#rammstein #tilllindemann #cancelled Till Lindemann - Another Victim Of Cancel Culture? Subscribe: th-cam.com/channels/OkCJAmiw7xJw3ZBGeKcpLw.html Follow me On Instagram: instagram.com/thegamesnapper121/ Follow Me On Twitter: twitter.com/HannSologuitar Checkout My Facebook Page: facebook.com/masterless1 Find me on Pinterest :pin.it/728IFPp Original Article on Metal Injection Linked Here: metalinjection.net/news/rammstein-issues-statement-after-publisher-drops-till-lindemann-over-additional-allegations
The problem we are having again. People are up in arms without definitive proof that these things happened. In other words people judge him and Rammstein in a sense of "Guilty until proven innocent." And that is what pisses me off so much. You can't have a normal, rational and logical discussion with anyone anywhere these days that you defend the notion of "Innocent until proven guilty."
@@roberteckenberg1129 thats wrong. This is like cancel culture about the whole germans. There are just too much girl speaking about too much details on so many different places. You are saying they're all lying? All of them? Come on you wouldn't say that if one of these were your daughter or so...
@@marviv3714 One starts with the lies and encourages others, and it cascades. Yes, certainly they all lie. You demand to ignore proofs of exogenation. That's fascistic.
Had a discussion about it with some woman, they openly admitted that they would not behave the same if gender roles were reverssed, i.e., a men would accuse a woman of the same. Kinda of a sexist mind set to only cancel men, but leave woman basically untouched, for basically the same behaviour if you ask me, I am not sure how to argue with these people (or woman in that case) tbh.
Till is a victim of himself and it is affecting Rammstein. I'm not saying he's guilty of anything criminal, that's up to a court to decide, but he has been self destructing for awhile. It's sad to see yet we as fans know he has always had issues; it's what drives his art. He could fix a lot of this by dropping the row 0 nonsense and cut ties with Alena and Joe.
I know what you're getting at. There's an old saying : "Never shit on your own doorstep". So, if you put yourself in the position where these things can occur then you shouldn't be surprised when they do. Like, he's made himself a juicy target. So I can see your point.
@@coreydavis2375 Yes, row 0 and messing around with GenZ girls is nonsense for a sixty year old man. He looks foolish and is asking for trouble with this generation of social justice warriors. All his own doing.
This was really well said. None of the news seems unbelievable, but i question if anyone didn't see something coming. Not necessarily rape exactly but something.
@@chelleb3055 Yes bad enough when 20 and 30 something rock stars take up with a teenage groupie or girlfriend. Such as Jimmy Page, Steve Tyler and David Bowie did and found that some of the girls were under the age of consent. But they grew out of it eventually and settled down albeit though with a much younger and glamorous wife but not someone under 22. To keep going like this at 60 is so sick. When men get to that age they have trouble having sex even with their regular partner let alone a series of hook ups. But there are elite men such as Henry Kissenger who can keep going with sex well into their 60's, 70's and 80's. There are conspiracy rumours of them getting adrenochrome from the blood of young people. What concerns me just as much is him treating some of his band members like sex toys especially Flake on stage. Flake never looks comfortable having to kneel on all fours on a platform while Lindemann dry humps him. They are being used as strawmen in stage performances and music videos to push the idea that it's OK for women to be naked or topless in videos if the men are too. There is one video where the other band members are naked while peforming except for boots and have their private parts hidden behind their instruments. Which isn't so bad but in the second half of the video they are being mauled about in turn by the muscle men who were to the side of the stage in a rugby scrum in the first half of the video.
The story with the book publisher has a back story. When the book was published 2 years ago (?), some people noticed a poem by Till in which he writes about sex with a woman drugged with Rohypnol. (There are much more disturbing poems in it) Many thought that it described the character of Till and demanded already at that time that the publisher distance himself from Till and end their business relationship. At that time the publishing house stood behind Till and asked people to separate artist and lyrical ego. Now, after more than two years, the publisher is bothered by the fact that his book is featured in a video published two years ago. The publisher is now afraid of being canceled by buyers and other artists.
Interesting. Thanks for providing those details. Yeah, thats another issue, the fact that publishers, movie studios and probably even your local vape store are terrified they'll say the wrong thing and get brought down by the mob... Where does it end you know?
@@blabla-qz6mn also true but so long as they're ficticious, then it's subjective, although I'm sure most people would certainly agree that it's disturbing. The same could be said though of certain types of murder thrillers and stories about psychopaths etc. That's why my video focused on not whether we think he's guilty or not, but the fact that the man's business is shock rock and shock everything else and his publisher originally backed him up and then suddenly dumped him. Until he's proven guilty he's guilty of nothing more than creating what some people would consider distasteful art and or other creative projects. There's a market for that clearly as the publisher originally backed him up quite firmly and enjoyed the profits of their partnership . Shocking or distasteful as it is, it's not illegal in most territories. My issue so far is all the allegations at time of recording were rather flimsy under scrutiny and many are changing their stories as they go. This is usually an indication that something else is happening entirely. So where there is reasonable doubt, then the man has to be allowed to make his case before he's hung out to dry. Even if he's hated or despised for his views, thoughts or creative expressions. I also want to be clear that I'm not attempting to discredit the woman or girls making the allegations. Not at all. However, the stories they've shared so far aren't building a particularly strong case so far as I can tell. We'll see how things progress though I'm sure.
I certainly don't disagree that that gives them weight. It isn't enough however in my estimation to pass judgment yet. So we know there are lots of people coming forward. However when you go into a lot of the specifics of what they're actually saying it starts to look... Well.. Harder to consider each one as credible. I'm trying to phrase that in a fair way to both sides. More will come to light as things go forward and my video is really about people not passing judgment one way or the other until both sides cases are heard. Does that make sense? In our current society there tends to be a knee jerk reaction that says "This person is seen as problematic, so everyone should condemn them and sever ties with them or else". So, for example, his publisher could have said "We are putting a Hold on our partnership with Till Lindemann pending the outcome of the investigations into the alleged events in relation to the the charges brought against him." Or something like that. However, what they did because of the pressure companies are under these days to maintain public perception as one free of sexism or bigotry etc etc was to drop him altogether going back on the previous stance they took according to another comment poster on this video. It's really those elements I'm focused on in the video as opposed to assuming to have any grasp on whether he is in fact complicit or guilty outright, or even innocent. In my estimation I have to consider him innocent until PROVEN guilty and trust that the legal system will do it's very best to make the correct determination with the evidence available. Until that time, I personally, am unwilling to condemn him. Nor am I prepared to criticise or condemn any of the accusers in any way. I hope that makes sense.
@@Masterlessmusic I totally get your point. The publisher btw. did not cancel the partnership because of the current discussions, but because Lindemann used the book of that publisher visible in his porn music video. At least that is what they announced. Of course the current discussion did not work in favor of Lindemann. You are right of course with innocent until proved guilty, as far as it is about legal prosecution. But for my personal judgement that does not apply in any case. For example if someone is homophobic, that would not be against any law, so he would be innocent. Still I would judge that person. For the current case I see different women from very different directions independently reporting about similarities about what happens on these after show parties. Of course some of the reports assume things, but still for me it is enough to see that there is something morally wrong. Something shady the least. And I have no reason to think that all these women lie. For now I am quite unsure if there is something punishable, but that is not me to judge but the law authorities.
They say that Lindemann is cultured as he paints and writes poetry. But he paints nude women and writes filthy poems. He's a one man porn industry but he uses men as well such as his bandmates and the extras in some of the videos. The men he uses are like strawmen used to deflect. I long for Saturday Night Live or Spitting Image to send him up like they've done Jim Morrison, Ed Sheeran, Grimes and Billie Eilish.
The girl herself tweeted that Till never touched her or assaulted her in anyway...he did get a little angry but that's it and he left and then she did the same and I believe afterwards went to talk to Joe Letz...
@@Masterlessmusic i saw a video where another girl claims to have been at the same concert where the alleged assualt occured and she said she saw shelby outside and she was totally fine she did not look like she had been allegedly assualted or allegedly drugged up at all she just looked like an annoying drunk. You even see her on video all over Joe and poor Joe is trying to be nice and respectful while at the same time trying to get her off him...she's an attention getter and a total joke...not to mention potentially hurting future women who do get sexually assaulted ...
@@peekaboosue oh dear... Thats not a good look. From what I can tell, there seems to be a lot of "she said" and "I heard such and such".. Ie. A lot of hear say. I've not come across anything so far that sounds... Well.. Credible. In fact the only credible sounding thing so far has been the Band's statement where they asked everyone to be respectful to the alleged victims and afford the band the same courtesy while this gets addressed. Aside from that though I've not heard anything sensible about all of this.
One simple question we need to answer if these allegations are true is- Why TWO rooms for ONE party and why was there a division apparently so that young women were only taken to the " sex room" and denied access to the " glamour room"? In my personal view cancel culture has nothing to do with this...
Actually that sounds like a good question for the courtroom. Don't you think ? Not in the case the allegations are true as that seems a tad redundant, but to help ascertain whether they are true or not. This is what I'm talking about. It all tends to happen in the wrong order these days. For example, this all kicked off on social media right? If you've got a serious allegation why not go to the authorities first? I don't understand this way of thinking. Is that because these women / girls strongly suspect something happened but don't know for sure precisely because of drink spiking, so they seek strength in numbers to try to, I guess increase the resolution of available data on the issue ? Possibly, but it just seems a little odd that no one has come straight out to say they were they were " sexually assaulted by the accused" and here's the key bit of evidence and charges were raised first, then reported on. If I'm not mistaken, this was, social post first, then more claims on media networks, then charges. Am I right on this? If I'm wrong, I'll happily put an updated video out saying that but that's my current understanding based on the reports so far.So, Normally, in that scenario, you know you have a case or at the very least that you've definitely been assaulted by this person so, you call the police. I find it odd that, that hasn't happened. Not one... It's just odd. Whereas in the modern day, it all spills out on social with a lot of conjecture and hear say, which gets worse over the Internet and actually makes it a tonne harder for the courts to do their job, as well for the respective legal teams a lot of times. Meanwhile, if there are no basis legally for the accusations (regardless of public perception) the accused gets put through the wringer regardless as do their family and associates and so on. So for me, this bares the hall marks of the "Me Too" movement. Which has had both positive outcomes ( Harvey Weinstein ) and negative outcomes ( Johnny Depp, Cliff Richard etc) as far as professional reputation and credibility damage. So, it does have something to do with cancel culture. From your comment, you seem very suspicious which is fair enough, however you didn't seem quite confident enough to simply say " I think he's guilty and should be locked up and the key thrown away" or similar. So, that implies there's some doubt. I'd imagine a judge or jury would see things the same way at this early stage. So, again, the case needs to be brought before the courts with each side having their chance to speak and then, and only then should judgment be passed. Shouldn't it ?
I did wonder about this two room party. And was it just Till in a room with drugged up girls? Surely the tour manger,band members roadies etc would of had a word and said,hey you don't do that? If this was backstage there's always crew and venue staff about.
@@Maliceuk yeah, so this is what the drummer was saying was that although Till has his own bubble of people around him, it's still Rammstein security and procedures etc for both parties, so he reckons he would have seen or heard something from their own guys. He goes on to say about how drinks are all brand new and sealed and only opened directly in front of the consumer or handed to them to be opened. It's an interesting read.
Have you heard the statements from young women all over several countries? Please try, for example, watching the video by Kayla Shyx. There are just too many young girls talking about the same things. And take a look at the messages from the songs and the porn movie that he made, and so on. It's just too much. We need to discuss it in society. I feel sorry for his family, but after so many heinous crimes involving drug use and the exploitation of young girls for sex within a cruel system... it's disgusting. I don't like cancel culture; he can defend himself with lawyers, etc., but ultimately, we have a cultural agreement about what is acceptable and what isn't. Please just listen to the voices of the victims. We're not talking about someone who makes jokes about horrible crimes or acts like a racist, and so on. This case is much worse.
Yes, I have read the statements. There is a case to answer but the statements are being altered as they go and bare many inconsistencies. The point of the video is that it's not for the public to make a judgment. Both parties should be given time to make their cases in court and a judgment will be made there with due process. It should not be made before that. Even in your comment you presume guilt, yet it is only in this last week that charges have formerly been brought against him. Prior to that his publisher dropped him and now Rammstein's label have halted all promotion for the band in the middle of a tour. This is all before a verdict. I don't agree with that. He may well be guilty but it simply hasn't been proven yet. Despite that, him and all his associates are being cut off from their livelihood bit by bit under pressure from the media and public Opinion. That's not right. You are right that the alleged victims need to be heard. I simply disagree with premature judgment and the implications of that as pertaining to their livelihood.
On one hand I hope so and on the other, if that's proven to be the case it'll be awful for him, his family and the band regardless, so I hope not... Its so weird. I don't want to keep seeing these people go through this for months or even years only to be proven innocent. It used to be "innocent until proven guilty"...
Do you have an article in criminal law in the United States for libel? It is necessary not to go to the world with false prosecutors, but to initiate criminal cases. Including for posts on the network.
I think we can all imagine Till's weirdness where sex is involved, but I very much doubt these allegations are real. For a start, he wouldn't need to spike anyone's drinks! I imagine there's enough fans that would take him up on an offer 😅 I bet she's someone that tried it on with him and he said, 'No thanks'. I hope they aren't true. But sadly, if they are true, it's difficult to believe because of this cancel culture.
While I have know idea one way or another on his guilt. The "he can have anybody" or "shes not his type" is mass rapists defense 101 & it's only cringer when fans do it.
He's got a point though, I mean if you're the groupie right, and you make moves to get "cozy" with Till, you gotta expect some wild shit is gonna go down.. I mean this is the guy who rides giant pyro cock rockets and sprays fake jizz on the crowd from a giant strap on... That doesn't excuse drugging and essentially rape, or any acts of violence (without consent, because some people are into that and there's an understanding), but I what I'm getting at is I can see his point if maybe someone thought it was a good idea at the time and then realised they were in over their head. However, in that case it's gonna depend on what happened when the victim said stop. Did he let it go, or press ahead or force things? That is of course where these cases are often won or lost. I hope for the band and his family's sake that it's not true and if that's the case that he can mount a strong enough defence. If it is true then, he's gonna have to accept the consequences. Thing is, like I said, that should be for the courts to decide. He and the alleged victims should have their chance to make their case and be heard before sentences are handed out.
The sex itself isnt the only reason to spike someones drink. Its also about power. I was doubtful in the beginning but its getting more and more obvious that there are some shady things happening at the afterpartys. There are many women affected. A german youtuber did a video about this and she has proof. I dont think she faked the chats because some of them show a date that back ups her story. There are also chats with Alena that proves that something happened.
@@Masterlessmusic Did the goalpost jus move from rape defense 101 "she's not his type", to rape defense 102 "hes kinky, things got out of hand". Again, I have no idea if this man is innocent or guilty, full disclosure court of law & a bag of beans. But the arguments I see from fans are so rapy apologist adjacent comes off like you fear his guilt outta the gate
He won all the court cases. They go on a great tour in Europe 2024. Rammstein was damaged but at least he is not dead like Marilynn .anson.The publisher might have to pay for this.
Yeah. What's really interesting is how little we heard from the press once things started going in his favour. Typical. I know they need dramatic headlines and so on but they should also aim to set the record straight and keep people updated regardless of the outcome. Maybe I'll do a follow up video about this. They're playing near me in the summer but I'm not going to be able to make it. Out baby girl is still very young so mum can't be away too much and it's hard for me to get to gigs as well for a while. I'm sure it'll be fantastic.
I just saw an interview with a girl that was with this woman that came out with the accusations and she paints a very different picture of what is being said. th-cam.com/video/12_nUrgZCXs/w-d-xo.html
@@lemsip207 No. Without Till or any other band member Rammstein is not Rammstein. And I believe Till is innocent, because there's so many proofs why the accusations are false
Yeah, it was nice to see Johnny get that standing ovation for his latest project. Although some members of the press were still treating him as guilty there. Nice to see Brie Larson of all people swat their stupid provocative questions down.
More like Ian Watkins of the Lost Prophets only he sexually abused very young children including a one year old baby or persuaded their mothers to. The rest of the band had no idea it was going on and when they found out they were in denial at first. That's until his girlfriend Joanna tricked him into confessing to her. Then she went to the police again. She had a huge job getting the police to take her seriously. But the grooming of young girls is almost as bad. It's called hebophilia rather than paedophilia. Even if sex didn't happen until they reached the age of consent they were groomed years before that at the age of twelve to fourteen. There is one Rammstein music video Rosenrot which has hebophilia in a remote Romanian or Bulgarian village as the story line. In it Lindemann seduces a girl of fourteen or fifteen and then beats her parents to death in their house. The rest of the band dressed as priests and monks burn Lindemann at the stake. The girl is then forced to watch this and is comforted by Flake so the whole process repeats. Lindemann claims he wrote the song and made the video to protest this but it reflects what he's really like.
#rammstein #tilllindemann #cancelled
Till Lindemann - Another Victim Of Cancel Culture?
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Original Article on Metal Injection Linked Here:
metalinjection.net/news/rammstein-issues-statement-after-publisher-drops-till-lindemann-over-additional-allegations
The problem we are having again.
People are up in arms without definitive proof that these things happened.
In other words people judge him and Rammstein in a sense of "Guilty until proven innocent."
And that is what pisses me off so much. You can't have a normal, rational and logical discussion with anyone anywhere these days that you defend the notion of "Innocent until proven guilty."
This is Germany. It is not "Guilty until proven innocent", it is "Guilty forever if accused even if proven innocent".
@@roberteckenberg1129 yeah, I've been noticing that. What's the deal with Germany these days?
@@roberteckenberg1129 thats wrong. This is like cancel culture about the whole germans. There are just too much girl speaking about too much details on so many different places. You are saying they're all lying? All of them? Come on you wouldn't say that if one of these were your daughter or so...
@@marviv3714 One starts with the lies and encourages others, and it cascades. Yes, certainly they all lie. You demand to ignore proofs of exogenation. That's fascistic.
Had a discussion about it with some woman, they openly admitted that they would not behave the same if gender roles were reverssed, i.e., a men would accuse a woman of the same. Kinda of a sexist mind set to only cancel men, but leave woman basically untouched, for basically the same behaviour if you ask me, I am not sure how to argue with these people (or woman in that case) tbh.
Till is a victim of himself and it is affecting Rammstein. I'm not saying he's guilty of anything criminal, that's up to a court to decide, but he has been self destructing for awhile. It's sad to see yet we as fans know he has always had issues; it's what drives his art. He could fix a lot of this by dropping the row 0 nonsense and cut ties with Alena and Joe.
I know what you're getting at. There's an old saying : "Never shit on your own doorstep". So, if you put yourself in the position where these things can occur then you shouldn't be surprised when they do. Like, he's made himself a juicy target. So I can see your point.
Nonsense. Corey
@@coreydavis2375 Yes, row 0 and messing around with GenZ girls is nonsense for a sixty year old man. He looks foolish and is asking for trouble with this generation of social justice warriors. All his own doing.
This was really well said. None of the news seems unbelievable, but i question if anyone didn't see something coming. Not necessarily rape exactly but something.
@@chelleb3055 Yes bad enough when 20 and 30 something rock stars take up with a teenage groupie or girlfriend. Such as Jimmy Page, Steve Tyler and David Bowie did and found that some of the girls were under the age of consent. But they grew out of it eventually and settled down albeit though with a much younger and glamorous wife but not someone under 22.
To keep going like this at 60 is so sick. When men get to that age they have trouble having sex even with their regular partner let alone a series of hook ups. But there are elite men such as Henry Kissenger who can keep going with sex well into their 60's, 70's and 80's. There are conspiracy rumours of them getting adrenochrome from the blood of young people.
What concerns me just as much is him treating some of his band members like sex toys especially Flake on stage. Flake never looks comfortable having to kneel on all fours on a platform while Lindemann dry humps him. They are being used as strawmen in stage performances and music videos to push the idea that it's OK for women to be naked or topless in videos if the men are too. There is one video where the other band members are naked while peforming except for boots and have their private parts hidden behind their instruments. Which isn't so bad but in the second half of the video they are being mauled about in turn by the muscle men who were to the side of the stage in a rugby scrum in the first half of the video.
The story with the book publisher has a back story. When the book was published 2 years ago (?), some people noticed a poem by Till in which he writes about sex with a woman drugged with Rohypnol. (There are much more disturbing poems in it) Many thought that it described the character of Till and demanded already at that time that the publisher distance himself from Till and end their business relationship. At that time the publishing house stood behind Till and asked people to separate artist and lyrical ego.
Now, after more than two years, the publisher is bothered by the fact that his book is featured in a video published two years ago.
The publisher is now afraid of being canceled by buyers and other artists.
Interesting. Thanks for providing those details. Yeah, thats another issue, the fact that publishers, movie studios and probably even your local vape store are terrified they'll say the wrong thing and get brought down by the mob... Where does it end you know?
It's good that such a publisher does not publish Stephen King)) 🙃
@@anniethedarkchild8962 haha true
@@user-vf7mj8ur1hI didn't even know he did a book.
I have now brought them. There's no such thing as bad publicity
They’re not cancelled, their concerts go on.
I was referring to his book publisher.
@@Masterlessmusic fair enough
IMO they should never published a poem with rape fantasies. There is No Message, No Art, Just discusting fantasies.
@@blabla-qz6mn also true but so long as they're ficticious, then it's subjective, although I'm sure most people would certainly agree that it's disturbing. The same could be said though of certain types of murder thrillers and stories about psychopaths etc. That's why my video focused on not whether we think he's guilty or not, but the fact that the man's business is shock rock and shock everything else and his publisher originally backed him up and then suddenly dumped him. Until he's proven guilty he's guilty of nothing more than creating what some people would consider distasteful art and or other creative projects. There's a market for that clearly as the publisher originally backed him up quite firmly and enjoyed the profits of their partnership . Shocking or distasteful as it is, it's not illegal in most territories. My issue so far is all the allegations at time of recording were rather flimsy under scrutiny and many are changing their stories as they go. This is usually an indication that something else is happening entirely. So where there is reasonable doubt, then the man has to be allowed to make his case before he's hung out to dry. Even if he's hated or despised for his views, thoughts or creative expressions. I also want to be clear that I'm not attempting to discredit the woman or girls making the allegations. Not at all. However, the stories they've shared so far aren't building a particularly strong case so far as I can tell. We'll see how things progress though I'm sure.
There is not only one girl but dozens with similar accusations, which gives these accusations quite some validity as of now.
I certainly don't disagree that that gives them weight. It isn't enough however in my estimation to pass judgment yet. So we know there are lots of people coming forward. However when you go into a lot of the specifics of what they're actually saying it starts to look... Well.. Harder to consider each one as credible. I'm trying to phrase that in a fair way to both sides. More will come to light as things go forward and my video is really about people not passing judgment one way or the other until both sides cases are heard. Does that make sense? In our current society there tends to be a knee jerk reaction that says "This person is seen as problematic, so everyone should condemn them and sever ties with them or else". So, for example, his publisher could have said "We are putting a Hold on our partnership with Till Lindemann pending the outcome of the investigations into the alleged events in relation to the the charges brought against him." Or something like that. However, what they did because of the pressure companies are under these days to maintain public perception as one free of sexism or bigotry etc etc was to drop him altogether going back on the previous stance they took according to another comment poster on this video. It's really those elements I'm focused on in the video as opposed to assuming to have any grasp on whether he is in fact complicit or guilty outright, or even innocent. In my estimation I have to consider him innocent until PROVEN guilty and trust that the legal system will do it's very best to make the correct determination with the evidence available. Until that time, I personally, am unwilling to condemn him. Nor am I prepared to criticise or condemn any of the accusers in any way. I hope that makes sense.
@@Masterlessmusic I totally get your point.
The publisher btw. did not cancel the partnership because of the current discussions, but because Lindemann used the book of that publisher visible in his porn music video. At least that is what they announced. Of course the current discussion did not work in favor of Lindemann.
You are right of course with innocent until proved guilty, as far as it is about legal prosecution.
But for my personal judgement that does not apply in any case. For example if someone is homophobic, that would not be against any law, so he would be innocent. Still I would judge that person.
For the current case I see different women from very different directions independently reporting about similarities about what happens on these after show parties.
Of course some of the reports assume things, but still for me it is enough to see that there is something morally wrong. Something shady the least.
And I have no reason to think that all these women lie.
For now I am quite unsure if there is something punishable, but that is not me to judge but the law authorities.
They say that Lindemann is cultured as he paints and writes poetry. But he paints nude women and writes filthy poems. He's a one man porn industry but he uses men as well such as his bandmates and the extras in some of the videos. The men he uses are like strawmen used to deflect.
I long for Saturday Night Live or Spitting Image to send him up like they've done Jim Morrison, Ed Sheeran, Grimes and Billie Eilish.
@@lemsip207🤦♂️
he is innocent now
The girl herself tweeted that Till never touched her or assaulted her in anyway...he did get a little angry but that's it and he left and then she did the same and I believe afterwards went to talk to Joe Letz...
Yeah. I saw that thread from Twitter yesterday.
@@Masterlessmusic i saw a video where another girl claims to have been at the same concert where the alleged assualt occured and she said she saw shelby outside and she was totally fine she did not look like she had been allegedly assualted or allegedly drugged up at all she just looked like an annoying drunk. You even see her on video all over Joe and poor Joe is trying to be nice and respectful while at the same time trying to get her off him...she's an attention getter and a total joke...not to mention potentially hurting future women who do get sexually assaulted ...
@@peekaboosue oh dear... Thats not a good look. From what I can tell, there seems to be a lot of "she said" and "I heard such and such".. Ie. A lot of hear say. I've not come across anything so far that sounds... Well.. Credible. In fact the only credible sounding thing so far has been the Band's statement where they asked everyone to be respectful to the alleged victims and afford the band the same courtesy while this gets addressed. Aside from that though I've not heard anything sensible about all of this.
One simple question we need to answer if these allegations are true is- Why TWO rooms for ONE party and why was there a division apparently so that young women were only taken to the " sex room" and denied access to the " glamour room"? In my personal view cancel culture has nothing to do with this...
Actually that sounds like a good question for the courtroom. Don't you think ? Not in the case the allegations are true as that seems a tad redundant, but to help ascertain whether they are true or not. This is what I'm talking about. It all tends to happen in the wrong order these days. For example, this all kicked off on social media right? If you've got a serious allegation why not go to the authorities first? I don't understand this way of thinking. Is that because these women / girls strongly suspect something happened but don't know for sure precisely because of drink spiking, so they seek strength in numbers to try to, I guess increase the resolution of available data on the issue ? Possibly, but it just seems a little odd that no one has come straight out to say they were they were " sexually assaulted by the accused" and here's the key bit of evidence and charges were raised first, then reported on. If I'm not mistaken, this was, social post first, then more claims on media networks, then charges. Am I right on this? If I'm wrong, I'll happily put an updated video out saying that but that's my current understanding based on the reports so far.So, Normally, in that scenario, you know you have a case or at the very least that you've definitely been assaulted by this person so, you call the police. I find it odd that, that hasn't happened. Not one... It's just odd. Whereas in the modern day, it all spills out on social with a lot of conjecture and hear say, which gets worse over the Internet and actually makes it a tonne harder for the courts to do their job, as well for the respective legal teams a lot of times. Meanwhile, if there are no basis legally for the accusations (regardless of public perception) the accused gets put through the wringer regardless as do their family and associates and so on. So for me, this bares the hall marks of the "Me Too" movement. Which has had both positive outcomes ( Harvey Weinstein ) and negative outcomes ( Johnny Depp, Cliff Richard etc) as far as professional reputation and credibility damage. So, it does have something to do with cancel culture. From your comment, you seem very suspicious which is fair enough, however you didn't seem quite confident enough to simply say " I think he's guilty and should be locked up and the key thrown away" or similar. So, that implies there's some doubt. I'd imagine a judge or jury would see things the same way at this early stage. So, again, the case needs to be brought before the courts with each side having their chance to speak and then, and only then should judgment be passed. Shouldn't it ?
I did wonder about this two room party. And was it just Till in a room with drugged up girls? Surely the tour manger,band members roadies etc would of had a word and said,hey you don't do that? If this was backstage there's always crew and venue staff about.
@@Maliceuk Kayla mentioned other crew members also having sex with some of these girls if I remember correctly...
@@Maliceuk yeah, so this is what the drummer was saying was that although Till has his own bubble of people around him, it's still Rammstein security and procedures etc for both parties, so he reckons he would have seen or heard something from their own guys. He goes on to say about how drinks are all brand new and sealed and only opened directly in front of the consumer or handed to them to be opened. It's an interesting read.
CAN'T CANCEL SOMEONE LIKE TILL... ✌👊❤
Have you heard the statements from young women all over several countries? Please try, for example, watching the video by Kayla Shyx. There are just too many young girls talking about the same things. And take a look at the messages from the songs and the porn movie that he made, and so on. It's just too much. We need to discuss it in society. I feel sorry for his family, but after so many heinous crimes involving drug use and the exploitation of young girls for sex within a cruel system... it's disgusting. I don't like cancel culture; he can defend himself with lawyers, etc., but ultimately, we have a cultural agreement about what is acceptable and what isn't. Please just listen to the voices of the victims. We're not talking about someone who makes jokes about horrible crimes or acts like a racist, and so on. This case is much worse.
Yes, I have read the statements. There is a case to answer but the statements are being altered as they go and bare many inconsistencies. The point of the video is that it's not for the public to make a judgment. Both parties should be given time to make their cases in court and a judgment will be made there with due process. It should not be made before that. Even in your comment you presume guilt, yet it is only in this last week that charges have formerly been brought against him. Prior to that his publisher dropped him and now Rammstein's label have halted all promotion for the band in the middle of a tour. This is all before a verdict. I don't agree with that. He may well be guilty but it simply hasn't been proven yet. Despite that, him and all his associates are being cut off from their livelihood bit by bit under pressure from the media and public Opinion. That's not right. You are right that the alleged victims need to be heard. I simply disagree with premature judgment and the implications of that as pertaining to their livelihood.
I think your thinking is quite good. For me this is 'cancel culture'.
On one hand I hope so and on the other, if that's proven to be the case it'll be awful for him, his family and the band regardless, so I hope not... Its so weird. I don't want to keep seeing these people go through this for months or even years only to be proven innocent. It used to be "innocent until proven guilty"...
We don’t know if it did or didn’t happen. That’s literally all anyone should say on this. We don’t know 🤷🏽♀️
Exactly.
Do you have an article in criminal law in the United States for libel? It is necessary not to go to the world with false prosecutors, but to initiate criminal cases. Including for posts on the network.
Sorry but, I think something is getting lost in translation. I don't really understand what you're getting at I'm afraid.
I think we can all imagine Till's weirdness where sex is involved, but I very much doubt these allegations are real.
For a start, he wouldn't need to spike anyone's drinks! I imagine there's enough fans that would take him up on an offer 😅 I bet she's someone that tried it on with him and he said, 'No thanks'.
I hope they aren't true.
But sadly, if they are true, it's difficult to believe because of this cancel culture.
While I have know idea one way or another on his guilt. The "he can have anybody" or "shes not his type" is mass rapists defense 101 & it's only cringer when fans do it.
He's got a point though, I mean if you're the groupie right, and you make moves to get "cozy" with Till, you gotta expect some wild shit is gonna go down.. I mean this is the guy who rides giant pyro cock rockets and sprays fake jizz on the crowd from a giant strap on... That doesn't excuse drugging and essentially rape, or any acts of violence (without consent, because some people are into that and there's an understanding), but I what I'm getting at is I can see his point if maybe someone thought it was a good idea at the time and then realised they were in over their head. However, in that case it's gonna depend on what happened when the victim said stop. Did he let it go, or press ahead or force things? That is of course where these cases are often won or lost. I hope for the band and his family's sake that it's not true and if that's the case that he can mount a strong enough defence. If it is true then, he's gonna have to accept the consequences. Thing is, like I said, that should be for the courts to decide. He and the alleged victims should have their chance to make their case and be heard before sentences are handed out.
The sex itself isnt the only reason to spike someones drink. Its also about power. I was doubtful in the beginning but its getting more and more obvious that there are some shady things happening at the afterpartys. There are many women affected. A german youtuber did a video about this and she has proof. I dont think she faked the chats because some of them show a date that back ups her story. There are also chats with Alena that proves that something happened.
@@Masterlessmusic Did the goalpost jus move from rape defense 101 "she's not his type", to rape defense 102 "hes kinky, things got out of hand". Again, I have no idea if this man is innocent or guilty, full disclosure court of law & a bag of beans. But the arguments I see from fans are so rapy apologist adjacent comes off like you fear his guilt outta the gate
@@sophieabcde839 I started to watch the video but there were no English subtitles.
Ladies enjoy the show don't go back stage. Be safe
To be fair, ladies shouldn't have to worry about such things. Not in a backstage environment at a show staged by professionals. Ideally, not anywhere.
He won all the court cases. They go on a great tour in Europe 2024. Rammstein was damaged but at least he is not dead like Marilynn .anson.The publisher might have to pay for this.
Yeah. What's really interesting is how little we heard from the press once things started going in his favour. Typical.
I know they need dramatic headlines and so on but they should also aim to set the record straight and keep people updated regardless of the outcome. Maybe I'll do a follow up video about this.
They're playing near me in the summer but I'm not going to be able to make it. Out baby girl is still very young so mum can't be away too much and it's hard for me to get to gigs as well for a while. I'm sure it'll be fantastic.
Knowing his reputation what did they thing was going to happen when they agreed to go backstage?
Victim blaming much. Usually girls have to compete for the attentions of a rock star so they think nothing would happen without their consent.
🔥100% Support to RAMMSTEIN❗️ 🔥
Any chick can claim anything. Prove it.....rough sex consent? Just a tease for money?
Till is 100 percent innocent I believe
I hope so for the band's sake. They're awesome and I'd hate to see it come apart over something like this.
@@Masterlessmusic hes kinda old to start such habits I think. I don't trust this cancel culture crap. Its dumb.
I just saw an interview with a girl that was with this woman that came out with the accusations and she paints a very different picture of what is being said. th-cam.com/video/12_nUrgZCXs/w-d-xo.html
@@Masterlessmusic The band would be better off ditching Lindemann and becoming a five piece. Richard Kruspe can sing and play guitar at the same time.
@@lemsip207 No. Without Till or any other band member Rammstein is not Rammstein. And I believe Till is innocent, because there's so many proofs why the accusations are false
A bit like Johnny Depp, and He's bouncing back
Yeah, it was nice to see Johnny get that standing ovation for his latest project. Although some members of the press were still treating him as guilty there. Nice to see Brie Larson of all people swat their stupid provocative questions down.
More like Ian Watkins of the Lost Prophets only he sexually abused very young children including a one year old baby or persuaded their mothers to. The rest of the band had no idea it was going on and when they found out they were in denial at first. That's until his girlfriend Joanna tricked him into confessing to her. Then she went to the police again. She had a huge job getting the police to take her seriously. But the grooming of young girls is almost as bad. It's called hebophilia rather than paedophilia. Even if sex didn't happen until they reached the age of consent they were groomed years before that at the age of twelve to fourteen.
There is one Rammstein music video Rosenrot which has hebophilia in a remote Romanian or Bulgarian village as the story line. In it Lindemann seduces a girl of fourteen or fifteen and then beats her parents to death in their house. The rest of the band dressed as priests and monks burn Lindemann at the stake. The girl is then forced to watch this and is comforted by Flake so the whole process repeats. Lindemann claims he wrote the song and made the video to protest this but it reflects what he's really like.
Can’t cancel god