M+ was dated out the gate, NI has amzaing sound sets but Maschine eco system always needs you to do more outside of the unit. NI Maschine is a dead unit and I've owned 7 Maschines. The Push 3 is an extension of the an actual DAW and that is why it will leave all other stand alone boxes in the dust. I wish NI the best but they're looking really dated now. Good luck to any Manufactuers not making updateable units from here on out.
@@jgcamil I love my Maschine+ I'd say the big decision is if you absolutely need standalone. Maschine Mk 3 is much cheaper if standalone isn't a requirement, and you want to give Maschine a go. Maybe that's a better option if you have a good computer and decide to get a Maschine. Using standalone you need to be more conscious of CPU usage. Push has a much better CPU. I tend to use a lot of sampler instruments, which are very efficient, and sound great. Some Massive patches can use a LOT of CPU (but sound awesome... And you can always convert them to samples if the track gets too CPU heavy) Push is amazing because of its Ableton integration. Maschine is amazing because the hardware workflow is probably the best there is, and the live performance options are very good (in my opinion of course!). Also, it's nice to have an arranger in hardware - I think it's mostly well implemented in Maschine
@@tMena45888 yeah man, easily one of the best production devices on the market right now! Loving mine too. Recent updates have significantly improved stability on Push 3 now too thankfully... It was pretty buggy on launch. Ableton Live 12 is gonna be awesome on Push 3 when it launches - I'm looking forward to using the new distortion effect, Roar.
I also have the two. Native's ecosystem seems to me to be much more equipped in plugins of copied instruments from the 80s/90, plus new from the scratch, and lots of effects to which you can add all the compatible NKS brands, i.e. Arturia, but Ableton Push 3 seems to me much more powerful to meet the challenges of the future. Wish there was a Native Maschine plus Mk2: I wouldn't say no!
I have a push 1 and a maschine mk3, and the maschine workflow for me is much better, the sensitivity of the pads too, and one thing that I don't like about the push 1 and that still persists in this most recent version is that the knobs are above the screen, causing your arm and hand to cover the information on the screen while tweaking the knobs
I fell in love with the German supermodel groovebox, but it broke my heart. Awful CPU issues, crashes, freezing, ten minutes to boot up and down...and this was a brand new unit. It's beautiful to look at and use, but its untrustworthy IMO. Got the Mark 3 and use a pc now.
Great video thanks for that! I like my maschine plus for it‘s workflow and i think it is just underrated because of wrong expectations from peoples.. the M+ is not a laptop and it‘s limited in standalone, but there is the possibility to connect to a computer for the endless experience too. The push for me is more complex and less jam friendly at a too high price (only intro in the box is a joke).. ✌🏻
Wrong expectations? That it runs an equivalent amount of tracks and effects as other similar or cheaper devices? Seems a pretty fair expectation to me.
I have both, too. And I heavily gravitate to the Push 3 more often, simply because it’s also an instrument … and the Maschine+ isn’t. Plus it quickly became my go-to multi-track recorder for my few hardware synths and my small Eurorack case.
@@FurkanTopal Don’t get me wrong: The Maschine+ is still an incredible drum machine and overall groovebox. But the Push 3 does not only have *more* pads (although this actually adds to it as a big plus), its pads are also smaller (playing free chords on Maschine+ is almost impossible with my finger spread, not to speak of two handed playing) and - thanks to MPE - are way more expressive (polyphonic aftertouch, bending/sliding notes etc.). That way they offer a much superior playability and actually feel like an instrument.
@@PantaFlux Thanks for explanation. I have Push 3 (not standalone yet) but because I'm an arrangement view guy and because I have encountered some infringements (when you connect Push to computer and drag midi notes inside Ableton Live, it gives crashes) so I'm gonna either upgrade or try something else and except MPE technology, Maschine seemed more appetizing in production wise but also it has its own drawbacka as you said. Because now I got used to MPE, it would feel something is lacking, and also 4gb ram gives suspicions because we all know Native Instruments plugins are heavy, but I wanna feel the production feeling you know what I mean. Doing everything with mouse and computer feels lack of soul, I also want to be able to produce without needing a software but as I understand technology is not there yet and no standalone hardware is not good enough to catch what we can do easily on computer.
I bought a M+ recently and it was just a pain to make it work. Constant crashes, freezes. When it works is amazing, but making it work is terrible. I had to give it back. Let's see how it goes with P3. I'm getting it in 2 days.
Excellent video. You covered a lot of ground and most importantly, kept a neutral point of view. Push 2 owner, then years later became a M+ owner and prefer the M+ way of working. I do keep looking at the Push 3 and wondering if it's something I might want to buy, but I just don't see enough improvement over a Push 2 for me to justify buying one at twice the price of a M+, plus I think Ableton really benefits having a large display to keep tabs of everything. Worryingly, my Push 2 enclosure is pretty sticky now, so I really hope they've improved the plastic they use. Both great devices though and would be nice to own both, but because of the price, for now i'm out. Maybe the Push 4 will have a folding, unit sized large screen.
How does 3rd party vsts work in push 3 stand alone. If you start a project using something like dune 3 vst on your computer, can that even transfer over to push 3 stand alone? It will carry over the vst of dune 3 to the stand alone push?
I have Push 2 and Maschine MK3, for flow maschine is much faster, i like to use it on Ableton, not produce on it's software. Maschine is powerfull tool for find timbres, nice presets for everything. Expansions are very into the genre, so for who produce music long time as full job it save my time to focus in Music. Push I like as keyboard, phrases and chords as I am guitar and bass player I am not good on Keys. SO they work for me in this way.
I love Fm8 and Prism so i'm happy with M+ for percussive sound it's a wonderful box and it's wonderful sampler sequencer ...( but i need keyboard to do music with, like a big Yamaha Modx ) Push 3 is wonderful too for many many thing i think to play like instrument it's better ,one of them is enough for me ;)
This just shows how incredibly powerful Maschine+ is, and for half the price of a push 3… And you actually arrange your entire track on the M+, while the Push only has the basic session view. Not sure about the ADAT connections. Most audio interfaces and mixers use audio over USB, something Push3 can’t handle. Strange choice by Ableton…
Im still rocking my Machine Studio and Jam, I also have a Push2 thinking about upgrading. I love the workflow of my M/Studio and Jam. Really not into standalone. But, I am interested in the Push 3, not standalone, but MPE is tempting for the Push 3.
I have push 2 I want both combined to be PushMaschina but that reality leaves me wanting to demo both. Happy with enough features on suite and there is a lot of cool hacks you can do with push 2 such as looping and playing instruments and having a finger drum machine live.
Well... I've recently ordered a push 3 (controller version) as I really want to delve into its MPE capabilities.... which is something maschine can't do.... So it was a no brainer for me. I find tweaking/automating parameters to a grid makes things sound robotic and too predictable. The only thing that bothers me is the size of push 3 compared to maschine +. Studio space is important at the end of the day.
M+ has Jam, that extends the clip launching with the ‘ideas’ mode, then you have a full grid and larger sequencer like push. M+ has frozen its development, where as the Push appears to have a future. Come on NI!
hard decision but i think to go for MAschine +... i have a little question maybe u or someone more expert can help me for psytrance what could I add to it for that particular sound ?!.. maybe u can help me to find the masterpeace for add at this beautiful maschine thanks i already have a roland se-02 but my birthday is near lol
Hallo! alles ist gut, was Sie gesagt haben, verglichen mit 2 mk2+ und P3-Geräten , ich habe die billigste Option und die beste Option, um mit syhtn zu kommunizieren. zum Beispiel habe ich mpc one und push2 mit ablt 11, einschließlich eines 12-Kanal-Mischpults, das passt, und natürlich passt der neueste Push3 großartig ,trotz der Tatsache, dass ich einen mpc one und push2 mit ablt 11 habe, einschließlich eines 12-Kanal-Mischpults. das mk2+ hat immer Fehler und der mpc hat einen sehr guten Bildschirm , leider im Gegensatz zu einem 10-jährigen Tablet im Vergleich zum aktuellen Tablet. Ich habe P3 ausprobiert und im Prinzip nicht so viel Neues gefunden, ja Batterien, Midi-Eingang und Einstelltasten was + der Preis von cosmiq ist))), ja natürlich denke ich in Zukunft daran, mein P2 gegen P3 zu tauschen, aber das sind noch größere Fragen, aber am Ende kann ich ein paar gute Systeme für mein Hausestudio kaufen, stimmt's? daher ist dies immer noch eine große Frage zur Diskussion))))) Video zum Fall , vielen Dank an alle! Es war interessant zu sehen
I switched from Cubase to Ableton live around a year ago and have had the push 3 controller version for a few months. love its tight integration with live 11 and Maschine was never really a purchase consideration for me although I do own Komplete ultimate 13. don't regret purchasing push 3 over any other device on the market.
May i know why you switched from cubase to ableton? I've been using ableton for 10 years and i am planning to switch to cubase. I would really love to know your reason for that switch. Thank you
@@jackc8120 I was a cubase stalwart since the days of the Atari ST when Cubase was just a MIDI sequencer and I was using it to trigger external synths & samplers ect. the style of music I make is electronic and after seeing most of the producers I like using Ableton Live, I thought I would give it a go. I mean if everyone else is using it, there has to be a reason. After a bit of practice I just found it an easier workflow for that type of music than cubase. the addition of the max for live environment and the availability of the creative devices on offer swayed me. I just felt Live was more geared towards electronic music and had better tools available for me to do that. the recent addition of the push 3 and its easy integration with Live is a god send. I always seemed to have problems with mapping controllers in cubase, it's a dark art and don't get me started on Track controls & quick controls :) don't get me wrong, Cubase is a wonderful DAW and I'm sure you will love it. Also, my pal used Ableton Live so collaboration is easier.
I did not see these two in the same category until this video. Thanks. Ironically the push 3 standalone ups the value of the Maschine + as a stand alone. Never considered Maschine+ until right now.
Video makers talking about Push 3 like to skip the price difference, perhaps because they are asked to: Push 3 basic: $1000, P3 standalone: $2000. He rescues Maschine shortcomings whenever possible, so despite shying away from actual value comparisons, you can read between the lines (not that you want to in a long video (audio x2 is at least understandable here).
Maschine + or Push 3, you decide!
M+ was dated out the gate, NI has amzaing sound sets but Maschine eco system always needs you to do more outside of the unit. NI Maschine is a dead unit and I've owned 7 Maschines. The Push 3 is an extension of the an actual DAW and that is why it will leave all other stand alone boxes in the dust. I wish NI the best but they're looking really dated now. Good luck to any Manufactuers not making updateable units from here on out.
I'm fortunate to have Maschine + and Push 3, and I love them both. The standalone workflow of Maschine is hard to beat though!
We agree...
I have the P3 and want to get the M+ for easiness to program beats.... Should I pull the plug?
@@jgcamil I love my Maschine+
I'd say the big decision is if you absolutely need standalone. Maschine Mk 3 is much cheaper if standalone isn't a requirement, and you want to give Maschine a go. Maybe that's a better option if you have a good computer and decide to get a Maschine.
Using standalone you need to be more conscious of CPU usage. Push has a much better CPU. I tend to use a lot of sampler instruments, which are very efficient, and sound great. Some Massive patches can use a LOT of CPU (but sound awesome... And you can always convert them to samples if the track gets too CPU heavy)
Push is amazing because of its Ableton integration.
Maschine is amazing because the hardware workflow is probably the best there is, and the live performance options are very good (in my opinion of course!). Also, it's nice to have an arranger in hardware - I think it's mostly well implemented in Maschine
I'm hooked on Push 3
@@tMena45888 yeah man, easily one of the best production devices on the market right now! Loving mine too.
Recent updates have significantly improved stability on Push 3 now too thankfully... It was pretty buggy on launch. Ableton Live 12 is gonna be awesome on Push 3 when it launches - I'm looking forward to using the new distortion effect, Roar.
Sold Push 2 and M+ to get Push 3 instead 😎
I also have the two. Native's ecosystem seems to me to be much more equipped in plugins of copied instruments from the 80s/90, plus new from the scratch, and lots of effects to which you can add all the compatible NKS brands, i.e. Arturia, but Ableton Push 3 seems to me much more powerful to meet the challenges of the future. Wish there was a Native Maschine plus Mk2: I wouldn't say no!
Nice thought..who knows what's coming in the future
I have a push 1 and a maschine mk3, and the maschine workflow for me is much better, the sensitivity of the pads too, and one thing that I don't like about the push 1 and that still persists in this most recent version is that the knobs are above the screen, causing your arm and hand to cover the information on the screen while tweaking the knobs
The knobs over the Display Its just dumb …
I fell in love with the German supermodel groovebox, but it broke my heart. Awful CPU issues, crashes, freezing, ten minutes to boot up and down...and this was a brand new unit.
It's beautiful to look at and use, but its untrustworthy IMO.
Got the Mark 3 and use a pc now.
Great video thanks for that! I like my maschine plus for it‘s workflow and i think it is just underrated because of wrong expectations from peoples.. the M+ is not a laptop and it‘s limited in standalone, but there is the possibility to connect to a computer for the endless experience too. The push for me is more complex and less jam friendly at a too high price (only intro in the box is a joke).. ✌🏻
Cheers, appreciate your feedback
Wrong expectations? That it runs an equivalent amount of tracks and effects as other similar or cheaper devices? Seems a pretty fair expectation to me.
I like Maschine+ more because i can't afford it less than standalone Push 3.
I have both, too. And I heavily gravitate to the Push 3 more often, simply because it’s also an instrument … and the Maschine+ isn’t. Plus it quickly became my go-to multi-track recorder for my few hardware synths and my small Eurorack case.
Maschine+ is intrument too. Why did you say so? Just because Push has more pads?
@@FurkanTopal Don’t get me wrong: The Maschine+ is still an incredible drum machine and overall groovebox. But the Push 3 does not only have *more* pads (although this actually adds to it as a big plus), its pads are also smaller (playing free chords on Maschine+ is almost impossible with my finger spread, not to speak of two handed playing) and - thanks to MPE - are way more expressive (polyphonic aftertouch, bending/sliding notes etc.). That way they offer a much superior playability and actually feel like an instrument.
@@PantaFlux Thanks for explanation. I have Push 3 (not standalone yet) but because I'm an arrangement view guy and because I have encountered some infringements (when you connect Push to computer and drag midi notes inside Ableton Live, it gives crashes) so I'm gonna either upgrade or try something else and except MPE technology, Maschine seemed more appetizing in production wise but also it has its own drawbacka as you said. Because now I got used to MPE, it would feel something is lacking, and also 4gb ram gives suspicions because we all know Native Instruments plugins are heavy, but I wanna feel the production feeling you know what I mean. Doing everything with mouse and computer feels lack of soul, I also want to be able to produce without needing a software but as I understand technology is not there yet and no standalone hardware is not good enough to catch what we can do easily on computer.
Akai Force is the hero
I bought a M+ recently and it was just a pain to make it work. Constant crashes, freezes.
When it works is amazing, but making it work is terrible. I had to give it back. Let's see how it goes with P3. I'm getting it in 2 days.
I have the same issues with mine :(
Native Instruments just wants you to get the Maschine+ mk2
@@EvilMambo after the latest M+ update I never crashed again. And CPU usage went down drastically
same for me@@Mr.Facebox
And upgrade the sdcard. As the one it ships will cause crashes.
Excellent video. You covered a lot of ground and most importantly, kept a neutral point of view. Push 2 owner, then years later became a M+ owner and prefer the M+ way of working. I do keep looking at the Push 3 and wondering if it's something I might want to buy, but I just don't see enough improvement over a Push 2 for me to justify buying one at twice the price of a M+, plus I think Ableton really benefits having a large display to keep tabs of everything. Worryingly, my Push 2 enclosure is pretty sticky now, so I really hope they've improved the plastic they use. Both great devices though and would be nice to own both, but because of the price, for now i'm out. Maybe the Push 4 will have a folding, unit sized large screen.
How does 3rd party vsts work in push 3 stand alone. If you start a project using something like dune 3 vst on your computer, can that even transfer over to push 3 stand alone? It will carry over the vst of dune 3 to the stand alone push?
no, push 3 doesn't support external plugins :(
I hope they will introduce it one day. In case of this push 3 will become a leader of the market
Having both of them is like owning a Mercedes Benz and a Porsche. The best of both worlds. ☺️
I have Push 2 and Maschine MK3, for flow maschine is much faster, i like to use it on Ableton, not produce on it's software. Maschine is powerfull tool for find timbres, nice presets for everything. Expansions are very into the genre, so for who produce music long time as full job it save my time to focus in Music. Push I like as keyboard, phrases and chords as I am guitar and bass player I am not good on Keys. SO they work for me in this way.
Maschine+ needs a capture mode. I lost so much good ideas.
I love Fm8 and Prism so i'm happy with M+ for percussive sound it's a wonderful box and it's wonderful sampler sequencer ...( but i need keyboard to do music with, like a big Yamaha Modx ) Push 3 is wonderful too for many many thing i think to play like instrument it's better ,one of them is enough for me ;)
Thanks for your comments, appreciate your insight
you forgot to mention the USB port on the push.
This just shows how incredibly powerful Maschine+ is, and for half the price of a push 3…
And you actually arrange your entire track on the M+, while the Push only has the basic session view.
Not sure about the ADAT connections. Most audio interfaces and mixers use audio over USB, something Push3 can’t handle. Strange choice by Ableton…
Push 3 interface is still USB. ADAT is just to expand to more ins/outs
Im still rocking my Machine Studio and Jam, I also have a Push2 thinking about upgrading. I love the workflow of my M/Studio and Jam. Really not into standalone. But, I am interested in the Push 3, not standalone, but MPE is tempting for the Push 3.
Workflow is better on m+, hardware quality still M+. But I'd like to have that with the power of p3
If ableton Link exists between Push 3 and Maschine + that would be fire!! 🔥
Thats already possible. Ableton Link exist on both devices in standalone mode.
Maschine+ all the way! NI is awesome!
I have push 2 I want both combined to be PushMaschina but that reality leaves me wanting to demo both. Happy with enough features on suite and there is a lot of cool hacks you can do with push 2 such as looping and playing instruments and having a finger drum machine live.
Love the sound of the bass of the M+ in intro! How can I found it? Many thanks ;-)
Push 3 has 2 stereo CV outputs (4 mono), which is essential for musicians that use Eurorack modular synths!
Which one pounds and sound sonically better
Well... I've recently ordered a push 3 (controller version) as I really want to delve into its MPE capabilities.... which is something maschine can't do.... So it was a no brainer for me. I find tweaking/automating parameters to a grid makes things sound robotic and too predictable. The only thing that bothers me is the size of push 3 compared to maschine +. Studio space is important at the end of the day.
M+ has Jam, that extends the clip launching with the ‘ideas’ mode, then you have a full grid and larger sequencer like push. M+ has frozen its development, where as the Push appears to have a future. Come on NI!
Id still prefer Maschine mk3 + mcbook air
Cheers, its a good combo
hard decision but i think to go for MAschine +... i have a little question maybe u or someone more expert can help me for psytrance what could I add to it for that particular sound ?!.. maybe u can help me to find the masterpeace for add at this beautiful maschine thanks i already have a roland se-02 but my birthday is near lol
push is also good because u can open it in ableton live but also double the prince..hard decision ...
Why no bug or update comparison? I think future customers should really visit user communities for that, because there’s a lot going on… or not.
is there something like this less for electronic music production?
Can you put each group on it's own midi channel and how ?
Yea it would be cool if doesn’t freeze all the time
Hallo! alles ist gut, was Sie gesagt haben, verglichen mit 2 mk2+ und P3-Geräten , ich habe die billigste Option und die beste Option, um mit syhtn zu kommunizieren. zum Beispiel habe ich mpc one und push2 mit ablt 11, einschließlich eines 12-Kanal-Mischpults, das passt, und natürlich passt der neueste Push3 großartig ,trotz der Tatsache, dass ich einen mpc one und push2 mit ablt 11 habe, einschließlich eines 12-Kanal-Mischpults. das mk2+ hat immer Fehler und der mpc hat einen sehr guten Bildschirm , leider im Gegensatz zu einem 10-jährigen Tablet im Vergleich zum aktuellen Tablet. Ich habe P3 ausprobiert und im Prinzip nicht so viel Neues gefunden, ja Batterien, Midi-Eingang und Einstelltasten was + der Preis von cosmiq ist))), ja natürlich denke ich in Zukunft daran, mein P2 gegen P3 zu tauschen, aber das sind noch größere Fragen, aber am Ende kann ich ein paar gute Systeme für mein Hausestudio kaufen, stimmt's? daher ist dies immer noch eine große Frage zur Diskussion))))) Video zum Fall , vielen Dank an alle! Es war interessant zu sehen
Not having the arranger sorry not worth it
Thanks to pay attention’s. Really appreciate your kindness.😊
Mashine inside Live 12
Great comparison Cheers 👏🔥🤘
my brain damage argh
Great video very descriptive!
Thanks Steven
I switched from Cubase to Ableton live around a year ago and have had the push 3 controller version for a few months. love its tight integration with live 11 and Maschine was never really a purchase consideration for me although I do own Komplete ultimate 13. don't regret purchasing push 3 over any other device on the market.
May i know why you switched from cubase to ableton? I've been using ableton for 10 years and i am planning to switch to cubase. I would really love to know your reason for that switch. Thank you
@@jackc8120 I was a cubase stalwart since the days of the Atari ST when Cubase was just a MIDI sequencer and I was using it to trigger external synths & samplers ect. the style of music I make is electronic and after seeing most of the producers I like using Ableton Live, I thought I would give it a go. I mean if everyone else is using it, there has to be a reason. After a bit of practice I just found it an easier workflow for that type of music than cubase. the addition of the max for live environment and the availability of the creative devices on offer swayed me. I just felt Live was more geared towards electronic music and had better tools available for me to do that. the recent addition of the push 3 and its easy integration with Live is a god send. I always seemed to have problems with mapping controllers in cubase, it's a dark art and don't get me started on Track controls & quick controls :) don't get me wrong, Cubase is a wonderful DAW and I'm sure you will love it. Also, my pal used Ableton Live so collaboration is easier.
I did not see these two in the same category until this video. Thanks. Ironically the push 3 standalone ups the value of the Maschine + as a stand alone. Never considered Maschine+ until right now.
can you not use them both in tandem? I would love to know if Push3 can be the master clock for M+
Yep it can for sure!
Neither. I can play real instruments.
cringe
I'm a guitarist for more than 15 years and believe me real instruments are boring af compared to electronic music production.
The entire orchestra? You should be making videos!
Video makers talking about Push 3 like to skip the price difference, perhaps because they are asked to: Push 3 basic: $1000, P3 standalone: $2000. He rescues Maschine shortcomings whenever possible, so despite shying away from actual value comparisons, you can read between the lines (not that you want to in a long video (audio x2 is at least understandable here).