Think I’ve already commented, but your poetic descriptions of the cards and play style makes my day. As a vorthos player I def dive into the magic of magic.
I used your video as a guide (couldn't get my hands on every card) with a TCGPlayer guide. The end product is actually pretty good. It rarely has bad opening hands and is able to consistently mill and take stuff. Thank you for the video!
I just finished building my own deck like this, didn't have the pre con so i had to track down a lot of those cards too, I took it a more horror based deck and leaned more into the mill that way, its great to see how we diverged and leaned into so many of the same cards!
I just bought this deck and watch many other guide to modify it. Until now, nobody seem to offer something that interest me, but your take seem the most fun. So I wish to thank you for the tips and idea and hope to see more of your content.
Friend got me this deck last year, I think, and I've just started to really play with it. While Uchuulon can be a pain, he's an absolute beast if you can get him going. Found out in a friendly game that what makes Uchuulon a powerhouse is when you couple him with the copy creature enchantment, Endless Evil, that comes in the deck. You'll essentially get x2 Uchuulons, and then next turn you get a x2 with the first Original Uchuulon + 2 more with your token guys, so it just makes more and more critters. The Kicker, they feed off themselves since they're considered crabs/horrors, giving each other +1/+1. The combo is devastating, but it does take time to setup properly.
Great changes! But one disagreement I have is removing Everflowing Chalice. As that forms an infinite mana combo with Sol Ring and Hullbreaker Horror! Tap Sol Ring > cast Everflowing Chalice for 0 > Hullbreaker Horror triggers > Return SR back to your hand > With 2 floating mana, recast SR > HH triggers > Return EC to your hand > Repeat for infinite colorless mana.
Very interesting, I completely missed that interaction! I don't think the build has any ways to put that infinite colorless mana to use, but we may be able to snatch one from an opponents so maybe it is worth leaving in.... Good suggestion!
@@GrazzetMTG yeah play testing it for me online is a little awkward because stealing stuff from your opponent is the secret weapon I can’t account for.
Here is the list for the mass entry, not including the final upgrades at the end of this video! I look forward to these upgrades myself! 1 Frightcrawler 1 Boneshard Slasher 1 Changeling Outcast 1 Faceless Devourer 1 Rathi Intimidator 1 Wasp of the Bitter End 1 Possessed Aven 1 Stitchwing Skaab 1 Arvinox, the Mind Flail 1 shadow kin 1 Dimir Doppelganger 1 Body Double 1 Lazav, Dimir Mastermind 1 Rakshasa Debaser 1 Wrexial, the Risen Deep 1 Geth, Lord of the Vault 1 Burnished Hart 1 drown in dreams 1 Grisly Spectacle 1 pilfered plans 1 Life's Finale 1 court of cunning 1 Patient Rebuilding 1 Reconnaissance Mission 1 Wayfarer's Bauble 1 Fellwar Stone 1 Charcoal Diamond 1 Sky Diamond 1 Swiftfoot Boots 1 Whispersilk Cloak 1 Bident of Thassa 1 Strionic Resonator 1 Shipwreck Marsh 1 Castle Locthwain 1 Bonders' Enclave
I'm new to MTG, longtime yugioh player here. Mind Flayaaayrs is my first taste of magic. After playing a few games with my buddies I've seen how the strengths of this deck just pop off when things go right. However I noticed how it can significantly slow down with some of the creatures that just don't mesh well. I'd really like to upgrade this deck. Thank you!!!
Maskwood Nexus would be hilarious in this build to turn the creatures we steal from our opponents into horrors to mill them even faster, but Reflections of Litjata I found to be a bit too slow in this build since the pool of horrors we want extra copies of is small (as most of our horrors are small evasive ones that are not really worth doubling up on).
I wouldn’t cut all those sweet horrors and put in a bunch of non-horror creatures just because they help with the mill plan. If you want to build Wrexil the Risen Deep, just build Wrexil the Risen Deep. A tribal-agnostic deck that isn’t really horror tribal is not what I personally would want to do with Captain N’gathrod. There’s like 4 better commanders to do that, some of whom you put in your list. The addition of some of the small evasive horrors is smart, though.
Fair - the initial testing for this build was nearly all horrors but, while it did okay, it ultimately felt a bit underwhelming. We already have a dictated horror commander with Umbris, Fear Manifest, who is incentivized to run horror payoffs as they tend to help it grow in size as well and while Captain N’gathrod can certainly be build as a horror commander, he ultimately uses them more as a means to an end (that end being mill) than as the key players (since we can build Captain N’gathrod without a single horror and he would still work) . That doesn't mean that running him as a pure horror tribal commander is not possible or effective by any means though, so if you feel like the running him as a source of evasion and mill for your horrors with the occasional reanimation, I can see that working just fine as well.
Yes, this is definitely the horror tribal deck Umbris has been waiting to command lol. I think as a sub-theme, I would double down on confiscating opponents stuff and not just from graveyards. Perhaps something similar to what my Xanathar deck was built like. 🧠
Fair, but I figured since our commander is already in on graveyard focused theft we may as well lean into it instead of diversifying into other forms of pillaging (since there are other commanders that are better that the Captain when it comes to that). Still, if you want to diversify you thieving, there is certainly no shame in doing so!
Great vid I just got into MTG with this deck, the last few cards you had as extra upgrades what would you swap them for? And do we need all 3 of the necromancy spells? Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it! You may not need all 3 necromancy spells (since our commander will be doing a lot of reanimation for us) but they do let us get extra bodies on board, so its really dependent on personal preference. Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead. Possessed Aven for Nautiloid Ship would be good since we'll likely get mote value out of Nautiloid Ship for it graveyard hate and on damage reanimation than from its predecessor. Extract from Darkness, Memory Plunder, & From the Catacombs for Reanimate, Animate dead, & Necromancy would be solid choices since their upgrades are cheaper to cast. Arvinox, the Mind Flail can also be swapped out for Toxrill, the Corrosive instead if we'd rather have the removal and draw. Life's Finale can be exchanged for Thing in the Ice - since its a tribal wipe that doesn't affect our horrors. And Stitchwing Skaab can be cut for Phyrexian Obliterator since players will be unwilling to lock it anyway since they don't want to lose permanents.
That he does! If we were running tutors in the build and focused more on combo kills I would certainly recommend him. As is though, since we have no reliable way to get to him and Mindcrank, he's not as good IMO - but could still be slotted in as per preference. Thanks for the suggestion!
I know this video was posted a while ago, but wanted to comment on the "seemingly random inclusion of Everflowing Chalice". Someone on Reddit posted that the deck includes at least two infinite mana combos, and both rely on Sol Ring and Everflowing Chalice. I'm weighing whether I want to just keep these four decks as built, assuming they were built balanced by WotC or to start dropping in consistent upgrades between decks...
The combo is Hullbreaker Horror + Sol Ring + Eveflowing Chalice - which does generate infinite colorless mana but has no good mana sinks to pump it into or ways to tutor for the pieces, which is why I commented it was odd since the deck has no real way of taking advantage of it (apart from maybe dumping our entire hand but that doesn't usually win us the game on the spot, which is what infinite mana is used for). Hope that helps explain my comment!
I haven't bpught the precon yet but I was wondering does this deck run into the issue of enemies removing the commander and completely stunting the deck?
Great analysis! I love your videos. One quick question: I have Elder Brain and am considering putting it in as you mentioned. What do you think I should cut?
Glad you've been enjoying the builds! I would say that if you want to add in Elder Brain, cutting Rakshasa Debaser or Wrexial, the Risen Deep - since it won't increase the curve that much and adds an extra horror in to replace a non-horror. Hope that helps!
Man I hope you don't get overwhelmed by all this commander stuff. I guessing your probably not going to touch the choose a background legends right? Stay strong Grazzet.
Yeah, WotC just keeps rolling out the product don't they? I may have a poll for all 4 of the background commanders from the precons and do at least 1, but we'll just have to see!
What a horror-able deck tech!🤣🤣🤣 😘 But seriously this looks pretty sweet and I think that Bond of Insight would be decent too Which background would you pair with Renari, Merchant of Marvels to get the most of an artifact themed deck?
Glad you enjoyed it and the pun is appreciated! Bond of Insight would indeed make of a solid addition to get us some of our more powerful non-creature spells to be used again while enabling our commander reanimation - good suggestion! Acolyte of Bahamut seems like it would be the most useful when paired with Renari, Merchant of Marvels to get that minus discount on every single turn, though our pool of dragons will be smaller without access to red.
Good upgrade guide, definitely focusing in on the central gameplan a bit more. Have any general advice as far building from precons? In my case I have that one zombie precon with wilhelt and want to transition over to Nevinyrral. For some reason it's proving harder for me than just building from the ground up...
Glad you enjoyed the build! Building up a precon is certainly harder than it seems, I lesson I learned when I started doing these upgrade builds. What tends to work for me is figuring our what the commanders unique strengths are, that no other commander can do, and try to build around that. In this case, free graveyard reanimation based on mill and turning horrors into mill sources to enable that. From there, it is a matter of looking to see what cards work with this playstyle, which do but are a bit clucky, and which ones don't work at all - gradually replacing them until the deck "feels good" to play. Hope that helps!
Love the ideas but a bit off base for some, do yourself a huge favor, keep the chupacabra, removal is super nice with an added bonus of a potential horror is just impossible to skip out on
I like Ravenous Chupacabra, I really do, but it always fell short in testing in this build. Sure its removal and its a horror, but its small stat block and only evasion being our commanders menace makes it very difficult to get it in for damage (since we took our a lot of the horror matters payoffs to focus more on enemy graveyard value). In a build that can either more easily grow its stats, flicker it, or reanimate it I can see it doing work, but in the build as is it just felt a bit meh. But meh is certainly not bad, so if you want to run it just as a removal source with occasional upside if it can get in for cheecky damage, then by all means go for it.
Its not a bad include by any means, but I personally prefer a larger quantity of evasive horrors at that mana point to more reliable set up our commander, which is why it got the axe.
I tried it, honestly its VERY meta dependent. If you're doing well, and up against a bunch of creature heavy decks (so 1/3 cards is a creature ish when you mill) then it gets decently big. If you're doing poorly, or the decks you are up against are not creature heavy then it does very poorly. In my case I also swapped it out wanting either some more utility from a creature, or a larger reliable threat. Just creating a (maybe) big body with no natural evasion isn't that great. Definitely a card that worked better on paper, than it did in person.
Thank you for the deck tech! Newbie here, a buddy of mine runs blightsteel colossus in his daretti deck. Pretty busted. I was wondering if you can snatch Blightsteel colossus with N'ghatrod since it says reveal and shuffle into the library if it's put into the graveyard.
Glad you enjoyed the build! Sadly, you will not be able to reanimate Blightsteel with N'ghatrod since its a replacement effect - because it says instead it never actually hits the graveyard and therefore can not be reanimated/copied/cloned from the bin. Hope that helps!
Hi, great video. I appreciate description of every card. I just wonder, which card would you swap for "Elder brain", "Reanimate" and "Animate dead" if you want them in deck?
Glad you enjoyed it! I would say swapping out Extract from Darkness and Memory Plunder (or possibly From the Catacombs) for Reanimate and Animate dead would be solid choices since their upgrades are cheaper to cast and Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead (since Elder Brain is also technically card advantage for us and still mills thanls to our commander). Hope that helps and sorry for the later response!
Great video and really useful tips for upgrading the deck! I'm really enjoying your vids even the ones from decks I would never build, so you have a new subscriber. One question: Would it be worth including enchantments like "Dauthi embrace" or "Intimidation" to help make creatures harder to block? What do you think? Thanks and keep up the good work, comrade commander :D
For some reason in my play group they really hate mill even more so than land destruction and when I play with this deck it is never able to hit the battlefield, they play Sephris of the Hidden ways, Urza and a pirate tribal with a commander I don't remember and they all have 10+ counterspells in the deck and some of them are dedicated to my commander, how can I explain to them that not allowing me to play the game with counter spells is worse than milling some cards
That's really a rule 0 conversation you need to have with them - I would say that you need ask them directly they they hate mill so much and why they feel that that justifies them picking on you for it (since your only trying to have fun just like they are and getting counter-spelled to oblivion isn't fun for anyone). And if they feel that being "milled out" is not fun, you can let them know that while this deck does mill, it does not use milling out as a alternate wincon (I mean it can happen but it would take a very long time compared to a "real mill" deck) - it just used their graveyards as a resource. Hope that helps and sorry for the late response!
Not sure why Nihilith is never getting any love in these deck upgrades. I think it’s super synergistic. casting it’s suspend seven cost for two mana, landing a milling ability and getting a 4/4 with fear and menace because of your commander just seems too good to pass up
Any chance you have plans to build a deck with Zellix? I’m personally finding Zellix more interesting than N’gathrod beside the fact that N’gathrod is Davy Jones as a mind flayer space pirate.
I think Elder Brain would make a fine addition! Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead (since Elder Brain is also technically card advantage for us and still mills thanks to our commander).
the blightsteel colossus will shuffle it self after it hits the graveyard from anywhere, can the captain reanimate the colossus eventhough card is not in the graveyard.?
I agree with the majority of this video, though I think Uchuulon is a very fun card with the potential to get massive if allowed to duplicate itself several times. Also, would anyone know the source of the artwork of the humanoid creatures praying to the weird eldritch brain. Looks insanely cool.
I agree that Uchuulon could have remained in this build but he just fell short in testing for being not so good without proper setup. With a established board and filled up bins it works great, but when we're running low on creatures and need immediate board presence its is a bit slow (though it multiple very quickly if given enough time). Overall, I would say its dealers choice whether to leave it in or not, because when it works, it really works!
Hey I play the Cap myself and upgraded it as well to the sky 🦾😁 Never Cut Uchuulon this Horror Wins Games alone + dealing with problematic cards in opp greaveyard! Never Cut Spellskite protects your creatures so good Don‘t cut chupacabra its simply to effective Don’t cut „fractured sanity“ it mills unpreventable 12 Cards! + draws a card! In a 4player match Where are the black most powerful cards like tutors? Where is cyclonic or Manadrain? Use cheap reanimators like „reanimate“ and „animate dead“ to steal even more Steal Life while you mill with „bloodchief ascension“ If you fill the graveyard so much you often need to handle some cards there Use „unlicensed hearse“ its cheap + a big thread Use phyrexian obliterater and toxrill both are one of the most powerful Horrors Use Toxic deluge as the cheapest and most powerful black sweaper that deals even with indestructible Use the new blackmarket connection, not even gives you carddraw, it even ramp’s and makes more horrors! Best regards Arcain
Personally, I get all 4 on gamenerdz (www.gamenerdz.com/magic-the-gathering-commander-legends-d-d-battle-for-baldurs-gate-commander-deck-set-of-4) which for about $140, making them about $35 each, but if you'd rather just buy a single deck - I believe coolstuffinc as them individually for $40 each. Hope that helps!
Glad to hear your enjoying them! We should be back to regularly scheduled builds from the sets themselves after the precons are done being covered, though we may see a non-face precon commander on the polls every now and again to give them a chance to have build made around them as well.
Probably an errata but Rathi’s creature type is a Phyrexian Mercenary Horror. It can’t be blocked except for artifacts and other black creatures making it an easy way to proc your commander. It can also search for the changeling addition so you can fill the board with more bodies.
Yarr Harr fiddledeedee... Truly a deck to steal the sanity- I mean steal the win from your opponents! Testing will be underway right when the shrine to Dagon is finished! Now my extensive, elaborate and enormous analysis of the upcoming deck to be upgraded: Pretty convincing /10. Day 298 of waiting for the face reveal. Thoughts on the Pirates of the Carribean franchise?
Glad you enjoyed the build and thanks for the support as usual! Pirates of the Caribbean is a fun collection of movies and I've enjoyed them well enough - though admittedly I have not seen them in some time.
It is a solid card, but not great in this build since we don't have the capability to making it enormous with horror tokens or a critical mass of horrors in this build and it gets worst because it has difficulty enabling Captain N'ghathrod without being powered up already - ultimately making it a win more card than an enabler (which we already have enough of that do not need the setup Uchuulon does).
Rings of Brighthearth only works for activated abilities, so it will not work with Captain N'ghathrod since his ability is triggered, not activated. And sadly I'm not familiar with the minion cycle your referring to... What are its members?
@@GrazzetMTG okay, basically, go into scyfall. The group members are the Cateran and the Rathi. They have been errated to have the creature type horror.
They would be the following: Captain N'ghathrod, Aboleth Spawn, Dimir Doppelganger, Grell Philosopher, Lazav, Dimir Mastermind, Shadow Kin, Body Double, Geth, Lord of the Vault, Rakshasa Debaser, Wrexial, the Risen Deep, Arvinox, the Mind Flail, Brainstealer Dragon, Memory Plunder, From the Catacombs, & Psionic Ritual. They all allow us to "steal" our opponents creatures or effects (though some to not physically take the card, just become copies of the card or copy their effects). Hope that clears that up and sorry for the late response!
As a matter of fact it is - it was Errated and you can see its new typing in Gatherer here: gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=21307 - Hope that clears that up!
It is a very good mill spell, no argument there, but that is all it does. Our horrors damage and mill our opponents, and the vast majority of our mill effects have other effects that help our core stats such as draw and removal. While Fractured Sanity is a spectacular additional to a full on mill deck who's main goal is to mill out the table, its less good in this build were mill is more a means to an end than the win condition. Still, because we can cantrip it for 2 and still mill everyone for 4, it could be worth keeping for just that.
@@GrazzetMTG I do agree that a lot of players are focusing way too much on the mill and not the horrors, but I'd still play Fractured Sanity, etc in the deck. It's a 3 mana steal something huge potentially.
@@Zeromus5555 In defense of the video (and my own choices) I'd still swap out Fractured Sanity for Maddening Cacophony. If you're gonna play one shot big mill, play the really big stuff, half of each opponents library rounded up. Now its not "maybe" you get something good, its almost for sure you get someone's best creature. Plus it can dramatically speed up the mill strategy if you need to go that route (like against a lifegain deck or something where beats isn't gonna cut it). That said, i can also see removing it completely. There are a ton of sources of repeatable mill that will provide great value over time instead of this one shot. Especially since you only get 1 free reanimate target per turn and then everything else that was milled that turn is "lost" to your commander. Something like Psychic Corrosion for the same 3 mana will mill you 6 cards per turn from your opponents (assuming just your natural draw) for the rest of the game the same as connecting with 2 evasive horrors, and any time you get extra draw off it scales up. So all those draw engines in the deck just make it better, functionally making all your horrors mill an additonal 2 per opponent when they connect.
No Trepanation Blade? It has an attack trigger that grinds until you reveal a land, then put all of those opponent's cards into a graveyard and giving equipped creature plus 1/0 per card revealed. It mills without requiring a creature to deal player damage and can easily boost up a weaker creature to be a viable threat or used in a pinch. Since the commander does not require combat damage to be dealt to activate his EOT ability, this makes it a consistent and recurring source of theft, damage, and mill.
Very good suggestion! I honestly had not thought of this card but you are entirely correct, it would make for a great addition - especially when equipped to our smaller evasive horrors to get even more mill out of them as they swing in!
Don’t agree with getting this far away from the horror, tribal aspect of the deck. It’s probably a strong deck and a good build, but I feel like it’s missing the point and cutting mind flayer is an absolute flavor fail.
While it does make more horrors, its still has to get in for damage to do so (as our deck does not have other means of self discard) and its combination of lows stats and poor evasion with skulk make that unreliable at best in this build, but it would be definitely more viable in a more token heavy horror build like Zellix, Sanity Flayer + Haunted One.
@@GrazzetMTG Skulk by itself isn't great evasion. Skulk+Menace is pretty good. Wont get you in vs tokens or elf tribal or something but they need two 1/X's to keep you out. The additonal payoff when you connect of hand sculpting and possibly generating additonal horrors if you got stuck with a late drop in your hand in the early game is really good. If you're running a reanimation package discarding your big heavy cost threats to reanimate them for 1 or 2 mana is a great play and this has the bonus of replacing the card and generating a horror token. All great stuff. I cut it at first, but i'm putting it back in.
Below is the complete list of swaps made to the build - enjoy!
Creatures
Dross Harvester > Frightcrawler
Phyrexian Rager > Boneshard Slasher
Phyrexian Revoker > Changeling Outcast
Nighthowler > Faceless Devourer
Plague Spitter > Rathi Intimidator
Chasm Skulker > Wasp of the Bitter End
Woe Strider > Possessed Aven
Uchuulon > Stitchwing Skaab
Dusk Mangler > Arvinox, the Mind Flail
Forgotten Creation > Shadow Kin
Psychosis Crawler > Dimir Doppelganger
Wharf Infiltrator > Body Double
Mind Flayer > Lazav, Dimir Mastermind
Dark Hatchling > Rakshasa Debaser
Nihilith > Wrexial, the Risen Deep
Ravenous Chupacabra > Geth, Lord of the Vault
Spellskite > Burnished Hart
Instants
Fact or Fiction > Drown in Dreams
Pull from Tomorrow > Grisly Spectacle
Sorceries
Fractured Sanity > Pilfered Plans
In Garruks Wake > Life's Finale
Enchantments
Endless Evil > Court of Cunning
Haunted One > Patient Rebuilding
Reflections of Littjara > Reconnaissance Mission
Artifacts
Leyline of Anticipation > Wayfarer's Bauble
Ash Barrens > Fellwar Stone
Dimir Aqueduct > Charcoal Diamond
Everflowing Chalice > Sky Diamond
Crippling Fear > Swiftfoot Boots
Hex > Whispersilk Cloak
Black Market > Bident of Thassa
Herald's Horn > Strionic Resonator
Lands
Temple of the False God > Shipwreck Marsh
Port of Karfell > Castle Locthwain
Drownyard Temple > Bonders' Enclave
What cards are taken out for the phyrexian obliterator, Reanimate, Necromancy etc.
@@Creedlafreniere this tells you
I don't see what is taken out for the phyrexian obliterator, Reanimate, Necromancy etc
Thank you for posting this! One of my pet peeves is upgrade guides not posting a list of cuts and adds
Think I’ve already commented, but your poetic descriptions of the cards and play style makes my day. As a vorthos player I def dive into the magic of magic.
Happy to hear your enjoying my style! Never thought I would hear it called poetic, but I'll take the complement! Thanks!
@@GrazzetMTG Honestly thought it was a computer reading from a script at first. Glad to learn it’s not. Love your videos.
I used your video as a guide (couldn't get my hands on every card) with a TCGPlayer guide. The end product is actually pretty good. It rarely has bad opening hands and is able to consistently mill and take stuff. Thank you for the video!
I just finished building my own deck like this, didn't have the pre con so i had to track down a lot of those cards too, I took it a more horror based deck and leaned more into the mill that way, its great to see how we diverged and leaned into so many of the same cards!
I just bought this deck and watch many other guide to modify it. Until now, nobody seem to offer something that interest me, but your take seem the most fun. So I wish to thank you for the tips and idea and hope to see more of your content.
Glad you enjoy it and thank you for the well wishes!
Friend got me this deck last year, I think, and I've just started to really play with it. While Uchuulon can be a pain, he's an absolute beast if you can get him going.
Found out in a friendly game that what makes Uchuulon a powerhouse is when you couple him with the copy creature enchantment, Endless Evil, that comes in the deck. You'll essentially get x2 Uchuulons, and then next turn you get a x2 with the first Original Uchuulon + 2 more with your token guys, so it just makes more and more critters. The Kicker, they feed off themselves since they're considered crabs/horrors, giving each other +1/+1. The combo is devastating, but it does take time to setup properly.
Another amazing tech. Your videos are just done and presented in such an excellent manner. Well done!
Glad your enjoying them and thank you for your kind words!
Definitely a good video! Great budget upgrade and then more pricey better cards! This video is definitely worth a subscribe!
Glad you think so and thanks for the sub!
Great changes! But one disagreement I have is removing Everflowing Chalice. As that forms an infinite mana combo with Sol Ring and Hullbreaker Horror!
Tap Sol Ring > cast Everflowing Chalice for 0 >
Hullbreaker Horror triggers > Return SR back to your hand > With 2 floating mana, recast SR > HH triggers > Return EC to your hand > Repeat for infinite colorless mana.
Very interesting, I completely missed that interaction! I don't think the build has any ways to put that infinite colorless mana to use, but we may be able to snatch one from an opponents so maybe it is worth leaving in.... Good suggestion!
@@GrazzetMTG yeah play testing it for me online is a little awkward because stealing stuff from your opponent is the secret weapon I can’t account for.
Here is the list for the mass entry, not including the final upgrades at the end of this video! I look forward to these upgrades myself!
1 Frightcrawler
1 Boneshard Slasher
1 Changeling Outcast
1 Faceless Devourer
1 Rathi Intimidator
1 Wasp of the Bitter End
1 Possessed Aven
1 Stitchwing Skaab
1 Arvinox, the Mind Flail
1 shadow kin
1 Dimir Doppelganger
1 Body Double
1 Lazav, Dimir Mastermind
1 Rakshasa Debaser
1 Wrexial, the Risen Deep
1 Geth, Lord of the Vault
1 Burnished Hart
1 drown in dreams
1 Grisly Spectacle
1 pilfered plans
1 Life's Finale
1 court of cunning
1 Patient Rebuilding
1 Reconnaissance Mission
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Charcoal Diamond
1 Sky Diamond
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Bident of Thassa
1 Strionic Resonator
1 Shipwreck Marsh
1 Castle Locthwain
1 Bonders' Enclave
Thanks for the inclusion! Much appreciated!
I'm new to MTG, longtime yugioh player here. Mind Flayaaayrs is my first taste of magic. After playing a few games with my buddies I've seen how the strengths of this deck just pop off when things go right. However I noticed how it can significantly slow down with some of the creatures that just don't mesh well. I'd really like to upgrade this deck. Thank you!!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is a very nice decktech! I see this Commander a between Anowon and Umbris, mixing milling and Horror tribal
That is a good assessment of him, yeah!
Interesting upgrades you have chosen. I will certainly look into them.
Please do!
I'm using this guide to rebuild my Mind Flayarrrs deck after how well Painbow did with your suggested upgrade guide! Cheers
Glad to hear that you enjoyed both builds and hope that the Mind Flayarrrs upgrade works well for you!
Amazing content!! I will definitely give this one a try. Absolutely loved it!! Keep it coming 😁
Glad to hear you enjoyed it and will do! At time of writing this 3 out of 4 of the precons have upgrades the last last one will be covered next week!
Awesome vid! I’m looking forward to seeing the rest of the BTB precons upgraded
Glad you enjoyed it! The rest of the Battle for Baldur's gate precon upgrades will be dropping soon, so you certainly won't have to wait long!
two of my favorite creature based tribal support cards are Maskwood Nexus and Reflections of Litjata(blue).
Maskwood Nexus would be hilarious in this build to turn the creatures we steal from our opponents into horrors to mill them even faster, but Reflections of Litjata I found to be a bit too slow in this build since the pool of horrors we want extra copies of is small (as most of our horrors are small evasive ones that are not really worth doubling up on).
Awesome video! Great editing and awesome explanation for each of your swaps. New subscriber!
Happy to hear that you enjoyed the build and welcome aboard!
Might be one of my fav precons to date.
Yeah, a few of the folks who I test the builds with will agree with you there!
Well done. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it and thanks for watching!
I would recommend Irenicus's Vile Duplication for this one. Cheap way to get a copy of your commander out which is just great for this guy.
Good suggestion! Doubling up on our commanders ability is a great option to have!
I wouldn’t cut all those sweet horrors and put in a bunch of non-horror creatures just because they help with the mill plan. If you want to build Wrexil the Risen Deep, just build Wrexil the Risen Deep. A tribal-agnostic deck that isn’t really horror tribal is not what I personally would want to do with Captain N’gathrod. There’s like 4 better commanders to do that, some of whom you put in your list. The addition of some of the small evasive horrors is smart, though.
Fair - the initial testing for this build was nearly all horrors but, while it did okay, it ultimately felt a bit underwhelming. We already have a dictated horror commander with Umbris, Fear Manifest, who is incentivized to run horror payoffs as they tend to help it grow in size as well and while Captain N’gathrod can certainly be build as a horror commander, he ultimately uses them more as a means to an end (that end being mill) than as the key players (since we can build Captain N’gathrod without a single horror and he would still work) . That doesn't mean that running him as a pure horror tribal commander is not possible or effective by any means though, so if you feel like the running him as a source of evasion and mill for your horrors with the occasional reanimation, I can see that working just fine as well.
Yes, this is definitely the horror tribal deck Umbris has been waiting to command lol. I think as a sub-theme, I would double down on confiscating opponents stuff and not just from graveyards. Perhaps something similar to what my Xanathar deck was built like. 🧠
Fair, but I figured since our commander is already in on graveyard focused theft we may as well lean into it instead of diversifying into other forms of pillaging (since there are other commanders that are better that the Captain when it comes to that). Still, if you want to diversify you thieving, there is certainly no shame in doing so!
Great vid I just got into MTG with this deck, the last few cards you had as extra upgrades what would you swap them for? And do we need all 3 of the necromancy spells? Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it! You may not need all 3 necromancy spells (since our commander will be doing a lot of reanimation for us) but they do let us get extra bodies on board, so its really dependent on personal preference.
Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead.
Possessed Aven for Nautiloid Ship would be good since we'll likely get mote value out of Nautiloid Ship for it graveyard hate and on damage reanimation than from its predecessor.
Extract from Darkness, Memory Plunder, & From the Catacombs for Reanimate, Animate dead, & Necromancy would be solid choices since their upgrades are cheaper to cast.
Arvinox, the Mind Flail can also be swapped out for Toxrill, the Corrosive instead if we'd rather have the removal and draw.
Life's Finale can be exchanged for Thing in the Ice - since its a tribal wipe that doesn't affect our horrors.
And Stitchwing Skaab can be cut for Phyrexian Obliterator since players will be unwilling to lock it anyway since they don't want to lose permanents.
I'm kinda surprised that Syr Konrad wasn't included, since he pairs so beautifully with Mindcrank.
That he does! If we were running tutors in the build and focused more on combo kills I would certainly recommend him. As is though, since we have no reliable way to get to him and Mindcrank, he's not as good IMO - but could still be slotted in as per preference.
Thanks for the suggestion!
I really love Imperious Mindbreaker. Combined with the commander it's really strong
Its a solid card to get a lot more mill out of either our commander or other big horrors once we get them down.
Where would the more expensive cards be slotted in? Like what cards would they replace?
I know this video was posted a while ago, but wanted to comment on the "seemingly random inclusion of Everflowing Chalice". Someone on Reddit posted that the deck includes at least two infinite mana combos, and both rely on Sol Ring and Everflowing Chalice. I'm weighing whether I want to just keep these four decks as built, assuming they were built balanced by WotC or to start dropping in consistent upgrades between decks...
The combo is Hullbreaker Horror + Sol Ring + Eveflowing Chalice - which does generate infinite colorless mana but has no good mana sinks to pump it into or ways to tutor for the pieces, which is why I commented it was odd since the deck has no real way of taking advantage of it (apart from maybe dumping our entire hand but that doesn't usually win us the game on the spot, which is what infinite mana is used for).
Hope that helps explain my comment!
Fyi Blightsteel never enters the graveyard. It has a replacement text that sends it into the library if it would enter the graveyard.
Yeah, missed that in editing.... Thanks for letting me know!
I haven't bpught the precon yet but I was wondering does this deck run into the issue of enemies removing the commander and completely stunting the deck?
Great analysis! I love your videos. One quick question: I have Elder Brain and am considering putting it in as you mentioned. What do you think I should cut?
Glad you've been enjoying the builds! I would say that if you want to add in Elder Brain, cutting Rakshasa Debaser or Wrexial, the Risen Deep - since it won't increase the curve that much and adds an extra horror in to replace a non-horror.
Hope that helps!
Man I hope you don't get overwhelmed by all this commander stuff. I guessing your probably not going to touch the choose a background legends right? Stay strong Grazzet.
Yeah, WotC just keeps rolling out the product don't they? I may have a poll for all 4 of the background commanders from the precons and do at least 1, but we'll just have to see!
What a horror-able deck tech!🤣🤣🤣 😘
But seriously this looks pretty sweet and I think that Bond of Insight would be decent too
Which background would you pair with Renari, Merchant of Marvels to get the most of an artifact themed deck?
Glad you enjoyed it and the pun is appreciated! Bond of Insight would indeed make of a solid addition to get us some of our more powerful non-creature spells to be used again while enabling our commander reanimation - good suggestion!
Acolyte of Bahamut seems like it would be the most useful when paired with Renari, Merchant of Marvels to get that minus discount on every single turn, though our pool of dragons will be smaller without access to red.
Fuck yeah! Watch this after I sleep!
Hope you enjoyed it!
@@GrazzetMTG always do!
Good upgrade guide, definitely focusing in on the central gameplan a bit more. Have any general advice as far building from precons? In my case I have that one zombie precon with wilhelt and want to transition over to Nevinyrral. For some reason it's proving harder for me than just building from the ground up...
Glad you enjoyed the build!
Building up a precon is certainly harder than it seems, I lesson I learned when I started doing these upgrade builds. What tends to work for me is figuring our what the commanders unique strengths are, that no other commander can do, and try to build around that. In this case, free graveyard reanimation based on mill and turning horrors into mill sources to enable that. From there, it is a matter of looking to see what cards work with this playstyle, which do but are a bit clucky, and which ones don't work at all - gradually replacing them until the deck "feels good" to play.
Hope that helps!
Love the ideas but a bit off base for some, do yourself a huge favor, keep the chupacabra, removal is super nice with an added bonus of a potential horror is just impossible to skip out on
I like Ravenous Chupacabra, I really do, but it always fell short in testing in this build. Sure its removal and its a horror, but its small stat block and only evasion being our commanders menace makes it very difficult to get it in for damage (since we took our a lot of the horror matters payoffs to focus more on enemy graveyard value). In a build that can either more easily grow its stats, flicker it, or reanimate it I can see it doing work, but in the build as is it just felt a bit meh. But meh is certainly not bad, so if you want to run it just as a removal source with occasional upside if it can get in for cheecky damage, then by all means go for it.
I'd keep in Nighthowler. That thing can get huge.
Its not a bad include by any means, but I personally prefer a larger quantity of evasive horrors at that mana point to more reliable set up our commander, which is why it got the axe.
I tried it, honestly its VERY meta dependent. If you're doing well, and up against a bunch of creature heavy decks (so 1/3 cards is a creature ish when you mill) then it gets decently big. If you're doing poorly, or the decks you are up against are not creature heavy then it does very poorly. In my case I also swapped it out wanting either some more utility from a creature, or a larger reliable threat. Just creating a (maybe) big body with no natural evasion isn't that great. Definitely a card that worked better on paper, than it did in person.
Thank you for the deck tech! Newbie here, a buddy of mine runs blightsteel colossus in his daretti deck. Pretty busted. I was wondering if you can snatch Blightsteel colossus with N'ghatrod since it says reveal and shuffle into the library if it's put into the graveyard.
Glad you enjoyed the build!
Sadly, you will not be able to reanimate Blightsteel with N'ghatrod since its a replacement effect - because it says instead it never actually hits the graveyard and therefore can not be reanimated/copied/cloned from the bin.
Hope that helps!
@@GrazzetMTG Thank you!
If your friend is running a one-shot bot against you when you just stared playing mtg, you might want to consider getting new friends.
@@IsThatAProGenji well my options are either to play against that or a broken toxril deck. I guess it's trial by fire :D
Hi, great video. I appreciate description of every card. I just wonder, which card would you swap for "Elder brain", "Reanimate" and "Animate dead" if you want them in deck?
Glad you enjoyed it! I would say swapping out Extract from Darkness and Memory Plunder (or possibly From the Catacombs) for Reanimate and Animate dead would be solid choices since their upgrades are cheaper to cast and Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead (since Elder Brain is also technically card advantage for us and still mills thanls to our commander).
Hope that helps and sorry for the later response!
Great video and really useful tips for upgrading the deck! I'm really enjoying your vids even the ones from decks I would never build, so you have a new subscriber. One question: Would it be worth including enchantments like "Dauthi embrace" or "Intimidation" to help make creatures harder to block? What do you think? Thanks and keep up the good work, comrade commander :D
For some reason in my play group they really hate mill even more so than land destruction and when I play with this deck it is never able to hit the battlefield, they play Sephris of the Hidden ways, Urza and a pirate tribal with a commander I don't remember and they all have 10+ counterspells in the deck and some of them are dedicated to my commander, how can I explain to them that not allowing me to play the game with counter spells is worse than milling some cards
That's really a rule 0 conversation you need to have with them - I would say that you need ask them directly they they hate mill so much and why they feel that that justifies them picking on you for it (since your only trying to have fun just like they are and getting counter-spelled to oblivion isn't fun for anyone). And if they feel that being "milled out" is not fun, you can let them know that while this deck does mill, it does not use milling out as a alternate wincon (I mean it can happen but it would take a very long time compared to a "real mill" deck) - it just used their graveyards as a resource.
Hope that helps and sorry for the late response!
Not sure why Nihilith is never getting any love in these deck upgrades. I think it’s super synergistic. casting it’s suspend seven cost for two mana, landing a milling ability and getting a 4/4 with fear and menace because of your commander just seems too good to pass up
any possible replacement for stitichwing skaab?
Any chance you have plans to build a deck with Zellix? I’m personally finding Zellix more interesting than N’gathrod beside the fact that N’gathrod is Davy Jones as a mind flayer space pirate.
I may put Zellix, Sanity Flayer and the background that came with this deck into a future poll to be voted for in the near future, so stay tuned!
Would you add elder brain? And if you did what would you cut?
I think Elder Brain would make a fine addition!
Arvinox, the Mind Flail can be swapped out for Elder brain if we want to keep the CMC the same, or if we don't mind bumping the CMC up a bit, Pilfered Plans can be exchanged out instead (since Elder Brain is also technically card advantage for us and still mills thanks to our commander).
the blightsteel colossus will shuffle it self after it hits the graveyard from anywhere, can the captain reanimate the colossus eventhough card is not in the graveyard.?
Blightsteel would shuffle itself back in.... That was an editing mistake, sorry about that!
I agree with the majority of this video, though I think Uchuulon is a very fun card with the potential to get massive if allowed to duplicate itself several times. Also, would anyone know the source of the artwork of the humanoid creatures praying to the weird eldritch brain. Looks insanely cool.
Elder Brain is the card artwork in the background, also from the new set 😁
@@revenantjb575 Many thanks
You might want to look at mindflayer Lore from D&D :)
I agree that Uchuulon could have remained in this build but he just fell short in testing for being not so good without proper setup. With a established board and filled up bins it works great, but when we're running low on creatures and need immediate board presence its is a bit slow (though it multiple very quickly if given enough time). Overall, I would say its dealers choice whether to leave it in or not, because when it works, it really works!
Nice
Glad you think so!
Hey I play the Cap myself and upgraded it as well to the sky 🦾😁
Never Cut Uchuulon this Horror Wins Games alone + dealing with problematic cards in opp greaveyard!
Never Cut Spellskite protects your creatures so good
Don‘t cut chupacabra its simply to effective
Don’t cut „fractured sanity“ it mills unpreventable 12 Cards! + draws a card! In a 4player match
Where are the black most powerful cards like tutors?
Where is cyclonic or Manadrain?
Use cheap reanimators like „reanimate“ and „animate dead“ to steal even more
Steal Life while you mill with „bloodchief ascension“
If you fill the graveyard so much you often need to handle some cards there
Use „unlicensed hearse“ its cheap + a big thread
Use phyrexian obliterater and toxrill both are one of the most powerful Horrors
Use Toxic deluge as the cheapest and most powerful black sweaper that deals even with indestructible
Use the new blackmarket connection, not even gives you carddraw, it even ramp’s and makes more horrors!
Best regards Arcain
Where are you getting the precon for 40$?? My LGS had 55$ on it since this whole set is like what 6% more expensive?
Personally, I get all 4 on gamenerdz (www.gamenerdz.com/magic-the-gathering-commander-legends-d-d-battle-for-baldurs-gate-commander-deck-set-of-4) which for about $140, making them about $35 each, but if you'd rather just buy a single deck - I believe coolstuffinc as them individually for $40 each.
Hope that helps!
Love your videos! I see that you’re only doing precon guides recently, will you go back to making decks based off non precon commanders?
Glad to hear your enjoying them! We should be back to regularly scheduled builds from the sets themselves after the precons are done being covered, though we may see a non-face precon commander on the polls every now and again to give them a chance to have build made around them as well.
What's the point of Rathi Intimidator? It's not a horror and there are no other mercenary cards in the deck.
Scary fall has it updated to be a mercenary!
Probably an errata but Rathi’s creature type is a Phyrexian Mercenary Horror. It can’t be blocked except for artifacts and other black creatures making it an easy way to proc your commander.
It can also search for the changeling addition so you can fill the board with more bodies.
Yarr Harr fiddledeedee... Truly a deck to steal the sanity- I mean steal the win from your opponents! Testing will be underway right when the shrine to Dagon is finished!
Now my extensive, elaborate and enormous analysis of the upcoming deck to be upgraded: Pretty convincing /10.
Day 298 of waiting for the face reveal. Thoughts on the Pirates of the Carribean franchise?
Glad you enjoyed the build and thanks for the support as usual!
Pirates of the Caribbean is a fun collection of movies and I've enjoyed them well enough - though admittedly I have not seen them in some time.
Uchuulon is also incredibly good... cutting it makes no sense.
It is a solid card, but not great in this build since we don't have the capability to making it enormous with horror tokens or a critical mass of horrors in this build and it gets worst because it has difficulty enabling Captain N'ghathrod without being powered up already - ultimately making it a win more card than an enabler (which we already have enough of that do not need the setup Uchuulon does).
Also rings of brighthearth/minion cycle?
Rings of Brighthearth only works for activated abilities, so it will not work with Captain N'ghathrod since his ability is triggered, not activated. And sadly I'm not familiar with the minion cycle your referring to... What are its members?
@@GrazzetMTG okay, basically, go into scyfall. The group members are the Cateran and the Rathi. They have been errated to have the creature type horror.
And I realized I actually meant mercenary cycle
What are the 15 “steal” cards?
They would be the following: Captain N'ghathrod, Aboleth Spawn, Dimir Doppelganger, Grell Philosopher, Lazav, Dimir Mastermind, Shadow Kin, Body Double, Geth, Lord of the Vault, Rakshasa Debaser, Wrexial, the Risen Deep, Arvinox, the Mind Flail, Brainstealer Dragon, Memory Plunder, From the Catacombs, & Psionic Ritual. They all allow us to "steal" our opponents creatures or effects (though some to not physically take the card, just become copies of the card or copy their effects).
Hope that clears that up and sorry for the late response!
Rathi intimidator isn’t a horror?
As a matter of fact it is - it was Errated and you can see its new typing in Gatherer here: gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=21307 - Hope that clears that up!
FRACTURED SANITY is the best mill spell..... wtf.
It is a very good mill spell, no argument there, but that is all it does. Our horrors damage and mill our opponents, and the vast majority of our mill effects have other effects that help our core stats such as draw and removal. While Fractured Sanity is a spectacular additional to a full on mill deck who's main goal is to mill out the table, its less good in this build were mill is more a means to an end than the win condition. Still, because we can cantrip it for 2 and still mill everyone for 4, it could be worth keeping for just that.
@@GrazzetMTG I do agree that a lot of players are focusing way too much on the mill and not the horrors, but I'd still play Fractured Sanity, etc in the deck. It's a 3 mana steal something huge potentially.
@@Zeromus5555 In defense of the video (and my own choices) I'd still swap out Fractured Sanity for Maddening Cacophony. If you're gonna play one shot big mill, play the really big stuff, half of each opponents library rounded up. Now its not "maybe" you get something good, its almost for sure you get someone's best creature. Plus it can dramatically speed up the mill strategy if you need to go that route (like against a lifegain deck or something where beats isn't gonna cut it).
That said, i can also see removing it completely. There are a ton of sources of repeatable mill that will provide great value over time instead of this one shot. Especially since you only get 1 free reanimate target per turn and then everything else that was milled that turn is "lost" to your commander. Something like Psychic Corrosion for the same 3 mana will mill you 6 cards per turn from your opponents (assuming just your natural draw) for the rest of the game the same as connecting with 2 evasive horrors, and any time you get extra draw off it scales up. So all those draw engines in the deck just make it better, functionally making all your horrors mill an additonal 2 per opponent when they connect.
No Trepanation Blade? It has an attack trigger that grinds until you reveal a land, then put all of those opponent's cards into a graveyard and giving equipped creature plus 1/0 per card revealed. It mills without requiring a creature to deal player damage and can easily boost up a weaker creature to be a viable threat or used in a pinch. Since the commander does not require combat damage to be dealt to activate his EOT ability, this makes it a consistent and recurring source of theft, damage, and mill.
Very good suggestion! I honestly had not thought of this card but you are entirely correct, it would make for a great addition - especially when equipped to our smaller evasive horrors to get even more mill out of them as they swing in!
Don’t agree with getting this far away from the horror, tribal aspect of the deck. It’s probably a strong deck and a good build, but I feel like it’s missing the point and cutting mind flayer is an absolute flavor fail.
Wharf Infiltrator makes more Horrors.... don't cut that people...
While it does make more horrors, its still has to get in for damage to do so (as our deck does not have other means of self discard) and its combination of lows stats and poor evasion with skulk make that unreliable at best in this build, but it would be definitely more viable in a more token heavy horror build like Zellix, Sanity Flayer + Haunted One.
@@GrazzetMTG Skulk by itself isn't great evasion. Skulk+Menace is pretty good. Wont get you in vs tokens or elf tribal or something but they need two 1/X's to keep you out.
The additonal payoff when you connect of hand sculpting and possibly generating additonal horrors if you got stuck with a late drop in your hand in the early game is really good. If you're running a reanimation package discarding your big heavy cost threats to reanimate them for 1 or 2 mana is a great play and this has the bonus of replacing the card and generating a horror token. All great stuff.
I cut it at first, but i'm putting it back in.
@@Loln02345 good call. It's over performed for me. Big issue the deck has is low drops
trigered by his voice
In a good or bad way?
You can definily call this a downgrade.
Sorry you feel that way. What do you disagree with in the build?
At least provide some insight if you're going to make a negative comment.
Ya, bad "upgrade." You basically cut out every single good card for worse ones...
Sorry to hear you think that but I appreciate the feedback regardless.