The White Princess by Philippa Gregory
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Philippa Gregory, #1 New York Times best-selling author and “the queen of royal fiction” (USA Today), presents the latest Cousins’ War novel, the remarkable story of Elizabeth of York, daughter of the White Queen.
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Based on my own research, I don't agree with everything in the books, but it's still very entertaining and she's a gifted writer.
I'm so excited I can't wait for the white princess to start I love the White Queen I watched it about 4 times over the last couple years now I cannot wait for the white princess thanks for making it now if you would just bring Camelot back.!!
Vickie Dorton I can't wait either! The White Queen was so well done and I'm looking forward to the White Princess!
Freya McCullough the books are considered historical fiction. Meaning because we obviously don't have all the information, she edits to what she believes happened. Many of her interviews from other books she has stated that. Her books are great. The show is never as good as the books though. Just to be a fly on the wall of that era would be fascinating!
Yeah its...Historical Fiction. Its not a History Textbook lol
they were in love! Elizabeth even wrote a love poem about him suring her years of marriage. Henry never had mistress AND never remarried. He died a widower 6 years after her death and it speaks a lot, knowing that unions at this time were vital politicaly speaking. Any historians would tell you that they loved each othe but do not forget that Philipp Gregory IS NOT an historian
It's just so sad that thousands of people watching the shows based off her books and even some reading them won't do independent research many viewers will just accept it as fact and having seen all 3 of Philippa Gregory's tv dramas I know how much she gets wrong, it's really depressing honestly to know that a generation is gonna grow up watching these shows and will have a completely bastardized soap opera inspired version of England's history, by time I got to the show about Catherine of Aragon I was completely overwhelmed by the inaccuracies and utter crap being portrayed as history, these shows need giant obvious disclaimers that point out that the show is a fantasy written by a clearly tallented but obviously biases author, it would be awesome to have better versions of these novels and tv shows written by an impartial author who stuck to the facts rather than using rampant speculation and a facade of feminism as a shield, If she truly wanted to show respect for these women she'd use real history and evidence rather than making stuff up just to make a character a more compelling hero or villain, she is a great writer don't get me wrong I just find her style unclean similar to a journalist who might lie about a celebrity to sell a gossip rag
Interesting how Henry Tudor is referred to as in his 30s to show how much older he was than Elizabeth (I guess we're supposed to be horrified?) when in reality, Elizabeth was 19 and Henry was 28 when they married, and Richard, her so called "true love" was 32.
Gregory seems to have a bias toward the York's there are heaps of signs of her distaste for Lancaster and the Tudors spread throughout her books and television
I tried to read the book I really tried but every time the main character would go on about how Henry had usurped an ordained king Richard I found myself cringing to the point I could no longer read any more. You can tell she is a supporter of Richard iii. She forgets that he was usurper getting rid of Elizabeth brothers to seize the throne for himself. This book makes my skin crawl it is so bad
I hated it. Especially when henry forces himself on Elizabeth. Disgusting to accuse a real person of that with no evidence whatsoever.
+cherrytraveller The dialogue in them is absolutely awful and bears no resemblance to they way the real characters spoke.
There's no evidence that Richard lll killed his nephews and he was already king when they disappeared.
+cherrytraveller that made me SMH as well. Would EoY really have thought that fondly of Richard when he in fact took the throne from her younger brother and declared her and her siblings to be royal bastards?
Even if he did not kill them, he still isolated them in the Tower and bastardized them so he could become the king. He was a usurper and traitor to his kin, not some kind of romantic hero as so many people seem to think nowdays due to inaccurate historical fiction.
Season 2 please I have been waiting for it for the longest and I love The White Queen Season 1 it was expectacular. Please Phillippa Gregory. Thank you.
Speaking of messed up dates, there's this hilariously inconsistent part in TWP where Philippa writes about how Henry VII was "almost thirty" as a way of emphasising the 9 year age gap between him and Elizabeth. However, she seems to have totally forgotten that Richard III (aka. Elizabeth's lover in the book) was actually 14 years older than her.
I mean, if Philippa wants to go down the "big age difference is gross guise" route, I'm not sure that's the best way to do it lol
Henry was 28 though
28 is almost 30 though....
Im trying to forget she tried to ship Richard III with Elizabeth of York. Thats just sick. TOO closely related
Because Gregory Is clearly a York supporter and despite such bias having no place in writing she frequently let's it leak across her pages
I absolutely loved watching The White Queen and The White Princess...wonderfully acted by talented actors and well written. Of course there is some creative licence regarding historical plots and how certain characters behaved.
Watching the series right now - for the second time - thank you for writing such an entertaining novel on such an interesting period of history!
Just noticed that Gregory is wrong. Henry was not "in his 30s" when he came to the throne. He was 28 when he won Bosworth. He had been in exile since 1471, when he was 14, and before that had been raised in Wales. That's not an old age to become king, and an older king is better than a baby/boy king.
Does she age him up in the book, and that's why she says so here? Or is this simply a mistake, or a misreading of dates? I can't believe that it's pure ignorance.
Liz Evans lmao! She rounded it up. It was only 2 years. The king was late coming into his reign. In those times girls were married off at 12 yrs and most people died around 45 yrs old. Those born into royalty usually started their reign between 18-22 yrs if they were lucky. If we had to fast forward then yes a man is better than a boy king but obviously between early deaths in that era it was nearly impossible. I'm sure you the book by now but definitely this writer is not ignorant just rounded off like most historians or educated people do.
@@nurserocky6159 - Not true. Life expectancy numbers are skewed by infant mortality rates which was about 30%. If you actually made it to adulthood - about 20 years - the average age increases to about 65 yrs. Except during the Bubonic plague years where aveage age dropped to 45.
literally every scholar and historian has disregarded and disapproved of this "letter" that Elizabeth supposedly sent Norfolk. Elizabeth was a very clever and soft hearted woman who had to watch her own uncle exiling her family, imprisoning her little brothers who some historians even suggest that she was so close to them since she helped her mother raise them, and killed her other brother and uncle. Elizabeth was aware of what a monster Richard was and never had such feelings for him
I loved The White Queen Series .I am so sad that its going to end.I am going to start reading the white princesses .I love the History of the English Royalty .Also the way that Ms. Phillippa Gregory puts it together is exquisite as well as the film series.
Kinda contradicts all the scope of historical evidence we have. Of course, there is artistic license like Dumas made a fascinating story of the Three Musketeers, but I'd like Ms Gregory to not claim historical accuracy or "discovery". I don't think she is a very good writer, either. I've read excerpts from her book and it is very shabby indeed.
There is evidence Henry VII and Elizabeth really did love each other, he was known to never even take a mistress, which was very strange for a king at that time. Elizabeth of York played no part in politics either, she was a political pawn and did as she was told. Henry VII mourned for her until his death. And why one earth would she love a man who killed her two brothers? I enjoyed a couple of her books but they crap she comes up with...
Richard III killed the princes from the tower tho
@@user-uv9zr8qs2c It works out then that Margaret Beaufort killed the princes. If Richard had killed them the incestuous plot wouldn’t have made sense. 😳🙄
But Gregory's love of Richard III is quite real.
Her books are historical fiction. The history is true, but she just made up a few things. Straight facts would be boring. She had a put her own twist on things. I Love all her books in the Cousins War series and I'm sad that there is only one left
Faith Johnston She didn't just make up things, she flat-out lied. Richard III never would have married EOY, he flat-out denied the rumors and had been planning matches for both him and EOY to Portugal probably in February given how fast ships were sent out after Anne Neville's death.
She completely ignores this, and she somehow thinks that Richard, who spoke out strongly against adultery and moral misconducted would have openly cheated on his dying wife with EOY.
She also completely ignores all evidence that Henry VII was a good faithful and loving husband to EOY, and that she in turn held just as much affection for him. She lies, plain and simple.
The funny thing is that the history is so amazing you don't need to make up stuff like she did. The only thing she did was re wrote history to suit her own story. I believe that Elizabeth and Henry marriage was a loving one and the proof of that lies in the fact that a Henry never took a mistress. A first at the time. I hate what this author did to that marriage.
cherrytraveller Well said :)
Yes but just because they are not in love at first it doesn't mean they can't fall madly in love eventually..it IS an arranged marriage
Id be totally cool with her novels if she didn’t actively and voluntarily sell them as the truth, using words such as ‘evidence’ when there is nothing.
@Liz Evans
But Gregory's love of Richard III is quite real.
- lol, the best comment on Ph.G. so far.
philippa gregory you are the best author who writes on these topics and currently im watching white princess the new tv show based on your book!
The tudors are Plantagenets too ... two branches of the same tree
I read a few of Gregory's books and found the dialogue utterly ridiculous. The women sounded like bimbo's from Desperate Housewives, full of trivial gossip. The worst was Cromwell's dialogue, which made his sound like a blabbermouth, when in fact he was very discreet and and kept his cards close to his chest. In her book Gregory made him out to be very indiscreet indeed about the kings business. I couldn't finish the books to the end they were so stupid.
AnneBoleyn. Cromwell? Wrong book...
I'm her fan of her books. Love it so much! Pls write more. Thanks^^
Can you tell who she supported at Bosworth?
read all her books...very well done
she is one of my many royal ancestors , proved it on my heritage
Best use of "crack!ship" I've come across in some time. Bravo.
Gregory takes alot of history and makes it completely fiction. Her biased twoard hating the Tudors is so evident, I couldn't finish the series. I can't tell if she is anti protestant or just hated the Tudor reign that much, almost all of her books are past the point of fiction.
You literally took the words out of my mouth on every single point, even up to the point of not being able to finish the books, this woman lies plane and simple she makes stuff up disregards proven history anything just to make the Tudors look bad and what she's done to Margaret Beaufort is disgustingly offensive and people defend her by saying "it's historical fiction" but she goes out of her way to trick readers and viewers and deliberately trys to portray herself as a historian which is entirely inaccurate, the woman is a fine storyteller and writer she just needs to stick to fiction and stop trying to sell her books as "the truth from the perspective of women" it's vulgar in it's arrogance and she seems to be prostituting the feminist movement by using it to sell her books she's just a bit grotty tbh
according to historians, Elizabeth was not very fond of the Tudors. you have to remember that this was a girl who was raised as a York Princess so the Tudors were automatically seen as her enemies. not to mention she was there when her father who to go to battles time and time again against the Tudors so its expected that she was not fond of the idea of marrying a Tudor. however, she accepted it nevertheless because there was no other choice left. her brothers were dead, and Richard was insane
Just read Three sisters, Three Queens. I haven't read The White Princess but does it explain any further in the novel the magical gifts Elizabeth inherited from her grandmothers family? In three sisters, Three Queens the main heroine is Margret Tudor the eldest daughter of Elizabeth of York and Henry the 7th. I was wondering why Phillipa didn't give Margret the sight and the magical abilities that ran in her mothers family. Perhaps she being a Tudor cancelled out those power? Does the White princess talk about the passing on of the gifts from generation to generation? If not what are people's thoughts? Was disappointed that she didn't get her mothers powers
I havent read the book but I wonder that too. I read the white princess and the white queen and most of lady rivers and I have to say while Jaquetta and Elizabeth Woodville seem to have strong powers, Elizabeth York seems to have 'dulled' scenes, yes she can hear the river singing when someone of her house dies but that seems to be the best of it for her. So maybe the secret is not just being the eldest daughter but being taught these traits and handed down by the mother. We see in the White Queen that Elizabeth Woodvilles mother encourages and teaches her daughter all the skills. But while Elizabeth shows her daughter some of these things she doesn't really have the time or the patience to foster her daughters abilities. By the time we come to the White Princess we find Elizabeth York some what resistant to engage in magic and she never talks about it with anyone apart from her own mother and sisters and even then she often tries to make her sisters not mention it. So Elizabeth York never would have even mentioned it to Margaret for fear she would go to her father or worse that she would be suspected of witchcraft. I would love to ask Phillipa Gregory all of this to get her answer
I just love Philippa Gregory! I can't wait to read this, I would love to see it on screen aswell, the white queen was very well done, exellent story teller!!! and the Doc, the real white queen and her rivals was amazing I love to see the stories of these women told , very well done ! :)
PG obviously loathes Henry. There's no way sweet and gentle EoY could have stood the verbal abuse he dished out without committing suicide...
I'm sad that they didn't bring back the actor who played Queen Elizabeth from the White Queen and placed this other not so very attractive one in her place as in the show Queen Elizabeth was breathtakingly beautiful, so why not keep her? Also missing is the actor that played King Henry's Mother, she played it so well! The one that now plays her is strange looking. I still like the show but miss the two actor's that would have made it fantastic...
People move on to other projects. I think the only one who reprised her role was the really outstanding actress who played Duchess Cecily of York. She was great. I loved her costumes -- the other costumes in both series sucked.
I thought both actresses who played HVII's mom played the role strangely. But that's how they wanted it played. Margaret killed Jasper for goodness sake! I did love it when Henry practically choked her to death! Henry in the show treats Elizabeth so much better than in the book. He was a lot cuter than the Henry in the White Queen. That guy was homely.
Sorry ,Richard III. had every intention in taking Elizabeth as his queen. that is why, he sent her away I believe that she may well have been pregnant, and the child killed when he lost Bosworth.
He wanted to marry Joanna of Portugal after his wife's death. Not Elizabeth of York!
How do you know he wanted to marry EOY? Because Phillippa Gregory says so? Where did you hear Elizabeth was pregnant and lost the child after Bosworth? Even PG didn't come up with that one! I'd be interested to know.
Wendy Hull I disagree with the 'irrefutable assertion' that Richard was in negotiations to marry Joanna of Portugal maybe he used as scape card from the rumors unleashed about his niece which is well known were so strong that he had to publicly deny them in front twelve doctors of divinity in the parlamient but If we use the logic we have to consider a fact that Joanna was much advanced in age and had never given birth to children, Richard would certainly never agree to marry even for political advantages to a women that could not bear children in a delicate time for his reign where he desperately needed an heir, he would probably went for a young and fertile woman. It was very true for the aristocracy especially those individuals who relied upon they needed to have a male heir and a spare. Richard lost his wife due to probably from tuberculosis or some unknown sickness not to mention the lost of his son, his heir who was reported by several written accounts as being sickly or weak. . So NO, Richard would never marrying Joanna that doesn't mean that the speculated relationship with Elizabeth was true either.
@@lisabaez5260 Joanna was the same age as Richard lll and known for being a virgin so she at least was pure. She was actually recently in a convent (?)when she received 2-3 other offers of marriage. She accepted Richard's...There is a rumour that Joanna had a dream that she would not marry him though. After Richard 3rd's death, she never married and died at the age of 38.
Loved it!
Today I finnished the book, and at final Elizabeth says that Henry wa always guilty of usurpe the throne from Richard. Philippa Gregory was very partial for York house. Edward IV was a usurper too and a killer as well.
Soooo disappointed that they aren't using any of the original actors/actresses from the cast of the first season but one, from what I can find (the actress that played Dowager Queen Cecily).....what a huge let-down :(
Please note that Elizabeth was the NEICE of Richard III
by blood or marriage? Just curious.
@@KindCountsDeb3773 By blood.
@@zoeeliason7435 oooops. thanks.
@@KindCountsDeb3773 :D
I have not heard that from any historians, even Starkey who has such a low opinion of Margaret Beaufort and Henry VII. Dorset was in France, Richard III executed Richard Grey and Anthony Woodville, the rest ran to France too.
I think that Gregory does these people a great disservice. And I'm a fan of other HF writers. But her insistence that her stories are fact drives me nuts. If she would just come out and say "Yeah, that was my personal opinion/bias" I would read her stuff again.
Liz Stark. When she sends her harebrained theories, she says "other historians agree.". She just doesn't say who, of course!
It's never stopped them before.
If Elisabeth were in love with her horrible uncle who took the throne by claiming her a bastard and killing her brothers, it means she was a pure evil like her son Henry VIII.
there will be no season 2?
I disagree with the 'irrefutable assertion' that Richard was in negotiations to marry Joanna of Portugal maybe he used as scape card from the rumors unleashed about his niece which is well known were so strong that he had to publicly deny them in front twelve doctors of divinity in the parlamient but If we use the logic we have to consider a fact that Joanna was much advanced in age and had never given birth to children, Richard would certainly never agree to marry even for political advantages to a women that could not bear children even more in the delicate time for his reign where he desperately needed an heir, he would probably went for a young and fertile woman. It was very true for the aristocracy especially those individuals who relied upon they needed to have a male heir and a spare. Richard lost his wife due to probably from tuberculosis or some unknown sickness not to mention the lost of his son, his heir who was reported by several written accounts as being sickly or weak. . So NO, Richard would never marrying Joanna that doesn't mean that the speculated relationship with Elizabeth of York was true either.
Yep and Henry VII wasn't in his 30's he was 28 years old, Richard was 32, It is funny how some Ricardians think was Elizabeth who was in love with her uncle or had some kind of crush lol but get angry at the fact of thinking that could be at the other way around, considering that elizabeth was young and described like very beautiful and who also came from females descend with a reputation for being very fertile. Richard supposed bird johanna of Portugal was 46 years old, she was quite advanced in age by the time they were suited and it was not certain that she could bear an heir, so the statement that he wanted to marry johanna is quite caustic knowing how important were for kings have an heir especially for Richard who had lost his, knowing the environment in his kingdom due to the wars for successions.
What rubbish, this woman calls herself a historian? Ha! First off, Henry was not in his 30s when he took the throne by conquest, he was in his late 20s, younger than Richard III.. Second, how would the saintly Richard have married a niece he has had declared a bastard? If he legitimized her, he would be setting up Elizabeth of York as the rightful heir to the crown. Which she was after Richard destroyed her brothers. As for the supposed letter, it was a fragment that does not exist, supposedly witnessed by a 17th century Richard fanboy antiquarian named Buck. Finally, Ricardians love to use Margaret Beaufort as an all around punching bag when in fact she was a strong intelligent woman who survived the lot of them. She adored her extended family of half brothers and sisters. She was especially fond of Cecily of York, Elizabeth's younger sister. In fact Cecily eloped with a man considered unsuitable but Margaret intervened and smoothed things over for the couple. How evil of her. sarc. I could go on but why bother.
3minutesingle Plus if Richard had cancelled the Titulus Regius in order to marry EoY, it would be a strong indicator that he knew the princes were dead. If he had lived and had insisted on marrying her I wonder what he would have done?
Richard wasn’t even going to marry Elizabeth. He was going to marry a Portuguese princess, which would’ve been a much more prestigious match.
season 2 please
Not really. Yes, they would be on her side as they are her mother's family, but she would have not be close enough to be considered a Rivers.
Which of course begs a bigger question, as Elizabeth's uncles and her half-brother were on the side of Henry Tudor (earlier on the side of Buckingham). Why does she insist on saying that they hate each other? Her family WANTED Richard off the throne and Henry on it, and I don't know of any source that says they were enemies.
There is a lot of illegitimacy in these royal families. 🤣🤣
Hmm just reading these comments, the white queen and princes may be as far off from the actual thing as show reign was. So in fact there may not of even of been a older daughter lizzie and Henry may not of even been able to have a claims to the thrown. The acting is great but the historical stuff may be very off.
My god, the muzak - please get the lord high executioner!
This video keeps loading why does youtube think it is wrong to breathe
Wondering if a Elizabeth even married a Edward way back then.
Historical Fiction
But...Princess Elizabeth is also a River
And King Richard is on the opposing side of the Rivers...
I watched TWQ, TWP, and currently TSP. Although they are interesting series, i knew thay they are very loose from the historical fact. Idk why PG liked Richard III/Yorks and loathe Tudors so much. If she claimed to be historian or her books based on the historical account, she cannot be that bias.
I read this book and all I was thinking was poor Anne Neville. I didn’t like Elizabeth at all.
Will this be the sequel to the Tudor/White Queen? and when will it start???????????????
We don't know yet but it will be an eight episode mini series.
Can't wait, Thx!!!
You welcome :)
+Wendy Hull As a Neville and a Stanley I know that Richard needed to keep the throne a York throne it had been hard won. Elizabeth would have secured his right as she did Henry. I do have a Hons Degree from Leicester University. I also talk to Historical Societies on the Wars of the Roses Thank you for getting back to me these things need to be discussed, because so many of the primary sources on Richard were destroyed. Marilyn nee Stanley.
Aside from Uncle Richard marrying Niece Elizabeth -- yuck -- I know, creepier things happened, I think he would have been better served by marrying a French or Spanish or Portuguese princess to cement relations, especially for a new king. I wonder if he could have forced himself to marry Elizabeth, considering how much he truly hated all the Woodvilles. He seemed to be more interested in killing as many of them off as he could!
awfull book. Henry and Elizabeth loved each and the Elizabeth/Richard story is just rumors! FOR GOD'S SAKE this woman is not a historian! it's pure fiction. Is she aware that there was a double betrothal planned by Richard with Portugal for Elizabeth (and the pince Manuel) and for Richard with another princess. GOD! I am so mad at her and the fact that so many people wathc/read TWQ thinking this is historical accurate annoyed me so much
Why do all the women have two or three rings at different positions
I don't' buy it with Richard III, you can't be in love with your Uncle that's gross. I think he would have more likely secured a marriage with a foreign Princess after his wife died to secure his throne.
You’re a very entertaining writer, but perpetuating the myths of the princes and supposed near incest is just plain ghoulish and nasty.
All of the supposed proofs didn’t appear until well after Richard was dead.
She is obviously a Yorkist 500 years too late.
The Dame Barbara Cartland of historic novels.
Pure chicklit trash fiction.