Anyone else think that the reason that Dumbledore hates the dementors so much is because he is reliving that initial duel between him, Aberforth, and Grindlewald (when Arianna dies)? He is tortured by that moment and is forced to relive it.
Absolutely. Like Harry the worse traumatic memories one has in their past the more they dislike the dementors and the more seriously they take the threat of them. I think it's also a major factor that Dumbledore is just more aware of their dark nature and that they will side with Voldemort in the event of his return.
I don't think that's the REASON why he hates them, I definitely agree that's what he experiences near them, but I think he'd aware of what the kiss does and the fact they are aligned with dark forces that is just everything awful
Off topic but my kids are both autistic. My son loves your intro and music is his thing he keeps starting it just to listen. My daughter has trouble sleeping and finds this podcast soothing. I love the content but it honestly helps my family and I appreciate it.
@@kyriepitcher355 I’m going to make you love them even more. I’m autistic (but an adult). I went to one of their live shows in June. After the show I was super overstimulated (but in the good way) and needed to de-stim and hung out while everyone else was leaving. The guys came out at the end of the show and I explained to them why I was still there. They were super nice and chill about it and we ended up chatting for like 20 mins!
Sirius has not escaped before seeing Weasleys (and Peter) in the Daily Prophet! Dumbledore sending Weasleys to Egypt to thwart Sirius makes ZERO sense to me. But like this is the third video they make this claim… am I missing something here?
I didn't see the part where they said it was about Sirius. The sending the Weasley's to Egypt thing is to protect him to Dumbledore. He needs Harry to be technically living with the dursleys so that the protection spell keeps working. It's not about Sirius, it's about Voldemort.
@ but they also said he didn‘t have a problem with harry staying with the dursleys in other years, precisely because the „threat of sirius“ hadn‘t been around then.
You know what’s funny is even if Harry had died in the forest, his act of sacrifice literally turned every person in the castle into a new chosen one. Because when Voldemort comes back he can’t hurt any of the people in the castle due to the same sacrificial magic Lily used. Harry enacted the same love protection on a massive scale. So Voldemort was GOING to go down even if Harry had died. Someone else would have done it.
Florian Fortiscue in this book is a set up for something that never paid off. There is an old Pottermore article (that is also in the new From the Wizarding Archive books/audiobook), that clarifies he was set up to be very knowledgable about Wizarding History and that he would have some rare knowledge he would tell Harry later in the series, but that Rowling later dropped that or couldn't fit it in the story as it panned out. The fact that both Florian and Olivander gets captured in Half-Blood is a nod to this as well and might even show that she was still trying to make him part of the conclusion somehow, but ultimately killed off page.
Florian was always suppose to be “dumbledore's man” in the Alley… However, the story didn’t need another adult non-DarkLord supporter for readers to keep track of, and after the events of book 4, then the eventual opening of Weasley’s; the shop owner angle, was already over-saturated for plot options… In death: he faced an Ice-cream cooler, that he been transfigured into a bear. Gruesome way to go…
One reason that might explain how Dumbledore never found out about what the Marauders were up to doing their years at school, could be that Dumbledore was very frequently abscent during that time, fighting off Voldemort etc and dealings with the order etc.
Yup. The war was really ramping up at this point, and Dumbledore was the most powerful wizard in the world. He likely tried hunting Voldemort down many times, knowing that with the Elder Wand, he could certainly beat him. Voldemort, of course, was always one step ahead. A team of Aurors was surely hunting for Voldemort too, but to no avail. The war continued and people kept dying. Unlike Grindelwald, who acted in the open, Voldemort acted from the shadows, patiently wearing out his enemies.
It's kinda sad that Hermione never invites Harry home with her (the few times she's there, like in the beginning of this book). Like sure, her parents are muggles and she might be hesitant to bring SOME wizards (Ron) into her house, but Harry lives with muggles.
There is a rather dark aspect to this. Hermione rarely talked about her parents, and we rarely see them in the books. Even during the holidays, she is almost always staying at the Burrow, Grimmauld Place or Hogwarts. She never even mentions her life before she learned what she was. I have no idea if Rowling planted that seed intentionally, but it is there. Hermione even used a very powerful memory charm on them that, if reversed, can cause brain damage. That is a horrific thing to do to anyone, never mind your parents, especially without their consent.
@@Cailus3542 pretty sure it's more just that Harry Potter is supposed to be kind of escapist fantasy for children and just visiting your friend is not exactly unknown exciting magic stuff, so they are only mentioned when necessary (like the whole what about her parents when she goes on the lets destroy voldemort camping trip)
Still running into the problem that Sirius escaped from Azkaban after the Weasley's went to Egypt. Not only could this not have been part of Dumbledore's plan to protect Harry, but being out of the country would have been safer for him. Harry is safe from Voldemort and anyone taking orders from Voldemort at the Dursley's. He's not safe from a rouge death eater acting on his own.
Came here to say the same thing! The Weaselys must have wanted it to just be a family trip and/or felt weird about taking Harry abroad. Sirius not breaking out until after he saw Peter in the Egypt picture is an easy detail to mix up/forget though. It’s a smaller reveal amidst a ton of huge reveals
They never said he sends the wesley's were sent to Egypt bc of Sirius's escape.their theory is that he wanted Harry not to have the option of staying at the Weasley's bc of the lack of blood protection.
Peter was actually at Hogwarts much longer than 2 years at this point, since he was with Percy before Percy became a prefect. Also do you think Peter being Ron’s rat, is that why Ron had trouble transfiguring him? Now I’m picture what Peter is thinking when being transformed into a goblet!
That transfiguration thing is a movie only detail, it doesn't happen at all in the books and all transfiguration components seem to always be available in the school (as they probably can be detransfigured and reused anyway)
@@failurenotsorry6600 but it calls into question if it even happened ever, the movies are unfaithful adaptations and not primary canon It's like Ron being in the forest year 1
@@heylolp9 okay? that isn't relevant. the point is the commentor was wondering if it was a clever detail that was hinting at scabber's true nature, hence the speculation.
@failurenotsorry6600 the answer if the 2nd movie adapted a detail that is part of book 3 because maybe "they wanted to include a easter egg" is No The Movie wanted visual jokes The only lesson ever that any Pet is part of the Lesson is the Potions Class where Snape wants to poison Neville's Toad Trevor Beyond that it's only Hedwig turning up during History of Magic, injured in Book 5 The Movies wanted to show how Ron's broken wand doesn't work, not as foreshadowing of Scabbers next Movie but as foreshadowing for the Lockhart wand backfiring, even though Books 1 2 and 3 were released at time of Movie 2's making Because if it was intentional then anything beyond the scene would exist in Canon to back this up Why would everyone in class get a Rat to transform anyway, except for Students that own a Rat (against express school rules) as a pet? That Class of Transfiguration, the same where Hermione asks McGonagall about the Chamber of Secrets, doesn't even exist Hermione asks Professor Binns This entire lesson is a full invention of the movies and doesn't work within the book canon, so by the regular rules of Canon that the Harry Potter community agreed upon (Book canon > Movie canon) that scene did not happen at all
okay if they say Dumbledore arranged the Weasley to go to Egypt cause Sirius black escape. well he escaped cause the Weasley won the lottery and was on the front page which happens before Sirius escapes but he arranged cause he escape? so Dumbledore planned the Weasley to go to Egypt cause Sirius black escaped after the daily prophet publish the Weasley's on their vacation....am i missing something here.
The other thing that I think is wrong is Dumbledore wanting to know Harry's greatest fear - or at least it doesn't go to plan. Lupin doesn't let Harry face the boggart, and I think if he had instructions from Dumbledore he would have.
@Elf0304 i think dumbledore suggested it it work in a way cause harry knew his boggart would be a dementor. and we see that while he tired learning the patronus charm.
I'm in the hospital at the moment and the guys really help me relax . Sometimes they make me sleepy which is so helpful. Thank you so🤕 much Super Carlin Brothers!
The holiday/Dumbledore things seems off. Sirius didn't escape until after he saw the photo in Fudge's Prophet which was taken when the family was already in Egypt.
In book 2 Harry was rescued by the weasleys and Dumbledore probably thought that he was save enough there, as long as he returns to the Dursleys next year. The egypt holiday could be an excuse, why he has to go back to the Dursleys.
@@philw6056 but that is not what they said. Also to keep the protection alive, he indeed needed to return, but he did not need to stay for a long time. If this was Dumbledore’s plan, he could just make Harry wait-it-out for a week or so and then off he goes.
@@Alwarin1 I think it isn't about time, but his feeling. As long as he genuinely calls at the Dursleys "home" he is safe and can go to the Weasleys or whereever as a guest.
@ in that case the protection would end like 10 years ago, as Harry never felt at home with Dursleys… but OK, he technically did not know about alternative so we can give it a pass, but at very least, at the end of the Philosophers stone Harry claimed that he is not going home when boarding the Express back to London. That magic seems to be working on some kind of technicality, but I think either way it should be fine if he went to visit Ron (or anybody) for majority of summer (he did that in years 4 and 5)
@@Alwarin1 He didn't feel positive about his home, but at least until book 3 his worst nightmare is being expelled from hogwarts. Because his "home" were the Dursleys. He never thought, if Ron and I were expelled, we could live together at the Weasleys.
I think as far as the bogart goes, it can't have manifested as a dementor if Harry never saw one first. The whole "I believe what you fear most is fear itself" is an interpretation of Harry's bogart from Lupin more than anything else. Harry himself even said he was thinking about Voldemort until he remembered the effect the dementor had on him. I think the bogart would have been Voldemort had he not encountered the dementor, but its much less because Harry fears Voldemort and more he fears what Voldemort represents and what he could do to his loved ones if he isn't stopped. Just my interpretation, I love these episodes that go through how Dumbledore planned the year to go and where things lined up and where they didn't
To me, prophecies in the Potterverse have always been determinations of *character* not fate. Trelawney's prophecy has always been a prediction of what Voldemort (and Harry) would do, not what fate would have them do.
I really want a video about what if Snape never told Voldemort the bit of the prophecy he overheard? The prophecy is still in effect, but no one but Dumbledore knows.
Thought on the Marauders Map. What if there is a code that the Marauders use to “unlock” the map. And that is how when Lupin opens it Peter shows up on the map. There are other ways to open it/get it to give information, and the Map determines based on the user what information they get. Snape, not worthy, gets a rude response. The twins, worthy, get the fun map but the Marauders are protected. The odds that they stumble on the correct password seems low, but if they provide a code this the Marauders deem worthy so they get access to the Map.
I’m guessing that Dumbledore was planning on simply canceling Hogsmeade for everyone, until he found out that Harry didn’t get his form signed and then just rolled with it because while he believes Sirius is guilty, he’s also only after Harry and thus not a threat to the other students.
As far as Dumbledore knows, Sirius is a powerful Dark wizard, just like the rest of his family. Just because he's after Harry doesn't stop him from hurting other children. He actually did hurt Ron, breaking his leg, if unintentionally.
So, the necklace from Borgin & Burke's that Katie accidentally touches (but was meant for Dumbledore), do we think it couldve have been someone else's horcrux? Also meant to be interracted with?
What if Sirius had seeked out Dumbledore to try and explain himself. I know Sirius was dead set at his goal to just hunt down Peter, but just what if.. Dumbledore is the type of person that would atleast hear Sirius out instead of just turning him in right away.
He wouldn't even need to go to Dumbledore in person. After his escape with Buckbeak he was able to send an owl (Pigwidgeon) to Harry, so why couldn't he just send an owl with a letter to Dumbledore and explain the whole story without a great risk for himself?
@@rittersportfan i mean sure he could do that but i would think it more likely for Dumbledore to realise Sirius' innocence if he met with him face to face. Also the fact that Sirius would even try to go to Dumbledore directly would be something Dumbledore would've looked at as a major thing for the story to be true. Cause if Sirius was actually guilty then going right to Dumbledore would've been the dumbest thing ever.
One Question: How was Harry protected from Sirius as long as he stayed at the Dursleys ? I thought the protection from Lily's sacrifice only worked against Voldemort himself. Or am I missing something ?
The protection was also supposed to end at 17 but supposedly Voldemort kept it alive in himself and that's what let Harry to live. Even though the protection should have ended by that point.
@satsujin-shathewitchkingof6185 Extending the duration of the protection is one thing. But Dumbledore could only put the protection on the House of the Dursleys since Petunia and Lily were sisters and Harry was connected to both of them by blood. In no way could Dumbledore extend the protection to other enemies when it's based on Lily's protection which was only targeted at Voldemort himself. But this also creates another plot hole. Why didn't the Death Eaters try to attack the Dursleys house since the protection would not work against them ?
So I have a theory about order of the Phoenix and the weird plot. It gives me sorcerers stone vibes, where dumbledore is intentionally putting lots of protections on the prophecy to lure Voldemort into trying to steal it, so that he can expose Voldemort to the ministry. Dumbledore knows that knowing the rest of the prophecy makes no difference for Voldemort, he will continue to hunt Harry, so he doesn’t really mind if Voldemort actually gets it, he just wants to lure Voldemort into doing exactly what he ends up doing (obviously without Harry getting involved)
Voldemort surely suspects that Dumbledore is trying to draw him out, which is why he never takes the bait. This leads to a stalemate until Voldemort tries another plan.
@ except for he DOES take the bait😅 the very night that Harry goes to the ministry he couldn’t help but go himself. Which also ends up doing exactly what I implied would happen anyway Edit: also it was always part of voldemorts plan to go to the ministry that night as well. None of the death eaters call him and, completely unprompted, with no way of even knowing that Harry has actually taken the bait he goes to the ministry anyway, which also completely undermines voldemorts whole plan of luring Harry to the ministry. It appears as tho he attempted to lure Harry to the ministry, but this was his planned night to get the prophecy, regardless of whether he had successfully lured Harry or not. “If Harry isn’t gonna go to get it tonight, then I’ll just go get it myself. Oh wait, he’s here!! It worked!!” Is what seems to have happened, at least when reading it from every angle.
56:52 wow, what a great question. Agree - Dementors probably couldn’t extract a soul from a horcrux and doubt they would stop after taking one soul from HP.
Hey, brothers! I cannot tell you how much I love listening to this podcast and how much excitement it brings me each week. I am loving listening to each episode again with my husband and diving deeper into each chapter even more. I have a question for you. What if a second safe house had been set up for the Potters? It could be a vacant location and the Potters could be the Secret Keepers. We learn from Harry's memories that they saw him coming and James had time to tell Lily to take Harry and run. We assume she ran upstairs to the bedroom. What would have happened if they had the second location set up and, once they saw Voldemort coming, they Apparated to the second location where nobody else would be able to find them since they are the secret keepers? It would give them time to come up with a new plan and be able to get word to those in the Order that Peter was no longer on their side, and find a new way to keep them safe.
I have a question about Dumbledore's knowledge of Sirius' innocence regarding the death of Lily and James, or lack thereof. I will preface this by saying that I may just not understand how the Fidelius charm works. So if I understand correctly, Dumbledore is the one who performed and placed the Fidelius charm over the Potters. I would assume that the one performing the charm would need to know who the intended secret keeper is in order for the charm to successfully take hold. So in order for Sirius' plan to switch to Peter as the secret keeper to take effect, wouldn't Dumbledore have to have been made privy to the switch PRIOR to the charm being performed? My understanding of the facts: 1. Dumbledore successfully cast a Fidelius charm over the Potters. 2. Sirius was SUPPOSED to be secret keeper. 3. Peter WAS the secret keeper. How could Dumbledore NOT know that Sirius was innocent? Sorry if I'm missing something simple or if this has been covered before. I've already typed all of this out so I'll post it anyways, but after a quick Google search I found that "Dumbledore only suggested the Fidelius charm. Lily and James performed it and chose Peter as secret keeper." This must be what I have been missing this whole time?! 🤣🤦
Another amazing episode from an amazing team! Can't wait for y'all to bring that tour closer to me, so jealous of people who've already gotten to go. Still crazy that we're already on Goblet! Looking forward to chapter 1!
I’m very excited for the next Monday though!! Goblet of fire [and halfblood prince] are my absolute favourites! And I also thought that it would take you absolutely ages to get there But here we are ! Good stuff!) Keep it up!)
I read the Harry Potter series for the first time when I was in my early 30's and I hadn't seen any of the movies. After I read the line about the "glimmer of triumph" I worried it meant Dumbledore was working with Voldemort and I was devastated. 😆
The whole time you guys are talking about Nagini as a snake I just want to remind you that she's not a snake, she's a maledictus. So she has some amount of human soul in her...
Is there any way that you guys could come up with an ending for fantastic beasts since we’re not getting one?? I mean… I know we kinda already know what happens but just adding those details would be so great!!
I'm going to be so there if you all get a tour that comes to Indianapolis, Louisville, and/or Cincinnati. All are within an hour away from me so please do come out to the midwest
I think Dumbledore even planted the idea to use Harry’s blood into Voldemorts head by letting Harry go after the Philosophers stone and showing Voldy the protection in his blood. As soon as Voldemort had the opportunity to get his body back the plan is immediately to use Harry.
To add onto the end question, there is also the thought of "would they even attempt to suck the piece of Voldemort's soul out of Harry due to it being specifically Voldemort's, who would go on to command them, so would the piece of soul have some amount of command or resistance to a Dementor's Kiss?"
I feel like there's a lot of horocrux details glossed over in this discussion and that any of the remainders if given the chance to feed on someone could form into a new prime
In regards to where do the souls consumed by a dementor go, I think the answer to "Where do lost things go?" may hold some insights. "They go into non-being, that is to say everwhere" (Quotes may not be exact this was from memory)
In my head canon, Dementors are like especial mobile Veils. So when they suck a soul, it stays stuck on limbo until the Dementor vanish. They are unable to move on. This connects with your theory that Death is the final evolution of Dementors. Death makes souls move on but Dementors can't. They feed on too emotions because this maintain there existence and the suffering of the souls they suck in limbo. Big fan of the show. Keep up the good work. It would be awesome to see your take on this. Maybe a suggestion for a video.
Hey Brother, I was wondering based on the sword quote from Hermione, would the sword of Gryffindor, impregnated by basilisk venom, could it do damage to anyone's soul? After all, it could kill a horcrux, which is a chunk of soul. Maybe bad guys? or Voldemort? And for that matter, could a tiny scratch from the sword now cause death because of the basilisk venom? Love your podcast. I stay up until 2am on a Sunday night just to watch/listen with no interruptions. Keep up the great analysis and laughs.
Horcruxes are protected by magic that makes them nearly invincible. A soul is not destroyed by physical means at all, except if it is a horcrux. A horcrux is completely dependent on the container. Once the container is destroyed, the soul is destroyed. Regular human souls do not work this way. As Hermione says, if I run you through with a sword, your soul would be just fine. So basilisk venom or not, the sword won't destroy your soul. It can kill you, but your soul will move on. This brings up the question of why the venom did not destroy the horcrux inside Harry when he fought the basilisk. That is because the container, Harry, was not destroyed. If Harry had died, then that horcrux would have died. But Harry lived, so that horcrux lived.
I think that the items of the founders are different from horcruxes because they were the ones that actually made the objects. They didn't just have the objects and just put themselves into it. People say that when you make something you put a part of yourself into whatever you're creating as a piece of like art and any kind of items that you create so that's different from a horcrux and makes these things as part of their you know legacy more unique.
If Buckbeak's trial was meant to show Harry that you should save innocent people, was Dumbledore always planning on saving Buckbeak? Even sending Harry back with the time turner might have been part of the plan. That might explain why he seemed to know they were breaking buckbeak free even before any sirius related things went down.
Before finishing the episode, I am pausing to posit that, perhaps if you destroy soul fragments ("prime", or otherwise), what happens is, you can still restore the person from "the next" soul fragment in the queue. So, you destroy Voldemort prime, and now it is the fragment inside Marvolo's ring that can be restored to full Voldy. If you destroy that, the diary is next, etc. Assuming Horcruxes work in FIFO order, not FILO order.
I think there *is* grounds to believe that the soul radiates emotions, as that would explain how the Horcrux within Harry gives him insight into the strong emotions of Voldemort prime The main issue I see with Dementors destroying Horcuxes however I see in exit points The Mouth is apparently the weak point of the Human body towards Dementors, an Object that was made a Horcrux would be a locked manufactured container, so I think there are measures to be taken to ensure impremnability, that makes Horcruxes have to be destroyed beyond repair to get the soul out of there in the first place And I don't see a way for a Dementor to physically break the container open to feast on the soul So it's to the Dementors in Harry Potter the equivalent to (to borrow from a different fandom) Portal's "The Cake is a lie" Basically Dementors getting to communicate between each other "Horcruxes man? don't even bother, those nuts are impossible to crack!"
A lot of talk about whether or not the dementors could suck out the soul of a beast, but Nagini isn’t technically a beast, she’s a Maledictus. Her soul should still be human.
in an alternate timeline Dumbledore put all his eggs in Harry's basket, but Neville was the chosen, but because he wasn't groomed to succeed he is killed by a triumphant Voldemort
So in “Chamber” when Dumbledore cancels the exams, did he also have the authority to cancels OWLs and NEWTs? Because that is a Ministry thing. And kids need them to get to advanced classes and eventually jobs…
1:01:06 Another question: If someone was kissed by a dementor and became an empty shell, would Voldemort take full control of that body after Voldemort prime possessed that empty shell? After all, there is no other soul inside. Or think of an ordinary ghost. Can they capture an empty shell?
Heres a note that might make you reconsider if dumbeldore knew the entire time if sirus was innocent. So, of course, we get told by hagrid that Sirus asked for Harry that night, claiming to be his godfather. He never tried to forcefully take Harry in fact as soon as he is denied Harry and is told Harry is being brought to dumbeldore. Sirius gives up his flying bike to help hagrid. Then at the end of chapter one hagrid says he is going to return sirius bike. IF DUMBELDORE THOUGHT HE WAS GUILTY WHY WOULD HE LET HAGRID GO!!! I need someone to hear me and get this to SCB i think either dumbeldore had to of always known sirus was innocent as in he knew they switched. This wouldnt mean he would know about them being animagas (sorry about spelling) .Or when hagrid is telling him the story it clicks for dumbeldore the fact sirius didnt try to kill hagrid and harry then and there must of meant he didnt betray them but if he didnt betray them then the only reason voldemort found out is the fact they switched. He would have no clue who they switched it to. Sirus would then get arrested for killing peter pettigrew and 13 muggles. Dumbeldore would assume when sirus kills peter its because sirus knew he was the secret keeper and he knew peter betrayed them. Yet in a rage, sirus did kill peter, and maybe that would be just but its the 13 muggles in which dumbeldore cant defend his crimes which is why he lets him go to azkban. Not knowing james was a stag, sirus a wolf, and peter a rat.
At that time, Sirius hadn't gone after Peter yet. It was only after he went after Peter and Peter framed him that Sirius gets pegged as the traitor. Dumbledore may have suspected that someone betrayed the Potters and that it may have been Sirius, but he just as easily could have suspected Peter, Lupin, or maybe even someone else to be the traitor. The explanation could just easily be that he did not think it was Sirius and that after Peter faked his own death and framed Sirius, it takes Dumbledore by surprise.
@keithg460 I know that's when he gets pegged as the traitor this theory is based on the idea dumbeldore I'd able to realize sirus isn't the traitor and dumbeldore knew all along. I think it has some really validity. Would love to here SCB's take on it because to me it's a real possibility dumbeldore is so smart I believe he could've connected the dots and if he didnt and still though sirius was the traitor then he shouldn't of allowed hagrid to seek out sirius without warning him
J and Ben, my issue is this: we say that Dumbledore did not seek Voldemort when he was weakened in Albania because of the prophecy, but Dumbledore also said to Harry that the prophecy is only meaningful because Voldemort puts stock in it. If Dumbledore only thinks the prophecy has power because Voldemort believes it and will act on it, why does that stop Dumbledore from attacking Voldemort while weakened? Just because Voldemort believes he will die at the hands of Harry (or not at all) should not have stopped Dumbledore from seeking to defeat him.
@@satsujin-shathewitchkingof6185 yeah, basically everything he does affirms his faith in the prophecy, so i think he just felt the need to make sure harry wouldn't be inhibited by putting too much faith in it
With the Horcruxes still in play, would there have been a point of attacking until they were all destroyed, though? At best, it would have just slowed him down, and his disembodied spirit would have just moved on to someplace else.
Dementors vs. Horcruxes: I agree that there's no positive emotions coming from the bit of soul so the dementor wouldn't be interested in terms of feeding on it in that way, but it feels like the kiss is a separate thing than happiness-feeding. They probably wouldn't seek out horcruxes because of the lack of happy thoughts, but they seem to kiss people on orders rather than/in addition to some feeding instinct. They don't go around kissing everyone in Azkaban, but they seem to do it readily enough when told to, and I imagine there aren't a lot of happy thoughts left by the time they get to that point. My issues (and I'm not saying they're insurmountable) are 1: how tightly the bit of soul is bound to the vessel (like Hermione says, a living person's soul can go on just fine without a body but the bit in a horcrux is entirely dependent on its container, so I don't think it would be easy to separate them) and 2: there may be other protective measures placed on a horcrux to somehow thwart dementors (repel them, hide the soul bit, whatever). Voldemort can't cast a Patronus, which is the only *known* way to repel dementors, but he's certainly aware of dementors and likely cautious of the threat they present to a yummy little flayed piece of soul, I think it's entirely possible he came up with some sort of Dark Arts method of repelling dementors. Maybe it's Fiendfyre! I never considered the parallel until you brought it up in this video, but it does have similarities to the Patronus in terms of who can cast them and what effect it has on the caster (plus it's a bit like a chaotic evil phoenix... can phoenixes repel dementors? Phoenixes and unicorns: potential natural dementor repellent), so maybe Voldemort rigged up a version of Fiendfyre to attack dementors. All that to say I think a dementor could, with proper persuasion and assuming lack of adequate protection/attachment, kiss the soul out of a horcrux, but they wouldn't be interested in it for its own sake.
15:27 my only thought here is don’t the Weasley’s go on holiday before Sirius escapes? Is it not the photo of them in the daily prophet that causes Sirius to breakout of Azkaban? Or am I remembering wrong?
I don’t know if Dumbledore knew that Harry’s bogart would be a dementor. I think that the test was to see what the dementor would become. Dumbledore’s plan is so brilliant because it’s dynamic-it’s flexible enough to adjust successfully with unexpected changes.
I love this show so much and I have been looking for a new great Harry Potter experience for years! I have a thought. If Sirius Black had died for the marauders would that put the same ancient magic that Lily put on Harry ?
Also, Dumbledore by the time of book 2 was aware of the curse on the DADA position. He also thought he could use the curse to deal with Lockhart and bring a certain amount of justice for his actions.
They don't seem to get that Harry is not in danger from Sirius until after the Wesley's go to Egypt. Their trip being published in the paper is how Sirius learns that Peter is alive.
Harry Potter is famous in the wizarding world. Many wizards would love to have Harry Potter be at their business. Isnt that how famous people are treated. I believe your theory however. And about Sirius not being good with words....did he not just get out of Azkaban after 11 years with dementors? You wont give the character/ man a break. Jeez! I think Snape killed Dumbledore. Murdered him is a bit harsh for what really happened.
Was just listening to Snape grudge again and wanted to provide my own explanation to the snape insult scene with the map. What if, similarly to the founders, the marauders put their intelligence into the map so that they could defend the map from people like filch and Snape, but ensure future troublemakers would know how to use the map? Similar to the sorting hat, the map looks inside the user to discern the “mischeviousness” of the person in question and will reveal the trick to look at the map.
Each of the horcruxes (Voldemort) lacks happy memories, but they have fragments of soul (which dementors suck out). The dementors might not be able to feed on happy memories, but I think they’d still be able to suck out the fragments of soul.
57:40 I dont think Ben is right here. Destroying a horcrux is difficult, thats why they need the basilisk venom or fiendfyre to do it. Horcruxes are inherently hard to destroy. Any extra enchantments on them would give them their offensive capabilities, like the diary draining Ginny or the ring cursing Dumbledore.
The ice cream - it made sense to me. I think of how when Harry first arrived on the wizarding scene and how famous he was. It could just be an extension of that popularity, Folks were not only grateful to Harry but also, they would also feel bad for his loss of both parents that day. There is also the clout that any shop keeper could claim having THE Harry Potter in his store each day for long periods of time. I'm surprised that with all the details you explain but also create in the what if scenarios you both create that none of the previous reasons would be enough of a stand-alone but then in combination show plenty of reason to give Harry free ice cream or anything else really with the benefits the store owner stood to gain.
Weird What If idea, because the conversations in this video got me thinking about it: what does a situation where both Harry and Voldemort lose look like? Cause "neither can live while the other survives" is the rule, and one must die at the hands of the other, but death doesn't have to be death. Idk: I'm having trouble trying to articulate what I'm trying to ask today. XD Oh well!
We know the ring was the first horcrux, thanks to paying the math budget that one time. Thus the ring is just defended in a way that just kills you. However, after the dairy he might have realized how useful the resurrection powers could be, so he implemented it in the rest. Except for maybe Nagini
Maybe with Ron trying to Avada Kedavra Nagini and failing has more to do with the fact that to perform Unforgivable Curse you REALLY have to WANT it. One could argue that Ron doesn’t actually want to kill nagini at that moment - he wants to safe himself and hermione from naginis attack. Killing her is one of the ways to defend, but it’s not the goal itself
Dumbledore could not have planned the trip to Egypt as a way to keep Harry from the Burrow, because they won before Sirius escapes (Sirius sees the newspaper story about it and that prompts him to escape).
Lupin threw himself between Harry and the boggart during the boggart lesson because he believed Harry would fear Voldemort most and wanted to prevent scaring the children. If Dumbledore intended to learn about Harry's greatest fear, and he believed it would be a dementor, 1. He didn't communicate that with Lupin, and 2. It was not intended for that specific lesson by Lupin in the classroom that day.
Possibly silly question, but what does the killing curse 'Avada Kedavra' actually do? Well, obviously it kills the target if the spell connects, however it doesn't appear to harm the body of the target what-so-ever, or at least very little. In the goblet of fire it is stated that the muggle police came to the conclusions that the Riddles were in perfect health apart from being dead, meaning that their body is potentially still fully functional. The question that needs to be answered first is what constitutes being 'dead' in the wizarding world. Either it could simply be when the soul parts with the body, or it could be like in the real world where a person is considered dead when the heart stops or if the head is separated from the body. For honesty's sake, I'll add that it's very much possible that I'm wrong about what 'dead' means in the real world.
I think one reason why Dumbledore goes to such great lengths to keep the prophecy secret is because he understands that the one thing Voldemort doesn’t know will always be a source of doubt and uncertainty for him. By withholding this information, Dumbledore creates a psychological leverage over Voldemort. The ambiguity of the prophecy prevents Voldemort from fully understanding the conditions of his defeat, which fuels his paranoia and fear. This doubt becomes a powerful tool, subtly manipulating Voldemort’s actions and decisions, ultimately guiding him toward his own downfall. In essence, Dumbledore is using the prophecy as a subtle form of psychological warfare, capitalizing on Voldemort’s fear of the unknown. It’s not just about the prophecy itself; it’s about how the lack of complete knowledge affects Voldemort’s behavior, creating opportunities for Dumbledore to influence the final outcome.
You're forgetting Hagrid's appointment. It follows the same logic as Lupin's. Dumbledore has to know how people regard half-giants (even if Hagrid's ancestry isn't well-known). When he appointed him, Dumbledore should have known it would cause strive with a certain part of the school, which it did with Malfoy (take a look at the school's reaction upon his announcement. So, in a way, while Dumbledore didn't orchestrate the Buckbeak incident, he did set the scene, testing Harry in this way as well. Too bad it was mainly Hermione (and later Ron) who dealt with the issue though.
Loved this part. Question: How does the ministry control the dementors? How do they communicate with them? This means, they had been controlling Death itself, or at least, communicating with it (unknowingly, I guess)? i'm a Venezuelan fan living in Florida. I will see you in the tour. Can I go visit you in Virginia?
Re: Horcruxes, I've always believed that Voldemort never intended for the Diary to be able to come to life like it did. Voldemort would never have intentionally created something that could produce a second Voldemort while he was still alive. In other words, it's a bug, not a feature.
The dememntors threat is even worse than that. They could kiss harry, suck out harry's soul, and leave voldemorts piece inside harry, making harry a sort of human nagini effectively
Who was better at being sneaky or shenanigans: the Weasley Twins or the Marauders? I want to say the Twins, but I think the Marauders took things to another level. Any thoughts?
25:20 Do you really think that *the* A. P. W. B. Dumbledore could have done *nothing* if the Dursleys had signed his Hogsmeade permission slip? I don't know what he would have done, but certainly he could have done something. It may have been trickier, especially to keep it from being too obvious that it's about Sirius (which would only have made Harry more eager to go, especially after the godfather news got spilled), but Dumbledore at his most helpless was still able to fight off an army of Inferi, Apparate to the borders of Hogwarts, dismantle the protective spells to allow him and Harry to fly in, and then stand up to Draco well enough to convince him that he's not actively dying... I think he could come up with a reason/way to keep Harry in the castle at least as effectively as not having the signed permission slip (Harry still has the cloak and the map, though, so of course it would all be fruitless anyway).
Can we imagine a universe where dementors suck Harold's soul from Harold's body but Voldemort's stays in his body and he's back with the chosen one's body?
so what if you wore the diadem to much, or drank from the cup, would you be a new voldemort? also, if sirius is good at spells, but bad at words, could he properly cast Wingardium Leviosa?
Anyone else think that the reason that Dumbledore hates the dementors so much is because he is reliving that initial duel between him, Aberforth, and Grindlewald (when Arianna dies)? He is tortured by that moment and is forced to relive it.
I think they actually talked about that in their last episode! I think you're absolutely right.
Definitely a factor.
Absolutely. Like Harry the worse traumatic memories one has in their past the more they dislike the dementors and the more seriously they take the threat of them. I think it's also a major factor that Dumbledore is just more aware of their dark nature and that they will side with Voldemort in the event of his return.
So, probably that potion that Dumbledore took in book 6 contains something similar to dementor essence. If it forces you to relive your worst memory.
I don't think that's the REASON why he hates them, I definitely agree that's what he experiences near them, but I think he'd aware of what the kiss does and the fact they are aligned with dark forces that is just everything awful
Off topic but my kids are both autistic. My son loves your intro and music is his thing he keeps starting it just to listen. My daughter has trouble sleeping and finds this podcast soothing. I love the content but it honestly helps my family and I appreciate it.
@@kyriepitcher355 I’m going to make you love them even more. I’m autistic (but an adult). I went to one of their live shows in June. After the show I was super overstimulated (but in the good way) and needed to de-stim and hung out while everyone else was leaving. The guys came out at the end of the show and I explained to them why I was still there. They were super nice and chill about it and we ended up chatting for like 20 mins!
Sirius has not escaped before seeing Weasleys (and Peter) in the Daily Prophet! Dumbledore sending Weasleys to Egypt to thwart Sirius makes ZERO sense to me. But like this is the third video they make this claim… am I missing something here?
Right? Are they not reading comments?
They’ve acknowledged this mistake in the past. If they make it again here they must have just forgotten.
@@SierraMascara28 it kinda feels like a bigger oversight, tho.
I didn't see the part where they said it was about Sirius. The sending the Weasley's to Egypt thing is to protect him to Dumbledore.
He needs Harry to be technically living with the dursleys so that the protection spell keeps working.
It's not about Sirius, it's about Voldemort.
@ but they also said he didn‘t have a problem with harry staying with the dursleys in other years, precisely because the „threat of sirius“ hadn‘t been around then.
You know what’s funny is even if Harry had died in the forest, his act of sacrifice literally turned every person in the castle into a new chosen one. Because when Voldemort comes back he can’t hurt any of the people in the castle due to the same sacrificial magic Lily used. Harry enacted the same love protection on a massive scale. So Voldemort was GOING to go down even if Harry had died. Someone else would have done it.
Florian Fortiscue in this book is a set up for something that never paid off. There is an old Pottermore article (that is also in the new From the Wizarding Archive books/audiobook), that clarifies he was set up to be very knowledgable about Wizarding History and that he would have some rare knowledge he would tell Harry later in the series, but that Rowling later dropped that or couldn't fit it in the story as it panned out. The fact that both Florian and Olivander gets captured in Half-Blood is a nod to this as well and might even show that she was still trying to make him part of the conclusion somehow, but ultimately killed off page.
Florian was always suppose to be “dumbledore's man” in the Alley… However, the story didn’t need another adult non-DarkLord supporter for readers to keep track of, and after the events of book 4, then the eventual opening of Weasley’s; the shop owner angle, was already over-saturated for plot options…
In death: he faced an Ice-cream cooler, that he been transfigured into a bear. Gruesome way to go…
One reason that might explain how Dumbledore never found out about what the Marauders were up to doing their years at school, could be that Dumbledore was very frequently abscent during that time, fighting off Voldemort etc and dealings with the order etc.
This, and he had no special reason to pay attention to them like he does with Harry.
@@SierraMascara28 well i mean he did probably pay some attention to them cause of Remus' situation.
Yup. The war was really ramping up at this point, and Dumbledore was the most powerful wizard in the world. He likely tried hunting Voldemort down many times, knowing that with the Elder Wand, he could certainly beat him. Voldemort, of course, was always one step ahead. A team of Aurors was surely hunting for Voldemort too, but to no avail. The war continued and people kept dying. Unlike Grindelwald, who acted in the open, Voldemort acted from the shadows, patiently wearing out his enemies.
It's kinda sad that Hermione never invites Harry home with her (the few times she's there, like in the beginning of this book). Like sure, her parents are muggles and she might be hesitant to bring SOME wizards (Ron) into her house, but Harry lives with muggles.
There is a rather dark aspect to this. Hermione rarely talked about her parents, and we rarely see them in the books. Even during the holidays, she is almost always staying at the Burrow, Grimmauld Place or Hogwarts. She never even mentions her life before she learned what she was. I have no idea if Rowling planted that seed intentionally, but it is there. Hermione even used a very powerful memory charm on them that, if reversed, can cause brain damage. That is a horrific thing to do to anyone, never mind your parents, especially without their consent.
@@Cailus3542 pretty sure it's more just that Harry Potter is supposed to be kind of escapist fantasy for children and just visiting your friend is not exactly unknown exciting magic stuff, so they are only mentioned when necessary (like the whole what about her parents when she goes on the lets destroy voldemort camping trip)
Still running into the problem that Sirius escaped from Azkaban after the Weasley's went to Egypt. Not only could this not have been part of Dumbledore's plan to protect Harry, but being out of the country would have been safer for him. Harry is safe from Voldemort and anyone taking orders from Voldemort at the Dursley's. He's not safe from a rouge death eater acting on his own.
Seriously, I’ve been thinking this every time they say this !! Are they ignoring these comments !
Came here to say the same thing! The Weaselys must have wanted it to just be a family trip and/or felt weird about taking Harry abroad. Sirius not breaking out until after he saw Peter in the Egypt picture is an easy detail to mix up/forget though. It’s a smaller reveal amidst a ton of huge reveals
They never said he sends the wesley's were sent to Egypt bc of Sirius's escape.their theory is that he wanted Harry not to have the option of staying at the Weasley's bc of the lack of blood protection.
@@russelltoothman3168 but he’s ok with it year 2 and year 4 ?
@@jensenpeters6244 And actually promotes it in year 6! (Year 5 was a necessity after the Dementor attack.)
Peter was actually at Hogwarts much longer than 2 years at this point, since he was with Percy before Percy became a prefect.
Also do you think Peter being Ron’s rat, is that why Ron had trouble transfiguring him? Now I’m picture what Peter is thinking when being transformed into a goblet!
That transfiguration thing is a movie only detail, it doesn't happen at all in the books and all transfiguration components seem to always be available in the school (as they probably can be detransfigured and reused anyway)
@@heylolp9yeah, but that doesn't invalidate the speculation whether it's a movie or book detail. could have been a clever movie thing.
@@failurenotsorry6600 but it calls into question if it even happened ever, the movies are unfaithful adaptations and not primary canon
It's like Ron being in the forest year 1
@@heylolp9 okay? that isn't relevant. the point is the commentor was wondering if it was a clever detail that was hinting at scabber's true nature, hence the speculation.
@failurenotsorry6600 the answer if the 2nd movie adapted a detail that is part of book 3 because maybe "they wanted to include a easter egg" is No
The Movie wanted visual jokes
The only lesson ever that any Pet is part of the Lesson is the Potions Class where Snape wants to poison Neville's Toad Trevor
Beyond that it's only Hedwig turning up during History of Magic, injured in Book 5
The Movies wanted to show how Ron's broken wand doesn't work, not as foreshadowing of Scabbers next Movie but as foreshadowing for the Lockhart wand backfiring, even though Books 1 2 and 3 were released at time of Movie 2's making
Because if it was intentional then anything beyond the scene would exist in Canon to back this up
Why would everyone in class get a Rat to transform anyway, except for Students that own a Rat (against express school rules) as a pet?
That Class of Transfiguration, the same where Hermione asks McGonagall about the Chamber of Secrets, doesn't even exist
Hermione asks Professor Binns
This entire lesson is a full invention of the movies and doesn't work within the book canon, so by the regular rules of Canon that the Harry Potter community agreed upon (Book canon > Movie canon) that scene did not happen at all
Florian could make a killing marketing his shop as THE Harry Potter’s favorite ice cream spot 😂
okay if they say Dumbledore arranged the Weasley to go to Egypt cause Sirius black escape. well he escaped cause the Weasley won the lottery and was on the front page which happens before Sirius escapes but he arranged cause he escape? so Dumbledore planned the Weasley to go to Egypt cause Sirius black escaped after the daily prophet publish the Weasley's on their vacation....am i missing something here.
The other thing that I think is wrong is Dumbledore wanting to know Harry's greatest fear - or at least it doesn't go to plan. Lupin doesn't let Harry face the boggart, and I think if he had instructions from Dumbledore he would have.
@Elf0304 i think dumbledore suggested it it work in a way cause harry knew his boggart would be a dementor. and we see that while he tired learning the patronus charm.
I'm in the hospital at the moment and the guys really help me relax . Sometimes they make me sleepy which is so helpful. Thank you so🤕 much Super Carlin Brothers!
Dumbledore's Big Azkaplan
or Plansoner of Dumblebig
The holiday/Dumbledore things seems off. Sirius didn't escape until after he saw the photo in Fudge's Prophet which was taken when the family was already in Egypt.
In book 2 Harry was rescued by the weasleys and Dumbledore probably thought that he was save enough there, as long as he returns to the Dursleys next year. The egypt holiday could be an excuse, why he has to go back to the Dursleys.
@@philw6056 but that is not what they said.
Also to keep the protection alive, he indeed needed to return, but he did not need to stay for a long time.
If this was Dumbledore’s plan, he could just make Harry wait-it-out for a week or so and then off he goes.
@@Alwarin1 I think it isn't about time, but his feeling. As long as he genuinely calls at the Dursleys "home" he is safe and can go to the Weasleys or whereever as a guest.
@ in that case the protection would end like 10 years ago, as Harry never felt at home with Dursleys… but OK, he technically did not know about alternative so we can give it a pass, but at very least, at the end of the Philosophers stone Harry claimed that he is not going home when boarding the Express back to London.
That magic seems to be working on some kind of technicality, but I think either way it should be fine if he went to visit Ron (or anybody) for majority of summer (he did that in years 4 and 5)
@@Alwarin1 He didn't feel positive about his home, but at least until book 3 his worst nightmare is being expelled from hogwarts. Because his "home" were the Dursleys. He never thought, if Ron and I were expelled, we could live together at the Weasleys.
I think as far as the bogart goes, it can't have manifested as a dementor if Harry never saw one first. The whole "I believe what you fear most is fear itself" is an interpretation of Harry's bogart from Lupin more than anything else. Harry himself even said he was thinking about Voldemort until he remembered the effect the dementor had on him. I think the bogart would have been Voldemort had he not encountered the dementor, but its much less because Harry fears Voldemort and more he fears what Voldemort represents and what he could do to his loved ones if he isn't stopped. Just my interpretation, I love these episodes that go through how Dumbledore planned the year to go and where things lined up and where they didn't
To me, prophecies in the Potterverse have always been determinations of *character* not fate. Trelawney's prophecy has always been a prediction of what Voldemort (and Harry) would do, not what fate would have them do.
I really want a video about what if Snape never told Voldemort the bit of the prophecy he overheard? The prophecy is still in effect, but no one but Dumbledore knows.
They made that already. It's on the Owlery though
Thought on the Marauders Map. What if there is a code that the Marauders use to “unlock” the map. And that is how when Lupin opens it Peter shows up on the map. There are other ways to open it/get it to give information, and the Map determines based on the user what information they get. Snape, not worthy, gets a rude response. The twins, worthy, get the fun map but the Marauders are protected. The odds that they stumble on the correct password seems low, but if they provide a code this the Marauders deem worthy so they get access to the Map.
Harry would have to been mistaken for James with regards to the map in order to see Peter. This is possible.
Voldy made a "grave mistake" 😂 ... my kind of humor Ben. 😊
I’m guessing that Dumbledore was planning on simply canceling Hogsmeade for everyone, until he found out that Harry didn’t get his form signed and then just rolled with it because while he believes Sirius is guilty, he’s also only after Harry and thus not a threat to the other students.
As far as Dumbledore knows, Sirius is a powerful Dark wizard, just like the rest of his family. Just because he's after Harry doesn't stop him from hurting other children. He actually did hurt Ron, breaking his leg, if unintentionally.
@ well, sure, but he’s obviously canonically still not that concerned since he does send all the students to Hogsmeade
So, the necklace from Borgin & Burke's that Katie accidentally touches (but was meant for Dumbledore), do we think it couldve have been someone else's horcrux?
Also meant to be interracted with?
Yes, watched this on Patreon already. Great episode, just about to watch for second time on TH-cam! These videos make my weekend
What if Sirius had seeked out Dumbledore to try and explain himself. I know Sirius was dead set at his goal to just hunt down Peter, but just what if.. Dumbledore is the type of person that would atleast hear Sirius out instead of just turning him in right away.
He wouldn't even need to go to Dumbledore in person. After his escape with Buckbeak he was able to send an owl (Pigwidgeon) to Harry, so why couldn't he just send an owl with a letter to Dumbledore and explain the whole story without a great risk for himself?
@@rittersportfan i mean sure he could do that but i would think it more likely for Dumbledore to realise Sirius' innocence if he met with him face to face. Also the fact that Sirius would even try to go to Dumbledore directly would be something Dumbledore would've looked at as a major thing for the story to be true. Cause if Sirius was actually guilty then going right to Dumbledore would've been the dumbest thing ever.
One Question: How was Harry protected from Sirius as long as he stayed at the Dursleys ?
I thought the protection from Lily's sacrifice only worked against Voldemort himself.
Or am I missing something ?
The protection was also supposed to end at 17 but supposedly Voldemort kept it alive in himself and that's what let Harry to live. Even though the protection should have ended by that point.
@satsujin-shathewitchkingof6185
Extending the duration of the protection is one thing.
But Dumbledore could only put the protection on the House of the Dursleys since Petunia and Lily were sisters and Harry was connected to both of them by blood.
In no way could Dumbledore extend the protection to other enemies when it's based on Lily's protection which was only targeted at Voldemort himself.
But this also creates another plot hole. Why didn't the Death Eaters try to attack the Dursleys house since the protection would not work against them ?
So I have a theory about order of the Phoenix and the weird plot. It gives me sorcerers stone vibes, where dumbledore is intentionally putting lots of protections on the prophecy to lure Voldemort into trying to steal it, so that he can expose Voldemort to the ministry. Dumbledore knows that knowing the rest of the prophecy makes no difference for Voldemort, he will continue to hunt Harry, so he doesn’t really mind if Voldemort actually gets it, he just wants to lure Voldemort into doing exactly what he ends up doing (obviously without Harry getting involved)
Voldemort surely suspects that Dumbledore is trying to draw him out, which is why he never takes the bait. This leads to a stalemate until Voldemort tries another plan.
@ except for he DOES take the bait😅 the very night that Harry goes to the ministry he couldn’t help but go himself. Which also ends up doing exactly what I implied would happen anyway
Edit: also it was always part of voldemorts plan to go to the ministry that night as well. None of the death eaters call him and, completely unprompted, with no way of even knowing that Harry has actually taken the bait he goes to the ministry anyway, which also completely undermines voldemorts whole plan of luring Harry to the ministry. It appears as tho he attempted to lure Harry to the ministry, but this was his planned night to get the prophecy, regardless of whether he had successfully lured Harry or not. “If Harry isn’t gonna go to get it tonight, then I’ll just go get it myself. Oh wait, he’s here!! It worked!!” Is what seems to have happened, at least when reading it from every angle.
56:52 wow, what a great question. Agree - Dementors probably couldn’t extract a soul from a horcrux and doubt they would stop after taking one soul from HP.
Hey, brothers! I cannot tell you how much I love listening to this podcast and how much excitement it brings me each week. I am loving listening to each episode again with my husband and diving deeper into each chapter even more. I have a question for you. What if a second safe house had been set up for the Potters? It could be a vacant location and the Potters could be the Secret Keepers. We learn from Harry's memories that they saw him coming and James had time to tell Lily to take Harry and run. We assume she ran upstairs to the bedroom. What would have happened if they had the second location set up and, once they saw Voldemort coming, they Apparated to the second location where nobody else would be able to find them since they are the secret keepers? It would give them time to come up with a new plan and be able to get word to those in the Order that Peter was no longer on their side, and find a new way to keep them safe.
I have a question about Dumbledore's knowledge of Sirius' innocence regarding the death of Lily and James, or lack thereof. I will preface this by saying that I may just not understand how the Fidelius charm works.
So if I understand correctly, Dumbledore is the one who performed and placed the Fidelius charm over the Potters. I would assume that the one performing the charm would need to know who the intended secret keeper is in order for the charm to successfully take hold. So in order for Sirius' plan to switch to Peter as the secret keeper to take effect, wouldn't Dumbledore have to have been made privy to the switch PRIOR to the charm being performed?
My understanding of the facts:
1. Dumbledore successfully cast a Fidelius charm over the Potters.
2. Sirius was SUPPOSED to be secret keeper.
3. Peter WAS the secret keeper.
How could Dumbledore NOT know that Sirius was innocent?
Sorry if I'm missing something simple or if this has been covered before.
I've already typed all of this out so I'll post it anyways, but after a quick Google search I found that "Dumbledore only suggested the Fidelius charm. Lily and James performed it and chose Peter as secret keeper." This must be what I have been missing this whole time?! 🤣🤦
Another amazing episode from an amazing team! Can't wait for y'all to bring that tour closer to me, so jealous of people who've already gotten to go. Still crazy that we're already on Goblet! Looking forward to chapter 1!
I’m very excited for the next Monday though!!
Goblet of fire [and halfblood prince] are my absolute favourites!
And I also thought that it would take you absolutely ages to get there
But here we are !
Good stuff!)
Keep it up!)
I read the Harry Potter series for the first time when I was in my early 30's and I hadn't seen any of the movies. After I read the line about the "glimmer of triumph" I worried it meant Dumbledore was working with Voldemort and I was devastated. 😆
Someone posted once that they'd accidentally opened Deathly Hallows when they picked it up to buy it, and read "Ginny kissed Albus"
@PerovNigma OMG they must have been terrified! 😆😆😆
Yeah, I remember feeling that too! It really stood out to me, and I couldn't fathom what it meant.
What a great twist that would have been!
The whole time you guys are talking about Nagini as a snake I just want to remind you that she's not a snake, she's a maledictus. So she has some amount of human soul in her...
Or I guess it could be "on the beach with suntan lotion on his nose" Dumbledore
Can’t wait for the goblet of fire series! I am re-listening to the audiobook now, getting ready.
Is there any way that you guys could come up with an ending for fantastic beasts since we’re not getting one?? I mean… I know we kinda already know what happens but just adding those details would be so great!!
I love this idea!! I need the closure 😂
I'm going to be so there if you all get a tour that comes to Indianapolis, Louisville, and/or Cincinnati. All are within an hour away from me so please do come out to the midwest
I think Dumbledore even planted the idea to use Harry’s blood into Voldemorts head by letting Harry go after the Philosophers stone and showing Voldy the protection in his blood. As soon as Voldemort had the opportunity to get his body back the plan is immediately to use Harry.
To add onto the end question, there is also the thought of "would they even attempt to suck the piece of Voldemort's soul out of Harry due to it being specifically Voldemort's, who would go on to command them, so would the piece of soul have some amount of command or resistance to a Dementor's Kiss?"
I feel like there's a lot of horocrux details glossed over in this discussion and that any of the remainders if given the chance to feed on someone could form into a new prime
In regards to where do the souls consumed by a dementor go, I think the answer to "Where do lost things go?" may hold some insights. "They go into non-being, that is to say everwhere" (Quotes may not be exact this was from memory)
Didn’t Sirius not break out until after the Weasley’s were already on vacation?
In my head canon, Dementors are like especial mobile Veils. So when they suck a soul, it stays stuck on limbo until the Dementor vanish. They are unable to move on. This connects with your theory that Death is the final evolution of Dementors. Death makes souls move on but Dementors can't. They feed on too emotions because this maintain there existence and the suffering of the souls they suck in limbo.
Big fan of the show. Keep up the good work. It would be awesome to see your take on this. Maybe a suggestion for a video.
Hey Brother,
I was wondering based on the sword quote from Hermione, would the sword of Gryffindor, impregnated by basilisk venom, could it do damage to anyone's soul? After all, it could kill a horcrux, which is a chunk of soul. Maybe bad guys? or Voldemort? And for that matter, could a tiny scratch from the sword now cause death because of the basilisk venom?
Love your podcast. I stay up until 2am on a Sunday night just to watch/listen with no interruptions. Keep up the great analysis and laughs.
Horcruxes are protected by magic that makes them nearly invincible.
A soul is not destroyed by physical means at all, except if it is a horcrux.
A horcrux is completely dependent on the container. Once the container is destroyed, the soul is destroyed. Regular human souls do not work this way.
As Hermione says, if I run you through with a sword, your soul would be just fine.
So basilisk venom or not, the sword won't destroy your soul. It can kill you, but your soul will move on.
This brings up the question of why the venom did not destroy the horcrux inside Harry when he fought the basilisk.
That is because the container, Harry, was not destroyed. If Harry had died, then that horcrux would have died. But Harry lived, so that horcrux lived.
I think that the items of the founders are different from horcruxes because they were the ones that actually made the objects. They didn't just have the objects and just put themselves into it. People say that when you make something you put a part of yourself into whatever you're creating as a piece of like art and any kind of items that you create so that's different from a horcrux and makes these things as part of their you know legacy more unique.
If Buckbeak's trial was meant to show Harry that you should save innocent people, was Dumbledore always planning on saving Buckbeak? Even sending Harry back with the time turner might have been part of the plan. That might explain why he seemed to know they were breaking buckbeak free even before any sirius related things went down.
Before finishing the episode, I am pausing to posit that, perhaps if you destroy soul fragments ("prime", or otherwise), what happens is, you can still restore the person from "the next" soul fragment in the queue. So, you destroy Voldemort prime, and now it is the fragment inside Marvolo's ring that can be restored to full Voldy. If you destroy that, the diary is next, etc. Assuming Horcruxes work in FIFO order, not FILO order.
I think there *is* grounds to believe that the soul radiates emotions, as that would explain how the Horcrux within Harry gives him insight into the strong emotions of Voldemort prime
The main issue I see with Dementors destroying Horcuxes however I see in exit points
The Mouth is apparently the weak point of the Human body towards Dementors, an Object that was made a Horcrux would be a locked manufactured container, so I think there are measures to be taken to ensure impremnability, that makes Horcruxes have to be destroyed beyond repair to get the soul out of there in the first place
And I don't see a way for a Dementor to physically break the container open to feast on the soul
So it's to the Dementors in Harry Potter the equivalent to (to borrow from a different fandom) Portal's "The Cake is a lie"
Basically Dementors getting to communicate between each other "Horcruxes man? don't even bother, those nuts are impossible to crack!"
A lot of talk about whether or not the dementors could suck out the soul of a beast, but Nagini isn’t technically a beast, she’s a Maledictus. Her soul should still be human.
Fiendfyre is cursed fire, water wouldn’t put it out, you saw what happened when Crabbe couldn’t control it!
Maybe dumbledore allowed the trial to continue the way it did to show harry the corruption of the ministry
in an alternate timeline Dumbledore put all his eggs in Harry's basket, but Neville was the chosen, but because he wasn't groomed to succeed he is killed by a triumphant Voldemort
So in “Chamber” when Dumbledore cancels the exams, did he also have the authority to cancels OWLs and NEWTs? Because that is a Ministry thing. And kids need them to get to advanced classes and eventually jobs…
There’s no way he can cancel OWLs and NEWTs. I guess end of year tests are normally a formality
1:01:06 Another question: If someone was kissed by a dementor and became an empty shell, would Voldemort take full control of that body after Voldemort prime possessed that empty shell? After all, there is no other soul inside. Or think of an ordinary ghost. Can they capture an empty shell?
Dumbledore also hired Lupin to see whether Snape is able to rise above his grudge.
Heres a note that might make you reconsider if dumbeldore knew the entire time if sirus was innocent.
So, of course, we get told by hagrid that Sirus asked for Harry that night, claiming to be his godfather. He never tried to forcefully take Harry in fact as soon as he is denied Harry and is told Harry is being brought to dumbeldore. Sirius gives up his flying bike to help hagrid.
Then at the end of chapter one hagrid says he is going to return sirius bike. IF DUMBELDORE THOUGHT HE WAS GUILTY WHY WOULD HE LET HAGRID GO!!! I need someone to hear me and get this to SCB i think either dumbeldore had to of always known sirus was innocent as in he knew they switched. This wouldnt mean he would know about them being animagas (sorry about spelling) .Or when hagrid is telling him the story it clicks for dumbeldore the fact sirius didnt try to kill hagrid and harry then and there must of meant he didnt betray them but if he didnt betray them then the only reason voldemort found out is the fact they switched. He would have no clue who they switched it to. Sirus would then get arrested for killing peter pettigrew and 13 muggles. Dumbeldore would assume when sirus kills peter its because sirus knew he was the secret keeper and he knew peter betrayed them. Yet in a rage, sirus did kill peter, and maybe that would be just but its the 13 muggles in which dumbeldore cant defend his crimes which is why he lets him go to azkban. Not knowing james was a stag, sirus a wolf, and peter a rat.
At that time, Sirius hadn't gone after Peter yet.
It was only after he went after Peter and Peter framed him that Sirius gets pegged as the traitor.
Dumbledore may have suspected that someone betrayed the Potters and that it may have been Sirius, but he just as easily could have suspected Peter, Lupin, or maybe even someone else to be the traitor.
The explanation could just easily be that he did not think it was Sirius and that after Peter faked his own death and framed Sirius, it takes Dumbledore by surprise.
@keithg460 I know that's when he gets pegged as the traitor this theory is based on the idea dumbeldore I'd able to realize sirus isn't the traitor and dumbeldore knew all along. I think it has some really validity. Would love to here SCB's take on it because to me it's a real possibility dumbeldore is so smart I believe he could've connected the dots and if he didnt and still though sirius was the traitor then he shouldn't of allowed hagrid to seek out sirius without warning him
49:15 HP’s is in his jacket when he enters the Forbidden Forest to face Voldy. He is armed. He chooses to surrender, not fight.
J and Ben, my issue is this: we say that Dumbledore did not seek Voldemort when he was weakened in Albania because of the prophecy, but Dumbledore also said to Harry that the prophecy is only meaningful because Voldemort puts stock in it. If Dumbledore only thinks the prophecy has power because Voldemort believes it and will act on it, why does that stop Dumbledore from attacking Voldemort while weakened?
Just because Voldemort believes he will die at the hands of Harry (or not at all) should not have stopped Dumbledore from seeking to defeat him.
Dumbledoor was lying,I guess? Trying to make Harry feel better about his predetermined fate?
@@satsujin-shathewitchkingof6185 yeah, basically everything he does affirms his faith in the prophecy, so i think he just felt the need to make sure harry wouldn't be inhibited by putting too much faith in it
With the Horcruxes still in play, would there have been a point of attacking until they were all destroyed, though? At best, it would have just slowed him down, and his disembodied spirit would have just moved on to someplace else.
@@pdfbanana That makes sense
@@EndlessNight025 He didn't know they were in play
Dementors vs. Horcruxes: I agree that there's no positive emotions coming from the bit of soul so the dementor wouldn't be interested in terms of feeding on it in that way, but it feels like the kiss is a separate thing than happiness-feeding. They probably wouldn't seek out horcruxes because of the lack of happy thoughts, but they seem to kiss people on orders rather than/in addition to some feeding instinct. They don't go around kissing everyone in Azkaban, but they seem to do it readily enough when told to, and I imagine there aren't a lot of happy thoughts left by the time they get to that point.
My issues (and I'm not saying they're insurmountable) are 1: how tightly the bit of soul is bound to the vessel (like Hermione says, a living person's soul can go on just fine without a body but the bit in a horcrux is entirely dependent on its container, so I don't think it would be easy to separate them) and 2: there may be other protective measures placed on a horcrux to somehow thwart dementors (repel them, hide the soul bit, whatever). Voldemort can't cast a Patronus, which is the only *known* way to repel dementors, but he's certainly aware of dementors and likely cautious of the threat they present to a yummy little flayed piece of soul, I think it's entirely possible he came up with some sort of Dark Arts method of repelling dementors. Maybe it's Fiendfyre! I never considered the parallel until you brought it up in this video, but it does have similarities to the Patronus in terms of who can cast them and what effect it has on the caster (plus it's a bit like a chaotic evil phoenix... can phoenixes repel dementors? Phoenixes and unicorns: potential natural dementor repellent), so maybe Voldemort rigged up a version of Fiendfyre to attack dementors.
All that to say I think a dementor could, with proper persuasion and assuming lack of adequate protection/attachment, kiss the soul out of a horcrux, but they wouldn't be interested in it for its own sake.
Go Hokies! Love to see them represented on the pod!
McNair is the anti-Hagrid 😂
Also, Neville's grandma is AugustA. AugustUS is the masculine version.
15:27 my only thought here is don’t the Weasley’s go on holiday before Sirius escapes? Is it not the photo of them in the daily prophet that causes Sirius to breakout of Azkaban? Or am I remembering wrong?
48:45 interesting. Where did you read about the death eaters’ specialities?
Dumbledore, but with the Charlie from Always Sunny conspiracy board
I don’t know if Dumbledore knew that Harry’s bogart would be a dementor. I think that the test was to see what the dementor would become.
Dumbledore’s plan is so brilliant because it’s dynamic-it’s flexible enough to adjust successfully with unexpected changes.
I love this show so much and I have been looking for a new great Harry Potter experience for years! I have a thought. If Sirius Black had died for the marauders would that put the same ancient magic that Lily put on Harry ?
Also, Dumbledore by the time of book 2 was aware of the curse on the DADA position. He also thought he could use the curse to deal with Lockhart and bring a certain amount of justice for his actions.
They don't seem to get that Harry is not in danger from Sirius until after the Wesley's go to Egypt. Their trip being published in the paper is how Sirius learns that Peter is alive.
Harry Potter is famous in the wizarding world. Many wizards would love to have Harry Potter be at their business. Isnt that how famous people are treated. I believe your theory however. And about Sirius not being good with words....did he not just get out of Azkaban after 11 years with dementors? You wont give the character/ man a break. Jeez! I think Snape killed Dumbledore. Murdered him is a bit harsh for what really happened.
Was just listening to Snape grudge again and wanted to provide my own explanation to the snape insult scene with the map. What if, similarly to the founders, the marauders put their intelligence into the map so that they could defend the map from people like filch and Snape, but ensure future troublemakers would know how to use the map? Similar to the sorting hat, the map looks inside the user to discern the “mischeviousness” of the person in question and will reveal the trick to look at the map.
46:02 isn’t Amose diggory in the disposal of dangerous magical creatures? I think he says it to winky
Dumbledore wasn't Headmaster when Newt was at Hogwarts. He couldn't have stopped the expulsion.
That's not a Dumbledore that's master roshi!
Each of the horcruxes (Voldemort) lacks happy memories, but they have fragments of soul (which dementors suck out). The dementors might not be able to feed on happy memories, but I think they’d still be able to suck out the fragments of soul.
57:40 I dont think Ben is right here. Destroying a horcrux is difficult, thats why they need the basilisk venom or fiendfyre to do it. Horcruxes are inherently hard to destroy. Any extra enchantments on them would give them their offensive capabilities, like the diary draining Ginny or the ring cursing Dumbledore.
The ice cream - it made sense to me. I think of how when Harry first arrived on the wizarding scene and how famous he was. It could just be an extension of that popularity, Folks were not only grateful to Harry but also, they would also feel bad for his loss of both parents that day. There is also the clout that any shop keeper could claim having THE Harry Potter in his store each day for long periods of time. I'm surprised that with all the details you explain but also create in the what if scenarios you both create that none of the previous reasons would be enough of a stand-alone but then in combination show plenty of reason to give Harry free ice cream or anything else really with the benefits the store owner stood to gain.
I think the reason Dumbledore didn’t intervene with Buckbeak is the same reason he hired Umbridge. To understand the corrupt system.
Umbridge was hired by the Ministry, not Dumbledore.
@@KudaKeileontrue, but only because Dumbledore couldn’t find a replacement (we all know he could if he had wanted to)
"He's so good at magic and so bad at words" 😂😂😂😂😂 REAL
Would the curse that Dumbledore got when he put on the ring been stopped by the philosopher stones elixir of life?
Weird What If idea, because the conversations in this video got me thinking about it: what does a situation where both Harry and Voldemort lose look like? Cause "neither can live while the other survives" is the rule, and one must die at the hands of the other, but death doesn't have to be death. Idk: I'm having trouble trying to articulate what I'm trying to ask today. XD Oh well!
We know the ring was the first horcrux, thanks to paying the math budget that one time. Thus the ring is just defended in a way that just kills you. However, after the dairy he might have realized how useful the resurrection powers could be, so he implemented it in the rest. Except for maybe Nagini
Maybe with Ron trying to Avada Kedavra Nagini and failing has more to do with the fact that to perform Unforgivable Curse you REALLY have to WANT it. One could argue that Ron doesn’t actually want to kill nagini at that moment - he wants to safe himself and hermione from naginis attack. Killing her is one of the ways to defend, but it’s not the goal itself
Where did Dumbledore heir queril ??
Dumbledore could not have planned the trip to Egypt as a way to keep Harry from the Burrow, because they won before Sirius escapes (Sirius sees the newspaper story about it and that prompts him to escape).
I think Dumbledore knew everything that was going to happen that year due to knowing about the time turner.
I’m never not clicking a Dumbledore’s Big Plan- or DBP for short.
The phrase “Voldemort flavored smoothie” was not on my TTGD bingo card 😅
Lupin threw himself between Harry and the boggart during the boggart lesson because he believed Harry would fear Voldemort most and wanted to prevent scaring the children. If Dumbledore intended to learn about Harry's greatest fear, and he believed it would be a dementor, 1. He didn't communicate that with Lupin, and 2. It was not intended for that specific lesson by Lupin in the classroom that day.
We need fan art of, "everyone take a slurp"
Possibly silly question, but what does the killing curse 'Avada Kedavra' actually do?
Well, obviously it kills the target if the spell connects, however it doesn't appear to harm the body of the target what-so-ever, or at least very little. In the goblet of fire it is stated that the muggle police came to the conclusions that the Riddles were in perfect health apart from being dead, meaning that their body is potentially still fully functional.
The question that needs to be answered first is what constitutes being 'dead' in the wizarding world. Either it could simply be when the soul parts with the body, or it could be like in the real world where a person is considered dead when the heart stops or if the head is separated from the body. For honesty's sake, I'll add that it's very much possible that I'm wrong about what 'dead' means in the real world.
I think one reason why Dumbledore goes to such great lengths to keep the prophecy secret is because he understands that the one thing Voldemort doesn’t know will always be a source of doubt and uncertainty for him. By withholding this information, Dumbledore creates a psychological leverage over Voldemort. The ambiguity of the prophecy prevents Voldemort from fully understanding the conditions of his defeat, which fuels his paranoia and fear. This doubt becomes a powerful tool, subtly manipulating Voldemort’s actions and decisions, ultimately guiding him toward his own downfall.
In essence, Dumbledore is using the prophecy as a subtle form of psychological warfare, capitalizing on Voldemort’s fear of the unknown. It’s not just about the prophecy itself; it’s about how the lack of complete knowledge affects Voldemort’s behavior, creating opportunities for Dumbledore to influence the final outcome.
You're forgetting Hagrid's appointment. It follows the same logic as Lupin's. Dumbledore has to know how people regard half-giants (even if Hagrid's ancestry isn't well-known). When he appointed him, Dumbledore should have known it would cause strive with a certain part of the school, which it did with Malfoy (take a look at the school's reaction upon his announcement. So, in a way, while Dumbledore didn't orchestrate the Buckbeak incident, he did set the scene, testing Harry in this way as well.
Too bad it was mainly Hermione (and later Ron) who dealt with the issue though.
Out of the horcruxes, I think the dementors can destroy the one inside Nagini, as it is alive
Loved this part.
Question:
How does the ministry control the dementors?
How do they communicate with them?
This means, they had been controlling Death itself, or at least, communicating with it (unknowingly, I guess)?
i'm a Venezuelan fan living in Florida. I will see you in the tour. Can I go visit you in Virginia?
Re: Horcruxes, I've always believed that Voldemort never intended for the Diary to be able to come to life like it did. Voldemort would never have intentionally created something that could produce a second Voldemort while he was still alive. In other words, it's a bug, not a feature.
I think all of them could but that wasn't Voldy's intention. Although, then you get into questions regarding sense of self
How about you tour Europe for Order of the Phoenix? I'd certainly love to join a live Griffin Door chapter!
The dememntors threat is even worse than that. They could kiss harry, suck out harry's soul, and leave voldemorts piece inside harry, making harry a sort of human nagini effectively
Who was better at being sneaky or shenanigans: the Weasley Twins or the Marauders? I want to say the Twins, but I think the Marauders took things to another level. Any thoughts?
25:20 Do you really think that *the* A. P. W. B. Dumbledore could have done *nothing* if the Dursleys had signed his Hogsmeade permission slip? I don't know what he would have done, but certainly he could have done something. It may have been trickier, especially to keep it from being too obvious that it's about Sirius (which would only have made Harry more eager to go, especially after the godfather news got spilled), but Dumbledore at his most helpless was still able to fight off an army of Inferi, Apparate to the borders of Hogwarts, dismantle the protective spells to allow him and Harry to fly in, and then stand up to Draco well enough to convince him that he's not actively dying... I think he could come up with a reason/way to keep Harry in the castle at least as effectively as not having the signed permission slip (Harry still has the cloak and the map, though, so of course it would all be fruitless anyway).
Can we imagine a universe where dementors suck Harold's soul from Harold's body but Voldemort's stays in his body and he's back with the chosen one's body?
so what if you wore the diadem to much, or drank from the cup, would you be a new voldemort?
also, if sirius is good at spells, but bad at words, could he properly cast Wingardium Leviosa?