Why A Fender Strat Or Tele With Humbuckers Doesn't Sound Like a Gibson
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ย. 2021
- Can you Just Add Humbuckers To a Fender to make it Sound Like a Gibson? This video explains it
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Dylan Talks Tone Recieves Commision From Some Of These Links - เพลง
They all sound the same when I'm running the signal chain through a maxed out Boss HM-2
Yeah. Shit. 😄
They all sound the same through a Crate practice amp with a Ds-1 full blast.
Uh, yeah, being that you can get the Boss MII to sound like anything or even nothing.
@@viy4616 black paint makes sound heavier
this is the way
As someone who can really only have a single guitar, I've been playing an HSH Strat (well, "an S-style guitar", as they now say) for years. I like the Strat shape and how they feel, so that was a big factor. Nobody ever told me it shouldn't be done, so I just did it because I wanted more sounds out of my guitar due to a fairly wide variety of music I play. I can split both humbuckers, and I can also engage the neck pickup with any combination of the other two pickups. So it does cover a lot of ground. No, it doesn't sound like a "true Strat" or like an LP, it does its own thing and does what I want it to. The idea that someone might think a guitar like that shouldn't even exist or is "wrong" is actually quite funny to me. As if I should care what somebody else thinks about my guitar I'm quite happy with :)
I also have a HSH superstrat washburn x40 only one electric and one acoustic. I can get the sweet tone, you just start the position from the neck, volume and tone on zero. I can always find the right sound by adjusting the Pick up positions, volume and tone slowly I can always tune the guiatr to the amp and effects.
There is also blue cat re guitar which can change the sound of the guitar.
Hey, 2 separate volume knobs & 2 tone knobs too far away to reach while playing is the perfect formula for a chump-ass loser guitar. Even if it weighs 32 pounds & costs 32000.
I do the same thing but in a tele. I a pro but I’ll be honest I don’t really have the funds to have more than 1 guitar, so I just have rigged it HSH with coil splits. It covers just about all the bases. I seem to get called back on sessions plenty so I must be doing something right.
A lot of Strats are routed to take HBs so it's way more mainstream than many might think. Think Hiram Bullock and his famous HSH Strat. There's a lot of scope to add treble bleeds and switching. Mine has treble bleeds on the two Phat Cat P90s and the centre APS1 Alnico II. Each has a volume pot - 500s for the Phats and 250 for the APS1 - 5-way switching, no tone pots. This guitar is like a toolbox of sounds.
Purism does have its uses, but at other times, it's just restricting and life-constricting. You modified a common Stratocaster, not a Stradivarius. Anyone saying "Don't do that, you'll never get true Strat tone" might have misinterpreted what *you* want in a guitar for your own enjoyment. It could be that in their minds, a Strat is for Strat things while a Les Paul is for Les Paul things. What ever happened to mixing it up so it fits you better?
But so help you if you would modify a rare 1965 Mosrite Ventures II "Slab" model, unless you were Johnny Ramone; you might de-value the guitar by thousands of dollars if you modded it. There's no problem in building a near identical replica, though.
I'm a former vibration test tech. You did very well explaining nodes and anti-nodes in an easy to understand manner. Where they appear does change with scale length, and pickups placement is important I'm that respect. I'd like to add that anything that resonates (most everything...) is a system. The resonant system that is a Les Paul body is very different from the system that is a Strat or tele. String tension, bolt-on vs. fixed neck, body weight and composition (trigger the tone wood argument), where the string is plucked and with what...all of these and more will affect the resonance of the system to varying degrees. Whether one agrees or disagrees with your conclusions, your video does a good job of showing that there is more to an electric guitar than just some strings vibrating over a pickup.
Correct, The term "tonewood" really spoil's the argument that the body ie: shape, wood type, etc. is all part of the "system" that vibrates. If the string vibrates different - different tone, period.
I think a lot depends whether you use a lot of distortion or not. The more gain you add to your guitar tone, the less its raw sound really matters. Then it comes more down to preference and comfort of playing.
Great video. Scale length is one of those extremely obvious physical influences on your sound that many guitarists will happily ignore and then talk at length about magical diodes in pedals, expensive cables or minute differences in wood composition. All instead of actually practicing of course.
Lol
I saw a good review on the exchanger pedal which changes the tone of a single coil to humbucker and vica versa.
I literally laugh my ass off when I hear these forum “experts” say you ruin a Strat with humbuckers and that “it will never sound right”. I’ve heard them say that a lot. Mr. Van Halen, anyone? When I say that they TRY to defend their stupid comment by saying “his tone really wasn’t that great.” 😂😂😂
LMFAO......yeppers. His bad awful tone sold countless albums, spawned a new industry for strat and strat style guitars, led to the creation of his own EVH line of guitars and amps, and it all started with a guitar made from so called "sub standard" parts without a working neck or middle pickup. Just that god awful sounding humbucker in the bridge. What in the world was he thinking?
I put a SD Little 59 in the bridge of my Nashville Tele and that thing absolutely kicks fracking arse. Doesn't sound like a Gibson and never will, but the sound from it is absolutely amazing. I'm sure there's a crowd that would frown and say that I just ruined the sound of the tele.
Many of these experts are trapped in a traditional mindset and will tell you something is wrong or can’t be done right up until someone famous does it and then suddenly it’s all “what a genius” and “famous dude shakes up the game with a wild idea”, etc.
Do what you want how you want. Conventions and habits are made to be broken.
@@ronpipes1988 An SD 59 in a Tele? Sounds like a GREAT combination! I’d love to hear that. I’m sure it does kick ass!
@@softlightsymphonyband Completely agree! Don’t get me wrong. I love a completely original old Tele, Strat, Les Paul, etc. For some things I tend to also have a traditionalist point of view. But for the most part when it comes to making an instrument into a tool that you can use for your own art, break all the rules if you have to. That’s my philosophy.
Not everyone likes the music that has been generated by super strat players, Eddie Van Halen included. Not saying a Strat with humbuckers shouldn't exist, but what is produced through them might not appeal to everyone. It doesn't have to.
While in theory that dead spot explanation has an influence on the sound quality EVERYONE who uses this as an argument overlooks one massive counterpoint. Those explained dead spot positions are there on an open string. If a string is pressed on one of the frets that division falls in different spots.
You can see in practice when you need to do pick squeals. To get the same harmonic resonance on different frets you need to shift the pick position.
I only play in slack key( open g/drop c) I can tell you going to Gibson scale makes a huge difference once you get out of E standard.
Tarbo tuning is almost unusable in shorter scales unless you use heavier gauge strings. Just sayin.
Absolutely true. I dont understand, why the scale length argument is still out there and even presented by guys that should understand the fallacy quickly...
@@thomaslthomas1506 Yeah but that's a different property that gets impacted - string tension.
Same exact reason why the 22 vs 24 frets and the 432 vs 440 arguments make no sense, same way the fact of having pups mounted floating on a thin piece of plastic called a pickguard should have buried the tonewood debate a looong time ago, but hey, guitar nerds are for the most part pretty much like religious fanatics
@@wasichu66 put a neck on a fence post, put strings on it. It’ll still pretty much sound like….well the pickups. 😎
I'm just drooling over how gorgeous that strat looks.
I really love how you dive into those little details that can have such big effects! I'm a small-time guitar builder, and I remember when I started realizing some of those things (after making errors and accidents), it was so exciting to understand why some things happen. It's great that that kind of thing is easy to learn online like this as well.
It's an interesting one. My old 73 Fender Jaguar I've had since new has a humbucker in the middle and I toured it back in the 70s. It came directly from Fender with the humbucker loose. It's a short scale and narrow neck and was a special order. I asked for it as the idea was to not have to keep changing guitars due to the recordings of the songs and the guitars we used. I was pretty pleased as it did go some way towards that end. I was told that the pickup was one they were working on at the time. It's twice as loud as the single coils and sounds really ballsy when the single coils are switched off. I actually lent it to a well known guitarist on a gig in Germany as his Strat had been damaged. Afterwards he said a few things but the first was "you seem to have a Les Paul hiding in your guitar". I've had several other say the same since. If it does then it's a pure fluke. I still have it.
I've been wanting to put a humbucker in the middle of my jag forever but like no one has it so I didnt know how it would sound.. so your saying it's legit? Just asking cuz once the router comes out lol haha
@@lenbones7940 kk
Fender made a Jag in 73 with 3 pickups and a humbucker in the middle? Is this a typo?
@@Blueguitar007 To claify it was the standard two single coils with a humbucker in the middle. It was a special order. We were under pressure on time and they shipped the guitar and the humbucker followed and was fitted by the German dealer. It really does give you a massive extreme of sound with the output being much higher. Hit the switch and off it goes into LP territory.
@@breifne555 Oh ya special order - I forgot Japan made many special order guitars for Fender. My bad. I had an SG custom that had 3 humbuckers and I found it really annoying not to have that picking space left open in the middle plus the buckers taking up so much room - it was all pups below the strings. I have a 2003 Jap Jag and with distortion it screams and with it clean it can get really good jazz out of neck pup - I have flats on it.
yess finally someone who understands, this is my reason on why i never really liked the sound of a strat with humbuckers in it, in my opinion still doesn't hit as hard and full sounding like a les paul with humbuckers or any other solid body guitar with humbuckers
In my experience a humbugged in the bridge position of a Strat sounds 👍 great but doesn't seem to have as much hard hitting gain as the same humbucker in a less Paul
My Strats with humbuckers completely rip.
I have to disagree on that, take jake e lee for example or any other charvel arist, it's basically a fender strat with humbuckers. And man it sounds massive enough to me.
it's all about the scale length and the position of the buckers on said scale length
no
Those are definitely contributing factors
Man, you explained that really well! Gonna reference this in the future.
Same. Been thinking about the subject lately. Already saved to favorites.
Well explained but objectively false.
Scale length changes in the moment you start playing and pressing down the strings on different fret positions.
@@u.haselsteiner562 Frets have different sizes in different scale lenghts, which means that a pressed fret's scale length is diferrent accordingly.
@@professoroak2252 of course, thats right. But all that talking about nodes and antinodes and the Pickup placement on the "right" sweet-spot is calculated for the open string. As soon as you start playing and shortening strings by pressing your fingers down, all the nodes and antinodes start to change their spots. Simple maths.
Love the unexpected crossover here: your channel and Dylan's are two of my faves 👍
After watching nothing but Dylan videos all lockdown, I'm turning an old sewing machine into a pickup winder. Once I make the perfect high-output ceramic shredder, I'm gonna name it the Dylan McKrunchy.
I believe the difference in tone is the sum of many small factors. Scale length and pickup position may be one of those factors. However, every fret changes the location of the string's vibration nodes and relative position of the pickups so it's not as simple as it first seems. When you play an E# at the first fret, your Strat isn't going to sound more Gibson-like.
Man…. Your videos are so educational. Thanks for everything you do and the information you share.
For the first bass I made from a slab of wood, I attached the machine heads and bridge before routing the pickups. I placed the pickups by finding where I had harmonics on the strings, rather than by measuring where pickups were placed on other basses.
I'm planning to build other basses now; probably the most unorthodox pickup configuration I'm considering is a '51 Precision-style with a Ric 4000-series bridge pickup.
And these considerations are what led me to this video.
Thank you, Dylan.
My Fender Sixty Six came stock with a pretty unconventional pickup setup: a Humbucker on the bridge and telecaster single coils on the middle and neck…. And I love it!
I have same setup on my ‘87 MIJ Tele. Came from factory that way. I think that line was called “Contemporary.”
@@josecuervo1747 it was! I have a contemporary strat with a Floyd and love it. I'm super jealous of your tele.... ever want to sell it? Lol
I have an early 80's pre-lawsuit ESP 400 series S454 Strat, with EXACTLY that H/S/S configuration... the best for metal in my view!
It is rigged up as if it were a 50's strat... which is my dream guitar. Oh, how I would LOVE to get a nice clay0dot '59 Strat, and instantly dig a great hole in the bridge to slap a period-correct Humbucker in there!
Guitars are for playing... and we love what we love.
Stay heavy and harmonious out there! Cheers - from the UK
I have a 66 as well and love it.
Those Sixty Sixes are beautiful guitars. I have a cheesy Squire Strat (I'm mainly a bassist) with that same pickup configuration. It's like five totally different sounds. My other Squire Strat has the the three single coils as each of the five sounds are a lot more similar to each other.
That's why I love my Tele Custom. Single in the bridge, and Wide Range in the neck. Great and unusual to me. All my guitars are unique in voice. That's why I have and keep them. I don't want a "One Guitar to Rule them All."
I have bought and sold many guitars, from ibanez prestige, contemporary strats with Floyd's, gibson SG, PRS S2's, Se's, EVH Frankie etc looking for the one to rule them all guitar. I've concluded it doesn't exist and each one has something appreciable that is excels in, whether it is a specific tone or playability in a genre. So I have completely changed my thinking and agree with you 100%
@@dakotamorgan6594 Agreed. "Non-guitar people" are like "Why do you need more than one, or two at most?"... Haha, man, you just nailed it. I love that all of my guitars sound and play a little different. It kind of "forces" me to play them all, depending on my mood that day!
Hehe at his point I have three different t-type guitar with three different neck pickups. I prefer the humbucker and the p90 combos, really couldn’t choose between the two.
@@jonthehermit8082 oh yeah! i dont have a tele with P90's in it yet!... DANG IT! lol
@@MajorUpgrade -I always respond to that question with "would ya play golf with one club?"
Love your channel. Gives me so much important information in such a nice way
In my 40+ years of playing I've never heard this theory before, and it makes total sense!
I built a project guitar a few years back, a MIM Strat with Pearly Gates pickups wired in the normal humbucking fashion. It sounded half-@ssed, so I wired the pickups in series and it now sounds like a Strat with souped-up single coil pickups. I use it a lot as my go-to Strat (I usually play a Les Paul).
That division explanation falls flat when you take into account the ability to fret the strings.
@@NeZversSounds yeah I was kinda thinking the same thing, and also that moving the pickups to the relative distance from the common nodes on the string would account for that. You could even have scaled up/ down pickup widths, if that actually mattered. My guess is that it's not the pick-ups or the harmonics from the scale length, but rather it's the harmonics from the chladni patterns on the wood which probably emphasizes the lower harmonics and acts like a low band pass filter.
I have an Eddy-inspired Strat, but I put my pickup parallel to the bridge and about 1/2inch twd the neck to be a bit less thin and trebly. The fact that you can play with pickup position just by making a pickguard has to make Strats the best platform for trying things like this. Good vid, thanks
1000%
Cheers brother
I ordered a mod shop Strat with dual humbuckers, instead of HSS or SSS and love that its a familiar set up to my Gibson LP, but with a bit different tone for some variety
...a spankier proposition, if I may say so!
Mattew Perkins - In the 70's Allan Holdsworth used to put dual PAF's in his Strats. Just like EVH he wanted a guitar that played like a Strat, but didn't sound like one.
Great info . . . keep 'em coming mate !
i love learning something new every day. Thanks man!
Scale length is huge when it comes to humbuckers but oddly nowhere near as big of a deal when it comes to single coils. Put a conversion neck on a single coil Strat or Tele and the tiny difference will be nixed once in the mix with a band; put a conversion neck on a Strat or Tele with humbuckers and you have a different guitar. Not better or worse, just different. It is wildly cool. Try it if you get the chance.
Interesting. Never heard that before, thanks.
That makes no sense whatsoever. You basically say, that putting a capo on the first fret of a super strat with "transform" the guitar. Sorry, but it does not work like that.
To be fair, it's cheaper than buying a new guitar, but from my experience, getting a different pick is cheaper still. And the advantage is, that it actually works. Picks change the tone.
@@bakters What? a capo does not change the scale length which is what he's talking about. Changing the scale length dramatically affects the feel and tone of the instrument, a lot more than a capo
"Scale length is huge when it comes to humbuckers"
I disagree utterly. I've owned guitars, all with humbuckers, with scale lengths of 25.5", 27.0", 28.0", 28.625", and 29.4" and while the tension on the strings changes / has to be accounted for (with different gauges and/or downtuning), the difference in sound isn't markedly different. It's mostly feel.
@@DapperHesher I agree with you, however don't discount that the way you play changes with how the guitar feels, and how you play absolutely does influence tone. "Tone is in the fingers"
Awesome video as always. I'd also like to add:
Different geometries in different instruments like a strat and a LP for example changes the way you play the guitar. The attack on strings would be different, the way you fret the notes also.
So besides all those fisical facts about the guitars per se, the tone would also not be the same simply because you can't play two different guitars the same way
My number one guitar right now is a Godin with a 25.75” scale that I installed some Fender “No Caster” Tele pickups into - but also left a Strat single coil pickup in the middle position that I can add into the mix with a toggle switch.
This gives me the 3 position tele sounds PLUS another 3 “in-between” Strat sounds when I toggle on the middle pickup. I LOVE IT!
Always learn something new from you. Very informative 👍
100% Right on regarding the significance of differences in scale length and guitar architecture. When the telecasters first appeared traditionalists felt they were cheap junk. Despite that, they succeeded in creating their own unique nitch in sound and performance.
Teles are awesome
Great video and analysis man! What about a Fender Mustang HH with hard tail bridge?? They have the exact same scale than gibsons (24.75"). If you install gibson pickups on it, should it sound the same??
Great video. I always suspected as much about the bridge and how much it affects tone, but your point about measurement is spot on.
A great video. Thank you for accurately explaining in layman's terms, the basics of why this is the case. It's the next best thing to building from scratch your own guitar. Nothing taught me more about what truly makes a difference in the tone of an electric guitar.
I’ve had just a bridge full size humbucker in my Strat for a decade, and I recently upgraded it to a Fishman Fluence Classic, and it’s my favorite guitar I own now. I prefer it over my “cool” guitars (Mustang, Jazz Master, Casino). I tune down to D and use 9-46s, and it does something I’ve been searching for for awhile. It isn’t a Les Paul, and it’s more powerful than a Strat. It is it’s own thing.
Hi Dylan, I have a 72 Thinline Telecaster with an ash body, maple neck and fretboard. It came with 2 humbuckers, but not the Fender Wide range ones. The pickups are from a PRS SE model. It has a 3 position switch and push push pots for more tone selections. Since it is a semi hollow body due to the left side of the body having the Florentine cut, the control cavity under the pick guard and the top being a cap like an ES 335 it does sound quite a bit different. It does get a sound pretty close sound to an ES 335 when the pickup selector switch is in the mid position and the controls are in the normal position.
For a "fatter" sound try 9,5 strings that they don't brake easily.
@@Tolbens I don't have a problem with fat tone. I use 8 gauge strings because the tension is tighter since it's a fender scale guitar they feel like 10s would on a Gibson. I haven't broken a string since getting the guitar last December. I like the sound and it works for me.
Very nice video, Dylan! Im planning to put humbuckers in one of my Strats and this video helped to do that! Thanks!
Enjoyed that explanation and dig your philosophies... first time here.. subscribed! ;-)
Had a buddy in 1990 that was excited about his newly aquired Fender Tele he had just put Humbuckers on ... had no Idea at that time what he was talking about... since then, picked up the guitar and this video gives new perspective to the whole topic.. his guitar sounded GREAT, btw... but definitely it's own flavor, as you point out here.."Let the flavor, be the flavor." ... words to live by.. ^_^
Thanks, brother... happy to have found you...
Two weeks ago I bought a Slick SL55. I wanted to get it because it has a Gibson scale length on a Telecaster style body with filtertron pickups. I have Telecaster style guitars with traditional Fender scale length and P90s, another with Humbuckers, and one with traditional Telecaster pickups.. It's interesting how much the sound changes with the different pickups and placement. Thanks for your video.
That sounds like something I would buy. Really intrigued by filtertron lately , one of the things I love but don’t have.
@@jonthehermit8082 filtertrons really are great and unique
Thank you! After realizing tone wood makes no difference for electric guitars (SMG on TH-cam did a great video on this) I wondered why guitars sound so different between brand and model when the pickups are the same. This cleared it all up for me. If only guitar companies spent more time on these factors while elaborating on them rather than the sexier “tone wood” bs.
@@ericv7720 I suggest you check out all the videos that prove with science that tone wood is a myth with electric guitars. I’m sorry but simply stated wood does not enhance or filter out frequencies. Your pickups do and the speakers do, wood does not. It’s been proven and the evidence is all over TH-cam.
@@ericv7720 no, science is the final judge. Null tests have been done between identical guitars with different wood types. They showed absolutely no difference in frequency response. Same as tube type for amps in fact (yet another tone myth). If you want to know the truth just look it up. Or you can spend extra money for something that won’t do a thing for your tone. It’s your choice. I’ll be spending my time and effort on things that actually effect frequency response like pickups, bridges and speakers. Just think about it logically, how on can a type of wood change the sound being generated by metal strings being vibrated and transferred into electrical signals into magnets? That wood can help with sustain but that’s it my friend. I’m not trying to be a jerk, just trying to inform. Best of luck to you.
@@ericv7720 btw, ears aren’t a judge. The brain interprets signals received by your ears to produce a perception. And as we all know the brain can be fooled by misconceptions and bias. That’s why science is so good at clearing up these fallacies.
@@michaelsnydermusic ohhh just sustain that’s all.
Jim Lill did a really awesome series of videos on some of these sound myths, including tonewood. Even took care of the effect of scale length and pickup position. Was super cool to watch.
I started off being certain that the only real difference is the longer scale 25-1/2 in. VS. 24-3/4 (Gibson), but optimal positioning of the pickups under the strings undoubtedly makes a significate difference in sound as well. Thanks for the info!
I reckon this is one of the nicest channels to watch with an evening drink after a hard day's night.
I like your attitude of “just do whatever you want” I really think that is the key. There’s so many other companies out there now making hybrids of Gibson/Fender styles anyways that the actual instrument you play is kind of irrelevant.
That guitar is B E A U T I F U L! I'm really starting to like that vintage white and torti pick guard look.
See Mark Knopfler's Pensa white Strat!
Thom Yorke has a jazzmaster like this and honestly it's my favorite guitar of his(he uses it a lot in the smile)
That was great information! Thanks for posting it. 😎👍
GREAT explanation! Very easy to understand.
Love it! technically fairly correct. Easier to say pickup placement in ratio to scale length is different, affecting tonality. scale length alone would've settled the premise. Now go search some Tele Deluxe vs Les Paul sound comparisons. You hear a fender scale length being a fender scale length, BUT, with the Seth Lover Pickups, placement running the same amp there is only a bit more treble to the fender and low E chord plays less muddy, but man, Its a Paul enough character that it would take an extreme cork sniffer to pick it out of a recording.
Such a wonderfully non-pretentious video full of expert info in layman's terms. I have always favored Gibson and the like while not discounting Fender style humbucking guitars.
I am a new fan and subscriber as a result of your delivery.
Helpful. Thanks. I swapped the humbuckers between a Les and an EVH and i couldnt believe the results! The guitars still sounded exactly like they did originally. I learned that tone is in the guitar not the pickups. Your explanation adds another reason why this is the case. Cheers.
Thank you for such a clear, logical explanation! I have never heard this before, and I have learned a lot from this video. Now subscribed!
Enlightening! Doesn't sound like an LP; still sounds damn good.
Strat with humbuckers = Eddie Van Halen = “Super Strat” = Ibanez and every other guitar made in the 1980s. (plus Floyd Rose)
Exactly why I wouldn't be interested in them. Not everyone likes 80s hard rock and hair metal.
@@feloniousmonk321 they do blues,rock and pop extremely well.......maybe look around at what so many different musicians used at different times..and as a side note how the fuck can anyone NOT like 80s hard rock and hair metal?
They're cool back then. But as you grow older. They kinda starting to look cringy.
This is an awesome video, very well put
It's not too often I actually learn something new from these kind of videos but I'm glad I watched this video. I now (sort of) understand why an SG sounds different than a Les Paul.
My favorite guitar right now is a 2020 epiphone standard SG that I modded with a fender jaguar pickup in the middle position. I tune down to C standard and call it doom twang.
Now that’s an interesting idea👍
How are the Epi SG Standards routed under the pickguard? Is it a "swimming pool" route, or did you have to route out space for the Jaguar pickup?
@@Justin.Franks I wasn't there when the work was done so I didnt see how exactly it was routed to start with. My assumption was for two humbuckers. But I had my buddy route it out swimming pool style in case I wanted to switch out with something else or move them around. Was thinking it would be cool/funny to replace the humbuckers for jazzmasters.
Okay about scale length, but then just place the pickups in the same relative location on the Strat vs the Les Paul, and you greatly reduce any effect of scale length on the sound. Would be a good experiment to prove or disprove sonic differences due to pickup location.
but the scale would still be different..i suggest having a strat neck made up with the shorter scale. THEN place the pickups in the same relative position as a Les Paul.
I seem to recall Gibson having a pick up that slid on a track up and down the body. I can't recall if it was the neck, bridge or both. I didn't play guitar at the time, so I didn't pay that much attention but looking back, it seems like a killer idea that didn't catch on.
Awesome video!! I have a PRS SE Custom 24 and I have been toying with the idea of changing the pickups out to a different Humbucker in the bridge with the ability to split it and a Humbucker style P90 in the bridge position.
Excellent Video, I learned a lot from that. I also wondered what the difference was on an SG vs. a Les Paul.
That is a good question, maybe it's the maple neck? I'm just guessing. Try changing the pickups to a Classic '57 or a Seymour Duncan JB, or a Dimarzio Distortion? Maybe that is a good thing that it doesn't sound like a Les Paul. It has a unique personality about it. It's sounds just different.
scale length...bolt on neck....pickup position in relation to bridge and from each other....different bridge.....tuners in line......different body and neck material........different nut width.........hollow pickup cavity with resonant pick guard......different wiring style,possible caps,pots might have different rating 250 vs 500?
Battle of the single coils. Strat with 3 P-90 pickups and/or Tele with P-90s.
They can sound great in either.
I have a tele with 2 Rio Grand P90's. I thought it sounded good, but I haven't compared the sound to my LP with P90's.
“ any combination of pick ups in any guitar”- I like that. I noticed right away during the demonstration at the beginning of this video, the sound did retain a Strat like quality, even with the humbuckers. Great video - keep them coming
Great video Dylan. I have a T styled guitar with a little 59 in the bridge (so a humbucker) and Tele with a P90 in the neck. I love them both...all good fun....Thanks
But, a Tele with Humbuckers is amazing. I personally like and play my Tele (with Dylans pickups), much more than my Les Paul!
agreed
Eddie Van Halen did a mod where he added humbucker to a strat style guitar and many people liked it
I own a custom shop tele with single coils, I have been wanting to convert the bridge to fit a humbucker. How does the sound/tone change on a tele when you swap the single with a humbucker in the bridge? COuld you explain? Thanks
I bought a Tele Deluxe awhile back. I haven't compared it to a LP yet to see how different it may sound. Maybe my ears aren't good enough to hear it if it is different. lol
@@VapnFagan you can suddenly play slayer and metallica on your tele and it will sound sick...add coil splitting to the humbucker and you will have a very versatile guitar
but will a LP with single coils sound more like a strat than a strat with humbuckers sound like a LP ?
no
You'll find your answer with none other than Frank Marino, who actually plays a Gibson SG but with strat pickups, and sounds phenomenal!
Nope!
@@Caged63Man I think that was the whole point. You don't to mimic a specific sound to find a sound you like.
@@Caged63Man Marino is such a monster.
Good video! Question: did you compensate for the pickups' distance from the neck/bridge in consideration of those "dead spots" when you put them in? I'm imagining that there was some drilling/boring involved, as the pre-existing spaces in that guitar would've been too small for those P-90's.
Excellent explanation of exactly why the scale length alters the sound -- I think it's something most guitarists figure out by experience, but the nodes chart and nodes explanation really helps.
I want to see a pickup set that can be slid forwards and backwards to hear the difference and find the best spots
Check out the Gibson Grabber bass! The single pickup does what you described. Not a guitar but still super cool!
It has been done.
I had a 1975 Gibson Grabber. The sliding pickup was great and a shame it never caught on. Like a P bass on steroids.
i believe that the gibson grabber bass had a sliding pickup setup?
@@charlesstiebing9231 It did. I had one.
Don't forget that Strats are routed heavily behind the pickguard, creating a chambered effect. Also, the pickups are mounted onto the pickguard, not the body. These factors also influence tone dramatically.
@@unrealworld6782 Actually, no. He didn't nail it. The biggest reason an LP guitar sounds different from a Strat style guitar with the same pick-ups, is because of the difference in scale length and placement of said pick-ups. Everything else is tiny factors.
No.
Good points
My “secret” favorite combination for a great studio tone. Fender Duo-Sonic (24” ‘short scale’) with 2 Dimarzio Pro Track single sized humbuckers. It is has a great, very musical voice and easy to play.
I'm working on a build right now that is a PRS style body/scale with a P90 bridge pickup and a tele neck. I'm super stoked, I've never seen that combo before and I think it's gonna rock!
Would be really curious about how a Tele bridge PU sounds in a Les Paul…, honestly!
Exactly!
I’ve got 2 Warmoth Strats with 24.75” scale length necks and a single bridge humbucker each, specifically built them to mimic the Tom Delonge style Strat but ended up doing my own thing. They both have a coil split in case I want a more traditional Strat sound, but needless to say, they still sound like strats compared to my Les Pauls, they’re just different animals entirely, but ultimately they sound close enough when running a high-gain sound.
Mine probably sound closer to Les Pauls because they’ve got Tune-O-Matic bridges as well.
If you want to see one of them, click on my profile here on TH-cam
one day you will stop copying others and have your own tone...but alas I doubt it, you're still chasing others peoples tones...I bet you have relic'd guitar too..lol
play some AIC ....that boy can rock a strat like humbucker loaded guitar
Really enjoyed this. Super good explanation of something I never knew the answer to until now! Thanks! Also - that guitar colorway is gorgeous. I would love to own that guitar.
I enjoy learning about the physics of sound from yr contributions. Thanks.
I get why scale length and pickup placement would make a difference on open strings, but once you fret a note, all the nodes and anti-nodes have shifted, right? It seems to me that the string tension and the bridge design have a greater effect than scale length as an independent factor. The guitar sounds great and I appreciate the discussion, so much respect.
Yes. The loudest (and lowest) part of the string is half way. The neck pickup will be closer to that point until you get way up to the 17th fret or so, after that the center pickup will be over the loudest (and lowest) part of the string.
The scale length itself is a different issue. That is, any neck pickup will sound warmer on any scale length if you put it closer to the neck. I think Dylan is saying that even if the pickups are in the same relative positions, a higher scale length will make it sound brighter, but I have no idea.
To be honest, even PRS SC245 with exactly same scale length as '59 Les Paul, sounds nothing like a Les Paul ;)
I have a prs 594 it doesn't sound like the lespauls I've had in the past
I ordered a custom guitar from a local shop. Strat body shape but Gibson-like scale length and 2 SD P-Rails. Excited to see the end result in about a month
Excellent explanation. I learned something this morning
Research it dont just take my word but zz top used teles live for years and got the audio to come out les paul theres videos that describe how they did it every show... and simply cuz dude liked the tele neck and light weight lol theres also vids of people putting strat single coils in les Paul's and playing Hendrix and it's very dead on but with distortion and fuzz and modern tech you can get any sound these days personally I prefer single coils In my fender types but the bridge bucket in a strat and jag and neck of a tele deff has a large following
lol
@@DylanTalksTone seriously its hilarious especially when the asks about the finish of this heavy reliced war torn tele and p bass... you expect to hear this amazing tale about these vintage instruments as top uses and... the tech is like.. "oo yeah there both new fenders the finish is actually a sticker of a p bass I found online that was In a flood.." hahaha I'm like dang theres like a whole rack unit to make the new tele sound like a les and a decal to make something new look old... it shows that when your a guitar hero you just do what you plz hahaha..
Just so it's clear tho I dont think a humbucker strat sounds like a les when you play them back to back clean they simply wont the scale length is different the pickup spacing is different even the angle the strings are as well and the different bridges all will slightly change sound... but a few dirt pedals and a equalizer pedal is alot different then clean vs clean... I'd even say becuz of shape you'd even play each one differently unconsciously that's just my opinion tho
Very interesting video, but I'm skeptical about the importance of the scale length.
Put a capo on the first fret of the strat, and you have effectively shortened its scale length. Retune it, and suddenly it sounds more like a Gibson? I would not think so.
I’d say the mass of the guitar, the type of bridge (tremolo vs. fixed), and the neck construction (bolt-on vs. glued) probably are more important IMHO. Maybe even how the pickup is fixed to the guitar (to the pickguard or to the body).
But regardless what are the reasons for sounding different, there is no point in saying that any design is superior than the other, just play what feels good to you!
I play a US-made Floyd Rose Fender Strat with retro-fit HH conversion and scalloped Fretboard. Doesn't sound as sweet as a "real" strat, but the sweetness of tears people cry about it absolutely makes up for it.
You make so much sense. Thank you!
Strats with humbuckers are my jam. Once you're in distortion land, everything goes out the window. Nobody listening to metal would ever be able to tell if someone is using a strat or LP.
I doubt they'd care either. As long as you have that humbucker through a Marshall/Mesa/Bogner, etc. sound, you'll be good.
...especially with modern distortion levels and active pickups, which is the case in so many metal guitars/rigs.
"These pick-ups are lower output than the P90s in my SG" - there you go with the main reason why it will never sound like a Gibson, even if these pick-ups were on a Gibson.
I remember reading about how Gibson won the "loudness war" in the late 50s, how their PAF pick-ups were designed and often set high to be louder than the competition. They were sacrificing clarity (through increased inductance) for output level and that shaped "the Gibson sound". It became a stylistic choice and Fender took the opposite camp as a differentiation. This is why they went for "wide range humbuckers" that would preserve the Fender clarity instead of emulating the Gibson style. Gibson went further in their own direction by using 300K pots instead of the usual 500K for humbuckers. These two were openly flying different colours. You need PAF and 300K pots to "sound like a Les Paul", not low output humbuckers designed for better clarity.
Aren’t PAFs fairly low output in the grand scheme of things?
@@Dram1984 Today they are, but back then they were louder than Filtertrons or P90s. Output is also a matter of magnets, so weaker magnets (AlNiCo2) required more wire, meaning more inductance and less high end.
Lol …. Vintage PAFs are lower output than P90s no matter what…. Less resistance (less coil) 7.6k usually with less volume of wire. Also… half the magnet strength. P90s have TWO magnets, more wire… more inductance… way hotter. Not sure where the false info came from, but … yeah.
LOL!
I have a Strat that I made a 24.75" scale, (mighty might 3x3 gibsonesque neck), put a couple of Gibson Humbuckers in it, changed out the bridge mounting screws for flat ones and installed longer saddle screws so I could intonate it correctly. Sounds fantastic but nothing like an LP or a Strat... definitely it's own entity. Great video, thanks for sharing!
This Tech Tip makes choosing pickups better too!
Especially if you can see the "eq" and know what you want more/ less of from old to new.
_this coke tastes like pepsi_
With all due respect this is nonsense. When you change the vibrating length of a string, those nodes and anti-nodes move. Plus the magnetic field of a Gibson style humbucker is much larger than the magnetic field of a Fender single coil. Therefore, the single coil pickup placement should be MORE sensitive to node/anti-node than a humbucker.
Break angles over the bridge saddles and nut do make a difference. Tremolo vs. fixed vs. tune-o-magic bridges make a difference. Heck, even saddle material does. A set neck (or neck thru) makes a difference. Body weight and thickness make a difference. That maple fingerboard vs. rosewood or ebony makes a difference.
But I think where you pick the string and what you pick it with makes a bigger difference than 1/4” this way or that with humbucker placement.
I think in the video he covered most all of your issues! Yes all these things make a difference. So I don't understand your nonsense statement. Not trying to be confrontational just wanting to understand your side of things 👍.
@@josephc3276 The “nodes” he talks about are a function of the length of the vibrating string. When you fret a note, that length is shorter - it changes. Therefore, the location of the nodes change. Furthermore, humbuckers have a larger magnetic field than single coil pickups. Substantially larger. So even if his theory made sense, single coil pickups would be MORE sensitive to changes in placement relative to the “nodes” than humbuckers.
I was really intrigued by his discussion until I realized “Wait a minute - the length of the vibrating portion of the string is the important data point, not the scale length.”
Thanks for your reply 👍. I understand your point.
So you think that top loading Tele will sound different that thru thru the body Tele?
Very interesting and well explained! Thanks a lot ;-)
Hey, Dylan! Yet another excellent video! You are absolutely correct in your statement that the scale length affects the tone, by re-locating the nodes & anit-nodes, as compared to other scale lengths, thereby changing where the pickup is located, relative to the nodes! In fact, I remember seeing a bass guitar, made I believe by Epiphone, which had only a single pickup and no typical "tone" controls - instead, the pickup was located on a pair of rails, and could be slid nearer to the bridge, or nearer to the neck, thus amplifying different harmonics, and in turn giving a "brighter" or "darker" tone!
However, keep in mind that the scale length also affects the tension on the strings, such that, given the same gauge of strings, they would need to be tuned "tighter" on a longer scale length than on a shorter one, in order to maintain "standard" tuning. This increased tension tends to subdue the vibrations of the lower harmonic frequency, which require a larger excursion (wider swing) than higher frequencies, thus giving an overall brighter or "twangier" sound!
Thank u for building my first pickguard,,,I actually changed to a different guitar and pick guard then changed it back.but your pickups are great u set me up humbucker 2 single coils I took Indio 100 guitar put hipshot locking tuners, I grounded cavities with alum tape connected with groundwires it has nearly no noise either in single coil mode or humbucker..plays pretty darn good I've been at it for 2yrs made a little progress....Thank u for helping me get started
Does this also affect harmonics? I notice some guitar are more harmonically rich than others and wondering if pickup position and scale length affect it.
Very informative video! I had never considered that scale length played such a role in overall tone. Strat, Tele, Les Paul, they all sound good to me...
Thank you ...
Very well explained in simple terms
With the diagram pulling it all together...
All together now...
Nice set up.. Keep rolling and rocking😎
Hey Dylan, I absolutely love this video. What are your thoughts on how this informs a Series/Parallel switch on a two-single-coil Tele? I'm adding a DPDT mini toggle to my Tele in the next few days, basically creating a big stretched out humbucker between the two positions. I'm stoked, anticipating all the bite from the bridge and the chimey warmth of the neck, combining with impedence and phase cancellation for a hotter, heavier tone with the specific nodes along the 25.5" scale length. Any thoughts on switching the volume pot to 500k to compensate? I might try that after, if I don't get the highs I'm expecting.
Love your stuff, man!
Excellent explanation, thank you!
Tele with a humbucker in the neck is my favorite guitar set up, I have about 7 or 8 of them, all great guitars. Building a strat right now with Humbucker neck and a Tele bridge, cant wait to see how that comes out. I don't expect them to sound like anything else, but I do expect any guitar I build to sound GREAT. So far, all good!
Hi Dylan, interesting video, do you know of a pedal called the exchanger which changes the sound of single coils to humbuckers and vica verca as well as giving a number of other tones.
I'd say that it (mostly) comes down to construction.
Take a Les Paul and an SG; essentially the exact same neck, the same bridge, pickups, woods, etc. and yet they sound different from eachother. The main difference is the construction, the Les Paul not only being e thicker slab of mahogany, but also with the addition of the maple cap as well, adding even more mass.
Then imagine a fender with humbuckers where it's a string-trough bridge/tremolo system, bolt-on neck, different scale length and other woods at that (not to mention the difference in the exact pickups in the guitar)
The pickups are the biggest factor in a guitars tone, sure, but the bridge, scale length and construction method matter almost as much when added up, much more than "tonewoods" does, even though that also contribute