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Reminds me of that one story about platinum games. The game testers for one of their games (forgot which one) complained that the game was too hard. in response, the developer made it even harder.
What game
@@GamerBoy870 Bayonetta i think
@@collaterale1 if that's true then it is hard. I still don't understand how you approach the game.
Lol 😂I remember that article PERFECT EXAMPLE 👌
Yeah platinum is petty like that you! 😆
The reason why anime and manga have proven difficult for them to conquer is because of the number of players involved. Japanese video games were easier to crack because all they needed to do was get to either Sony or Nintendo. The closest thing to a single point of failure that anime has, at least in the west, would be a major localization platform like Crunchyroll, but anime fans have always been willing to sail the high seas when translators betray them.
The one good thing about pirate life. Freedom from normie influence.
@@Dinoslay i put 4kids in a more respectable category compared to funi and crunchy by comparison. At least their ignorance was genuine laughable and not hateful.
@LAW nobody is saying that. Obviously they exist since an ideology loud enough is going to turn at least a few heads in a population of millions. But unlike the west they're not the majority rule when it comes to entertainment
If telling people to watch a series in the correct order is gatekeeping, so is telling soneone to pass a driving test before driving a car.
You want to get to the good part ASAP, but you need to do this first.
"Do you want to learn how to drive, or do you just want to uncontrollably plow a car into a wall?"
They call it "gatekeeping" when we don't let them come into our hobby and change everything
Amen to that, its just another word for them to use as Shaming Language.
Yet Normal people(Normies) use the term at points such as people who post on r/gatekeeping
Nice alita pfp
The obvious SJW answer would be everything changes what do you have against changes are you so afraid of them?
To which i can only say no, but not all changes are for the good.
I like miniature painting and know a little about D&D.
So lets use those to to show what good changes might be.
Lets say you wanted to run a campaign in the underdark and you wanted to play a warband of Drows.
Well to do that you would need at the very least 10 different volumes and with most of these volumes only maybe 3 or 4 pages out maybe 50 page volume or something like that.
So a good change might be, can we make a separate book that incorporates all those bits and pieces i need to play in the Underdark, in one large volume.
Sure i might miss out on stats for these and these monsters, but since i play in the under dark and these monsters don´t live there, its not a big loss.
Another might be the rules if i can take a popular meme from the movie Gamers, in D&D 2.0 or 2.5 backstabbing was broken, the backstabbing with a Balista was actually possible with the rules as was written.
So your rouge would be generally op as he/she could basically defeat even the toughest of enemies to death with backstabbing.
so here a good change might be to nerf the stealth and backstabbing rule a little so it isn´t as op.
Last is the miniatures there was a time where they where made out of metal and anyone who has painted or tried to assemble those, knows what a pain in the ass they can be.
So lets say you have a miniature using a whip well the way the miniature is made the handle and the whip is in two pieces and the connection point is only 1mm thick.
This means that almost as soon as you look at the miniature the whip falls of the handle and you basically have to carry around a bottle of superglue all the time to constantly fix it.
Here a change might be could we maybe change the miniature so that instead of the whip and handle being in two pieces it is in one and the arm is the place that needs to be glued on.
The connection point there is at least 3mm meaning that you have a larger surface area to hold the piece of the miniature in place, also you can do other things to make sure it stays where it needs to be.
Later when plastic became something you could cast miniatures in with as much detail as metal, it wouldn´t be out of place to say could we please shift to plastic miniatures instead, they are much easier to assemble and plaint doesn´t chip off them as easily as it does with the metal miniatures.
Also if it falls off the table and onto the floor, it won´t shatter into all the individual pieces of the miniature.
All those things does change the hobby in some aspects, but none of them is malicious or completely changes the hobby beyond recognition.
They will come to your hobby reguardless of what you do. You can try to stop them, but it will do more damage to your own hobby. Just leave the idiots alone and they will leave your hobby
the point of gatekeeping isnt to keep them from consuming the medium, its to keep them from changing the medium
FORREAL
@@jimmesheoniacheeks you are the problem
If the Uzaki wiki is true, then Uzaki isn’t short. The National average height of japanese women is 4’9”. Uzaki is 4’11”.
Woah, I didn't think they were that short in Japan.
In Uzaki she looks short by comparison to her senpai who's supposed to be really tall
4"9 and 4"11 is very short in the US.
@@SuiteLifeofDioBrando no shit sherlock.
@@marunomi Yes Watson
It's hard to take accusations of "gatekeeping" seriously when you see the exact same people whining about this doing the same thing. But even worse.
A normal guy gets into a manga, let's say something Junji Ito made. He tries it, gets creeped out, and decides it's simply not for him. Not a fan of J Horror. He moves on and finds something he likes.
One of these clout chasing weirdoes gets into a manga, once again Junji Ito, and they absolutely meltdown. They'll call it sexist, disgusting, and rally to ban Junji Ito's entire library because it made *them* uncomfortable.
So it gets ruined for everyone, and it's all because some selfish dick didn't like it.
At least for the U.S., the best solution is to have a Japan operated site equivalent to Bookwalker for anime. Twitter mobs can literally call for something to be banned all they want but at least in the U.S. anime is in fact protected under the first amendment. And in fact, even so-called "lolicon" is unless the art meets very specific criteria, which is that it has to fail to meet at least 1 of the following 3 standards 1. It has to have no artistic value 2. It has to have no educational value and or 3. It has to meet the legal definition of obscene. Also, of course, it cannot depict a real child and or person. This is due to an amendment that was made to the Protect Act. While it is a grey area it is almost impossible for even most hentai much less anime to be deemed illegal under the guidelines.
The only reason why those mobs have any power over the stores is that American based companies tend to listen to them. However, even after other stores have removed light novels and Patreon started to ban anime art, they were still available on the Japanese owned sites that operated in other countries like Bookwalker and Pixiv.
I hope, my long post did not seem offputting, I tried to summarize the situation as best I could. I am not sure how I could have put the legal stuff into fewer words. Did what I say make sense?
Also the second these people take over your medium, they immediately start gatekeeping themselves and make sure people who don’t share their worldview feel unwelcome and go out of their way to stop you from entering because they seriously believe companies have a moral obligation not to do business with people who disagree with them.
Raging Golden Eagle's "A hill to die on" rant really sums up why gatekeeping your fandom quickly and fiercely is a required evil.
SJW deserve to be gatekept
@@blastmako05 I do not consider that a evil deed, more of a common sense move to stop a whiny self centered idiot from ruining your fun.
I think Carl/Sargon of Akkad said it best in a recent lotus eaters podcast that they are accusing you of everything they themselves are doing.
We know that once they get into something they start gatekeeping like all hell.
I’m a gatekeeper yes. I wasn’t always a gatekeeper, I’d even recommend animes and mangas to strangers I meet through the internet but when anime started being a trend and guys kept saying “give me a girl who’ll sit down and watch anime with me” girls started coming in and calling themselves “supreme fans” without even watching an anime. For example AOT, the show is trending understandably so but with the semi twisted plots (not rlly lol) people tend to get bored and not watch it but then tell people they have.
The big problem with the gatekeeping argument is that there is absolutely nobody on the anti side. Not a single person. EVERYONE has someone else they want out of the hobby, or at least stuffed under a rock where no one can see them, whether due to political reasons, bad behavior or just shit taste. Even the "anti-gatekeeping" people want to ostracize and remove the people they perceive as gatekeepers.
It sure is easy to muddy up those waters without caution.
And that is why Fate is my favorite anime. I don't have to gatekeep the anime. The anime has done a pretty well job gatekeeping for me with its university-level lore on its magic system and its own character.
^This, but also for Toaru and Monogatari as well.
Yup so glad I got into Fate. Unlike stuff like MHA, Fate is pretty much free of people like thia
The only problem is that if it's suddenly found as "problematic" then it could suffer the same fate as Ishuzoku Reviewers where a company like Funimation will pick it up and then sit on it so it doesn't see distribution. I think they need to have a clause that if a distributor like Funimation picks up a series then they *have* to air it or at the very least release the DVD/Blu-ray or they lose their licence for it.
@@jovenc4508 At this point, I think that Fate makes too much money for western licencees to care. They are only woke when it suits them.
@@liamdell6319
One would think money would be a motivating factor, but they've proven time and again that the message is more important than profit. Look a Marvel and DC as examples. At least DC is getting a house cleaning, but the damage has been done and it's probably irreversable.
They aren't apart of the fandom, they only pretend to be. Funimation and other companies have no passion for the jobs they work or the fans, they simply see a market and wish to profit, reputation be damned. That's why I think Anilog is a good idea. I've been waiting for a direct way to legally watch anime for years, and I feel that I'm not the only one. Will this mean all anime will be on that channel? I doubt it. Will the obscure stuff be on there? I heavily doubt it. But when people say that preserving old anime through pirating sites is stupid, it just doesn't make sense to me. These companies would allow their hard work to be lost to the sands of time instead of giving us a way to watch it. I wouldn't care if they stuck Urusei Yatsura or some other stuff on a BD as they were with no changes than let it get vaulted for no eyes to look upon it ever again.
Unfortunately Anilog isn't an answer for dub lovers. Sorry but I don't like reading. And learning Japanese isn't a solution for me either. It's never gonna be fluent for me. I'm always gonna translating everything said into english and replay what is said in my head and that's a stupid amount of work to enjoy something. I just want to sit and watch the show and listen to it in English.
@@pikalove4337 fortunately most people dont like cringey english dubs
which is a shame because I would show alot of passion and gratitude to the fans for enjoying anime. I think alot of dubbing companies follow the same suite as comic book companies where their staff is just out of touch with their fans. They don't realize what got them careers was fans, people that enjoy the things they were a part of. Now it seems like we're hated because we try to show appreciation for anime or comics. It just doesn't make sense to me tbh.
Gatekeeping exists because people like Mother’s Basement exist. Last time I heard of him he was whining about anime thighs in a show.
Gatekeeping in general requires moderation. Keep out the ones who want to change the medium to conform to their worldview and welcome anyone else who won’t.
how do you get part 7 and 8 right but put giorno before Jonathan
melvinator “Because Part 1 has bad HNK art and I don’t like it.”- Mother’s Basement
Manannan anam I like every single part of jojo and don’t understand what people don’t like about part 1
They should leave the fandom and never return
He complained of thighs... The hypocrisy
The whole Usaki story is a prime example of body shaming.
They attack a character purely based on her look
Is Uzuki even that lewd?
The outrage would be stupid regardless but other than the fact that she has big tits it seems relatively innocent. She isn't even in high/middle school like most other anime sex symbols.
@@doctabaldhead She was used by the Japanese Red Cross to get more people to give blood (which worked) and people got outraged (only in the West) but the Red Cross ignored it later because after getting rid of the promotion the people that give blood dropped and Japan has a shortage of blood donations
Bakemonogatari is an example of a series that gatekeeps itself
A: So, what do you like from your favorite anime?
Shonen fans: I like the fluid animation and battle scenes.
Slice of life fans: I like simple, heartwarming stories
Bakemonogatari fans: I like
*W A L L*
*O F*
*T E X T S*
I mean it's not that hard to figure it out, even if you just watch season one, then two and treat the rest as OVAs.
I mean it's not that hard to figure it out, even if you just watch season one, then two and treat the rest as OVAs.
You mean the series sucks ?
unless you missed your Exel Word and PowerPoint classes then the monogatari series aren't that hard to get into. i did, so can 90% of the human race ever existed. also read the light novels i heard that they're better
8:10 "If people get offended, just keep doing that."
Oh boy with the recent release of Interviewer Species, Dokyuu HH and Uzaki, I think the studios are starting to purposely create those to "offend" them.
They should continue, I'm enjoying some of those series and I want the normals to leave.
Why is gatekeeping inherently bad anyway? Clubs, organizations and businesses do it all the time. Discrimination is not always bad.
To be fair, gatekeeping makes it hard for new fans to enter a fandom. Discouraging them to liking a fandom due to the strict "unwritten rules".
But at the same time, gatekeeping also keep the normies away from defiling said fandom.
So, it has it own weakness/merit.
@@ridwana4037 Well I didn't say its always good either.
If we don't gatekeep then we will have more fandoms like the My Hero Academia Twitter
Alex Player To be quite honest, MHA is the kind of standard shonen anime series meant to be a gateway for young anime fans (both action-loving boys and yaoi-loving girls) to get into - immature and irrational as they are and all that entails. I’m not entirely surprised that there’s icky aspects to its fandom. It’s what it is.
@@astraldirectrix When I mention the MHA Twitter "fandom", I mean the people outraged about everything, that clearly don't like series that they are a "fan" of.
The issue has never been new people coming in, but rather when said people try changing everything to suit their own views and tastes. An issue that's been far too common in the past decade.
If you aren't willing to let fans enjoy something for what it is, don't be surprised when you are not welcome among them.
EXACTLY
Do you guys want a advice?
Consume what you like to consume...
Keep your opnions to yourself or maybe close friends...
Never enter any fandom.
Okay but can we agree to not let normies into our niche hobbies?
Gatekeeping is a good thing. If someone wants to join a community they should learn the culture and integrate. If a community lets just anyone in then that community will change overtime to be unrecognizable, whether it be from dilution or a co-opt.
Of course it is happening for some time now, it is a need to see who really wants to enjoy the content, make something in the Fanbase etc.
Let’s just all accept the fact they want to be part of the fandom to be niche and quirky, everyone wants to be special and be validated for it without even trying to be interested in what they are claiming to be ‘obsessed’ with.
In rome be roman
"Keep making things these people hate" oh hell that's easy, I mean, these people get offended by someone saying a "nasty" word ;3
Hell, simply share a hentai discord/subreddit to these people and they'll freak out x3
Just tell them to visit 177013 and grab the popcorn. Or pass them a tinyurl direct link.
My favorite anime is guaranteed to trigger puritans because one character in it does more cussing by himself than an entire western R rated movie
More cussing than Revy from Black Lagoon?
@@hypershock0storm479 I've never seen Black Lagoon but that's an anime and not a western work
@@defox8929 If you like action anime I'd say give it a watch when you have the time.
@@hypershock0storm479 I already know enough about it to know it's not my thing plus I don't like really violent anime
The only time gate keeping is acceptable, imo, is when it comes to the cultures of fandoms. People watching these things is not the issue, the real problem is when these people come into pre-established communities with pre-established rules, and decide that they are entitled to change everything about these communities for their own agenda, and when people refuse, they shriek 'why are you excluding me. I'm ok with people watching anime or nerd stuff in general, but if you want to actually interact with the community, you need to follow the rules, not act like some sort of colonial explorer that visits a bunch of 'savages' in order to change them for 'the greater good'. And these people don't care about understanding nor do they comprehend the act of moving on and create their own community. This is when gatekeeping is good.
been noticing those people a lot more when it comes to lolis
This people dont really care, they are just kids wanting attention so they say they are and cry, and cry.
So you ignore them or give up and please them.
BUT THEY WOULD NEVER STOP CRYING.
This are kids mentally, and would reduce to grow up, because its easier for them to just CRY.
I'm about to get the studded belt after them
You just roasted the hxh, jojo, fmab, and berserk fandom
Some people should be gatekept, like all the Twitter NPCs.
8:10 This is exactly what I advocate for. If it pisses them off, make more of it. Every time they complain about boob, make them bigger. Every time they say clothes/armour are too skimpy, make them skimpier. If they say the pumps the warrior girl is wearing are unrealistic, change them to platform stilettos. Hopefully they'll eventually claw their own eyes out or give themselves an aneurysm in frustration.
Redo of a Healer can't come fast enough.
Idk, if I found out that my creative product over a children's cartoon had a fanbase that bullied a fan artist almost to suicide, I'd be absolutely furious.
I'd do everything in my power just to spite those fans directly, have that bullied person on that show, give her some creative freedom over it, pay her for her time, show her a good time, reference the fab artsyle heavily in the show even if its against my beliefs just to piss off my own fans and teach them a lesson.
I would actively stab myself multiple ways in the foot just out of spite for that.
Her: I don't at all like this thing
Me: So you don't like this thing?
Her: Stop gatekeeping
I watched detective Conan by starting at episode 750 and went to current. Later on I went back to the beginning to watch the episodes I missed and recently I finished catching up on the older episodes
Gate keeping is fun when it actually keeps its core demographic while laughing at the mob outside.
Indeed aside from the creators needing to make money still.
Forgot Negan was in Tekken
Imagine if PlayStation Allstars returned and Goku and Shrek were playable
Shrek would be way too OP man. That’s why he never gets added.
(Seriously though Shrek would be a cool addition to any game).
Manannan anam are you insane?!?! There isn’t a console or computer powerful enough to handle so much power!!!
On one hand I find gatekeeping pretty dumb. I also find it dumb to let people try and control your hobbies as well. You shouldn't feel bad because someone online said you weren't a true fan because of arbritrary reasons. Life is too short to let others control how you feel. It's not worth the hassle. It's also not worth throwing a fit when people tell you to watch something in order to get the full context. I think the main issue is that people have confused being a jerk with telling people basic information. I can't believe we live in a time in which telling someone to start at the beginning is the equivalent of making fun of someone for not having the most amount of knowledge possible. It's stupid. Plain and simple.
I say this all the time for dark/horror BL. If you like it, cool. If you hate it, cool.
But don't be pushing your opinions on others (or making assumptions), especially if you cry when people do it to you
You enjoy what you love, if other people hate it then at least you gate-keep the people who don't like it out of your entertainment.
Tell them to find something they enjoy, and if they still have a hissy fit, then they can't find something they personally enjoy.
If we talk about anime people in west gets offended from everything.
Life is strange 2 have teen sex scene, where are these people? Why are Australia didn't ban that game? What is this double standards?
Wait what?
OK now I'm glad I skipped LiS 2
Thank you for saving me money when I was thinking of series I haven't finished
@@anotherinternetperson8495
Both LiS 1 and 2 have underage sex scenes in them. Obviously this is ignoring a lot of context, but the point still stands.
Weirdoes will freak out over anime titties, yet go dead silent when Game of Thrones shows violent rape and torture.
@@TheAlmightyLoli game if thrones are ok, meanwhile goblin slayer -> outrage.
I hate they double standards.
If I want to get a fan into something gargantuan such as say.... Gundam, I suggest one of two things. Either pick up one of the alternate timelines (other than SEED) or start with Mobile Suit Gundam The Origin. Namely with The Origin is it gives you the set up for Universal Century without having to rely solely on the 1979 original series or its much improves movie trilogy reworking (now available on Gundam.info for free) There are multiple gates and they each are a valid way to approach it. After that the order in which you watch Universal Century series matters very little.
If I started with Gundam Wing, then got into G Gundam, and then dipped my toes into the OG Mobile Suit Gundam, can I still be a fan? G Gundam is cool right?
@@kazineverwind5267 ....they are both alternate timeline series.... Jack ass
Yeah, gate-keeping is absolutely annoying. I really hate it when someone flat out tells people that their opinions are the definitive answer to any form of fictional media, and acts like nobody else's opinions matter which is just wrong. Pointing out flaws, and giving valid criticisms is isn't gate-keeping, criticizing people that loves any form of fictional media is gate-keeping. Exactly! If people get offended over fictional content that's not for them, GOOD! It means you're doing an amazing job not giving into their stupidity! If my created video game(s) was/were triggering people, then it shows that they're not the targeted audience for my work, and would NEVER stoop so low as to censor my game(s)! I have heard about the recent news of KissAnime, and KissManga, and, it sucks, and, I know there are some people that are happy that they're both gone forever like CBR posted in their recent article about KissAnime being shutdown is a "good thing": www.cbr.com/kissanime-is-dead-and-it-deserved-to-die/ yes, they even defend garbage services like Crunchyroll, and Funimation, like, of course, they would...! Fuck CBR...!
Oh, and, I'm not a fan of Mother's Basement either as I just don't find him to be a very good anime TH-camr at all
I think gatekeeping in this context is not about blocking acess to the media, but about being against changes that cater to mass appeal.
Closed gate = niche appeal. Open gate = mass appeal.
The pragmatic way to do that is banning this type of discussion from online communities.
The problem is that the weebs simply don't fight back. Except for very few and even fewer when you exclude TH-camrs. We saw this after this whole Trap deal where the far majority stuck around on the old sub reddit and even on the new the Trojan horse of otonoke was actually the Japanese word for trans was only challenged by like 5 people. Despite that it would take 2 mins on Google to figure out it was bullshit.
The fact people are so afraid of being called out on the internet is why we are in this situation in the first place, sorry for the bitter pill, but that is how it is, you can't rely on companies as they will follow the money and percieved majority, which are the SJWs.
Boom! Exactly!! I've had enough conversations with people where you can show them all the steps, a myriad of examples, and they will still refuse to acknowledge and engage. They will sooner let everything fall into ruin before even remotely, whisper any sort of skepticism of the changes the invasive element puts into effect. It's like Angry Joe. Where all the bad shit is bubbling over the pot, you can't ignore it anymore, and you know where it's coming from. They followed the string/thread its attached to, they saw it, and when asked "what is it attached to?" they will refuse to openly say it.
@LAW Exactly!
Another example would be PewDiePie and that one "artist" on Twitter who found out that PewDiePie listens to "his" music and told him to stop listening to him.
if someone demands a franchise to what can only be described as "going woke" or defends a franchise doing it, its not a true fan but a fandom colonizer
You’re gatekeeping my gatekeeping!
I'm not elitist, but people who play Persona are subhuman. That doesn't mean I hate them. I just recognize them for what they are, a different species that is inferior in many ways. This is proved by the fact that we would have wiped them out if we hadn't decided not to. That's just how natural selection works, less fit species die out in competition.
And before you ask, no, I don't support SMT fans reproducing with persona fans. Not only is it unethical to have a child that you know will have a low IQ, and be less moral, it's basically bestiality because they're a different species.
Sorry for the long rant, I'm just tired of people calling me a bad person because I'm not afraid to say what everyone already knows.
Be honest here: Persona 1 and 2 fans are genuinely different from the crop that came after P3 (which can be differently classified as the fandom shift wasn't nearly as apparent until P4Golden and P5). Persona 1 and 2 shared more in common with SMT than their predecessors did, and that can be narrowed down to the series finally getting its own identity. And while that in and of itself is not a bad thing on its own, I would have preferred that it kept more of the darkness and macabre that permeated the originals.
In short, the series needs Kazuma Kaneko back on art design, and probably the writers they nixed in between the shift.
@@Starphoenix Nah, as a P2 fan I can confirm that most are fans of P3-5 as well and probably started with either P5 or P4
Mother's Basement was always a tool.
It not
People be parading around Fate and Monogatari as if only high IQ geniuses are capable of watching it when in reality it's no different from watching so called plebian long running anime but with 5 minute of research added to figure out the order.
Watching JoJo chronologically = you get background on what characters in later parts are talking about
Part skipping = you are either having fun or are just a dirty hethan (Joking, Joking)
The police officer illustration in the thumbnail gave me flashbacks to when there was that troll group called "Utube Troll Police" who pretended to be police officers and trolled people using the same 7 lines over again.
Such classics were: "ALL TROLLS WILL BE DETAINED", "LET'S GET THESE RASCALS", "FIRST WARNING" and "UTUBETROLLPOLICE"
Unrelated to the video, but those were the simpler days...
I disagree with most of the thing you said here. Specially that last part. "Yea, keep making that thing, remind them that this isn't for them!" Do you think this will not have consequences? Do I have to remind you what happens when mainstream people or a collective doesnt like something? They demonise it, they go to the point of harrasing other people that are enjoying their stuff without doing harm to anyone.
Hell, recently a guy that had a car with a Uzaki-chan picture got people so triggered they started trowing eggs at it
If someone threw eggs on my car just cut i had a picture of an anime character they don't like i will shoot em
They can die for all i care
Japan also has strict anti prostitution laws resulting in whats probably the weirdest red light industry there is...
....what im saying is i look forward to the japanese ingunuity to circumvent this laws in a true japanese manner
Action instead of words, that is the most effective and simple solution to everything. A good video
The other issue is that they only watch target shounen anime that is targeted at teenage boys and never look the other genres of anime that target different demographics like shoujo and seinen anime
Same for Josei, Shounen ai or Shoujo Ai, along with Mecha, And a list of other genres or themes.
I thought your solution would be to have Xiaoyu apply her combo on them. Repeatedly.
Imma be real it's the western fandom that tend to ruin my fun in enjoying anime and games because all they want to talk about is the lack of alphabet and diversity REPRESENTATION and ships and the "bad things happen to these characters therefore creators are bad people" rhetoric that makes me want to question the education level of Americans in general.
I don't get the representation thing. Anime had gay, lesbian and trans characters for decades before the west started making it an almost required thing and it would be pretty weird to expect constant minority representation in a country that is 98% ethnic Japanese.
Twitter warriors just can't fathom that there is an entire world with different values and that it doesn't revolve around them.
Then just ignore them. Its what i do.
@@pheunithpsychic-watertype9881 You kind of can't. The loud minority screeches until things change for them. Hence things like Marvel comics self-destructing over the last few years.
With anime thankfully we are probably good because Americans aren't the primary audience but western scenes (tabletop games, video games, cartoons, comics, ect) are getting fucked left and right.
@@doctabaldhead i know. Thats why i gave up on them for alternatives like anime/manga/manwha/eastern video games/old media.
One thing we all have to keep in mind is that when fighting against a problem not to start doing it ourselves. Something that is easier said than done given the state of things. One side trying to force unreasonable changes that don't make sense and causing the other to become so defense as to rejet or consider any type of change out of fear of what may or may be attached to that.
Gatekeeping exists for the same reason you lock your front door.
Personally I don't mind JoJo part skippers. Each JoJo part is very self contained. It does borrow continuity from other parts but if you're not looking for the COMPLETE EXPERIENCE then you can skip parts, since each parts is their own story and sometimes even a WHOLE difference genre. If you don't like Slice of Life/Mystery and want to skip Part 4 for example, it's fair.
However, I think if someone does that they can't complain about stuff plot related because many payoffs only work by watching the whole thing. But that will be their problems in arguments. As long they knowlodge their argumentation is weaker due the fact they skipped parts, all is good.
I consider gate keeping useless. Since when did introverts require validation from others to do their hobbies?
This is pretty true honestly.
They can't even properly articulate why they even watch the shows so it does it self when you start a conversation and they just run off into something completely irrelevant. Why they simply hate something so fundamentally integral to what ever material is being addressed and basically warp it into completely something else rather than transforming it into the next natural step of either exposition, more content or revelations and correlations and include even more speculation that just adds onto the wonder of the world and not take it away so you can act like you found something amazing when it's already been found. Most of the things non-fans wants are basically retcons, spinoffs character breaks to character shifts and character design change in every second that completely shatters the immersion so much you can't even have a favorite one without it being a watered down version of something better you once remembered eating you from the memory.
I honestly never felt like the clonewars or rebels cg starwar series were even that great despite how much praise it gets from actual fans the same goes for mandalorian, none of the world feels big enough to challenge and none of their stories ever feel like they ever pushback the viewer they only push you down into a hole.
Ishuzoku is a great example of what we need more of.
unless you are one of those game companies that ban people from playing a game online for wrongthink, they CAN gate keep you XD
I'd say _"If you don't like what most people do like, deal with it."_
That's the best "gate" I can think of.
I watched Part 3 first, as I wanted to see ghosts punch the shit out of people. At the end I thought "That was great! That DIO guy is cool! How did he get where he was?" Then I saw Part 2 existed and I was like "AAAAAHH SHIT! Badass Joseph Joestar?! Count me in!"
To this day, I still haven't fully watched Part 1. I keep being distracted by ghosts beating people up. I know I'm a cretin, but Part 3 is the part that drew me in to JoJo's.
8:59 Correct
Watched it all the time with my sister, I blame her for what I have become.
I feel like Uzaki is bland because the environments are bland and are barely detailed. Hopefully they fix that in the BD release.
@Janeiro I Yeah, which is why I will wait for the BD release to see if I will buy it. Otherwise I'll stick to the manga.
2 thumbs WAAAY up👍👍 for this eye-opening video Appa!
watching/reading JoJo out of order is a sin
the title is literally impossible
Its possible. You just needs to have guts to pull it off.
@@bryanmerel agreed
What title?
As much as I like the "keep making what they don't like" idea.. these people have enough sway to make what they don't like illegal.. which is of course the real reason why this twitter drama begins. We know what it leads to and desperately try to stop it the moment its tweeted.
Honestly I totally understand part skipping when it comes to part 3. It is a brick wall to get through, I didn't skip to 4 because I wanted to preserve that for a later experience, but I wont lie, I took a two month break in or around "The Sun" because it got to stale, totally get it.
Outside of that, I think it's also cool to skip part 1-6 to part 7. You wont get the call backs but it stands all buy itself.
Someone can watch/read jojo anyway they want. The only reason I advise against part skipping is it makes multipart character arcs like Dio and Jotaro's make a lot less sense even though they are well written and it totally takes the hype out of moments like Joseph in part for and especially Polnerff in part 5.
Watch it anyway you want. Each part stands up on it's own to be enjoyed in a vacuum, but you do miss out on some truly epic moments if you skip around. Anyone who enjoys jojo, is a fan a jojo.
So, just ignore them til they leave. Works for me. 😋
I think the best way to gatekeep is really to warn people about the aspects of a game or story that they may not like, such as how the blades in Xenoblade 2 are sexualized with no way for the player to tone it down and that you need either have "high iq" or to go out of your way to watch youtube videos about the combat to truly understand and have fun with it. I can enjoy the combat and fanservice of that game, but if others don't I understand that the game simply isn't gonna be right for them. If they ignore my warnings or see them as green flags then I can just let the cards land where they land and later see if they enjoyed it.
I think gate keeping is to keep out those people who are not real fans, but want to bring stuff like social justice into the hobby, like they did in many other places. The fandom here is also not so much important but the creators and the platforms where the fans gather are. If these are corrupted, that is when we get stuff like The Last Jedi, Prometheus, Pacific Rim 2, Jurassic World 1-2, Mass Effect Andromeda, The Last Of Us 2, etc.
My take on gate keepimg is that anyone can come and enjoy said product bit cannot change said product to more suit them to the point of it no longer being enjoyable from its original point
I agree, keep making the things that make them rage and then laugh at them because that's all they deserve.
So basically we need to tell the outrage mobs: " *You have no power here* "
Oh and yes after this video watch Appabend's other video about Juices becoming water because no one needs to be offended by drinking orange juice drink water
gatekeeping does work when you show people what the fandom is really all about
when you show people that shooting games are about shooting, and how the majority of people who play them like shooting and winning, those who like losing and not shooting will be less inclined to play
when you show people that certain forms of media have lots of sex and violence, those who do not like sex and violence will be less inclined to take part in the media
its not about saying "get out" its more about "this isn't yours, you are not a part of this, you will never be a part of this, you are trying to change what it is because you're too stupid to enjoy it as it comes, you are not welcome and will be treated as an outsider until you quit griping and learn our ways"
There are 2 very distinct types of gatekeeping that are very prominent.
Those that want to keep the medium the same without experimentation.
Example would be anime clubs in the early 90s who were not really sure if they were keen on anime becoming officially licensed and consumed unmassed because it would be in the hands of those that don't understand anime.
And the second gatekeepers that have a vision on what the medium should be.
The medium must change to be a certain way.
Example is the progressive side that desires anime to be fit certain "standards" that they deem acceptable
Both are inflexible and annoying
7:30 - This picture represents something I am thinking about regarding Gatekeeping. The only form of acceptable Gatekeeping, is the exclusion of people from closed groups (In other words, something they have access to, versus something they don't). If you had a group of friends that you played games with, and someone wanted in, what do you do? Let them in? Test them out to see if they click with your group? Say no to start with? What if you kick them out afterwards?
A good example of the kind of Gatekeeping I am talking about, would be invitational clubs with bouncers and the like, or perhaps, Dungeons and Dragons sessions. There are a lot of these kinds of things that should be closed to outsiders (and for good reason), but here's the thing, they can start their own DnD Campaign without you.
Gatekeeping, from what I've seen, is basically summed up as "Forcibly trying to prevent other people from enjoying things that they want to try to enjoy". Take speedrunners as an example. They play video games differently than regular people. They seem to enjoy it too. Just because they play it differently, does that mean that they should be excluded from liking what they do? No. Anybody that tries to force that, is Gatekeeping.
Like Appa said, it's like harassment/bullying. It's really difficult to prevent people from enjoying what they want to enjoy.
There is good Gatekeeping, and there is bad Gatekeeping. I don't know how many people realize this.
Uzaki Chan is fun but yeah it's not that good. Still it's fun lol. But to each their own Appabend ^^ also great points all around indeed
We need to get this video into the hands of the Senran Kagura team as well as bash Team Ninja over the head with it Clockwork Orange style.
Gatekeeping is good. Change my mind.
When I hear discussions about gate keeping that is pretty much the strategy that I hear.
The issue seems to be in finding a more appropriate term.
Like, "normie scaring" or other...
You know what we can gatekeeping we have to establish the fandom first and beat them to the punch. We should demand more edgy stuff that scare the normies away.
gatekeeping is not a solution to cleanse these sociopaths
calling out is
close ranks and don't capitulate to bullying
I hate Gatekeeping. It like that I love the Avatar Series. But have to keep that I love Legend of Korra over the Last Airbender a secret. But I really like Avatar: The Last Airbender. I like the characters in the show, the world. There's a lot that I like about The Last Airbender. But I love Korra more. But I have to keep that fact a secret because I tell anyone, then I will be Gatekeep and not be called a "Real" fan. The one thing that I'm afraid of is that if I tell anyone. They will do some I call the the "Look". They will look at you and say right and roll their eyes. The moment they do then it mean that they won't accept you in to the group. So you've got to stuff about you like a secret. I hate Gatekeeping and I'm glad that it's being called out more.
*ARE YOU APPROACHING ME APPA !?*
Gatekeeping is good, actually
I actually agree, make the product as niche as possible so less people are clamoring over it. Some anime like Monogatari series are gatekept by heavy dialogues and throws concept willy nilly (not to mention it is almost impossible to eng dub monogatari series unless soulless bad dubs that goes word for word even when compared to other better eng dub animes are your thing), same as some titles in the Nasuverse where heavy concept are thrown here and there like El Melloi 2 case files anime for example. However the creators can only do so much niche content that mainstream attention will ignore, eventually the mainstream attention will get there.
case and point? Persona. i started since Persona 3, then came 4 which is still kind of niche to a certain extent, Then came 5 which i think is the amalgamations of lessons learned from 1 to 4 and since it's anime visuals it also attracts anime fans that kinda goes mainstream at the time of release. in the end we can all gatekeep in whatever fashion but eventually mainstream attention will go there.
Would like to see you debate RGE on gatekeeping
The most insane thing is that when the companies capitulate to their demands the new demographic wont even consume the media they wanted to be changed.
But then what is gatekeeping yuri?
NGL, I don't watch anime and I agree. It's your thing and as a person who doesn't even care about watching anime, I have no right say what should and should not be shown/said within the media. Don't make the same mistake what games/movies/TV shows/comics/sports/etc.
But if you do make the same mistake... all I ask to make some more English dubbed versions of shows please.
Are elitists even real fans? I swear new fans who are actually interested in anime are way more of a real fans than elitists
Dear Appa, can I know the comic you used as a point's?
Appabend: shortstack respecter
This is a rhetorical question, but how does recommending an order to watch things so that you get more enjoyment out of them a way of trying to keep people out? I don't watch Jojo so forgive me if I make an assumption, but wouldnt watching them in order give you a different appreciation and understanding than that of watching them in any order?
As for an example that I can actually talk about, a friend told me to watch FMA 03 before watching Brotherhood, so I did. I can agree that this was the right decision, and I enjoyed both so much that I watched them both again right after watching them the first time. Being able to appreciate their differences and having some context made the experience much better, and if I watched Brotherhood first I would have likely been turned off a bit by 03 being a larger chunk of what was condensed in Brotherhood. That isn't trying to keep me out, it's giving me a recommended order so that I can enjoy both more.
Jojo parts are mostly self-contained, but they're also sequals to one another. Not watching them chronologically will make no sense. In the order made by MB, you are literally spoiling yourself the ending of some parts. I don't understand why is it hard to watch them in the correct order. You're not going to watch Game of Thrones starting with season 4, then 2, 5, half of 3, 1, rest of 3, 6, 7, 8. FMAB is a remake of FMA 03, so you can watch it without seeing the original, but 03 first is better. If not, your experience of FMAB will be the same, but of 03 will suffer. Meanwhile with Jojo you will be confused about what's happening for what? Ending the series with the DIO fight. To put it into an FMAB context, you watch it in a a weird order to end with the Envy fight. You ruin your experience to end with the most anticipated fight.
Sorry for the wall of text.
TL;DR: Watch Jojo in order
Isn't this where the issue comes in that when you try to eject these toxic nu-fans from the fandom they are already entrenched enough to just change things in localization so that people like them can keep enjoying it over the actual target demographic?
well said