I got Scammed on eBay buying an Interurban Locomotive - Can It Be Fixed?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ต.ค. 2024
- A couple months ago I was browsing eBay and I found this class c Illinois Central interurban locomotive and managed to outbid everyone. As it would turn out it wasn't as much of a "win" as I originally thought. Right out of the box this thing had countless issues despite the seller claiming that it was in working order. I decided to try and fix it myself which is not a great idea since it would void any chance of a refund but it ended up working out.
I sold that exact model in the video on eBay 2 years ago, because I have a fleet of 6 already and this one was deemed needing too much work. Glad to see you got it running. It definitely didn’t run when I sold it, so whoever you bought it from wasn’t honest.
This engine was imported by Ed Suydam under the Suydam brand name. He began importing many traction related models in the 1950s. You did a very nice job in bringing it back to life. Many Suydam models are difficult to find these days. Congratulations on an excellent buy.
Thanks for the info!
If this model dates in the 1950s it is recomendable to renew the wiring because old wires tend to loose their insulation. Current wire insulations get less brittle over time.
😢😭😭😭
love you
The inter urban is a strong runner! Your clean-up n maintenance repairs really helped maximize its former glory!❤🎉😊
Good job on fixing such a complex motor! I could’ve never done that. 😂
The design of the chassis was super confusing when I first started working on it. The challenge with brass is that everything is a spot for a short.
Gonna be honest, I would've given up and thrown the towel in once I saw it wouldn't run. You're so talented and patient that you saw it as an opportunity, that's amazing! love the videos, keep it up!
I have learned from smt, and have repaired plenty of locos
Thanks. Honestly I had to step back a couple times working on this one and think about what to do next. The problem this brass is that just about anything could be where the short is coming from.
Same 😆
Well but those locos are a bit like classic cars. Repairs are part of the deal ;)
The prototype of this locomotive is a Class C from the Illinois Terminal and was built in Decatur, Illinois in the 1940's. I have seen these models with all 16 wheels driven.
YES! I had one that was 16 wheel drive, and because it was brass, i ended up selling it to an Illinois Terminal enthusiast, and i have no clue where it went after he bought it.
I've never seen a Tenshodo locomotive before. They are quite expensive here but this one I must admit looks very cool. Didn't expect a band drive. Excellent repair. Thanks to your videos I eventually got confident enough to buy broken locos and repair them myself. 90% of the time it's just dirty wheels and commutators. You're truly a locomotive wizard 👌 great video really love em
Oh no!😢 Sorry for you Harrison. Maybe just don't buy stuff from that seller anymore. Great to see you at least got it going again!
Not a big deal since I got it working honestly, I just wish they had just been more truthful.
I certainly agree.
Noooo, people are horrible but atleast you made it run! I swear you work magic on these trains!
Hi again Harrison greetings from the UK, I am watching another one of your rebuilds sadly a lot of us have bought ebay models that turn out to be non-runners but with a little work they can usually be returned to working order. Your collection of HO models are so different to what we usually see here and your solutions to problems are really helpful. Keep up the good work.
Brian.
I'm glad you find these videos helpful. I don't have an issue with people selling non runners, I just want them to be honest about it since it effects the price.
Alot of far eastern hanbuilt brass equipment has problems even when new. Usually the earlier they were made the worse they were.
Some makers were far worse than others.
However owners back then had more capabilities to fix some if the problems to an extent.
Well done that you were able to get it running where many could not.
A cautionary tale for those buying old brass equipment or any models without knowing what to expect. Sellers seem to have unusual ideas of what running means.
The thing I find challenging with hunting down shorts on brass locomotives is that any surface could be where the short is coming from.
That is really a great find in my opinion - and to see how you repair things and find the issues to correct is cool. I’m new to the hobby and have yet to lay some track - bought a simple “starter set” just about to begin - I’d love to have the knowledge you have and enjoy all your videos so far. Thanks for sharing .
Thanks. What starter set did you choose?
I have a couple of these, as well as a couple of Class B’s (the two truck version of these freight motors. The Class C’s I have are from a later run that have all four trucks powered. These were made by Orion, and imported by Suydam. If you want any history on the freight motors these are based on, I’m a member of the Illinois Traction Society. We cover the history of the Illinois Traction/Terminal. I grew up one street over from where the IT ran in my hometown. Great video!
Amazing job as always, and keep being awesome! :D
Yea ebay can be a shady place if you’re not too careful i always check the full description even if its claimed to be powered or running but usually ebay isnt all that bad
Most sellers are pretty good about being honest to avoid negative feedback but that doesn't mean it can't go wrong.
You did a great job of sorting out the running problem. I find if you have some idea of how it should work - you have a good start. Well done and Thank you. Stay Safe.
Master class in trouble shooting and servicing. Nice to see something a little different. You’re at the point where nothing fazes you anymore, you just fix it. Thanks for sharing!
Interurban railways were very widely used all over the place, sadly most of the orginal track has been removed for a long time. The closest interurban line to my home was in Northville MI, and the line ran right down Main Street. I learned once that some interurbans also hauled various freight cars along with their passengers.
Nice locomotive, though! Most interurbans I've seen look more like streetcars. It's nice to see some variation.
Wow.. Doctor.. That was really really great of you to work on this unusual locomotive.. Real brain work.. Also had never seen this kind off locomotive.. ILLINOIS TERMINAL SYSTEM Class C Electric Locomotive.. Well done.
Seller: "It was running fine, so I detached a wire, flipped a truck, and took off some insulators for you."
Haha, "yeah bro, it like was running before I broke it"
Brilliant work there! Would have never guessed that a mechanism of that sort of design could run so well. Guess that is a testament to Tenshodo's quality.
This isn't Tenshodo....
Great video. As someone who is planning their first layout, it's great to see the troubleshooting along with the regular videos just to give everyone ideas how to fix stuff. (Hoping to get some newer engines and cars to start with though.) 😉
Thanks Harrison for the video. Very nice model, it always interesting to see how many different kinds of trains and engines out in the world.
Outstanding, SMT... congrat's on this brass electric. You've done well. John BC, Canada
You can never be too sure when it comes to buying stuff online. Some people you can trust to back up their descriptions, but some people simply aren't as invested in making sure that everything they sell is exactly as advertised. And one person's "runs well" might be another person's "barely runs at all"- it's all very subjective. Depending on the fault, it's not a problem to me if the things I buy don't work- I always expect that, when buying used, I need to service my new purchase.
The problem comes when someone advertises something as working- especially if they're charging more for it, because it doesn't need any work. If it turns out it's in need of a lot of work, while I technically can do it, it's still upsetting. It feels rather insulting to shell out extra for something ready to run, and then end up having to put in all the work to make it run again because it wasn't sold as advertised.
I had someone about ten years ago pitch a fit on eBay, because he sold a "mint" condition engine to me that didn't run...the years of corrosion on the wheels and gears were obvious to a blind man...didn't like the negative feedback...tried to get me to ship it back, for a refund, which I wouldn't do, because it wasn't a million dollars, and I knew he'd just repost it for sale again...figured I'd take the loss, and save someone else the headache when he tried to sell it again...learned to keep a naughty and nice list of ebay sellers after that...luckily, he's been the only problem I've ever really had with n gauge trains & CD/DVDs...🤔
"Runs well" and "barely runs at all" are not subjective terms. They are completely different.
I've never seen a locomotive like that before....enjoyed watching you get it running and how you got it going!!!!!
Harrison great work as always. Awesome video.
Hey smt do you have the Pere Marquette 1225 I think you can get it with dcc or DC
I have some similar locomotives but not 1225
I’m Sorry But I Don’t E bay My Choices are? Eau Claire, Rice Lake , or Madison For Train Shows only. Or I go hobby Lobby or Classic in Eau Claire.
I've been scammed several times at train shows too
Not Trying To Offend Anyone.
We Learn One Way Or Another So Far I have Been Careful.
congratulations harden! i hope your layout comes out well!
Brass locomotives never ran good right out of the box even when it was brand new.most were just put in a display case. I remember a case where a manufacturer had 1.2 volt motors instead of 12 volt motors and he got no complaints because they all went right in the display case
The Illinois Traction System built 20 Class C electric interurban freight locomotives at their Decatur , IL shops, using trucks, traction motors and control equipment from retired passenger cars. Later it became the Illinois Terminal Railroad. These were needed as freight trains became heavier. The Class C is 52' 5" long and weighs 160,000 lbs. The eight 75 HP traction motors used in its articulated four truck design could produce 1,500 HP for short periods of time. This design used two independent cast steel sub-frame that are each 20' 7" long and 9' 2 ½ " wide and are ballasted with scrap steel and concrete. This gives it a (B-B)-(B-B) classification; two unconnected frames, each with two swiveling trucks, and all axles are powered. The design made it very flexible, able to take 35' radius street track curves, and spreads out its weight, avoiding the need to replace light rail and existing bridges on the line. These locomotives could operate in multiple with each other as well as Class B locomotives. They ran on 600 volt DC power taken from an overhead wire via trolley poles. The columns at the end are sandboxes used when improve traction was needed. Considered one of the most successful electric "interurban" of the first half of the 20th century, the Illinois Terminal operated both passenger and freight service between downtown St. Louis and central Illinois . It crossed the Mississippi River on the McKinley Bridge . Number 1595 was donated in 1956 by the Illinois Terminal Railroad when the railroad ended both long-haul passenger and electrified freight service.
Thanks for all the info!
Great video and love your vids and can you try to get some Santa fe cars for the super chief? I do learn alot about ho trains from you, if it picks me i dont know if it Will run on Märklin track, i have the newer ones.
That is a pretty cool locomotive. I have never seen that sort of drive system before, not sure what it is called, with the double spring band for each truck. The motor seems to have an electromagnet instead of a permanent magnet for the stator, don't think I've seen that on a model train before. Also, when it was running at the higher speeds, the noise it made sort of reminded me of the noise that old electric motors and subway cars would make, with their straight cut gears.
Nice video. Thanks for sharing.
Quite interesting way to troubleshoot the issue!
Starting to play around with traction. Very nice Harrison. Think you might have a typo in the description as Illinois Central was a steam road and the Class C would have been Illinois Terminal. IT started out as an interurban but deep sixed passenger service in the mid 50s and dieselized at that time. Lasted as an independent diesel road til 80 or 81 when it got borged by NW. We have one of their Class B motors ( same design but simply the non articulated 2 truck version)out at Illinois Railway Museum.
Did you know Illinois terminal is my favorite railroad
That things got a great litttle motor in it, very smooth no cogging and good low speed. Nice quality brass interurban great find.
That was made by Sydam. It is an Illinois Terminal class C freight motor, the one you have is a first run made back in the mid to late 60's. The 2nd run had all the trucks geared. I have had several of them, the paint job is incorrect. It should be Brewster green body with a terracotta red roof or apple green with a white top depending on the numbers used.
Thanks for the info. I was wondering what it was suppose to be
We had that same blue transformer. Came with a basic set in the late 1970s. I'm sure my brother still has it. We kept all our toys and I know he has the train stuff.
Nice got the Old interurban trolley running looks nice I like it
If you can ever get down to the Illinois Railway Museum when they have their interurban weekend you would gave a blast.
Really interesting engine, the drive system is apparently a common design for old brass models, I have a 2-6-6-2 with a similar drive to that interurban car
Holy moly I won the raffle 2:53❤🎉 thanks smt computer you made my day I never won anything before
Love seeing the wide collection of trains you have. its certainly inspired me to start my own! ^w^
I like your profile picture
Thanks ❤️
@@durrainsnow8455 my profile picture is a robot
Welcome to the hobby!
@@durrainsnow8455 are you a furry?
One reason it may not have run wa because it was meant to run on overhead wire, and not on regular track. It's a common thing in traction modelling.
And some traction models don't have the wheels insulated. It's a bit like Lionel, except the 2nd contact is overhead. No special wiring for reverse loops.
To be honest, i got too distracted looking at your nice layout...as an n gauger, im sometimes jealous of what you guys have in ho (specifically train cars for my nyc mta)...but, then remember as an apartment dweller, i need to do n, for space reasons, and because I'm a rolling stock junkie...yeah, I'm one of those that can never run multiple matching ore cars, gondolas, or boxcars...😁
You have done a fine job getting this locomotive to run. It is not, however, an interurban. It is simply an electric locomotive, made to pull cars just like steam or diesel.
Interurbans are passenger carriers. They were larger and faster than trolleys and streetcars, and were designed to move quickly between towns, villages and cities. Many were capable of more than 100 mph. They were usually more comfortable than city trolleys, with better seats and toilets. Many had a baggage compartment and some had trailers that carried freight, or could pull a freight car or two.
Thanks for the info
IT was an interurban line. Most carried some sort of freight in addition to passenger service
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_Terminal_Railroad
That’s a cool locomotive!
Wow…it creeps along really well also!
Serenity! We have a runner! Cheers from eastern TN
👉 This particular model looks similar to several third rail electrics used by New York Central and its subsidiary Cleveland Union Terminal ( CUT ) .
Looks great!
It looks like a Yosemite valley freight electric interurban. I could be wrong but that's what popped into my head when I first saw it.
Hello i love you videos and i try to be like you and my birthday is sunday the 17 December but i can't get train stuff like you but i love your videos your bigest fan eve lollis
Nice repair job. That is a very cool piece to have.
Could be as simple as a wire rubbing against the frame or the body plastic crumbles off wires with age that's why claw situation is so much better because it does not dry out with age I said cloth not claw.
I like the videos where you fix locmotives. Maybe if I watch more of your videos I'll scratch build my own H0 locomotive
It's fun to work on this kinda stuff and project locomotives are pretty cheap.
@@SMTMainline indeed it is, unfortunately I live in Romania and I don't think I'll ever afford a locomotive that is of decent quality, so scratchbuilding is my only option. It's fun to make locomotives/rolling stock, but I often don't respect scale, but I think it's around 1:32 or something. But I might start production of some smaller locomotives to have in my living room and not my garden. So far I've learned a lot about woodworking and electronics and with every new piece of rolling stock I make them better and better.
My dream is to make a garden railway in my Grandparents' backyard and I am getting there, slowly and surely, but it'll certainly be put on a backburner as next year I have some pretty important exams... I'm confident I will not give up on my dream.
And regarding the production of smaller rolling stock, I think I'll probably do something 1:64 or 1:48 since the gauge is small enough that it's easy to work with and it won't be that hard to add details. I found H0 quite hard to work with when it comes to trains made out of wood.
You really should give the seller negative (or at least neutral) ratings.. If for nothing else, then to serve as a warning for other potential buyers. If he makes claims like that about your listing, then he's certain to make the same dubious claims for other listings.
Their other feedback seems to be very good so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and hope they were being honest. It seems like a bit of a long shot considering how many different issues it had though
absolutely gorgeous I believe you did not get scammed at all. Maybe it ran when the seller Tested it. No telling how long it wasn't used. Great buy, Congrats
I hope that's the case. I find it hard to believe considering how many issues it had but it's not impossible that it somehow ran for a moment.
@@SMTMainline Well you got it running and it is gorgeous. Amazing to think it might be 60 years or older. Fantastic find.
Buying on eBay is always a gamble to some extent. I purchased a Bachmann 4-8-4 Northern. The description said sluggish in forward, but runs better in reverse. In actuality the plastic couplers between the eight drivers were all cracked causing the quartering to be way off. Contacted Bachmann repair. Wasted time. They said it was too old to make any guarantees, but send it and they should be able to take a look in 4-6 weeks! Their further response was parts were discontinued 15 years ago. There are NO after market replacements to get the loco running again.
Yeah the old Bachmann Daylights are notorious for quartering problems as they age. They thankfully fixed that problem on modern releases, but those old ones are all SOL.
At least you can fix these guys, I woulda been MAAAAAAD
There such a complex locomotive good luck SMT
The spring band design was designed by a Japanese firm called Syndam. They're best known for models of traction, including freight motors, trolleys, interurbans, and gas electric rail cars. I'd date this model late 70s to late 80s.
Ed Suydam wasn't japanese but American, he got the brass trolleys and interurbans made in small series in the far east
Sorry it wasn't a runner right out of the box but I'm really glad we got to see you fix it. I love your restoration and clean up videos.
Honestly its VERY common for old brass trains to have shorting issues. They can be a real pain.
When everything is a potential source it can be hard to track.
Often in trolley/traction modelling, both the rails are joined together as one leg of the circuit and the overhead wire as the other
Good point! That's most likely how this was set up to run.
Engine repairman extraordinaire!
Interesting concept of power transmission and the motor looks very powerful, like 20 W - a bit much for a H0 model loco.
It seems to run half decent. I think it must be lower than a 20 watt or the current draw would be higher.
I normally comment from my other TH-cam account called the Eco guys, but watching you today on this account of course I've followed you on both accounts subscribe that is. This was a fantastic little video to watch. This is what scares me about ordering things on eBay since I'm not as good as you are at fixing things if I get something that's broken. But I am learning a lot by watching you. I am the guy who lost my entire HO train set in a house fire. But I was collecting from a little boy. Sad and I am very slowly as I can afford it which I can't afford much these days rebuilding my ho set. Right now I'm buying box cars and other items that I lost in the fire that I'm finding on eBay vintage things that go back to that point. But enough of my sad story. I just enjoy watching your videos and I'm learning a lot. This Channel and the education you put out. Entertaining becoming one of my favorite channels definitely.
Sorry to hear about your loss, I can't imagine what going through that must have been like. I hope you can find exactly what you need to build an awesome new layout.
@@SMTMainline I am trying. The Covid really hurt my businesses and money is an issue, but I will not give up. Thank you for the knowledge and inspiration
Québec ! That's cool ! Very interesting videos, thanks for sharing 😊
I like your videos
Good job i try to watch all your videos
What a great find. Hopefully, you find a front-end plow along with adding couplers to add it to a run session in the future.
E Suydam & Company ??
I think to say you were “scammed” was a bit exaggerated. The unit only needed minor fettling, well within the expectations of most competent modellers. To throw the towel in as one bonehead suggested probably explains why so many fine but different models get lost forever. Your persistence is commendable but really there was nothing I would describe as a “scam”. This fascinating model now runs superbly well with a lot less effort than I’ve used to bring “non runners” back to life. Jealous? Raaather!
The reason it could be a scam is because it was sold in what was suppose to be working order which increases the price 5x. If people wanna sell things that are broken that's okay but they have to be honest about it.
i love trains, little track but a whole shoe box of cars, and when looking at videos of HO scale trains i think i have all older ones because of the couplers, and i have the batch man santa fe 307 set, when i looked up my nickle plate road tender i saw one similar for $92.
Cleaning brass pickup Wheels with a piece of bright boy track cleaner boy does that bring back memories of my HO scale days.
They do a wonderful job at that.
I enjoy your, “We got a runner!” declaration! Ironically funny! Your problem solving assessment skills are impressive. Bravo!
That locomotive is so cool with the 16 wheels under it. I'm glad you were able to get it running.
😆 Try a dirty lawnmower sometime. Same deal. Clean em' up and they usually run pretty well. ✌️
Choo-choo!
I agree, it's not always worth returning something. Might as well fix it while you have it. It's possible that it got bounced around in shipping. Great job on the repair. That looks like a pretty strong motor and drive system. All metal parts.
Hopefully that was the case and it actually did work on the test. Despite being unlikely
Nice work, I would still leave negative feedback as that's the really the only weapon we have to combat dishonest Escam errr Ebay sellers. Great video!
I'll try to give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they might have somehow got it to run for a few seconds but considering how many issues it had I find that hard to believe.
Reminds me a bit of Mister Roger's neighborhood
I'm new to the hobbie and have yet to build my first layout. I have a plan in mind. First im building a small diorama just to practice and learn what im doing. I discovered your TH-cam channel (among the hundreds out there) and enjoy watch how you do things. Thank you.
Looks like "Messed up and self-disasembled in transit". More like incompetence than malice.
I'd like to think so. I have a hard time believing this thing ran okay with the amount of different issues it had however the seller seems to have really good feedback so maybe they truly didn't know.
Hi, I love fixing things and I've made use of so many things to affect a repair and as soon as you mentioned needing an isolation washer I immediately looked at the Qtip ear buds stalks. Lol.
I don't know the internal diameter of the hollow stalks and I don't know the diameter of the axles I also have no idea of whether or not you could of hobby knife sliced the thinnest of a slither of the buds hollow stalk to make an insulation spacer.?
I just thought I'd share, you know, Knowledge, power and all that.
Nice repair. Cheers & TTFN
Thanks for the idea, I hadn't thought of that.
It would be really cool to get a locomotive like that one. I managed to get a tyco gp-20 GM&O for $20 at a hobby shop.
You put so much effort into maintenance, upgrades and repair and as a result, you teach us a lot-thank you! I’m glad you could make this a working locomotive. eBay is an unpredictable place.
Do you plan to string an overhead wire for a growing traction fleet? 😊
Maybe on the industrial side
Hey SMT i own a bachmann F7 from the Bachmann Challenger train set and it doesn’t run but the light turns on only i tried tapping on it but it did nothing.
Man why do I always miss the giveaways 😒
What a great addition to your collection! Always amazed at how you bring these locomotives back to life.
Cool very nice of you train looks great 😃👍
I gave my old HO train layout to the local train club to give to a deserving kid.
That was very kind of you.
I have 4 of those currently thanks for the video.
I noticed IMMEDIATELY when you turned it over that the INSULATED axles were NOT aligned properly with the non insulated axles and thus caused a short . VERY common issue , Happens
alot with older model Locomotives .. I've been working on Model Railroad Trains for 60+ years : )
I think someone might have dropped it at some point. It was strange that it was also missing a washer on one of the trucks.
I mean hey… you were able to fix it and find the issue right away…. Also could be worse. You could accidentally buy a real locomotive thinking it’s an HO scale locomotive lmao.
Boy that is a strange locomotive both in how it’s made and with the prototype. It’s too bad you got scammed there, I’ve been scammed in the hobby as well, and it’s not fun. Lucky for me that it was just my local hobby shop’s consignment area, but not everyone is as lucky.
Amazing how you diagnosed and fixed all the problems. Looks great running.
Cool train and awesome work. I do have a question how do you bids. Do you have bid snipper or do just get lucky because I could never win any bids the last couple months. I do like Interurban trains they are cool and odd looking trains and keep up the good work
Ebay is really just another place where caveat emptor is good policy. Congratulations on this acquisition, and thank you for showing the way troubleshooting ought to be done. I think I should say a word on terminology: while the scorch marks indicate there were short circuits the initial problem (the disconnected wire) is an open circuit. Thank you for letting me climb on my soapbox for a moment and address a pet peeve.
I the wheels being rotated and the missing isolators were probably the main issue although that wire could have been touching anything inside and causing a short.
@ChrisBullington - While I would agree with you, Chris, that some sellers on eBay aren't the most honest of people, my experience has shown me that most are. Of the 2300 or so purchases I've made on eBay (most of which were for NOT brand new product), only about 30 (or 0.013%) have had issues. The worse was getting a DVD that I'd been looking for a long time. Seller said it was Brand New. When it arrived (Media Mail) it was still in its original cellophane wrap. I opened it up, popped it into my player, and it ran perfectly for the first 43 minutes (video was 1 hour 16 minutes long). At that point the video on the screen literally froze. I popped the disk out to see if I'd accidentally scratched it. Nothing that I could see. Then I gave it a careful cleaning. Looked truly brand new after that. Popped it back in the player again--and the same thing happened. Popped it back out and skimmed the playing surface with a magnifier. Saw no defects. In fact, the the disk looked pristine in all aspects. Tried it again--same thing! I then contacted the seller, described my problem, and then waited (and waited and waited) for a reply. Three weeks later I got a "new" disk. Popped it in my player--and it, too, did the same thing. I notified the Seller again, letting him know that his source was sending him defective disks--or else he was making copies from a defective disk. Haven't heard anything from him since. Left all negative feedback for him, too. Still have the disks in case anyone has any suggestions on resurrecting (if it's possible) the disk.