Naue II Mycenaean Bronze Sword Tests
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- Thrand and Eldgrim test the long awaited Naue II Bronze swords from master bronze weaponsmith and Historian Neil Burridge . They give short history and Thrand test the sword along with aspis in hand out on 20% ballistic gel ans with layers of linen to simulate the old linothorax to see how powerful a thrust can come from the these revered ancient weapons of war! So sit back grab a mead, wine or ouzo and enjoy the package opened and bronze blades of a master smith tested.
www.bronze-age-...
Neil Burridge's site to order these wonderful works of antiquity and learn from him as well!
www.bronze-age-...
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Note from viewer css1971
Bronze hardness (Vickers) : 60-258 depending on the mixture of tin/copper
Iron hardness: 30-80
Steel (iron/iron carbide matrix): 175-458
Hard steel (late swords and modern steels): 650+
A good bronze sword wouldn't be a bad choice until steel came along, and even then the early steels would have been half a dozen of one six of the other.
Lovely swords btw. ... Only ￡350 ... hmmmm..... I know what I'm saving up for now.
![[UNCUT] “บอสณวัฒน์” ลากไส้!! ใครหนุนหลัง "แม่ตั๊ก ป๋าเบียร์" I คนดังนั่งเคลียร์ I 30 ก.ย. 67](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QlD7mU2KKRk/mqdefault.jpg)
Good test, Thrand! And I can really notice the improved quality with the new camera, quite nice.
Several layers of linen offer quite impressive protection against cuts, it's hard to believe for anyone who hasn't tried it. :)
Thanks Skall and we are enjoying our new camera. I might add your camera looks awesome and I am envious it is so nice with remote and all. Yes clothe can be quite protective and in many layers can even stop heavy warbows :D
This tests make me think about differences between type XIII sword (rounded tip) and type XIV sword (acute tip). Perhaps the change of the tip shape come from general uses of helmets and fabric armor. Against this type of protection cuts and sword hacking seems weak.
safety sally skall would get destroyed by you boys
Leather was the answer against bronze swords
Nikulas Kraigsson These Bronze age sword made by Neil Burridge are very addictive and feel wonderful in the hand. I highly recommend his work and bronze is such prize of antiquity.
Hel yea, everything I thought I knew about bronze has been SHATTERED.
ThegnThrand The Viking Sword or the migration era sword, is a later development of the Roman Spatha, just thought I'd let you know, and thank you for the great video, I look forward to seeing more.
InsensitiveCrackbaby
Very true this is like the great grand father of the Viking age sword :D
ThegnThrand Which one should I get :D
Argonian Ale
The Nuae II is very nice and the Ewart Park is a bit heftier as a cutter both are very nice.
Now that was an effective design that stood the test of time.
I'm starting to LOVE Bronze Age swords.
According to Robert Drews the Naue II was really important to history. The oldest samples were found in northern Italy which belonged to the European Bronze Age culture and dated to around 1300 BC. From there it made it to the eastern Mediterranian during the 13th century and became the main weapon of the runners who accompanied the chariots. The combination of fletched short javelins (about 1m long) for toppling the chariot horses and the sword to finish off the crews was so effective that it ended the dominance of the chariots on the battlefield and made it possible for less developed societies to effectively raid the great empires.
According to Drews this was the reason for the Bronze Age collapse. I think other factors played an equally important role, but it was definitely a major contribution. The people in the region stuck with it because it still made a good sidearm when warfare was dominated by infantry.
I remember reading about one of the last battles of Bronze Age empires, I think it was Egypt against the Hittites at Kadesh where each side had something like at least 2000 heavy chariots. The Hittites may have had way more.
Did you tried somthing between a chop and draw cut? I think it it best working against enemy upper limbs, face and neck
We have tested many different types of cuts with the Naue II yes a proper cut to uncovered or lightly cover flesh will go through and deep. You are describing a proper cutting method for this weapon. Against multiple layers of cloth such as in cloth armour it has trouble cutting through like all swords do but thrusting goes though easily if not an extreme amount of layers.
Have you seen this video on our super tough Ivar the Draugr analog gel head.
Naue II Bronze Swords Received and Tested on a Gel Head
th-cam.com/video/oHjDMF78SDY/w-d-xo.html
Very informative video! That sword looks absolutely amazing!
Thanks and it truly is from our testing we were impressed with Neil Burridge's work and craftsmanship.
The Linothorax was incredibly hard, and much lighter than bronze cuirasses. A common misconception is that the linothorax was less advanced than the bronze armor, but this is not true. Later Greek armies relied on lighter armor so they could be more maneuverable in the battlefield.
Alot of bronze swords had a leaf blade shaped that helped with slicing and cutting. They were also great for trusting but the leaf shape gave them better slicing ability over a straight sword.
5:36 after you plugged that test dummy it makes me think that the hilt is designed so to make it easier to pull out of your target once it gets in-bedded deep into it.
Nice shield
Thanks
perhaps the club grip was to prevent the blade from being smashed at an angle more likely to bend or break the blade?
Very good idea and I believe this is correct. Good bronze normally does not break but that slicing angle doe reduce stress and possible bending if you hit harder things like armour or large bones. IF ti does bend it can be easily bent back but in combat might be a disaster.
You said the mix was copper and tin he measured to make it very hard. Would using aluminum bronze work because it is the hardest form of bronze.
Ancient Greeks called that kind of sword 'AOR' if i remember well...
That looks pretty much like the roman gladius, which is made for thrusting rather than slashing (you can still slash with it thou).
Gabriel Olmedo The Nuae II design was for both and yes I believe the thrust was the most effective with it.
Lmao I can remember reading these things would "not have been effective" and were just "ceremonial" in a museum.
The shit people can come up with when they... Don't actually know anything about it from experience.
Honestly it made no sense to me at the time anyways, why would you develop the concept of a sword... for ceremony? It just doesn't add up at all.
Agreed the blades are very effective
Pommel was more for gripping while pulling out after thrust.
I like it, but I'm not even that into HEMA and weaponry. I just like you guys.
:D
Great video man :-)
Cheers from Sweden
Thanks Shield Brother! Cheers!
I've heard of these swords referred to as bronze age rapiers because, even though they could cut, their best feature was their thrusting ability, and likely the primary mode of dispatching enemies.
can you make a ballistic Hoplite shield please
Can you guys try to make a video on using modern weapons such as machetes while using medieval weapon techniques?
Sure we could put that in the works for and upcoming episode :D
Most warriors of that period only had large shields and helmets.
So guy with blade in close combat would just slice open cuts and win by bleeding of opponents...
Very true many Greek hoplites would yield to a good cut too.
A beautiful sword. Great video ;)
This might be your best demo video yet. Tight scripting, clear tests, and great pacing. The improved production values are also notable. Nice work, Thrand and Eldgrim
Thank you :D
ys! i love what you do...So awesome to see ancient weapons and skills kept alive ;) Id love to know how you made your Aspis shown in few of your vids. Did you ever do a tutorial on how to make one? If not, would you please? Keep doing what you do to keep the old ways alive. And Im so buying a Naue 2 now ;)
Siônmarc Simpson We could do a video aspis creation in the future. You will be extremely happy with the Naue II from Neill Burridge I am certain.
www.bronze-age-craft.com/
Looks magnificent but a short for a Naue 2 sword. Classical historian Robert Drews says they are most often 70 cm in length.
You guys have made some excellent videos, and I'm glad to see that your video quality has improved so much from your earlier stuff.
Thank you and that was thanks to a donation of fine Fuji camera with all the extras!
I think a great way to test it, would be to have 2 identical blades. Use one strictly with cuts and the other strictly for thrusting and see how well the blade holds up on the test.
no such thing as testx or not, perfx nmw
How is the pommel held on that sword?
Glad that you show that bronze swords could be sharp and effective to. I noticed a lot of people think bronze swords where dull and crappy.
Ofcourse a steel sword is better. but that does not mean that a bronze sword could not be an exelent weapon for its time and sharp even if comparing to a steel sword
Very true and bronze can be very sharp!
Wow the stab is very effective. Thing is though, id imagine in the "hoplite" style formations and battles, it must be difficult to kill someone. Seems like that shield is very hard to get around in such a tight formation like the phalanx, i wonder how they might have gotten around it with a sword that length (possible topic for a future video?)
We shall cover this in the upcoming videos on what we believe is the style or techniques used with theses weapons and weapons sets.
ThegnThrand This is why you guys are among my favorites, keep up the great content!
***** Thank you and we shall try our best!
I WANT DAT SWORD!
Excellent video dudes! Those same style hilts, and flatter "Disk" hilts are commonly seen on a lot of curved indian blades. On them, it seems to be there to get rid of your "chopping" motion and instill good draw-and-push cuts with them. i've actually been looking into getting a Punjabi Kukri (a kukri with a disk pommel and a hand guard) to practice with.
We felt that the handle was made in that manner to represent the style it was used and force it to be used properly for its design :D
The image the bulbous pommel made extracting the point from a person's body alot easier
Very true!
I was sold on this sword when you demonstrated it actually had springiness to it, & didn't just bend or shatter like most replica bronze weapons built these days do -those are wall hangers. That sword is crafted to authentic functional specs. I have always loved bronze age metal technology, in some ways the copper based alloys are more interesting, more varied than the iron alloys. Also, something that i didn't realize until recently is that copper is heavier than iron, and so alloys like bronze and brass are a bit heavier than steel. I suppose if i had paid more attention in chemistry class i would have recognized this! ;) But watching this vid, it completely makes sense why for hundreds of years after iron was known about, it never superseded bronze for military implements. Sweet!
You will not be disappointing if you get one of Niel's well crafted bronze age weapons we have been more than impressed with these great works of antiquity.
Fantastic work, and great video as usual, guys! That pommel shape reminds me of a question that i wanted to ask you guys; There is a thread on myarmoury about whether or not to use the "hammer grip" or the handshake grip when using a viking sword; www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=2478 the general consensus throughout the thread favours the handshake grip. Compare that to Matt Easton, who favours the hammer grip theory, gripping the viking in a similar way to a tulwar; th-cam.com/video/RTD4LoXpUL8/w-d-xo.html I was curious to know what you guys thought on these theories, seeing as you guys are viking experts. Cheers and all the best!
Thanks and I will check out the links :D
Scholagladiatoria made the same point about the Tulwar pummel. It's so interesting seeing these weapons that have spread over continents and became so prevalent they still influenced weapons thousands of years after.
Very true!
The sword seems like it would useless without a shield. Looks like its to be used short ranges with great power and accuracy. I wonder if ancient warriors would drop their spear momentarily to get in close in 1v1 combat?
The spear is overall better but if a solider knew an armors weakness and how to close the distance, he could get in range with his shield. Especially if his opponent was running around with his shield but using to much energy to stay away farther and use the spears range properly.
For most of history a sword was always used together with a shield. Not until the advent of full plate armour did shields paired with swords become a common site.
And yes a sword was a side arm and the spear the main weapon, also the case for the vast majority of infantry warfare over the millennia and didn’t really change from the Sumerians through to the Middle Ages Until the advent of full plate armour.
In infantry line, shield wall style fighting, think of a spear as your m16 and a sword as your beretta.
It's a sticker however as you noted arms, legs and necks were fair game for the chop/slash.
Very true! the Naue II was the ultimate design that lasted longer than any other becasue it was good at cutting and thrusting. Not the best at one but a good medium between the both.
www.bronze-age-craft.com/Naue_II.htm
Sweet test :)
Thanks we are really enjoying these fine bronze weapons from Neil Burridge :D
It looks that you have blast :) Dont forger check out us on weekend new vid and tomorow one special :))
Sharp Blades This is Thrand! and I shall check out your your new vids!
ThegnThrand Thank you buddy ,) you have sick channel guys ,) keep doing great work,)
Sharp Blades We try our best to be extreme and real!
I was totally wrong with the bronze weapons, they are a lot more useful than it seemed.
What work, works. Don't fix it if it ain't broken.
I am so impressed by this sword, I have no words. It's in a league of it's own.
Thank and we are as well Niel crafts some very fine bronze!
ThegnThrand is master Burridge going to send You one of his bronze axes as well? I just took a look at them and I'm pretty shure I've passed out :D I'd love to see one tested by You!
RubberKidney - I will ask but we just got a shipment in today and have not opened as of yet!
ThegnThrand
OH! Make an unboxing video!
RubberKidney -
We shall ASAP Eldgrim is not here atm though :(
A point about shields: If we look at the art, Dipylon or Figure-of-8 shields would be more period appropriate. The aspis didn't really come into use until the latter half of the Archaic period which coincides with the start of the Iron Age in Greece.
I was watching skall the other day and imagining a fight. I was feeling sorry for skall because you would beat him into a pulp.
So swinging a short sword was like throwing hooks in boxing
+Mark Murphy The biggest foe of a guy with a swordsman would either be a shield to block the sword or a pole arm to have reach over the sword. Leverage would be very important to get around the shield or deny the reach of the pole arm. Things would happen fast so one would need a very maneuverable weapon to hit those gaps when they appear.
i get the impression they were used as bludgeoning and stabbing weapons more than hacking and cutting weapons.
I can tell the sword would slice fare however that shape of blade makes it a better stabbing weapon.
Also the sword also reminds me of the Ulfberht.
Cloth, especially modern cloth, is very difficult to cut through, make sense though, if you take into account the tight fiber weave of the material. Bronze is a very good material, it keeps a better edge than iron and it doesn't rust like iron and steel. The only downside is that it can bend when striking a hard target, like bronze armor for example. Given the design, I would imagine a very close-quarter, almost knife-fighting, combat style, where the combatants try to angle their blade to either cut the unprotect parts of their opponent's body or thrust over or under armor plates.
Charles W We have tested bronze in many videos now on mild steel and the hammered hardened cold worked bronze edge is harder than the mild or untempered steel it will not even dull it. This means it is harder than wrought iron as well being a hair softer than mild steel. Here are or or other bronze test!
Bronze Sword Cuts Steel Plate Mycenaean Sword Challenge! Reply to Samurai Challenge!
th-cam.com/video/Uz_CBcxzOFkM/w-d-xo.htmliddle Bronze Age Spear Vs Auto Hood!th-cam.com/video/8jP3TLZ3RyET/w-d-xo.htmlesting Middle Bronze Age Spears from Neil Burridge - Pierces Steel?
th-cam.com/video/SmKKWmnPWaI/w-d-xo.html
Thrand's Guide to Sharpen Bronze Age Weapons!
th-cam.com/video/t5COC7PjiJw/w-d-xo.html
ThegnThrand Cool, great videos. If not for the relative scarcity of both copper and tin deposits in every region and relative abundance of iron, the Bronze Age would've lasted a lot longer. It's certainly better looking than iron.
Charles W
:D
Lovely video and lovely sword!
It's interesting to consider what hector and achilles might have actually looked like in period gear. (www.markchurms.com/mm5/graphics/achilles-d.jpg)
As for that pommel, it's a curious configuration, I notice that too (very much so) on the Roman gladius, it's got that large rounded pommel that doesn't really agree with certain motions of the wrist. But then, I notice that as well on a synthetic viking sword of mine.
As for the armor, it'd be cool to see if it can be defeated directly with blades of this type, though largely I agree with the belief that you'd aim for unarmored parts, especially with such an effective cutter/thruster.
I think you're dead on about the shields. They did see some usage of center-gripped shields, and some very massive tower shields as well, like the figure-eight shield and this one which is rather reminiscent of the ancient Egyptian infantry shields. (www.leadarmy.com/content/images/products/2380/5012_7web.jpg) (periklisdeligiannis.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/dipylon-sh.jpg)
Some of that bronze armor was pretty gnarly, too. (koryvantesstudies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/8338420083_f225386051_o.jpg?w=750&h=497) (koryvantesstudies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/8339568244_996d9cd9cd_o.jpg?w=750&h=497) (farm9.staticflickr.com/8497/8339687146_5462ea9e11_c.jpg) (farm9.staticflickr.com/8074/8339430570_8510e854a3_c.jpg)
Apologies for the image spam. (: It's an interesting era.
Thanks! Very awesome links and thanks for the post!
Bronze swords are so underrated. It seems the general opinion, including mine at one time, was that bronze was little better than wood and would be shattered by any good steel sword. While steel is undoubtedly superior, bronze is not magnitudes behind. Wonderful metal. Wonderful swords. I need to buy one of Neil Burridge's swords at some point.
Yes I highly recommend Niel's Work.
I remember when you made the viking shield tutorial you explained that applying animal glue to linen would give it a consistency similar to rawhide, would it be feasible to apply glue to parts of a gambeson that you don't need bend? If so, would archeologists today be able to find the residue of the glue on the cloth?
Thanks in advance!
Clothe and milk or casein glues normally do not survive history water it self can dilute and and remove these types of adhesives. Hide glue does not survive either that I know of it is water-solubleas well over time especially that long of time. We do have references in very old text to it being used to make shields with and other things such as composite bows.
Do you guys plan on testing the more pointy "horned" Mycenean swords?
If Neil sends us one we will test it.
Neil is a talented man
Bronze can't match steel for durability and edge retention, but until you get one in your hand and use it the reality of how sharp they can be and how lethal is underrated as long as as you said there used within there optimum style or not reaching
Very true Neil's swords are spectacular and work very well as they were meant too.
I wondered about the round pommel hitting the wrist the first time I saw this type of sword. It was in a picture so I couldn't judge much. The idea that the pummel was there to force the sword to be used in that manner is very interesting. It does seem to be the best reason. I love that idea, holding one of these swords MAKES you adhere to its style, its several thousand year old style.
Yes and we have tried other grips none feel as good as just gripping it the way it appears it was meant too. I have spoke with Roland Warzecha and might try a few different ideas as well on grips.
ThegnThrand I hadn't heard of him before, looked him up, few videos and his website. He seems like a good guy to get some feedback from. You and Elgrim really are experimental archaeologists in my mind, hope Roland and whoever else you guys work with shares you're enthusiasm.
Midwest Mage Roland has some great post and Ideas on his page Dimicator on Facebook. Roland has also reconstructed Viking large round shield combat based on the later century Tallhofers Fight manual.
He's impressive with that shield and buckler from the videos I saw. Buckler always confused me, not ambidextrous enough for a shield that small I suppose. Ill check out the facebook stuff.
Midwest Mage Check this video out as well he is working with all shields even large.
Sword & Shield Fighting with Roland Warzecha
th-cam.com/video/dkhpqAGdZPc/w-d-xo.html
Awesome!
Thanks and we are very impressed with Neil Burridge's work!
Great videos again you guys. Hail and salute to you! Weapon demos and sparring videos are my favorite. I hope to build a nice collection of my own for historic blades in the future but for now training weapons for sparring and machetes will have to do for target practice. One day I want to join a HEMA group but no such group exists where I live. Not even a sport fencing or kendo, which I would pass on both of those. Historical fencing for real combat accuracy without the BS rules is best.
Thanks and hope you find others to practice with soon.
If you can't find HEMA, then study another martial art in the meantime if you're not already. The principles of combat are universal. I would recommend Wrestling or Judo as an excellent foundation for HEMA. Even boxing or MMA training are great and way better for HEMA than not training at all. Another good option are Filipino Martial Arts which often have a large amount of armed training. Judo has the added bonus of being inexpensive. That way when you finally start HEMA, you will already be a trained fighter, and better able to use what's being taught.
Kunstdesfechtens
Well said! Some practice is better than nothing and it will build on it self in time as you find more outlets of arts you wish to train in as they come available.
ThegnThrand It is. I started with HEMA and added classical Japanese swordsmanship and then Judo. Both have cut years off the time I would have needed to understand HEMA from the manuals alone, and are great pursuits in their own right.
Kunstdesfechtens
Very true some are purist and stick with one martial art but I say practice many and find your own style and this will help you understand them all and any thing you encounter. You will become well rounded and be better at the art or arts you favour. They will become one if you need them as well. Many arts or almost all cross over as well if you look at them closely.
How many layers of linen was that?
8 heavy tight weave.
8? That's an odd number... I've never heard of less than 10 being meant as armor... although 2, 4, or 6, with padding between them was popular, but padded armor not layered. But yeah, like 10 to 30 seems to serve as proper armor, although 10 seems unpopular as stand alone armor... more of the ideal under chain amount.
Gehrig RFC Sorry we doubled the layers think it was about 14 miss counted not counting the compression shirt :D
ThegnThrand Oh my, that's plenty. I'm surprised that you managed to cut through it, but only mildly. I made some comments few weeks ago on another channel, and your test is like a direct answer to my questions. Coincidence or not, you are awesome.
Thanks for this vid. You guys are making science. The love of my life.
BTW - can you make a close-up of the edge on some other occasion? I'm interested in how it is peened.
bakters Thanks and with new camera we can do an extreme close up of it soon. Also you post was most likely one I read before I made this video and helped inspire test done :D
Our ancestors the Mycenaens came from the North at Hellas and they were tall,1,80-1,85 m,so maybe that s a connection with the Scandinavians.
This comment section reminds me of: this is how I protect my virginity!