Great video! To answer some of the questions above. 1. Yes, you need a mirror image. 2. You cannot use an ink jet printer. You MUST use a laser printer. Ink jet is dye based and toner is a plastic resin. The resin sticks to copper when heat is applied. If you don't care about fine details, you can first print with an ink jet and then use a toner based photocopier to make a toner based image. This is how you have to do it when you are making PCB's from magazine articles. 3. more..
Great vid... nicely done. Only comment, responding to some earlier ones. I've been using PNP paper for a while and have NEVER been pleased with the results. The PNP backer is all plastic and has a tendency to curl or smear when exposed to the heat. The thick paper substrate on the glossy inkjet paper eliminates that problem entirely. Starts flat, stays flat. I have about a 95% success rate with this method as opposed to about 15% with PNP.
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,, Show less REPLY
1. What temp is iron set to? 2. Not really mirror-printed -- should use top-view print of circuit. It will mirror when you apply it. Good video, shows how much time and pressure needed.
@sirloon75 i saw videos in which people boiled the water in a pan and it seemed to work fine! i didn't try it but as long as the board doesn't touch the bottom of the pan, it can't be damaged. the hotter the water is, the faster paper can be soaked. it can be worth giving a try i think!
Forget photo paper. GLOSSY MAGAZINE PAPER rocks! Transfers perfectly in less than one minute of ironing, and super easy to remove! The whole transfer can be done in less than five minutes. Also: sponge method to etch. Instead of dipping the board in a big tub of etchant, I load etchant into a small sponge and wipe away the copper. This also takes five minutes, using only a small quantity of fresh FeCl. From laser printing to the first hole being drilled in a pad in less than 10 min!
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,,
toner from laser printers contains plastic, when you iron the paper, toner (and plastic) melt on the copper board, it gets transfered. Since it's plastic, etchant doesn't remove, you got your PCB at the end... The main issue here to get some paper where toner won't get "integrated" into the paper's structure. That's why glossy papers are better, toner less sticks on it, you can more easily melt it with your iron.
@KazKylheku , that sounds great. Why not make a video and post. Also, what do you mean by Glossy Magazine Paper ? Are these available as standard consumables in stores selling printer paper ?
3. The paper is special paper. Thin photo paper works good. I have had good luck with using junk mail catalog covers. The paper needs to be glossy. Glossy paper has a gel coating that makes it glossy and prevents toner penetration into the paper. The toner releases from the paper when the gel is wet. 4. Some laser printers use high temp toner and this kind won't work for making PCB's. 5. The printed image must be pure black and pure white - no gray lines. 6. more
Just tell me what is photo laser paper? I thin thet work with ordinary printing paper, like markers, alcohol and without alcohol.I use this for drawing and fixing bugs.
I can't imagine ohp film working but would be interested in results! Cheaper than p&p! How about baking paper, you know, the stuff used for cooking? My laser tends to burn magazine paper,
I had sucess of my first try and got it down perfect on my second, I don't know what you are doing wrong. Are you sure you are using a laserjet print? And also make sure you trace the lines really hard with the tip of the iron, that's really important.
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,, Show less REPLY
sorry for this amateur question but how does the toner prevent the acid from etching off the tracks underneath the print itself? is it because toner isn't water permeable? thanks.
I tried this serval times all failures. I used photo glossy paper with the ink on full. From iron temperatures starting at hot to paper browning hot. All failures. Have I missed something in treating the copper or is this a hoaks?
If you want to go as cheep as you can then let someone do the etching for you. By the time you get all the materials and know-how, you will destroy a dozens of PCBs (or hundreds in your case :). There is a "PCB Etching Service" on ebay that makes PCBs quite cheap so don`t have to bother
@banzie74 glossy magazine paper is torn from the pages of a glossy magazine. I could make a video but I'm not planning to make any new boards in the near future. Anyway, what I wrote really says it all. Almost. You still use water to remove the glossy magazine paper. But it's very thin so it dissolves without a lot of difficulty. You don't need the heavy scrubbing.
@rishikeshsharma1 How then? No point in saying you can get a better result without soaking in boiled water, in much less time without saying how. Otherwise, it's just flaming.
@Hayden3430 I highly doubt it given the complexity. This comes out cleaner than an average person can draw and is less time consuming if you have more than a few tracks or if you have components with 8 or more pins.
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,, Show less REPLY
FYI, the temperature from my iron (the one on the video) is about 180°C. Not toot much I guess, even it is the max. I don't know what would be the optimal temperature, but this is working perfectly for me.
I finaly transfer looking your video and thak you very much on this. But i finishd with HYDROCHLORIC ACID and HYDROGEN 6%. I do useful pcb and nice together. I am satisfied! :)
I suggest laser photo paper - not inkjet photo paper. The plastic coating on the inkjet paper has a low melting point and I've had nothing but trouble trying to use it.
buddy,,,,i dont know much about the laser printing paperor inkjet paper,,,but once i tried it works,,,then on the other try it doesnt,,,,although i pressed it with the iron for 30mins,,,
I don't think it would work with inkjet, I've searched for this, found nothing. This is because laser toner contains plastic, which actually results in PCB tracks.
I've seen where he first cleaned the board to remove the oxidation layer with a final stripping pad, and then used "isopropanol 99%" after that it just like this process. look for "DIY Printed circuit board"
Owen Chase Don't preheat the board, there is no need . Use a very high gloss paper, not photo paper. No it wont hard your printer. set your iron to medium heat and iron gently with the tip of the iron. throw the board into warm water and wait about 10 min. this method has worked for me for years.
Xerox harlequin coated paper 80 lb. , this is a very high gloss paper that falls apart very nicely in warm water. Use windex and a cloth to remove the residual white paper after soaking board in water.
search youtube for "Building a super spy bug transmitter" guy called dazaro3 uses plain old used magazine paper. only heats it for 45 secs. search google "Make PCBs at home with magazine paper and your laser printer" - will be listed first.its all there in black and white:)
Ive tried this a hundred times. The paper WILL NOT stick to the copperclad! WTF?!?! I'm using Staples Photo Basic Gloss and a very hot iron (turns paper brown)
Great video!
To answer some of the questions above.
1. Yes, you need a mirror image.
2. You cannot use an ink jet printer. You MUST use a laser printer. Ink jet is dye based and toner is a plastic resin. The resin sticks to copper when heat is applied. If you don't care about fine details, you can first print with an ink jet and then use a toner based photocopier to make a toner based image. This is how you have to do it when you are making PCB's from magazine articles.
3. more..
Great vid... nicely done. Only comment, responding to some earlier ones. I've been using PNP paper for a while and have NEVER been pleased with the results. The PNP backer is all plastic and has a tendency to curl or smear when exposed to the heat. The thick paper substrate on the glossy inkjet paper eliminates that problem entirely. Starts flat, stays flat. I have about a 95% success rate with this method as opposed to about 15% with PNP.
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,,
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REPLY
Running this through a laminator instead of ironing works so much better. I found my laminator at Goodwill.
I use almost the same method but without hot water...
And now my secret is the hot water at the end its perfect ;)
Gratz (:
1. What temp is iron set to?
2. Not really mirror-printed -- should use top-view print of circuit. It will mirror when you apply it.
Good video, shows how much time and pressure needed.
No, it's not that hot, just medium hot. You can use cold water, it'll take longer. Don't use too hot water as I've observed it may damage tracks.
@sirloon75 i saw videos in which people boiled the water in a pan and it seemed to work fine! i didn't try it but as long as the board doesn't touch the bottom of the pan, it can't be damaged. the hotter the water is, the faster paper can be soaked. it can be worth giving a try i think!
Forget photo paper. GLOSSY MAGAZINE PAPER rocks! Transfers perfectly in less than one minute of ironing, and super easy to remove! The whole transfer can be done in less than five minutes.
Also: sponge method to etch. Instead of dipping the board in a big tub of etchant, I load etchant into a small sponge and wipe away the copper. This also takes five minutes, using only a small quantity of fresh FeCl.
From laser printing to the first hole being drilled in a pad in less than 10 min!
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,,
toner from laser printers contains plastic, when you iron the paper, toner (and plastic) melt on the copper board, it gets transfered. Since it's plastic, etchant doesn't remove, you got your PCB at the end... The main issue here to get some paper where toner won't get "integrated" into the paper's structure. That's why glossy papers are better, toner less sticks on it, you can more easily melt it with your iron.
@KazKylheku , that sounds great. Why not make a video and post. Also, what do you mean by Glossy Magazine Paper ? Are these available as standard consumables in stores selling printer paper ?
3. The paper is special paper. Thin photo paper works good. I have had good luck with using junk mail catalog covers. The paper needs to be glossy. Glossy paper has a gel coating that makes it glossy and prevents toner penetration into the paper. The toner releases from the paper when the gel is wet.
4. Some laser printers use high temp toner and this kind won't work for making PCB's.
5. The printed image must be pure black and pure white - no gray lines.
6. more
nice but how do you get the toner off the tracks after etching?
Just tell me what is photo laser paper? I thin thet work with ordinary printing paper, like markers, alcohol and without alcohol.I use this for drawing and fixing bugs.
Am I the only one who gets the chills from the sound of a toothbrush brushing something..?
@rockwizclown I think it can melt or unstick plastic from toner, and damages tracks. Have you tried ?
Ok.. Thanks.. can i use jet printer and not laser?? sorry for disturbing..
I can't imagine ohp film working but would be interested in results! Cheaper than p&p! How about baking paper, you know, the stuff used for cooking?
My laser tends to burn magazine paper,
Yes, normal piece of copperbut a quality copper board. I observed low quality copper boards don't give good results, tracks are blur
I had sucess of my first try and got it down perfect on my second, I don't know what you are doing wrong. Are you sure you are using a laserjet print? And also make sure you trace the lines really hard with the tip of the iron, that's really important.
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,,
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REPLY
sorry for this amateur question but how does the toner prevent the acid from etching off the tracks underneath the print itself? is it because toner isn't water permeable? thanks.
@alfredpauly press 'n' peel is expensive and the results are reported to not always be as good as glossy paper.
I tried this serval times all failures.
I used photo glossy paper with the ink on full. From iron temperatures starting at hot to paper browning hot. All failures.
Have I missed something in treating the copper or is this a hoaks?
I think buddy,,,u r using inkkjet printing rather than laser printing,,,
I like that answer
My iron is set to max temp, but that's an old one, not heating much. Next time I'll build a PCB, I'll measure the exact temp.
What can I use as a substitute for the Window Cleaner? Thank you. :)
And type of degreaser(soappy things).
If you want to go as cheep as you can then let someone do the etching for you. By the time you get all the materials and know-how, you will destroy a dozens of PCBs (or hundreds in your case :). There is a "PCB Etching Service" on ebay that makes PCBs quite cheap so don`t have to bother
if you put paper down on heat plate and apply same pressure, you'll get better result.
@banzie74 glossy magazine paper is torn from the pages of a glossy magazine. I could make a video but I'm not planning to make any new boards in the near future. Anyway, what I wrote really says it all. Almost. You still use water to remove the glossy magazine paper. But it's very thin so it dissolves without a lot of difficulty. You don't need the heavy scrubbing.
@rishikeshsharma1 How then? No point in saying you can get a better result without soaking in boiled water, in much less time without saying how. Otherwise, it's just flaming.
works with a inkjet printer? my can print photos but it not laser, does it work? :(
do you use a normal piece of copper
Thanks. Not necessarily "freshly" printed. The iron will melt down the ink on the paper.
@Hayden3430 I highly doubt it given the complexity. This comes out cleaner than an average person can draw and is less time consuming if you have more than a few tracks or if you have components with 8 or more pins.
and what is using for preparing pcb to transfer? Lot a quescons... Sorry... And answer don;t metter a time!
@Moyo2k inkjets use ink, not toner. It only works with laser printers
ya,,its good,,i tried 3 to 4 methods to make pcb's on large scale but every time i failed,,,As well as glossy papers are concerned,,,they are not producing the same results,,,,this is the bigest issue,,,,then i go towards the yellow butter paper but they are not getting the print very well,,,,although they are far better than the glossy foto paper,,,third,,i used to go for screen printing,,,but the ink usually dried after one or two prints on the pcb,,,,
Show less
REPLY
FYI, the temperature from my iron (the one on the video) is about 180°C. Not toot much I guess, even it is the max. I don't know what would be the optimal temperature, but this is working perfectly for me.
You miss to add pictures of the photo paper (brand, model, etc)
What is the name of photo paper ?
isn't it pain when u put your hand in hot water??? Dont mind if i was wrong... is that really HOT?
what excact type of paper do you recomend? as in the brand?
Can you do this with canvas as well?
Hi there! Really nice video...Very helpful!
Do you, or anybody, knows how to transfer the silkscreen part (top, without copper)?
Thanks!!!
I think silk screen part can be done by screen printing method,,,,,it is some bit complex process i think,,,
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if you mean office inkjet paper, nope, it would stick to the paper but wont transfer to pcb.
you can use magazines man, or try anything glossy
I used glossy foto paper but it doent work,,,even i applied 30min iron with pressure,,,
@xato909 no. You MUST use a laser printer
I finaly transfer looking your video and thak you very much on this. But i finishd with HYDROCHLORIC ACID and HYDROGEN 6%. I do useful pcb and nice together. I am satisfied! :)
I suggest laser photo paper - not inkjet photo paper. The plastic coating on the inkjet paper has a low melting point and I've had nothing but trouble trying to use it.
buddy,,,,i dont know much about the laser printing paperor inkjet paper,,,but once i tried it works,,,then on the other try it doesnt,,,,although i pressed it with the iron for 30mins,,,
@Joeshitsu sure, but if you do that you wait a week or more, if you fabricate it yourself you're looking at an hour's work
Pro-Tip for all here, Iron over PCB over Paper, over Table.
1000x cleaner peel, dip and peel, painless.
pcb express or eagle cad or any pcb drafting sofware you may have known till the time you get back here
Which photo paper it is Gsm ?
does this need to be printed from a laser printer or can i just use laser photo paper and print from an inkjet printer? just a little curious thanks
I don't think it would work with inkjet, I've searched for this, found nothing. This is because laser toner contains plastic, which actually results in PCB tracks.
I've seen where he first cleaned the board to remove the oxidation layer with a final stripping pad, and then used "isopropanol 99%" after that it just like this process.
look for "DIY Printed circuit board"
toner contains plastic, and cover the copper so etchant can't access it.
@GmodSkylines yeah it's really old, only 600DPI, my results are much better with gloss photo paper :)
cant you just order these from china?
Sir Loon is this safe for my laser printer?
Owen Chase Don't preheat the board, there is no need . Use a very high gloss paper, not photo paper. No it wont hard your printer. set your iron to medium heat and iron gently with the tip of the iron. throw the board into warm water and wait about 10 min. this method has worked for me for years.
ventureelect if I can't use photo paper what one would I use?
Xerox harlequin coated paper 80 lb. , this is a very high gloss paper that falls apart very nicely in warm water. Use windex and a cloth to remove the residual white paper after soaking board in water.
ventureelect using foil is also a good alternative which is easy to remove and you dont have the problem which you get with paper
+Matze Strawberrymaker Your printer will explode
Where can I buy the copper plate from
where can I get the copper plated board
i know right?
can not use a ink jet printer only
Laser-Jet Printers will work the paper you used will work but wax paper works good and is cheep
nice video.... thakns for it!
LOL you need more window cleaner!
Nice vid.
Great video
De ce nu sint traduse in limba romana?
Thank you.
6. Now if someone could find an easy way to make the holes.
might have used some time lapse-capable camera... :) but thumbs-up, anyway! левша какой-то...
Ink???
You should be using a laser printer not ink-jet
search youtube for "Building a super spy bug transmitter" guy called dazaro3 uses plain old used magazine paper. only heats it for 45 secs. search google "Make PCBs at home with magazine paper and your laser printer" - will be listed first.its all there in black and white:)
god I hate studying , why I'm here ?
cause you fucked
Its ok, I was being a fool with an inkjet.
it is 9 & 31 sec not 10 minutes
god bless u :D
He has audio. ! Why use text when you can speak. ?
Mike lynn Maybe his spoken English is not so good.
@6:20 ,, the part i hate the most
An improved method.
th-cam.com/video/PB7N9uIYW4A/w-d-xo.html
I am just using less characters and not adding useless words like "DUMP FUCK"
^ok
Ive tried this a hundred times. The paper WILL NOT stick to the copperclad! WTF?!?!
I'm using Staples Photo Basic Gloss and a very hot iron (turns paper brown)