Dammit ... I likes me miffs ... I read 'Exploration Fawcett' quite some decades ago (don't ask) and was hooked by the unasked questions; and by the few bones that Fawcett tossed our way. I'm still ravenous, still gnawing bones, my empty-bone pile is now massive - and all I have is ever more questions and a depleting store of years.
Why single out 'Abrahamic'? To me all religions (that I know of) are simply con-games to separate the uncritical/and or uneducated from their funds. I'll cheerfully debate this with anyone that doesn't (it means: does NOT) refer me to their 'holy' book. Brrrrr ... just too many of 'em.@@percubit10
Oh, did you know that for example the city of Troy was a popular history myth ?? Yes that's right, .... until someone actually FOUND that city !!!! So myth are in (lots of) cases, backed my a true moment or event in history. People that say that one thing IS OR ISN'T a MYTH, is actually , in many cases, taking you for a ride
I'm a ♌, down to the extra gravity that bears down on my spinal column, he mentions the cosmic hunt, but modern Astrology is so accurate, you should even consider that Leo's spend their maturnal months in September, thus shaping us even more by the seasons, skeptical therefore more logical than non leos? Logic is intentful, the inhabitants knew the shape of the cities pathways relative to the stars, but when is key here: the painting was commissioned when they saw a link, during king Arthur age, but all roadways/pathways do that is the logical fallacy at hand, it reflects a logical understanding of reality, and human nature, but proves nothing new about anthropology let alone Astrology The logical fallacy that the zodiac was random, based on "subliminal will" of early stone age man, seems to be underlying the viewpoints of modern humans, that is most offensive, the cosmic hunt the vid author points out is most logical explanation of the entire mystery
Apparently the Pawnee Indians of North America were reasonably advanced star-watchers. They apparently made star-charts on hides. It'd be interesting to review ancient non-western astronomical knowledge.
Remember that old sci fi movie, Close Encounters of The Third Kind? All over the world, a series of tones and colors were being - copied around the world? In the movie it was aliens, but let's say a solar maximum of extreme output from the sun, created Aurora Borealis - but huge scale that was observed simultaneously across the planet by various "Priest Class" and recorded on animal hides, cave walls, land formation?
Be advised, don't follow that line ... it is very addictive. I fell into the trap when I looked into sites dealing with ancient constructions. We all accept them because they are there but few ask "How the heck did they DO that?" ... and such answers as we are given often make no sense at all.
Excellent as always. Although Katherine Maltwood can be dismissed as an example of mild British eccentricity, one rascal, Iolo Morgannwg (real name Edward Williams) was responsible for the creation of a pseudo-Druid culture in Wales and celebrated as the world famous Eisteddfod festival. Iolo forged amongst many manuscripts the "Lost" poems by Dafydd ap Gwilym, but his enthusiasm included design resulting in construction of Gorsedd megalithic stone circles dotted around Wales, non of which are ancient although many believe them to be so. His design copies Boscawen-Un located in Cornwall. I would loved to have taken tea with Katherine, probably mad as a March Hare but fascinating non the less.
Gotta give kudos to the incredibly diligent work on the captions. They even cover the sections you respond to! It's a small thing most may not end up seeing but is still highly appreciated.
I “love” the ominous music on ancient alien and similar videos. The lyrics are “Idiot, you are easily impressed by confirmation bias”. Not very poetic lyrics, I know.
Another great video. I would love to hear you go over more ancient alien videos. I’ve long since been a fan of the show, and they make it sound so logical to someone with no education on the subject. But you basically debunk it with facts, and that’s what I like. So if you could go over more of ancient aliens episode I would love it
These clips are killing me and reminding me of why I both love and hate these kinds of shows: the extremely dramatic music stings for...absolutely nothing happening. I watched a bit of The Curse of Oak Island and I will never forget the absolutely hilarious moment of everyone sitting around a computer, looking incredibly bored, as this tense, horror movie music plays, building up, with dramatic camera angles, until, with a sudden swell and silence the computer watcher said: "Still nothin'." and went back to her half nap as the music faded back to neutral as though disappointed with itself. Amazing television, 10/10.
I grew up in South America in a small town with little light pollution and loved to watch the night sky, but had no idea of how to recognize constellations there. I was only able to locate "Las Tres Marías" (which many, many years later I learned were Orion's Belt). Frustrating! How to figure out a zodiac sign among all those thousands of stars? As a young adult I eventually became a radio operator in the Norwegian merchant fleet, but I still hadn't figured out the constellations. I secretly believed that the Pleiades were the Big Dipper (similar shape, right?) and was looking for other constellations in that size range without discovering any. And I was too ashamed of my ignorance to ask... Until one evening while crossing the Mediterranean I was on the bridge watching the sunset, and as the sky turned darker and the first stars began to appear over the horizon I suddenly got THE revelation! I could clearly see that the stars formed the figure of a lion, and it was enormous! So I just stood there mesmerized by the sight until more and more stars became visible and the shape of Leo slowly merged with the star crowded sky.
Good job! Your last point about the need for interdisciplinary studies with critical analysis is well-taken. There is so little direct evidence for connections between the calendar and asterisms or constellations that fantasy prevails over science in most cases. People want to see something, therefore the see it. For my part, I have always thought the best evidence for a very ancient connection between asterisms, animals, and possibly seasonal patterns is the Lascaux Aurochs as Taurus with the Hyades on its face and the Pleiades over its shoulder.
I only saw one image, the one with a man next to a bull with a bird at his feet, if the Bull is Taurus, the man is Orion, the bird at his feet would be Lepus the rabbit, which was a Rooster first, the problem is, Orion's Sword is pointing the wrong direction, and the bird is on the wrong side of Orion. I know this are as being "The Silver Gate of Man", between Gemini and Taurus, Orion stands in the center. We have "The Golden Gate of the Gods', behind Sagittarius. Did you know, if you play the words "Say There Is A Guest" in reverse, you can hear it echo "Sagittarius", in ancient times known as Pabilsag, his name means "Chief Ancestor", the father of a dying and rising god known as Damu, which has the meaning of "Relative". Scorpio is hard to echo, but I think it is "Wise Quotes", Scorpio is part of the Golden Gate, as well a Ophiuchus, whose echo is "Seek Reefer", LOL, which aids in your "Wise Quotes". The Silver gate speaks too,and their echoes reveal that this is a "Gate". Play the words "Say Oath--They All Rule--Beyond The Mist". Orion's Sword, pointing at the Bull, it speaks too, Hatysa is the star at it's tip, it means "Slaughter", but in Hebrew, you read read right to left, 'yasa' means "Savior", 'hata' means "to sin", meaning "Savior of Sinners". Hiding the word Hatysa is Haya, meaning "Grain/Seed", like that of a Man, Haya is the God of Scribes, guess what, he is also a Door-Keeper, can you can that a gate, and it is the Scribes that write the Wise Quotes we read to day, and if you play Hatysa in reverse, you hear "iosa", which seems to be another way of spelling Jesus, and that word is associated with meaning "Healer", which brings you back to Damu, which is a healer too. I've read where they said Jesus is "The Lion", in the zodiac, that would be Urgula, we call Leo the Lion, 'ur' means Dog, Gula was the mother of Damu, the Dog headed goddess Bau-Gula. Now play "Way--I'll Open It--So They Go--See God", in reverse, they echo "August--Regulus--Denebola-Leo". If you didn't know, Regulus is the Heart, Denebola is the tip of the tail, an odd fact, when the Heart of the Lioness tell her its time to hunt, she uses the tip of her tail to communicate with the others on the hunt. In ancient art, it shows a Goddess riding a Lion, must be Virgo, Latin meaning "virgin", a word that hides Man/Woman, in Latin, 'vir' means Man, in Greek, 'gyne' (gin) means Woman, playing the words "Boy/Girl" in reverse will echo "Virgo". Orion is seen battling the bull Taurus, 7 stars giving Orion his hourglass shape, Hatysa is the 8th brightest, but that is his seed, in Latin, 'septem' means Seven, where we get "September", which has an echo "Her Mithras", the "Gohatya" means "Cow Slaughter". In mythology, Seth threw the man part of Osiris into the marsh, where a upon our Southern Fish ate it, found at the foot of Aquarius, known as The Great One Ea, (Enki). Enki is Wise, if you play the words "Say You're Well Taught" in reverse, it echoes "Aquarius", and the word "Ur" also means Wolf, and "Thou Am Wolf" will echo "Fomalhaut" the mouth of the Southern Fish. The Wolf headed son of Seth was known as Wepwawet, the 7 stars of the Little Dipper, who the ancient Greeks called "The Dog's Tail", fore the 7 stars of The Big Dipper was known as Seth, "Thigh of the Ox Leg". Polaris is our pole star, on the other side of Earth's tilt is Vega, which was known as the Dog headed goddess Bau-Gula, wife of Pabilsag, mother of "The Child" Damu. Do you have the ears to hear these words
I don't know if you read comments ten months later but I just wanted to highlight the disingenuousness of the ancient aliens team at the end. Magli says things like, "it may be", "it's possible", Tsoukalos then says, as fact, "they built it to be Gemini, why?" It's a really standard tactic the alternate history crowd do. Take a possibility, in this case exaggerate it, then continue on as if that original idea is established fact. Then from there they build more suggestions, then continue on as if they also are fact. Till by the time you reach the end of a book or TV show you have a whole house of cards built on incredibly shaky foundations. Great content by the way. Definitely got my subscription. I'm enjoying going through your back catalogue
I like the more holistic approach to understanding, different disciplines can become very focused and unaware of discoveries in others by putting them together the whole of fuzzy pictures of past can become more resolved.
I have been waiting for this since you talked about it on Stefan's channel. I am an Astrologer but have always been interested in the ancient origins and when I heard you and Stefan talk about this I was really excited. Sometimes when you are really looking forward to something and you build it up in your mind the reality can be disappointing. Instead, this has surpassed my expectations. This is a video I will be watching many times over. Thank you so much for doing this and well done.
So glad these videos are available, every time a friend or family member mentions one of these topics I have an interesting and digestible thing to share with them. For some reason, me googling an answer to give them an answer/explanation is questionable (for my more conspiracy minded friends or family) but, when I send a video (on a Google owned platform haha) they watch them and are more willing to listen
Ah, I think I know about what you'll talk about Golbektepe. I don't belive that "the zodiac" existed until recorded story but I do belive that humans looked and though about the skies. It's something that they must have tried to understand, because "the above" is a place where a bunch of strange phenomenons happen. Things that humans would remember, discuss and record (like they maybe did at Golbek).
I find your content so intriguing that I would like to share it with my friends (and "enemies"), but most of them speak Spanish. Would you be interested in a translation?
Having watched many alternative history shows on TH-cam it’s a real pleasure to watch a learned wet blanket man give commentary. These shows did however give me a lust for all things ancient and without them I wouldn’t have found yours. Good job. Right I’m off to trawl the rest of your vids to get more countervailing perspectives.
wet blanket = noun, Synonyms of wet blanket : one that quenches or dampens enthusiasm or pleasure. Eg: We were all having a good time believing in fairy tales of Atlantis until the wet blanket man from World Of Antiquity said it never happened.
I have no problems with what other people believe. To whatever degrees suits them they've formed conclusions from their researches (okay, their inputs) and seem happy knowing what they know; however rational or otherwise. This is one reason why I rarely debate religion/s ...@@ashesblues1097
Interesting video, though here is some food for thought Gobekle Tepe in Anatolia may be the earliest confirmable reference we have for prehistoric man's understanding of the Zodiac, and for precession in particular. The archaeological site, located within the Taurus Mountains, has been found to represent the Pleiades in their circular placement. We know this because, unbeknownst to many, Gobekli Tepe, and Enclosure D in particular (which is the largest this far) is located within a massive geoglyph of a bull. This is only seen from above, and the enclosures are located exactly within the "bull's" shoulder, which has historically been understood to represent the Pleiades. Unfortuantely, tourism has destroyed most resemblance of this geoglyph to accommodate parking lots and tourist centers. This hypothesis is further corroborated by the now famous Pillar 43 you mentioned, which likely represents Cygnus and Scorpio in their correct positions. While this is not a fully realized set of 12 constellations the gradually shifting orientations of the enclosures as time dragged on suggests that the builders of the site understood that the sky shifted with time, and while no evidence has been found thus far to prove this (its likely still buried) its not a far stretch from here to assume they came to understand Precession. Just imagine how dizzying it must have been for the first shamans, usually in their psychedelic stupor, that realized the they were standing on a wobbling needlepoint. Im a Libra sun and Mercury with Cancer Moon and Rising,. I have to consider possibility that makes too much sense for it not to make sense. Im also Scorpio Mars and Venus, so I can get aggressive, which I would like to apologize to the creator for cuz we butted heads earlier. Ill read your rebuttal later.
At 23:40 you mention "Samian Ware" as being Greek pottery. I've only heard that term used for the "terra sigillata" made in Gaul during the Roman period.
One can see the stars about 30 min before sunrise. They were also charting the stars every night so they knew what would happen the next month, week, day and hour
It's not a dumb question at all. But not only does the sun travel along that path during the day, planets also travel along it at night. Early astronomers from several different cultures were able to make this observation
When I first came across this years ago it was in an article noting a lot of what you mention plus the fact that scale is never taken into account. A pencil line on a map can cover anything from metres to miles on the ground depending on scale. Eg roads are marked with thin lines on maps but we all know that they are metres wide on the ground.
I found this video very helpful. I'm not sure if I could really tell that the landscape looked like the constellations. I am fascinated by history and Astrology. so I really enjoyed this. As I am writing this you as basically saying the same thing using SpongeBob 🤣.
How about teaming up with an astronomer and show the distance between each star in any given constellation. Show the constellations in 3d, as opposed to the 2d we see. Then invite any astrologer to explain how these bodies, in their real dimensions and proportions, can effect a person's characteristics and daily condition?
Astrology is fascinating! Although i don't believe that planets can influence the course of our life( i don't believe either that a ghost can decide our destiny) i find amazing that it comes from ancient times and still exists😲
Another great one, couldn't agree with more with your point about interdisciplinary collaboration. Not only do I think a lot of these pseudo-historians miss out on a lot of art and aesthetic knowledge (as in maybe it's shaped like that because humans think that shape looks nice), but they also seem to fall into some gaps that a little behavioral science could fill in. For example, when you're talking about the lineage of the zodiac, you say the Romans "got it" from the Greeks, and the Greeks "got it" from the Babylonians, and so on. That process of "getting it" is, I think, where historical evidence is most lacking, and so it's the gap that conspiracy theorists fill in with Aliens, the Illuminati, the European monoculture, etc. A little bit of behavioral biology might tell us that those ancient people were exactly the same as us, they think like us, feel like us, etc. That means it very well could have been some Greek dude who saw a Sumerian dude's star chart and thought it looked cool. Maybe he's inspired to do one for his Greek buddies, but they wouldn't really get the reference of the swallows, and they won't know who Dumuzi is, so our Greek guy will have to change some things so the locals will get it easier. Of course, there's no evidence for that at all, that's why we have to say they "got it from" instead of so-and-so was inspired by this other guy. But if you're going to get into speculation and use your imagination to fill in those blanks, why is it always Aliens? Why can't it be "yeah, lions are cool, let's put a lion on our thing, too!" Anyway, thanks for another amazing video!
Dammit. I like aliens. Cool idea, no? But- -but to be from outside of our own solar system would make their travels untenably lengthy in duration; unless they could somehow tweak Time. (And then we be opening yet more cans of worms, not limited to just the religious ramifications.)
LOVE the channel, been binging all your stuff! It took work to find channels that arent total nonsense on youtube, you and "history for granite" are wonderful! If anyone has some other suggestions for other non-crackpot channels i'd love to hear them :>
@@WorldofAntiquity :: You do us all a disservice, especially after your other good presentations, when you don't go back far enough in time regarding this phenomenon. The Ancient Egyptians were studying this field before any of the Greeks you mentioned and definitely before the Romans. The knowledge of the Ancient Egyptians, in this regard, was the foundation of their existence on the planet, especially the After-Life of the Pharaohs.
@@WorldofAntiquity :: Shu ( the god of the air ) :: January 26-February 24. Born under this sign :: creative / conscientious. Isis ( goddess of discipline ; wife of Osiris ; motherly-love ) :: February 25-March 26. Born under this sign :: straightforward / confident / idealistic. Osiris ( god of the underworld ) :: March 27-April 25. Born under this sign :: emotionally-paradoxical / enterprising / shys-away from responsibility. Amun ( god of creation ) :: April 26-May 25. Under this sign :: strong-willed / brave / good leaders. Hathor ( goddess of love ) :: May 26-June 24. Characteristics :: emotional / expressive / bi-polar. Anubis ( god of resurrection ) :: July 25-August 28. Profile :: self-confident / self-control. Thoth ( god of wisdom & learning ) :: August 29-September 27. critical-thinkers / problem-solvers. Horus ( god of the sky ) :: September 28-October 27. People close to nature / hard-working / responsible / imaginative. Wadget ( goddess of the royal cobra ) :: October 28-November 26. rational / cautious / conscientious / opinionated. Sekhmet ( goddess of war ) :: November 27-December 26. optimistic / imaginative. Sphinx ( "guardian" ) :: December 27-January 25. sensible / adaptable. Seth ( god of chaos ) :: May 28-June 18. ambitious. Bastet ( cat goddess ) :: July 14-28 / September 23-27 / October 3-17. Born under this sign :: charming / charismatic. The Nile ( a non-god ) :: January 1-7 / June 19-September 28. The Nile is the Beginning. passionate / impulsive. Geb ( god of the earth ) :: February 12-19 / August 20-30. diplomatic / tactful. 📌 The Babylonian Empire didn't predate the Egyptian Civilization. Most historians and archeologists place Egyptian Civilization beginning around 3100 BCE, 12 Centuries before the rise of the Babylonians. I'm not a historian or archeologist ... but you guys _who are_ ... should converse more ...
Great video as usual! When I was much younger, I took a great interest in astrology. I can guarantee that back in the 80s, no one was discussing anything about the history of the zodiac. So this was very engrossing... up to the part from Ancient Mysteries. I understand why you want to engage and refute that kind of stuff, but it wasn't nearly as interesting as the actual pieces of history you discussed before that section.
Amazing video and very helpful! A question came up while watching : was there a time where astrology was more of an importantance in society and that social and political decisions where based upon the stars? Or was astrology always a niche like it is now? So for example : was there a time that a Greek king decided to have a Scorpio as an army general because he thought the fireish personality of Scorpio would be more suitable for the job.? Or maybe a Nobel father is picking a Leo for his daughter to be married with. So IF there was a time that astrology was leading the politics why did that ends? Did Christianity downgraded astrology?
Astrology was very much used to make decisions in the ancient Near East and ancient China. There was a bit of it in classical civilization too, but not as much.
@@WorldofAntiquity You may have to look at a video of my comment, because the PUNKS at TH-cam deletes them all the time, so I must record all my reply's, I can call you or TH-cam every 4 letter word in the book, and it would not get deleted until you or someone else reported it, many of my deleted comments are about the zodiac and planets, I reveal how they can speak and YT seems to not like it. I have many short videos of deleted comments from here on YT. I can post a comment to you and YT will delete it and I'll have a video of the deleting from your eyes seeing it, like the one I uploaded this morning, that had nothing but simple math but it was associated with the cycles of the inner planets. What I say next may get this comment deleted, but it will be a small example of what they delete. The word Virgin comes from 2 words, Latin 'VIR' meaning Man, Greek 'GYNE' meaning Woman, in the zodiac that would be Virgo, I use "Say It Backwards", play the words "Boy/Girl" backwards it says "Virgo", something you can not debunk, it says what it says, Virgo rules 3 weeks of September, now play "Her Mistress Boy/Girl"
It was very important for a lot of history - at least in the upper cases. It took a real nosedive during the Enlightenment when there was a shift from more holistic to more secular thinking. But I’m sure there were other times astrology’s important waxed & waned.
Curious as to why Gobekli Tepe is not discussed here anywhere that I seen yet display relatively clear images of many Astrological symbols. This would lead it back to the stone age roughly. I get Archeology loves to ignore that site at all cost it seems but I am curious about why it was skipped over when it suggest the entire thesis of this video is incorrect.
Hi! Thanks for the info! Is there any easily understood academic book that you would recommend and talks about the history of astrology in the ancient cultures in a introductorily handbooklike manner? Thanks very much in advance.
4:09 "from mediterranian sailors who used it for navigation" - i once learned about a hypothesis, that those constellations were formed to resemble coastlines, not only in the mediterranian but around europe. That is approximately the region where most megalithic structures are found. But some constellations might also resemble the currents leading cross the atlantic to america and back to europe, and some coastlines in the carribean. It is been said, that Ophiuchus, the "bearer of the snake", leads over the atlantic. And that again reminds me of the american myth about the "Feathered Snake", that came from the west. These currents might also be depicted in the El Castillo cave, along pictures of ancient sailing ships. Coincidence? Or is it a jigsaw puzzle coming together?
I really appreciate the thoroughness of this video, and the solid critique of the last few examples. I especially like your call to interdisciplinary collaboration. I don't know if you are aware that there is a scientist who discovered those same for fixed zodiac signs on stones at Göbekli Tepe which would date the zodiac prior to 9000BC E. So at this point we would be talking about the zodiac lost in antiquity and being possibly sourced in Atlantis, if Atlantis, did indeed exist. Also, thank you for not taking jabs at Astrology itself. Also, look into Robert hand, if you have not yet. And if you want to get red pilled on Astrology, see Cosmos and Psyche by Rick Tarnas. Cheers! OK I see you do have a video one Gobekli Pepe and the zodiac.
The constellations are a natural consequence of the projected path of the sun in the celestial ecliptic, so as soon as humans noticed this path, they began attributing importance to those specific "sets" of stars. Great channel, every video I've watched so far is interesting.
So, TH-cam is reading my mind. I've been watching programs about Gobekli Tepe, and wondering why archaeologists are assuming that the ancients named the constellations like we did, using the same images: bear, scorpion, hunter etc. Guess I'm about to find out! Really interesting, informative and, most importantly, objective video. I'm looking forward to watching your video on GT now.
Because I remembered the date's for all the zodiac signs as a kid by calling the daily horoscope line. I now use it as a way to remember when people's birthdays are coming up. I personally think the stories told are a way to remember .
As a practitioner of astrological magic, I believe the absence of the signs mentioned in the boundary stones could be related to those signs not being suitable for the workings intended, since most of them are “soft” signs in themselves and the planets related to them.
Thanks! I am wiser and more curious after this video, which is a rare and desirable combination. I believe that Capricorn is often known as a sea-goat even today, meaning that it didn't change from that old list?
I was wondering if the whole concept of the Leo constellation could go back as before the modern humans began to spread out of Africa, or at least before they entered Europe? If "Leo" traveled along the same migratory routes with early humans into Mesopotamia and then Europe that could account for the Lion being a symbol and/or constellation in both places.
@@maidende8280 Plus there is no evidence of any formulation of zodiac signs between 50-70,000 years ago when the initial out of Africa migrations are believed to have occurred.
What about the Nasca Lines representing some of the constellations? Does it not have a Scorpian in it? I have always thought that they were trying to replicate the sky on the ground for some reason since there is no exact determined reason that they were made. It is just a thought
I had to come see how you put this together, Doc. I ain't a fan of Ancient Aliens, but I do like me some archaeoastronomy. Do you nail this, or before I respond to your vid on pillar 43 am I gonna have to do this? Will your vid on pillar 43 change my opinion? Will this video change my opinion? I dunno, let's find out *cracks beer
Good stuff, although I do believe you're missing part of the picture. But you touched on why at the end, you're an archeologist, not an astronomer or such. But I do applaud you not taking some "we got this artifact and its the oldest so meh" position, which would be the most advantageous for you in these debates. I know I criticize you sometimes, in defense of Hancock's work usually, but I criticize Hancock a ton too. Not playing teams here, I want truth.
The zodiac must already have been known by the people who created the calendar on the sungate of Tiahuanacu. The meander band in which the 12 months are embedded means the course of the earth round the sun. That means the months are not defined by moon phases but by parts of the course of the earth round the sun. And these parts can only be defined by the constellations of the zodiac through which the earth moves in the course of the year. This calendar shows the 360-days year before the flood. Also this calendar is in detail identical with the calendar in Rigveda 1.164.11 - 14 + 48 (in which 1.164.11 + 14 + 48 refer to the zodiac) and to the calendar Berossos suggested for the time before the flood. And this flood he dates at about 33.500 BC while the backwards calculation of the up and down movement of the constellation Orion (called the three (!) steps of Vishnu through the universe) gives a date of 36.500 BC. Even before that the zodiac was known just in a different composition. Though the zodiac of Dendera in Egypt was created at or after the time of Julius Caesar (visible by the constellation Libra) it shows a time much before that namely 10.500 BC which was the lowest point of the movement of Orion (Vishnu in Rigveda) which means Vishnu came to the mortals on earth at this time (compare Rigveda 4.58.3b).
I've read there is a Sumerian system, or Akkadian, that started with twelve bright stars in the sky, one for each month, and developed into the twelve zodiacs over a couple thousand years to around 700-600 BCE. Any basis for this in history?
[" Gobekli Tepe, the oldest archaeological site, has carvings of the constellations/zodiac. Look it up, or watch Graham Hancock - Ancient Apocalypse. "]
08:15 - Whoops! Capricorn is very much indeed depicted as a "goat-fish" in Greco-Roman depictions. It is less common to find Capricorn depicted as only a goat. ^_^
Sagittarius is the Hebrew War Horse. The same horse Pluto/Hades has been following for a while now. ..sorry for the multiple posts. But this way each is easier to respond to with insight, correction, question etc.👍🏼
Thank you for mentioning that constellations are social constructs. It pains me every time I see a non-western culture compared to Greco-Roman constellations.
To witness and track the constellations, it would to have had to mean someone was around for twenty-four thousand years just to understand procession of the planet now explain that
What is the earliest indication (inscription/text) stating the concept of an Astronomical/Astrological Age? All of this bull imagery during the Bronze Age, does it suggest wizard/shaman/star-gazers have confirmed the movement of the equinox sun-position and the "Age" concept is under development? It seems impossible that this concept only appears a couple of centuries before the transition into Pisces in high antiquity when the Pyramids are already 2 thousand years old. This would have been a sensation in historical times, post Alexander, that mankind had been passing thru "Ages" . (I'm not into Astrology), it's the concept of an "Age" that is intriguing, it would mean a multigenerational oral transfer of knowledge of sun's position and that could suggest the odd constellation names and mythology have far less "religious" value and are more mnemonic devices although the transitions would have created great superstitious speculation.
Have you run into stories told through star symbols? Like do people describe certain seasons or years as "When this constellation did that to some other contemplation"?
Dumuz is not Aries but Orion. It's a summer month (visible in the northern winter night). The sun is in Orion in about July, just like in the Babylonian and Jewish calendars.
Ophiuchus the Serpent Bearer is sometimes called the or constellation of the zodiac. Because the sun passes in front of Ophiuchus from about November 30 to December 18 each year. And yet no one ever says they’re born when the sun is .
If stone hedge and globe tepi, are solar/ celestial clocks?(The Great Clock) And they take like 12,500 years to observe a cycle... Who gave them the complete cycle? Neanderthal were around for hundreds of thousands of years. Perhaps they were star watchers too? They're holy priest's could have observed several cycles.
Answering your Question at the end? The 12 Spokes Letters of the Hebrew Square Script do pictographically represent the 12 signs of the Greek Zodiac. I believe both the Babylonians and Greeks recieved the Zodiac from, not Torah Jews, but the Nasarean Essenes who rejected the Torah. Although the Sefer Yetsirah Text attributes Hebrew Letters to the Zodiac, Unfortunately that book did not attribute the correct letters to the correct zodiac. The Nasarean Bible does attribute the 12 Spokes Letters to a different ordering of letters than the Sefer Yetsirah. And based upon that deacription, i am the only one i know of who have proven this is true when looking at the Hebrew Square Script as Pictographic Forms. If you would ever be open to having a conversation about that, i would be open to it. I have been planning to make a video series about the the secrets of the Hebrew Alphabet from the Essene perspective for quite some time. Eventually perhaps you can critique that video series.
Maybe first analyzing the ancient calendars- Sun and Jupiter cycles, Lunar cycles etc and then Explaining the constellations and zodiac signs. Also Vedic astronomy and astrology wasn’t mentioned at all so doesn’t many others..
With regards to Picies, if the Greeks morphed the symbol into a fish, it is just as possible Babylon did the same to the paleolithic symbol, drawn from their own mythos. Much the same way we recognize Christmas as drawn from pagan mythology based around the solstices and rewritten into a celebration of Christian mythology. Even the symbol went from the sun disc to a cross.
[" This discussion led to judgements, and disapproving of claims that don't align with your, or mainstream, thought process, techniques, and filters. "]
To me the discussions involving the Zodiac is kind of a quirky one. I think it’s like you said, that you would need a few experts from different fields of study to get together to come up with some ideas on how to interpret all the “evidence” to come up with a consensus of how to best describe everything in a historical way. And the only reason I put the word evidence in quotes, is because I look up at the stars, and I just see stars. I don’t see how anyone can look up and think - look, that’s Hercules! Or see the lion? For me it seems silly to look up and think that the stars in the universe are all arranged to be viewed just from one little planet. (OK. I will be honest. I really wanted to say stupid, not silly. But I wanted to be nicer about it.) I am not sure how far back in time you would need to go to have the stars in the earth’s night sky be different from how it is seen now. But I am sure that early man would have been able to see many more stars in the sky than we do now, due to light pollution. I also do not know how many stars have died and vanished from the sky, or how many new stars are visible now that we didn’t have or could not see before either. So, seeing certain Zodiacs in the stars has always been more humorous to me than anything. But thank you for the interesting watch! I love learning new stuff. Even if I can’t remember enough of the details in order to relay it to anyone else that might be interested. But at lleast now I have a TH-cam site that I can send them to in order to learn more about it themselves!
The Ancient Egyptians were credited with the "discovery" of Astrology as far back as Ancient Times. They were studying the Constellations ( stars & planets ) long before the Greeks and obviously before the Romans.
I’m obsessed with these videos. As a history major in college I like how you use actual academic methods to debunk popular history myths
Myths
Dammit ... I likes me miffs ...
I read 'Exploration Fawcett' quite some decades ago (don't ask) and was hooked by the unasked questions; and by the few bones that Fawcett tossed our way. I'm still ravenous, still gnawing bones, my empty-bone pile is now massive - and all I have is ever more questions and a depleting store of years.
@@johnhough7738 There is some truth to these. More truth here than in Christianity or Islam or any other Abrahamic religions.
Why single out 'Abrahamic'?
To me all religions (that I know of) are simply con-games to separate the uncritical/and or uneducated from their funds.
I'll cheerfully debate this with anyone that doesn't (it means: does NOT) refer me to their 'holy' book. Brrrrr ... just too many of 'em.@@percubit10
Oh, did you know that for example the city of Troy was a popular history myth ?? Yes that's right, .... until someone actually FOUND that city !!!! So myth are in (lots of) cases, backed my a true moment or event in history. People that say that one thing IS OR ISN'T a MYTH, is actually , in many cases, taking you for a ride
I don't believe in Astrology. I'm a Leo and Leo's are skeptical.
I'm a ♌, down to the extra gravity that bears down on my spinal column, he mentions the cosmic hunt, but modern Astrology is so accurate, you should even consider that Leo's spend their maturnal months in September, thus shaping us even more by the seasons, skeptical therefore more logical than non leos?
Logic is intentful, the inhabitants knew the shape of the cities pathways relative to the stars, but when is key here: the painting was commissioned when they saw a link, during king Arthur age, but all roadways/pathways do that is the logical fallacy at hand, it reflects a logical understanding of reality, and human nature, but proves nothing new about anthropology let alone Astrology
The logical fallacy that the zodiac was random, based on "subliminal will" of early stone age man, seems to be underlying the viewpoints of modern humans, that is most offensive, the cosmic hunt the vid author points out is most logical explanation of the entire mystery
So you believe astrology at the same time you reject it🙄
I don't believe in astrology, either. But them I am Aquarius and Aquarians are too intelligent to believe in astrology and _Woo!_
{:-:-:}
👏👏👏👏
Hahahah
Apparently the Pawnee Indians of North America were reasonably advanced star-watchers. They apparently made star-charts on hides. It'd be interesting to review ancient non-western astronomical knowledge.
Remember that old sci fi movie, Close Encounters of The Third Kind? All over the world, a series of tones and colors were being - copied around the world? In the movie it was aliens, but let's say a solar maximum of extreme output from the sun, created Aurora Borealis - but huge scale that was observed simultaneously across the planet by various "Priest Class" and recorded on animal hides, cave walls, land formation?
Be advised, don't follow that line ... it is very addictive. I fell into the trap when I looked into sites dealing with ancient constructions. We all accept them because they are there but few ask "How the heck did they DO that?" ... and such answers as we are given often make no sense at all.
Excellent as always. Although Katherine Maltwood can be dismissed as an example of mild British eccentricity, one rascal, Iolo Morgannwg (real name Edward Williams) was responsible for the creation of a pseudo-Druid culture in Wales and celebrated as the world famous Eisteddfod festival. Iolo forged amongst many manuscripts the "Lost" poems by Dafydd ap Gwilym, but his enthusiasm included design resulting in construction of Gorsedd megalithic stone circles dotted around Wales, non of which are ancient although many believe them to be so. His design copies Boscawen-Un located in Cornwall. I would loved to have taken tea with Katherine, probably mad as a March Hare but fascinating non the less.
Gotta give kudos to the incredibly diligent work on the captions. They even cover the sections you respond to! It's a small thing most may not end up seeing but is still highly appreciated.
Thanks. I have only done it with a few videos so far, but I am working on it.
Finally. Some trustworthy information on the history of the Zodiac calendar.
A Diablo 4 ad at 12:08 played just after you said “but first a necessary evil”👹😈😅
A real teacher at heart. A role model for any teacher or parent
I feel like "a deficiency of knowledge" should be the motto of Ancient Aliens.
I “love” the ominous music on ancient alien and similar videos. The lyrics are “Idiot, you are easily impressed by confirmation bias”. Not very poetic lyrics, I know.
Capricornus as a goat-fish did carry over to cultures after Babylon. That is how it is depicted in many old Eurpopean star maps.
Interesting. Good to know!
@@WorldofAntiquity goat with fish tail is the default representation of Capricorn I see in most horoscopes, and even little desktop figurines or cups.
Another great video. I would love to hear you go over more ancient alien videos. I’ve long since been a fan of the show, and they make it sound so logical to someone with no education on the subject. But you basically debunk it with facts, and that’s what I like. So if you could go over more of ancient aliens episode I would love it
These clips are killing me and reminding me of why I both love and hate these kinds of shows: the extremely dramatic music stings for...absolutely nothing happening.
I watched a bit of The Curse of Oak Island and I will never forget the absolutely hilarious moment of everyone sitting around a computer, looking incredibly bored, as this tense, horror movie music plays, building up, with dramatic camera angles, until, with a sudden swell and silence the computer watcher said: "Still nothin'." and went back to her half nap as the music faded back to neutral as though disappointed with itself.
Amazing television, 10/10.
There is speculation that some of the carved figures at Gobekli Tepe are referencing constellations.
Discussed in Part 2.
I grew up in South America in a small town with little light pollution and loved to watch the night sky, but had no idea of how to recognize constellations there. I was only able to locate "Las Tres Marías" (which many, many years later I learned were Orion's Belt). Frustrating! How to figure out a zodiac sign among all those thousands of stars?
As a young adult I eventually became a radio operator in the Norwegian merchant fleet, but I still hadn't figured out the constellations. I secretly believed that the Pleiades were the Big Dipper (similar shape, right?) and was looking for other constellations in that size range without discovering any. And I was too ashamed of my ignorance to ask...
Until one evening while crossing the Mediterranean I was on the bridge watching the sunset, and as the sky turned darker and the first stars began to appear over the horizon I suddenly got THE revelation! I could clearly see that the stars formed the figure of a lion, and it was enormous! So I just stood there mesmerized by the sight until more and more stars became visible and the shape of Leo slowly merged with the star crowded sky.
Good job! Your last point about the need for interdisciplinary studies with critical analysis is well-taken. There is so little direct evidence for connections between the calendar and asterisms or constellations that fantasy prevails over science in most cases. People want to see something, therefore the see it. For my part, I have always thought the best evidence for a very ancient connection between asterisms, animals, and possibly seasonal patterns is the Lascaux Aurochs as Taurus with the Hyades on its face and the Pleiades over its shoulder.
I only saw one image, the one with a man next to a bull with a bird at his feet, if the Bull is Taurus, the man is Orion, the bird at his feet would be Lepus the rabbit, which was a Rooster first, the problem is, Orion's Sword is pointing the wrong direction, and the bird is on the wrong side of Orion. I know this are as being "The Silver Gate of Man", between Gemini and Taurus, Orion stands in the center. We have "The Golden Gate of the Gods', behind Sagittarius.
Did you know, if you play the words "Say There Is A Guest" in reverse, you can hear it echo "Sagittarius", in ancient times known as Pabilsag, his name means "Chief Ancestor", the father of a dying and rising god known as Damu, which has the meaning of "Relative". Scorpio is hard to echo, but I think it is "Wise Quotes", Scorpio is part of the Golden Gate, as well a Ophiuchus, whose echo is "Seek Reefer", LOL, which aids in your "Wise Quotes". The Silver gate speaks too,and their echoes reveal that this is a "Gate".
Play the words "Say Oath--They All Rule--Beyond The Mist". Orion's Sword, pointing at the Bull, it speaks too, Hatysa is the star at it's tip, it means "Slaughter", but in Hebrew, you read read right to left, 'yasa' means "Savior", 'hata' means "to sin", meaning "Savior of Sinners". Hiding the word Hatysa is Haya, meaning "Grain/Seed", like that of a Man, Haya is the God of Scribes, guess what, he is also a Door-Keeper, can you can that a gate, and it is the Scribes that write the Wise Quotes we read to day, and if you play Hatysa in reverse, you hear "iosa", which seems to be another way of spelling Jesus, and that word is associated with meaning "Healer", which brings you back to Damu, which is a healer too.
I've read where they said Jesus is "The Lion", in the zodiac, that would be Urgula, we call Leo the Lion, 'ur' means Dog, Gula was the mother of Damu, the Dog headed goddess Bau-Gula.
Now play "Way--I'll Open It--So They Go--See God", in reverse, they echo "August--Regulus--Denebola-Leo". If you didn't know, Regulus is the Heart, Denebola is the tip of the tail, an odd fact, when the Heart of the Lioness tell her its time to hunt, she uses the tip of her tail to communicate with the others on the hunt. In ancient art, it shows a Goddess riding a Lion, must be Virgo, Latin meaning "virgin", a word that hides Man/Woman, in Latin, 'vir' means Man, in Greek, 'gyne' (gin) means Woman, playing the words "Boy/Girl" in reverse will echo "Virgo". Orion is seen battling the bull Taurus, 7 stars giving Orion his hourglass shape, Hatysa is the 8th brightest, but that is his seed, in Latin, 'septem' means Seven, where we get "September", which has an echo "Her Mithras", the "Gohatya" means "Cow Slaughter".
In mythology, Seth threw the man part of Osiris into the marsh, where a upon our Southern Fish ate it, found at the foot of Aquarius, known as The Great One Ea, (Enki). Enki is Wise, if you play the words "Say You're Well Taught" in reverse, it echoes "Aquarius", and the word "Ur" also means Wolf, and "Thou Am Wolf" will echo "Fomalhaut" the mouth of the Southern Fish. The Wolf headed son of Seth was known as Wepwawet, the 7 stars of the Little Dipper, who the ancient Greeks called "The Dog's Tail", fore the 7 stars of The Big Dipper was known as Seth, "Thigh of the Ox Leg". Polaris is our pole star, on the other side of Earth's tilt is Vega, which was known as the Dog headed goddess Bau-Gula, wife of Pabilsag, mother of "The Child" Damu.
Do you have the ears to hear these words
I don't know if you read comments ten months later but I just wanted to highlight the disingenuousness of the ancient aliens team at the end. Magli says things like, "it may be", "it's possible", Tsoukalos then says, as fact, "they built it to be Gemini, why?" It's a really standard tactic the alternate history crowd do. Take a possibility, in this case exaggerate it, then continue on as if that original idea is established fact. Then from there they build more suggestions, then continue on as if they also are fact. Till by the time you reach the end of a book or TV show you have a whole house of cards built on incredibly shaky foundations.
Great content by the way. Definitely got my subscription. I'm enjoying going through your back catalogue
Yes, they do that a lot, don't they? Thank you for watching!
I like the more holistic approach to understanding, different disciplines can become very focused and unaware of discoveries in others by putting them together the whole of fuzzy pictures of past can become more resolved.
I have been waiting for this since you talked about it on Stefan's channel. I am an Astrologer but have always been interested in the ancient origins and when I heard you and Stefan talk about this I was really excited. Sometimes when you are really looking forward to something and you build it up in your mind the reality can be disappointing. Instead, this has surpassed my expectations. This is a video I will be watching many times over. Thank you so much for doing this and well done.
I am so happy to hear that. Thank you!
Stellar work Dr Miano, your a real star!
Ha thanks. I like the pun!
didn't watch this one on its release but glad I made up today.. you're right. interdisciplinary research is the key to understanding in depth.
So glad these videos are available, every time a friend or family member mentions one of these topics I have an interesting and digestible thing to share with them. For some reason, me googling an answer to give them an answer/explanation is questionable (for my more conspiracy minded friends or family) but, when I send a video (on a Google owned platform haha) they watch them and are more willing to listen
I love how you explain history. I have learned more from you then I ever did when I went to school!!
Ah, I think I know about what you'll talk about Golbektepe.
I don't belive that "the zodiac" existed until recorded story but I do belive that humans looked and though about the skies. It's something that they must have tried to understand, because "the above" is a place where a bunch of strange phenomenons happen. Things that humans would remember, discuss and record (like they maybe did at Golbek).
In the #shamanic and #animistic traditions there are 3 planes of existence - above, terrestrial and below - th-cam.com/video/JJVmRifjOGU/w-d-xo.html
I find your content so intriguing that I would like to share it with my friends (and "enemies"), but most of them speak Spanish. Would you be interested in a translation?
Yes, I would be interested. Shoot me an email. My address is in the About section of my channel page.
I'm glad history with Kayleigh suggested your channel. Awesome video
Very interesting. Thanks for the upload.
I loved the part when Ancient Aliens Gyez made out shapes from the clouds.
Having watched many alternative history shows on TH-cam it’s a real pleasure to watch a learned wet blanket man give commentary. These shows did however give me a lust for all
things ancient and without them I wouldn’t have found yours. Good job. Right I’m off to trawl the rest of your vids to get more countervailing perspectives.
Okay.
I give up.
"Wet blanket man"?
wet blanket = noun, Synonyms of wet blanket : one that quenches or dampens enthusiasm or pleasure. Eg: We were all having a good time believing in fairy tales of Atlantis until the wet blanket man from World Of Antiquity said it never happened.
I have no problems with what other people believe. To whatever degrees suits them they've formed conclusions from their researches (okay, their inputs) and seem happy knowing what they know; however rational or otherwise. This is one reason why I rarely debate religion/s ...@@ashesblues1097
Great content as always. Keep it up.
I was a test tube baby. My star sign is Pyrex.
Spent my childhood as a happy go lucky Sag. Now I am Ophiuchus, the depressed adult version.
Interesting video, though here is some food for thought
Gobekle Tepe in Anatolia may be the earliest confirmable reference we have for prehistoric man's understanding of the Zodiac, and for precession in particular. The archaeological site, located within the Taurus Mountains, has been found to represent the Pleiades in their circular placement. We know this because, unbeknownst to many, Gobekli Tepe, and Enclosure D in particular (which is the largest this far) is located within a massive geoglyph of a bull. This is only seen from above, and the enclosures are located exactly within the "bull's" shoulder, which has historically been understood to represent the Pleiades. Unfortuantely, tourism has destroyed most resemblance of this geoglyph to accommodate parking lots and tourist centers.
This hypothesis is further corroborated by the now famous Pillar 43 you mentioned, which likely represents Cygnus and Scorpio in their correct positions.
While this is not a fully realized set of 12 constellations the gradually shifting orientations of the enclosures as time dragged on suggests that the builders of the site understood that the sky shifted with time, and while no evidence has been found thus far to prove this (its likely still buried) its not a far stretch from here to assume they came to understand Precession.
Just imagine how dizzying it must have been for the first shamans, usually in their psychedelic stupor, that realized the they were standing on a wobbling needlepoint.
Im a Libra sun and Mercury with Cancer Moon and Rising,. I have to consider possibility that makes too much sense for it not to make sense. Im also Scorpio Mars and Venus, so I can get aggressive, which I would like to apologize to the creator for cuz we butted heads earlier. Ill read your rebuttal later.
See Part 2, which is about that: th-cam.com/video/vUdJCVwqJNM/w-d-xo.html
At 23:40 you mention "Samian Ware" as being Greek pottery. I've only heard that term used for the "terra sigillata" made in Gaul during the Roman period.
Hmm. I did not realize that. I assumed "Samian" meant from Samos. But maybe the samian ware found there was from Gaul.
You're correct, samian ware was only made in Roman Gaul, the Greek equivalent would be closer to the black figure pottery tradition of Athens
DUMB QUESTION... how did they know the sun passed through those constellations if they couldn't see starts during the day?
I think they just became familiar with the sun's path sufficiently enough so that at night by memory they knew where it would be.
One can see the stars about 30 min before sunrise. They were also charting the stars every night so they knew what would happen the next month, week, day and hour
They seen what stars came up before the sun came out and they noticed what stars were out when the sun set.
It's not a dumb question at all. But not only does the sun travel along that path during the day, planets also travel along it at night. Early astronomers from several different cultures were able to make this observation
When I first came across this years ago it was in an article noting a lot of what you mention plus the fact that scale is never taken into account. A pencil line on a map can cover anything from metres to miles on the ground depending on scale. Eg roads are marked with thin lines on maps but we all know that they are metres wide on the ground.
I found this video very helpful. I'm not sure if I could really tell that the landscape looked like the constellations. I am fascinated by history and Astrology. so I really enjoyed this. As I am writing this you as basically saying the same thing using SpongeBob 🤣.
How about teaming up with an astronomer and show the distance between each star in any given constellation. Show the constellations in 3d, as opposed to the 2d we see.
Then invite any astrologer to explain how these bodies, in their real dimensions and proportions, can effect a person's characteristics and daily condition?
15:13 - “the swallow and the fish” - a bird is just an air fish
Astrology is fascinating!
Although i don't believe that planets can influence the course of our life( i don't believe either that a ghost can decide our destiny) i find amazing that it comes from ancient times and still exists😲
Love that oblique 'destiny-defining' (ghosty) bit.
You/I/we may not believe, but such beliefs had very powerful effects. Still do ... sadly.
Another great one, couldn't agree with more with your point about interdisciplinary collaboration. Not only do I think a lot of these pseudo-historians miss out on a lot of art and aesthetic knowledge (as in maybe it's shaped like that because humans think that shape looks nice), but they also seem to fall into some gaps that a little behavioral science could fill in. For example, when you're talking about the lineage of the zodiac, you say the Romans "got it" from the Greeks, and the Greeks "got it" from the Babylonians, and so on. That process of "getting it" is, I think, where historical evidence is most lacking, and so it's the gap that conspiracy theorists fill in with Aliens, the Illuminati, the European monoculture, etc. A little bit of behavioral biology might tell us that those ancient people were exactly the same as us, they think like us, feel like us, etc. That means it very well could have been some Greek dude who saw a Sumerian dude's star chart and thought it looked cool. Maybe he's inspired to do one for his Greek buddies, but they wouldn't really get the reference of the swallows, and they won't know who Dumuzi is, so our Greek guy will have to change some things so the locals will get it easier. Of course, there's no evidence for that at all, that's why we have to say they "got it from" instead of so-and-so was inspired by this other guy. But if you're going to get into speculation and use your imagination to fill in those blanks, why is it always Aliens? Why can't it be "yeah, lions are cool, let's put a lion on our thing, too!" Anyway, thanks for another amazing video!
Dammit. I like aliens. Cool idea, no? But-
-but to be from outside of our own solar system would make their travels untenably lengthy in duration; unless they could somehow tweak Time. (And then we be opening yet more cans of worms, not limited to just the religious ramifications.)
LOVE the channel, been binging all your stuff! It took work to find channels that arent total nonsense on youtube, you and "history for granite" are wonderful! If anyone has some other suggestions for other non-crackpot channels i'd love to hear them :>
Graham Hancock is my own favourite "go to" crackpot; but-
- but the more you experience him the less cracked his pot.
another excellent presentation, great work David!
Thank you!
@@WorldofAntiquity ::
You do us all a disservice, especially after your other good presentations, when you don't go back far enough in time regarding this phenomenon. The Ancient Egyptians were studying this field before any of the Greeks you mentioned and definitely before the Romans. The knowledge of the Ancient Egyptians, in this regard, was the foundation of their existence on the planet, especially the After-Life of the Pharaohs.
@@cliffgaither If you know of any Egyptian documents that speak of the Zodiac prior to the Babylonians, please let us know what they are.
@@WorldofAntiquity ::
Shu ( the god of the air ) :: January 26-February 24. Born under this sign :: creative / conscientious.
Isis ( goddess of discipline ; wife of Osiris ; motherly-love ) :: February 25-March 26. Born under this sign :: straightforward / confident / idealistic.
Osiris ( god of the underworld ) :: March 27-April 25. Born under this sign :: emotionally-paradoxical / enterprising / shys-away from responsibility.
Amun ( god of creation ) :: April 26-May 25. Under this sign :: strong-willed / brave / good leaders.
Hathor ( goddess of love ) :: May 26-June 24. Characteristics :: emotional / expressive / bi-polar.
Anubis ( god of resurrection ) :: July 25-August 28. Profile :: self-confident / self-control.
Thoth ( god of wisdom & learning ) :: August 29-September 27. critical-thinkers / problem-solvers.
Horus ( god of the sky ) :: September 28-October 27. People close to nature / hard-working / responsible / imaginative.
Wadget ( goddess of the royal cobra ) :: October 28-November 26. rational / cautious / conscientious / opinionated.
Sekhmet ( goddess of war ) :: November 27-December 26. optimistic / imaginative.
Sphinx ( "guardian" ) :: December 27-January 25. sensible / adaptable.
Seth ( god of chaos ) :: May 28-June 18. ambitious.
Bastet ( cat goddess ) :: July 14-28 / September 23-27 / October 3-17. Born under this sign :: charming / charismatic.
The Nile ( a non-god ) :: January 1-7 / June 19-September 28. The Nile is the Beginning. passionate / impulsive.
Geb ( god of the earth ) :: February 12-19 / August 20-30. diplomatic / tactful.
📌
The Babylonian Empire didn't predate the Egyptian Civilization. Most historians and archeologists place Egyptian Civilization beginning around 3100 BCE, 12 Centuries before the rise of the Babylonians.
I'm not a historian or archeologist ... but you guys _who are_ ... should converse more ...
@@cliffgaither You seem to be under the mistaken notion that Egyptian civilization existed only before Babylon and not after.
Great video as usual! When I was much younger, I took a great interest in astrology. I can guarantee that back in the 80s, no one was discussing anything about the history of the zodiac. So this was very engrossing... up to the part from Ancient Mysteries. I understand why you want to engage and refute that kind of stuff, but it wasn't nearly as interesting as the actual pieces of history you discussed before that section.
Amazing video and very helpful! A question came up while watching : was there a time where astrology was more of an importantance in society and that social and political decisions where based upon the stars? Or was astrology always a niche like it is now?
So for example : was there a time that a Greek king decided to have a Scorpio as an army general because he thought the fireish personality of Scorpio would be more suitable for the job.? Or maybe a Nobel father is picking a Leo for his daughter to be married with.
So IF there was a time that astrology was leading the politics why did that ends? Did Christianity downgraded astrology?
Astrology was very much used to make decisions in the ancient Near East and ancient China. There was a bit of it in classical civilization too, but not as much.
Astrology is day to day life in India.
@@WorldofAntiquity You may have to look at a video of my comment, because the PUNKS at TH-cam deletes them all the time, so I must record all my reply's, I can call you or TH-cam every 4 letter word in the book, and it would not get deleted until you or someone else reported it, many of my deleted comments are about the zodiac and planets, I reveal how they can speak and YT seems to not like it. I have many short videos of deleted comments from here on YT.
I can post a comment to you and YT will delete it and I'll have a video of the deleting from your eyes seeing it, like the one I uploaded this morning, that had nothing but simple math but it was associated with the cycles of the inner planets. What I say next may get this comment deleted, but it will be a small example of what they delete.
The word Virgin comes from 2 words, Latin 'VIR' meaning Man, Greek 'GYNE' meaning Woman, in the zodiac that would be Virgo, I use "Say It Backwards", play the words "Boy/Girl" backwards it says "Virgo", something you can not debunk, it says what it says, Virgo rules 3 weeks of September, now play "Her Mistress Boy/Girl"
It was very important for a lot of history - at least in the upper cases. It took a real nosedive during the Enlightenment when there was a shift from more holistic to more secular thinking. But I’m sure there were other times astrology’s important waxed & waned.
@@honeyhunters6055 the planet has moved. The signs are now off apparently.
Curious as to why Gobekli Tepe is not discussed here anywhere that I seen yet display relatively clear images of many Astrological symbols. This would lead it back to the stone age roughly. I get Archeology loves to ignore that site at all cost it seems but I am curious about why it was skipped over when it suggest the entire thesis of this video is incorrect.
LMFAO, Ty, I stated that with like 30 seconds left in the Video considering it over :D Sorry . Ill go check that one out now
Hi! Thanks for the info!
Is there any easily understood academic book that you would recommend and talks about the history of astrology in the ancient cultures in a introductorily handbooklike manner?
Thanks very much in advance.
4:09 "from mediterranian sailors who used it for navigation" - i once learned about a hypothesis, that those constellations were formed to resemble coastlines, not only in the mediterranian but around europe. That is approximately the region where most megalithic structures are found.
But some constellations might also resemble the currents leading cross the atlantic to america and back to europe, and some coastlines in the carribean. It is been said, that Ophiuchus, the "bearer of the snake", leads over the atlantic. And that again reminds me of the american myth about the "Feathered Snake", that came from the west. These currents might also be depicted in the El Castillo cave, along pictures of ancient sailing ships.
Coincidence? Or is it a jigsaw puzzle coming together?
I really appreciate the thoroughness of this video, and the solid critique of the last few examples. I especially like your call to interdisciplinary collaboration. I don't know if you are aware that there is a scientist who discovered those same for fixed zodiac signs on stones at Göbekli Tepe which would date the zodiac prior to 9000BC E. So at this point we would be talking about the zodiac lost in antiquity and being possibly sourced in Atlantis, if Atlantis, did indeed exist. Also, thank you for not taking jabs at Astrology itself. Also, look into Robert hand, if you have not yet. And if you want to get red pilled on Astrology, see Cosmos and Psyche by Rick Tarnas. Cheers!
OK I see you do have a video one Gobekli Pepe and the zodiac.
The constellations are a natural consequence of the projected path of the sun in the celestial ecliptic, so as soon as humans noticed this path, they began attributing importance to those specific "sets" of stars.
Great channel, every video I've watched so far is interesting.
There are ads on youtube?
So, TH-cam is reading my mind. I've been watching programs about Gobekli Tepe, and wondering why archaeologists are assuming that the ancients named the constellations like we did, using the same images: bear, scorpion, hunter etc. Guess I'm about to find out!
Really interesting, informative and, most importantly, objective video. I'm looking forward to watching your video on GT now.
Because I remembered the date's for all the zodiac signs as a kid by calling the daily horoscope line. I now use it as a way to remember when people's birthdays are coming up. I personally think the stories told are a way to remember .
what about siderial astrology (Ophichius)?
As a practitioner of astrological magic, I believe the absence of the signs mentioned in the boundary stones could be related to those signs not being suitable for the workings intended, since most of them are “soft” signs in themselves and the planets related to them.
Gemini Readings
th-cam.com/play/PLEG2XGhpU6eu-Al6xDXLmaWcL_Ewx2One.html
21:57 (inset 00:01:48:45) zoom up from - Burrow Mump while Hugh is talking about Glastonbury Tor 😄😃😄
Thanks! I am wiser and more curious after this video, which is a rare and desirable combination.
I believe that Capricorn is often known as a sea-goat even today, meaning that it didn't change from that old list?
you said unnecessary eliv and Disney advert started. Nice :) great video btw, thank you
Anyone who's ever been to Glastonbury can attest to it being a powerful centre of crank magnetism.
Even better video than the great one I expected it to be👍
Wow, thanks!
That image of Leo at 15:05 looks strangely like the sphinx
I was wondering if the whole concept of the Leo constellation could go back as before the modern humans began to spread out of Africa, or at least before they entered Europe? If "Leo" traveled along the same migratory routes with early humans into Mesopotamia and then Europe that could account for the Lion being a symbol and/or constellation in both places.
That's a feasible scenario.
You don’t need to resort to Out of Africa. There were lions in Europe in the past.
@@maidende8280 Plus there is no evidence of any formulation of zodiac signs between 50-70,000 years ago when the initial out of Africa migrations are believed to have occurred.
What about the Nasca Lines representing some of the constellations? Does it not have a Scorpian in it? I have always thought that they were trying to replicate the sky on the ground for some reason since there is no exact determined reason that they were made. It is just a thought
I asked an "astrologist" to determine my birthdate by only asking me questions about my personality. He failed miserably.
He’s not a real one I guess😂
I hadn't thought about the Babylon people at the time of Alexander. They would be the last generations to be able to read and properly use cuneiform.
I had to come see how you put this together, Doc. I ain't a fan of Ancient Aliens, but I do like me some archaeoastronomy. Do you nail this, or before I respond to your vid on pillar 43 am I gonna have to do this?
Will your vid on pillar 43 change my opinion? Will this video change my opinion?
I dunno, let's find out *cracks beer
Good stuff, although I do believe you're missing part of the picture. But you touched on why at the end, you're an archeologist, not an astronomer or such. But I do applaud you not taking some "we got this artifact and its the oldest so meh" position, which would be the most advantageous for you in these debates.
I know I criticize you sometimes, in defense of Hancock's work usually, but I criticize Hancock a ton too. Not playing teams here, I want truth.
@@DeDunking I believe Dr. Miano is an historian. 😃
Gotta love the dramatic sound in the...."documentaries"
Southern Cross is helpful for finding where you are going, having a henge helps .
4:45 -why did the “hour” replace the degree??
The zodiac must already have been known by the people who created the calendar on the sungate of Tiahuanacu. The meander band in which the 12 months are embedded means the course of the earth round the sun. That means the months are not defined by moon phases but by parts of the course of the earth round the sun. And these parts can only be defined by the constellations of the zodiac through which the earth moves in the course of the year. This calendar shows the 360-days year before the flood. Also this calendar is in detail identical with the calendar in Rigveda 1.164.11 - 14 + 48 (in which 1.164.11 + 14 + 48 refer to the zodiac) and to the calendar Berossos suggested for the time before the flood. And this flood he dates at about 33.500 BC while the backwards calculation of the up and down movement of the constellation Orion (called the three (!) steps of Vishnu through the universe) gives a date of 36.500 BC. Even before that the zodiac was known just in a different composition.
Though the zodiac of Dendera in Egypt was created at or after the time of Julius Caesar (visible by the constellation Libra) it shows a time much before that namely 10.500 BC which was the lowest point of the movement of Orion (Vishnu in Rigveda) which means Vishnu came to the mortals on earth at this time (compare Rigveda 4.58.3b).
I wish you would've told me not to skip the ad before I skipped the ad
I've read there is a Sumerian system, or Akkadian, that started with twelve bright stars in the sky, one for each month, and developed into the twelve zodiacs over a couple thousand years to around 700-600 BCE. Any basis for this in history?
What about the nazca lines in the peru landscape being older zodiac or star map than the zodiac constellation traditions of babylonian origins?
[" Gobekli Tepe, the oldest archaeological site, has carvings of the constellations/zodiac. Look it up, or watch Graham Hancock - Ancient Apocalypse. "]
Thank You
08:15 - Whoops! Capricorn is very much indeed depicted as a "goat-fish" in Greco-Roman depictions. It is less common to find Capricorn depicted as only a goat. ^_^
Sagittarius is the Hebrew War Horse.
The same horse Pluto/Hades has been following for a while now.
..sorry for the multiple posts. But this way each is easier to respond to with insight, correction, question etc.👍🏼
7:00 STARRRRRRS 18:48
Thank you for mentioning that constellations are social constructs. It pains me every time I see a non-western culture compared to Greco-Roman constellations.
Really interesting video thank you.
To witness and track the constellations, it would to have had to mean someone was around for twenty-four thousand years just to understand procession of the planet now explain that
What is the earliest indication (inscription/text) stating the concept of an Astronomical/Astrological Age? All of this bull imagery during the Bronze Age, does it suggest wizard/shaman/star-gazers have confirmed the movement of the equinox sun-position and the "Age" concept is under development? It seems impossible that this concept only appears a couple of centuries before the transition into Pisces in high antiquity when the Pyramids are already 2 thousand years old. This would have been a sensation in historical times, post Alexander, that mankind had been passing thru "Ages" . (I'm not into Astrology), it's the concept of an "Age" that is intriguing, it would mean a multigenerational oral transfer of knowledge of sun's position and that could suggest the odd constellation names and mythology have far less "religious" value and are more mnemonic devices although the transitions would have created great superstitious speculation.
That looks like Mr. Crabs on the kool! lol
Have you run into stories told through star symbols? Like do people describe certain seasons or years as "When this constellation did that to some other contemplation"?
Great video 😁👍
Thanks 😁
Dumuz is not Aries but Orion. It's a summer month (visible in the northern winter night). The sun is in Orion in about July, just like in the Babylonian and Jewish calendars.
Ophiuchus the Serpent Bearer is sometimes called the or constellation of the zodiac. Because the sun passes in front of Ophiuchus from about November 30 to December 18 each year. And yet no one ever says they’re born when the sun is .
Glastonbury Zodiac is a match to the #AlbionZodiac which is at least 10,000 years old 😎👍
If stone hedge and globe tepi, are solar/ celestial clocks?(The Great Clock) And they take like 12,500 years to observe a cycle... Who gave them the complete cycle? Neanderthal were around for hundreds of thousands of years. Perhaps they were star watchers too? They're holy priest's could have observed several cycles.
Answering your Question at the end?
The 12 Spokes Letters of the Hebrew Square Script do pictographically represent the 12 signs of the Greek Zodiac.
I believe both the Babylonians and Greeks recieved the Zodiac from, not Torah Jews, but the Nasarean Essenes who rejected the Torah.
Although the Sefer Yetsirah Text attributes Hebrew Letters to the Zodiac, Unfortunately that book did not attribute the correct letters to the correct zodiac.
The Nasarean Bible does attribute the 12 Spokes Letters to a different ordering of letters than the Sefer Yetsirah. And based upon that deacription, i am the only one i know of who have proven this is true when looking at the Hebrew Square Script as Pictographic Forms.
If you would ever be open to having a conversation about that, i would be open to it. I have been planning to make a video series about the the secrets of the Hebrew Alphabet from the Essene perspective for quite some time. Eventually perhaps you can critique that video series.
The way this video is showing stone carvings as if we are well versed with what's written on them
Maybe first analyzing the ancient calendars- Sun and Jupiter cycles, Lunar cycles etc and then Explaining the constellations and zodiac signs. Also Vedic astronomy and astrology wasn’t mentioned at all so doesn’t many others..
This is not about all astrological systems and calendars. It is about the Greek Zodiac.
@@WorldofAntiquity in that case you are correct. Thank you. It was very interesting and informative as always.
Cancer is the Hebrew Eagle in Flight that is spreading its wings to fly as if rises in the East.
The 3rd of the ‘Four Creatures’ group.
With regards to Picies, if the Greeks morphed the symbol into a fish, it is just as possible Babylon did the same to the paleolithic symbol, drawn from their own mythos. Much the same way we recognize Christmas as drawn from pagan mythology based around the solstices and rewritten into a celebration of Christian mythology. Even the symbol went from the sun disc to a cross.
One can imagine that we left Africa with a word for lion. Probably the last time all those seedling cultures lived with lions.
[" This discussion led to judgements, and disapproving of claims that don't align with your, or mainstream, thought process, techniques, and filters. "]
Just what I was looking for, from someone reliable.
Excellent research.
did you also do the voice for Konkers bad fur day?
To me the discussions involving the Zodiac is kind of a quirky one. I think it’s like you said, that you would need a few experts from different fields of study to get together to come up with some ideas on how to interpret all the “evidence” to come up with a consensus of how to best describe everything in a historical way.
And the only reason I put the word evidence in quotes, is because I look up at the stars, and I just see stars. I don’t see how anyone can look up and think - look, that’s Hercules! Or see the lion? For me it seems silly to look up and think that the stars in the universe are all arranged to be viewed just from one little planet. (OK. I will be honest. I really wanted to say stupid, not silly. But I wanted to be nicer about it.)
I am not sure how far back in time you would need to go to have the stars in the earth’s night sky be different from how it is seen now. But I am sure that early man would have been able to see many more stars in the sky than we do now, due to light pollution.
I also do not know how many stars have died and vanished from the sky, or how many new stars are visible now that we didn’t have or could not see before either. So, seeing certain Zodiacs in the stars has always been more humorous to me than anything.
But thank you for the interesting watch! I love learning new stuff. Even if I can’t remember enough of the details in order to relay it to anyone else that might be interested. But at lleast now I have a TH-cam site that I can send them to in order to learn more about it themselves!
The Ancient Egyptians were credited with the "discovery" of Astrology as far back as Ancient Times. They were studying the Constellations ( stars & planets ) long before the Greeks and obviously before the Romans.