Getting in the mind of a GrandMaster Thrall. (Gameplay With Commentary)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
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![[HotS] The Ultimate Solo Lane Guide](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YCQagtH3JpI/mqdefault.jpg)
Definitely need to use trait more than I did. To be completely honest guys I used thrall as one of the heroes I got to gm but haven't played him much recently so while the information Is there the mechanics are a bit rusty I just really wanted to get a thrall video out.
That was the only thing I really noticed. Specifically because you talked about how much you like it lol. The CD is so low that you can use it pretty liberally. (Though I do like holding it to bait fights too).
I was going to comment, good on you for the reflection.
NotParadox next time ask Liam for solo lane videos, one of, if not the best solo laners in the amateur league, yes he stole me real name
Awesome guide !
yeah but we were able to kinda get the idea of how you utilize his strengths. that was good.
Great video. Few things I would like to add as someone who plays a ton of Thrall in regular ol' Masters:
1. You mentioned Thrall's immortal race isn't very good. While you're correct, his race is a lot better if you opt for Follow Through at level 7 over Ancestral Wrath. However, I really only take this talent if the enemy team is super squishy or I feel like I'm going to be soloing camps all game as it speeds that up immensely as well. AW is more often than not the correct pick versus a double frontline.
2. Speaking of camps, regardless of the talent you pick at 7, if you're playing Thrall, doing camps is your job. You can do them fast and have good self-sustain, plus the means to get away (W+E) in case of an invade. Call for someone to cover your lane while you go.
3. While you do mention how good Earthen Shields is in the video, I feel like I need to elaborate how insane it actually is. It's basically taking Lucio's ult and stacking it on top of Earthquake. It can win fights alone.
4. The level 13 trait heal talent gives you extra stacks for AW as well as proccing Mana Tide, so it's pretty much the pick all the time. I use it off cooldown for extra sustain unless I know I will need it for a teamfight soon.
Otherwise great video, even if the teams were a little silly (red team had no actual main tank).
My most common experience as solo laner is my team dying and losing fort 4v4 or 3v3 or 4v3...
and blame you sayes 4v5 - solo line lose my game
I'm a GM thrall and I always take follow through at 7. The burst it provides proc's off up to 6 of your abilities including your 13. Provides much more dmg than ancestral wrath.Wolf quest at 4 is good if you can complete it.
Hey, man, just wanna put it out there. I'm new to your channel, and, as someone said in one of your videos (don't remember which one tho) - i'm one of thouse guys who "came for hots, stays for life advices". :) What i'm trying to say is, your idea of improving skill in hots and in general kinda sticked with me. Also that approach is helping me right now in dealing with a lot of personal issues - and i do mean A LOT of thouse - so i'm finaly in process of actually solving some problems that haunted me for years. And your advices pointed me in the right direction, so that i get some real progress for a change. Thank you! You really kinda hit the right spot for me.
P.S.: too bad my pc litteraly died a few month ago, and i can't actually get to play hots and improve by practicing... But, as you keep saying, one thing at a time :)
Thanks for real! Subbed, gotta catch up with other interesting stuff you got there!
Please do one about either alarak or samuro. These characters have such high skill ceiling and skill caps that they need to be done! Also, your videos are awesome and give really valuable advices! Keep up the good work! :D
you know what... i compare this now to other videos ive seen and: the info you give me here is exactly what i need to better find the mistakes i do, confirm what i may do pretty decent and to enhance my game play faster. I´m not a friend of the vblogging entertainment style of these days you know. Also I´m playing games since my amiga 500 and appreciate clear info on game mechanics... this really makes things easy for me. So thanks a lot for helping me to get outta the mmr swamp! (initially watched your abathur video)
Is "Getting in the mind of a" the new trend now or something? Great vid btw XD
I just found him a month ago and he has done several videos about some heroes. Havent seen any other channel do this but then again, i just started trying to git gud for real at the game a couple months ago so maybe is more channels i dont know.
People seemed to like the first couple, so it will be a series just for the heroes I use to get to Grandmaster. Explain while playing. For everything else I will still have my other stuff.
I think you should use your D trait healing more times and the talent following throw is very interesting with double Q and the bonus of nexus blade at lv 20. More slows and more dmg on basic attacks ,making you E and following throught basics attacks stronger. finally if you go for the talent that gives you doble temple (E talent lv 13 ) you will have the highest dps build of thrall possible.
PD:More slows makes you easier to approach / get closer to ranged assasins and heroes with high mobility.
Watch how he kills jaina at 7:30, he could not have done that with follow through, you can see that jaina gets out of his auto attack range because thrall was slowed, he finished her with ancestral (it gives more burst to his already bursty combo). You don't pick thrall for his dps, there are better picks for that.
@@kimahri3267 But FT is great for Immortal, taking/clearing camps.
It basically is never a wrong choice as it provides A LOT of damage enemies do not expect and it is very versatile.
You can not spam AW, it's only applied to heroes and there's even no guarantee you'll be able to use it when you face enemy hero.
AW is good, but I would really argue that it's not the go-to option.
@@LegsON Is it reliable damage though? How are you going to get damage out of follow through if the ranged dps just kites you? You wont be able to get all 4 follow thorugh procs in the short duration of your wolf's root. Almost always you are just going to get 1-2 auto attacks before the enemy just disengages. No one will stand and fight at melee range 1v1 against a thrall, unless they are bad, in which case any talent works.
@@kimahri3267 iz teru It is much more reliable in this particular scenario.
1. Ranged enemies are of low hp, so AW won't do much damage to them, neither it will heal you noticeably.
2. Are you going to use God know how long of a cooldown ability to poke? Enemies will just heal it out like no big deal.
3. Optimally AW has to be used when u are not at full health, or else you lose healing. FT works anytime.
4. Again, how often do you expect to use AW in a team fight? Lucky to do it 2 times. In a situation against ranged enemies it's even worse.
Again, FT helps at siege (minions, camps, monsters, structures).
Enemy might summon some shit.
There's no use in AW vs Hanzo. He won't care for 1 more poke attack once every 15 seconds.
Better clench yo teeth, bear pain and humiliation.
Then, when the time comes, get close to the arrowsucker and blow the shot out of him!
Same goes with Jainas, Tracers, Raynors, Tychuses. :)
@@kimahri3267 Can't Butcher 1v1 a Thrall in melee range?
excellent video, thrall's solo lane and team fight potential was obvious to me but these types of videos help highlight less obvious points and show you how certain tricks can be used; thankyou for making them
One of the best HOTS teachers out there at the moment. Cheers bud. keep um coming.
More videos like this, very good help :). Also very fun to watch.
awesome video, thank you. get that thrall a wolf, that jumpy thing is embarrassing lol
15:40 Q the fountain
Yep
Just wanted to add that I like to go Earthquake whenever the enemy has some sort of potentially fight-ending combo, like Jaina's ring of frost in that game. Pre-20 the slow can negate any ranged or melee that are trying to position closer to start dealing damage, and post-20 you negate the damage itself plus a massive slow and the fight turns completely in your favor.
"and he got cleansed, weird" Zul has like 15 sec cooldown on that
Been playing Thrall a lot since Mal'ganis's patch and I play him the same exact way as you with the solo lane thrall build.
I want to add that Thrall is one of those heroes in which you can go any talent build and still make him work. Shit, I saw people going with the fkin none-quest build and still carry games. My personal favourite is his 1-7 quest E build with sundering. The amount of damage you do is absolutely retarded and unless the enemy team has blinds you're an absolute nightmare to their backline because of the extra movement speed granted by maelstrom weapon.
On the topic of his lvl 13 talent, atleast to me, it comes down to if the enemy team has a frontline that I can melee safely or not. If they have 2 ranged heroes I tend to go mana tide into lvl 16 quest. If all they have are midrange heroes (i.e Alarak, greymane) I tend to go the E build at 13-16.
I LOVE E build, it's all I do xD
watching this in 2020, watching these tower dives gives me anxiety
*teleports behind jaina*
"Its nothing personal, kid."
I like going Windfury build, it takes a while to stack up, but late game you absolutely blow everyone, even tanks, up. I've started calling Thrall the better Butcher because of that, lol! His E empowered auto attacks don't hit as hard as a fully stacked Butcher, but pretty close once you account for the speed you're hitting them at. I mean stacking so you're hitting for 500 damage it do-able, and hitting 3 times in a row with E means you're hitting for 1500. Add in Tempest Fury at 16 where your final strike hits 3 times for 75% damage that's over 2000 damage per E. Get the teleport at level 20 and you can hit for another 2000 after teleporting. And that's just if you hover around 500 damage, every auto attack while Windfury is active infinitely keeps stacking, including your 3 mini hits, so you're getting 5 stacks every time you hit someone, raising your damage. Once I hit 600 damage per auto attack, meaning a full hit of Windfury hits for 2500. With the teleport that's a full 5000 damage in one sitting you can pop on someone at a moment's notice and it just requires auto attacking them after popping your talents.
I found this video very helpful. Thank you for doing this.
I love this video series but would you consider recording game play footage and then talking over it after? I feel that sometimes you get distracted explaining and maybe you aren't playing as optimally
The point of this series is to get in the mind of someone who is explaining their thought process during the game (some get a bit tough because BoE doesn't have a lot to do, so it gets boring). I do replay recordings with most of my videos though.
Good video, like hearing what you're thinking when playing.
Taking another wave at minute 4:30 after clearing a bruiser camp was a misplay. Your team was fighting 4 vs 5 at that time. That wave could had easily costed you few dead people and an objective if enemy team knew what they were doing.
WAS WAITING FOR THRALL VIDEO!!!
Why is he not spamming his lvl 13 when he is low?
Was about to ask same question, with so low cooldown he could pop it 2 times at 18th minute before his allies ress. @NotParadox getting coached by YT :P
Joshprits That's still unacceptable for a GM player. I mean you would expect these players to use their characters to the maximum potential and not forget something so simple.
The Chill dude while true he is also doing a live commentary while playing the game, prob just a whole bunch of things on his mind
18:01
Well he's american....GM there is Plat/Diamond in EU and Korea.
Same build I use. Thrall is one of my favorite players in the game and he is extremely versatile and I think fits into many comps.
13:01 Diavolo be like
Hello NotParadox, as always, good job on the video. I wish you had more time to put out more content and also that your mistakes as... series had more views.
Getting in the mind of a GrandMaster Kelthuzad next, please, pretty please.
Thank you very much for this build and your knowledge!
20:35 the reason he's Master isn't his ability picks. its his efficiency at getting xp. 21k vs 8, 9, 10k.
Never really played Thrall but he looks like a lot of fun. Might try him out because of this video
Zul'jin cleansed himself, what's weird in that? (11:25)
Also just press D on cooldown, there's no reason not to. Mana, hp and stacks for free.
And why are you using E after wind rush when it gives one for free :o
He's obviously not nearly as experienced and skilled in the game as he thinks he is
if this is the "mind" of a "grandmaster" thrall....
In a unranked game, with 4 friends ;-)
if you have problems with zagara, you have to go heal on one and then E quest build. I asked a thrall player what thrall counters and he said "zagara" xD
nice video bro, wanted to ask, why didnt u used micro steps to freeze the lane and dont get hits from enemy minions by cancel their attack and moving back during minion attack animation? its pretty useful, u can freeze the lane and save hp at the same time. Also sorry for bad english, with love from Russia
It's a minmax thing, If you do it perfectly you stay a bit healthier, but if you make a mistake it doesn't freeze the lane correctly. I don't mind a bit of damage on thrall.
at the end of these videos you should show the score card on the talent tab so we can easily see the build you go. i know you go over it, but having the talent page is a nice way to quickly see it or even screen grab it.
15:40 you could use the Q on structures to let it jump on jaina :)
Btw, you dont lose stacks once the quest is done if you chain lightning twice on the same person.
You do. The quest resets to 0.
Great Video. But a few complaints. You where not using your Level 13 Talent at all. Hit a Building with Q when you cant hit for example jaina. We are not dumb we see what you are doing, i would like to hear more indepeth instead of just speaking about the obvious. Still great Job . Sorry for bad english
Norman Schober Obvious to you may not be obvious to others. I assume that NP is trying to cater his content to a wider audience by explaining everything that he thinks is useful to players of varying skill levels.
Much prefer follow through with double chain lightning plus e talents to close it out.
Great video on one of my favorite heroes!
Could you do a video on how to *win the objective on BoE*? I always struggle with that and it's my worst map by far, because I always lose the immortal.
"getting in the mind of a grandmaster thrall" Kind of cute when he did nothing out of the ordinary. I see gold and diamond thralls do the same thing.
his videos aint bad, but he sometimes doesnt know what hes doing. hes a main healer and claims to be a "GM Thrall" gotta love those "in the mind of a GM...*insert hero* " videos.
Not Para's videos have always been more about the strategic part of the game over gameplay. This isn't a Thral guide it's the mind of a thral player.
my most played hero...but have not played him in a while...i think tomorrow ill try him out again
What about the melee build? I've seen thralls doing a shit ton of damage with that build, even more than with the lightning one. Atleast for me it seems like an anti-melee build that could destroy assassins like Malthael in 2 seconds if not less
How does Zagara counter him exactly? I saw in your Zagara video you would say to just toss the hunter killer on him and he would be "Busy with that" but the hunter killer dies in like, 2-3 hits from him and in that time it will do like, 5% of his hp maybe. This is supposed to be Grandmaster level but when you put the hunter killer on Thrall in that video, he would always run away like it was the most dangerous thing imaginable.
at 17:11 you didn't hit them with sundering to stop their follow up on the ring of frost. do you think it would've made sense to do it in retrospect?
5:20 - the enemy in this match is what i hate to get for a team - they just chase, trying to get kills and totally ignore the objectives. Just see how deep they went... 5:33 they are all out of resources(mana&hp) and lost the immortal which they had a huge lead on.
What's your thought on rolling thunder? It helps you to win the solo lane against heroes like Zagara.
I swear your Trait was up more often than your Q
Probius best boy
really nice video
keep doing thrall vids
please start using e as an AA reset. gives you about half a free aa worth of damage for free (dont use this way when chasing, as aa animation is slower, stopping you in place longer)
These videos are still good even tho there is No hgc
Do you often first pick Thrall? If so, are the opposing team usually trying to counter you?
Yes thrall was my go-to in the solo purely because he is hard to counter and does a little bit of everything. He has a bit of wave clear with low mana costs, poke and burst when needed. Both ults bring a lot of utility. You can play him really safe or really aggressive. He just works in a lot of areas. He does have counters though, just nothing too crazy. I find if you don't play offlane a lot and can't have a wide hero pool in your offlane, then thrall is a good one.
@@NotParadox thrall has quite a few counter picks, like tychus or especially varian* with the reduce heal on E, cassia is also good against him
@@alboforlife18 tychus and varian are hardly picked for sololane on the higher tiers.
Mainly because they dont fit in the larger team comp as well or they are weak teamfighers.
Varian (twin blades) is a good example. It can beat almost everything in sololane. but has a very hard time in teamfights.
Also winning in sololane means denying exp from the other laner by zoning him away or forcing a recall.
Varian cant do this as he needs to attack minions to heal. He always pushes the lane and you cant deny exp like that.
You can play against it exactly as shown in this vid (freezing the lane) and you should be fine.
So yes he is a counter in 1v1 but no it not bad at all if they pick it against you as you can deal with heroes like that by playing smart.
That's exact build I was using to this day with Thrall but please hit the D on cooldown. You missed so much free healing. It's just a 15 sec cd.
I use crash lightining more because people at my rank (gold 3) teamfight a lot more and its more caotic.
I also like malestrom weapon, grace of air and tempest weapon (with mana tide) if we a re a dive comp.
Its hilarious how fast you can take down a squishy when they position poorly. (assuming you land a root)
So, I've been trying other builds for heroes, and on Thrall I tried a Windfury (E) build. And it worked pretty well (in quick match though), do you think it can be viable in some scenario? Like if they have lots of melees and so they will be close to you a lot?
Sgt. Hammer reks thrall on solo lane
I like to use E build thrall I know that's not the best way to play thrall . But when you get some stack you can bet the living shit out of the people and in E build thrall moves so fakin fast
You ever do one of these for Azmodan, Butcher, or Tychus?
4:28
Do I “pretty much” mash my abilities up or down!?
Gotta admit i have no idea why ANYONE picks up the e talent on 13. Its utter garbage and i can prove it mathematically: D is, used on cooldown, a 250% trait heal every 15 seconds while the e is even the lvl 16 quintuple hit still only a single additional trait proc for normal healing every 12 seconds. And you might wanna hang on to your e, and you have to get your AAs off so its not muh worth in poke or escape situations.
So E lvl 13 WITH lvl 16 synergy does, at most, half the healing as the D every 15 seconds (i multiplied the healing from e by 1.25 since 15 seconds is 12 times 1.25)
So yeah, grace is absurdly good, im glad blizz doesnt seem to do the math since they dont nerf it.
Also a super small tip: if you wanna really optimize your burst or make a camp .5 seconds faster, do a normal AA first before using E, since the first AA comes without E nearly as fast as with E, so one looses a teensy bit of DPS. Ofc if the mobility is needed you cannot do that.
2:35 Why is he just running around when the enemy creeps is killing his last few creeps and starts pushing and damaging his towers? His next creep wave is far away so why doesn't he start to attack them so he saves the health of his towers/wall? :o
2:47 You traded evenly? Sure you're both at the same amount of health, but he's taken down 40% of one of the tower's health.
I'm sure he's very good at the game but there seems to me that there's things he could've easily done that would result in the very same situation for him except his tower not going so low that early in the game.
Towers aren't actually that powerful, you know? Additionally, at the start of the game, characters like Thrall want to soak up XP to grow more powerful and affect team fights in substantial ways. The more time you lose defending early game, the slower you reach that "effective" power
13:03 *IT JUST WORKS*
I was getting bored with the heroes I've been spamming. I used to play Thrall a lot I'l have to pick him up again now :D
I sound dumb, but how do you identifying bot? I’ve never known how to.
also, dont you think you can improve autoattack reset with your e ?
How about a video about situations where things keep going wrong while you are doint it right? Like you are creating exp advantage but the team is fighting 4vs5,or even 4vs4 and losing? Or your team takes the boss and instead of pushing with it,goes to do siege camp on your side? Even though you are advising against it.
I did a video on taking trades, can't remember the name. It explained how when you're down a big talent tier don't fight for an objective instead take all the camps. I have a Johanna video coming out soon where I explain how that works when you are with people you don't know.
What do you think about Frostwolf Pack? Is Mana Tide too valuable to not pick?
Pick it when enemies will have many melee heroes.
Pick it 100% if you plan on picking 3rd talent at 16.
Mana tide is super versatile and basically go-to.
Can you imagine scenario where lower CDs on all abilities, more healing from D and more mana aren't useful? :D
Now imagine you also pick ancestral wrath and it's cool down is also lowered.
Or you pick follow through - it will buff your AA even more often!
Why don't you have in-game sounds?
Why you don't use your active trait?
Thrall is ezz mode
them alt tab frames tho.... or frames in general...
You could work on using your ultimate in more meaningful way. Here it was just for burst damage, ignoring its masssive value as AoE instant burst. Your dislike for storm talent upgrade also shows your preference not to use this ultimate in a meaningful way during teamfights to split up enemy teams.
Do you ever go Maelstrom Weapon or is it never worth?
It's not that easy to stack.
If you compare playing through Q with it, you will see with Q it's simply easier to play.
BTW follow through will boost your damage more in most scenarios.
Just count numbers.
how do you like the wolf build?
Gosu
How did you get that mount ?
USE THE D!!!
You do mistake is that you never use your 13 talent, like 2 times i think
And you spam your root instead of keeping it to follow up your tank, I hate assassins that do that when I'm tank omg
i got hard time vs yrel but other then that his strong
He is good but blaze is better utility
Update
So who is this grandmaster player? xD
use ur D heal more often :)
Can we play sometime? 😊
Trumpetgast#2882
First like first view
19:35 Nice Wind Rush promotion just to see you totally waste your E after teleporting.....how can you be a GM?
This guy likes to pretend he has gm skill on every hero. If he plays other champs as badly as he plays Thrall then idk wtf to think
Really nice video, but could've been a little less condescending and pointed out the actual GM mechanics/thoughts. Most of the time you talked about the obvious and gave away general basic tips. Not everyone is bronze, silver or mentally challenged, talk about the things out of the ordinary...
Thrall is one of those heroes that is just to strong, he brings so much for being so easy to play. unbalanced.
Thrall is one of the most balanced heroes in the game lmao
@@CaptainTed i love thrall. Hes one of the heroes i pick when i want an almost sure win. Along with varian, azmo, sonya, Sometimes malthael and guldan too. When i want to have fun i choose genji, alarak, tracer, sometimes hanzo. Im not trying to say the heroes arnt specifically unbalanced. Im trying to say that for the necessary skill shots, risky dives and lack of self heals, some character's are by nature much harder to play at not ussually better damage/usefulness.
Awkward