I’m absolutely loving your shameless reactions, i get so excited whenever they pop up. For the Frank thing in this episode, the implication i believe, is that Frank is drugged out of his mind and can’t move and doesn’t consent
Him and Debbie would still be half siblings and cousins. It makes sense that they look alike even if they aren't full siblings. In the first episode Fiona comments that Frank may dislike Ian more than the others cause he looks the most like Monica.
i’m so glad you watching this. unfortunately my fave characters mickey gets like the least screen time cause he wasn’t supposed to be a main character until fans started to love him
My main issue with Mickey in the early seasons isn't actually how little screen time he gets. Warning cause once you notice it may drive you nuts, but in early seasons, they were constantly forgetting to color his eyebrows. The actor is natural blonde, and so has pale eyebrows. Sometimes, they would remember to pencil them in to match the dark hair the characters meant to have butmthey didnt have a consistent shape, and other times, they just forgot entirely.
I think my opinion on the last scene might be unpopular but: frank did nothing wrong. cuz literally HE DID NOTHING. He was drunk and drugged. The law will think what it'll think, but Karen literally r4ped Frank. I hate Karen so much.
You're correct. Frank is still a drunk, shameless, deadbeat predator that wouldn't mind in this scenario. But that doesn't make Karens actions any less messed up.
I don't think your opinion is unpopular at all I fuckin hate Frank but he was barely conscious and Karen literally raped him I fuckin despise Karen bro
I’m really glad you still like the Jimmy/Steve & Fiona relationship at this point. It’s one of my favorites in the show and a lot of people don’t like it.
When the brother and his wife leave the room you can here them arguing in the background of Ian and Lips conversation, she asks something like why does he look just like (name I can’t remember) which implies that Ian looks a lot like their son. She probably always suspected something happened between him and Monica and seeing ian was confirmation enough for her. I have complicated feelings about how everyone reacts to the Tony thing. Yes Tony is being weirdly possessive and it’s clear his motivations aren’t good, but they don’t honestly change the outcome all that much. Tony is a cop, his partner figured out a car they had recently seen was reported stolen so they know the person driving it likely stole it. They should’ve arrested Steve right there. Tony wanted to give Fiona a heads up that Steve was going to be arrested because he assumed she wouldn’t know Steve was a car thief. That in itself isn’t a bad thing to do. The fact that he hopes by telling her she’ll want to be with him instead is not good. The ultimatum he gives Steve is really more of a heads up, Tony was able to hold his partner off temporarily but his partner knows Steve is a car thief if they keep seeing him around he will be arrested. Yeah Tony wants him to leave so he’s being selfish but it amounts to the same thing any way Steve gets arrested or he goes on the run. Lip and Ian getting arrested isn’t Tony’s fault either, cops all got that license plate as a stolen vehicle, he assumed it was Steve but if a cop recognizes a stolen car they have to pull it over. I understand being annoyed at Tony’s possessive attitude, but literally non of what happens here is his fault and I feel like people act like Tony was out here gunning for Steve trying to ruin his life when literally everything that goes wrong is Steve’s fault.
I really appreciated you calling out the bull with Frank getting disability and workmens comp on the show. They seriously did a disservice with how they handled such things with Frank and Sheela on the show. Lots of misinformation and renforcing stereotypes. No way would Frank be able to keep disability let alone get it as he wouldnt put in the work necessary to fill out the paperwork and such to get it done. He'd probably get drunk, forget he had an appointment, miss it, and loose it all. And Sheela, even actually having a disability and proof of it, wont have the amount of money she is shown to have. Especially as being married to Eddie and having then house and car would mean she isnt eligible for a lot. I know so many people on disability constantly dealing with misconception about them leeching from the government with people thinking they get so much with no oversight or people asusming they are faking. Portrayals like on this show dont help. And its a real shame as sticking to the truth would have given them plenty of things that could make drama and plot without forcing in anything new in. Reality can be crazy and dramatic enough.
@@Darkrose517I beleive Lip is confirmed 16 either because his age is verified or because he and Ian are meant to be Irish twins so like 9 to 10 months apart, and Ian is declared definitively 15. Ian's in the 10th grade. Lip and Karen are in the 11th. I cant recall if Karen's age is ever confirmed however. Its possible because of how their brithdays fall she is a year older than Lip but still in the same grade or was held back a year at some point and is older because of that. Held back a year might make sense for how much she wanted someone there for teacher night to see her doing well even though she isnt shown to care overly much about school. Could be back when she could leave the house Sheila only got to attend meetings from when Karen was struggling in school. But the truth of it is Shameless writers are a but notorious for messing up the timelines, established backstories, facts, and so on including ages. A big deal is made on occasion about how Kev could get in trouble serving to minors while ignoring Fiona's only supposed to be 19 (at least by the timeline of season 1) so its not legal to serve her either. The inconsistencies always drove me nuts so I spent too much time trying to make sense of them and sort it out. Anyway, back to Karen but with spoilers. . . . In order for her to marry like she does in season 2 she would either have to be 18 or have parental consent. I always just assumed Sheila gave it to her since she was a big fan of Jody's but it could be Karen was already 18. Given she then ends up leaving at the end of season 2 and no one thinks to consider her a run away or wonder how she is going to get by I always figured she turned 18 while pregnant.
I hate Karen so much. Her whole storyline just is so unimportant to me and I couldn't give a shit about it. Lip also pisses me off in the next few episodes going back to Karen and stuff. Love your reactions👍
Spoilery talk ahead for the character. . . . I liked her well enough right up until the end of this episode and then at the finale their were some moments where I had hope they would redeem the character and actually do something intresting with her. Sadly, season two did not do. I didnt even hate her. I just didnt like the storylines given and wanted the time spent on someone else. Then 3 came and just... jesus.
I'm just getting started with shameless and up until this episode i really liked her... Not because of HER necessarily but because of her relationship with sheila
I think they intended us to feel torn about her. But, spoiler . . . Most ended up hating her so I think they just leaned into that later, and once you know what the character does in later seasons it makes sympathy for her at this point in a rewatch a lot harder. Its actually a pittle fucked up that people hate Karen and have no pity for her yet will have all the sympathy and love for Sheila who does some equally really messed up stuff and has some responsibility for a lot of what Karen ends up doing.
@@xXSinForLifeXx so, so many spoilers. 1. Sheila literally rapes Frank in epsiode two, just hours after meeting him. She then uses things she knows he will want to convince him entice him stay with her in a relationship where she is then shown to regularly do things in bed he doesnt want and she knows he doesnt want, will leverage and trade too continue getting what she wants, and does all this with Karen, her child who is not yet 18 and she is responsible for, in the house and having an idea what is going on. She is regularly setting an example that raping, using, and abusing Frank and men in general really is fine as we are shown she did such behavikr with her husband for likely years before this for Karen to be exposed to. And for anyone doubting that Sheila just thinks its fun or that zhe thinks Frank staying means he likes it, she confesses in the show that she gets off on doing sexual things to men they dont want. She actively works to drive someone past their set boundries because its what she wants despite knowing he's a sex addict. 2. Despite knowing nothing about Frank she moves him into the house where her underage daughter lives without talking with the daughter about it ahead of time. 3. Despite knowing from the start that Frank is a single father to 6 children she happily has him move in with her, rejoices in hi spending the bulk of his time there, and never shows any concern about the burden this places on Fiona. And again for anyone looking to make excuses about her like her thinking Frank's still helping out, when Monica comes she describes the kids as living at Fiona's which rather clearly shows she's mentally disconected Frank fro that house or as the one raising them. When Frank gets sober and actually apends time with his family she isnt happy for them while being upset for herself, she is only upset for herself and while taking support from her daughter isnt inherently wrong, the fact that Karen is so often having to play the role of support and taking on more a role of friend than child is. 4. Sheila regularly chooses to simply not question things. She isnt an ignorant or unintelligent woman so that ignorance is a choose. She is avoiding stressors and pushing but as a parent she sort of needs to do that. So much about Karen and Frank is ignored not because they are hiding it well but because Sheila doesnt want to know. Including not looking into how to properly support her daughter after she comes out as a sex addict and joins sex addicts anonymous. 5. Major spoilers for seasons two and three but everything with Jody is fucked up. That she lets her daughter who is either 17 or 18 at the time date a man in his late 40s and then happily supports the marriage. That she then sleeps with him. What she ends up doing as his partner. Then letting him take Karen and the baby despite Karen having left him so clearly shown when herself to not want to be his wife and being in no state to be consenting to returning to a relationsip with him. 6. Again major spoilers. This time for season 3. She literally kills someone and wants to do it again! She chooses to think of it as freeing them and offering a service through hospice care but thats what she is doing. And given what we are told and shown about her sexual prefrences she is probably very much empowered by it because its an act of control 7. She ignores the fact that Karen has every right to give up her baby, ignores Karen is clearly not okay, ignores all her own failings as a mother and just gives up on her to start again. And maybe I could view it differently if not for everything we are shown with her and Liam and her going off her birth control in the hope of Frank getting her pregnant to have another baby despite not being in a palce to parent the kid she already has at the time. There is also her future behavior with wanting to adopt a another family of kids without really questioning if she can provide, marrying a dying Frank in the hope of getting custody, not getting custody so latching on to keeping Frank as a husband then offically being stepmom to Franks kids only to loose intrest and then abandon them with no goodbye. Also, in season 3 despite having an infiant in the house who she chose to take on the responsibility of mothering, she lets Frank back into the house not just to live but Nanny. And at this point there can be no arguement that she knows the kind of man he is and she chooses to entrust him with that child. And this is after finding out Frank got Liam kidnapped. Either that or back to 4 where Frank admitted he messed up which lead to all his kids breaking in and demanding to know where Liam is then leaving in the night with her daughter and she never pushed for answers. I think therenis actually more than this but Imthink that covers the worse. As for comparing her to Karen, at least as far as we know Karen never killed anyone.
May be spoilers!!! but when the show was still airing they were going to make fieona gay but scrapped if when the actor wanted to leave. which is sad cause of just how fruit she was.
More spoilers here as well. . . I never heard that before. Im curious though what they had in mind. Personally, I would have really loved if we saw Bi or Pan Fionna as it works with what we see here, and given her relationship with Steve and others mentioned, I think she is attracted to guys. Unfortunately, given this was over a decade ago, what we saw with them handling other queer women on the show even years later, and the trend of writers insisting if a female character become intrested in a women they will suddenly loose the ability tombe attracted to a guy and are now a lesbian with no questioning of that (and doing it the oppisite way with guys) I cant see them having handled Fiona being queer well. It could have been really fun though to later have her and Tony commiserating over both having realized they weren't heterosexual as adults. P.S. Thank you for the spoiler alert and putting it down. So many people are just throwing them about casually in the comments.
I actually had a little hope for what they would do with her in the early episodes, but where they ended up taking the character was such a waste. The fact that so many dislike her and cant even enjoy her storyline while disliking the character is proof of that.
for those asking for Gap, IT'S UP NEXT :)
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I’m absolutely loving your shameless reactions, i get so excited whenever they pop up. For the Frank thing in this episode, the implication i believe, is that Frank is drugged out of his mind and can’t move and doesn’t consent
And he literally said "no" multiple times
Nothing can excuse what Karen did. Never liked her but when I saw this for the first time I knew I wouldn't change my mind. Thank you for the video
Him and Debbie would still be half siblings and cousins. It makes sense that they look alike even if they aren't full siblings. In the first episode Fiona comments that Frank may dislike Ian more than the others cause he looks the most like Monica.
Then they cast an actress that really didnt look like him. Its always bugged me.
@@krose6451yeah, but the guy who is possibly his dad and Franks brother looked so much like him
i’m so glad you watching this. unfortunately my fave characters mickey gets like the least screen time cause he wasn’t supposed to be a main character until fans started to love him
Same it sucks how little screen time he has but when we do see him he does such an amazing job in the role.
My main issue with Mickey in the early seasons isn't actually how little screen time he gets. Warning cause once you notice it may drive you nuts, but in early seasons, they were constantly forgetting to color his eyebrows. The actor is natural blonde, and so has pale eyebrows. Sometimes, they would remember to pencil them in to match the dark hair the characters meant to have butmthey didnt have a consistent shape, and other times, they just forgot entirely.
I think my opinion on the last scene might be unpopular but: frank did nothing wrong. cuz literally HE DID NOTHING. He was drunk and drugged. The law will think what it'll think, but Karen literally r4ped Frank. I hate Karen so much.
It shouldn't be unpopular because he was literally raped.
You're correct. Frank is still a drunk, shameless, deadbeat predator that wouldn't mind in this scenario.
But that doesn't make Karens actions any less messed up.
i also agree he was also saying no
I don't think your opinion is unpopular at all I fuckin hate Frank but he was barely conscious and Karen literally raped him I fuckin despise Karen bro
Agreed
Ian’s rxn to the whole situation was so realistic. Ppl are afraid of the unfamiliar, even if it’s good for them
I hope you'll watch shameless more often.. i enjoy these reactions sm 🥺
I’m really glad you still like the Jimmy/Steve & Fiona relationship at this point. It’s one of my favorites in the show and a lot of people don’t like it.
Same it’s definitely my favorite relationship Fiona has been in.
I loved it at first until JImmy got weird like in the later seasons. That's all I'm gonna say about that. Don't wanna be a spoiler.
yesss I loveee the shameless reactions
When the brother and his wife leave the room you can here them arguing in the background of Ian and Lips conversation, she asks something like why does he look just like (name I can’t remember) which implies that Ian looks a lot like their son. She probably always suspected something happened between him and Monica and seeing ian was confirmation enough for her.
I have complicated feelings about how everyone reacts to the Tony thing. Yes Tony is being weirdly possessive and it’s clear his motivations aren’t good, but they don’t honestly change the outcome all that much. Tony is a cop, his partner figured out a car they had recently seen was reported stolen so they know the person driving it likely stole it. They should’ve arrested Steve right there. Tony wanted to give Fiona a heads up that Steve was going to be arrested because he assumed she wouldn’t know Steve was a car thief. That in itself isn’t a bad thing to do. The fact that he hopes by telling her she’ll want to be with him instead is not good. The ultimatum he gives Steve is really more of a heads up, Tony was able to hold his partner off temporarily but his partner knows Steve is a car thief if they keep seeing him around he will be arrested. Yeah Tony wants him to leave so he’s being selfish but it amounts to the same thing any way Steve gets arrested or he goes on the run. Lip and Ian getting arrested isn’t Tony’s fault either, cops all got that license plate as a stolen vehicle, he assumed it was Steve but if a cop recognizes a stolen car they have to pull it over.
I understand being annoyed at Tony’s possessive attitude, but literally non of what happens here is his fault and I feel like people act like Tony was out here gunning for Steve trying to ruin his life when literally everything that goes wrong is Steve’s fault.
police brutality? hes a complete awful cop. beats up a guy just cause he can't get the girl
I think alot of it just comes to people liking Steve and/or the ship more. Such things pretty notoriously blind fans into reading things differently.
I mean here, Frank, pretty much got raped. He wasn't clear of mind at all.
Oh boy, I’ve been waiting for this reaction😅
I really appreciated you calling out the bull with Frank getting disability and workmens comp on the show. They seriously did a disservice with how they handled such things with Frank and Sheela on the show. Lots of misinformation and renforcing stereotypes. No way would Frank be able to keep disability let alone get it as he wouldnt put in the work necessary to fill out the paperwork and such to get it done. He'd probably get drunk, forget he had an appointment, miss it, and loose it all. And Sheela, even actually having a disability and proof of it, wont have the amount of money she is shown to have. Especially as being married to Eddie and having then house and car would mean she isnt eligible for a lot. I know so many people on disability constantly dealing with misconception about them leeching from the government with people thinking they get so much with no oversight or people asusming they are faking. Portrayals like on this show dont help. And its a real shame as sticking to the truth would have given them plenty of things that could make drama and plot without forcing in anything new in. Reality can be crazy and dramatic enough.
aaah i love your reactions
I love your shameless reactions sm but it’s killing me how long we have to wait lmao
i’m sorry! I have an autoimmune disease and i’m going through a flare up right now. I physically couldn’t get out of bed for over a week
i’m super surprised by these comments because yes karen is a terrible person but are we really just ignoring everything that’s happened to her …?
The age of consent in Chicago is 17, but Karen was much younger so yeah, she’s lashing out big time
im pretty sure karen was 17?? she wasn't that young
@@acailoves I think her and Lip are 16 in Season 1
@@Darkrose517 you're right.
@@Darkrose517I thought they were 17 cause Ian was 15
@@Darkrose517I beleive Lip is confirmed 16 either because his age is verified or because he and Ian are meant to be Irish twins so like 9 to 10 months apart, and Ian is declared definitively 15. Ian's in the 10th grade. Lip and Karen are in the 11th. I cant recall if Karen's age is ever confirmed however. Its possible because of how their brithdays fall she is a year older than Lip but still in the same grade or was held back a year at some point and is older because of that. Held back a year might make sense for how much she wanted someone there for teacher night to see her doing well even though she isnt shown to care overly much about school. Could be back when she could leave the house Sheila only got to attend meetings from when Karen was struggling in school.
But the truth of it is Shameless writers are a but notorious for messing up the timelines, established backstories, facts, and so on including ages. A big deal is made on occasion about how Kev could get in trouble serving to minors while ignoring Fiona's only supposed to be 19 (at least by the timeline of season 1) so its not legal to serve her either. The inconsistencies always drove me nuts so I spent too much time trying to make sense of them and sort it out. Anyway, back to Karen but with spoilers.
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In order for her to marry like she does in season 2 she would either have to be 18 or have parental consent. I always just assumed Sheila gave it to her since she was a big fan of Jody's but it could be Karen was already 18. Given she then ends up leaving at the end of season 2 and no one thinks to consider her a run away or wonder how she is going to get by I always figured she turned 18 while pregnant.
SPOILERS DO NOT READ KY NICOLE
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she gone? I can’t wait to see her reaction to gangster Carl
I saw this video on my recommended while I was watching this episode
Jimmy-Steve 😶
I hate Karen so much. Her whole storyline just is so unimportant to me and I couldn't give a shit about it. Lip also pisses me off in the next few episodes going back to Karen and stuff. Love your reactions👍
Spoilery talk ahead for the character.
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I liked her well enough right up until the end of this episode and then at the finale their were some moments where I had hope they would redeem the character and actually do something intresting with her. Sadly, season two did not do. I didnt even hate her. I just didnt like the storylines given and wanted the time spent on someone else. Then 3 came and just... jesus.
I'm just getting started with shameless and up until this episode i really liked her...
Not because of HER necessarily but because of her relationship with sheila
I feel like you sympathise with Karen too much lol pretty sure we are meant to hate her. But I guess people have different opinions.
I just feel bad because of the original issue with her Dad! but she is definitely not one of my favorite people, that’s for sure.
I think they intended us to feel torn about her. But, spoiler
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Most ended up hating her so I think they just leaned into that later, and once you know what the character does in later seasons it makes sympathy for her at this point in a rewatch a lot harder. Its actually a pittle fucked up that people hate Karen and have no pity for her yet will have all the sympathy and love for Sheila who does some equally really messed up stuff and has some responsibility for a lot of what Karen ends up doing.
@krose6451 Wait what did Sheila do wrong? Karen does way worse shit.
@@xXSinForLifeXx so, so many spoilers. 1. Sheila literally rapes Frank in epsiode two, just hours after meeting him. She then uses things she knows he will want to convince him entice him stay with her in a relationship where she is then shown to regularly do things in bed he doesnt want and she knows he doesnt want, will leverage and trade too continue getting what she wants, and does all this with Karen, her child who is not yet 18 and she is responsible for, in the house and having an idea what is going on. She is regularly setting an example that raping, using, and abusing Frank and men in general really is fine as we are shown she did such behavikr with her husband for likely years before this for Karen to be exposed to. And for anyone doubting that Sheila just thinks its fun or that zhe thinks Frank staying means he likes it, she confesses in the show that she gets off on doing sexual things to men they dont want. She actively works to drive someone past their set boundries because its what she wants despite knowing he's a sex addict.
2. Despite knowing nothing about Frank she moves him into the house where her underage daughter lives without talking with the daughter about it ahead of time.
3. Despite knowing from the start that Frank is a single father to 6 children she happily has him move in with her, rejoices in hi spending the bulk of his time there, and never shows any concern about the burden this places on Fiona. And again for anyone looking to make excuses about her like her thinking Frank's still helping out, when Monica comes she describes the kids as living at Fiona's which rather clearly shows she's mentally disconected Frank fro that house or as the one raising them. When Frank gets sober and actually apends time with his family she isnt happy for them while being upset for herself, she is only upset for herself and while taking support from her daughter isnt inherently wrong, the fact that Karen is so often having to play the role of support and taking on more a role of friend than child is.
4. Sheila regularly chooses to simply not question things. She isnt an ignorant or unintelligent woman so that ignorance is a choose. She is avoiding stressors and pushing but as a parent she sort of needs to do that. So much about Karen and Frank is ignored not because they are hiding it well but because Sheila doesnt want to know. Including not looking into how to properly support her daughter after she comes out as a sex addict and joins sex addicts anonymous.
5. Major spoilers for seasons two and three but everything with Jody is fucked up. That she lets her daughter who is either 17 or 18 at the time date a man in his late 40s and then happily supports the marriage. That she then sleeps with him. What she ends up doing as his partner. Then letting him take Karen and the baby despite Karen having left him so clearly shown when herself to not want to be his wife and being in no state to be consenting to returning to a relationsip with him.
6. Again major spoilers. This time for season 3. She literally kills someone and wants to do it again! She chooses to think of it as freeing them and offering a service through hospice care but thats what she is doing. And given what we are told and shown about her sexual prefrences she is probably very much empowered by it because its an act of control
7. She ignores the fact that Karen has every right to give up her baby, ignores Karen is clearly not okay, ignores all her own failings as a mother and just gives up on her to start again. And maybe I could view it differently if not for everything we are shown with her and Liam and her going off her birth control in the hope of Frank getting her pregnant to have another baby despite not being in a palce to parent the kid she already has at the time. There is also her future behavior with wanting to adopt a another family of kids without really questioning if she can provide, marrying a dying Frank in the hope of getting custody, not getting custody so latching on to keeping Frank as a husband then offically being stepmom to Franks kids only to loose intrest and then abandon them with no goodbye. Also, in season 3 despite having an infiant in the house who she chose to take on the responsibility of mothering, she lets Frank back into the house not just to live but Nanny. And at this point there can be no arguement that she knows the kind of man he is and she chooses to entrust him with that child. And this is after finding out Frank got Liam kidnapped. Either that or back to 4 where Frank admitted he messed up which lead to all his kids breaking in and demanding to know where Liam is then leaving in the night with her daughter and she never pushed for answers.
I think therenis actually more than this but Imthink that covers the worse. As for comparing her to Karen, at least as far as we know Karen never killed anyone.
😢Karen is so bad
When is the next reaction ❤️
May be spoilers!!!
but when the show was still airing they were going to make fieona gay but scrapped if when the actor wanted to leave. which is sad cause of just how fruit she was.
More spoilers here as well.
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I never heard that before. Im curious though what they had in mind. Personally, I would have really loved if we saw Bi or Pan Fionna as it works with what we see here, and given her relationship with Steve and others mentioned, I think she is attracted to guys. Unfortunately, given this was over a decade ago, what we saw with them handling other queer women on the show even years later, and the trend of writers insisting if a female character become intrested in a women they will suddenly loose the ability tombe attracted to a guy and are now a lesbian with no questioning of that (and doing it the oppisite way with guys) I cant see them having handled Fiona being queer well. It could have been really fun though to later have her and Tony commiserating over both having realized they weren't heterosexual as adults.
P.S. Thank you for the spoiler alert and putting it down. So many people are just throwing them about casually in the comments.
Karen is an awful character.
I actually had a little hope for what they would do with her in the early episodes, but where they ended up taking the character was such a waste. The fact that so many dislike her and cant even enjoy her storyline while disliking the character is proof of that.