Nobody ever mentions "Delanclip" It's the same thing as "TrackIR 5", its Wireless, its easy to attach to your headphones with a little Velcro pad it comes with, battery lasts all day and takes 2 minutes to unbox it, set it up and get to gaming. Oh and its super cheap compared to TrackIR 5 and Tobii
It is cheaper at least in Europe as it looks to be sold in pounds shipping would probably kill the deal for me but I would prefer to buy a working flushed out system like the TrackIR over an unknown system that is compatible with who knows what games! Edit: I just took a closer look at the delanclip it is a home made solution for use with open track software!!! You can make one of these yourself for about $30 if not cheaper! Especially if you have a 3D printer! No wonder it is cheaper
@@levinste2750 I personally think they're on par. I use an older delanclip (just 3 IR lights powered by USB) + opentrack software. With a little fine tuning its perfect.
I use the cheap clip on TrackIR 5 and it is perfect - no wires, no lag. I wear hats so it doesn’t bother me and I just found that I can attach to the top of my audio headphones (Sony studio monitor) directly!
I have the Tobii 5 for years now. First on a 34" Ultrawide, now on a 42" monitor, which "officially" is not supported. The eye tracking needs good calibration of course, but if you're more in it for the head tracking... well. Currently (because on the new 42" OLED I neither can use the velcro mount, nor the magnet strip) I have it sitting on the desk below the monitor or on a small box. EVEN if it moves a little bit from time to time, it does not really matter for effective head tracking in Star Citzen for example. Still works, even if not perfectly centered. Magnets: The magnetic strip included is crazy strong - at least in newer mounting kits. I made the mistake to bring the magnet strip near the back of the Tobii while playing around with it, and it snapped in place. I needed quite some strong tweezers to get if off from there. Also - Tobii heard us users with bigger monitors or where we don't want to install it directly beneath the monitor. There is a beta software, where you can configure where exactley you installed the tracking device in relation to the display and your head. Really powerful. Also have the TrackIR... never used it much since I got the Tobii. For me, it's the clear winner (even for head tracking, not even considering the added features like eye tracking and Windows Hello capabilities).
Same here, got a new display with buttons in the middle where the Velcro is supposed to be. I sticked tobii on an old iPhone box and put it below the monitor. Works fine as long as it roughly stays at that spot.
Grumpy: have you ever been sponsored by tobii? Seems like the entire SC community creators have. I've owned both for years, Track IR much longer. At the end of the day, both are a step up from nothing. However, only track IR has little to no latency on your movements and allow muscle memory. When you've used track IR, tobii feels heavy and slow. You can easily move from tobii to track IR... because its better in game. If you've used track IR, you couldn't possibly move to tobii and feel its ok. Its just not. Do you have to clip it to a hat... yup... is that hard, not at all. If you have a headset, then you buy the headset version of track IR. Personally , I wear a hat with headphones over the hat with the track IR hat clip. I find tobii just unusable and it sits at work now as a glorified windows hello device. I don't smoke inside but I do vape... never noticed a single issue with this, that's news... anyway, nice video but I'm always unsure about SC creator opinions on tobii when they are so heavily subsidized by tobii themselves. To be clear to those not owning either of these... I have a track IR with hat clip that has zero cables and no batteries.
The best way I can put this to those who own neither devices... track ir feels like you are looking around... tobii feels like you are using your head to move the screen around because it doesn't react to you head movements fast enough... I can't notice any lag in track ir whatsoever so it feels like I'm just looking around. Hope that helps anyone looking into either.
TrackIR is snappier, but im not sure both should be used the same way. Grumpy definitely uses Tobii the same way as he would the TrackIR, and he is discarding a large portion of the feature set, which is the actual eye tracking. I do use both (takes a little getting used to), and i cant imagine myself playing for example without gaze targeting or gaze missile loading. I you wanna go full Erich Hartmann on the game, grab the TrackIR, but for general use, id say the Tobii is a significantly better package.
@@Sylar0n Track IR is cheaper so I'm not sure why you wouldn't go the snappier route. Personally, I also turn off eye tracking when I did try the tobii as its annoying. In order to stay locked you have to keep staring at your target... look down at your power settings or shield and it loses. I re-tried tobii this afternoon to remind myself of the experience and almost got sick using it. Head wondering around all the time with movements that didn't match my head and I must have it reset head tracking / 100 times in a short period as it slowly drifts or loses my center position. I'm not a fan.
@@trevoC132 Again, what are you trying to achieve? IF you want to be Erich Hartmann and you snap your head left and right all the time, by all means, pick TrackIR. I will not trade my Tobii because i look left/right/up/down 90 degrees and target a ship effortlessly. I can missile lock someone without pointing my ship's nose at the enemy ship. Its the package. It may be slower to react, but ill take the eye tracking over it any day. And lets not even talk about the fact that i have a cross on my head with an attached cable all the time.
The best setting with tobii for SC is head tracking to do head movement, eye tracking just for eye targetting, look at what you want it will highlight and press target lock.
Thanks for this review. Never used TrackIR 5 but I have Tobii Eye Tracker for almost 3 years now and I am really happy with it. Works perfectly with Star Citizen!
I disabled the movement for the tobii 5 eyetracking in star citizen as well. But I do use the eyetracking for target selection. You can look at any target even in the corners of the screen (its not necessary for it to be under the reticle) then it gets highlighted. Then you can press a button on your joystick to lock it (must be assigned, this one is not default). This feature is really nice.
if you give yourself a TINY amount of eye input, it makes it even more responsive in SC. You usually move your eye before/same time as your head and the software seems to prioritize eye movement over head movement (likely easier to calculate), so with a tiny amount of eye input, it responds to head movement much faster.
I have had my Track IR 5 for 13 years without any issues. I also have only used the hat clip. Never had an issue attaching my hat clip to a headset. If you need to get creative you can make your own clip out things around the house. The hat clip has no batteries or wires needed. Works in all lighting situations. The hat clip is not flimsy. Its made from spring steel which can be damaged with intentional excessive force. But your not going to break it under normal use. I just ordered another Track IR for a second computer, and made sure it came with the hat clip.
Very useful. I have had TrackIR for many years, and it worked fine when I could really control the environment for spurious IR sources - track down the glass door that was reflecting light from a window, etc. But I am moving my setup to the living room, and someone else controls that environment. . . There was an open source head tracker that used visible light and an attached or built-in monitor camera, but was not at all reliable. Not going back to a hat switch for view control, so I think I will give the Tobii a try.
If I could afford it, I'd definitely be going for a Tobii. But figuring out why my son's Win10 PC is getting daily BSOD's is a higher priority. One day. Maybe by the time I do you'll have a Tobii sponsorship and I can get a discount while you get a kickback.
I love me some Tobii 5. It gave me all the emersion I crave for MSFS. The perfect medial solution toward VR. Thanks for the breakdown. I learn a little more.
I used AI Head Tracking and OpenTrack for almost a year before getting TrackIR, and it works 75% as well as the Track IR, just not as precise and doesn't handle the greater degrees of movement that you really need PVP dogfighting. My biggest complaint is that Track IR is technology from 40 years ago, and is way too expensive for what it is.
you got me confused at "and doesn't handle the greater degrees of movement that you really need PVP dogfighting" are you talking about the AI Head Tracking and OpenTrack here or TrackIR ?
Great comparison! I used to own a trackIR a couple of years back, now use a Tobii in Star Citizen and I must say you were spot on in my opinion with the grades
I have a tobii5. I use a odyssey ark 55" curved monitor. The tobii is only supposed to be on a 32" max monitor. So if you want to get more accuracy make a stand and put it closer to your face. Mine is positioned a little higher than the bottom of the monitor and about a foot closer to me. Eye tracking with a little adjustment to find the sweet spot works perfectly on my screen now.
I have the same setup... after mounting Tobii5 closer to me it worked much better. But, did take some "home engineering" to get a stable mount at the right height and distance.
I have a 55 inch tv I use with my flight simulator and the Tobii is about 3 feet away mounted to my TV and it works perfectly! It may just be the angle of the camera and yur setup
For me, buy your favourite baseball cap with the money you save getting TrackIR and use the clip. Never had any issue pulling leads/cables due to sensible placement of PC/devices with sensible cable management. Personally I can't fault it and would highly recommend TrackIR for the speed and accuracy above all else. Software is also much better in my opinion too.
Really good, objective comparison, @Grumpy, with a liberal and welcome dose of your trademark humour - Thanks! I get that many PvP pilots prefer TrackIR for the snappy response. I'd previously plumped for Tobii on the basis I didn't need to clip something to my scone. I personally like the eye + head tracking in SC, as it allows me to glance down at the two bottom MFDs in a Sabre, for instance, as well doing preliminary scans just outside my direct cone of vision without moving my bonce. - My main gripes with the Tobii are: - The adhesive on the Tobii's pads will fail after some months if you're in a climate where the room gets quite warm in summer - Bringing a mug of tea to my mouth will upset the Tobii's tracking - even more so than talking / pulling faces P.S.: I rather enjoyed your provided conversion of metric units to so-called "freedom" units 🤣
The big thing about TET 5 that puts it over TIR 5 is that you can run something like nofaceir which converts tobii to TIR signals and allows you to use tobii in any game that trackir can whereas you can't do the opposite so far as I'm aware. Tobii is SLIGHTLY less responsive and accurate than Track IR, but the issue is you don't use head tracking for aiming, you use it to look around which means it's MORE than responsive enough. The difference between the 2 is small enough that only experienced TIR users will really notice the difference. Edit: facetracknoir
like 10 years ago when i first made my track ir thing with a ps3 eye and some ir leds, i read somewhere that you should mount the camera off center of the monitor -slihtly left of the center to be precise-. because your head would obscure the leds when you turn your head to left. the track clip and the trackir camera should be in line basicly. that would help the tracking when you turn your head to left.
I think your TrackIR is an older version my pro clip has it's own USB power cable and I can use it with an extension if needed. Nothing from my pro clip connects to my TrackIR5 sensor camera.
I only have tobii. Love it other than centre focus being bugged and needing to be set every time you sit in a pilot seat. Also had to full reinstall when it broke after I reset it in ac.
@@GrumpyEyeGaming I've got an on/off toggle set. Centre focus I need to change the slider value to fix. It's well reported on IC, hopefully should get fixed.
I concur with trackir pros and cons, don't have tobi, but the cable and background light interference is the biggest cons, that should be biggest deciding factor. Have not used the flimsy reflector clip yet either 🤔
After using the TrackIR for about 2 years, the headphone clip broke (no surprise). I've got it duct-taped to my headphones but, screw that, I'm just going to switch to the Tobii while they're 15% off
With TrackIR I find the software crashes every now and then which requires a restart of the game which is frustrating. Looking at getting a Tobii at some point this year.
ooohhh man that sucks you got that glue stuck on your monitor. Grab some nail polish remover or if you got iso par that works great. just careful if you have iso par cause it can eat through glue.
I got a track IR and use the Hat clip. It is odd to have to wear a hat to game. I wrote them and asked if they could come out with reflective stickers for eye glasses? Giving users a 3rd option. I also must start Track IR 1st before gaming... Star Citizen. Plus I too have a ton of nick-nacks Infront & under my monitor that would block Tobii
I had been useing Track IR 5 for a few years... and just got a Tobii.. My two biggest con/pro for each is: 1) Track IR cares not what size your screen is. Tobii does. 2) Tobii's combination of eye-head tracking feels more 'natural' in movement wise than the pure head-tracking of the Track IR. This is part of the "snappyness" of Track IR... it feels to 'jerky' even if you use the software to 'tune' the head-motion with curves.. it just feels more 'artificial'. Biggest issues i had with both: 1) Track IR hates, hates, hates, sunny days. If you have a window anywhere near you and sunlight is coming behind you or even onto you... it'll interfere with the tracking (as said in this video) 2) The Tobii can make your eyes feel tired/agrivated after a long gaming session as the unit itself is 'transmitting' an IR signal nonstop to work its tracking. Oddly enough, i havnt noticed it moving when i move my mouth, though i may keep an eye out for that now to see if its still doing it or if after 3 months of your video being out, if they have changed its software any to filter that out :P
My main gaming desktop is tripple 27 inch monitors, my flight simulator has a 55" TV and I use Tobii eye tracking just fine on both! TrackIR is a more flushed out system and compatible with way more games.
I love my Track IR. I actually prefer the Traick IRs ball cap clip over the "Pro Clip". I have found the pro clip cuts out if you turn your head too far to one side and the the way it clips on to you headset wears out too quickly making it difficult to say on. I have been using the ball cap clip exclusivly and have better gameplay.
Isn’t there a resolution limitation with the tobi product? When I switched to a 4K monitor I struggled with keeping to Tobi in sync. It’s a great product and can’t wait for them to support the larger resolutions.
ahh great stuff! thanks for helping me decide I don't want a track IR. I had a tobii a year ago but i could'nt handle it. Because it made me sick. I sent it back. I want to try it again but it costs so much. Guess I'll have to save my $$.
Great a nd fair review, I prefer tobbi as its built into the game. Tobii 5 mounting issues can be fixed easily with 1-2mm think double side super stickt tape. Mine tobii 5 has not moved in 3 years
that attachment issue for the tobii is why I don't use it. Been sticking to the OpenTrack for a while and it works fine. Its opensource and just uses the webcam. kind of reminds me of the built in thing in star citizen but works in all games that support eye tracking
Great video and thank you! You're always welcome back again and again and again in Star Citizen! Whenever you're ready to go through the meat grinder again, we'd love to have you :)
Long story short: If you are using Tobii for headtracking, you are fucking up. The eye tracking is where it is at ESPECIALLY for flight sims. People move their heads a lot, but the way our eye muscles work keeps our eyes steadier than our heads. Setting flight sims to use eye tracking for in-game gaze controls results in a much more natural "look around" feel in flight sims
I just use the clip that goes on a hat. Works great, no wires, and would solve just about all the problems you mention. I tried the clip and agree it is a pain and really has no advantages - why use it?
This is a brilliant review Grumpy! I'm so impressed by how comprehensive your thoughts were. I subscribed. I'm interested in Tobi for MSFS 2020... It's the only game I play. But, I have a bunch of Honeycomb flight controls on my desk in front of my three 4k monitors. And, I guess I'd have to raise the monitors to get Tobi to see my face? Also, I'm not sure how it works with three monitors. I'm using MSFS's experimental feature to split my cockpit across three monitors. It's crazy immersive and really does a nice job of show casing my Nvidia 4090 GPU. Any thoughts are appreciated. I'd love to be able to look around the cockpit. Thanks! Jerry. Fort Worth, Tx
Oh, I have VR, HP goggles... but, I found I couldn't fly for more than 20 minutes. Almost too immersive and tiring. And like you, you have to memorize where all the controls are on your flight set up. Not easy.
I use a set of AKG's that have the strap plus 2 hoops over the top. Any chance that trackIR hat clip can attach to them instead of a hat brim? I'm thinking it might be modified to grab the hoop that's always above my head
Have both. The Tobi has been utter garbage when I wear my glasses. The Track IR works better but needs an update and an onboard battery. I soldered a small buck converter and run mine from a 850 mah lipo. The IR is great for DCS and even works in DayZ but I get weird pulsing behavior and have to reset it in Star Citizen every few minutes.
I wear glasses all the time, no a problem at all with TET so it's by no means a universal issue. I've several friends with glasses as well that swear by tobii so I'm also not an outlier from my experience.
There’s software that lets you use both head tracking tracking(camera) and eye (Tobii). Only use it for star citizen though so not sure about any other game. It lets you tweak the head tracking in the software and the Tobii is tweeted in game. Works great for me.
I get tired of the heat, pressure on my face and lugging out the headset and hooking it up (Quest 2 VR over Link cable). I have a grassmonkey 3-light IR unit with the PS2 Eye camera and it was a lot cheaper than TrackIR and I use it a lot more than my VR headset for sims.
Bro how the f are you saying the cable "sometimes" covers the IR lights 🤣🤣🤣 how the f are you wearing it for that to happen?? Ive had trackir5 for almost 10 years now and not once have I ever had that happen with the cable 🤣. And also any head tracking device (minus vr) is meant to allow you to look around with minimum head movement. So yeah, you are suppose to adjust the sensitivity of it. You can also adjust how sensitive the camera is as well so you dont pick up much interference with other IR signatures. I do agree with the clip design on the pro but honestly it isnt that big of a deal especially with 3D printers out there. Also for the cable, I sit pretty far from my desktop and it reaches just fine going under the desk and all. Ive tweaked the settings a lot to get the best of trackir5 and I love it. I would hope with how new Tobii5 is that it would be better. I plan on getting one one day but not any time soon. My trackir5 is going strong to this day. Heck I might get the delanclip one day for wireless option. Plus the trackir5 is 120hz.
I'm very unhappy with TrackIR. Whatever setup and orientation I try, there's always an angle where 2 of the 3 IR lights - as perceived by the sensor - overlap into one point, and it snaps into a weird angle. It always happens at the worst times during a dogfight. And as you said, it's also incredibly sensitive to IR noise in the room. If it's a sunny day and there's a window behind you, it will snap. If the sun is shinning on your face, it will snap. IMO it's an outdated, overrated, overpriced piece of junk. And there are very cheap alternatives using the same flawed tech if that's what you really want.
I can't say that it's an overpriced piece of junk, but I can say that it's outdated and overrated for sure. Although, it might solve some issues temporarily for some people.
![งมหอย จับปลา มือเปล่า หาอยู่หากินแบบวีถีอีสานกับแก๊งเซียนหรั่ง ม่วนคัก! [ขอนแก่น] @Sianstudio](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/JEJZg6N-AbU/mqdefault.jpg)
Nobody ever mentions "Delanclip" It's the same thing as "TrackIR 5", its Wireless, its easy to attach to your headphones with a little Velcro pad it comes with, battery lasts all day and takes 2 minutes to unbox it, set it up and get to gaming. Oh and its super cheap compared to TrackIR 5 and Tobii
I think it's a PS2 camera
It is cheaper at least in Europe as it looks to be sold in pounds shipping would probably kill the deal for me but I would prefer to buy a working flushed out system like the TrackIR over an unknown system that is compatible with who knows what games!
Edit: I just took a closer look at the delanclip it is a home made solution for use with open track software!!! You can make one of these yourself for about $30 if not cheaper! Especially if you have a 3D printer! No wonder it is cheaper
GRASSMONKEYSIMULATION also is an elite head tracker that's affordable.
is Delanclip better than TrackIR 5?
@@levinste2750 I personally think they're on par. I use an older delanclip (just 3 IR lights powered by USB) + opentrack software. With a little fine tuning its perfect.
I use the cheap clip on TrackIR 5 and it is perfect - no wires, no lag. I wear hats so it doesn’t bother me and I just found that I can attach to the top of my audio headphones (Sony studio monitor) directly!
I have the Tobii 5 for years now. First on a 34" Ultrawide, now on a 42" monitor, which "officially" is not supported.
The eye tracking needs good calibration of course, but if you're more in it for the head tracking... well. Currently (because on the new 42" OLED I neither can use the velcro mount, nor the magnet strip) I have it sitting on the desk below the monitor or on a small box. EVEN if it moves a little bit from time to time, it does not really matter for effective head tracking in Star Citzen for example. Still works, even if not perfectly centered.
Magnets: The magnetic strip included is crazy strong - at least in newer mounting kits. I made the mistake to bring the magnet strip near the back of the Tobii while playing around with it, and it snapped in place. I needed quite some strong tweezers to get if off from there.
Also - Tobii heard us users with bigger monitors or where we don't want to install it directly beneath the monitor. There is a beta software, where you can configure where exactley you installed the tracking device in relation to the display and your head. Really powerful.
Also have the TrackIR... never used it much since I got the Tobii. For me, it's the clear winner (even for head tracking, not even considering the added features like eye tracking and Windows Hello capabilities).
Same here, got a new display with buttons in the middle where the Velcro is supposed to be. I sticked tobii on an old iPhone box and put it below the monitor. Works fine as long as it roughly stays at that spot.
Grumpy: have you ever been sponsored by tobii? Seems like the entire SC community creators have. I've owned both for years, Track IR much longer. At the end of the day, both are a step up from nothing. However, only track IR has little to no latency on your movements and allow muscle memory. When you've used track IR, tobii feels heavy and slow. You can easily move from tobii to track IR... because its better in game. If you've used track IR, you couldn't possibly move to tobii and feel its ok. Its just not. Do you have to clip it to a hat... yup... is that hard, not at all. If you have a headset, then you buy the headset version of track IR. Personally , I wear a hat with headphones over the hat with the track IR hat clip. I find tobii just unusable and it sits at work now as a glorified windows hello device. I don't smoke inside but I do vape... never noticed a single issue with this, that's news... anyway, nice video but I'm always unsure about SC creator opinions on tobii when they are so heavily subsidized by tobii themselves. To be clear to those not owning either of these... I have a track IR with hat clip that has zero cables and no batteries.
The best way I can put this to those who own neither devices... track ir feels like you are looking around... tobii feels like you are using your head to move the screen around because it doesn't react to you head movements fast enough... I can't notice any lag in track ir whatsoever so it feels like I'm just looking around. Hope that helps anyone looking into either.
Nobody ever sponsored me on this channel. Probably because I tend to point the bad stuff out
TrackIR is snappier, but im not sure both should be used the same way. Grumpy definitely uses Tobii the same way as he would the TrackIR, and he is discarding a large portion of the feature set, which is the actual eye tracking. I do use both (takes a little getting used to), and i cant imagine myself playing for example without gaze targeting or gaze missile loading. I you wanna go full Erich Hartmann on the game, grab the TrackIR, but for general use, id say the Tobii is a significantly better package.
@@Sylar0n Track IR is cheaper so I'm not sure why you wouldn't go the snappier route. Personally, I also turn off eye tracking when I did try the tobii as its annoying. In order to stay locked you have to keep staring at your target... look down at your power settings or shield and it loses. I re-tried tobii this afternoon to remind myself of the experience and almost got sick using it. Head wondering around all the time with movements that didn't match my head and I must have it reset head tracking / 100 times in a short period as it slowly drifts or loses my center position. I'm not a fan.
@@trevoC132 Again, what are you trying to achieve? IF you want to be Erich Hartmann and you snap your head left and right all the time, by all means, pick TrackIR. I will not trade my Tobii because i look left/right/up/down 90 degrees and target a ship effortlessly. I can missile lock someone without pointing my ship's nose at the enemy ship. Its the package. It may be slower to react, but ill take the eye tracking over it any day. And lets not even talk about the fact that i have a cross on my head with an attached cable all the time.
The best setting with tobii for SC is head tracking to do head movement, eye tracking just for eye targetting, look at what you want it will highlight and press target lock.
Thanks for this review. Never used TrackIR 5 but I have Tobii Eye Tracker for almost 3 years now and I am really happy with it. Works perfectly with Star Citizen!
I disabled the movement for the tobii 5 eyetracking in star citizen as well.
But I do use the eyetracking for target selection. You can look at any target even in the corners of the screen (its not necessary for it to be under the reticle) then it gets highlighted. Then you can press a button on your joystick to lock it (must be assigned, this one is not default). This feature is really nice.
if you give yourself a TINY amount of eye input, it makes it even more responsive in SC. You usually move your eye before/same time as your head and the software seems to prioritize eye movement over head movement (likely easier to calculate), so with a tiny amount of eye input, it responds to head movement much faster.
I'll give that a try! @@TheWorldsprayer
I did this too
@@TheWorldsprayer nice! thanks im going to try that too
@@TheWorldsprayer I naturally settled on a 98-99% head to eye ratio when I set mine up. Seemed to have the most natural motion.
I have had my Track IR 5 for 13 years without any issues. I also have only used the hat clip. Never had an issue attaching my hat clip to a headset. If you need to get creative you can make your own clip out things around the house. The hat clip has no batteries or wires needed. Works in all lighting situations. The hat clip is not flimsy. Its made from spring steel which can be damaged with intentional excessive force. But your not going to break it under normal use.
I just ordered another Track IR for a second computer, and made sure it came with the hat clip.
My dog chewed up my track clip :(
@@goobernoodles You can buy them separately.
@@festersmith8352 Yeah, I'm aware. I play in VR now, but I think I may pick one up as an alternative. VR has it's own headaches.
Very useful. I have had TrackIR for many years, and it worked fine when I could really control the environment for spurious IR sources - track down the glass door that was reflecting light from a window, etc. But I am moving my setup to the living room, and someone else controls that environment. . .
There was an open source head tracker that used visible light and an attached or built-in monitor camera, but was not at all reliable. Not going back to a hat switch for view control, so I think I will give the Tobii a try.
Can just imagine you in a super serious space battle, lit ciggy in the lip 😂
I'm not paying 500$ for a fucken eye tracker. I would pay no more than 50 bucks.
So I'm not the only person who experiences Tobii track my jaw or facial movements when talk and such.
I'ld say that we all do, but most people don't talk about it
If I could afford it, I'd definitely be going for a Tobii. But figuring out why my son's Win10 PC is getting daily BSOD's is a higher priority. One day. Maybe by the time I do you'll have a Tobii sponsorship and I can get a discount while you get a kickback.
I love me some Tobii 5. It gave me all the emersion I crave for MSFS. The perfect medial solution toward VR. Thanks for the breakdown. I learn a little more.
I used AI Head Tracking and OpenTrack for almost a year before getting TrackIR, and it works 75% as well as the Track IR, just not as precise and doesn't handle the greater degrees of movement that you really need PVP dogfighting. My biggest complaint is that Track IR is technology from 40 years ago, and is way too expensive for what it is.
so true
you got me confused at "and doesn't handle the greater degrees of movement that you really need PVP dogfighting" are you talking about the AI Head Tracking and OpenTrack here or TrackIR ?
Great comparison! I used to own a trackIR a couple of years back, now use a Tobii in Star Citizen and I must say you were spot on in my opinion with the grades
I have a tobii5. I use a odyssey ark 55" curved monitor. The tobii is only supposed to be on a 32" max monitor. So if you want to get more accuracy make a stand and put it closer to your face. Mine is positioned a little higher than the bottom of the monitor and about a foot closer to me. Eye tracking with a little adjustment to find the sweet spot works perfectly on my screen now.
I have the same setup... after mounting Tobii5 closer to me it worked much better. But, did take some "home engineering" to get a stable mount at the right height and distance.
I have a 55 inch tv I use with my flight simulator and the Tobii is about 3 feet away mounted to my TV and it works perfectly! It may just be the angle of the camera and yur setup
For me, buy your favourite baseball cap with the money you save getting TrackIR and use the clip. Never had any issue pulling leads/cables due to sensible placement of PC/devices with sensible cable management. Personally I can't fault it and would highly recommend TrackIR for the speed and accuracy above all else. Software is also much better in my opinion too.
Tobii eye tracker, I suggest you wire it to monitor USB and then wire neatly the monitor USB to PC.
Really good, objective comparison, @Grumpy, with a liberal and welcome dose of your trademark humour - Thanks! I get that many PvP pilots prefer TrackIR for the snappy response.
I'd previously plumped for Tobii on the basis I didn't need to clip something to my scone. I personally like the eye + head tracking in SC, as it allows me to glance down at the two bottom MFDs in a Sabre, for instance, as well doing preliminary scans just outside my direct cone of vision without moving my bonce.
- My main gripes with the Tobii are:
- The adhesive on the Tobii's pads will fail after some months if you're in a climate where the room gets quite warm in summer
- Bringing a mug of tea to my mouth will upset the Tobii's tracking - even more so than talking / pulling faces
P.S.: I rather enjoyed your provided conversion of metric units to so-called "freedom" units 🤣
The big thing about TET 5 that puts it over TIR 5 is that you can run something like nofaceir which converts tobii to TIR signals and allows you to use tobii in any game that trackir can whereas you can't do the opposite so far as I'm aware.
Tobii is SLIGHTLY less responsive and accurate than Track IR, but the issue is you don't use head tracking for aiming, you use it to look around which means it's MORE than responsive enough.
The difference between the 2 is small enough that only experienced TIR users will really notice the difference.
Edit: facetracknoir
holy shit I didn't know that nofaceir can do that.
Whoops, it was facetracknoir @@GrumpyEyeGaming
Best comparison video for those 2 producs so far. Thanks a lot!
Thanks for a great review of both in helping me make a decision... As at this time and until Sept 2024 there is a 20% discount off Tobi
like 10 years ago when i first made my track ir thing with a ps3 eye and some ir leds, i read somewhere that you should mount the camera off center of the monitor -slihtly left of the center to be precise-. because your head would obscure the leds when you turn your head to left.
the track clip and the trackir camera should be in line basicly. that would help the tracking when you turn your head to left.
I use Tobii for about 4 years now (Elite and some other games like assassins creed, farcry or division)...i like it :)
Using the Tobii 5 in DCS does not work at all. its jittering all over the place and cant hpld still for even a second
I think your TrackIR is an older version my pro clip has it's own USB power cable and I can use it with an extension if needed. Nothing from my pro clip connects to my TrackIR5 sensor camera.
Great video as this is a much over looked topic. I personally have Tobi and love it.
I only have tobii. Love it other than centre focus being bugged and needing to be set every time you sit in a pilot seat. Also had to full reinstall when it broke after I reset it in ac.
you can set it to a keybind. I have it on my sticks because I move around a lot.
@@GrumpyEyeGaming I've got an on/off toggle set. Centre focus I need to change the slider value to fix. It's well reported on IC, hopefully should get fixed.
I concur with trackir pros and cons, don't have tobi, but the cable and background light interference is the biggest cons, that should be biggest deciding factor. Have not used the flimsy reflector clip yet either 🤔
After using the TrackIR for about 2 years, the headphone clip broke (no surprise). I've got it duct-taped to my headphones but, screw that, I'm just going to switch to the Tobii while they're 15% off
With TrackIR I find the software crashes every now and then which requires a restart of the game which is frustrating. Looking at getting a Tobii at some point this year.
ooohhh man that sucks you got that glue stuck on your monitor. Grab some nail polish remover or if you got iso par that works great. just careful if you have iso par cause it can eat through glue.
I got a track IR and use the Hat clip. It is odd to have to wear a hat to game. I wrote them and asked if they could come out with reflective stickers for eye glasses? Giving users a 3rd option. I also must start Track IR 1st before gaming... Star Citizen. Plus I too have a ton of nick-nacks Infront & under my monitor that would block Tobii
I had been useing Track IR 5 for a few years... and just got a Tobii..
My two biggest con/pro for each is:
1) Track IR cares not what size your screen is. Tobii does.
2) Tobii's combination of eye-head tracking feels more 'natural' in movement wise than the pure head-tracking of the Track IR. This is part of the "snappyness" of Track IR... it feels to 'jerky' even if you use the software to 'tune' the head-motion with curves.. it just feels more 'artificial'.
Biggest issues i had with both:
1) Track IR hates, hates, hates, sunny days. If you have a window anywhere near you and sunlight is coming behind you or even onto you... it'll interfere with the tracking (as said in this video)
2) The Tobii can make your eyes feel tired/agrivated after a long gaming session as the unit itself is 'transmitting' an IR signal nonstop to work its tracking.
Oddly enough, i havnt noticed it moving when i move my mouth, though i may keep an eye out for that now to see if its still doing it or if after 3 months of your video being out, if they have changed its software any to filter that out :P
My main gaming desktop is tripple 27 inch monitors, my flight simulator has a 55" TV and I use Tobii eye tracking just fine on both! TrackIR is a more flushed out system and compatible with way more games.
I love my Track IR. I actually prefer the Traick IRs ball cap clip over the "Pro Clip". I have found the pro clip cuts out if you turn your head too far to one side and the the way it clips on to you headset wears out too quickly making it difficult to say on. I have been using the ball cap clip exclusivly and have better gameplay.
Isn’t there a resolution limitation with the tobi product? When I switched to a 4K monitor I struggled with keeping to Tobi in sync. It’s a great product and can’t wait for them to support the larger resolutions.
I'm on 4k and I have no issues
Welp time for a suggestion beam eye tracking. Uses webcam and one can mount anywhere that it sees your eyes/face well.
ahh great stuff! thanks for helping me decide I don't want a track IR. I had a tobii a year ago but i could'nt handle it. Because it made me sick. I sent it back. I want to try it again but it costs so much. Guess I'll have to save my $$.
you need to set it up. just disable eye tracking and you won't get sick :)
Great a nd fair review, I prefer tobbi as its built into the game. Tobii 5 mounting issues can be fixed easily with 1-2mm think double side super stickt tape. Mine tobii 5 has not moved in 3 years
Awesome! This is VERY valuable input and exactly what I as looking for! THANK YOU - and really nice channel and content btw.!
what was the games that you were playing besides Star Citizen
that attachment issue for the tobii is why I don't use it. Been sticking to the OpenTrack for a while and it works fine. Its opensource and just uses the webcam. kind of reminds me of the built in thing in star citizen but works in all games that support eye tracking
Tobii 5 owner here. No mechwarrior 5 support 😢
Great video and thank you! You're always welcome back again and again and again in Star Citizen! Whenever you're ready to go through the meat grinder again, we'd love to have you :)
Long story short: If you are using Tobii for headtracking, you are fucking up. The eye tracking is where it is at ESPECIALLY for flight sims. People move their heads a lot, but the way our eye muscles work keeps our eyes steadier than our heads. Setting flight sims to use eye tracking for in-game gaze controls results in a much more natural "look around" feel in flight sims
subbed for the American conversion
I just use the clip that goes on a hat. Works great, no wires, and would solve just about all the problems you mention. I tried the clip and agree it is a pain and really has no advantages - why use it?
This is a brilliant review Grumpy! I'm so impressed by how comprehensive your thoughts were. I subscribed. I'm interested in Tobi for MSFS 2020... It's the only game I play. But, I have a bunch of Honeycomb flight controls on my desk in front of my three 4k monitors. And, I guess I'd have to raise the monitors to get Tobi to see my face? Also, I'm not sure how it works with three monitors. I'm using MSFS's experimental feature to split my cockpit across three monitors. It's crazy immersive and really does a nice job of show casing my Nvidia 4090 GPU. Any thoughts are appreciated. I'd love to be able to look around the cockpit. Thanks! Jerry. Fort Worth, Tx
Oh, I have VR, HP goggles... but, I found I couldn't fly for more than 20 minutes. Almost too immersive and tiring. And like you, you have to memorize where all the controls are on your flight set up. Not easy.
I use a set of AKG's that have the strap plus 2 hoops over the top. Any chance that trackIR hat clip can attach to them instead of a hat brim?
I'm thinking it might be modified to grab the hoop that's always above my head
Thanks for the video. Can you share yuor Tobii setup for DCS. I have one, but I'm not able to find the right setup for DCS. Thanks
Have both. The Tobi has been utter garbage when I wear my glasses. The Track IR works better but needs an update and an onboard battery. I soldered a small buck converter and run mine from a 850 mah lipo. The IR is great for DCS and even works in DayZ but I get weird pulsing behavior and have to reset it in Star Citizen every few minutes.
I wear glasses all the time, no a problem at all with TET so it's by no means a universal issue. I've several friends with glasses as well that swear by tobii so I'm also not an outlier from my experience.
I never had any issues with tobi because of my glasses. Check if you have some strong IR signals bouncing around in your room
Welcome back Grumpy Eye...
Can you tell us what flightstick you are uding in this vid please?
thanks!
I'm using virpil constellation aphas
I own both. Tobii
Bro is Skar's brother, holy smokes. Same voice.
nobody would sponsor your product videos, because you're way to honest 😛
There’s software that lets you use both head tracking tracking(camera) and eye (Tobii). Only use it for star citizen though so not sure about any other game.
It lets you tweak the head tracking in the software and the Tobii is tweeted in game.
Works great for me.
bruh you just chiefin cigs in the house? is it 1986?
Red panda...not a raccoon but close
thanks been wondering about this. was not sure if i should go for a tracker or say F it and get VR
headset
Don't go VR, its as real as it gets but you need muscle memory for any keyboard keys also I have dizyness afterwards for days.... but thats just me
I get tired of the heat, pressure on my face and lugging out the headset and hooking it up (Quest 2 VR over Link cable). I have a grassmonkey 3-light IR unit with the PS2 Eye camera and it was a lot cheaper than TrackIR and I use it a lot more than my VR headset for sims.
Is that Star Wars squadrons at 2:32?
Yes
Better to buy used quest 2 for tobii traker price
Bro how the f are you saying the cable "sometimes" covers the IR lights 🤣🤣🤣 how the f are you wearing it for that to happen?? Ive had trackir5 for almost 10 years now and not once have I ever had that happen with the cable 🤣. And also any head tracking device (minus vr) is meant to allow you to look around with minimum head movement. So yeah, you are suppose to adjust the sensitivity of it. You can also adjust how sensitive the camera is as well so you dont pick up much interference with other IR signatures. I do agree with the clip design on the pro but honestly it isnt that big of a deal especially with 3D printers out there. Also for the cable, I sit pretty far from my desktop and it reaches just fine going under the desk and all. Ive tweaked the settings a lot to get the best of trackir5 and I love it.
I would hope with how new Tobii5 is that it would be better. I plan on getting one one day but not any time soon. My trackir5 is going strong to this day. Heck I might get the delanclip one day for wireless option. Plus the trackir5 is 120hz.
I am laughing so hard at the trolling of Asians with the "raccoon"!
a meter and a half is 8.427 bananas for us americans
I'm very unhappy with TrackIR. Whatever setup and orientation I try, there's always an angle where 2 of the 3 IR lights - as perceived by the sensor - overlap into one point, and it snaps into a weird angle. It always happens at the worst times during a dogfight.
And as you said, it's also incredibly sensitive to IR noise in the room. If it's a sunny day and there's a window behind you, it will snap.
If the sun is shinning on your face, it will snap.
IMO it's an outdated, overrated, overpriced piece of junk.
And there are very cheap alternatives using the same flawed tech if that's what you really want.
I can't say that it's an overpriced piece of junk, but I can say that it's outdated and overrated for sure. Although, it might solve some issues temporarily for some people.
Thanks
You didn’t include webcam…
Never had any luck with it. It was too slow and too unprecise when I tried it
Got both. Tobii is way better. Independent head and eye tracking you cans do with trackir.
have u tried them on movie editing, sth not gaming
can they work fine and accracy what u aimming
thx
I think your spirit animal is a red panda not a raccoon 😀
American bashing!!! Love it!
Tobii Eye Tracker 5👍
Mf that's a red Panda 🤣
Grumpy Eye Tracker.
you need to learn to hone your track IR profile. you move your head waaaaay too much
But Grumpy........