Hunting, is when the wheel carriers are trying to find the center of the track. Wooden coasters tend to "hunt" more. Hunting also causes loss of momentum. When i made working models, i had aluminum frames (for weight) aluminum frames (wheel carrier) i used a fanged road wheel + up stops. inset screws w/ hex Allen fasteners. piece of rubber to keep axle from "walking" out. external washers to fasten + keep carriers "toed" properly. Up stops canted 15%. I made tubular tracked coasters. Preston spray silicon for lube of track, wheel, hitches, chain.
Your videos are really great. Even though I'm from Germany, I can understand almost everything because of your good explanations. What I would also like to see is a video about the wheel carrier itself and the spring loaded wheels (What are they there for? How to see them? Which manufacturers use it? Advantages and disadvantages?). Unfortunately I can't find much about it on the internet. I would be happy to see a video like this. Keep it up and greetings from Germany. :)
I had a guest lose their weave on Manta, and it flat spotted several upstops and took out a couple of sensors. Took me awhile to dig all of it out and replace the wheels.😂 Oh, i sent you a fun email. I think you will like the pic!
I think your channel is awesome! I totally dig having a professional ride machanic who is just removed enough from the active industry where you can be honest. Thank you Ryan for your content!
Is that a part of why RMCs tend to be a bit smoother? Because they're steel coasters with urethane wheels, but with box rails so there's a larger (potential) contact patch between each wheel and the rails.
They are subject to the same issues. They also blow through wheels fast because of their aggressive nature. I think it’s the quick replacement why they are always smooth.
This was very insightful, Ryan. Thank you! When you first brought up flat spots, I though, "How?!" I knew about flat spots in motorsports because you are locking the wheel via braking, and overcome friction. However, most coasters don't have wheel brakes (At least from my limited knowledge), normally a fin, friction against a chassis element, or EM. I never considered the stopped time of sitting in station or in the shed! This channel is awesome!
B&M's typically feature roller assemblies on the chassis which actually support the train's weight when on the storage track....it's yet another ingenious design feature that sets their products above the competition.
@@ScjheinenSince other manufacturers seem to have picked it up after such a long time, I wonder if B&M held a patent on that design aspect and the patent is now expired. Otherwise i would have expected this great idea to spread more quickly.
@@Colaholiker I actually think that they saw the idea a long time ago but couldn't do it with the generation of trains they where selling. I believe Mack picked it up in 2009 with the introduction of their mega-coaster line (starting with Blue Fire).
@@ScjheinenIt may have taken some time to implement, but at the same time, B&M had been around with that design for more than 15 years at that point. But I guess we will never find out for sure 😅
Hi Ryan. Thank you for an awesome channel. Apologies if this has already been covered, but have you thought about doing a video covering all the reasons why a coaster becomes rough (wood and steel) or why a coaster is rough in the first place? I know you’ve talked about wheels. There’s also the subject of mitigating roughness and its effects. Many manufacturers have tinkered with restraints for example, to make roughness more tolerable. I think you’ve talked about Vekoma being able to smooth out older steel track. That’s fascinating. Keep up the good work. Love the merch!
A good demonstration of what you mentioned at 17:30 is furius baco at PortAventura. If you look at newer ride footage (I'm guessing it has got worse with time as the old ones don't seem to have this) and look at the final turn before the brake run, you can really see the zero car shaking like this.
Very informative. I have often wondered what caused B&Ms to rattle. I suspected it had to do with the wheels since they will rattle sometimes and another trip, they would not be.
"Here's a wheel... it's round. A flat spot makes it not round. Okay, nailed it...moving on" 😂😂😂 Fantastic video man! Makes me wonder what some of these mechanics aren't doing with some of these rides. The camber makes total sense as well as the wheel bogies needing to be straight. Those nylons sound like a pain in the d!ck to maintain!
Haha yea they are awesome unroll they are not. Then the short way is to replace them but everyone says “we can fix it” then it’s an uphill battle from there.
I remember back when Predator at Darien Lake used those PTC Trailored trains those things shuffled you all throughout the course along with the jack hammering, that was horrible, they did replace them with articulate trains from the Voyage at Holiday World which did improve the ride a little bit. The Titan Track is really helping the ride though and is supposed to be completely Titan Tracked in a few years.
I hated Mondays and Tuesdays on our Vekoma Junior Coaster, grease and wheel lube day... they used dielectric grease, word is thats what the Vekoma rep recommended back in the late 90s.
The main reason I've never cared for Nighthawk (Flying Dutchman) at Carowinds is because of the wheel vibrations to your head when you are on your back. It is not as bad in the flying position because your head tilts forward off the seat and chassis.
The damage that’s done is minimal compared to the time to Jack up 18-22 carriers a night. So there’s no benifits from it. Most maintenance areas the rain does not sit on its wheels so the problem is more aimed at old rides with no work area. I’d be afraid the blocks would be left in place and the train dispatched. Depending on the size of the block, that could do some damage.
What a great and informative video! I think we can say that maintenance is everything and parks with a good engineering team coupled to a company prepared to invest will keep their rides better for longer
And maintenance is the first think most parks deny when it comes to holding a ride down for service or making repairs that can fix long term issues. Maintenance is looked upon as a necessary evil. They just take up time and money. I know everyone on this channel will disagree but it seems to be the norm in parks.
i had no idea about the nylon wheels. i thought it was all polyurethane on steel coasters and mainly steel wheels on wooden coasters (i know there are a few exceptions for this though) but it makes total sense
@@ryantheridemechanic is that why everyone says six flags over georgia’s batman clone runs faster then any other batman clone or do you think that is a different reason
@@VECTOR_Coasters well it could be all speed wheels. Light grease and little grease and lots of track lube. Then mix it with hot fry air and it should be a rocket fully loaded.
What about sprung vs unsprung wheel carriers? Quite a few models from Gerstlauer, including the eurofighters, use unsprung wheel carriers and have a reputation for roughness. Is this the main cause of gerstlauer's roughness problem? Or is it at least as much due to wider tolerances in the track shaping process?
If your referring to guide wheels these typically don’t smooth the running. Spring tension is only to keep the wheels against the track when shifting side to side.
Some of those B&M coaster roar while intamin wheels are quiet..For example rougaru at CP man that thing roars like there is no tomorrow,next to it is intamins Mille Force which is quiet..
Think about the different track designs. B&M have that big resonance cavity - I mean the box spine, while Intamin didn't have a spine in their track design back than at all (and even now just uses small tubular spines). Look at Millie's track - it's a lattice structure of rather small diameter tubing. That's what makes the difference in sound.
TMNT Shellraiser is one of the WORST jackhammering steel coasters I've ever ridden. I wonder if it's because of the wheels or something else? I went on this a few weeks ago toward the end of my 2 week coaster vacation. Granted this is a Gerstlauer coaster. I could only last one ride. It was painful and gave me a giant headache. Such a shame because it's an AWESOME layout.
Thank you so much for your informative and interesting videos! You explain these concepts so well. Do you get asked about zero-cars very often? For example, I think I understand their function, but I don’t always understand why some manufacturers use them on some of their models, like B&M hyper coasters, but then on their dives, floor-less, and inverts, the first car functions as a zero car (except for Alpengeist?). Then, for example, Intamin usually uses a zero-car, but premier rides almost never does-I find this especially interesting because I feel like that axles on the first car must take a beating, bblike on their LIM rides. This is all just speculation, but something I’m very curious about!
I understand them as well. Never thought much about them though. Not sure why some opt to build it into the coach and some opt for a wishbone on the front or back. Maybe it’s less stress on the frame. Never thought about it.
Thank you! Rule of thumb I don’t say the park or the company o worked for as most people get the wrong idea and thing that I’m representing that park and company. And I’m not. So if you just watch the video and listen you can easily figure out the park I worked for. I just don’t want to put that out front. Same thing when I talk about a specific problem with a ride. I’ll use the trade name or and example and leave the manufacture out of it. I don’t like a lot of channels that seem to breed hate toward parks an manufactured. I have too much respect for this industry to go out and talk bad about places although sometimes I come close.
@@ryantheridemechanic just what needed to be done in terms of maintenance and what inspections and testing is involved with this sort of thing , I work with PLC'S all the time but in water production and I'm looking at getting into the theme park industry and I'm curious
Was the entire track redone? Hmm not sure there. If the design has a small laminate stack then that would do it. We had sections of track at a time that were done. They felt smooth compared to the rest but they were still bumpy. Could also be poor stack compression during the assembly. Lots of factors to consider.
Interesting. Ive often wondered why some B&M coasters are so loud and others barely make a sound. I figured it was sound dampening in the track itself but different wheel materials would also make sense. Maybe a combination of both?
Yes. It is a combo. You can run all urethan with gravel in the track and it won’t be as loud as same thing with no gravel in the track. Nylons and no gravel is the loudest possible.
I worked a Schwarzkopf coaster with two trim brakes and when the ride was e-stopped, the trims would move to their fully open position (no trimming at all). How is that accomplished if power has been cut to the ride via an e-stop, since the other brakes will close in the same situation?
Trims are built normally open. Meaning that with no power or air pressure they open. Safety brakes are built so no power or air pressure they close. It’s achieved normally by placing the spring on the opposite side of the piston so the affect works backward.
its fine if you can't Answer this but out of curiosity with Kennywood being my home park I am very familiar with riding the Old classic Rides and I was curious with your experience of a ride mechanic what is the oldest ride you had to maintain and how much harder or easier is it to maintain?
Hard question. I worked a swarpskof (I misspelled the for sure) 5 looper tracking coaster with a curved drive tire lift. The lift was a pain but the rest of the ride was no more than any other coaster. I feel like until you play with B&Ms or prototypes they are almost all the same.
I wonder if aging wheels or toe issues on B & M Batman The Ride at Great America between Milwaukee and Chicago is causing it to vibrate more. In recent seasons they have not only removed the wheel covers which looks weird btw, but also it vibrates quite a bit now (could use a new paint job too lol. Also many ppl who have riden several Batmans always say this Batman is the roughest. What's your thoughts on that Ryan? Also side note: you would be proud. I was at that park yesterday (been watching your videos for weeks now) and a five year old was hanging on a lift gate, his parents wernt paying attention so I informed the kid for his safty don't hang on the lift gate. :) That one was for you man! Hehe
I know Kumba has bad wheel vibrations and has gotten a lot rougher over the years. Idk why they don’t re-do the tracks and make the coaster floorless. I think it would make Kumba a way more enjoyable experience. I do love Kumba! As this was the first coaster i ever rode as a teenager and it’s what got me into loving coasters!
Awesome. But typically if your replacing steel track that’s basically a new ride. Very rare they replace it. That’s why Alton towers kind of surprised me when they retracted theirs.
@@jackdavis007 I don’t see why you couldn’t. Need to replace the station area, station track, and controller. And install robotic flooring. But I know California great america made the standup into a floorless so 99% sure you can do it.
Hey Ryan, quick question. This might sound like a dumb one but when coasters are dispatched, say on a B&M floorless, do the buttons have to be held down until the train leaves the station completely/past a certain point, or do you just push the dispatch advance buttons once? Thanks.
Held down the entire time. Accidentally taking your and off during the dispatch could result in ride faults or possibly called train before the lift depending on the ride.
@@ryantheridemechanic There are of course some exceptions to the rule. Intamins are a momentary press, and older B&M Flyers only require the button to be held until the 4th carriage has left. At that 4-car mark, the next train will proceed in automatically.
Ryan, thanks for finally telling me what a wheel is. Wondering about this has given me sleepless nights for the last forty-some years. 😂 But what happened to your special effects team? Have they run out of paper so that you had to use some drawing made on a computer to show what toe angle is? I hope this crisis is resolved soon...
Haha! Thanks. Glad your sleeping better now! 😂 I feel most of the time I can explain what I’m talking about but I have some videos coming up where I will have to make something on paper or out of cardboard for sure.
Wouldn't wear and tear have an effect on the vibrations of the wheels? I noticed it a lot on Vekoma's that the wheels will sort of dry out on the surface and have little cracks all over them. Those are not enough to replace them on te spot but I always figured that was a reason for vibration. Second question, did you ever experience that the lube on a B&M left a thick blackend layer over the wheels that causes roughness?
The cracks in the urethane is just age. No vibrations from them. Yes the track lube can build up and stick on the wheels causing them to be rough. Problem is amplified if the line is mixed improperly
Hey Ryan Nemesis at Alton Towers just had a major retrack as im sure you're aware of. However it seams to have a rattle it never had before especially on the last stall turn before the brake run. Almost shakes the train there very noticable is there a specific reason for this on a retracked ride?
not really sure there but im thinking that more of a function of the train more than the track. First year of operation has lots of new things happening even for an old ride. just give it some time. im guessing the way you describe it, sounds like its in the guide assemblies. B&M does not give these as a normal adjustment to make so it could take lots of time.
Kind of, not as a full time position. They look for mechanics with machinist backgrounds. There is generally not enough machinist work to keep someone busy full time.
I am glad that he doesn't. The audio levels are very low on his videos to begin with, and adding music won't help there. This is pretty much the only channel I follow where my laptop speakers at max volume sometimes aren't enough and I have to rewind and listen again. If you want background music, just start the music you want to hear in a second browser tab. That gives you full control over it... 😉
I prefer not to as it makes it hard to hear for most people. I’ve been working on stabilizing and increasing my volume over the last several videos. Is the “wheel vibration” vide still too quiet? I though that one was ok.
@@marmaliser8159 years of music racing stock cars and amusement rides has left me with hearing damage so i put the audio mid of all my volumes. And I’ve had my fare share of microphone problems as well. Stupid adaptor only works one direction some times.
@@ryantheridemechanic As far as I can tell, it is getting better. But normally you could even go higher as long as you don't reach the point where it distorts. It is easier for the viewers just to turn the volume down a bit. Basically when you check your microphone levels, the "green" part of the scale 8i don't know what you use, but that's how they are often coded) should be pretty well used when you speak normally. With some sounds like p and t peaking into the yellow range is fine as well. Just avoid being in the red...
@@pizzafroth1521 basically. Gaps all over all of the wheels to rails. And I believe it would be better if the track gauge was wider. Or if the wheel carriers weee external to the track.
basically. Gaps all over all of the wheels to rails. And I believe it would be better if the track gauge was wider. Or if the wheel carriers weee external to the track.
@@ryantheridemechanicAnother problem, which is not just with SLCs but with any track design that is derived from the old Arrow track style is that all lateral forces can basically widen the track, and over time it will actually increase the track gauge by a tiny bit in areas with high lateral Gs. This is due to the quite long cross ties needed to connect the running rails to the spine, allowing for the train to be between the running rails. On more modern track designs, the cross ties are much simpler and of a stronger design, regardless of whether you look at B&M track, where cross ties look like they have just been cut out of a flat piece of steel or Schwarzkopf's last track design with the short and stubby "pyramids" between the spine and running rails. While the "Arrow derived" tracks basically flex the more or less C shaped cross ties, the other designs where the guide wheels are on the outside, the cross ties can actually transfer the compressive load from the inside of the curve straight into the spine. I would guess that Arrow started doing it on steel like it was done on wood for a long time, but there's a good reason why you hardly see anyone building track with guide wheels on the inside on steel coasters nowadays. RMC's I-Box and Topper Track may be the odd one out here, but their track, not being made from tubular steel and not having a spine, is a completely different animal anyway.
Do you have an explanation on wheels making high pitch noises, for example nitro & Montu both have a distinct noise leaving the station entering the lift hill.
I haven't been to either in ages, but are you sure the sound is coming from the wheels? Especially on B&Ms, the electric motors that run the booster wheels can have quite a high-pitched whine. I believe it is because they use variable frequency AC drives there that actually allow to adjust the speed (very important on the booster wheels into the lift, so you don't feel the train lock onto the chain), where other manufacturers just run the motors off line frequency and only switch them on or off. We may be talking about two totally different things though.
I agree with @colaholiker below. B&M wheels don’t have shrouds or caps to makes noises so if your hearing something in those areas it’s probably the VFD motors
@@ryantheridemechanic I know it's quite a ways away from you, but Europa Park's Silver Star is notorious for the motor whine when there is no train in the station and the booster wheels are running. (Or at least it was when I was a regular at the park, they may have changed things in the meantime) With no train being present at that time, that completely eliminates the chance of it being the train making the noise.🤣
So then its not impossible to fix yhe rattle on Diamondback, just that it would slow it down from 80 to what? 75? 70? Meh...... as long as you lean up in the valleys, the rattle isnt that bad😅. Also.... I dont see KI going against what B&M say to use either.
@@Spike-sk7ql big chins deviate the most. The internal engineering on larger chains will override manufactures recommendations. Most of the time it’s not a bad thing. It allows you to use different grease and small things like that.
@@ryantheridemechanic Sure, but not on things like "run 4 speed wheels, and the rest urethane" and the park being like, "ya know what, nah.... speed wheels for EVERYONE"😂 I would have thought grease would have been up to whatever the park wanted. Manufacturers are like that huh? Is it more than how "GM reccomends Mobil 1" (which is one of the worst synthetics btw)
@@Spike-sk7ql sure. I’ll give an example. For a B&M guide wheel they specify 7.5cc of TOPAZ NB52 per bearing. We had to have an professional engineer approve the change to a thinner Isoflex-5051 grease. Just grease but the OEM did not sanction the swap. So smaller parks are bound to that grease only. We were able to change and make it better. So it’s an easy example where the park went against what the OEM wanted.
Would the wheels slamming down onto the track after airtime risk creating flat spots as well, like with diamondback's first drop? (I assume that's what that sound is). th-cam.com/video/9W6hF4rleCE/w-d-xo.html
Hunting, is when the wheel carriers are trying to find the center of the track. Wooden coasters tend to "hunt" more. Hunting also causes loss of momentum. When i made working models, i had aluminum frames (for weight) aluminum frames (wheel carrier) i used a fanged road wheel + up stops. inset screws w/ hex Allen fasteners. piece of rubber to keep axle from "walking" out. external washers to fasten + keep carriers "toed" properly. Up stops canted 15%. I made tubular tracked coasters. Preston spray silicon for lube of track, wheel, hitches, chain.
This is an interesting video to revisit now...
I was thinking the same thing. After my ride experience on TT2, I can attest to that vibration, especially in the last row.
Your videos are really great. Even though I'm from Germany, I can understand almost everything because of your good explanations. What I would also like to see is a video about the wheel carrier itself and the spring loaded wheels (What are they there for? How to see them? Which manufacturers use it? Advantages and disadvantages?). Unfortunately I can't find much about it on the internet. I would be happy to see a video like this. Keep it up and greetings from Germany. :)
Thanks for the comment I appreciate your input. This is a Good idea I will try and create a video for this topic.
I had a guest lose their weave on Manta, and it flat spotted several upstops and took out a couple of sensors. Took me awhile to dig all of it out and replace the wheels.😂
Oh, i sent you a fun email. I think you will like the pic!
I think your channel is awesome! I totally dig having a professional ride machanic who is just removed enough from the active industry where you can be honest. Thank you Ryan for your content!
I appreciate ex-operator videos also, but the mechanics get down to raw grease and bolts of it all! I dig that!
Thank you. Yea you have to be out of the game to do this type of stuff.
Is that a part of why RMCs tend to be a bit smoother? Because they're steel coasters with urethane wheels, but with box rails so there's a larger (potential) contact patch between each wheel and the rails.
They are subject to the same issues. They also blow through wheels fast because of their aggressive nature. I think it’s the quick replacement why they are always smooth.
Hopefully this is less of an issue now that they've changed their train design to double up the wheels on each bogie.
@@SkeledroMan I’m sure that will help
This was very insightful, Ryan. Thank you! When you first brought up flat spots, I though, "How?!" I knew about flat spots in motorsports because you are locking the wheel via braking, and overcome friction. However, most coasters don't have wheel brakes (At least from my limited knowledge), normally a fin, friction against a chassis element, or EM. I never considered the stopped time of sitting in station or in the shed! This channel is awesome!
Thank you
B&M's typically feature roller assemblies on the chassis which actually support the train's weight when on the storage track....it's yet another ingenious design feature that sets their products above the competition.
Newer Macks and GCI's do this as well. I even saw an RMC that had it. Good thing manufactures are implementing these kind of tools.
@@ScjheinenSince other manufacturers seem to have picked it up after such a long time, I wonder if B&M held a patent on that design aspect and the patent is now expired. Otherwise i would have expected this great idea to spread more quickly.
@@Colaholiker I actually think that they saw the idea a long time ago but couldn't do it with the generation of trains they where selling. I believe Mack picked it up in 2009 with the introduction of their mega-coaster line (starting with Blue Fire).
@@ScjheinenIt may have taken some time to implement, but at the same time, B&M had been around with that design for more than 15 years at that point. But I guess we will never find out for sure 😅
love you channel im trying to be a rollercoaster engineer when im older
Learn love math. It rules the engineering worlds!
When you succeed, please design the tallest fastest longest coaster ever!
Hi Ryan. Thank you for an awesome channel. Apologies if this has already been covered, but have you thought about doing a video covering all the reasons why a coaster becomes rough (wood and steel) or why a coaster is rough in the first place? I know you’ve talked about wheels.
There’s also the subject of mitigating roughness and its effects. Many manufacturers have tinkered with restraints for example, to make roughness more tolerable.
I think you’ve talked about Vekoma being able to smooth out older steel track. That’s fascinating.
Keep up the good work. Love the merch!
@@woofbarked yea I could work on that.
The B&Ms I use to work on, we used a track lube that smelt like muscle rub (Deep Heat).
A good demonstration of what you mentioned at 17:30 is furius baco at PortAventura. If you look at newer ride footage (I'm guessing it has got worse with time as the old ones don't seem to have this) and look at the final turn before the brake run, you can really see the zero car shaking like this.
Cool, I never thought about using Dielectric grease as a lube for that reason, but it makes sense
Very informative. I have often wondered what caused B&Ms to rattle. I suspected it had to do with the wheels since they will rattle sometimes and another trip, they would not be.
B&M Rattle explained. And not for what most people may think
"Here's a wheel... it's round. A flat spot makes it not round. Okay, nailed it...moving on" 😂😂😂
Fantastic video man! Makes me wonder what some of these mechanics aren't doing with some of these rides. The camber makes total sense as well as the wheel bogies needing to be straight. Those nylons sound like a pain in the d!ck to maintain!
Haha yea they are awesome unroll they are not. Then the short way is to replace them but everyone says “we can fix it” then it’s an uphill battle from there.
Ryan thanks for making these videos and giving us some of your knowledge.
Your welcome!
I remember back when Predator at Darien Lake used those PTC Trailored trains those things shuffled you all throughout the course along with the jack hammering, that was horrible, they did replace them with articulate trains from the Voyage at Holiday World which did improve the ride a little bit. The Titan Track is really helping the ride though and is supposed to be completely Titan Tracked in a few years.
Loved the show-and-tell with this video :) Thanks again!
Welcome!
I hated Mondays and Tuesdays on our Vekoma Junior Coaster, grease and wheel lube day... they used dielectric grease, word is thats what the Vekoma rep recommended back in the late 90s.
We used the same. Applied by hand. Kind of messy.
Wow thanks for all your info. Now I know why Fury 325 has that rattle.
Your videos are awesome! So interesting! Thank you for sharing all this info with us 🤩
Your welcome! Glad your enjoying them.
I already know this lrod video is about to be spicy
Another very interesting video, well done Sir!
Thank you very much.
This is hands down my new favorite channel! So insightful!!
Thank you!
Comment for the algo. Thanks for the video.
The main reason I've never cared for Nighthawk (Flying Dutchman) at Carowinds is because of the wheel vibrations to your head when you are on your back. It is not as bad in the flying position because your head tilts forward off the seat and chassis.
I wonder why we haven't heard of support jacks in the station and holding brake to remove the weight for the wheels while parked overnight.
The damage that’s done is minimal compared to the time to Jack up 18-22 carriers a night. So there’s no benifits from it. Most maintenance areas the rain does not sit on its wheels so the problem is more aimed at old rides with no work area. I’d be afraid the blocks would be left in place and the train dispatched. Depending on the size of the block, that could do some damage.
Great video! I know so much more about coaster wheels now, haha (alignment, material types, properties of each type, etc).
What a great and informative video! I think we can say that maintenance is everything and parks with a good engineering team coupled to a company prepared to invest will keep their rides better for longer
And maintenance is the first think most parks deny when it comes to holding a ride down for service or making repairs that can fix long term issues. Maintenance is looked upon as a necessary evil. They just take up time and money. I know everyone on this channel will disagree but it seems to be the norm in parks.
i had no idea about the nylon wheels. i thought it was all polyurethane on steel coasters and mainly steel wheels on wooden coasters (i know there are a few exceptions for this though) but it makes total sense
A lot of parks run nylons all over the train.
@@ryantheridemechanic is that why everyone says six flags over georgia’s batman clone runs faster then any other batman clone or do you think that is a different reason
@@VECTOR_Coasters well it could be all speed wheels. Light grease and little grease and lots of track lube. Then mix it with hot fry air and it should be a rocket fully loaded.
What about sprung vs unsprung wheel carriers? Quite a few models from Gerstlauer, including the eurofighters, use unsprung wheel carriers and have a reputation for roughness. Is this the main cause of gerstlauer's roughness problem? Or is it at least as much due to wider tolerances in the track shaping process?
If your referring to guide wheels these typically don’t smooth the running. Spring tension is only to keep the wheels against the track when shifting side to side.
Some of those B&M coaster roar while intamin wheels are quiet..For example rougaru at CP man that thing roars like there is no tomorrow,next to it is intamins Mille Force which is quiet..
Think about the different track designs. B&M have that big resonance cavity - I mean the box spine, while Intamin didn't have a spine in their track design back than at all (and even now just uses small tubular spines). Look at Millie's track - it's a lattice structure of rather small diameter tubing. That's what makes the difference in sound.
TMNT Shellraiser is one of the WORST jackhammering steel coasters I've ever ridden. I wonder if it's because of the wheels or something else? I went on this a few weeks ago toward the end of my 2 week coaster vacation. Granted this is a Gerstlauer coaster. I could only last one ride. It was painful and gave me a giant headache. Such a shame because it's an AWESOME layout.
That sounds like a wheel issue.
Thanks Ryan ….. another really interesting video 👍👍
Your welcome.
Thank you so much for your informative and interesting videos! You explain these concepts so well.
Do you get asked about zero-cars very often? For example, I think I understand their function, but I don’t always understand why some manufacturers use them on some of their models, like B&M hyper coasters, but then on their dives, floor-less, and inverts, the first car functions as a zero car (except for Alpengeist?). Then, for example, Intamin usually uses a zero-car, but premier rides almost never does-I find this especially interesting because I feel like that axles on the first car must take a beating, bblike on their LIM rides. This is all just speculation, but something I’m very curious about!
I understand them as well. Never thought much about them though. Not sure why some opt to build it into the coach and some opt for a wishbone on the front or back. Maybe it’s less stress on the frame. Never thought about it.
@@ryantheridemechanic thank you!
Your my new favorite!
So cool to learn about the details!🤓🙏
Can you tell us what park you worked at?
🤘
Thank you! Rule of thumb I don’t say the park or the company o worked for as most people get the wrong idea and thing that I’m representing that park and company. And I’m not. So if you just watch the video and listen you can easily figure out the park I worked for. I just don’t want to put that out front. Same thing when I talk about a specific problem with a ride. I’ll use the trade name or and example and leave the manufacture out of it. I don’t like a lot of channels that seem to breed hate toward parks an manufactured. I have too much respect for this industry to go out and talk bad about places although sometimes I come close.
@@ryantheridemechanic I totally understand. Thanks for the response and for all your efforts! 🙏
@@Novakiller no problem I love talking rides!
I've seen some proper damage due to vibrations, especially with a specific resonance is dangerous.
Can get bad
I know in NASCAR they talk about toe a lot. never knew it worked on rollercoasters
And Funny, you can’t have toe on a coaster that goes forward and backwards.
Can you do a video talking about the ride control systems in more detail going over PLC's and sensors etc in detail thanks
Why kind of detail? Your and my detail are probably two different things.
@@ryantheridemechanic just what needed to be done in terms of maintenance and what inspections and testing is involved with this sort of thing , I work with PLC'S all the time but in water production and I'm looking at getting into the theme park industry and I'm curious
@@ryantheridemechanic Just saw this, and I’d say go into as much detail as you know. I love the technical side of rides, especially sensors and such.
RYan,
Why would a freshly retracked wooden coaster Jackhammer throughout the ride
Was the entire track redone? Hmm not sure there. If the design has a small laminate stack then that would do it. We had sections of track at a time that were done. They felt smooth compared to the rest but they were still bumpy. Could also be poor stack compression during the assembly. Lots of factors to consider.
Interesting. Ive often wondered why some B&M coasters are so loud and others barely make a sound. I figured it was sound dampening in the track itself but different wheel materials would also make sense. Maybe a combination of both?
Yes. It is a combo. You can run all urethan with gravel in the track and it won’t be as loud as same thing with no gravel in the track. Nylons and no gravel is the loudest possible.
I worked a Schwarzkopf coaster with two trim brakes and when the ride was e-stopped, the trims would move to their fully open position (no trimming at all). How is that accomplished if power has been cut to the ride via an e-stop, since the other brakes will close in the same situation?
Trims are built normally open. Meaning that with no power or air pressure they open. Safety brakes are built so no power or air pressure they close.
It’s achieved normally by placing the spring on the opposite side of the piston so the affect works backward.
its fine if you can't Answer this but out of curiosity with Kennywood being my home park I am very familiar with riding the Old classic Rides and I was curious with your experience of a ride mechanic what is the oldest ride you had to maintain and how much harder or easier is it to maintain?
Hard question. I worked a swarpskof (I misspelled the for sure) 5 looper tracking coaster with a curved drive tire lift. The lift was a pain but the rest of the ride was no more than any other coaster. I feel like until you play with B&Ms or prototypes they are almost all the same.
I wonder if aging wheels or toe issues on B & M Batman The Ride at Great America between Milwaukee and Chicago is causing it to vibrate more. In recent seasons they have not only removed the wheel covers which looks weird btw, but also it vibrates quite a bit now (could use a new paint job too lol. Also many ppl who have riden several Batmans always say this Batman is the roughest. What's your thoughts on that Ryan? Also side note: you would be proud. I was at that park yesterday (been watching your videos for weeks now) and a five year old was hanging on a lift gate, his parents wernt paying attention so I informed the kid for his safty don't hang on the lift gate. :) That one was for you man! Hehe
I should point out this Batman was the first so it's the oldest Batman suspended ride out there.
I know Kumba has bad wheel vibrations and has gotten a lot rougher over the years. Idk why they don’t re-do the tracks and make the coaster floorless. I think it would make Kumba a way more enjoyable experience. I do love Kumba! As this was the first coaster i ever rode as a teenager and it’s what got me into loving coasters!
Awesome. But typically if your replacing steel track that’s basically a new ride. Very rare they replace it. That’s why Alton towers kind of surprised me when they retracted theirs.
Is there a way they could make it floorless?
@@jackdavis007 I don’t see why you couldn’t. Need to replace the station area, station track, and controller. And install robotic flooring. But I know California great america made the standup into a floorless so 99% sure you can do it.
And they did it for Sheikra at Busch Gardens it used to have floors on it
@@jackdavis007no reason to make it a floorless the track itself is already pretty old, new trains could do the trick.
It would be sick if KINGS ISLAND would watch this video and change the wheels on Banshee and D-back. Rattle is so bad its unenjoyable.
Interesting. Do you think the park upper management ever watch TH-cam? I honestly don’t think they do. But I could easily be wrong
Isn’t the track in the maintenance shed the same? Thus creating the same issue? Or are they suspended?
Suspended. They either have wheels holding up the center of the train or slide rails supporting the coach in the sides.
@@ryantheridemechanic That makes a lot of sense 😁
Hey Ryan, quick question. This might sound like a dumb one but when coasters are dispatched, say on a B&M floorless, do the buttons have to be held down until the train leaves the station completely/past a certain point, or do you just push the dispatch advance buttons once? Thanks.
Held down the entire time. Accidentally taking your and off during the dispatch could result in ride faults or possibly called train before the lift depending on the ride.
@@ryantheridemechanic There are of course some exceptions to the rule. Intamins are a momentary press, and older B&M Flyers only require the button to be held until the 4th carriage has left. At that 4-car mark, the next train will proceed in automatically.
Ryan, thanks for finally telling me what a wheel is. Wondering about this has given me sleepless nights for the last forty-some years. 😂
But what happened to your special effects team? Have they run out of paper so that you had to use some drawing made on a computer to show what toe angle is? I hope this crisis is resolved soon...
Haha! Thanks. Glad your sleeping better now! 😂 I feel most of the time I can explain what I’m talking about but I have some videos coming up where I will have to make something on paper or out of cardboard for sure.
Do steel wheels, like you see on most wooden coasters, often run with flatspots? Or is it very hard to flatspot them?
Very hard to flatspot a steel wheel but can be fixed. Typically it’s due to massive bearing failure.
I will watch the full video so we don’t have to go over anything again.
17:20 Same with railroad wheels, HUNTING.
Flat spots too, and a far more pervasive problem
Wouldn't wear and tear have an effect on the vibrations of the wheels? I noticed it a lot on Vekoma's that the wheels will sort of dry out on the surface and have little cracks all over them. Those are not enough to replace them on te spot but I always figured that was a reason for vibration. Second question, did you ever experience that the lube on a B&M left a thick blackend layer over the wheels that causes roughness?
The cracks in the urethane is just age. No vibrations from them. Yes the track lube can build up and stick on the wheels causing them to be rough. Problem is amplified if the line is mixed improperly
Hey Ryan
Nemesis at Alton Towers just had a major retrack as im sure you're aware of.
However it seams to have a rattle it never had before especially on the last stall turn before the brake run.
Almost shakes the train there very noticable is there a specific reason for this on a retracked ride?
not really sure there but im thinking that more of a function of the train more than the track. First year of operation has lots of new things happening even for an old ride. just give it some time. im guessing the way you describe it, sounds like its in the guide assemblies. B&M does not give these as a normal adjustment to make so it could take lots of time.
Fair enough that makes sense.
Hopefully it will disappear eventually then 😀
Do parks hire Machinist?
Kind of, not as a full time position. They look for mechanics with machinist backgrounds. There is generally not enough machinist work to keep someone busy full time.
Hi Ryan can you add background music to your new videos? It’s just kinda quiet.
I am glad that he doesn't. The audio levels are very low on his videos to begin with, and adding music won't help there. This is pretty much the only channel I follow where my laptop speakers at max volume sometimes aren't enough and I have to rewind and listen again. If you want background music, just start the music you want to hear in a second browser tab. That gives you full control over it... 😉
I prefer not to as it makes it hard to hear for most people. I’ve been working on stabilizing and increasing my volume over the last several videos. Is the “wheel vibration” vide still too quiet? I though that one was ok.
@@ryantheridemechanic nah the audio is perfect for me (although im a headphone user)
@@marmaliser8159 years of music racing stock cars and amusement rides has left me with hearing damage so i put the audio mid of all my volumes. And I’ve had my fare share of microphone problems as well. Stupid adaptor only works one direction some times.
@@ryantheridemechanic As far as I can tell, it is getting better. But normally you could even go higher as long as you don't reach the point where it distorts. It is easier for the viewers just to turn the volume down a bit.
Basically when you check your microphone levels, the "green" part of the scale 8i don't know what you use, but that's how they are often coded) should be pretty well used when you speak normally. With some sounds like p and t peaking into the yellow range is fine as well. Just avoid being in the red...
Can you speak on if this plays a role in Verona SLC’s being so rough? The trains feel like they are shaking around.
Nope! that’s an entirely different set of problems. Nothing to do with wheel vibrations.
Isnt it because the trains have a gap in between the wheels and the rail and they literally bounce around during the ride? Or am I wrong?
@@pizzafroth1521 basically. Gaps all over all of the wheels to rails. And I believe it would be better if the track gauge was wider. Or if the wheel carriers weee external to the track.
basically. Gaps all over all of the wheels to rails. And I believe it would be better if the track gauge was wider. Or if the wheel carriers weee external to the track.
@@ryantheridemechanicAnother problem, which is not just with SLCs but with any track design that is derived from the old Arrow track style is that all lateral forces can basically widen the track, and over time it will actually increase the track gauge by a tiny bit in areas with high lateral Gs. This is due to the quite long cross ties needed to connect the running rails to the spine, allowing for the train to be between the running rails. On more modern track designs, the cross ties are much simpler and of a stronger design, regardless of whether you look at B&M track, where cross ties look like they have just been cut out of a flat piece of steel or Schwarzkopf's last track design with the short and stubby "pyramids" between the spine and running rails. While the "Arrow derived" tracks basically flex the more or less C shaped cross ties, the other designs where the guide wheels are on the outside, the cross ties can actually transfer the compressive load from the inside of the curve straight into the spine.
I would guess that Arrow started doing it on steel like it was done on wood for a long time, but there's a good reason why you hardly see anyone building track with guide wheels on the inside on steel coasters nowadays. RMC's I-Box and Topper Track may be the odd one out here, but their track, not being made from tubular steel and not having a spine, is a completely different animal anyway.
Do you have an explanation on wheels making high pitch noises, for example nitro & Montu both have a distinct noise leaving the station entering the lift hill.
I haven't been to either in ages, but are you sure the sound is coming from the wheels? Especially on B&Ms, the electric motors that run the booster wheels can have quite a high-pitched whine. I believe it is because they use variable frequency AC drives there that actually allow to adjust the speed (very important on the booster wheels into the lift, so you don't feel the train lock onto the chain), where other manufacturers just run the motors off line frequency and only switch them on or off. We may be talking about two totally different things though.
@@Colaholiker agreed
I agree with @colaholiker below. B&M wheels don’t have shrouds or caps to makes noises so if your hearing something in those areas it’s probably the VFD motors
@@ryantheridemechanic I know it's quite a ways away from you, but Europa Park's Silver Star is notorious for the motor whine when there is no train in the station and the booster wheels are running. (Or at least it was when I was a regular at the park, they may have changed things in the meantime)
With no train being present at that time, that completely eliminates the chance of it being the train making the noise.🤣
@@Colaholiker was it coming from the audio speaker in the station area?
So then its not impossible to fix yhe rattle on Diamondback, just that it would slow it down from 80 to what? 75? 70? Meh...... as long as you lean up in the valleys, the rattle isnt that bad😅. Also.... I dont see KI going against what B&M say to use either.
Most will not go against the manufacturer’s recommendation
@@ryantheridemechanic I'd rather you said that none would.😂 Certainly a park in a big chain would never even think of it though, right?....... right?
@@Spike-sk7ql big chins deviate the most. The internal engineering on larger chains will override manufactures recommendations. Most of the time it’s not a bad thing. It allows you to use different grease and small things like that.
@@ryantheridemechanic Sure, but not on things like "run 4 speed wheels, and the rest urethane" and the park being like, "ya know what, nah.... speed wheels for EVERYONE"😂 I would have thought grease would have been up to whatever the park wanted. Manufacturers are like that huh? Is it more than how "GM reccomends Mobil 1" (which is one of the worst synthetics btw)
@@Spike-sk7ql sure. I’ll give an example. For a B&M guide wheel they specify 7.5cc of TOPAZ NB52 per bearing.
We had to have an professional engineer approve the change to a thinner Isoflex-5051 grease. Just grease but the OEM did not sanction the swap. So smaller parks are bound to that grease only. We were able to change and make it better. So it’s an easy example where the park went against what the OEM wanted.
Would the wheels slamming down onto the track after airtime risk creating flat spots as well, like with diamondback's first drop? (I assume that's what that sound is). th-cam.com/video/9W6hF4rleCE/w-d-xo.html
Possible but Not really because the wheels are at speed. Typically flat spotting is done more from sitting still.
Ryan,
I sent you an email…… idk if you got it or not? You never responded to it.
Email is still a new thing to remember to look at. I’ll see