of the timeline for shipping a recalled firearm and the amount of time between sending and receiving a rifle. Bottom line: It took 3 months 8 days from start to finish. Below is the complete timeline for shipping my daughter's Model 700 in .243: - 11 May 2014 - Completed Recall Submission on Remington website. Received confirmation e-mail from Remington. - 19 May 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington containing .pdf shipping label and shipping instructions. - 22 May 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington indicating shipping box was sent to my residence. - 27 May 2014 - Received shipping box at my residence. - 28 May 2014 - I packaged my daughter's Model 700 and delivered to UPS office for shipping. - 02 Jun 2014 - UPS online tracking indicated rifle delivered to Remington factory. - 10 Jun 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington stating they had received rifle. - 13 Aug 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington stating they shipped rifle for return to me. - 19 Aug 2014 - Received rifle at my residence. I will remount the scope and take it to the range for sighting in preparation for the upcoming deer season. I will let you know how it performs. Of note, though, we never experienced any problems with this rifle. My daughter and I sighted it during summer/fall temperatures and my daughtrer only shot it once during deer season, as she was fortunate enough to shoot a deer on her first shot. It was a nice, sunny relative warm day last fall. Great job, Remington, for turning this rifle in a relative short time, given the number of rifles affected by this recall!
Good video telling Remington what is wrong with their triggers cause they have no clue. Before I loved Remington guns I own a 870 and a model 700 ( I changed out the trigger with Timney ) but after realizing Remington took 15 years to recall the model 700 for trigger replacement, not caring about the people that were killed, I'm DONE with Remington guns.
The corporate heads of Remington are criminals, and belong in prison! Putting corporate profit above human lives and safety is just not acceptable. After this many years, those people should still have to go to prison.
@@jerrys2745 ... I remember years ago while deer hunting , I took off the safety and the rifle fired . I ( being served in the Marines) didn't know what happen , I was shocked that the gun shot without pulling the trigger and my cousin was mad because I could have scared off the deer . Only years later did I learn about the bad triggers and people dying. This should be true proof that these were bad trigger . By the way I shot expert 3 years straight in USMC.
UPDATE: 20 Apr 2014 9 Apr 2014 - Received a phone call from a Remington representative asking if I would speak to a Remington engineer regarding my rifle. I agreed. 10 Apr 2014 - Spoke to a Remington engineer who explained a major factor was my reference to the temperature and its affect on the trigger assembly (specifically, the bonding agent used during the manufacturing process). He also thanked me for producing this video, sending in my rifle, and sending the accompanying information paper explaining my rudimentary experiment and methods used to discover the issue. He informed me Remington was planning a multi-year recall of the Remington model 700 with the X-Mark Pro trigger, which was subsequently issued 11 Apr 2014.
I'm very late to the game here but I would like to personally thank you for your service to our country and the research you provided. Sir, you are the very definition of a true American hero.
To John Bohna - In 2009, when I purchased my Remington 700, it was called '700 BDL Exclusive 24" Fluted Barrel XCR Synthetic Stock'. It was a 'Cabela's Exclusive'. XCR stands for Xtreme Conditions Rifle. If you were to copy and paste '700 BDL Exclusive 24" Fluted Barrel XCR Synthetic Stock' into a Google search, you will see a Remington 700 with the synthetic stock which looks exactly like the one in my video. I'm not sure when they started calling it SPS, but in 2009, it was the BDL XCR.
Very interesting. I just inherited a 700 bdl (.243) from my grandfather, and have been nervous about the safety/trigger issues I've read about. The gun looks darn near brand new from the 70's. It more than likely has the same set up as the ones with issues. Your video makes perfect sense, and needs to be sent to Remington. If you watch the TH-cam videos with people showing the gun going off unintentionally, they look to be shooting in cold weather. I'm going to take mine to a gun store for a look, but I really think you are on to something here. Hate to pay 150 bucks for a new trigger! Thanks for the video.
UPDATE: After many phone calls and e-mails, I finally got a response from Remington. The customer service was slow, but I got what I needed - a Service Request number (the web site states not to ship a firearm to them with out the number). I FedEx'ed my rifle to ARM Services in Ilion, NY on 19 Feb 2014. I included an explanation of the issues I was having, and how the misfires seemed dependent on cold temperature. I received an e-mail response 25 Feb 2014 from Remington indicating they received my rifle. Also in the e-mail was a link I could click to get a status of my rifle's repair. Problem is when I click on the link, I get this message, "There are no results for the data entered." On 18 March, I sent Remington an e-mail asking for the status of my rifle, as the link is not helpful and my rifle seems to have disappeared. As of today, I have not gotten a response. I continue to wait...
About 8 years ago I was unchambering a round in my uncles house, gun pointed to the ground. 30-06. As I flicked from safety to fire to unchamber the round, the gun discharged into the tile floor. For 8 years I thought I must have pulled the trigger on accident. Questioned myself for a very long time. I can't remember if the bolt locked on safety or not, but I must have had a reason. Seeing this is a big relief. An important note is that the gun was just brought inside from a night long hunting trip in sub 40 degree weather.
I’m not a gunsmith but I know there’s an entire aftermarket industry for Remington 700 triggers, that says something. Half the guys I know who own 700’s have aftermarket triggers installed; they tell me to add $100-300 to the cost of a 700 and you’ll have a more accurate estimate of the rifle’s price. I own a pair of 1961 40X 22’s; one was adjusted by a 75yr old professional gunsmith and it breaks at the touch of a feather (2-4oz with the original trigger), the other has a Timney that’s adjusted as low as a second gunsmith said he felt comfortable with (4-6oz). The original 40X trigger has a pure magic to it but the Timney is a close second. It takes me a few sandbag rounds before I’m able to mentally swap between the two rifles. They’re extremely close on trigger pressure but I can feel the difference; both are terrific though. The cold theory might be a cause, I usually shoot in the fall through the early spring so my 40X’s are not dealing with temperature swings. I use Winchester Model 70’s for hunting so I’ve never encountered trigger issues like my friends using 700’s have.
UPDATE: 27 Mar 2014 - Received the following message from Remington in regards to my Customer Service inquiry (see post below): "Jim, Your gun is being replaced with a new gun. It should be shipped next week." No further explanation as to 'why' or findings/results of their testing. I'll let you know when the new rifle arrives.
JimmyDickens1 I just had the same problem with my model 770 270 gun sitting in my tree stand it was about 30 degrees and my gun went off great gun but kinda scared 2 hunt with it again
Chad - Thanks for the comments. If you have the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger installed, send it to Remington for the recall. They will fix it so it will be safe to use once again. The recall instructions are on the Remington website.
Back in the 90s a friend of mine bought a model 700 Safari in .375H&H (just to have it) and a round when off when a round was chambered. He was not on the trigger but I am glad I was not there to suffer permanent hearing damage.
yes this is very logical answer .As i have studied mechanical engineering .Im sure this metals mixture with climate is the many unexplained discharge complaints they get are denied because there is no experts at remington in metalurgy.
regardless of trigger who is responsible for pointing gun at someone who did die or could have that's a hugh book filled with jail time thank you for your service
Great video. You really problem solved this one out! I have a 700 50 th anniversary addition and I'm waiting on my box to ship it and have it fixed now. I just pray they get it fixed properly.
Thanks, Jayce. I just received my daughter's 700 from the factory a few days ago. I'll let you know how it performs. Of note, though, we never experienced this problem with her gun. We sighted it during summer/fall temperatures and she only shot it once during deer season, as she was fortunate enough to shoot a deer on her first shot. It was a nice, sunny relative warm day last fall.
I was surprised with a few texts and phone calls from friends and family this evening informing me CBS's 60-Minutes used my video in a story on the Remington 700. The clip ran this evening, 19 Feb 2017 and can be found here: www.cbsnews.com/news/popular-remington-700-rifle-linked-to-potentially-deadly-defects/ I was happy to see CBS differentiated between the two triggers used in the manufacture of the Remington 700: The X-Mark Pro trigger (which is what my video is about) and the "Walker" trigger.
JimmyDickens1 Saw the 60 minutes show this evening. I am going to disassemble my Rem and throw it in the ocean. Your idea of environmental problems was sharp thinking!!
Thanks for the info. I recently had my Remington 700 go off when I moved safety off before unloading. Blew a hole in my deer blind and scared the hell out of me. Luckily nobody was hurt. Researched it and didn't know this was a known problem. Shame on Remington. I will be replacing trigger and safety assembly with new trigger tech assembly.
Thankfully, the problem has been been corrected in this model, at least in every one of them made after 2010. The Remington 700 is one of the most popular hunting rifles of all time. It's also used as a sniper rifle by many poloce departments.
a lot of what i have been picking up on this issue the last few years seems to indicate you are at least partially on the right track . the other indicators seem to be a dirty trigger group and to lightly adjusted triggers. this would seem to be the situation that i have run into on those that i have worked on the last few years,.
+ TheOldGunsmith58 Please read the comments I posted with this video (click the 'Show More' button). It will explain that I sent Remington my rifle (the one in this video) along with an information paper referencing this video and explaining what I believe is the problem with Remington 700 rifles with the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger installed. As you will see, Remington tested my hypothesis, agreed with my theory (in part, as it was the bonding agent used in the manufacture of the XMP vice the metal alloy I mentioned in this video), and issued the recall for the XMP trigger. So I was a little more than partially on the right track. At any rate, Remington retained my rifle as evidence and sent me a custom-made Alaska Wilderness Rifle II as a replacement. Of note, many of the Remington 700s with the lightly adjusted triggers are the rifles with the older Walker Trigger installed. A video by arizonaresponse explains how misadjustment of a Walker Trigger will cause negligent discharges. When watching videos on Remington 700s, be mindful of which trigger they are addressing. Sometimes it's not so obvious.
Jimmy, I totally agree. arizonaresponse has lost the debate and has no credibility. He's like too many gun guys I have met. So full of themselves they are certain their opinions are right and everyone else has to be wrong but also goes so far as to let you know about it to make himself feel good. You and me are having the same issue with our rifles. It's not an adjustment issue!!! I really don't think you will get much satisfaction from Remington. But what else can we do?
I was friends with Mike Walker for 10-12 yrs until he passed away. He taught me how to hand lap barrels, make benchrest jacketed bullets, among other things in his small retirement garage work shop .. .During this time he built me a bunch of hunting rifles. I tried drive out to his house and take him out to lunch several times a month. It was a good time to just ask questions. Mr. Walker was legally blind his last years and not able to drive. He could still see to shoot if the sun was bright and behind him. Mr. Walker was still a active benchrest shooter up until his death and also still building rifles for me. I'd pick some caliber (Ackley calibers were one of my favorites) and assemble the parts(new custom barrel, Remington Receiver, Trigger and stock) Most people don't know that Mr. Walker had a design patent on the button rifling method which he sold and resulted in the famous Hart Barrel Company. Mike always said that the original trigger he designed was a good safe trigger as long as a qualified gunsmith did any adjustments. Mr. Walker taught me how to adjust the Remington Trigger the correct way. I own 30-40 Remington 700's and Model 7 Rifles currently --most have the original Walker trigger from Remington. Most are set at 2lbs. and I've NEVER HAD a ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGE. I've worked on Remington Rifles as a hobby for 45yrs. and I'd estimate I've worked on over a 1,000 Remington Rifles. I'm 65 yrs old and slowing down but still enjoy accurizing a old 30-06 or 308 . The Remington trigger is a great design (compared to Winchester or Ruger!) BUT IT TAKES A QUALIFIED GUNSMITH TO ADJUST CORRECTLY !!..... IF your Remington Rifle has the original WALKER trigger then I'll bet someone tried to adjust the pull weight and got the over travel or backlash screw(there are 3 adjustment screws on the Walker Trigger) set to light. A good article that explains everything on adjusting Remington 700 triggers was written by John Antanies in the July 2001 Issue of Varmint Hunters Magazine, Issue #39 starting on page 5. Give that a read and you'll understand more about the safe way to adjust the Walker Triggers. I follow the steps outline in the article any time I do a trigger adjustment--going so far as to read the article again if it's been a while since I've worked on a trigger. I'm not trying to be rude or talk down to your video but just so you know-- the Thimney Trigger is almost a exact replica of the Remington except of a higher quality. Mr. Walker was one of the early benchrest shooters and helped get the the sport started. His trigger designs (he had a bunch) reflected the benchrest shooter's search for a trigger that breaks like a glass rod. one other note- Near the end of WW2 he designed a armor piercing round that our tanks could use to defeat the German Tiger Tank. He gave me the proto-type as a gift. Later I bought a Martina Falling Block Benchrest Rifle he built in 1952 ... I think!? It weights 11-14 lbs and is chambered in 219 Donaldson Wasp. I got a 2nd barrel from Hart and Mr. Walker did a 30-30 Ackley chamber for me. Now I can get a 125 gr. Ballistic Tip out of a 30-30 Ackley at 3,000 ft per second! What a treasure! The last rifle Mike worked on was a 260 just before he passed away. I'm so luck to have known him. He was a great guy. He was 101 yrs old when he quietly passed away March 6, 2013.
Sir - Thank you for your comments. I don't know much about the Walker Trigger - I've never owned one. But from what I've read, it is a nice trigger. Arizonaresponse has a good video showing how mis-adjustments of the Walker Trigger can lead to a negligent discharge. My rifle (the one in this video) has the newer X-Mark Pro trigger. This is the trigger Remington recalled. From what I understand, Remington has never admitted to a problem with the Walker Trigger. I own three Remington 700's; all were manufactured with the X-Mark Pro Trigger; all have been through the recall and have performed flawlessly since.
Jim your Video is the best on the tube that shows the Trigger problem & how it is Fired etc.? I want to show this to my Boys.? Who are not aware of the Trigger problem.? Thanks for sharing this Great helpful video.?
I contacted them shortly after finding out about this problem. They sent me a message through email. They Remington would contact me when they did the recall. Several years now and nothing from Remington to this day
This whole thing has my curiosity sparked now. I have a couple of older 700's and have heard the talk about this trigger/safety issue. I've never once experienced this, but I can say that in all the decades of shooting them, I'm not sure if I've ever used the safety even once. I don't hunt, I'm a bench shooter, so I've always been of the school where we don't trust the mechanical safety on any firearm, ever. I do it the hard way, breech or bolt open until I'm ready to shoot... so now I'm wondering if I can create this condition on my own. Of course, this may not be as practical when hunting I guess, you can't afford to have the noise of opening and closing the action so the safety is pretty much required. I've heard tale of 700's going off when the bolt is snapped shut too, but don't know if this is verifiable or not, but I've never had it happen.
+funkyzero Your older 700's more than likely have the "Walker" trigger, named after the guy who designed it. My video demonstrates the issue with the newer X-Mark Pro trigger, introduced to the 700 in ~2006. Some have made claims that the older 700's with the Walker trigger have their trigger issues as well, but I can't speak to that. As you watch videos that address 'Remington 700 issues', be mindful which trigger they are addressing. Sometimes it's not so obvious. For instance, Arizona Response has a video called 'Remington 700 Trigger - Creating a negligent discharge' that has garnered many comments. Problem is, his video discusses the Walker trigger. Many commenters are confusing his results with the XMP trigger - two entirely different triggers.
+JimmyDickens1 You are absolutely right regarding the Walker and XMP - two different triggers. And many are confusing the two and comparing apples to oranges.
Well done video. Helpful, informative and peace of mind for using the model 700 30-06 I just bought used for my son. It has the ribbed trigger but I am still going to test it out in the cold. Thanks again. Great music track selection as well.
+mygreenmtns Thank you for your comments. I believe you have the Walker trigger installed (provided the ribbed trigger you mentioned is original equipment). Arizonaresponse created a good video titled 'Remington 700 Trigger - Creating a Negligent Discharge' discussing the Walker trigger and how mis-adjustments can cause issues to it. I think as long as your trigger is adjusted properly, you won't have any issues with it. Your son will enjoy and appreciate your gift to him. It's a great rifle! Thanks again.
I work on guns a lot. I have built over a dozen rifles of my own from Mauser actions, I have done everything from barrel installation, lathe work, blueing, made stocks from blanks and have added adjustable, after market triggers to most of the rifles I have built and naturally I have also set the adjustments. I recently added a Model 700 to my arsenal, the first one I have ever owned. It is my personal belief that the problem with Remington's triggers is a lack of sear engagement. That is the FIRST thing that should be examined in the case of an unintended discharge. This is simply Remington trying too hard to please the customer! Everybody in this day and age wants a light, crisp trigger. Just doing a quick glance at the comments I have seen remarks about "adjusting the 700 trigger down to 2 lbs" in spite of the fact that they were talking about a trigger that was SEALED BY THE MANUFACTURER TO NOT BE ADJUSTABLE!!! The problem with a trigger sear engagement that is extremely light is that it allows zero margin for error. After studying this issue and the trigger myself I am convinced that the problem is a lack of sear engagement. Ample sear engagement is absolutely essential and its adjustment should ALWAYS err on the side of caution with safety, NOT a light pull, being the A#1 priority.
I believe you are correct regarding the sear adjustment on the older Walker-designed trigger. However, the trigger in this video is the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. Remington has already publicized the issue with this trigger is the bonding agent used in the manufacture of the XMP. This led to the massive recall in 2014. Read more of the comments for more explanation, to include the comments I made in the video description.
@@JimmyDickens1 The bonding agent is nothing more than an exposing of the "margin of error" that they still do not allow for. I have a walker trigger and an X mark Pro. They made some safety improvements on the newer version, but the real culprit remains. There are thousands of rifles that are well over a hundred years old that are still being used today. But today people will complain about a 3 lb trigger pull. What is going to happen when today's rifles reach even half that age and "modern" trigger mechanisms begin to show even the slightest bit of wear? More dead people? I hold to my assertion that the real culprit is lack of a safe sear engagement, for fear of trigger creep complaints.
@@beestoe993 Well, I will tell you - I have never adjusted any of my triggers and you saw the results. Remington saw my video, called to discuss it with me, and issued the recall in 2014 due to the bonding agent as I described. I’ve since been called to give a deposition twice in different court cases. Even within the legal system and under oath, Remington reps attribute the problem to the bonding agent. But you are entitled to your opinion. We’ll just have to agree to disagree with your hypothesis.
I bought my Rem 700 Varmint Special BDL back in the early 80's. Never had any trigger problems as described etc.? But I am going to get it replaced with a TimneyTrigger from Midway USA.I do not want to hand down this Rifle to my Boys.? With this Safety problem pending.?
My understanding is this recall is for the model 700 made from 5-1-2006 to 4-9-2014 and can be checked by serial number. They also have non-ribbed triggers. I think you have hit on the reason for the problem with these rifles. Simple logic! Good informational video! My 700 30-06 is at least 25 years old and is the most accurate rifle I have ever owned. The news stories make people believe that all 5,000,000 700s that have been sold have a problem.
+navajopa31 Sir - thank you for your comments. You are correct regarding the ribbed/non-ribbed triggers. Per the Remington website, the ribbed triggers are not part of the recall; the smooth triggers are. Here is the site: (www.remington.com/pages/news-and-resources/safety-center/safety-warning-recall-notice-remington-model700-modelseven.aspx). The Ribbed triggers are the 'Walker triggers', which were installed on Remington 700s from inception until 2006. The triggers that replaced the Walker are the X-Mark Pro triggers, which were installed from 2006 to present. The XMP triggers have the smooth (non-ribbed) triggers installed. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP trigger - it is the bonding agent used during manufacturing that is heat and cold sensitive and can cause negligent discharges in colder temperatures (as verified by Remington engineers). Others have had issues with the Walker trigger, but I can't speak to that, as I have not researched those issues. The XMP triggers are under the current recall. The Walker triggers are not. My 700's are also very accurate and are my deer hunting go-to rifles. Thanks again for your comments.
Could be the lubricant inside the trigger housing affected by the cold. Might try blowing the trigger out with brake cleaner or a similar solvent and repeat your test.
During my investigation, I completely cleaned the trigger assembly and retested; same problem. The issue was the bonding agent. Remington issued a recall for the XMP trigger to fix this issue.
@@JimmyDickens1 I have several Rem 700's and never had an issue, but I'm wary of a potential problem. I'll always prefer a bolt safety over a trigger safety like on my Win model 70 or a Mauser '98.
Remington had issues with the X-mark Pro from day one-2004. The old Walker style trigger was by far better, and will safely adjust down to 2.5 lbs in most rifles. The stainless triggers seem to be a bit more difficult to deal with.
My Remington 700. I can actuate the bolt on safe and fire. The bolt does not lock on safe. Do you think my trigger needs to be replaced? Mine is a ribbed trigger.
So far I haven't had problems with mine granted I bought it last night and shot it only 16x's but all the research I've done no one can duplicate it firing by accidentally. Only when trigger is tweaked past the manual recommendation, or extreme neglect that's why remington doesn't loose any civil hearings when it goes to trial
I bought a remington model 700 sps, 300 winchester magnum. I took it to the range to zero it in and the next day i went to clean it, and the muzzle next to the crown there eas rust. I used steel wool to get rid of it as well as using my bluing kit, so far the gun looks like it never had a problem, but for me knowing that i had to blue it nearly gave me heart attack. Never, ever, ever again will i get a remington firearm. They are low quality. So far im thinking of buying a browning hells canyon rifle and giving away my remington rifle.
From an Army guy to a naval officer, thank you sir, for your service to out great country and all that you've done to help protect her. I want a Remington 700 30.06, but even after the initial video from CNBC, I can't but one knowing there might be a problem. Can you tell me if they've fixed or removed the problem? South Texas didn't get really cold much, but if needed, I wouldn't wanna take that chance. Thanks again sir
Nihipali5 - Thank you for your service as well. I love my Army brothers and sisters, except during the Army-Navy game, of course! It's 13 December this year. Of note, I completed flight school in South Texas - had a great time and really liked the Texans. Great place to call home! I'm sorry I can't answer your question regarding the fix and if it is effective and corrective to the problem. I sent my rifle (.30-06) to Remington, where it will be retained for their use. Remington intends to send me a replacement, which is currently being built in their custom shop. So I've not had the chance to test the fix in this regard. I also sent my daughter's Remington 700 (in .243) in for the recall, although it did not display the same problems my rifle did. Her rifle was returned to us and my daughter shot it this fall with no problems noted. But since it didn't have the issues prior to the fix, I didn't expect it to have the problems post-recall either. Once I receive my replacement, I'll test it and let you know what I find. Overall, I really like the Remington 700. Both mine and my daughter's rifles were extremely accurate and I personally like the X-Mark Pro trigger. Thanks, again, for your service.
Howdy Jim,I have a model 700 and have never had this problem. Many years ago, I had a Marlin 22 caliber bolt action which I used to take woodchuck hunting. I would occasionally forget to take the safety "off" before pulling the trigger. The gun did not fire with the safety "on", but when I put the safety "off" the gun did fire, and this was a repeatable condition. Would you try this with your 700 to see if this happens in your case ? Regards, Ed Fulton
Ed Fulton Ed - the rifle in this video was sent to Remington for their testing. They were able to duplicate my issue and kept it. Remington then sent me two-700’s - an exact duplicate and a custom rifle. I will try your scenario with them, but since both have been through the recall, I suspect I will not be able to duplicate your findings. Also my rifles have the X-Mark Pro trigger. I don’t know what trigger Marlin uses, but I’m sure it isn’t the X-Mark Pro. I’ll try it anyway to see if they might have similar behaviors.
Was out hunting today, winter time in Michigan, didn't see anything so I never let the round in the barrel go, turn safety off, since you can't rack it with it on, and boom, same thing your talking about. Also being ex military, I was not very happy with my outcome of handling the weapon, you sir, put me at ease a little...have you figured out if that's for sure what was causing it, it seems pretty accurate in my eyes.
Preston - Thanks for the comments. Remington has concurred with my theory (it was the bonding agent in the trigger assembly vice the metallurgy, but same results) and is effected by the cold. Remington issued a recall in April 2014 for X-Mark Pro triggers. If this is what you have installed on your Remington 700, I recommend sending it to Remington for the fix. You can google it for instructions on how to send it in or go to Remington's website. Other alternative might be to replace the trigger with an aftermarket (Timney, for example).
Would a aftermarket trigger group and safety remedy this situation? I came across a older BDL in 8mm Mag that has this issue, passed it up of course but thought about getting it and changing everything out if it would fix it.
I have had the same exact experience recently with my early 1980s 700. I live in Miami, so I can assure you it isn't from the cold. I'm wondering if a trigger exchange with an aftermarket model will correct the issue?
@@Betterifitsfree Since your rifle is from the 1980’s, it probably has the older “Walker” trigger vice the X-Mark Pro trigger, which is the trigger on the rifle in this video. Many have had issues with the Walker trigger as well, but this seems to be from improper adjustments, as demonstrated in a video by Arizonaresponse. My recommendation would be to take the rifle to a reputable gunsmith to check for proper trigger settings. Of course, the other option is to replace the trigger with an aftermarket. There are several good brands from which to choose.
had my trigger assemblt replaced on a remington trigger recall,, my gun went off when i pushed the saftey off with my thumb, leaving me with a badly torn thumb
In addition to this I have a 870 express 12 ga . not good . while shooting the empty case jams in the chamber. Bought 4 years ago new . Should have stayed with my Winchester mod . 120
Yes, that video explains a lot ABOUT A DIFFERENT TRIGGER! I agree 100% with arizonaresponses hypothesis with regard to the WALKER TRIGGER!As far as critical thinking - I've already proven myself there by solving the problem with this trigger - the X-MARK PRO TRIGGER. You should do your own research and READ THE COMMENTS before you post about something you obviously know nothing about. Buddy - when you're in a hole, stop digging. If I were you, I'd delete your posts before too many more people read them.
right because cars aren't recalled for safety issues all the time...maybe GMC, Ford, BMW, and VW and Toyota should all go out of business too by your reasoning?
Thanks Jim, do you know is anyone is making a list of guns that have been recalled for safety issues/accidental discharges? Probably a lot of people who don't know what safety issues their firearm has, me included. Thanks again.
@@JimmyDickens1 FYI the serial number only my Model 700 7MM was well before the serial number that started their recall. Though they did replace my trigger per the recall. Never fired again after the second time that if fired without touching the trigger. So the weapon is still almost brand new, even though I purchased in 1970. Its for sale . . . . . I just will not own Remington PERIOD!
My model 7 has intermittently done the same thing,//getting the run around from Remington about fixing it.Probably going to buy an after market trigger and no more Remington's.
Hi Jimmy, you commented on my video about my 700 misfire. It was a very cold day when I made the video of the misfires with my rem 700. Like you, I could not duplicate the misfires inside where it was warm. I sent my rifle back to Remington and all they said was they could not duplicate the misfire. They installed a New X-Mark pro trigger and sent it back. They said nothing was wrong with my original trigger so I asked them how is a new trigger that is the same as the original going to fix the problem? They had no answer for me. I'm afraid you will get the same response. I have tried to duplicate the misfires since I received it back from Remington inside the house with snap caps but after hearing your theory I just put it out in the cold garage and am going to try it later. I'll keep you posted.
Charles - After many phone calls and e-mails, I finally got a response from Remington. The customer service was slow, but I think I got what I needed - a Service Request number (the web site states not to ship a firearm to them with out the number). I FedEx'ed my rifle to ARM Services in Ilion, NY this morning. I included an explanation of the issues I was having, and how it seemed dependent on cold temperature. We'll see what happens. I'll let you know...
Has anyone heard of issues with the safety being released causing an accidental discharge on Remington's Model 770s? I bought one in .270 probably about 6 years ago with out doing much research. In hind sight I should have gotten something with better quality, but the price was right and it has served me well since, even with its poor bolt function. It is a ribbed design trigger and is not covered by the recall, but I am still slightly concerned if there has been any instances that are known. Great video JimmyDickens1. Are you still located in Bellevue? Some weather we have been getting, huh? Anyways, thank you for your service and safe hunting!!!
Thanks for your comments, Kyle. I'm not familiar with the model 770, so can't comment on that. Have you had an issue with it? I still live in Bellevue. Fortunately the bad weather has missed our neighborhood so far.
+JimmyDickens1 The 770 is a budget grade rifle that is part of the 700 series of Remington rifles. It also uses a trigger connector like the M700, but I don't think it has the true "Walker" trigger group. From what I have read about the current pending class action suit, the 770, along with its predecessor the 710, would be included in the models Remington is offering to replace the trigger mechanism on as part of the settlement. A far as when the judge will approve it, your guess is as good as mine. I haven't had any issues with my rifle as of yet, but then again I have not subjected it to as low of temperatures as you did. I have thought of sticking it in the deep freeze to test it, but my is guess my wife would not be overly happy about that.
Given Remington's choice to cover up their defective and dangerous trigger mechanism I would say that you could potentially be playing with fire. I would simply chose a manufacture that has a more credible reputation for safety.
I would bet that it was the trigger adjustments themselves that were out of wack, the ones they cover with glue so you cant adjust without removing it. The cold certainly causes metal to contract......enough to disengage the sear, and I would imagine the same thing could happen if you bumped/dropped it with the safety off. The sear can't be set so slick that temperature will cause it to disengage.
+IAMGOD712007 You obviously didn't read the previous comments. This has nothing to do with adjustments, as verified by Remington. Keep in mind Remington 700s were produced with TWO DIFFERENT TRIGGERS: The 'Walker' trigger was installed from inception of the Rem 700 to 2006 and the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger, which was installed on Rem 700s from 2006 to current. This video addresses the issues with the XMP trigger, which is the recall trigger. Other online videos address the issue with the 'Walker' trigger (i.e. the video by arizonaresponse). Don't confuse the two triggers. They are very different triggers with very different causes to their issues. By the way, it was the bonding agent you referred to in your comment that was causing the negligent discharges for the XMP trigger, as verified by Remington and led to the XMP trigger recall.
My story…. Inherited the Remington 700 22-250. 2009. I sighted gun in that summer. Went hunting that season. Was very cold and normally I don’t wear gloves. I had on gloves. Deer is approaching, I slide my finger over trigger and took the safety off before on target. BOOM. Until today, I thought it was my fault because of the thick glove and having my finger inside the trigger guard. I ran across this video bc now I shot the gun at a deer and the trigger creeped so much it surprised me so that I pulled my head back from scope and then the gun goes off. Of course it missed this nice Georgia buck. BUT it was a 250 yard shot so the buck just stood there. I jacked another round and place the cross hairs on him and pulled the trigger…..NOTHING. So, now the gun will not go on safe and the trigger is frozen. I go to remove bolt and I can’t. The button won’t press to release bolt. Any suggestion?????? THANK YOU!
@@rifleshooterchannel208 Not sure what comment you read but nowhere in my comment do I say it was not my fault. I will say it was not my fault the gun fired when I clicked off the safety. My finger was inside the trigger guard but not on the trigger.
@@riverratpat259 So you claim. Dollars to donuts the gun went off because you had a thickly gloved trigger finger inside the trigger guard and you put pressure on the trigger blade.
Was the gun purchased new or used? Anybody work on the trigger? Not that hard to adjust… I’ve done quite a few on my guns… mine were purchased in the late 60’s… Can’t believe the Supposed Trigger problem Remington has? Honestly don’t know what else to say
To answer your questions: purchased new; it came with the X-Mark Pro trigger, which is adjustable, bur I’ve never adjusted it as I liked the pull weight out of the box; since your guns were purchased in the 60’s, as you say, you would have the Walker Trigger, which is an entirely different trigger from the XMP trigger. If you read the comments and description section of the video, I layed out a comprehensive timeline of what happened, to include how Remington recalled REM 700s due to this video. I’ve also been contacted to testify in court and have provided recorded deposition in a particular court case. Parts of this video were also featured on 60-minutes. So if you are doubting the results of this rudimentary experiment or if you are doubting there is a problem with the XMP trigger, sorry, but that train has left the station. The problem has been verified and Remington issued a recall to fix the problem. Again, read the narrative and comments associated with the video and you will discover this. As for you Walker triggers, I can’t speak to those. There are documented problems with that trigger, but many believe those are caused by owners adjusting the triggers and not knowing what they are doing.
Hi jimmy. Apparently we aren't as stupid as all the self proclaimed gun experts on TH-cam say we are. Seems that Remington has finally acknowledged a problem with the xmark pro trigger. They recalled it April 11 2014. Said some triggers may have excess bonding agent in the mechanism creating negligent discharges.
Charles - you are correct. I was just posting information I received from Remington. Turns out my rudimentary experiment with temperature helped them "crack the case". I had a very nice conversation with the public relations representative and the engineer. They were very kind and complimentary.
Oh, Charles, one more thing - I went to Arizonaresponse's business website, found his e-mail address in his contact page, and forwarded the nice e-mail I received from Remington to him to inform him of the issue Remington acknowledged they had. I did it this way (privately between him and me) so as not to rub it in or be a sore winner He then deleted all the posts on his video where he debated me on this issue. He would not admit he was wrong and I was right. He went into total damage control mode. I guess he's one of those guys who won't admit when they are wrong.
WoT Professional I am a retired Navy Commander (pay grade O-5), equivalent to Army/Air Force/Marine Corps Lieutenant Colonel. From the looks of your picture, you are military as well.
JimmyDickens1 Actually no I have no military service I'm 18 years old an plan to join the Army next year to become a sniper go to 7 weeks of U.S. Army sniper school and thank you for your service.
How do u fix this I have never had it happen to me but I still have the stock trigger in mine and never new this was a problem I just bout a adjustable stock for mine but now I’m worried I bout mine in 2016
If you bought yours new in 2016, it’s post-recall and probably “fixed”. A quick way to tell for pre-recall guns to see if they’ve been fixed is to look at the bolt release button near the trigger guard. If it has a small punch mark, the trigger has been fixed. I don’t know if Remington continued doing this during manufacture after the recall, but worth investigating.
+Pride Rock Yes - Remington kept the rifle I sent them (the one in this video) and replaced it with the Remington 700 Alaskan Wilderness Rifle II. It is a sweet shooting rifle and is literally a tack driver.
Jim I believe that the Little Boy,? Who was Killed by the Trigger problem.? Happened on a Warm Weather Day.? I may be wrong.? Question the Weather Temps.etc.? Causing the problem.?
+A REDTAIL I believe the little boy who was killed was shot with a Remington 700 that had the Walker trigger installed. The Walker is the trigger that was installed on Remington 700s from inception until about 2006. In 2006, Remington replaced the Walker trigger with the X-Mark Pro trigger in part due to pressure to do something due to the issues with the Walker trigger. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP (X-Mark Pro) trigger. What I discovered (and verified by Remington engineers) is that the bonding agent used in the XMP trigger is heat and cold sensitive and may cause a discharge when moving the safety lever from safe to fire in colder temperatures. As I understand, Remington has never admitted to an issue with the Walker trigger. This most recent recall is for the XMP trigger (~7.8M rifles).Having said that, your Remington 700 from the early 80s more than likely has the Walker trigger, not the XMP. You can verify this by checking on the Remington website. It describes how you can tell which trigger you have installed. But as I mentioned, others have had issues with the Walker trigger as well, but I can't speak to that - I only researched the XMP trigger. You may want to view a video by Arizonaresponse as he discusses the Walker trigger and how a mis-adjustment can lead to negligent discharges.Thank you for your comments and kind words! Enjoy your 700 - it will be a great pass-down item to your boys.
After I sent my rifle to Remington so they could analyze it, they conducted a test of their own. From what I've been told, they were able to duplicate the issue I've demonstrated in 4 of 10 rifles. So not all of them have this problem, but enough to warrant a recall. Also, the recall is for the newer X-Mark Pro triggers; not the older "Walker" triggers. Not sure what trigger you have installed on your Remington 700, but it makes a difference.
Hi Jimmy, Good video and great detective work. Before I heard the actual cause I was thinking frost might be the problem. It's good to see that Remington stepped right up to address it. It wouldn't have happened without you. I wonder if the same process is being used by other manufacturers? Thanks for your efforts!
@@twentyfifthdui4717 I was joking when I said "stepped right up". Now that I re-read it, I can see why it might be taken the wrong way. Sorry for the confusion.
I had this happen once last year. I think it has something to do with where it's at in relation to the bolt. If the safety is on when you open the bolt or cock the rifle then when you close the bolt and take it off safety it goes off. The reason I believe my theory is you cannot open the bolt with the safety in the safe or on position. So what I do and will forever do is load it with safety off when I close the bolt with a chambered round it will always be in a safe direction when I close the bolt. I will put the gun on safety then take it off just to make sure it will not fire then on again. I want the peace of mind when I take it off safety to shoot a deer it's not going to go off unexpected. I thought I had did something wrong till I researched this. This is my personal experience with the safety.
Brandon Patterson You have one of the older trigger models that require the safety lever set to ‘Fire’ to manipulate the bolt. The newer trigger assemblies allow one to manipulate the bolt with the safety on. My rifle is one of those: safety on does not effect bolt operation. Remington has agreed with my theory and issued a recall in April 2014. I thought it was metallurgy when in reality, it was the bonding agent used in the manufacturing of the trigger assembly. Regardless, temperature was effecting the trigger assembly causing the rifles to discharge.
@@JimmyDickens1 I looked on the website with my serial number and it wasn't part of the recall. I love my 700 but I really have to be mindful of everything I do. I was once told in a safety course that the safety is a mechanical device it can and will fail at some point. I guess I will be looking for a better option to replace the trigger and safety. That's awesome though that they have contacted and given you inside information on the cause. The day it happen to me it was sunny and in the 60s. Thanks for sharing your video and knowledge on this issue :)
Brandon Patterson Great ‘talking’ to you, too. The safety class you took is correct: the safety device is merely a mechanical and can fail. The ‘ultimate safety’ is between your ears. My 700s have been great as well. All (3) have been through the recall and have performed flawlessly so far. Since yours isn’t part of the recall, there are a couple of things to consider: take your rifle to a reputable gunsmith to ensure your trigger/safety are adjusted properly (see video by Arizona Response on how maladjustments can cause discharges with that specific trigger assembly (Walker Trigger)). Second option is to replace the assembly. Timney makes a great trigger. Thanks again for sharing your information.
Alan - Thanks for your comments. I never adjusted the trigger on my rifle, but was able to duplicate the issue, leading to the Remington recall (read my remarks and video description above). I'm assuming you know about Remington recalling nearly 8-million rifles that are equipped with the X-Mark Pro trigger. I wouldn't expect your rifle to exhibit this issue since you purchased it a few days ago. I would assume your rifle has been modified due to the recall and was 'fixed' prior to you getting it (assuming you bought it from a retailer and not a private party transfer). To verify this, look at the bolt release near your trigger guard. If it is 'recall complete', it will have a dent on it from a punch. If the bolt release does not have the punch mark, I'd recommend sending it to Remington for the recall, provided it is equipped with the X-Mark Pro trigger.
Awesome good to know I'll look thanks. I even tried hitting the bolt flipping the safety trying to get it to miss fire. Gun pointed down range obviously. Thanks for the response merry Christmas
I noticed you had your safety on twice before closing the bolt. This may or may not be an issue, but it seems to me the safety is for locking out the trigger for a loaded weapon. Could it be that cycling the bolt while on safety causes undo stress on the trigger group. I'm just curious to know. I do not own any weapons with that trigger group and I also do not own any Remington products. I have a lot of years behind the trigger myself and have never used my safety in that manner. The safety always goes on after a round has been loaded.
With the Rem 700 (X-Mark Pro trigger installed), once the gun is de-cocked, the safety lever can't be placed in the Safe position (note it is in the fire position to accomplish the de-cock) until the rifle is re-cocked. Therefore, the bolt must be cycled to cock it (essentially lifting the bolt handle accomplishes this), then the safety lever can be placed to the safe position. The bolt can then be cycled with the safety lever in the safe position with no harm to the bolt or trigger assembly. From what I understand, with the older Rem 700's (with the Walker trigger installed), the safety lever had to be placed to the fire position to cycle the bolt in order to clear the magazine. This was deemed unsafe, so the change was made to allow for cycling with the safety lever in the safe position. I hope this answers your question/addresses your concern.
By the way I'm in Massachusetts and it's been cold here and was cold while zeroing in the scope and no the slightest defects it's a 700 adl varmit. But have been very curious into all the allegations for my own Safety reasons and my hunting partners. But at the end of the day the safety on the gun is the last resort of stopping an accident from occurring proper diligence of where you gun is pointing should really be your only safety but shit happens as we all know too well
I have three of them - all have been through the recall - and I haven't had an issue with any of them since getting them back from the factory. I'm confident Remington fixed the issue. Thank you for your comment and enjoy your 700s!
MyREDTAIL I have never owned a Walker trigger, so have no experience with them. While others claim there is a similar issue with them, Remington has never admitted to a problem with the Walker Trigger. Arizonaresponse has a TH-cam video that explains how misadjustments on the Walker Trigger can cause negligent discharges. Lastly, be mindful which trigger is being discussed while watching videos regarding Remington 700 triggers. Sometimes it's not so obvious and even worse, some making videos don't even realize Remington 700s were manufactured with two distinct and very different triggers. This only adds to the confusion.
TheRedmercy My model 700 (the one I sent to Remington) is going to be retained by Remington and they will replace it with a new one. My daughter also has a model 700 in .243 that I intend to send in for repair. I personally really like the X-Mark Pro trigger. It is very crisp and I agree with Remington's claim that it "breaks like a glass rod". I'm sure it will be a very good, reliable trigger once it is repaired, therefore, my intention is to keep it. Just my two-cents...
I shipped my daughter's Model 700 and have since received. Total time from start to finish was 3-months, 8-days. This was from registering on the Remington website to shipping the rifle to Remington to receiving the rifle at my residence. I have not shot this rifle as of yet, but I will let you know how it performs. See my latest post (above) for a complete timeline.
David Miller The problem is with the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. If your 783 has the XMP trigger, you can tell if it’s been through the recall if it has a punch mark on the bolt release. See the Remington website for full description.
I agree…. Which is why I never grease my trigger assemblies. I suggest you read the comments and the narrative I posted with the video. You will then discover the root cause.
@@cover557 since it was manufactured in 1973 (and if it’s the original trigger), it would have the Walker trigger. A reputable gunsmith might be able to tune it up for you. The trigger in my video is the X-Mark Pro.
@@cover557 There is a video by Arizona Response that demonstrates how monkeying with a Walker trigger can cause it to become unstable. Since you bought it used, the previous owner might have adjusted it too light, causing your problem. As I mentioned previously, I’d consider taking it to a reputable gunsmith to bring the trigger back to within specs.
Good video and as a Remington 700 enthusiast I intend on testing this issue with my 700. My only question to you is (and I'm not trying to create waves) you mentioned that you left your Remington 700 out in your garage for a couple days where it was rather cold out (I believe you said 10°). My question to you would be if it was 10° in your garage wouldn't we see you breath as you exhaled or spoke?
M Ross Thanks for your comments. I'm not a meteorology expert, but I'm assuming there are other factors besides temperature, such as humidity and dew point, that determine if one sees breath on cold days. Same principle as fog formation and the fact that some mornings you have to scrape your windows and some mornings you don't. Which reminds me: I've never had to scrape the windows of the cars in the garage. Not sure why, just haven't done it...
Also, I'll be curious to know if you get the same results as me. Keep in mind my trigger is the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. If your 700 was manufactured after ~2006, you probably have the XMP as well. If before 2006, then you probably have the 'Walker' trigger installed. See the video by arizonaresponse for an explanation regarding issues with the Walker Trigger.
For added safety, I never ever, ever, ever chamber a bullet and set the safety. I feel that if I don’t have time to load and fire all at once then it was too rushed anyway. Just say ‘in.
Seriously? That’s how you hunt? Even rabbits, squirrels, and pheasants? I think I’d be a vegetarian if I did that. No way would I be able to load and fire on a fleeting game.
Was commenting on the Remington 700 video. I only hunt moose and black bear so there’s usually time, if not then next time. Definitely didn’t mean to offend, just suggesting another layer of safety.. Take care.
@@randaman7098 No offense taken. Your explanation cleared it up. I've never hunted bear or moose, so I have no experience with regard to how much time is required to get set for a shot. Every gun I carry must be safe enough to carry loaded and on safe without concern that it will go off uncommanded. If not, I won't carry it.
I never disassembled the rifle beyond that recommended by Remington in the owner's manual for normal cleaning and maintenance. I never even adjusted the trigger using the adjustment screw - didn't need to, I was happy with the pull weight out of the box. Remington verified I didn't make adjustments when I sent my rifle to them. They tested my rifle, discovered the problem I described, and issued the recall. I'm sure had I made an adjustment inside the trigger assembly, Remington engineers would have discovered it and would have dismissed my claim.
I bought a gun that had that problem. The guy was scared of the gun an I got it cheappppp. Remington 700 270 wsm. I took to the gun smith an got it fixed. Nope !!!!! Your correct. On a cold morning. Bam !!! As soon as I put on fire !!! I did kill the deer. I took it back to him an inside the gun shop it would never go off. So he put a whole new trigger in it. Problem Solved. Thanks for Video an Your Service !!!!!!!! Your Awesome !!
+T Mon Great question. I thoroughly cleaned and lubricated the trigger assembly in accordance with the Owner's Manual in order to rule out gumming or 'stickiness' of the lubrication in colder temperatures. I'm sure the cleanliness of the trigger assembly is one of the things the Remington engineers considered as well when they inspected my rifle after I submitted it to them for repair. I'm certain another piece of their inspection was to rule out tampering of the trigger assembly. What they found was no tampering and a clean trigger assembly. As you probably read in my video description above, the engineers agreed with my findings and discovered the bonding agent they were using in the trigger assembly is what is/was heat and cold sensitive, causing the problem. Remington then issued the recall. Had they found a dirty, neglected trigger or a tampered with trigger assembly, they would have understandably dismissed my claims and sent my rifle back.
+JimmyDickens1 I've not had problems but they are newer. I cleaned mine with hopps bore clean and alcohol, there was a a lot of black residue that came out.
+T Mon You have to be careful cleaning a trigger assembly with a bore cleaner. Bore cleaner is a very strong cleaner suitable for removing lead and powder fouling from the all-metal (Steel) bore and barrel. Trigger assemblies may contain bonding agent, plastics and 'weaker' metals, such as aluminum and will not do well with a bore cleaner. That may explain the black residue you are seeing. I once "melted" the plastic hand grips on one of my pistols with bore cleaner - not good! Hoppe's Solvent #9 will work on your trigger, but not the Bore cleaner.
My trigger action actually improved quite a bit, much lighter and less gritty. It still breaks the same, tad heavy but not too bad. Will have to do till I get some Timneys in there. Thanks.
is the trigger assembly dirty ? have you taken the stock off and inspected for dirt ? has the trigger been oiled lately ? the gun oil could be hanging it up try synthetic gun oil Casey breech-wood makes some
+mad max The first thing I did was completely and thoroughly clean the rifle. My original assumption was gumming of the lubricant I was using, so I tested that first. This assumption turned out to be incorrect. the problem with my trigger (and all other X-Mark Pro triggers) was the bonding agent used in manufacturing the trigger. It is heat and cold sensitive, causing negligent discharges with the XMP trigger when moving the safety lever from safe to fire in colder temperatures. This has been verified and confirmed by Remington, causing the recall on the XMP triggers. Please read the comments I posted under the video for a complete timeline. I also noticed a post you made on the CNBC hit-piece. It appears you are confusing the TWO triggers Remington used during the manufacture of the Remington 700, which are the 'Walker trigger' and the X-Mark Pro trigger. The Walker is the trigger that was installed on Remington 700s from inception until about 2006. In 2006, Remington replaced the Walker trigger with the X-Mark Pro trigger in part due to pressure to do something due to the issues with the Walker trigger. The CNBC hit piece was a bash on the Walker trigger. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP (X-Mark Pro) trigger. As I understand, Remington has never admitted to an issue with the Walker trigger. This most recent recall is for the XMP trigger (~7.8M rifles), which Remington did confirm the issue. I hope this helps clarify the issue.
JimmyDickens1 i understand what you are talking about i do know that lack of maintenance can cause issues can mess things up in cold temps i have seen it and a good cleaning fixes it just thought i would ask i have seen people blame a weapon and its just dirty its hard for me to believe that Remington would put an unsafe rifle on the market today i have never owned a Remington rifle i am ruger guy its hard to have a issue with a maser action
+mad max I agree with you - I've seen people neglect the maintenance on their rifles as well, causing issues. Like I said though, I thought maybe it was the oil I was using (low-viscosity perhaps gumming in cold temperatures), but it wasn't. Ruger manufactures a great product! Thanks for your comments.
The sad truth is the trigger and safetys are faulty but 98% of these ND deaths involve some 1 pointing the rifle at some 1 and loading or unloading it WTF the 2% could be rounds skipping after ND. sad real sad
Remington did check the "Cold theory" after reading my information paper and watching this video and found 4 out of 10 rifles (according to CBS's 60 Minutes segment on Remington 700) had the same issue when subjected to cold temperatures. Read this article: www.google.com/amp/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/youtube-video-shows-gun-spontaneously-fire/?client=safari and watch this segment: www.cbsnews.com/news/popular-remington-700-rifle-linked-to-potentially-deadly-defects/ for additional information.
Either replace it or send your rifle to Remington for the recall. Many have said they were going to replace the X-Mark Pro trigger that came on their Remington 700s with a Timney, which is a great trigger. I sent my daughter's Remington 700 in for the recall and it came back after ~3-months. We've not had any issues with hers or the rifle Remington sent me to replace the rifle I sent them (the one in this video). I believe the fix Remington did with regards to the recall worked.
One more comment: If you do buy a Remington 700 with the X-Mark Pro installed, check the bolt release lever for a 'punch mark'. If it has this mark, it indicates the rifle has been sent to the factory and the recall actions have been performed on it. If the rifle doesn't have this mark and therefore has not been through the recall, I would probably pass on buying it. Check the Remington website for further information and to see a picture of what the 'punch mark' looks like.
Cool, thanks for the video and the advice. When I buy a 700, I thought about having it in the .308 configuration and thought about getting a Timney trigger installed right off the bat. Of course then again also thought about a custom build as well. Thanks for responding back. Good luck to you!
Good research on your own. I am shocked after several negligent unexplained discharges you would continue to use the firearm over a period of years. Did you contact Remington or a gunsmith and have the rifle examined after you were certain there was a problem? True you may have found a legitimate problem with the rifle but do you have the resources to determine how common or rare this issue is? I commend for diligence and for not immediately attempting to sue every person that may have handled the weapon before you. Inaction may have put other gun owners at risk.
Please re-read my remarks (posted under the title of this video), as your comments and assumptions are inaccurate. TWO negligent discharges are not several. I DID NOT continue to use the firearm over a period of years after the discharges. After the second discharge, I removed the rifle from service, conducted temperature-related testing, and sent it to Remington for their testing and confirmation of my results and conclusion. This is clearly explained in my comments above. If you were to read and comprehend my comments, you would clearly see that my ACTIONS prompted the Remington recall and therefore REDUCED the risk to other gun owners.
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I have a 1999 Rem. 700 never ever fired and I got it to fire after switching from the safety to fire TWICE!! in about 20 trys indoors at 70 degrees. Very scary! Thanks for your video sir and thanks Remington NOT!!!!
Yes mine fired switching the safety off in warm temps as well.
I am now 70 years old. When I was 17 my parents bought me a used .22/.250 Model 700 for Christmas. I had only fired it a few times when I took it to a friends hunting camp in northern PA on a early summer day. Sitting in a lawn chair I decided to fire it at their spring pond about 100 yards away down the hill (safe backdrop). I stood up and chambered another round and the rifle fired. I was sure I did not hit the trigger with my finger. I did not even consider the possibility that the trigger had design/manufacturing problems. A reputable manufacturer like Remington would simply not do that.
I fortunately missed my foot but did blast dirt and stone in my eye which luckily did no damage but hurt badly from the blow. For fifty years I blamed myself that somehow I had touched that trigger. Now I am sure that was not the case. Since then I have probably only fired 50 rounds through the gun. So fifty years later Remington is still having trigger problems? If there are trigger problems the firearm should not be on the market! Remington should remove their management. They should give engineers the lead in producing firearms, not bean-counters and marketeers. They should listen to the people on the production lines that warned of problems. I replaced my trigger with a Timney trigger. This episode destroyed my faith in Remington, a formerly great name. It's not coming back.
David, USED GUNS become “ for sale” for a reason. The older Remington 700’s are fine rifles AND HAVE ADJUSTABLE TRIGGERS. A competent gunsmith can adjust your trigger to a safe & reliable pull weight. Grease or lubricants containing paraffin can gum up your trigger. A thorough degreasing & professional trigger adjustment should solve your problem provided nothing is broken.
@@diogenes5381 YOU ARE WRONG! These Rem model 700 . . . . some had problems right out of the box BRAND NEW. I purchased mine brand new, and while sighting it in with a scope in the very first box of shells it fired without touching the trigger. I purchased this rifle in 1970, and at only 15 years old, my father did not believe that I had not touched the trigger. I never used the rifle again. Even at that age I understood the HUGE liability. Fast forward about a year, and it happened to my father as well. At this point it may have had perhaps 400 rounds fired through it. always cleaned after shooting it. Trigger never adjusted or lubed. After multiple attempts to get Remington to address the problem, they refused to admit that the weapon had any problem. Had they have maned up in 1971 lives would have been saved. I have owned well over a hundred guns in my 69 years. But that was the very last Remington. The corporate heads of Remington belong in prison!
UPDATE: 20 Apr 2014 (cont.)
11 Apr 2014 - Received following e-mail from Remington representative:
"It was a pleasure talking with you yesterday. I wanted to forward you a copy of the recall notice and press release that was recently released. Again, I would like to thank you very much for helping us. Without your rifle we might not have been able to identify this issue. Today we have all benefited from your efforts. I will be back in touch soon."
Right on man! You probably saved alot of lives with this!
@@twentyfifthdui4717 The earlier problems you referenced were with the “Walker” triggers, which were installed on REM 700’s from inception until 2006. After 2006, REM 700’s were manufactured with the X-Mark Pro triggers, which is what this video is about.
True, but in 2004 an executive from Remington sent a memo to Remington production calling them out for releasing subpar products. 2 years later in 2006 the xmp trigger was responsible for the death of Justin Stringer. Remington proved they are more interesting in the dollar than the human lives.
Thank you for your service
JimmyDickens1, I want to thank you for your efforts, you've certainly done a great job of demonstrating the issue that has plagued these otherwise excellent rifles since their inception. I'm a former sniper and have been in the process of building a nice long range rifle for home use. We have a fair amount of property so long range shooting at home is not a problem. Nonetheless, the Remington 700 has been on the table for the basis of my project until I became aware of this issue, then my choices have been moving to Savage 110's and their follow up guns. Again, thank you for your efforts and demand for the truth in this problem. We gun folks have had enough bad press in the media for some time and so it's gratifying to see one of our numbers pushing for safety in our hobby as you have clearly demonstrated. God bless you and your efforts.
Rick - Thank you for the kind words. They are greatly appreciated. And thank you for your service. Have fun with your build and enjoy the fruits of your labor.
During our last graded night shoot for U.S.Army Sniper School, one of the Sniper students on the line fired his weapon after the Instructor called "Range Hot" but before the targets (held by other students in the firing pit) came up. The Soldier told the Instructors he had just taken the rifle off safe and it fired on it's own, but they felt he had negligently pulled the trigger. He was dropped from the course with just a few days left in training. We will never know if he got a raw deal or not, but this video makes you think.
I know with both my issued M-24 (Iraq deployment 2004-2005) and my own custom built Remington 700 based sniper rifle (Speedco .308, heavy fluted barrel, McMillian stock, IOR Valdata scope), I would NEVER trust the safety on them. Better to keep the chamber EMPTY until you have a target in mind.
SSG U.S.Army (Ret), Infantry / Sniper, multiple tours
SSG - Thanks for the comments. Sucks to be the soldier who was dropped. More than likely not his fault, yet he paid the price for it.Thank you for your service!!
Thank you for your service. I feel bad for the ND guy. Thanks for your input on the 700s. I grew up all 700 and out of my dads 20 rifles 8 safetys fail. Just a feathers worth of side pressure on the trigger and flick the safety off and boom, just feel the trigger before touching the safety boom, close the bolt and boom open the bolt and boom i've seen it. I see you still luv ur 700s. That muscle memory right? What trigger did you use on ur build what pull weight? I would luv to spend a week a the range with you. I'll bet you rifles are sweet shooters and it would be humbling to have some 1 out shoot me make me feel like lil baby shooter again:). Than maybe you could help me rap my head around the whole changing zero on your scope for every shot?? 30 years of AK bear and moose hunting with leupold m8 4x/ Rem700 .458wm with 350gn pills with 100 yard zero and good old Kentucky windage to much muscle memory for me to change now. I would like to try your new fangled adjust on the fly scopes. Oh and moose and bears dont shoot back:) that often:0 I have fired untold rounds learned not to flinch years ago but now i find myself flinching closing the bolt, switching the safety off. Just the more i think about it the more flinchy i get. I hunt alone covered in moose piss making moose noises I have to have a round in so a good hunting season i load and unload many times. I'm looking for best trigger to replace mine. "The Remington lottery"" Win and you might shoot a battle buddy a foot or dear god your kid:( THANKS AGAIN FOR YOUR SERVICE. keep your primers and powder dry.... Ho ya wait what is a primer again what do they look like do you remember? LOLOOLOLOL
I don't want that rifle. It is a valuable lesson to all, never point a firearm in the direction of anything you don't intend to kill.
This issue dates back sixty plus years. A lot of manufacturers would have fixed this.
TH-camrs - Many have been curious of the timeline for shipping a recalled firearm and the amount of time between sending and receiving a rifle. Bottom line: It took 3 months 8 days from start to finish. Below is the complete timeline for shipping my daughter's Model 700 in .243:
- 11 May 2014 - Completed Recall Submission on Remington website. Received confirmation e-mail from Remington.
- 19 May 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington containing .pdf shipping label and shipping instructions.
- 22 May 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington indicating shipping box was sent to my residence.
- 27 May 2014 - Received shipping box at my residence.
- 28 May 2014 - I packaged my daughter's Model 700 and delivered to UPS office for shipping.
- 02 Jun 2014 - UPS online tracking indicated rifle delivered to Remington factory.
- 10 Jun 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington stating they had received rifle.
- 13 Aug 2014 - Received e-mail from Remington stating they shipped rifle for return to me.
- 19 Aug 2014 - Received rifle at my residence.
I will remount the scope and take it to the range for sighting in preparation for the upcoming deer season. I will let you know how it performs. Of note, though, we never experienced any problems with this rifle. My daughter and I sighted it during summer/fall temperatures and my daughtrer only shot it once during deer season, as she was fortunate enough to shoot a deer on her first shot. It was a nice, sunny relative warm day last fall.
Great job, Remington, for turning this rifle in a relative short time, given the number of rifles affected by this recall!
Good video telling Remington what is wrong with their triggers cause they have no clue.
Before I loved Remington guns I own a 870 and a model 700 ( I changed out the trigger with Timney ) but after realizing Remington took 15 years to recall the model 700 for trigger replacement,
not caring about the people that were killed, I'm DONE with Remington guns.
The corporate heads of Remington are criminals, and belong in prison! Putting corporate profit above human lives and safety is just not acceptable. After this many years, those people should still have to go to prison.
@@jerrys2745 ... I remember years ago while deer hunting , I took off the safety and the rifle fired . I ( being served in the Marines) didn't know what happen , I was shocked that the gun shot without pulling the trigger and my cousin was mad because I could have scared off the deer . Only years later did I learn about the bad triggers and people dying. This should be true proof that these were bad trigger . By the way I shot expert 3 years straight in USMC.
UPDATE: 20 Apr 2014
9 Apr 2014 - Received a phone call from a Remington representative asking if I would speak to a Remington engineer regarding my rifle. I agreed.
10 Apr 2014 - Spoke to a Remington engineer who explained a major factor was my reference to the temperature and its affect on the trigger assembly (specifically, the bonding agent used during the manufacturing process). He also thanked me for producing this video, sending in my rifle, and sending the accompanying information paper explaining my rudimentary experiment and methods used to discover the issue. He informed me Remington was planning a multi-year recall of the Remington model 700 with the X-Mark Pro trigger, which was subsequently issued 11 Apr 2014.
good job
I'm very late to the game here but I would like to personally thank you for your service to our country and the research you provided. Sir, you are the very definition of a true American hero.
EM Thank you, EM. I really appreciate it.
To John Bohna - In 2009, when I purchased my Remington 700, it was called '700 BDL Exclusive 24" Fluted Barrel XCR Synthetic Stock'. It was a 'Cabela's Exclusive'. XCR stands for Xtreme Conditions Rifle. If you were to copy and paste '700 BDL Exclusive 24" Fluted Barrel XCR Synthetic Stock' into a Google search, you will see a Remington 700 with the synthetic stock which looks exactly like the one in my video. I'm not sure when they started calling it SPS, but in 2009, it was the BDL XCR.
JimmyDickens1 Sell that thing and buy either a Wichester mod 70 or a Mauser M98 or Ruger M77.
CBS's 60-Minutes ran the Remington 700 segment again tonight. Hope you all saw it.
JimmyDickens1
First decent (and unbiased) explanation of the issue. Thanks.
Very interesting. I just inherited a 700 bdl (.243) from my grandfather, and have been nervous about the safety/trigger issues I've read about. The gun looks darn near brand new from the 70's. It more than likely has the same set up as the ones with issues. Your video makes perfect sense, and needs to be sent to Remington. If you watch the TH-cam videos with people showing the gun going off unintentionally, they look to be shooting in cold weather. I'm going to take mine to a gun store for a look, but I really think you are on to something here. Hate to pay 150 bucks for a new trigger! Thanks for the video.
UPDATE: After many phone calls and e-mails, I finally got a response from Remington. The customer service was slow, but I got what I needed - a Service Request number (the web site states not to ship a firearm to them with out the number). I FedEx'ed my rifle to ARM Services in Ilion, NY on 19 Feb 2014. I included an explanation of the issues I was having, and how the misfires seemed dependent on cold temperature. I received an e-mail response 25 Feb 2014 from Remington indicating they received my rifle. Also in the e-mail was a link I could click to get a status of my rifle's repair. Problem is when I click on the link, I get this message, "There are no results for the data entered." On 18 March, I sent Remington an e-mail asking for the status of my rifle, as the link is not helpful and my rifle seems to have disappeared. As of today, I have not gotten a response. I continue to wait...
Great video. Good job on isolating the problem.
Same here. Cold. Gun goes bang when you flip the safety off. 1 in 20 times the firing pin will also drop on bolt close.
About 8 years ago I was unchambering a round in my uncles house, gun pointed to the ground. 30-06. As I flicked from safety to fire to unchamber the round, the gun discharged into the tile floor. For 8 years I thought I must have pulled the trigger on accident. Questioned myself for a very long time. I can't remember if the bolt locked on safety or not, but I must have had a reason. Seeing this is a big relief. An important note is that the gun was just brought inside from a night long hunting trip in sub 40 degree weather.
I’m not a gunsmith but I know there’s an entire aftermarket industry for Remington 700 triggers, that says something. Half the guys I know who own 700’s have aftermarket triggers installed; they tell me to add $100-300 to the cost of a 700 and you’ll have a more accurate estimate of the rifle’s price.
I own a pair of 1961 40X 22’s; one was adjusted by a 75yr old professional gunsmith and it breaks at the touch of a feather (2-4oz with the original trigger), the other has a Timney that’s adjusted as low as a second gunsmith said he felt comfortable with (4-6oz). The original 40X trigger has a pure magic to it but the Timney is a close second. It takes me a few sandbag rounds before I’m able to mentally swap between the two rifles. They’re extremely close on trigger pressure but I can feel the difference; both are terrific though.
The cold theory might be a cause, I usually shoot in the fall through the early spring so my 40X’s are not dealing with temperature swings.
I use Winchester Model 70’s for hunting so I’ve never encountered trigger issues like my friends using 700’s have.
UPDATE: 27 Mar 2014 - Received the following message from Remington in regards to my Customer Service inquiry (see post below): "Jim, Your gun is being replaced with a new gun. It should be shipped next week." No further explanation as to 'why' or findings/results of their testing. I'll let you know when the new rifle arrives.
JimmyDickens1 I just had the same problem with my model 770 270 gun sitting in my tree stand it was about 30 degrees and my gun went off great gun but kinda scared 2 hunt with it again
Chad - Thanks for the comments. If you have the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger installed, send it to Remington for the recall. They will fix it so it will be safe to use once again. The recall instructions are on the Remington website.
Back in the 90s a friend of mine bought a model 700 Safari in .375H&H (just to have it) and a round when off when a round was chambered. He was not on the trigger but I am glad I was not there to suffer permanent hearing damage.
yes this is very logical answer .As i have studied mechanical engineering .Im sure this metals mixture with climate is the many unexplained discharge complaints they get are denied because there is no experts at remington in metalurgy.
regardless of trigger who is responsible for pointing gun at someone who did die or could have that's a hugh book filled with jail time thank you for your service
Great video. You really problem solved this one out! I have a 700 50 th anniversary addition and I'm waiting on my box to ship it and have it fixed now. I just pray they get it fixed properly.
Thanks, Jayce. I just received my daughter's 700 from the factory a few days ago. I'll let you know how it performs. Of note, though, we never experienced this problem with her gun. We sighted it during summer/fall temperatures and she only shot it once during deer season, as she was fortunate enough to shoot a deer on her first shot. It was a nice, sunny relative warm day last fall.
I was surprised with a few texts and phone calls from friends and family this evening informing me CBS's 60-Minutes used my video in a story on the Remington 700. The clip ran this evening, 19 Feb 2017 and can be found here:
www.cbsnews.com/news/popular-remington-700-rifle-linked-to-potentially-deadly-defects/
I was happy to see CBS differentiated between the two triggers used in the manufacture of the Remington 700: The X-Mark Pro trigger (which is what my video is about) and the "Walker" trigger.
JimmyDickens1 Saw the 60 minutes show this evening. I am going to disassemble my Rem and throw it in the ocean. Your idea of environmental problems was sharp thinking!!
Thanks for the info. I recently had my Remington 700 go off when I moved safety off before unloading. Blew a hole in my deer blind and scared the hell out of me. Luckily nobody was hurt. Researched it and didn't know this was a known problem. Shame on Remington. I will be replacing trigger and safety assembly with new trigger tech assembly.
You are most welcome. I’m happy no one was injured (or worse) with your incident.
Thankfully, the problem has been been corrected in this model, at least in every one of them made after 2010. The Remington 700 is one of the most popular hunting rifles of all time. It's also used as a sniper rifle by many poloce departments.
I agree! I own three REM 700s and all have run flawlessly after going through the recall. I hunt deer to this day with them.
a lot of what i have been picking up on this issue the last few years seems to indicate you are at least partially on the right track . the other indicators seem to be a dirty trigger group and to lightly adjusted triggers. this would seem to be the situation that i have run into on those that i have worked on the last few years,.
+ TheOldGunsmith58 Please read the comments I posted with this video (click the 'Show More' button). It will explain that I sent Remington my rifle (the one in this video) along with an information paper referencing this video and explaining what I believe is the problem with Remington 700 rifles with the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger installed. As you will see, Remington tested my hypothesis, agreed with my theory (in part, as it was the bonding agent used in the manufacture of the XMP vice the metal alloy I mentioned in this video), and issued the recall for the XMP trigger. So I was a little more than partially on the right track. At any rate, Remington retained my rifle as evidence and sent me a custom-made Alaska Wilderness Rifle II as a replacement. Of note, many of the Remington 700s with the lightly adjusted triggers are the rifles with the older Walker Trigger installed. A video by arizonaresponse explains how misadjustment of a Walker Trigger will cause negligent discharges. When watching videos on Remington 700s, be mindful of which trigger they are addressing. Sometimes it's not so obvious.
Jimmy, I totally agree. arizonaresponse has lost the debate and has no credibility. He's like too many gun guys I have met. So full of themselves they are certain their opinions are right and everyone else has to be wrong but also goes so far as to let you know about it to make himself feel good. You and me are having the same issue with our rifles. It's not an adjustment issue!!! I really don't think you will get much satisfaction from Remington. But what else can we do?
Thx for the information very scary!
I was friends with Mike Walker for 10-12 yrs until he passed away. He taught me how to hand lap barrels, make benchrest jacketed bullets, among other things in his small retirement garage work shop .. .During this time he built me a bunch of hunting rifles. I tried drive out to his house and take him out to lunch several times a month. It was a good time to just ask questions. Mr. Walker was legally blind his last years and not able to drive. He could still see to shoot if the sun was bright and behind him. Mr. Walker was still a active benchrest shooter up until his death and also still building rifles for me. I'd pick some caliber (Ackley calibers were one of my favorites) and assemble the parts(new custom barrel, Remington Receiver, Trigger and stock) Most people don't know that Mr. Walker had a design patent on the button rifling method which he sold and resulted in the famous Hart Barrel Company. Mike always said that the original trigger he designed was a good safe trigger as long as a qualified gunsmith did any adjustments. Mr. Walker taught me how to adjust the Remington Trigger the correct way. I own 30-40 Remington 700's and Model 7 Rifles currently --most have the original Walker trigger from Remington. Most are set at 2lbs. and I've NEVER HAD a ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGE. I've worked on Remington Rifles as a hobby for 45yrs. and I'd estimate I've worked on over a 1,000 Remington Rifles. I'm 65 yrs old and slowing down but still enjoy accurizing a old 30-06 or 308 . The Remington trigger is a great design (compared to Winchester or Ruger!) BUT IT TAKES A QUALIFIED GUNSMITH TO ADJUST CORRECTLY !!..... IF your Remington Rifle has the original WALKER trigger then I'll bet someone tried to adjust the pull weight and got the over travel or backlash screw(there are 3 adjustment screws on the Walker Trigger) set to light. A good article that explains everything on adjusting Remington 700 triggers was written by John Antanies in the July 2001 Issue of Varmint Hunters Magazine, Issue #39 starting on page 5. Give that a read and you'll understand more about the safe way to adjust the Walker Triggers. I follow the steps outline in the article any time I do a trigger adjustment--going so far as to read the article again if it's been a while since I've worked on a trigger. I'm not trying to be rude or talk down to your video but just so you know-- the Thimney Trigger is almost a exact replica of the Remington except of a higher quality. Mr. Walker was one of the early benchrest shooters and helped get the the sport started. His trigger designs (he had a bunch) reflected the benchrest shooter's search for a trigger that breaks like a glass rod. one other note- Near the end of WW2 he designed a armor piercing round that our tanks could use to defeat the German Tiger Tank. He gave me the proto-type as a gift. Later I bought a Martina Falling Block Benchrest Rifle he built in 1952 ... I think!? It weights 11-14 lbs and is chambered in 219 Donaldson Wasp. I got a 2nd barrel from Hart and Mr. Walker did a 30-30 Ackley chamber for me. Now I can get a 125 gr. Ballistic Tip out of a 30-30 Ackley at 3,000 ft per second! What a treasure! The last rifle Mike worked on was a 260 just before he passed away. I'm so luck to have known him. He was a great guy. He was 101 yrs old when he quietly passed away March 6, 2013.
Sir - Thank you for your comments. I don't know much about the Walker Trigger - I've never owned one. But from what I've read, it is a nice trigger. Arizonaresponse has a good video showing how mis-adjustments of the Walker Trigger can lead to a negligent discharge. My rifle (the one in this video) has the newer X-Mark Pro trigger. This is the trigger Remington recalled. From what I understand, Remington has never admitted to a problem with the Walker Trigger. I own three Remington 700's; all were manufactured with the X-Mark Pro Trigger; all have been through the recall and have performed flawlessly since.
Thanks for the update. I've never adjusted the X-Mark trigger. I see a lot mis-information from other You-Tubers - Best Regards,Ken Higgins
Jim your Video is the best on the tube that shows the Trigger problem & how it is Fired etc.? I want to show this to my Boys.? Who are not aware of the Trigger problem.? Thanks for sharing this Great helpful video.?
I contacted them shortly after finding out about this problem. They sent me a message through email. They Remington would contact me when they did the recall. Several years now and nothing from Remington to this day
This whole thing has my curiosity sparked now. I have a couple of older 700's and have heard the talk about this trigger/safety issue. I've never once experienced this, but I can say that in all the decades of shooting them, I'm not sure if I've ever used the safety even once. I don't hunt, I'm a bench shooter, so I've always been of the school where we don't trust the mechanical safety on any firearm, ever. I do it the hard way, breech or bolt open until I'm ready to shoot... so now I'm wondering if I can create this condition on my own. Of course, this may not be as practical when hunting I guess, you can't afford to have the noise of opening and closing the action so the safety is pretty much required. I've heard tale of 700's going off when the bolt is snapped shut too, but don't know if this is verifiable or not, but I've never had it happen.
+funkyzero Your older 700's more than likely have the "Walker" trigger, named after the guy who designed it. My video demonstrates the issue with the newer X-Mark Pro trigger, introduced to the 700 in ~2006. Some have made claims that the older 700's with the Walker trigger have their trigger issues as well, but I can't speak to that. As you watch videos that address 'Remington 700 issues', be mindful which trigger they are addressing. Sometimes it's not so obvious. For instance, Arizona Response has a video called 'Remington 700 Trigger - Creating a negligent discharge' that has garnered many comments. Problem is, his video discusses the Walker trigger. Many commenters are confusing his results with the XMP trigger - two entirely different triggers.
+JimmyDickens1 You are absolutely right regarding the Walker and XMP - two different triggers. And many are confusing the two and comparing apples to oranges.
Well done video. Helpful, informative and peace of mind for using the model 700 30-06 I just bought used for my son. It has the ribbed trigger but I am still going to test it out in the cold. Thanks again. Great music track selection as well.
+mygreenmtns Thank you for your comments. I believe you have the Walker trigger installed (provided the ribbed trigger you mentioned is original equipment). Arizonaresponse created a good video titled 'Remington 700 Trigger - Creating a Negligent Discharge' discussing the Walker trigger and how mis-adjustments can cause issues to it. I think as long as your trigger is adjusted properly, you won't have any issues with it. Your son will enjoy and appreciate your gift to him. It's a great rifle! Thanks again.
Interesting. Replace the trigger. That's what I did with my 700. Timney makes some nice ones.
I work on guns a lot. I have built over a dozen rifles of my own from Mauser actions, I have done everything from barrel installation, lathe work, blueing, made stocks from blanks and have added adjustable, after market triggers to most of the rifles I have built and naturally I have also set the adjustments. I recently added a Model 700 to my arsenal, the first one I have ever owned. It is my personal belief that the problem with Remington's triggers is a lack of sear engagement. That is the FIRST thing that should be examined in the case of an unintended discharge. This is simply Remington trying too hard to please the customer! Everybody in this day and age wants a light, crisp trigger. Just doing a quick glance at the comments I have seen remarks about "adjusting the 700 trigger down to 2 lbs" in spite of the fact that they were talking about a trigger that was SEALED BY THE MANUFACTURER TO NOT BE ADJUSTABLE!!! The problem with a trigger sear engagement that is extremely light is that it allows zero margin for error. After studying this issue and the trigger myself I am convinced that the problem is a lack of sear engagement. Ample sear engagement is absolutely essential and its adjustment should ALWAYS err on the side of caution with safety, NOT a light pull, being the A#1 priority.
I believe you are correct regarding the sear adjustment on the older Walker-designed trigger. However, the trigger in this video is the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. Remington has already publicized the issue with this trigger is the bonding agent used in the manufacture of the XMP. This led to the massive recall in 2014. Read more of the comments for more explanation, to include the comments I made in the video description.
@@JimmyDickens1 The bonding agent is nothing more than an exposing of the "margin of error" that they still do not allow for. I have a walker trigger and an X mark Pro. They made some safety improvements on the newer version, but the real culprit remains. There are thousands of rifles that are well over a hundred years old that are still being used today. But today people will complain about a 3 lb trigger pull. What is going to happen when today's rifles reach even half that age and "modern" trigger mechanisms begin to show even the slightest bit of wear? More dead people? I hold to my assertion that the real culprit is lack of a safe sear engagement, for fear of trigger creep complaints.
@@beestoe993 Well, I will tell you - I have never adjusted any of my triggers and you saw the results. Remington saw my video, called to discuss it with me, and issued the recall in 2014 due to the bonding agent as I described. I’ve since been called to give a deposition twice in different court cases. Even within the legal system and under oath, Remington reps attribute the problem to the bonding agent. But you are entitled to your opinion. We’ll just have to agree to disagree with your hypothesis.
I bought my Rem 700 Varmint Special BDL back in the early 80's. Never had any trigger problems as described etc.? But I am going to get it replaced with a TimneyTrigger from Midway USA.I do not want to hand down this Rifle to my Boys.? With this Safety problem pending.?
My understanding is this recall is for the model 700 made from 5-1-2006 to 4-9-2014 and can be checked by serial number. They also have non-ribbed triggers. I think you have hit on the reason for the problem with these rifles. Simple logic! Good informational video! My 700 30-06 is at least 25 years old and is the most accurate rifle I have ever owned. The news stories make people believe that all 5,000,000 700s that have been sold have a problem.
+navajopa31 Sir - thank you for your comments. You are correct regarding the ribbed/non-ribbed triggers. Per the Remington website, the ribbed triggers are not part of the recall; the smooth triggers are. Here is the site: (www.remington.com/pages/news-and-resources/safety-center/safety-warning-recall-notice-remington-model700-modelseven.aspx). The Ribbed triggers are the 'Walker triggers', which were installed on Remington 700s from inception until 2006. The triggers that replaced the Walker are the X-Mark Pro triggers, which were installed from 2006 to present. The XMP triggers have the smooth (non-ribbed) triggers installed. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP trigger - it is the bonding agent used during manufacturing that is heat and cold sensitive and can cause negligent discharges in colder temperatures (as verified by Remington engineers). Others have had issues with the Walker trigger, but I can't speak to that, as I have not researched those issues. The XMP triggers are under the current recall. The Walker triggers are not. My 700's are also very accurate and are my deer hunting go-to rifles. Thanks again for your comments.
So the one I bought in 1985 is OK?
Could be the lubricant inside the trigger housing affected by the cold. Might try blowing the trigger out with brake cleaner or a similar solvent and repeat your test.
During my investigation, I completely cleaned the trigger assembly and retested; same problem. The issue was the bonding agent. Remington issued a recall for the XMP trigger to fix this issue.
@@JimmyDickens1 I have several Rem 700's and never had an issue, but I'm wary of a potential problem. I'll always prefer a bolt safety over a trigger safety like on my Win model 70 or a Mauser '98.
@@G1951-w1y I’ve got three REM 700 and haven’t had an issue since they were fixed at the factory by Remington.
Remington had issues with the X-mark Pro from day one-2004. The old Walker style trigger was by far better, and will safely adjust down to 2.5 lbs in most rifles. The stainless triggers seem to be a bit more difficult to deal with.
My Remington 700. I can actuate the bolt on safe and fire. The bolt does not lock on safe. Do you think my trigger needs to be replaced? Mine is a ribbed trigger.
So far I haven't had problems with mine granted I bought it last night and shot it only 16x's but all the research I've done no one can duplicate it firing by accidentally. Only when trigger is tweaked past the manual recommendation, or extreme neglect that's why remington doesn't loose any civil hearings when it goes to trial
I have same problem wasn't cold so still investigating i was racking bolt back in place and went off hand not on trigger
I bought a remington model 700 sps, 300 winchester magnum. I took it to the range to zero it in and the next day i went to clean it, and the muzzle next to the crown there eas rust. I used steel wool to get rid of it as well as using my bluing kit, so far the gun looks like it never had a problem, but for me knowing that i had to blue it nearly gave me heart attack. Never, ever, ever again will i get a remington firearm. They are low quality. So far im thinking of buying a browning hells canyon rifle and giving away my remington rifle.
So it’s Remington’s fault you don’t properly maintain your firearms?
IAMGOD... - You obviously didn't read the previous comments. This has nothing to do with adjustments, as verified by Remington.
This has been known to us ranch kids since tBueno. When a 600 Mohawk 222 fired at safe off.. Triggers and assembly lube, for the most part, no bueno.
From an Army guy to a naval officer, thank you sir, for your service to out great country and all that you've done to help protect her.
I want a Remington 700 30.06, but even after the initial video from CNBC, I can't but one knowing there might be a problem. Can you tell me if they've fixed or removed the problem? South Texas didn't get really cold much, but if needed, I wouldn't wanna take that chance. Thanks again sir
Nihipali5 - Thank you for your service as well. I love my Army brothers and sisters, except during the Army-Navy game, of course! It's 13 December this year. Of note, I completed flight school in South Texas - had a great time and really liked the Texans. Great place to call home!
I'm sorry I can't answer your question regarding the fix and if it is effective and corrective to the problem. I sent my rifle (.30-06) to Remington, where it will be retained for their use. Remington intends to send me a replacement, which is currently being built in their custom shop. So I've not had the chance to test the fix in this regard. I also sent my daughter's Remington 700 (in .243) in for the recall, although it did not display the same problems my rifle did. Her rifle was returned to us and my daughter shot it this fall with no problems noted. But since it didn't have the issues prior to the fix, I didn't expect it to have the problems post-recall either. Once I receive my replacement, I'll test it and let you know what I find. Overall, I really like the Remington 700. Both mine and my daughter's rifles were extremely accurate and I personally like the X-Mark Pro trigger.
Thanks, again, for your service.
JimmyDickens1 oh that nasty Army-Navy game... Go Navy! ;)
Nihipali5 I watched the Army-Navy game Saturday. Good game! Both teams played well and left nothing on the field. Navy prevailed 17-10.
Howdy Jim,I have a model 700 and have never had this problem. Many years ago, I had a Marlin 22 caliber bolt action which I used to take woodchuck hunting. I would occasionally forget to take the safety "off" before pulling the trigger. The gun did not fire with the safety "on", but when I put the safety "off" the gun did fire, and this was a repeatable condition. Would you try this with your 700 to see if this happens in your case ? Regards, Ed Fulton
Ed Fulton Ed - the rifle in this video was sent to Remington for their testing. They were able to duplicate my issue and kept it. Remington then sent me two-700’s - an exact duplicate and a custom rifle. I will try your scenario with them, but since both have been through the recall, I suspect I will not be able to duplicate your findings. Also my rifles have the X-Mark Pro trigger. I don’t know what trigger Marlin uses, but I’m sure it isn’t the X-Mark Pro. I’ll try it anyway to see if they might have similar behaviors.
Jim, Thank you for your prompt response.
Was out hunting today, winter time in Michigan, didn't see anything so I never let the round in the barrel go, turn safety off, since you can't rack it with it on, and boom, same thing your talking about. Also being ex military, I was not very happy with my outcome of handling the weapon, you sir, put me at ease a little...have you figured out if that's for sure what was causing it, it seems pretty accurate in my eyes.
Preston - Thanks for the comments. Remington has concurred with my theory (it was the bonding agent in the trigger assembly vice the metallurgy, but same results) and is effected by the cold. Remington issued a recall in April 2014 for X-Mark Pro triggers. If this is what you have installed on your Remington 700, I recommend sending it to Remington for the fix. You can google it for instructions on how to send it in or go to Remington's website. Other alternative might be to replace the trigger with an aftermarket (Timney, for example).
Would a aftermarket trigger group and safety remedy this situation? I came across a older BDL in 8mm Mag that has this issue, passed it up of course but thought about getting it and changing everything out if it would fix it.
I have had the same exact experience recently with my early 1980s 700. I live in Miami, so I can assure you it isn't from the cold. I'm wondering if a trigger exchange with an aftermarket model will correct the issue?
@@Betterifitsfree Since your rifle is from the 1980’s, it probably has the older “Walker” trigger vice the X-Mark Pro trigger, which is the trigger on the rifle in this video. Many have had issues with the Walker trigger as well, but this seems to be from improper adjustments, as demonstrated in a video by Arizonaresponse. My recommendation would be to take the rifle to a reputable gunsmith to check for proper trigger settings. Of course, the other option is to replace the trigger with an aftermarket. There are several good brands from which to choose.
@@JimmyDickens1 Valuable advice. Thank you very much.
had my trigger assemblt replaced on a remington trigger recall,, my gun went off when i pushed the saftey off with my thumb, leaving me with a badly torn thumb
jim cherry Did this happen before or after the trigger went through the recall process?
In addition to this I have a 870 express 12 ga . not good . while shooting the empty case jams in the chamber. Bought 4 years ago new . Should have stayed with my Winchester mod . 120
That's pretty scary. Never owned a Remington(no particular reason, till now)
that video still explains a lot if you can't see that then you can't think critically
Yes, that video explains a lot ABOUT A DIFFERENT TRIGGER! I agree 100% with arizonaresponses hypothesis with regard to the WALKER TRIGGER!As far as critical thinking - I've already proven myself there by solving the problem with this trigger - the X-MARK PRO TRIGGER. You should do your own research and READ THE COMMENTS before you post about something you obviously know nothing about. Buddy - when you're in a hole, stop digging. If I were you, I'd delete your posts before too many more people read them.
Never buy a remington again. This company should go out of business
they did
right because cars aren't recalled for safety issues all the time...maybe GMC, Ford, BMW, and VW and Toyota should all go out of business too by your reasoning?
no they didn't go out of business, they filed for protection under Chapter 11 and restructured their debt and are still in biz
700 CDL and now I’m concerned about this problem in 3006 bolt action. I also heard after 2014 it was corrected. What’s your thoughts? Thanks.
great video and analysis!
Thanks Jim, do you know is anyone is making a list of guns that have been recalled for safety issues/accidental discharges? Probably a lot of people who don't know what safety issues their firearm has, me included. Thanks again.
Hi Walter. Remington has a recall list by range of serial numbers which can be accessed from their website.
@@JimmyDickens1 FYI the serial number only my Model 700 7MM was well before the serial number that started their recall. Though they did replace my trigger per the recall. Never fired again after the second time that if fired without touching the trigger. So the weapon is still almost brand new, even though I purchased in 1970. Its for sale . . . . . I just will not own Remington PERIOD!
My model 7 has intermittently done the same thing,//getting the run around from Remington about fixing it.Probably going to buy an after market trigger and no more Remington's.
Hi Jimmy, you commented on my video about my 700 misfire. It was a very cold day when I made the video of the misfires with my rem 700. Like you, I could not duplicate the misfires inside where it was warm. I sent my rifle back to Remington and all they said was they could not duplicate the misfire. They installed a New X-Mark pro trigger and sent it back. They said nothing was wrong with my original trigger so I asked them how is a new trigger that is the same as the original going to fix the problem? They had no answer for me. I'm afraid you will get the same response. I have tried to duplicate the misfires since I received it back from Remington inside the house with snap caps but after hearing your theory I just put it out in the cold garage and am going to try it later. I'll keep you posted.
Charles - Thanks for the info. I'll let you know what I hear from Remington. I suspect the same 'solution' you received.
Charles - After many phone calls and e-mails, I finally got a response from Remington. The customer service was slow, but I think I got what I needed - a Service Request number (the web site states not to ship a firearm to them with out the number). I FedEx'ed my rifle to ARM Services in Ilion, NY this morning. I included an explanation of the issues I was having, and how it seemed dependent on cold temperature. We'll see what happens. I'll let you know...
Has anyone heard of issues with the safety being released causing an accidental discharge on Remington's Model 770s? I bought one in .270 probably about 6 years ago with out doing much research. In hind sight I should have gotten something with better quality, but the price was right and it has served me well since, even with its poor bolt function. It is a ribbed design trigger and is not covered by the recall, but I am still slightly concerned if there has been any instances that are known. Great video JimmyDickens1. Are you still located in Bellevue? Some weather we have been getting, huh? Anyways, thank you for your service and safe hunting!!!
Thanks for your comments, Kyle. I'm not familiar with the model 770, so can't comment on that. Have you had an issue with it? I still live in Bellevue. Fortunately the bad weather has missed our neighborhood so far.
+JimmyDickens1 The 770 is a budget grade rifle that is part of the 700 series of Remington rifles. It also uses a trigger connector like the M700, but I don't think it has the true "Walker" trigger group. From what I have read about the current pending class action suit, the 770, along with its predecessor the 710, would be included in the models Remington is offering to replace the trigger mechanism on as part of the settlement. A far as when the judge will approve it, your guess is as good as mine. I haven't had any issues with my rifle as of yet, but then again I have not subjected it to as low of temperatures as you did. I have thought of sticking it in the deep freeze to test it, but my is guess my wife would not be overly happy about that.
+Kyle McAndrew. Thanks for the info. I'll be curious to know if the colder temps affect your trigger.
Given Remington's choice to cover up their defective and dangerous trigger mechanism I would say that you could potentially be playing with fire. I would simply chose a manufacture that has a more credible reputation for safety.
I would bet that it was the trigger adjustments themselves that were out of wack, the ones they cover with glue so you cant adjust without removing it. The cold certainly causes metal to contract......enough to disengage the sear, and I would imagine the same thing could happen if you bumped/dropped it with the safety off. The sear can't be set so slick that temperature will cause it to disengage.
+IAMGOD712007 You obviously didn't read the previous comments. This has nothing to do with adjustments, as verified by Remington. Keep in mind Remington 700s were produced with TWO DIFFERENT TRIGGERS: The 'Walker' trigger was installed from inception of the Rem 700 to 2006 and the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger, which was installed on Rem 700s from 2006 to current. This video addresses the issues with the XMP trigger, which is the recall trigger. Other online videos address the issue with the 'Walker' trigger (i.e. the video by arizonaresponse). Don't confuse the two triggers. They are very different triggers with very different causes to their issues. By the way, it was the bonding agent you referred to in your comment that was causing the negligent discharges for the XMP trigger, as verified by Remington and led to the XMP trigger recall.
My story….
Inherited the Remington 700 22-250. 2009. I sighted gun in that summer. Went hunting that season. Was very cold and normally I don’t wear gloves. I had on gloves. Deer is approaching, I slide my finger over trigger and took the safety off before on target. BOOM. Until today, I thought it was my fault because of the thick glove and having my finger inside the trigger guard. I ran across this video bc now I shot the gun at a deer and the trigger creeped so much it surprised me so that I pulled my head back from scope and then the gun goes off. Of course it missed this nice Georgia buck. BUT it was a 250 yard shot so the buck just stood there. I jacked another round and place the cross hairs on him and pulled the trigger…..NOTHING. So, now the gun will not go on safe and the trigger is frozen. I go to remove bolt and I can’t. The button won’t press to release bolt. Any suggestion?????? THANK YOU!
You touched the trigger with the safety off, the rifle fired, but it’s not your fault?
I think not.
@@rifleshooterchannel208 Not sure what comment you read but nowhere in my comment do I say it was not my fault. I will say it was not my fault the gun fired when I clicked off the safety. My finger was inside the trigger guard but not on the trigger.
@@riverratpat259 So you claim.
Dollars to donuts the gun went off because you had a thickly gloved trigger finger inside the trigger guard and you put pressure on the trigger blade.
Was the gun purchased new or used? Anybody work on the trigger? Not that hard to adjust… I’ve done quite a few on my guns… mine were purchased in the late 60’s… Can’t believe the Supposed Trigger problem Remington has? Honestly don’t know what else to say
To answer your questions: purchased new; it came with the X-Mark Pro trigger, which is adjustable, bur I’ve never adjusted it as I liked the pull weight out of the box; since your guns were purchased in the 60’s, as you say, you would have the Walker Trigger, which is an entirely different trigger from the XMP trigger. If you read the comments and description section of the video, I layed out a comprehensive timeline of what happened, to include how Remington recalled REM 700s due to this video. I’ve also been contacted to testify in court and have provided recorded deposition in a particular court case. Parts of this video were also featured on 60-minutes. So if you are doubting the results of this rudimentary experiment or if you are doubting there is a problem with the XMP trigger, sorry, but that train has left the station. The problem has been verified and Remington issued a recall to fix the problem. Again, read the narrative and comments associated with the video and you will discover this. As for you Walker triggers, I can’t speak to those. There are documented problems with that trigger, but many believe those are caused by owners adjusting the triggers and not knowing what they are doing.
Hi jimmy. Apparently we aren't as stupid as all the self proclaimed gun experts on TH-cam say we are. Seems that Remington has finally acknowledged a problem with the xmark pro trigger. They recalled it April 11 2014. Said some triggers may have excess bonding agent in the mechanism creating negligent discharges.
Charles - you are correct. I was just posting information I received from Remington. Turns out my rudimentary experiment with temperature helped them "crack the case". I had a very nice conversation with the public relations representative and the engineer. They were very kind and complimentary.
Oh, Charles, one more thing - I went to Arizonaresponse's business website, found his e-mail address in his contact page, and forwarded the nice e-mail I received from Remington to him to inform him of the issue Remington acknowledged they had. I did it this way (privately between him and me) so as not to rub it in or be a sore winner He then deleted all the posts on his video where he debated me on this issue. He would not admit he was wrong and I was right. He went into total damage control mode. I guess he's one of those guys who won't admit when they are wrong.
JimmyDickens1 What was your rank in the Navy? To me it looks like admiral?
WoT Professional I am a retired Navy Commander (pay grade O-5), equivalent to Army/Air Force/Marine Corps Lieutenant Colonel. From the looks of your picture, you are military as well.
JimmyDickens1 Actually no I have no military service I'm 18 years old an plan to join the Army next year to become a sniper go to 7 weeks of U.S. Army sniper school and thank you for your service.
How do u fix this I have never had it happen to me but I still have the stock trigger in mine and never new this was a problem I just bout a adjustable stock for mine but now I’m worried I bout mine in 2016
If you bought yours new in 2016, it’s post-recall and probably “fixed”. A quick way to tell for pre-recall guns to see if they’ve been fixed is to look at the bolt release button near the trigger guard. If it has a small punch mark, the trigger has been fixed. I don’t know if Remington continued doing this during manufacture after the recall, but worth investigating.
@@JimmyDickens1 it has a little dot noched I’m the very middle of the bolt release button. Is that it?
@@huntingoutdoors1412 Yup, that sounds like the punch mark. If so, your rifle should be fine.
Great video, thank you
Thanks, John!
Outstanding video and explanation of the X-Mark Pro issue. Did Remington follow up with sending you a replacement rifle?
+Pride Rock Yes - Remington kept the rifle I sent them (the one in this video) and replaced it with the Remington 700 Alaskan Wilderness Rifle II. It is a sweet shooting rifle and is literally a tack driver.
Jim I believe that the Little Boy,? Who was Killed by the Trigger problem.? Happened on a Warm Weather Day.? I may be wrong.? Question the Weather Temps.etc.? Causing the problem.?
+A REDTAIL I believe the little boy who was killed was shot with a Remington 700 that had the Walker trigger installed. The Walker is the trigger that was installed on Remington 700s from inception until about 2006. In 2006, Remington replaced the Walker trigger with the X-Mark Pro trigger in part due to pressure to do something due to the issues with the Walker trigger. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP (X-Mark Pro) trigger. What I discovered (and verified by Remington engineers) is that the bonding agent used in the XMP trigger is heat and cold sensitive and may cause a discharge when moving the safety lever from safe to fire in colder temperatures. As I understand, Remington has never admitted to an issue with the Walker trigger. This most recent recall is for the XMP trigger (~7.8M rifles).Having said that, your Remington 700 from the early 80s more than likely has the Walker trigger, not the XMP. You can verify this by checking on the Remington website. It describes how you can tell which trigger you have installed. But as I mentioned, others have had issues with the Walker trigger as well, but I can't speak to that - I only researched the XMP trigger. You may want to view a video by Arizonaresponse as he discusses the Walker trigger and how a mis-adjustment can lead to negligent discharges.Thank you for your comments and kind words! Enjoy your 700 - it will be a great pass-down item to your boys.
Bad news is it’s usually cold during deer season when these guns are so often used. That’s just so dangerous.
I have tried to get my 700 to do that and it never did. I will try to get it cold and try again. Thanks FB
After I sent my rifle to Remington so they could analyze it, they conducted a test of their own. From what I've been told, they were able to duplicate the issue I've demonstrated in 4 of 10 rifles. So not all of them have this problem, but enough to warrant a recall. Also, the recall is for the newer X-Mark Pro triggers; not the older "Walker" triggers. Not sure what trigger you have installed on your Remington 700, but it makes a difference.
Really good info . Thanks
Hi Jimmy, Good video and great detective work. Before I heard the actual cause I was thinking frost might be the problem. It's good to see that Remington stepped right up to address it. It wouldn't have happened without you. I wonder if the same process is being used by other manufacturers? Thanks for your efforts!
Bill - Thank you for the kind comments.
@@twentyfifthdui4717 I was joking when I said "stepped right up". Now that I re-read it, I can see why it might be taken the wrong way. Sorry for the confusion.
I had this happen once last year. I think it has something to do with where it's at in relation to the bolt. If the safety is on when you open the bolt or cock the rifle then when you close the bolt and take it off safety it goes off. The reason I believe my theory is you cannot open the bolt with the safety in the safe or on position. So what I do and will forever do is load it with safety off when I close the bolt with a chambered round it will always be in a safe direction when I close the bolt. I will put the gun on safety then take it off just to make sure it will not fire then on again. I want the peace of mind when I take it off safety to shoot a deer it's not going to go off unexpected. I thought I had did something wrong till I researched this. This is my personal experience with the safety.
Brandon Patterson You have one of the older trigger models that require the safety lever set to ‘Fire’ to manipulate the bolt. The newer trigger assemblies allow one to manipulate the bolt with the safety on. My rifle is one of those: safety on does not effect bolt operation. Remington has agreed with my theory and issued a recall in April 2014. I thought it was metallurgy when in reality, it was the bonding agent used in the manufacturing of the trigger assembly. Regardless, temperature was effecting the trigger assembly causing the rifles to discharge.
@@JimmyDickens1 I looked on the website with my serial number and it wasn't part of the recall. I love my 700 but I really have to be mindful of everything I do. I was once told in a safety course that the safety is a mechanical device it can and will fail at some point. I guess I will be looking for a better option to replace the trigger and safety. That's awesome though that they have contacted and given you inside information on the cause. The day it happen to me it was sunny and in the 60s. Thanks for sharing your video and knowledge on this issue :)
Brandon Patterson Great ‘talking’ to you, too. The safety class you took is correct: the safety device is merely a mechanical and can fail. The ‘ultimate safety’ is between your ears. My 700s have been great as well. All (3) have been through the recall and have performed flawlessly so far. Since yours isn’t part of the recall, there are a couple of things to consider: take your rifle to a reputable gunsmith to ensure your trigger/safety are adjusted properly (see video by Arizona Response on how maladjustments can cause discharges with that specific trigger assembly (Walker Trigger)). Second option is to replace the assembly. Timney makes a great trigger. Thanks again for sharing your information.
@@JimmyDickens1 Great talking to you as well. Happy holidays and thank you for service so we can enjoy what we have today
Thanks for the video tho I like being informed of potential malfunctions
Alan - Thanks for your comments. I never adjusted the trigger on my rifle, but was able to duplicate the issue, leading to the Remington recall (read my remarks and video description above). I'm assuming you know about Remington recalling nearly 8-million rifles that are equipped with the X-Mark Pro trigger. I wouldn't expect your rifle to exhibit this issue since you purchased it a few days ago. I would assume your rifle has been modified due to the recall and was 'fixed' prior to you getting it (assuming you bought it from a retailer and not a private party transfer). To verify this, look at the bolt release near your trigger guard. If it is 'recall complete', it will have a dent on it from a punch. If the bolt release does not have the punch mark, I'd recommend sending it to Remington for the recall, provided it is equipped with the X-Mark Pro trigger.
Awesome good to know I'll look thanks. I even tried hitting the bolt flipping the safety trying to get it to miss fire. Gun pointed down range obviously. Thanks for the response merry Christmas
alan bishop Merry Christmas to you, too. Have fun with your 700 and good luck with the hunt!
1:17 God bless you nobody got hurt.
I noticed you had your safety on twice before closing the bolt. This may or may not be an issue, but it seems to me the safety is for locking out the trigger for a loaded weapon. Could it be that cycling the bolt while on safety causes undo stress on the trigger group. I'm just curious to know. I do not own any weapons with that trigger group and I also do not own any Remington products. I have a lot of years behind the trigger myself and have never used my safety in that manner. The safety always goes on after a round has been loaded.
With the Rem 700 (X-Mark Pro trigger installed), once the gun is de-cocked, the safety lever can't be placed in the Safe position (note it is in the fire position to accomplish the de-cock) until the rifle is re-cocked. Therefore, the bolt must be cycled to cock it (essentially lifting the bolt handle accomplishes this), then the safety lever can be placed to the safe position. The bolt can then be cycled with the safety lever in the safe position with no harm to the bolt or trigger assembly. From what I understand, with the older Rem 700's (with the Walker trigger installed), the safety lever had to be placed to the fire position to cycle the bolt in order to clear the magazine. This was deemed unsafe, so the change was made to allow for cycling with the safety lever in the safe position. I hope this answers your question/addresses your concern.
By the way I'm in Massachusetts and it's been cold here and was cold while zeroing in the scope and no the slightest defects it's a 700 adl varmit. But have been very curious into all the allegations for my own Safety reasons and my hunting partners. But at the end of the day the safety on the gun is the last resort of stopping an accident from occurring proper diligence of where you gun is pointing should really be your only safety but shit happens as we all know too well
I love the remington 700s...had them my whole life but I have to say I'm a little worried about them these days :/
I have three of them - all have been through the recall - and I haven't had an issue with any of them since getting them back from the factory. I'm confident Remington fixed the issue. Thank you for your comment and enjoy your 700s!
You should be...
What about the Walker Triggers on the Rem 700 are they the same problem etc.?
MyREDTAIL I have never owned a Walker trigger, so have no experience with them. While others claim there is a similar issue with them, Remington has never admitted to a problem with the Walker Trigger. Arizonaresponse has a TH-cam video that explains how misadjustments on the Walker Trigger can cause negligent discharges. Lastly, be mindful which trigger is being discussed while watching videos regarding Remington 700 triggers. Sometimes it's not so obvious and even worse, some making videos don't even realize Remington 700s were manufactured with two distinct and very different triggers. This only adds to the confusion.
seems like you've locked onto the cause
Good work brother. Gonna send mine in as it is part of the recall. Any ideas on how long the turn around will be?
Thank you. Not sure how long it will take. This recall affects a lot of rifles, so I wouldn't expect a quick turn-around.
JimmyDickens1 better to just replace the trigger with an aftermarket trigger instead?
TheRedmercy My model 700 (the one I sent to Remington) is going to be retained by Remington and they will replace it with a new one. My daughter also has a model 700 in .243 that I intend to send in for repair. I personally really like the X-Mark Pro trigger. It is very crisp and I agree with Remington's claim that it "breaks like a glass rod". I'm sure it will be a very good, reliable trigger once it is repaired, therefore, my intention is to keep it. Just my two-cents...
I shipped my daughter's Model 700 and have since received. Total time from start to finish was 3-months, 8-days. This was from registering on the Remington website to shipping the rifle to Remington to receiving the rifle at my residence. I have not shot this rifle as of yet, but I will let you know how it performs. See my latest post (above) for a complete timeline.
Bloke what does USOG say about this
It happened to me. Traded it on a Winchester model 70. Much better gun.
Is this problem just with the 700 because i just recently purchased a 783
David Miller The problem is with the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. If your 783 has the XMP trigger, you can tell if it’s been through the recall if it has a punch mark on the bolt release. See the Remington website for full description.
@@JimmyDickens1 Thank you for the information
There should be NO grease in your trigger assembly. Take it out and clean it. DO not grease it.
I agree…. Which is why I never grease my trigger assemblies. I suggest you read the comments and the narrative I posted with the video. You will then discover the root cause.
72 degrees here pushed safety in and out repeated less than 2 minutes fired on me twice so yes same problem
What year was your gun manufactured? Which trigger do you have: Walker trigger or X-Mark Pro?
I recently bought it numbers say 1973 someone else told me about the trigger so I'll get that changed and see how that works
@@cover557 since it was manufactured in 1973 (and if it’s the original trigger), it would have the Walker trigger. A reputable gunsmith might be able to tune it up for you. The trigger in my video is the X-Mark Pro.
@@cover557 There is a video by Arizona Response that demonstrates how monkeying with a Walker trigger can cause it to become unstable. Since you bought it used, the previous owner might have adjusted it too light, causing your problem. As I mentioned previously, I’d consider taking it to a reputable gunsmith to bring the trigger back to within specs.
Good video and as a Remington 700 enthusiast I intend on testing this issue with my 700. My only question to you is (and I'm not trying to create waves) you mentioned that you left your Remington 700 out in your garage for a couple days where it was rather cold out (I believe you said 10°). My question to you would be if it was 10° in your garage wouldn't we see you breath as you exhaled or spoke?
M Ross Thanks for your comments. I'm not a meteorology expert, but I'm assuming there are other factors besides temperature, such as humidity and dew point, that determine if one sees breath on cold days. Same principle as fog formation and the fact that some mornings you have to scrape your windows and some mornings you don't. Which reminds me: I've never had to scrape the windows of the cars in the garage. Not sure why, just haven't done it...
Also, I'll be curious to know if you get the same results as me. Keep in mind my trigger is the X-Mark Pro (XMP) trigger. If your 700 was manufactured after ~2006, you probably have the XMP as well. If before 2006, then you probably have the 'Walker' trigger installed. See the video by arizonaresponse for an explanation regarding issues with the Walker Trigger.
For added safety, I never ever, ever, ever chamber a bullet and set the safety. I feel that if I don’t have time to load and fire all at once then it was too rushed anyway. Just say ‘in.
Seriously? That’s how you hunt? Even rabbits, squirrels, and pheasants? I think I’d be a vegetarian if I did that. No way would I be able to load and fire on a fleeting game.
Was commenting on the Remington 700 video. I only hunt moose and black bear so there’s usually time, if not then next time. Definitely didn’t mean to offend, just suggesting another layer of safety.. Take care.
@@randaman7098 No offense taken. Your explanation cleared it up. I've never hunted bear or moose, so I have no experience with regard to how much time is required to get set for a shot. Every gun I carry must be safe enough to carry loaded and on safe without concern that it will go off uncommanded. If not, I won't carry it.
Had you ever touched the inside trigger mechanism prior to the accidental discharge ?
I never disassembled the rifle beyond that recommended by Remington in the owner's manual for normal cleaning and maintenance. I never even adjusted the trigger using the adjustment screw - didn't need to, I was happy with the pull weight out of the box. Remington verified I didn't make adjustments when I sent my rifle to them. They tested my rifle, discovered the problem I described, and issued the recall. I'm sure had I made an adjustment inside the trigger assembly, Remington engineers would have discovered it and would have dismissed my claim.
Well, thank you. I stand corrected. My .308 was recalled and I said, screw it, I bought a Timney trigger. It is terrific.
dks13827 I've heard many good things about Timney triggers. Enjoy your .308!
+JimmyDickens1, Thank you for posting. People like you probably saved quite a few lives. I really hope that Remington solves the problem.
I bought a gun that had that problem. The guy was scared of the gun an I got it cheappppp.
Remington 700 270 wsm.
I took to the gun smith an got it fixed.
Nope !!!!!
Your correct.
On a cold morning.
Bam !!!
As soon as I put on fire !!!
I did kill the deer.
I took it back to him an inside the gun shop it would never go off.
So he put a whole new trigger in it.
Problem Solved.
Thanks for Video an Your Service !!!!!!!!
Your Awesome !!
+Michael Hollier Thanks, Michael. I appreciate your testimonial and kind comments.
Did you ever really clean the trigger assembly? I'm not intending anything, just curious.
+T Mon Great question. I thoroughly cleaned and lubricated the trigger assembly in accordance with the Owner's Manual in order to rule out gumming or 'stickiness' of the lubrication in colder temperatures. I'm sure the cleanliness of the trigger assembly is one of the things the Remington engineers considered as well when they inspected my rifle after I submitted it to them for repair. I'm certain another piece of their inspection was to rule out tampering of the trigger assembly. What they found was no tampering and a clean trigger assembly. As you probably read in my video description above, the engineers agreed with my findings and discovered the bonding agent they were using in the trigger assembly is what is/was heat and cold sensitive, causing the problem. Remington then issued the recall. Had they found a dirty, neglected trigger or a tampered with trigger assembly, they would have understandably dismissed my claims and sent my rifle back.
+JimmyDickens1 I've not had problems but they are newer. I cleaned mine with hopps bore clean and alcohol, there was a a lot of black residue that came out.
+T Mon You have to be careful cleaning a trigger assembly with a bore cleaner. Bore cleaner is a very strong cleaner suitable for removing lead and powder fouling from the all-metal (Steel) bore and barrel. Trigger assemblies may contain bonding agent, plastics and 'weaker' metals, such as aluminum and will not do well with a bore cleaner. That may explain the black residue you are seeing. I once "melted" the plastic hand grips on one of my pistols with bore cleaner - not good! Hoppe's Solvent #9 will work on your trigger, but not the Bore cleaner.
My trigger action actually improved quite a bit, much lighter and less gritty. It still breaks the same, tad heavy but not too bad. Will have to do till I get some Timneys in there. Thanks.
+T Mon I have heard many great things about the Timney triggers. Enjoy your 700!
is the trigger assembly dirty ? have you taken the stock off and inspected for dirt ? has the trigger been oiled lately ? the gun oil could be hanging it up try synthetic gun oil Casey breech-wood makes some
+mad max The first thing I did was completely and thoroughly clean the rifle. My original assumption was gumming of the lubricant I was using, so I tested that first. This assumption turned out to be incorrect. the problem with my trigger (and all other X-Mark Pro triggers) was the bonding agent used in manufacturing the trigger. It is heat and cold sensitive, causing negligent discharges with the XMP trigger when moving the safety lever from safe to fire in colder temperatures. This has been verified and confirmed by Remington, causing the recall on the XMP triggers. Please read the comments I posted under the video for a complete timeline. I also noticed a post you made on the CNBC hit-piece. It appears you are confusing the TWO triggers Remington used during the manufacture of the Remington 700, which are the 'Walker trigger' and the X-Mark Pro trigger. The Walker is the trigger that was installed on Remington 700s from inception until about 2006. In 2006, Remington replaced the Walker trigger with the X-Mark Pro trigger in part due to pressure to do something due to the issues with the Walker trigger. The CNBC hit piece was a bash on the Walker trigger. What I have identified is the issue with the XMP (X-Mark Pro) trigger. As I understand, Remington has never admitted to an issue with the Walker trigger. This most recent recall is for the XMP trigger (~7.8M rifles), which Remington did confirm the issue. I hope this helps clarify the issue.
JimmyDickens1 i understand what you are talking about i do know that lack of maintenance can cause issues can mess things up in cold temps i have seen it and a good cleaning fixes it just thought i would ask i have seen people blame a weapon and its just dirty its hard for me to believe that Remington would put an unsafe rifle on the market today i have never owned a Remington rifle i am ruger guy its hard to have a issue with a maser action
+mad max I agree with you - I've seen people neglect the maintenance on their rifles as well, causing issues. Like I said though, I thought maybe it was the oil I was using (low-viscosity perhaps gumming in cold temperatures), but it wasn't. Ruger manufactures a great product! Thanks for your comments.
The sad truth is the trigger and safetys are faulty but 98% of these ND deaths involve some 1 pointing the rifle at some 1 and loading or unloading it WTF the 2% could be rounds skipping after ND. sad real sad
Man that sucks. I was thinking of buying a 700. Has anyone else tried the "Cold theory"?
Remington did check the "Cold theory" after reading my information paper and watching this video and found 4 out of 10 rifles (according to CBS's 60 Minutes segment on Remington 700) had the same issue when subjected to cold temperatures. Read this article: www.google.com/amp/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/youtube-video-shows-gun-spontaneously-fire/?client=safari
and watch this segment: www.cbsnews.com/news/popular-remington-700-rifle-linked-to-potentially-deadly-defects/
for additional information.
Ah, 4 outta 10. That's a lot. Awesome, so change trigger assembly and then everything's good right?
Either replace it or send your rifle to Remington for the recall. Many have said they were going to replace the X-Mark Pro trigger that came on their Remington 700s with a Timney, which is a great trigger. I sent my daughter's Remington 700 in for the recall and it came back after ~3-months. We've not had any issues with hers or the rifle Remington sent me to replace the rifle I sent them (the one in this video). I believe the fix Remington did with regards to the recall worked.
One more comment: If you do buy a Remington 700 with the X-Mark Pro installed, check the bolt release lever for a 'punch mark'. If it has this mark, it indicates the rifle has been sent to the factory and the recall actions have been performed on it. If the rifle doesn't have this mark and therefore has not been through the recall, I would probably pass on buying it. Check the Remington website for further information and to see a picture of what the 'punch mark' looks like.
Cool, thanks for the video and the advice. When I buy a 700, I thought about having it in the .308 configuration and thought about getting a Timney trigger installed right off the bat.
Of course then again also thought about a custom build as well. Thanks for responding back. Good luck to you!
Good research on your own. I am shocked after several negligent unexplained discharges you would continue to use the firearm over a period of years. Did you contact Remington or a gunsmith and have the rifle examined after you were certain there was a problem? True you may have found a legitimate problem with the rifle but do you have the resources to determine how common or rare this issue is? I commend for diligence and for not immediately attempting to sue every person that may have handled the weapon before you. Inaction may have put other gun owners at risk.
Please re-read my remarks (posted under the title of this video), as your comments and assumptions are inaccurate. TWO negligent discharges are not several. I DID NOT continue to use the firearm over a period of years after the discharges. After the second discharge, I removed the rifle from service, conducted temperature-related testing, and sent it to Remington for their testing and confirmation of my results and conclusion. This is clearly explained in my comments above. If you were to read and comprehend my comments, you would clearly see that my ACTIONS prompted the Remington recall and therefore REDUCED the risk to other gun owners.