There is something important about the 16th century English of the KJV, I'm from Spain and in my opinion modern English lacks something. After knowing about the KJV I immediate knew what was it... The Thy, thou, thee, Ye, etc. They added a lot of context to the text, it was a lot easier to understand, it wasn't just you,you,you all the time. All people need is to memorize the meaning of a few words of that time and that's it, the moment you understand what those words mean then everything becomes very easy. I am convinced what Tyndale said to that catholic priest became true, "I will make sure a simple plowboy knows more than you about the scriptures".
Technically, the KJV is written in Early Modern English. Some of the characters you don't understand from Old English (like thorn) were in the original 1611 AV (I recommend Oxford's Quarter centenary Edition to see these), but modern editions of the KJV clean them up, i.e. ye to the, yt to that, etc.
Flipping through some pages of the 1611 with the gothic typeface. I do not see Thorns in it. Do you have a source for that? I'd be interested in looking at it.
@@DaneKristjan Thorn appears in its later form "y" in the AV, with an e or t above it, as opposed to the earlier "Þ" form - see Acts 19:28,35. I am not aware of any printed English Bibles that used the form "Þ".
Old English is pure Germanic, Anglo Saxon language. Almost totally unintelligible today. Old English died out around 1100. Middle English is closer but they use so many words that are archaic and pronunciations that are not in any English dialect today that if read or spoken it would be extremely difficult to understand. The KJV was written in what is known as Early Modern English. The spelling wasn't standardized in 1611 which makes it awkward to read but nevertheless it is entirely possible to read a 1611 with no issues. I've never heard of someone who did not know what the words "thee, thou, thy, thine, and ye" meant. It isn't hard to learn. I knew those words even as a child I had no issues understanding them. People who make a big deal about those are usually just lazy.
So I watched a video of Mark Ward on RFP in which he talks about these people he was witnessing to that couldn't understand the KJV. I believe it's episode 2 of 4 (I'm not sure so forgive me if I'm wrong). Anyhow, it seems very clear these people he referred to had a basic lack of literacy overall. So just practically should it be the mission of the Church to denigrate the Word of God to everyone's understanding? And what would be his scriptural authority to suppose so? Enjoying the channel brother and God bless you!
I learned the KJV in church when I was less then 10 years old and I wasn't exactly an honor roll student. Which is why I've never understood why so many willingly accept these arguments. That's basically saying don't read the KJV, because your to stupid too, it's insulting problem is the audience of people like Mark Ward don't realize their being insulted.
I read the KJV, the NKJV and MEV on a regular basis, all three are based on the TR and though I wish Passio would update the MEV, it's still a solid translation, hiccups notwithstanding. Hands down, the KJV is the most difficult to read and while it can be understood, it takes more effort. I use the Strongs and other lexicons all the time to find the meanings of difficult words in the KJV, something that doesn't have to be done quite as often with the other translations. Maybe I'm missing something, I haven't viewed many videos from your channel, is your position KJV only? I only ask to get a frame of reference. I'm most definitely TR preferred, but not dogmatically so. God bless you and your efforts for the Lord
The moment you learn what an old word means you don't forget it. Is not that hard, is just new for our brain, because nobody taught us those words in school, only on historical movies and books, and society always mocks everything that is old so, today anything old is looked at with disdain. Personally, I am dogmatic about it, I reject anything outside of the TR. Is black or white for me, is either the word of God or something else, and i don't want something else similar to the word of God but not quite and full of changes. I pray people realize how dangerous is to open the door to false doctrine, anything can happen. Is a matter of faith too, it makes zero sense to believe that God allowed his word to be lost after promising that he would preserve it forever and without changes just to be rediscovered later by dubious friends of the Vatican with very unbiblical beliefs and changed 28 times and counting. Where is the faith in God? I believe he preserved his word, and is perfectly translated. We don't need new discoveries, we don't need to add, change or subtract anything, God is perfectly capable of keeping his promises, no doubt about it Trying to save a brother from error is not a bad thing, who knows what those errors can lead them to if nobody says anything. I know someone who now believes all bibles are corrupt and only the original Hebrew and Greek are the truth, but he doesn't care about the textual criticism debate so he doesn't care WHAT hebrew and greek manuscripts, he thinks all Greek new testaments are the same, and no matter how much i try to talk to him about this he don't want to listen, in fact he mocks me now for believing my spanish Reina Valera 1602 (TR) is the word of God, he also mocks the 16th century reformers and says he ows them nothing, he also believes we must go back to the law to be perfectly sure of our salvation, making the gospel Jesus + judaizing works. Correcting the error of someone else could be the difference between a lose of faith in the gospel or not. If we don't say anything, i guarantee you, those who are getting far from God will only get farther and farther away.
And by the way brother Desoto, thank you for guiding people back to the inerrant word of God and make them stronger in their faith as a result. And thank the Holy Spirit of God for guiding you. The remnant may be small, but always strong in faith.
it is unbelievable that there still are some who say that the KJV is "old English" ... but i'm sure most just mean that it is old English in the sense of it being the English of hundreds of years ago or something, and are not using the term correctly.... but it's inexcusable when pastors or apologists or people from the platform in a church say that ... see Luke 6.3 (Wycliffe 1382) "And Jhesus answeride, and seide to hem, Han ye not redde, what Dauith dide, whanne he hungride, and thei that weren with hym;" - Luke 6.3 (KJV) "And Jesus answering them said, Have ye not read so much as this, what David did, when himself was an hungred, and they which were with him;" .... if we compare these two, we note that even in Middle English (Wycliffe 1382) it is mostly the spelling that is different from the KJV and modern English ... and of course there are some words in other passages that are more difficult than this... - thanks... :)
Don't get me wrong I am not being arrogant I have an average IQ but I could understand the kjv right away it wasn't hard to learn the old words it was obvious that thou, thee, ye are different ways to say you that you can understand whether it is singular or plural. Second the context helps you understand the old words that are not understood. Betwixt for example is another way to say between. Another word is verily is truly. Ensample is following the example of more than one person. Correct me if I am wrong on that one. Finally my children understand the kjv just fine, they actually like it better than the other versions my 5 year old son likes the thee and thou so hard to read just pay attention to the context it may be easier to catch on to what is being said. God bless you all
The problem is not the KJV, the problem is that schools are churning out too many people that can’t read. It saddens me to see young people struggling to read something that should be easy. Our education system is a complete failure. Most homeschooled kids I know can read at a much higher level than anyone coming out of the public schools.
Thanks for checking out this video! For more articles related to this topic, follow this link youngtextlessreformed.com/category/mark-ward-authorized/
Thank you for this. I get so tired when people say the english is the hard part.
There is something important about the 16th century English of the KJV, I'm from Spain and in my opinion modern English lacks something. After knowing about the KJV I immediate knew what was it... The Thy, thou, thee, Ye, etc. They added a lot of context to the text, it was a lot easier to understand, it wasn't just you,you,you all the time. All people need is to memorize the meaning of a few words of that time and that's it, the moment you understand what those words mean then everything becomes very easy.
I am convinced what Tyndale said to that catholic priest became true, "I will make sure a simple plowboy knows more than you about the scriptures".
Unrelated to the subject of the video but I notice the Steam logo in your taskbar... whaddya play?
Technically, the KJV is written in Early Modern English. Some of the characters you don't understand from Old English (like thorn) were in the original 1611 AV (I recommend Oxford's Quarter centenary Edition to see these), but modern editions of the KJV clean them up, i.e. ye to the, yt to that, etc.
Yep. If we take the standard KJV that everybody uses, it is almost entirely modern with a few exceptions.
@@theyoungtextlessandreforme7113 I agree fully.
Can you support the assertion that the KJV has the character thorn in it. English type printers did not have that letter as far as I'm aware.
Flipping through some pages of the 1611 with the gothic typeface. I do not see Thorns in it. Do you have a source for that? I'd be interested in looking at it.
@@DaneKristjan Thorn appears in its later form "y" in the AV, with an e or t above it, as opposed to the earlier "Þ" form - see Acts 19:28,35. I am not aware of any printed English Bibles that used the form "Þ".
Old English is pure Germanic, Anglo Saxon language. Almost totally unintelligible today. Old English died out around 1100. Middle English is closer but they use so many words that are archaic and pronunciations that are not in any English dialect today that if read or spoken it would be extremely difficult to understand. The KJV was written in what is known as Early Modern English. The spelling wasn't standardized in 1611 which makes it awkward to read but nevertheless it is entirely possible to read a 1611 with no issues. I've never heard of someone who did not know what the words "thee, thou, thy, thine, and ye" meant. It isn't hard to learn. I knew those words even as a child I had no issues understanding them. People who make a big deal about those are usually just lazy.
So I watched a video of Mark Ward on RFP in which he talks about these people he was witnessing to that couldn't understand the KJV. I believe it's episode 2 of 4 (I'm not sure so forgive me if I'm wrong). Anyhow, it seems very clear these people he referred to had a basic lack of literacy overall. So just practically should it be the mission of the Church to denigrate the Word of God to everyone's understanding? And what would be his scriptural authority to suppose so? Enjoying the channel brother and God bless you!
If I've learned anything about Mark Ward it's that either his friends are very stupid, or he thinks they are very stupid.
I learned the KJV in church when I was less then 10 years old and I wasn't exactly an honor roll student. Which is why I've never understood why so many willingly accept these arguments. That's basically saying don't read the KJV, because your to stupid too, it's insulting problem is the audience of people like Mark Ward don't realize their being insulted.
I read the KJV, the NKJV and MEV on a regular basis, all three are based on the TR and though I wish Passio would update the MEV, it's still a solid translation, hiccups notwithstanding. Hands down, the KJV is the most difficult to read and while it can be understood, it takes more effort. I use the Strongs and other lexicons all the time to find the meanings of difficult words in the KJV, something that doesn't have to be done quite as often with the other translations. Maybe I'm missing something, I haven't viewed many videos from your channel, is your position KJV only? I only ask to get a frame of reference. I'm most definitely TR preferred, but not dogmatically so. God bless you and your efforts for the Lord
The moment you learn what an old word means you don't forget it. Is not that hard, is just new for our brain, because nobody taught us those words in school, only on historical movies and books, and society always mocks everything that is old so, today anything old is looked at with disdain.
Personally, I am dogmatic about it, I reject anything outside of the TR. Is black or white for me, is either the word of God or something else, and i don't want something else similar to the word of God but not quite and full of changes. I pray people realize how dangerous is to open the door to false doctrine, anything can happen. Is a matter of faith too, it makes zero sense to believe that God allowed his word to be lost after promising that he would preserve it forever and without changes just to be rediscovered later by dubious friends of the Vatican with very unbiblical beliefs and changed 28 times and counting. Where is the faith in God? I believe he preserved his word, and is perfectly translated. We don't need new discoveries, we don't need to add, change or subtract anything, God is perfectly capable of keeping his promises, no doubt about it
Trying to save a brother from error is not a bad thing, who knows what those errors can lead them to if nobody says anything. I know someone who now believes all bibles are corrupt and only the original Hebrew and Greek are the truth, but he doesn't care about the textual criticism debate so he doesn't care WHAT hebrew and greek manuscripts, he thinks all Greek new testaments are the same, and no matter how much i try to talk to him about this he don't want to listen, in fact he mocks me now for believing my spanish Reina Valera 1602 (TR) is the word of God, he also mocks the 16th century reformers and says he ows them nothing, he also believes we must go back to the law to be perfectly sure of our salvation, making the gospel Jesus + judaizing works.
Correcting the error of someone else could be the difference between a lose of faith in the gospel or not. If we don't say anything, i guarantee you, those who are getting far from God will only get farther and farther away.
And by the way brother Desoto, thank you for guiding people back to the inerrant word of God and make them stronger in their faith as a result. And thank the Holy Spirit of God for guiding you.
The remnant may be small, but always strong in faith.
Exactly. It's crazy how dishonest everyone is to pretend the bible is hard to read.
it is unbelievable that there still are some who say that the KJV is "old English" ... but i'm sure most just mean that it is old English in the sense of it being the English of hundreds of years ago or something, and are not using the term correctly.... but it's inexcusable when pastors or apologists or people from the platform in a church say that ... see Luke 6.3 (Wycliffe 1382) "And Jhesus answeride, and seide to hem, Han ye not redde, what Dauith dide, whanne he hungride, and thei that weren with hym;" - Luke 6.3 (KJV) "And Jesus answering them said, Have ye not read so much as this, what
David did, when himself was an hungred, and they which were with him;" .... if we compare these two, we note that even in Middle English (Wycliffe 1382) it is mostly the spelling that is different from the KJV and modern English ... and of course there are some words in other passages that are more difficult than this... - thanks... :)
Don't get me wrong I am not being arrogant I have an average IQ but I could understand the kjv right away it wasn't hard to learn the old words it was obvious that thou, thee, ye are different ways to say you that you can understand whether it is singular or plural. Second the context helps you understand the old words that are not understood. Betwixt for example is another way to say between. Another word is verily is truly. Ensample is following the example of more than one person. Correct me if I am wrong on that one. Finally my children understand the kjv just fine, they actually like it better than the other versions my 5 year old son likes the thee and thou so hard to read just pay attention to the context it may be easier to catch on to what is being said. God bless you all
The problem is not the KJV, the problem is that schools are churning out too many people that can’t read. It saddens me to see young people struggling to read something that should be easy. Our education system is a complete failure. Most homeschooled kids I know can read at a much higher level than anyone coming out of the public schools.