"High Voltage!" Mooney 20J N201RF 27 Nov 2022
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ต.ค. 2024
- LINKS: UPDATE 29 NOV- 'Duck Under'- "“We were looking for the airport. I descended to the minimum altitude … and apparently I got down a little bit lower than I should have,” the pilot said."
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This is my home airport presently, and after I got the news somehow I just knew it wouldn't be long before you'd be talking about it 😉. As a high school teacher professionally, I was grading and preparing for work the next day (actually school was canceled due to the power outages in the region) when my team leader texted me just to check to see it wasn't me up there. Then said their power was out because of a plane crash. Couldn't believe it as the visibility and cloud deck were very low, it was raining, and low-altitude winds at the time (3,000' and above) were roaring about 44-45 kts. when the accident occurred (even though the surface winds were calm at GAI). That is something to also consider when flying the approach as it would've been tough to maintain a stabilized approach particularly at night, and as you get closer you get the mechanical turbulence from surrounding buildings and trees near the threshold. Another issue to look at is the runway end ID lights and VASI on 14 at Gaithersburg that were NOTAM'd out of service until this Friday. That would make seeing the airport at night especially difficult in thick clouds/fog considering it's sloped on a hill (upward for 14) with trees surrounding the grounds and threshold. With good visibility you would still see the taxiway lights and the runway edge lights well but not under those conditions until you were literally up next to the airport, if not overflying it low. Grateful both people came out of this OK, and will be interested to see what occurred once the official reports are released.
Thanks for the comment on lights! Another reminder to carefully check the field NOTAMs. …the lessons to learn and re-emphasize! Thank you!
Pilot will never repeat this mistake again. Next time he will find a hotel and wait until better conditions.
Thanks for the comment and very well written.
A pilot for 50 years, this is one of the most mind blowing things I've seen! Frigging incredible, every aspect of it. He had to have been slowed by a cable strike first, before he impacted the tower, unless he was flying 20 mph or that Mooney was built like a tank. I'd love to see his log book entry for this flight! Will he log the additional 7 hours spent in the tower? I would.
One take off, no landing.
@@markmossinghoff8185 An interesting play on the phrase, "taking off is optional, landing is mandatory". Well....maybe.
@@jamesw.6931 The utility said the tower was compromised down to the base; hope he has insurance.
@@549BR Maybe...is the tower height was correctly reported and if any required anticollision lights were working. Towers and other obstructions near airport approaches have liability too.
@@jamesw.6931 I bet he will fly again. I also hope he has insurance but I also bet he does. It may be inadequate but who knows. My Cherokee runs me $2000 a year for $1 million smooth liability (I have a co-owner). When it was just me it was around $1200 a year.. small money for the protection but you are right some people are shortsighted
I’d say these individuals used up all the luck ever bestowed. Flight into Tower, survived. Flight into multi thousand volts power lines, survived. Flight into structure 100’ above ground and not then falling 100’ to earth. This is “Wile E. Coyote” in reality.
if you listen to the atc, yes, they had 0 skill and were all luck just trying to simply turn
One news outlet reported that a pilot with the same name experienced a crash out west in montainous terrain 10 or so years ago. If this is the same pilot, I'd say he's used up all his nine lives too.
You can add in "surprising no fuel fire" to that lucky mix.
Obviously, they didn't look down. Cartoon physics indicate you don't fall until you look down.
Juan, figured you'd be on this one quick and accurate...as always, you did an awesome job covering it! This was an extraordinary incident not only from the Aviation side, but the Fire/EMS and Electrical Utilities side as well. This was a long, very technical, and very involved rescue with Montgomery County Fire and Rescue, D.C. Fire and Rescue, and the local power utility on scene and actively involved in the rescue. The crane used to access and rescue the patients actually belonged to the power utility. There are also several excellent videos of the rescue on TH-cam, and Statter911 (The blancolirio of Fire/EMS) livestreamed it. Trust me on this, Fire department training and safety officers world-wide are going to use this one as a training aid for years to come!
Juan, minor correction: the minima values in parenthesis in the Instrument Approach plate apply to military pilots only. The AGL value (HAT) you are looking for is the one in small font, e.g. 269 ft in this approach. You can confirm that's the case because 269 = 789 - 520 (TDZE). Thanks as always for the informational video.
thought it was a charging station for electric airplanes ?
Clever remark😄
Where do you plan on plugging 🔌 into.
Remarkable that they survived the deceleration, the electrical hazard, and the risk of falling to the ground while trapped in the aircraft!
it really is a miracle. ON a lighter side. I would like to hear some of the cockpit chatter /of the entangled couple dangling for 7 hours.
@@scottmoseley5122 I would say this is the result of a sequence of events.
Sometimes the lottery you win doesn't require the purchase of a ticket.
Well, you know what they say about any landing you can walk away from. =) That's a one in a million, two extremely lucky people!
Very Lucky.
The news said they removed the engine from the plane to lower them separately. They where very fortunate to survive and I agree with you that he ducked under forgetting the power lines shown on the map.
Was it that, or an incorrect altimeter setting? Too soon to know I suspect, but I heard the tower tried to reach him and advised he was too low on approach prior to providing him the current altimeter setting again.
They were extremely lucky to have survived that crash. Just cannot imagine how frightening it must have been for them, not only the impact itself, but just sitting there not being sure if the plane was going to stay where it was. Bet they made sure of not making any large movements inside the plane. Just glad they were rescued ok. I am not a pilot, but I can see exactly what Juan was talking about - being tempted to duck under the weather to get a better view.
Yes hopefully no large movements.
In a movie, about a 100 ravens would have landed on the power line.
@@bw162 Fredo Corleone picks up the mic and tells tower: “ I can handle things. I'm smart. Not like everybody says, like dumb. “
I'm a pilot, and Juan is not wrong. Done it myself, albeit in very familiar home territory
From what I have understood, the pilot was drunk.
Many thanks to all of the firefighters who handled this incident with wisdom and professionalism! This incident could have been so much worse.
A huge thank really needs to go to area power companies. They are the ones who had the task of shutting down and securing the power and bringing special equipment on site to make the rescue happen. This wasn’t much of a job for ARFF as it was more of a high angle rescue operation
@@hooknhose04 Agree !!! ARFF crews are assigned near or right on or off the field of large airports. If fire had much to do with getting these survivors out and down out of the aircraft it was specialty local power companies with the proper equipment that had everything to do with getting them safetly back on ground. NOT FIRE
Thank You. I have learned so much from you
Thankyou, I have learnt so much from you.
COMPLETELY MISSING THE POINT. THAT SAME PLANE WOULD HAVE FLOWN INTO A HOUSE KILLING PPL.
Night IFR approach with the weather at minimums or below, pretty risky situation, no room for anything to go wrong. Thanks to the Good Lord and Mooney’s steel cage construction that they lived through it. My goodness what a miracle.
I listed to this on another channel, and they sounded like newbies and not good at flying
I disagree. Day night.....no difference. Fly down to minimums and if you see the runway or lights and are in a position to land then land. DO NOT GO BELOW MINIMUMS. If you lose sight of them at any time then go missed approach.
I said that "in a position to land" because many forget this. Say you stay at minimums and pass the final approach fix for 20 seconds and then you see the lights snd/or runway below you. You probably are not in a position to land because you are too high.
And, probably easier at night because easier to see the lights.
This is another case of going below minimums and crashing. If they were above minimums they would have flown right over the airport. Or if they saw it then lost sight but decided to stay low and/or go lower (because it is right there!) they did the wrong thing.
@@jamescollier3 I had heard the same, that ATC had been correcting him a number of times about altitude. My brother is a very experienced pilot and used to own a Mooney. They are fast planes and not for novice pilots or “weekend warriors”. These folks are incredibly fortunate to have lived through this.
I agree. The steel cage tube construction had to be lifesaving factor here. It it was a monocoque/semi-monocoque fuselage design, I'd expect it would look like a squashed tin can. Makes me want to own a M20J in the future. Loved them before. Like em even more now (even if they're out of business,)
@@2005CessnaPilot Lot to like about Al Mooney’s design.
Thank you for clearing up some questions I have. I thought he might have been flying VFR in bad weather. But you have cleared that up he was clearly flying IFR and must have either panicked and not trusted his instruments and like you pointed out was trying to IFR in but decided to go VFR below the fog. As I understand it this would fall entirely as pilot error for trying to VFR into a location that has IFR that he seemed to ignore.
That that little Mooney flew direct into the tower and wedged tight is a near miracle I do hope he went out and bought a couple of lotto tickets yesterday, because he is one lucky (SOB) guy. I flew Grumman bi wing for Jade Air in Yuba city for a number of years doing crop dusting and one thing I learned was to ALWAYS be aware of where the power and phone lines were and to NEVER over fly my line of sight and always to assume there would be an tower or trees at the end of the pass. We had a pilot that had forgotten that and I will never forget, to the day I die, the electrical and fire burns on Jim's arms. He did try to over fly his line of sight and got into the wires.
I was lucky though because I got my commission during Vietnam and learned to fly B-52 D's. that was a plane you always had to stay a step ahead of so I think that has kind of set into my mind. I wish I could take the left seat again, but due to my heart and cancer issues, though I could still fly I chose not to so that I do not endanger anyone on the ground or any passengers. In short what I am trying to say is that you always have to be aware of your limits and to trust your maps and gauges and do not bring in your best guess until you have exhausted all else.
Thank you as always for your great videos. You never fail to deliver the best information.
Why aren’t the power towers covered in lights?? It’s on the approach.
Local reports advised that the towers are not high enough to require lights.
Fog can be scary stuff, even on the ground. Visibility can go from miles to feet in a heartbeat. Glad everyone is ok!
I will give them a 9 for difficulty and a 10 on execution. I couldn’t hang a plane on a tower if I tried a thousand times. Glad they are ok!
Those power lines are depicted on the chart at 636 feet, right between JOXOX and RW14, and right about the same point as the Visual Decent Point. I'm not super familiar with VDPs, but I think the notations indicate that you should be at an altitude of 1,280 feet at that point. If I'm reading the tea leaves right, that means he was about 644 feet lower than he should have been at that obstacle.
Alright guys let’s get it all out. I’m sure you were as ‘shocked’ as I was. I wonder who was in ‘charge’? Anyone know their ‘current’ status? After 7 hours I bet they had to ‘bolt’ out of there. Maybe they had too much coffee and were totally ‘wired’. Seeing this really struck a ‘cord’ with me.
Both pilot and passenger were taken to local hospital with "serious" injuries. As of now (6 PM Monday), one was released, the other remains hospitalized. News reports did not say which one remains in hospital.
OK, you covered 'em all, so I guess we can throw the breaker on these puns from now on.
Watt are you on about?
Tower control failure
Was there a bathroom on board? What happens when you pee on a power line?
Fly by wire.
Supposedly (according to local reporting here in the DC area), the propeller hit the power line and the plane then hit the second tower where it lodged. The lodged plane was not in contact with high voltage lines. If I was that pilot / passenger, I'd head for the closest lottery ticket sales office and buy a ticket. Man they were lucky. BTW this knocked out power to 80,000 Montgomery County residents for most of the night. County schools were canceled in anticipation of extended power outages. Power was back on by daybreak I believe. Incredible!
Or not buy a lottery ticket ...... they may have used up all the luck allotted to them.
James, I was getting ready to add that same info. 2 very lucky individuals there last night
I would tend to think they used up all their luck surviving that crash.(Thank God).
When my life as an aviation enthusiast and a powerlineman collide. I once got called to untangle an experimental from a line. Glad they all survived. Aviation is fascinating to me, although I've never flown. Love this channel. Appreciate the knowledge.
I live in Gaithersburg. Last night I was hanging out with friends after rooting our commanders to victory when the power went out everywhere in the city. The fact that they survived is a miracle for sure. I'm also amazed at how quickly they got the power back on given that they need 7 hours to get them safely out of the plane. The rescue crew and utility crew did a superb job. I mean how many times could they have ever been called upon to rescue people out of a plane stuck inside of a high voltage power tower. Bravo!
I live in the county due south of Gaitherburg. My power blinked twice, enough to make the internet router re-set. Glad the flyers seem to be okay, one was released I don't know about the other one.
Some really, really, really weird radio communications were had with ATC and this aircraft well prior to the accident, with the aircraft veering far afield of where ATC was telling them to go. Also seemed like this aircraft was struggling to fly IFR. Check REALATC on TH-cam for more details.
He was a mile and a quarter out and was only a couple of hundred feet above ground level. I see why you brought up the possibility of his ducking low for better visibility and either forgetting about the power lines or not knowing they were there.
Nice to see Montgomery County, MD make the Blancolirio channel with a spectacular, non-fatal accident! The image @ 7:50 says it all. It always makes you feel good to see people walk away from these things 👍
DCA which is 30 miles south of this airport had ground stops starting at about 1430 and a few other times that day until 2021 hours with delays of around 90 minutes for departures due to LOW CEILINGS.
Juan, the divergence in flight path that you showed is due to Westminster Airport being in a direct flight path.
This entire area is heavily regulated airspace. 4 airports, Camp David, plus military airspace.
We also have several private grass strips in the area, besides the main airports at Montgomery, Carroll, Davis.
@@joewilson9744 Not an issue at night, with IFR conditions.
Westminster is a VOR (EMI). The airport is Carroll County (KDMW). Neither of those is on the RNAV 14 approach which begins at RUANE when approaching from the North.
Actually if you listen to the audio w/atc this divert around KDMW was not supposed to occur. He was having problems there and was told several times he’s headed in wrong direction go direct BEGKA
@Zombie Hunter The audio shows that Potomac did give him an altitude warning as well, but that was probably after he had switched to CTAF.
201RF I had seen and worked on back in the 80s. Glad they survived Mooney is a smartly built airframe.
Having worked on a high voltage system, I do not recommend this. The insulators imply that this double circuit line has a voltage in the range of 300-500,000 volts.
Yes. I have effed around and found out around much lesser voltages. Bad day at the wellsite.
These people are lucky with capital L
Took out 4 separate 230 kV transmission lines
That was my guess. The number of insulators can vary based on climate, regulators, and polution.
@@dblair1247 sea spray and fog also factor in the insulators selection?
Would altitude also be considered?
Asking due to curiosity. Respectfully.
@@ricardokowalski1579 Sea spry falls under the category of pollution generally. Onset of corona, electrical noise and glowing, decreases about 2% per 1000 ft of elevation. I think insulation effectiveness is reduced about the same, so a few insulators are added at altitude as I recall. Have not worked the stuff in sum 30 years so its a bit vague. Sad comment about someone who used to be a sort of expert on the subject.
Juicy tank with AVgas and high voltage sparks all around... and no fire?
That is noteworthy.
Solid content
Arc fault interrupter?
Conspiracy? 😂😂😂
Lol
The aircon was on, therefore no spark.
That thought must have terrified the trapped couple for hours up there.
I live in the area where the plane made the half circle in Maryland. My guess they were scoping the conditions at the small airport north of Westminster. Conditions were heavy ground level fog. I couldn’t see the building 500 feet away.
I wonder if the FAA will ground the pilot?
Was he current? 😁
I'll almost bet it was an instrument failure (maybe they didn't adjust the altimeter for atmospheric at the destination) and the same numbers as the ads-b data is exactly what they were reading in the cockpit - since they line up perfectly with the glideslope. Pilot probably thought they had plenty of vertical separation from the altimeter and were all good.
The power plant I work at saw a spike of ~40 Megawatts on the grid when this incident happened, must have been quite the light show. Glad everyone made it out safely.
Juan, where you said “not sure what this is all about” at 4:23, he was actually admonished and corrected by ATC for drifting well off his assigned course or heading. I haven’t gone farther back in the tapes to see what was assigned previously.
Sounds like they were on top of controlling him but why didn’t they tell him to climb and that he was well below minimums?
@@natural-born_pilot by the time he was on the final approach segment, he had been given a frequency change to the CTAF frequency for the airport, which is “uncontrolled.” So he was no longer talking or listening to ATC.
This happened literally 500 feet from where I used to live. I used to fly out of the same airport (GAI) that this airplane was based at. I have done many approaches into GAI, including in low IMC, it is not an easy airport even in VMC - highly technical airspace and approach. I'm glad the pilot/pax are going to be OK.
I agree with you on technical coment. I am not a pilot but the math . Being 1 mile away when contact the power lines. It gives me the shivers. Thanks
@@douglasmoore4389 When the approach is flown correctly and to the correct vertical descent profile, you are well above those power lines. The question is why was he flying lower than that? The fact that the reported conditions were below minimums for that approach gives a little bit of insight, I suspect.
@@ScottsSynthStuff my only thought here is that he was ducking below the weather as best he could in a dive and drive scenario, and drove himself right into the power lines
@@bodenwhitmore7699 Which is suicidal during an instrument approach. Not saying people don't do it, and also not saying that this is what happened here, but the weather and circumstances sure point to this as a possibility.
@@ScottsSynthStuff its a bad move, I learned the dive and drive method during instrument training and boy it just felt sketchy, my personal minimums tell me to get a proper descent rate going, as if you dive too low its pretty easy to run into something. There’s a good reason why training in approaches such as the VOR approach is moving away from dive and drive.
Priceless value, thanks so much for what you do Juan!
It is a mystery as to why the ADSB data reported them at 1000 ASL and the chart shows the power lines at 527 ASL, so I wonder if they had their barometer incorrectly set resulting in being lower than they thought combined with the low visibility not giving them the visual feedback of how low they really were.
ADS-B doesn't use your altimeter setting, it transmits non-pressure-corrected altitude data. So even if they had set their altimeter setting incorrectly, it would not have affected the reported altitude.
Exactly my thoughts as well, although ducking under the weather is also very plausible 👍
@@ScottsSynthStuff Thanks for the clarification. So the ADSB data showing that they were over 1000 ft would only be actual numbers at 29.92?
@@Anonymous99997 Correct. It's the same altitude as is reported by the transponder. There is an encoding altimeter, completely separate from the altimeter on the instrument panel, that feeds barometric altitude data to the transponder and ADS-B. That encoding altimeter is uncorrected for ambient barometric pressure - so it is referenced to 29.92, regardless of what the pressure actually is.
ATC computers will adjust the displayed altitude for aircraft they are working based on the ambient barometric pressure. Sites that collect ADS-B data like FlightAware, to my knowledge, do not make this correction.
You can read more about how this works in CFR 91.217
ADS-B Pressure altitude of 1100 feet with an altimeter of 29.45 translates to about 600 MSL and many encoders only have a 100 foot precision.
A testament to the strength of the Mooney design with the single I-beam main spar and roll cage cockpit.
It has nothing to do with the Mooney wing spar. This was a lucky crash
@@2Phast4Rocket You see but you do not observe.
I neglected to mention that the cabin roll cage is made of heat-treated chrome-molybdenum steel and according to Mooney - NASCAR assisted with the design.
Juan thanks for posting this, love the work you do on crash analysis and flight safety education. This tower is about 300 ft from my home. I’ve long watched too many planes fly too low into KGAI. Complaints don’t seem to register with Montgomery county airport management. Glad the folks survived, there are no visual hazard lights or markers on the wires AND the cell antennae on top of that tower.
What! No lights? … on the flight path - that’s just negligence right there.
Not even any balls on the wires?!?
Government waits until there are fatalities. Same with road markings/signs.
@@straybullitt There is an aesthetics committee in the county government that has significant pull on how public infrastructure should look. They often make ridiculous and often counterproductive demands on how infrastructure is built. The fact that they depend on that very infrastructure for daily life is lost on them. I know this because I used to work for a utility that had to fight these battles all the time.
Don't need to be any lights, or balls on the wires because the minimums will keep you well above them.
DO NOT FLY BELOW MINIMUMS.
Simple as that.
Shocking! Glad they didn't end up in a INFERNO!! Very Lucky! Great report Juan, Thx! I flew through a single line in my early days! I went forward in my harness, heard the piano wire snap and sing!
Caught it by the main spring steel gear and took off about 6" of paint on the leading edge of the gear was all it did! Went right through the prop without a scratch! I was LUCKY! Needles to say, I NEVER fly low again unless I survey the area by ground first! STUPID!
According to Montgomery County MD authorities on Monday morning, they believe the Mooney's propellers contacted the powerlines and the plane's fuselage went thru the gap. The plane then hit the first transmission tower and that collision threw him into the second where it became lodge in the tower, 10 stores up. If you look at the video it appears all the power lines remained intact but the towers themselves were damaged.
Golden horseshoes
Flight data shows a final altitude of 1,100 ft when they struck the pylon 200 ft above terrain. Could it be a case of entering the wrong QNH data like by switching around two numbers?
THAT is what I am asking. If his altimeter told him he was at 1100, he surely thought he was OK.
I dont see how he could have lost 500 feet THAT fast, so it seems to me his altimeter was not accurate.
Or I'm full of it, as I am not a pilot but I get the idea that the data comes from his transponder.
@@NihongoGuy He may have neglected to update his altimeter setting, the transponder gets its data from the barometric instruments. He was passing from an area of high pressure to an area of low pressure, the tower usually gives pilots the current reading on their initial call. Did he drop below the cloud base, trying to sneak in underneath and forgot about the high-tension lines?
@@bernieschiff5919 I don't think he intentionally dropped at all. The data shows him reporting 1100 right up to impact. But I do question his altimeter setting.
I used to fly out of KGAI for years. At 1100 feet in that area, he should have been okay. I have heard that they NTSB is investigating. I am very interested to see what they have to say.
How helpful are the MIRL and REIL in low IFR conditions? Do you have to be right on top of the runway before you can see them?
I found a Mooney Mark 21 back in 1964 NE of Brookings, Oregon while working on my PPL. The pilot didn't survive although he did survive the crash.(It was winter and he tried to walk out, broke a leg and that did him in) If you line up Mt. Emily and Chetco Peak, it's about 5 miles east of Chetco Peak on that line. I think the Biscuit Fire burned it completely.
Some of us Honda 50 riders rode into it in 64 or 65. The cabin was completely intact but the tail had been torn off. The wing tanks were still full of fuel.(Us bike riders couldn't figure out why the pilot didn't use the fuel in the wing tanks to stay warm) The engine was out and wrapped in black Visqueen. We left the wreck at 7pm, just as the sun was setting, got back to the bikes at 10:30pm (I still don't know how we found the bikes in the dark but we went right to them) and back to Brookings about 4am. (It was great being young!!!!)
There is several descriptions and dates that are wrong on the Oregon Fatal Crash Map link about this plane. One says it's a Mooney 20, N7443 that crashed on March 1st, 1967. The other says it's a Mooney Mark 21(which it was), N9746M that crashed on December 12th, 1975. Both crash dates are wrong because we hiked into it in 64 or 65. If I remember right, my flight instructor said it had went down in the early 60's.
Glad they are ok.
I saw another video on this incident that included radio communications. Reading between the lines, I think they were having some nav issues. On several occasions the controller corrected their course and near the end issued a low altitude alert. I found that video here: th-cam.com/video/tVGk-2H5V9E/w-d-xo.html
glad the pilot & passengers made it out of the accident 😳. Thanks for all you do to keep us informed Juan, much appreciated!!!
No kidding. Guardian angels working OT!
Wow, he was in the air for over 8 hours on a Mooney. He can claim a record for that. Woww !!
200 miles 2 houres
@@pauleyplay Plus 7 hours on the tower and wires.
Oh, I imagine he emptied himself about the time he met the tower.
When they said "Contact tower now" they meant by radio. 😜 (I'm only joking about this incident because they survived.)
Don't worry. If they had died, I would have still been around.
That joke was getting cracked one way or another!
The engine was separated from the rest of the aircraft by the rescue crew after removing the passenger. This to make it easier to lower the A/C
So the plane hit the wires and slid along and hit the tower and did not short out on 50,000 volts and did not fall down 75 ft to the ground below, otherwise it's just a normal day flying an airplane. I'd say a one it's a one in a billion save.
As you’re pointing out it seems consistent with scooting along low enough to get some sense of lights and forms on the ground, planning to just use lateral guidance to align with the runway. We’ll see what the final report says, but this seems like a perfect example to remind us amateurs to fight the instinct to do that!
I have dreams about flying aircraft ranging from jetpacks to ultralights to military combat planes. In nearly every case power lines enter the scene, and most often I wind up hitting them.
Did this crash cause any hospitals or senior centers to loose power? How many people affected by the blackout, who pays for all the overtime, and repairs to the grid?
In order, yes, thousands, tens of thousands and insurance to a degree.
News reports during the evening indicated local hospitals modified their admission process during the outage; presume their backup generators handled critical loads until utility power restored
Very good and timely explanation. BTW my wife likes your theme music, "Weightless".
A very fortunate outcome, indeed!
I suspect wrong altimeter setting, perhaps combined with cold temperatures, caused true altitude to be less than indicated. Would be interesting to see what the barometric pressure was at White Plains compared to Gaithersburg.
Thanks Juan, for your insight!
Approach instructions call for adjusting pressure altitude obtained from IAD (if GAI weather out of service) by 80'. Contribution to accident?
This is why many will add some to the minimums. 25 or 50 feet is common. Been so long I don't remember what effects it.... temp, maybe humidity?
Or is it going from high to low, or low to high barometric preasure.?
@@truckerhershey7042 “High to low or hot to cold, look out below!”
Love those modern fly-by-wire Mooneys. 😉
Oooof!
Just an estimate, but based on what appears to be 18 or 19 insulator discs this was a 345kV transmission line. Absolute minimum safe distance for that voltage is 10 feet. These folks were extremely lucky. The plane came to rest entangled in the tower (ground potential) midway between two phase conductors. If they were any closer to either conductor the metal body of the plane could easily have arced to one of these conductors and it would all be over. It would take a _lot_ of coordination and work by the utility to shut down a transmission line of that size, but perhaps that's part of the reason it took almost 7 hours before they were rescued. I can't imagine safety personnel would attempt a rescue of the occupants and removal of the wreckage with the line still energized. Hats off to all rescue personnel and utility employees involved in this incident.
The Fire Service chief said the airplane cut some wires on the adjacent power line prior to impacting the tower. There are two transmission line sets parallel he cut the wires on the north set and impacted the south tower.
at time 6:36 and after you are completely ignoring the glide slope for the approach. this guy ADSB said he was 1100 ft at 1.25 mi. Which would have been right on glide slope that states 1280 at 1.4 mi. .He should have been Well above those power lines. this is a clear case of not getting atis and resetting his altimeter to the correct barometric pressure. His altimeter was way off and his instruments have no way to know if he calibrated it. His altimeter was off by at least 600 ft. THis guy though he was flying the numbers. Problem was they were wrong because he didnt get Atis
I'm pretty sure I heard them fly over me yesterday. It was a horribly cloudy, foggy day in that part of Maryland yesterday, and my butt was firmly planted on the couch watching football. Around that time I heard a small plane go past, and I thought "Man, I wouldn't want to be in the air today ."
So was his altimeter telling him he was at 1100 when he was really at about 570?
I find it very interesting how the wings took it very well. Mooney should obtain it and video the dismantling.
I used to fly a 201. Wings are very stiff, one piece, i believe. The weak points are the fuel bays. Older models tend to develop leaks. The photo shows a wire cut the leading edge just outboard of the right integral tank, which is in the leading edge, ahead of the spar. A column of fuel pouring onto the ground might have completed a ground circuit with the power line, and this could have turned into The Hindenburg. The engine tearing off might have prevented a fire. They were both very lucky. I hope they have insurance, both liability and property damage.
Juan, Nice analysis. This looks like a really tight approach. The approach plate shows the tower at 636, very close to the VDP. The MDA would have put them at least 150 ft. above the tower. Taking a peek, or descending before picking up the VGSI on this approach would not be a good idea. Thank you for your very informative videos. I was able to find the ATC recording of the last half hour of the flight. The last ATC transmission was a low altitude alert a few minutes after ATC approved the change to advisory frequency.
Fully subscribed with notifications turned ON. Still learning daily from you
Excellent choice.
Nothing annoys me more than those *partial* subscribers! 🤮
Thanks for the excellent and timely reporting as always, Juan. Whenever I see and incident or accident on the news I hope to see your coverage of it. You are a gift to the aviation community.
I owned a 1960 M20A, a precursor to the 201. Loved that plane, best flying most efficient plane I ever owned. It has a steel frame construction that makes the cockpit area way stronger than most small GA craft.
I noticed the wire missed cutting through the right fuel bay, just inboard on the leading edge. Would a column of fuel have acted as a ground, possibly causing a fire? The steel tube frame appears to have helped to keep the cabin intact. I agree, they were both very lucky.
Man that is all kinds of scary. Thank God they survived the crash and the hypothermia.
The good lord was watching out for those folks. Amazing
Watching them abot to crash and not doing anything to make them avoid it ? With friends like that...
If the goid lord was watching out for them, there would have been an up or down draft that moved them 50 feet up or down and they would have never known how close to a crash they came.
I think your assessment is very plausible. Are there any FAA requirements for marking beacons (obstruction lighting) to be on top of transmission towers that are in close proximity to an airport?
I was wondering about this for awhile early this morning. But if you look at the recommended IFR approach, these towers are along that path. If at correct altitude without the weather, these would line up to lead pilot to Runway 14. But it was dark and foggy while he flew low...
I’m a power line helicopter pilot. I expect the lines were idled. (Off) and they can be for numerous reasons. Otherwise the phase-to- ground electricity path would have killed them. The wire is not insulated like a house wire nor does it have a single operation circuit breaker. The induction energy alone from a live parallel circuit would also kill them.
I keep seeing testaments to the Mooney steel cage design, but if you look at the empenage accordion damage in the back of the aircraft, I can only imagine the sudden damage to the humans in the aircraft going thru the same level of deceleration! I'm absolutely shocked that they survived a sudden stop in mid-air like this! This was an absolute miracle they lived to tell the tale.
@@sparky6086 the approach is near perpendicular to the run of lines... it's difficult to understand the deceleration here. One would imagine the tower structure cutting through the wings.... or worse.
It’s all in the restraining harness doing it’s job.
Night flying IFR in a single is cause for a high workload... something I personally won't fly in, single engine failure at night really limits you.
Far too often mistakes made on instruments with GA pilots not sticking to training.
I can't imagine a scenario where I would end up below minimums... Perhaps with multiple diversions and go-arounds then fuel being critical, but then hopefully you would have been smart enough not to get up if the weather was that bad.
What a lucky escape! I do hope they learn from the incident.
I worked on a Mooney TLS Sabre, 6 cylinder Lycoming version when we were trying different engine mount designs and shock isolators to get the lowest felt vibrations in the cabin. I questioned the engineer about the (5) 1/4 inch bolts holding the engine mount to the firewall. He replied, "Well, we are bolting the plane to the engine, not the engine to the plane." Oh,. okay, I guess.
not too many pilots can talk about their take-off to landing ratio not being 1:1.
Wow! The physics of that accident, how the energy was dissipated in a way that left them suspended like that with the passenger compartment intact has to be almost impossible. The odds of survival are about the same as winning the PowerBall jackpot three times in a row. I hope the pilot/passenger debrief sheds some light on how that took place. Not that one can learn from it and hope to duplicate it, but just because this old engineer would love to know how it happened. Thanks for the post!
This must have been shocking to the pilot and passenger!!!
🍅🍅
Couldn't resist that joke?
It was current.
😆
@@ray_glaze was is reVolting?
Years ago there was a similar accident at what used to Phoenix Field in Sacramento. The aircraft flew too far West of the runway and ended up perched on top of the high voltage lines paralleling Hazel Avenue.
Another just outside Ontario International, in California mid-1980's. That plane basically landed on top of the power lines and stuck in them inverted. The operator of a large crane happened to be near the crash, and once the power was off he used the crane to hold the aircraft in place. It was stuck at about 110' above grade. The ultimate thrill park ride.
The occupants survived, thankfully
As soon as I read your comment I remembered a similar accident with power lines in 2002 or 2003 at Albuquerque’s Double Eagle Airport (KAEG) at night. Lessons to be learned: 1) Stay on the needles till DH/MAP as well as a programmed visual approach at night; and 2) Read NOTAMS especially when landing at night.
About 1975 my friend, Dr. Richard Fred and his daughter, died after crashing short of the runway in heavy fog while flying back from Canada. It should have been at this airport as they lived in Rockville.
Glad that all on board survived, but mourning the loss of the Mooney.
I saw this one on the news this morning and I was hoping you would cover it. Glad they survived!
ATC recordings indicate the pilot deviating to cause that weird pattern over KDMW when supposed to be direct BEGKA to join the RNAV 14 approach. Prior aircraft advised going missed and diverted. Two low altitude alerts issued while pilot presumably on CTAF. Appears human factors at play. Amazing to walk away from in some form, insurance claim of a lifetime to come.
This was about 1/2 mile from my old home. In 2014 ? we had a jet crash after going around this airport due to fog killing the two on board and two in the home he crashed near.
Imagine NTSB investigation will consider past accidents
Juan, why would the mins go up to 1 1/2 on lateral guidance only (LNAV) when this Mooney clearly isn't going to fly at category C/D speeds? And the mins are 289 above threshold not 300... close enough but confusing to the naive viewer who'll look at the military numbers. Finally... I'm often confused by ADS-B websites showing pressure altitude or something that is corrected, so closer to the actual MSL altitude. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter much. Obviously they were where they weren't supposed to be, and why isn't clear from the available data.
Looking at that jog in the route, it was exactly at my old home turf. They avoided flying over Westminster, Maryland, and flew directly over Jack Poag Airport (a.k.a. Westminster Airport, where I took my first official logged flight lesson). I wonder why? Was there a NOTAM? A special event at McDaniel College?
...or did they, knowing Gaithersburg was fogged in, take a look-see at Westminster airport to see if it was better?
UPDATE 29 NOV- 'Duck Under'- " “We were looking for the airport. I descended to the minimum altitude … and apparently I got down a little bit lower than I should have,” the pilot said."
wtop.com/montgomery-county/2022/11/person-inside-plane-that-hit-power-lines-is-out-of-the-hospital/
2nd 29 Nov UPDATE: Actual ATC Audio- th-cam.com/video/ykmPq0oA_BI/w-d-xo.html
And, ducking under in this instance is very bad. Looking at the Approach plate, just to the left of the glide path on the approach there is an obstacle right at roughly the same distance he hit the lines. I assume that the obstacle on the Approach plate is the wire towers. The disturbing thing is that at that point on the approach plate you are to be at 1280 ft msl @ 1.4nm from the runway (which is 741 ft agl roughly). And this is a definite firm 1280 feet as noted by the approach plate...no lower. With the tower being 636 ft AGL, That only puts you 105 feet above the top of that tower. Yikes!!! If you duck under to looksee....well, the result speaks for itself.
Given the ADSB altitude data does an incorrect altimeter settings sound possible?
The Mooney is a old design & built like a battleship with a steel tube fuselage construction around the passenger area. Aft the baggage compartment is stressed skin monocoque aluminum construction. You can see how its wrinkled in the photo but the cabin area intact. No other plane could you survive a crash like this. Also the wing is a solid one piece construction & broke the machine when it was stress tested. There countless Mooney accidents like this & pilots survived. One Mooney pilot passed out from carbon monoxide the Mooney crashed & he survived. It's ashame they just shut down the factory again.
"any landing that you can walk away from..."
how lucky can you get?
New trivia question, Has there ever been an airplane that took off but never landed? lol
Who, what, where, when, and why. With supporting details. There’s plenty of professional journalists out there with the college degree paper that would benefit from watching Blancolirio and learning how to report events.
W32 in Maryland has power lines on the approach landing south. I was always told to fly over the towers to make sure I cleared them with the helicopter during my training there.
I heard the ATC half of the conversation along with a simulation of the aircrafts track. The pilot was having trouble... wrong headings, etc... I wonder if he might have had a little carbon monoxide poisoning from the heater? His actions after they started vectoring him for the approach just seemed impaired. I am no expert, and I have nothing to base this hypothesis on but my gut feeling.
Vast amount of good tips from Juan…especially fior an ancient GA student like me.🏴
the one and only nightmare I have about flying... wires...
As a Montgomery County Fire Fighter. I hope you do more on the findings of this story!!!!!!!!
Those were power linemen, not ARFF guys. No one else had any business getting anywhere near those lines with equipment.
There's a story to tell your friends and kids about "Hey, remember the time we were in the airplane hanging off the high tension lines?!"
I had a friend who lived in a house on Euclid Ave. in Ontario, Ca. One night a piper landed in a big walnut tree in his back yard. Years later the damaged (missing) area of the tree was still quite obvious.
just north of Anchorage , Alaska in the fog, a Cessna 206 on floats hooked the floats on a high tension line and spun around the wire. As I recall only minor injuries but severe damage to the aircraft;
So I was driving my son back to college in DC, and this happened about the time we arrived there. The weather in the Baltimore-DC area was low clouds, fog, with rain showers at that time. I'd call it "low IFR" from what I saw. When I heard about this happening, my first thought was that the guy was "scud running" to get into Gaithersburg.
Oh wait, you said "hangar"? I thought you said "hanger".
They are lucky! I'm so glad they survived! ,the weather was very weird on the east coast yesterday and conditions were ever changing in bad ways.
My definition of lucky is different than yours… apparently
@@larryscott3982 to survive the impact, dangle for all that time, be rescued, not to mention 14KV all around. If that isn't lucky to you, please enlighten me. I'm not looking for a war, but I've been a first responder for 23 years now. They were lucky!
They used up any chances of hitting a big jackpot in the lottery kinda lucky....
@@Brian-cr6rb
It comes down to cause. They may have been lucky.
Last reported altitude is 1100. Then they hit a tower. So, did the engine quit? If the engine quit due to mechanical, that’s unlucky. If, it’s fuel exhaustion (pilot error) then it would be lucky that they survived.
Did they detour over the runway at Jack Poag Westminster Airport to see if the landing conditions were better there?