PTFE VS AN - Steel Braided vs Nylon Hose Motion 360
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ม.ค. 2019
- On this Episode of Motion 360 Doug Talks about the differences between PTFE and AN Fittings. Doug discuses the differences between ptfe braided hose and nylon braided standard rubber style hose. Motion Raceworks carries a full stock of Fragola fittings and both steel braid and nylon braided hose for your project!
Contact us today for help with ordering the correct hose and fittings for your application. (800)-878-9274
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Awesome video, great tips, especially on the conductivity. I'm just using these to dress up my engine, but I haven't even considered that.
One suggestion I'd like to make that I used in the past is lint-free cloth, with alcohol. Push a bit into the line before I cut it. As far as feeding it through different areas, I made caps for the different size lines I use and push the plug and cap onto the line before running it through areas that are contaminated. Although I'm working with water, it should work for these lines as well.
Gasoline builds static, alcohol and methanol will not. Low conductivity fuels build static by being pumped, but alcohol and methanol are high in conductivity.
Thanks for the info; great video.
great video learned a lot. thank you
That was the best vid on those type of hoses Iv ever seen! I’m about to replace my entire hose system on my 2015 Silverado and I’m tryn to figure it out.
Lafeyette Ransom give us a call, we would be happy to help!
Motion Raceworks Official : man I absolutely will! You guys r the only ones I’ve ever really been able to understand. I’m no dummy, it’s just that nobody gets to deep into the description of things. I’ve built pro street cars and trucks my whole life but I never used these because Iv always been on a budget and do has everyone I’ve built them for, Come to think of it I was never even able to keep my toys long cuz I’ve had to sell them to get me through tuff times. So now I’m just like screw it, if I cant build a ground up then I’ll just love the one I’m with lol. So my company truck is going HP lol. Iv always had this dream anyway. I always wanted a high performance show/race/work/ truck to draw attention to the company I’m still building. So I really appreciate the knowledge! I’m very loyal to the products that work well and the people behind them so I’m looking forward to meeting you guys.
Great video. I am working on a custom motorcycle oil cooler and definitely will be asking for your advise and hopefully be purchasing what I need from you. Thanks, Brian
Thanks Doug. 👍
I get the nylon braided hose off Amazon, it’s the same thing you showed in the video. The biggest difference in your nylon hose and Amazon nylon hose is the price. I got 25ft for $40, I checked the motion website and it was $8.49 PER FOOT. If I spent $40 on your nylon hose I would not quite get 5ft. It would cost me $212 plus tax and shipping to get what I got on Amazon for $40. It’s proven and I use it all the time. Not sure why your prices are so high on everything but I’m sticking with what I can afford. Looks like nice parts and nice quality by prices are insane compared to others.
You are absolutely spot on. These folks are selling just the fittings for 60 to $100 just for the fitting!
Same here been runing Amazon ones for 5 years now. No leaks
Made in the USA vs China. Expensive vs cheap.
speakn truth guy
Great info 👍🏽
Very informational!
Great video
aeroquip startlite is my new favorite line. Super easy to work with and holds up to everything I've used it for
I have to fundamentally disagree with you on push-lock hoses. Push-lock hoses are FIA and NHRA approved, are extremely reliable, and AQP socketless hose is alcohol rated (been running it on methanol-powered late models for 6-7 years without a problem). I would argue that due to how it's basically impossible to assemble them wrong, they are far more reliable than your standard reusable braided fittings.
Crimp-style fittings on aramid braided PTFE-lined hose is still superior to all, but push-lock isn't a bad alternative. In my opinion stainless braided hose with reusable fittings has no place on a modern race car. It's fine for a street car, especially if you like the look, but there is absolutely no reason to use it on a race car. Also, the whole "conductive vs. non-conductive" hose thing is absolute marketing bullshit. It is simply not a thing, and shouldn't factor into your hose selection.
Exactly as I was thinking. I’m not an EE but wouldn’t the Teflon and braid lead to the same ground?
Lol I was thinking something like this about the time he started saying and promoting only fragola hmm... Ya marketing BS I've used them good fittings but there are plenty of just as good stuff on the market. Was REALLY interested in what you said about psuhlock hoses. If you ran those on trans lines from trans to a cooler would a track allow you to run? what's the durability of those hoses? curious now
I just refinished replacing diesel fuel lines with AN hose and fittings. I had used push-locks in the past with a large aftermarket lift pump--and I would agree that they are pretty secure. but...I still went with AN fittings simply due to the fact that I can easily mount a pre-lift high flow in line filter and shutoffs on the lines--for diesel this is pretty critical as fuel quality simply isn't up to par with gasoline. One caveat, AN fittings nowadays leak...especially when you cross- use products by different manufacturers. Nobody seems to talk about this issue...but its definitely a "thing". I use Seco7 conical seals now on everything and no leaks at all. I also use a dab of Loctite 243 (only Loctite that works on anodized aluminum) on a clean install, or, believe it or not, old school "Indian Head gasket shellac" by Permatex...when using in the field. The IH is completely impervious to either gas or diesel...but not E85...but stops vibration from loosening AN fittings...
@@chicagomike6666 in the process of building a fuel system for my diesel. What fuel line did you use?
@@Blueovalnation i used ptfe braided nylon hose with AN fittings (AN6). This is easiest way to add shutoffs before and after fuel pump and external filter…Leroy Diesel kindly modified an FFM to accept the hose end . been great..no leaks snd i can easily shut off fuel when changing filter of pump. the best part is that to change a section…just unscrew…add new hose or whatever an tighten back up…
Good info👍👍
Thank you so much
Very helpful.
Looking to replace the entire fuel line in my 77 Ford Van no one has original lines for sale i came across this video can i run the nylon braided hose from Carb to fuel tank ? the van is a cruiser only Gas thanks
Can you tell me how long this cable cutters you used in this video? Thinking about ordering some. Didn't know if the ones you used are equivalent to 32 inch or 25 inch long handles.
Could I use a nylon hose as a turbo oil return/drain? But wrap a heat sheath around it for heat protection?
*we don't use push lock because there's not as much margin in it, so we don't sell it.
So we will talk trash about it, and tell you that our product is better so we can upsell you.
Matt G that’s not the case. It’s an unprotected, non reinforced hose.
Motion Raceworks Official : I was actually looking into the quick connect stuff for my project on my truck. What’s the risk percentage difference between the two? I don’t have time for issues at all. Thx?
Push loc everywhere. We use that suff on school buses. If it wasn't that safe it wouldn't be allowed..
Push loc is an amazing product and I have used it in automotive high end applications,
also in industrial maintenance, years of reliable service.
In a vibration free and torque free environment push lock is fine with decent hose. What happens under pressure is the sharp edges of the barbs dig in and cut the hose internally to hold. If the hose is twisted, bent tightly at the barb, gets close to its maximum operating temp or is even slightly vulnerable to the contents the sealed ends start to weep slightly but only for each pressure cycle as the barb digs deeper and further. So every time you turn on the pressure the hose whips slightly and worries the way the barb is seated inside. If the rubber isn't 100% resistant to the contents you get the rubber breaking down around the barb. So it wears out. That is the smell he was talking about. With decent molded hose {Reinforced inside the hose to prevent it from slipping} that is impervious to its contents it is fine as it doesn't whip during its pressure cycles. The Stainless braided hose unless it's aviation grade or partially molded also suffers from the hose whip wear on pinch olives. However when it fails it does so in a catastrophic fashion with that type of connection. The only benefit is it lasts longer in a fire. The time is seconds VS minutes. External wire braided hose is quite dangerous IMO when used for brakes as well. As the hose moves around inside the braid it wears and because it is not hermetically sealed dust and sand can get in there between the two surfaces and erode both surfaces. The only safe stainless Teflon hose IMO is the one with a smooth molded finish on the outside or aviation rated as that has the wire bonded to the rubber/Teflon hose inside. I shudder when I see these types of hoses used under the bonnet with high pressure and flow fuel as when they spring a leak it could turn into a disaster. OEM's use molded rubber and crimped for a reason and it isn't just price.
Can you use the ptfe hose on the pressure side of a power steering pump or is the pressure to excessive thank you
Good job
i have an unrelated question about hoses. Can you give me an idea or answer on what type of hose i can use that can handle the high vacuum of a turbo and not fail also with heat of the oil? i am installing an oil catch can . i used 1/2 inch fuel line and it gave in. if you guys carry any such hose please let me know and i can order it. thanks
How about running send and return fuel lines on a turbo diesel? Thanks for any info!
Ball valve on the fuel pump feed as well for easy filter and pump maintenance. Soooo much easier to service stuff without having to worry about draining the tank first.
By that do you mean a check valve somewhere along the fuel line?
@@pourtierbeatz7804 no a on/off ball valve like you would see on a water or gas line in a house. Couple bucks from the hardware store
I used autozone fuel lines on my boat motor and after the fuel sat in the lines overnight it turned brown. Then after sitting for a week in the lines the fuel was red in color. Boat did not want to start with the discolored fuel in the lines and carbs
How much heat can this nylon tube handle?
Those are electrical cable cutters. Awesome information videos always thank you very much
Chad Warner awesome! Everyone should be able to go to a local hardware store and pick them up. Life changing technique where we used to use a compound saw
In Australia we call them 'cocky cutters' because they look like a cockatoo's beak
I'm having a nightmare of a time trying to find a way to run a hose from my motorcycle crankcase to a catch can/breather.
The barbed fitting is a single barb on the crank case and is vary close to the exhaust would need a bend to keep it away from the heat as I keep blowing through hoses do to melting.
On top of that the OD of the crank case fitting is 16.80mm on a micrometer or I call it 17mm even and the OD on the fitting for the canister is 8mm I cant find any way to step a hose down from 17mm ID to 8mm ID.
Any help would be much appreciated as I basically just shove the smaller hose down the bigger one and call it a day since I burn through them so often.
I found it WAY easier to build a stainless braided PTFE line than a stainless braided rubber line.
What about for coolant lines or oil catch can lines? Ptfe? Or just regular an hose
What hose will you recommend for a return on a chevelle with carburetor with -6 an fittings from engine bay to fuel tank
Ok I usually really like your videos, but I felt a bit off about this one. First, alcohol is highly conductive, so it won't carry a charge, unlike gasoline which will. Gasoline has such a low conductivity it builds static by being pumped, or splashed etc. Methanol is also a ton more conductive than gasoline. That's a super critical point to make. And any amount of ethanol (that is beneficial to making power) will be enough to make it a high conductivity fluid.
When fuel carries a charge, it will look for the point of least resistance. It won't simply arc across the whole hose. It will allow charge through the ends (or fittings). Aluminum has a lot more resistance comparative to copper, but a lot less than arcing through a hose.
There are many many good hoses out there. I like that you talked about static charge building, many people don't know about that, but you should be more specific about which fuels are conductive and which ones aren't.
so then what do i run in my car to prevent it from burning to the ground
@@aidanmatthews5297 non metallic hose, secured to prevent rubbing, kept away from electrical as much as possible.
@@alexb4409 Well then I guess I'm already doing the right thing, thanks for the reassurance tho
Can you help me connecting my fuel system on my 2002 Camaro LS swap?
how can the conductive core ground through the fittings when the anodizing on the aluminum fittings is non conductive? the conductive liner in the hose only contacts anodized surfaces on the fitting, and then that fitting is most likely going to be attached to another anodized fitting before touching anything metal and chassis grounded. in other words, wouldn't the anodizing on the fittings insulate the conductive inner surface of the hose from grounding to the chassis?
I was just going to ask this. Most don't know that anodizing isn't conductive. I suppose the charge could bypass the anodized fitting and condust to the closest steel next after the fuel line.The carbon just protects the PTFE.
I need some assistance with finding the right fittings for my fuel system. What is the best way to get ahold of a support member?
What about hose for engine oil coolers?
Underneath an offroading rig for gas, I'm guessing stainless braided would be better for the abrasion resistance?
correct
If im replacing fuel hoses from engine bay & fuel tank hat to e85 compatible hose and connecting straight to existing hardline for feed and return ' will hardline act as earth for static build up compared to alloy fittings
Is it possible to use pressure hose clamps (not the regular worm-gear kind) for braided lines right onto the old steel fuel lines?
Only if you flare the steel line first and create a barb. If not it will most likely leak or blow off without a barb.
Wouldn't the static just discharge into the fuel rail that's attached to the engine block that is grounded? Do you have any resource material for this phenomenon about conductive and non conductive ptfe line?
Use dielectric great grease before pumping peroxide & liquid oxides! No, that rocket fuel, damnit. I dare anyone to use a Fluke 87-5 find a voltage drop from a grounded tank to a grounded engine! I alway park my "Top Fuel Dragster" at home in the garage. It is only 14" long but goes fast. But I am sure 400-700 garages exploded last night, they just don't report it like they do! Do the use "Cue Cards"?
ASE Master since 78, retired.
Pop! There go another one! Nope, just M-80!
What about hi pressure for fuel injection or power steering
Old thread… sorry, when having to replace a ptfe fitting, is it best to replace the ferrule as well or can I just slide in the new fitting into the ferrule and tighten it back down? I may have cracked the inner seat 🤦🏻♂️.
doesn't non conductive PTFE ground out from the olive to termination and the braided line regardless??
Not in the middle of the line when theres a static source
They add a tiny bit of carbon to the plastic usually to make it conductive.
Have you done any research regarding E85 fuel and if so what kind?
I like to put a ball valve on my fuel cell vents that way when i park the car for a week or so I can shut it off and have the cell sealed off from the elements better. Keeps that e85 from absorbing so much water and keeps the fumes away
SLOGOAT219 good idea!
what happens when ambient temp changes and so does the pressure in your tank? If ambient is hot, your tank will be building pressure. If ambient is cold is will attempt to contract.
@@alexb4409 it does expand and contract some. If the fuel is super hot when I park the car I wait till later that night or the next day to close the valve if I know it will be sitting for a few weeks. If not it will pull a huge vacuum
What about for an engine oil cooler? The temperature is only going to be around 120C
So can I use ptfe for my 93 octane fuel system, power steering, and trans cooler lines?
Yep
hey Doug, how do these compare to traditional 3/8 hardlines? im building my first truck and not sure wether to run hoses or try to do hardlines. Trans, Oil, Fuel.
Ptfd all the way . Takes one minute longer .. belive me its worth it..
What fire burn temeperature for ptfe?
Will the ends of AN and PTFE thread onto the same male thread?
ptfe for everything is supper hot like brake line or turbo feeder or clutch for the reste like oil cooler or fuel nylon is good
Stainless is a very good conductor. Non conductive hose will still ground out on the stainless steel. There is no way there will be burn hole in stainless braided.
Will those sheers cut braided PTFE ??
I use a stainless steel hose for an turbo oil return but it is close to the exhaust pipes, should a leave it the way it is or should I protect it with something?
Spinner it’s a good idea to put a heat wrap on it, otherwise there’s a chance the inner rubber portion of the hose can melt or degrade causing a leak
@@MotionRaceworksOfficial thank you!
Can you use the nylon hose for a turbo oil drain or would it get to hot?
No. Use stainless
Can this system be used on brake lines
I have a ptfe hose that I want to install for an engine oil cooling sandwich. A 45° adapter will be installed on the oil cooler sandwich, and the adapter will be attached to the sandwich, then the hose will be pressed to the other side of the adapter at a 45° degree, then the hose will extend to a length of 1 meter, then a 90° adapter will be installed, and the hose will be pressed here The problem is there is a problem with connecting the hose to its end. Is the required piece a phrase “Hedaan” and its connection for two years, or what, and what is the name of the piece? Then the hose extends to a length of 50 cm, then a 90° adapter is installed. Another one and what is its name so that I can search for it and thank you.
Aeroquip is a better product IMO.
with the recent fires in Australia some of the trucks brake lines were melting. would steel braided brake lines hold up to heat better than the stock rubber lines?
The brake lines they were referring to were for Air Brakes and they frequently just use plastic hose for these. Standard rubber hoses would be fine unless they parked or drove over a fire for extended periods and then they really have other things to worry about.
Some of the trucks being used in the new South Wales bush fires the rubber brake lines were melting due to the heat.
@@lorrystagg6578 no. metal retains heat. ALL hoses with stainless braiding is SOLEY designed to prevent abrasion or hot surafec direct contact, causing hose failure. You need a heat barrier hose covering to prevent the hose rubbers from soaking too much heat.
Can you use a standard an fitting without the olive on PTFE hose?
No, you have to have an Olive on PTFE, you can only use an olive once, it mars up pretty bad, don't use them more than once. you can buy extra olives.
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
id like 2 c static charge burn a hole threw i don't think so
can your team refer me to the best lottery ticket..ill take the wheel from there lol
Is Nylon PTFE easier to install then steel PTFE?
I ordered some e85 line and yall send me the black rubber type with the non compression type fittings... i thought i eas getting the teflon line... not happy
prdctofxprienc cars to shoot us an email to customerservice@motionraceworks.com ? We would love to hear more details
prdctofxprienc FYI Fragola standard rubber AN line with nylon braiding is E85 compatible. It is published as such in their catalog and we have proven it with many project cars to be a perfect option. I’m assuming that’s the line type you are referring to
bull s..t that will not catch fire, there just tryin to sell a product, tell me when the last time you saw somebody car catch fire because of fuel flow threw a braided line, what the hell bull s..t
the newer 10% ethanol blended gas vapor will seep through non ptfe hoses. go read reviews on summit. PTFE is just better and safer
My boss drag races and one day when I was helping him with the car, one of the stainless braided hoses started shooting fuel out of the side of the hose, between every braid, fogging out everywhere. He grabs an old one he had on the shelf, already made and everything, came off one of his older, but similar, set-ups. He puts it on and it does the same thing. Ended up having to buy a new roll of hose and remake them all. I doubt they were PTFE, but either way it's been making me weary about stainless steel braided hoses because I want my cars to be daily driverable without having to replace everything every year.
I repair hydraulic machineries for a living and most of the hose failures are from steel braided ones.
Sooo the static charge will arc through the teflon and ignore the metal connectors at the ends of the line.....niiiiice....it's like you can suck it without getting it wet. The flow of the gas will move electrons until it finds the metal connectors where it will dump them....
Tanase Andrei unfortunately that is not true. The electricity will take the path of least resistance. We didn’t come up with this theory, there are a lot of case studies and examples of this happening. We have no agenda but to educate our customers based off of real world results and experience.
@@MotionRaceworksOfficial 90% of the fuel lines car manufacturers use are made of cheap ass rubber or frying pan quality ptfe (in the 10-20 Mohm per mm resistance range ), and they never ever arc to nowhere. Give me one case study that states what you say please.
Tanase Andrei there are plenty of them online. Do your own searching and read away.
@@MotionRaceworksOfficial i did, there is no such thing....I was rhetorical when i asked you for a case study. By the way, let's say i work with hydraulics for a living....
What would be best for power steering?
PTFE would be, Power steering is high pressure 900-1600 PSI
I need 5/8 tread An fitting to connect 5/16 fuel line I bought this aftermarket gasoline tank
How many times can you fit “actual” and “actually” in one video
I like inexpensive, as opposed to cheap, lol.
Can u use non ptfe fittings on a ptfe hose?
This guy!!! Lol. Push to lock is the best out of all three. It is used in every vehicle on the road sice the late 90's. Every semi, bus, heavy machinery, regular cars. And I have never seen or heard of any failing hoses or fittings. And they dong corrode ever with e85 ever.
454lss push to loc is different than push loc.
@@MotionRaceworksOfficial no it's not. The terminology varies. But they all refer to a hose that pushes onto a fitting and can't be removed without cutting. Different types of hoses materials for different applications, all using the same type of fitting whether brass, steel or aluminum. ALL PUSH ON and "lock" in place.
The Ferrell goes over the plastic not inside of it…! When you tighten it up that ferrell crimps the out side of the plastic liner to make a seal! That’s how all plumbing stops work, like on toilets & sink lines. That is if you don’t use stainless flex supplies! 😂👌🏻🏁
Was this a comparison video or an advertisement?
advertisement....puch lock is safe to use.. just do all the conection right.. and you wont have a probem...in my " opinion "
pushlocks are nhra approved
Anybody got a tl;dw?
I have to disagree with you. For me personally PTFE is MUCH easier to assemble than the thick bulky nylon hose. Blue painters tape around the area I wanna cut so I'm cutting right in the middle of the tape. That way both ends are taped after I complete my cut and neither end has fraying wires to worry about poking your fingers. Blue masking tape, Bench vice, and a Dremel tool with cutoff wheel makes working with PTFE simple and easy.
The only real difference between these two hoses is the outer brading. one is steel wire, and the other is nylon fabric. The rubber hose inside is still EPDM rubber or something similar. The steel will deal with hot better, and the nylon will deal with flex better.
No.
One has a PTFE (Teflon) liner, to resist the more corrosive fuels (E85 through methanol). Did you watch the video at all?
@@mattmanyam I know this is way late… but did you watch the video? 10:24. Buddy. “Both will handle e-85”
@@nodekapunk "this one requires maintenance and draining". Dude.
@@mattmanyam he still said you can use it my guy. And plenty of people do.
@@nodekapunk and then they complain that their injectors failed.
You can tell who his sponsor is.
who's sponsor? We sell Fragola because we believe in their product and it works. Paid zero dollars by them
When teflon burns it creates deadly fumes!
too much talking, cut to the chase.
Welcome to modern day youtube.
He certainly could have cut a bunch of info and made it short and sweet. But you can't explain things as well as he did with fewer words. Most people appreciate the quality education.
Need more volume!
Fragola this, fragola tha just get to the point
Gonna blow if its non cunductive boys....stainless braid is cunductive genius.
Anyone else audio to quiet?
This is false info. Push lock hose and fittings have been approved since 2014 by both NHRA/IHRA.
brianawd there used to be a max length suggested by NHRA. It’s just a poor choice for plumbing due to it having no protective covering and not being steel reinforced.
brianawd there used to be a max length suggested by NHRA. It’s just a poor and unsafe choice for plumbing due to it having no protective covering and not being steel reinforced.
A Google search agrees. NHRA approves. Kinda lost credibility
Max length was for rubber fuel line of no more then 12in. Push lock hose is not the same as normal fuel line. pushlock like Parker or other brands have a textile braid core.
I understand using braided SS hose around the bell housing area for safety as it has added protection. But one could run push lock just before the bell housing. Then run braided SS to the rails.
To each there own. Run what works best for you.
I do enjoy your vids and the products you sell.
Asa Brown it’s not stainless braided or reinforced. There are a number of things the sanctioning bodies do and don’t do that still don’t make sense.
Push-lock is rated for nascar, and rated for on highway transport. This is an advertisement poorly mumbled to sell a product. Aka bull shit. Push lock comes in a variety of hose types for different liquids. Ranging up to 300 psi and temperatures above 300*f. Lightweight, non wearing reusable fittings. If you can't plumb hoses correctly by securing and routing away from sharp objects or heat sources while utilizing heat protection materials. You should not be plumbing anything to begin with. In MOST cases, push-lock will succeed requirement by far if selected and installed correctly.
very correct
13 minutes and all we see is one hose cut and only an explanation how to put it together... Show the problems people have getting it together and what problems to look out for.
U don't have a favorite brand do you 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Wut.. PTFE is a material. AN is a fitting style... This is a bad title.
Omg...I stopped after 3 min, just get to the point
Those cutters suck
People have been using non conductive for ages without issues. Clearly this guy is pushing Fragola hard lol smfh Always take these YT videos with a grain of salt...
Excellent job promoting fragola! Nice free marketing!.. Lame sir.. Lame
Guy didn't talk about ID size OD size or what AN is or nothing, worthless tutorial only advice from a another weekend driver
ejuste P read the title, the vid wasn’t about AN sizes it’s about the difference between a regular hose and PTFE hose. Clearly you’ve watched the wrong vid looking for the wrong info.