ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 มิ.ย. 2024
- In this week's video, I take an in depth look at the Intrepid 8x10 camera, a lightweight 8x10 view camera that I strapped to my back, and ventured into the wilds of Utah with this past Spring.
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#photography #intrepid #8x10
Really enjoyed this Ben. Great review of the Intrepid that looks like a neat piece of kit. Also good to have a better insight into what goes into setting up such a camera. Thanks
It really is a fun camera to work with. That's one of the cool things about shooting large format - the cameras are so simple that they can be made of plywood, and take great photos.
Thank you for the video Ben, I think this was a very fair and concise review. I recently decided to sell my Intrepid 8x10. I realised once it arrived that I needed more precision for my work and in this regard it couldn't compete with my heavy monorail. It's nice to see an impartial review which is not emotional and does not turn into a rant. I agree with you that with this camera you have to acknowledge how incredibly light weight and compact it is. The added advantage is you don't need to invest in high end tripods or expensive tripod heads. It really makes you feel like you can throw it in a backpack and head out at the drop of a hat - for this, Intrepid should be commended. I find geared movements are just so helpful when shooting large format and even more so for 8x10 - for this reason I realised the Intrepid was not the right fit for me. This is a really great camera for hiking and shooting landscape in the field ... and you don't need to take out a second mortgage. I think a mark ii would benefit from a spring back with more precise fitting of the ground glass frame. The front standard could be made of a stronger material and geared like on a Horseman 45FA. Finally, I wonder if your issue with the bellows couldn't be helped with some kind of simple prop like a piece of stiff card inserted underneath to just lift the bellows slightly. On my version the bellows did not have the misshaping - I suspect the bellows improved the more they produced, I was one of the last backers.
I literally laughed out loud when I realized the subject of this video. I saw that you had a new video up and thought "finally a break from all these whiny mirrorless camera reviews" ;-D
Thank you for this, I've been looking at the Intrepid and found this information very useful.
Not only is it mirrorless, it also has dual card slots and AMAZING battery life. ;-)
Indeed the battery life has to be way beyond my old 35mm Mamiyas and those could last several years.
Very good honest review, I enjoy your suggestions and add to the life a this camera. Your introduction about the weight of this camera hooked to watch your video, because the lens and shutter is what creates the photo, therefore backpacking/humping an 8X10 camera, along with lenses, and film holders is extremely important.
Thank you Mr.Horne this answered my questions about lens for the Intrepid. I was a little concerned about lens weight on the front standard. Thank you again.
Awesome review - thank you for taking the time to make this
The Intrepid is an excellent entry level 8x10 solution. and your review is most appreciated
Thanks John! Glad you enjoyed it!
Thanks Intrepid for allowing us to venture into 8x10 in a lightweight, affordable, and well designed setup! I am sure next generations will be even better
Love the idea of the box set both as a creative goal but also as something people can support. Just ordered mine in part to say thank you for your content but also to get the prints!
Thanks so much Joshua! I really appreciate the support!
I also have a 300 5.6 and while it’s a joy to compose/look through it is a beast. You really do have to crank the front element side screws down tight to keep it from tilting forward. Agreed, they are too short. Mostly I can’t stand the way the ground glass has to be rotated when folding. The magnets are cool but the screws on mine really have a hard time finding the thread. Not a bad first 8x10 for me but I almost wish I would have waited for a version 2. Seeing that slick new 4x5 they released makes me wish some of those changes had been incorporated into the 8x10.
The bellows dipping into the light path on vertical shots was the first thought that came to my mind when you initially opened the camera.
Ben, brilliant, short, pointed, the focus on the front standard is very helpful, only the reference to the Arca Swiss should be visualized better - in order to understand or to compare, because a beginner cannot follow that fully, but I understood fully for what objective I can going to purchase this model or not, thank you so much
Marvellous camera.
It really is a joy to use.
My Century Graphic has hanging rings on the top of the bellows to deal with sag. You can either run a piece of coat hanger wire through them and ground it on the front and back standards, or there is a hook on the front standard to hook them to.
Hi William! One thing I forgot to mention in the video is that despite being very lightweight, the bellows are quite stiff and resist being pushed out of the way. I tried to recreate the situation that chopped off part of the image, and found that I wasn't able to push the bellows out of the way like other cameras might be able to.
Great stuff.
Thanks Mikko!
Interesting small big camera. The only concerns i have is the very slim base of the front standard. A broader base or a strut that braces the front standard would give me a feel of better stability.
For my Graflex Speed Graphic I only buy 'pancake' lenses as in, I have a 5" f/4.7 and a 6.3/8" f/4.5 and they fit inside the camera when closed (obviously only one at a time).
I wanted to get a 10" lens but they're a bit big. It'll hold it, but storage and weight is an issue when the camera itself weighs about 4lbs.
This video is a few years old and when Intrepid first started the did have a few issues with quality control but I believe, by the drop in complaints on social media, they have improved tremendously, well at least I have no complaints on my Intrepid 4x5 black edition, and no I paid full price and am not receiving any gratuitous payment for this comment..
Nice hat!
It's my new favorite. 😉
Thank you very much for this valuable information, Ben. Would you say that with the slower lenses it is much more difficult to focus or it is tolerable? Thanks!
The slower lenses are definitely dimmer on the ground glass, but in most situations your eyes will adapt to it just fine. It's only really if you're trying to setup a shot during twilight conditions that the slower lens would really become a limiting factor.
Great video review Ben, I am very tempted to buy an intrepid camera, they look really portable. But I am concerned with the build and finish of these cameras at present. Others who have reviewed them have also found light leaks as well as loose screws and rough woodwork that they had to sandpaper. Hopefully this new company will improve their quality control.
Hi Andy! I didn't have any loose screws or any issues with the finish of the wood. The plywood has a very smooth feel to it. I wasn't sure what to think about it from the photos, but it has a very interesting look and feel in person. I suppose it is kind of a functional aesthetic. I know one other person had an issue with light leaks from the rear standard, but thankfully it is easy enough to fix. It's definitely good for them to see the feedback to improve their manufacturing process.
Thanks for the great reply Ben
轻便与精准调校不可兼得。这款8*10在轻便、便携方面做得不错。
i have had 8x10 cameras and they all had the corners trimmed for air flow
Hey, Ben, very nice review as always. I am thinking about getting the Intrepid. Could you recommend the most lightweight tripod possible for the thing?
I recently purchased a Gitzo 1 Series 3 section mountaineer for when I take the Intrepid backpacking. That is the lightest tripod I was comfortable with for this camera.
@@BenHorne Thanks, Ben. Looks like my GT1541 may be up to the task.
Hello Ben. Very interesting video. What tripod head are you using?
That's the Arca-Swiss Cube Geared Head.
@@BenHorne thank you so much!
for sure gives me something to think about in regards to what brand to go with - thinking about a 4x5 intrepid or chamonix, although the price of the 8x10 intrepid does make it tempting haha
well you gotta keep in mind film costs
Owned an Intrepid 4x5 for a couple months before upgrading to a Chamonix 045-N2 with a universal bellows. I shoot with a 90mm f/8 lens for architecture and the bellows on the intrepid was restricting from maximum rise/fall movements - something to consider if you're going with the intrepid, I wouldn't suggest going wider than a 90mm.
Love my Chamonix F1 and if I ever went to 8x10 or larger I would look at anther Chamonix.
Hello! what make and model is the light table you use for viewing your transparencies? thanks
I'm currently using a Kaiser Slimlite Plano. It's a wonderfully thin and lightweight lightbox.
Is it ready for a precise focus? That’s all i ask for a budget camera. Thanks!
Mine is very precise when focusing. It's the other movements (tilt, swing, etc), that aren't quite as precise.
Which backpack do you use with the Intrepid?
A camera this size won't fit in an ordinary camera backpack very well, but it will fit inside a hiking pack quite well. Just about any hiking pack will do. I had a wrap made by Dan Stone to help keep the camera safe when inside my backpack. The particular model I use is a Gregory Denali Pro, but that's a pretty huge bag.
If you have a real problem with the bellows sagging down into the picture area, try this: find an eyelet with some kind of tab on it (maybe at a picture framing store) or you could solder or glue a wire loop onto a little metal tab. At a model shop or hardware store, buy a piece of steel rod, maybe 1/8 inch thick (3 or 4mm). Test in the store to make sure in doesn't flex or bend in the length of the camera.
Glue the eyelet to the top of the bellows in the middle of its span. Be careful to use a flexible glue that will not eat the bellows material. Cut the steel rod to length, maybe 3 or 4 inches longer than the longest extension of the camera. Sand the ends so they're no sharp.
In the field, if you extend the bellows and it seems to be sagging into the picture, just slide the rod into the eyelet and rest it on top of the front and read standards. (Yes this will interfere with inserting the film holder in portrait orientation. Insert the film first.)
You won't have to do this with most cameras, but I've had a couple with very long or very old bellows where it was helpful.
Thats a great idea Scott! I hadn't thought about doing something along those lines. Another idea I had for backpacking was to bring a balloon, inflate it partially, and put it below the bellows.
Every shot I've taken out in the field has had focus issues. I think the front standard is a joke. The wood standard doesn't square up inside the metal brackets (and as you point out, those knobs could use improvement) so I've got to super carefully align that every time. This makes it hard to use front standard movements at all. The markings on the bed are terrible. I've been trying to decide whether I should get the plate you suggest and try the tape or sell the camera. I suppose if I did that stuff it would only increase the value if I did sell it. I'm about to do some paper negative tests to see if I can figure this out otherwise it's gotta go. I feel like I should have learned from the 4x5 and waited for a couple generations of improvements.
Do you have any ideas what might have caused the focus issues? Do you think it was because the movements weren't squared up fully, or something else?
Probably. I've done a series of tests contrasting the Intrepid with my friend's Arca Swiss to see if I can take a decent photo with a better camera. I'll report back when I get time to get the film developed and printed. Though all these shenanigans have me thinking I should stick with my 4x5 (Ebony).
would be nice if they cut the corners off the corners of the ground glass to check coverage as nearly all other 8x10 makers do
I've had the cut corners on past cameras, but I honestly never knew that was the purpose. I suppose with landscapes, I never really get close to maxing out the image circle of the lens, so it hasn't been a part of my workflow. I see how it could definitely be a factor for shooting architecture or other things along those lines though. I do find myself checking the placement of my lens hood, but for that I just stop down the lens, then wiggle it around a bit until it doesn't show up in the frame.
@@BenHorne plus it lets the bellows breathe when you extend or shorten them
Can you tell the prices of the lenses? you can put add them to the description below.
The prices area always changing since they are on the used market and going up in value. I bought my Fuji 300mm C lens for about $600, but they have been selling for more than that lately. The other lenses I use on the Intrepid are a Fuji 240mm A, and a Fuji 450mm C. Those lenses are often in the $800 to $1300 range.
If it was my camera I would finish the plywood to help prevent warping and UV damage.
What is the nest tripod to use with this camera?
Pretty much any tripod capable of holding a full size SLR will be fine with this camera. I am currently using it with a lightweight Gitzo 1 series Mountaineer tripod. That's about as small as I would go. Those specific tripods are quite expensive, but I want to keep it both strong and lightweight.
Would the new version be able to firmly hold a Kodak No. 35 10" anastigmat on a Compound #4 shutter, about 1.5 lbs?
I think that would probably be a bit too heavy for the first Gen 8x10. By comparison, the lenses I use are in the 0.5 lbs range.
Thanks for answering. Fortunately I do have a few lighter lenses in the 210-300mm range that will cover 8x10. And I'm supposed to be getting the 2nd generation 8x10 Yay!@@BenHorne
Can you also explain what mm lens in proportion to which holes to use?
The best way is to just do some quick experimentation when you first get the camera. I know that my 450mm lens is the furthest hole, and the closest hole is for my 150mm. My 240 and 300 are somewhere in between. Ideally you should select a hole where you have to focus the lens outward just a little bit to achieve infinity focus. Once you figure out which hole works best, you'll most likely remember it for next time. If you have a hard time remembering, you could always put some color coded stickers on the bed of the camera and on your lens board so you can quickly see which hole to use.
@@BenHorne Thank you so much for your reply! That is helpful. I just haven't found a tutorial that has truly explained it.
I’m surprised you don’t mention the constraints introduced by the “front standard only” focusing; if you can only focus using the front standard, you are changing the lens-to-subject relationship with effectively impacts on your composition. The closer you are to the subject, the more problematic this gets to be. I feel this is a noteworthy flaw in the Intrepid design, and one they ought to consider addressing. Your opinion?
The Ebony RW810 that I used for many years was front focus only as well, so it is something I am accustomed to. I think it also comes with the territory of having such a lightweight camera. Adding rear focus would add more weight, bulk, and complexity. Now that I have the Arca Swiss, I focus with the rear standard which is great for closeups, but I did quite well with the Ebony even for closeup shots.
No doubt this is one of the compromises (and I DO regard it as a compromise) made when designing a lightweight, inexpensive camera. I simply think its worth pointing out to potential buyers that this is a limitation in certain scenarios - close-up work/still life compositions, etc. (I'm used to working with an 8X10 Deardorff) For grand, sweeping landscapes, this is an insignificant detail, however. Thank you for this excellent, thorough review. You do a superb job at presenting the information concisely and with style.
Surely front standard focussing is standard on a field camera design. I wasn't aware of any that focus at the rear.
You've never seen a Deardorff??
I've never noticed the rear focussing. Fair enough... Still, it seems to be an exception. And not a lightweight design.
what kind of tripod head are you using?
The one in this video is an Arca-Swiss C1 Cube. It's a very expensive tripod head, but an absolute joy to use because it is a geared head.
@@BenHorne Awesome! Thank you so much for that information. I'm slowly collecting all of the necessary accessories and it is helpful to know what is working for other people out there.
How do you buy lens for this camera?
You'll need to look for a lens on the used market since they really aren't being made anymore. My favorite lenses are the very compact Fujinon series lenses. Take a look at the Fujinon C 300mm f/8.5. They're quite common on the used market and it's a normal focal length on 8x10. My other favorite is a moderate wide angle Fujinon A 240mm f/9.0, and on the long side, I love the Fujinon C 450mm f/12.5. The second two are more expensive than the first, so I always recommend the Fujinon C 300mm f/8.5 assuming a normal focal length is appropriate for your choice of subject. Ebay is a good place to look, and you'll find some like-new and mint versions coming from sellers in Japan.
@@BenHorne Thank you for the advice I’m looking for a focal length for both landscape and portraits
how can it cost 500 pounds , not taking into account the lenses one would need too? This makes it so difficult or next to impossible to enter the field.
Prior to the Intrepid 8x10, you would pay about 4x to 8x that on an 8x10 camera, and the camera would weigh 2x or 3x the weight.
To be honest there sounds like a LOT of mods are needed to make that camera worth even considering. No excuses are justified it's not their first
camera/effort.
Swansong 007 This video is several years old now, and they now have the 8x10mk II which is greatly refined. Even though the camera in this video wasn’t their first camera, it was their first 8x10, which presents a whole new level of design challenges over 4x5 cameras, which is what this design originated from. Also, keep in mind that when the original Intrepid 8x10 debuted, it was a fraction of the cost of the nearest 8x10 (3k) range, and also the lightest 8x10 on the market. In that sense, certain quirks are very well worth it. I took several portfolio shots with my first gen 8x10, and now I am happily working with their second generation version.
seems ridiculous to sell a brand new camera system with some afterthought "engineering" to correct issues with a poor design i.e: grip tape? I know the price is super low on these cameras but still, it seems like they could have come up with a real solution to the problem instead of something that doesn't really work or introduces a new problem in the process.
why do you say that the price is super low ? In contrast to other ones ? 500 pounds is not low, if one looks at row materials and the simplicity of the design.. I wonder why it does not cost somewhere near 200
FFS go digital!!!!
It wouldn't be as much fun. 😉
While you're at it, stop playing hand-made musical instruments and use a synthesizer. Also, get a set of virtual reality goggles so that life itself is simulated. The only real things that you will require are Doritos and Mountain Dew.
@@Chris-wj4ze I'm sure, well pretty sure, that you can't help talking like a twat........
Sure, when any digital camera can come even remotely close to the resolution and detail of an 8x10 negative. Gimme a call in 50 years.
@@UltraSaturday psssssst - they already can.....
nice video, however would it not be better to go for a 4*5 and have the lighter weight and BETTER QUALITY, than a bulkier and MEDIOCRE quality 8*10?? think if you have to 'BODGE' the camera that much to get a stable shot, TELL INTREPID to make a BETTER CAMERA, and buy something better man!!, than have to put up with this sort of cheap Chinese crap; even though a chamonix is Chinese, at least it's a half decent camera, with lockable movements, AND is made of REAL WOOD, not what looks like chipboard and finally the Chamonix at least has detents so referencing the camera during assembly is an easy job, not guesswork like on this camera!!
andy van A large format view camera is simply a light proof box that holds a lens on one side, and a film holder on the other. My ~$9000 Arca Swiss camera will take photos with the same quality as this $600 camera. The 4x5 camera I use to own weighed more than the Intrepid 8x10. The Intrepid’s rear standard is more stable than the rear standard on my Arca Swiss, and after a simple modification with gaffers tape, the front standard of the Intrepid is pretty similar to the Arca Swiss. I don’t know about you, but I think that is pretty impressive. I am unsure of your motivation, but I am very satisfied with the Intrepid for the purpose of backpacking, and have several additional photos in my portfolio thanks to the lightweight design.
When you are an engineer, you always know that there will be tradeoffs made. Make it light, cheap, ultra precise, from the best materials and small. However, that is not how it works. You can have one or two, but you cannot have it all. The trick is finding the right balance for the application.
Why would you choose 4x5 over an 8x10, Andy? If you have a choice between these two, there's really no choice, you take the 8x10 EVERY TIME. Also don't forget that the Intrepid is $500, where an equivalent Chamonix is $3000...
it's made in the UK, not China.
what a crap of a camera... you need glue and tape to make it work...
Kirill Tigai No camera is perfect, but you are getting a 700+ megapixel camera for $600. A similar camera made by other companies is in the $3k to $5k range. A matter of perspective is always important.