This is really interesting. Thank you for sharing something so fundamental. I’m atheist - now - but was brought up Anglican Christian and it took a long time to shed all the layers of belief instilled in me. Now, I guess I’m a humanist.
Cool, a couple who are happy and are having fun together! My question that hopefully isn't too personal and pokey is: "Does the title of being a power couple create the good feelings you were expecting even though it is not in a church? How big will your community be to support yourselves?
I'm also Martho, and I know exactly what you're talking about. Growing up around high school, I doubted some of the things that I heard in church, and my parents were really great in explaining things to me. After I got married and had a family it was important that my husband and I bring up our kids in the Martho church. My sister, on the other hand, feels that the Martho church is not the right fit for her family. I think the most important thing is that you both need to do what is right for you both. Church is where two or three are gathered in God's name. Hope you all have a blessed Christmas and a prosperous New Year! PS: Brent, my daughter says your nails are on point. She loves them.😊
I know that I have made similar comments to you before. But I think it is appropriate to express them again on this particular post and subject. I tend to share the views of Professor Dawkins on this matter. I believe that all religions attempt to control people and tell them what to do. Do we really believe that people should be stoned for adultery? Should be sentenced to death for apostasy? Suffer punishment for breaking the Sabbath? Morality should be thought out and reasoned by argument based upon intelligence and our growing knowledge of the universe. We no longer believe in slavery, yet Judaism, Christianity and Islam all did at one time and included rules for their treatment in their canons [bibles]. In our society we believe in equality of women yet our religions at one time did not and even today Islam treats its women as second class citizens. Do we believe that God created man in his own image? That God created the world in 6 days and rested on the seventh? That non-believers will burn in hell? As a result of moral and political reasoning, we believe that people should be kind to animals none of which came from religious canons. It is true that there are parts of the Tanakh (Jewish), Christian Bible and Qur’an (Muslim) that propound acceptably moral points, but these have to be cherry picked from the other violent and unacceptable parts. This modern arrival at moral rectitude has been driven out of a secular debate and is not due to the guidance from religions who all claim to have the moral route to God. I think Atheism means different things to different people, just like the multifarious religions that exist. Many Atheists accept that there is a superior force at work in the universe which is beyond man's comprehension. They certainly don't believe that it is some super ‘man like’ figure sitting somewhere in the sky. They also believe in moral values like do not steal, do not kill, be kind to your neighbour, do unto others as you would have them do unto you, just to quote some of the more familiar tenets. The reason is because these help to create a loving society that gets along with each other even if they are of different ethnic origins. Hate has to be taught unlike love, which is natural. I have as much a right to express my opinion as the religious leaders.
This video popped up on my TH-cam feed and after watching I thought I would offer some points for you two to consider: First, I am truly sorry you have both had rough experiences in the evangelical church. I do not want to make light of the ways in which you have been treated by professing Christians. Second, I have to respectfully disagree with your understanding of what the church is. What is the church? Is the church overall harmful and judgmental, as you say? Or are the churches you have experienced harmful and judgemental? It is important to remember that every church has severe weaknesses, not everyone who goes to church is a genuine Christian, and the values of the church (unity, purity, justice, love, peace, holiness, righteousness, etc.) are diametrically opposed to the values of the world. So it is only right that you should expect some tension! Unfortunately, sometimes Christians misrepresent what the church's mission is and her values and unintentionally hurt those around them. In these cases we pray for the grace to help us seek forgiveness, pursue reconciliation and peace, and desire to walk in humility amongst each other, serving each other in love. The church is the body of Christ. Jesus literally shed His blood for His church! It is a community of weak, lost, immoral people who know their need for a redeemer. It is a community of poor, broken, sinners who have been redeemed from sin and death who have caught a glimpse of the beauty and majesty of Christ and are now progressively being renewed and transformed to look like the Savior! There is so much more I could say but I do not want to belabor myself in this comment section so I will end with a quote from one of my favorite authors. "The church is where I hear the voice of Christ in the Word of God, read and preached, and where I see the promises of His Word visibly displayed in the sacraments of baptism and the Lord's Supper. The church is where my sin is exposed, challenged, and where I am brought to renewed repentance. The church is where I hear - again and again- Christ's commitment to receive me, hold on to me, and make me more like Him. The church is where I see men and women, boys and girls, who model to me holiness and Christlikeness- in sorrow and in joy, in drudgery and in drama, in weakness and in strength. There is no place like the church on earth. And there is no place I would rather be." -Guy Waters So, before you criticize and judge the church, make sure you remember whose church it is: The Lord Jesus Christ's!
I'm a born-again gay Jew and I know Jesus is our Messiah and He's not anti-gay. 1946themovie proves the Bible is mistranslated. Jesus said in Matthew 19:11-12 that we're born this way. Men who don't marry women because of how they're born? That's gays! 1John3:23 sums up Christianity. 1John4:20 is most Christians today, unfortunately. 2Thess2 is here. Trump is lawless. Jesus is coming soon but not one right-wing bigot will rise. Revelation 13:11-16 is USA. The Image of the Beast is right in front of you.
Agreed. BUT the weight of millennia of religious belief, fined down to the last two, does mean a huge majority of ‘believers’ are completely blinkered and feel that the bible - or other religious text(s) - is the ‘proof’. By which token I guess I’d be a Jane Austen-ite or Shakespearean if I were to hold any texts holy! 🤣🤣🤣 In school, we were told, ‘would you walk off a cliff if you were told to by…?’ and no one, clearly, has ever said this to believers about their religious leaders.
Hi Joe and Brent, I sent you both a email on the email that was posted on here and your Instagram. I wrote you an email sharing my story and hoping that I could get your feedback. I tried contacting you on Instagram too but never got response. Hope I hear back from you both. Thanks.
This is really interesting. Thank you for sharing something so fundamental. I’m atheist - now - but was brought up Anglican Christian and it took a long time to shed all the layers of belief instilled in me. Now, I guess I’m a humanist.
Thank you for sharing your experiences and thoughts on this very personal topic!
Cool, a couple who are happy and are having fun together! My question that hopefully isn't too personal and pokey is: "Does the title of being a power couple create the good feelings you were expecting even though it is not in a church? How big will your community be to support yourselves?
I'm also Martho, and I know exactly what you're talking about. Growing up around high school, I doubted some of the things that I heard in church, and my parents were really great in explaining things to me. After I got married and had a family it was important that my husband and I bring up our kids in the Martho church. My sister, on the other hand, feels that the Martho church is not the right fit for her family. I think the most important thing is that you both need to do what is right for you both. Church is where two or three are gathered in God's name. Hope you all have a blessed Christmas and a prosperous New Year!
PS: Brent, my daughter says your nails are on point. She loves them.😊
I know that I have made similar comments to you before. But I think it is appropriate to express them again on this particular post and subject. I tend to share the views of Professor Dawkins on this matter. I believe that all religions attempt to control people and tell them what to do. Do we really believe that people should be stoned for adultery? Should be sentenced to death for apostasy? Suffer punishment for breaking the Sabbath?
Morality should be thought out and reasoned by argument based upon intelligence and our growing knowledge of the universe.
We no longer believe in slavery, yet Judaism, Christianity and Islam all did at one time and included rules for their treatment in their canons [bibles].
In our society we believe in equality of women yet our religions at one time did not and even today Islam treats its women as second class citizens.
Do we believe that God created man in his own image? That God created the world in 6 days and rested on the seventh? That non-believers will burn in hell?
As a result of moral and political reasoning, we believe that people should be kind to animals none of which came from religious canons.
It is true that there are parts of the Tanakh (Jewish), Christian Bible and Qur’an (Muslim) that propound acceptably moral points, but these have to be cherry picked from the other violent and unacceptable parts. This modern arrival at moral rectitude has been driven out of a secular debate and is not due to the guidance from religions who all claim to have the moral route to God.
I think Atheism means different things to different people, just like the multifarious religions that exist.
Many Atheists accept that there is a superior force at work in the universe which is beyond man's comprehension. They certainly don't believe that it is some super ‘man like’ figure sitting somewhere in the sky. They also believe in moral values like do not steal, do not kill, be kind to your neighbour, do unto others as you would have them do unto you, just to quote some of the more familiar tenets. The reason is because these help to create a loving society that gets along with each other even if they are of different ethnic origins. Hate has to be taught unlike love, which is natural.
I have as much a right to express my opinion as the religious leaders.
This video popped up on my TH-cam feed and after watching I thought I would offer some points for you two to consider:
First, I am truly sorry you have both had rough experiences in the evangelical church. I do not want to make light of the ways in which you have been treated by professing Christians.
Second, I have to respectfully disagree with your understanding of what the church is. What is the church? Is the church overall harmful and judgmental, as you say? Or are the churches you have experienced harmful and judgemental?
It is important to remember that every church has severe weaknesses, not everyone who goes to church is a genuine Christian, and the values of the church (unity, purity, justice, love, peace, holiness, righteousness, etc.) are diametrically opposed to the values of the world. So it is only right that you should expect some tension!
Unfortunately, sometimes Christians misrepresent what the church's mission is and her values and unintentionally hurt those around them. In these cases we pray for the grace to help us seek forgiveness, pursue reconciliation and peace, and desire to walk in humility amongst each other, serving each other in love.
The church is the body of Christ. Jesus literally shed His blood for His church! It is a community of weak, lost, immoral people who know their need for a redeemer. It is a community of poor, broken, sinners who have been redeemed from sin and death who have caught a glimpse of the beauty and majesty of Christ and are now progressively being renewed and transformed to look like the Savior!
There is so much more I could say but I do not want to belabor myself in this comment section so I will end with a quote from one of my favorite authors.
"The church is where I hear the voice of Christ in the Word of God, read and preached, and where I see the promises of His Word visibly displayed in the sacraments of baptism and the Lord's Supper. The church is where my sin is exposed, challenged, and where I am brought to renewed repentance. The church is where I hear - again and again- Christ's commitment to receive me, hold on to me, and make me more like Him. The church is where I see men and women, boys and girls, who model to me holiness and Christlikeness- in sorrow and in joy, in drudgery and in drama, in weakness and in strength. There is no place like the church on earth. And there is no place I would rather be." -Guy Waters
So, before you criticize and judge the church, make sure you remember whose church it is: The Lord Jesus Christ's!
I'm a born-again gay Jew and I know Jesus is our Messiah and He's not anti-gay. 1946themovie proves the Bible is mistranslated. Jesus said in Matthew 19:11-12 that we're born this way. Men who don't marry women because of how they're born? That's gays! 1John3:23 sums up Christianity. 1John4:20 is most Christians today, unfortunately. 2Thess2 is here. Trump is lawless. Jesus is coming soon but not one right-wing bigot will rise. Revelation 13:11-16 is USA. The Image of the Beast is right in front of you.
Cute ❤
not having any proof a god exists should be one reason to leave religion.
Agreed. BUT the weight of millennia of religious belief, fined down to the last two, does mean a huge majority of ‘believers’ are completely blinkered and feel that the bible - or other religious text(s) - is the ‘proof’. By which token I guess I’d be a Jane Austen-ite or Shakespearean if I were to hold any texts holy! 🤣🤣🤣 In school, we were told, ‘would you walk off a cliff if you were told to by…?’ and no one, clearly, has ever said this to believers about their religious leaders.
Hi Joe and Brent,
I sent you both a email on the email that was posted on here and your Instagram. I wrote you an email sharing my story and hoping that I could get your feedback. I tried contacting you on Instagram too but never got response. Hope I hear back from you both. Thanks.