Aplogies if this was already mentioned in the comments, but... The concept art - those being pages/paper - new Alan Wake Manuscript sounds like the most straightforward explanation for what they are. Also - with the Blessed Organization trying to deliver power to not just the board altered item, but THE Board attached to The Oldest House - and given Chester Bless is, most likely, a villan (just as The Board is hinted to be "evil"), it feels like The Board/Black Pyramid is either an aspect of, or IS the true essence of The Dark Presence trying to access the Remedy connected reality via the Threshold of the Oldest House. I think if Alan failed to de-couple Scratch from himself, Scratch Wake would've just been an agent to ultimately accomplish the overall goal of bringing The Board into physical being in the Remedy-verse/to break the Black Pyramid out of the prison of "the light place" that is the astral plane (accessed most directly via the oldest house, just like the dark place is accessed most directly via Cauldren Lake). Maybe Chester Bless is the dark presences' "back up" vessel, and Control 2 will be the story of the Hiss backed Bless bringing The Board into "reality" and the "heros" of the Remedy-verse uniting to either stop, or reverse that outcome. I also think this will all be framed with a Ragnarok/literal Norse God mythology playing out, but I don't have that angle quite cyphered out yet. 🙂 P.S. The Former is Alan after the bullet of light - de-coupled from The Board/Dark Presence - ejected from the Black Pyramid when Scratch Wake was no longer a viable vessel to assist with Bringing The Dark Presence into the Remedy-verse... Maybe.
2:26 my guess is it’s FBC staff or civilian who are now covered in something like how you’d cover a corpse at a crime scene. The paper is what I’d assume to be notes on the body. Who they were. When they were discovered. Notes on the current status of their body.
Hatch in his letter from Quantum Break says he found a time anomaly in a cave - in Alan Wake 2 Night Springs DLC, we see Door's origin play out this same exact way: finding an anomaly in a cave. Peak storytelling connection.
@@HiddenMachineGaming probably different examinations on the affected agents, maybe even reports on the specific AWE??? Or other AWEs that are similar?
@@mr.radovic702 I wonder if someone placed them there as a threat to the FBC, as if someone obtained some leaked documents and put them on display there
Here's what I think happen in Control 2: The Hiss and Chester Bless would team up, The AWE within The Oldest House would leak out and take a portion of New York, we would play as both Jesse and a couple of field agents outside the O.H. and and possibly have about 2-3 expansions that would involve Alan Wake and Tim Breaker/Jack Joyce
At the start of the video, I think you are right that those three floating figures are being weighted down, but the uncanny aspect of the image is that It appears they are weighted down by sheets of paper. The the tautness and straight perpendicular lines of the rope, and the clear sense of upward motion being restrained, looks exactly like you originally interpreted it ... Except that it's not heavy stone holding them down but paper. So why is that paper so heavy? Altered item?
Considering Lance Reddick bless his soul was supposed to play Mr Door, makes obviouse sense that they got to make those connection Hope for Remedy to regain the rights to quantum break so that they can make a more direct link
I think that Control 2 can have a dual protagonist system like in Alan Wake 2 where you would have Jesse dealing with the board and the former, and then you can have an agent outside of the oldest house (Maybe Sarah?) investigating the blessed, and these two narratives would come together in the end
19:15 “we can see she didn’t die” - not sure if that is your interpretation or you simply forgot the details of the timeline: the Beth you see in the end of the game has not yet even met Jack and she’s not frozen in time, she just experiences one of the initial stutters. She does meet him that night, then helps him kidnap Dr. Amaral, then gets transported to 1999, helps William Joyce with building his countermeasure and then, yes, actually dies in 2010 after Jack travels there to get the countermeasure. So Jack is not misinterpreting anything: by the time this interview happens, Beth is no longer there because she died “relatively speaking” 6 years ago, because Jack chose to not introduce a time paradox by snatching her from before she even meets him in the first place, similarly to how Serene chooses to not do anything about stopping the End of Time because he already saw it, but Jack does leave a possibility of traveling back in time once again and saving Beth in a different timeline in a different universe similar to how he ends up saving William even though he thought he saw him die. This paradox of choice and interpretation and the idea of multiple realities existing at the same time is one of the core themes of the game.
Awesome video. I never thought about the taking 'Control' of Jesse herself concept. On another note, it's crazy that some of the important characters from Control has already spiraled into the story of Alan Wake, I wonder if it'll be the same but reverse in Control 2.
All this talk about meta-narratives has me thinking I'll disappear...Mr. Door says accompanied by the sound of the angel lamp and the sight of flickering lights.
In terms of the "red headed woman", I just want to point out that Beth Wilder is ALSO technically a "red-headed woman". Her hair colour is auburn, which is a variety of red hair. The colour grading in the game can obscure that sometimes, but in the TV show, it's much clearer. At 30:02 and 32:45 you can definitely see it. That's auburn. Red. So yes, she doesn't look like Pippi Longstockings, but it is technically red hair. So Breaker could be referring to Beth as well. So basically: ... Nobody puts Beth Wilder in the corner!!! ;)
Totally! I may have been unclear, but I tried to imply that the reason he was looking for Jesse in the first place is because he was originally searching for Beth
@@UberNoodle Lol… they were being polite by downplaying your lack of comprehension. They made the Faden and Wilder connection right as they presented the whiteboard. You are forgiven for your arrogance.
Wild theory here… What if the main Antagonist of Control 2 is a Hiss-corrupted/controlled Warlin Door? As Door is the master if many worlds and can access every reality, a Hiss-corrupted Warlin Door would be very very very bad for the Remedy Multiverse because he could spread the Hiss to every universe. Amd the only people whom stand a chance against a Hiss-controlled Warlin Door are the FBC, Jesse and Dylan Faden (I think Dylan will be a playable character), Tim Breaker/Jack Joyce, and yes even Alan Wake. I have a feeling the Hiss is still very much a threat, and that Warlin Door will be a major antagonist in Control 2. Why not be a Hiss-controlled Warlin Door?
A hatch is usually an opening on a flat surface. Like so ____ but put a mirror next to it at a 45 degree angle \ and it becomes standing | a door. Mirror the name MARTIN and it looks like WARLIN. Yes you flip the m and it's w, but you can also flip the t and the closest letter to that is an L.
:::Spoilers::: If you haven’t figured it out yet: the FBC is a manifestation of Zane’s writings; and “the oldest house” I believe is meant to be (Odin’s Horse) or Yggdrasil the world tree… with the area inside the “house”, being Asgard. Ahti, was hired to protect the house: He originally lived in Watery, and you visit his residence in Alan Wake 2; it’s the cabin stuck in the loop at coffee world (Nightless Night, Same Lake’s movie, explains this, and how he was hired)… In Norse Mythology: he is sometimes represented as a talking squirrel, or the keeper of Yggdrasil; who maintains and protects the world tree, essentially a Janitor. The Plot: is based heavily on Norse Mythology, meaning based on what happened in the first game, we most likely know what will happen in the 2nd… Northmoor is quite obviously a representation of Surtr; caste in fire with his tightening headband; and will bring about Ragnarok… My guess is… Trench was never a true director, I believe Trench and the Board stopped Ragnarok by encasing Northmoor in the NSC2; and I think this is the reason for the events of Control… I think Northmoor reached out to Dylan via the astro-plane as “the Former” director, explaining that the FBC needed to be destroyed: which is why the hiss was released; eventually causing the NSC2 to fail, and Northmoor to bring about Ragnarok… I think Trench knew something like this was going to happen: which is why he was searching for a strong enough replacement to be able to fight Northmoor directly, or at least be able to keep him in the NSC2 indefinitely… I think this also explains his obsession with the slide projector; he thought he’d be able to “control” it, and become powerful enough to become a true director… I also think the Hiss would have most likely never been able to break into “the oldest house”; if it hadn’t been for the mining of Black Rock, which weakened Yggdrasil’s barriers between Realms… The last thing I’ll leave you with is… In Norse Mythology symbolism is very important, and travel using Yggdrasil(Odin’s horse) is usually done by using symbols of the place your trying to get to… this sounds an awful lot like the “Oceanside Motel”; which allows transit between different realms (games), via the symbols on the doors…
I loved every minute of this video, great details, very important video... I think there will be three playable characters. Jesse, Dylan and Dr. Casper Darling. As always amazing video and theories.
the notes on 34:03 (i thought this was from some random person in cauldron lake area that we never meet, but apparently this too was Tim?) makes me wonder if polyhedrons with 'different number of sides' represent the 'same type' of entity/concept in these multiple worlds that remedy created. The Countermeasure seems to be a regular dodecahedron, Hedron seems to be polyhedron with a lot of triangular faces(i dont know the exact name), and the one Tim saw in the sky he distinctly notes as an octahedron(drawn right beside it). Then at the bottom of the note we see various other regular polyhedrons including things simliar to the countermeasure(second last) and Hedron (last). Not to mention 'hedron' is the literal generic name(idea) for these type of structures. What characteristic is such a name/structure supposed to represent in this world(in line with names like Door/Hatch/Wake etc. which reflect a literal meaning very closely attached to the character it belongs to) ? Is there some similar structure/shape/entity we can find in the Max Payne universe?
I had actually suddenly realised about the email Barry says about Chester Bless before you brought it up... didn't he mention about Bless saying it was good for Barry to have joined them, and that something bad would've happened to him if he had stayed in New York? Perhaps something like, i don't know, what that concept art teases?? 👀 if anything this more hints that we'll see a Barry return in the future. Whether in C2 or AW3 or something else.
Just recently finished Control and it was great. Def looking forward to a sequel. Never did play Ala Wake though so bought that and am playing that at the moment., among a couple other games.
Sounds interesting and I'm really looking forward to Control 2 bc the first one is my favourite Remedy game. But what about Ahti? Did you forget about him? I mean,he plays a significant role in Control and Alan Wake 2,and he's also a supernatural entity...
Ahti is a really interesting one. He's guided us from Control to Alan Wake 2. But I wonder if his character would eventually faded away like Zane did. Ahti seems to be really worry during the event of Alan Wake 2.
Hard to say much about Ahti, he's always there, but it's hard to say how actively involved he will be. I feel like he tries to present himself as if he is taking a very passive role in things, which might be misleading.
Let’s say The Board is a collective of consciousness across all reality like Tim and Alan or Jesse but maybe not just Tim maybe The Board is also True Thomas Zane and “The Former” refers to Zane appearance before being replace hence why it looks so similar to the Diver. Banished because it was self serving and manipulative just like Tom in Alan Wake 2
I hope control 2 tackles the backrooms in some way. liminal space and the backrooms weren't talked about until during the pandemic. i hope we get something like that.
@@HiddenMachineGaming Yeah but in 2019 people didn't really talk about liminal space or know what it was. i was hoping they could just do a straight up backrooms level/mission.
Hopefully they explain the hints about Jessie and Dylan being the same person at one point. Even in the story he doesn’t get brought up UNTIL they meet Polaris, and how polaris speaks to him too… and darling being led by hedron into the dark place? So confused lol
Remedy could do a war of two worlds storyline with the casts of Quantum Break and Control fighting over resources in order to stop the time apocalypse in Quantum Break. Or the time apocalypse already happened and Jesse has to deal with the refugees.
before i watch this video i want to share kind of a stoned thought a had a few days ago thinking on this topic. i was thinking about alan wake and his "Para Utilitarian" abilities. I was wondering if the line at the end of the game where Alan described himself as the "master of many worlds" might be a hint that they are planning on upping that characters power scaling to be on the same level as Jesse. I had a few images flying around my head of Alan in the Oldest House using darkness themed powers to beat on enemies. That's just a random thought though.
Yes! That line, and the way he kinda smiled while delivering it, really made me wonder what sort of new powers he had acquired at that point. Definitely seems like there is a whole lot more for us to learn about Alan Wake going forward!
This may sound weird but whats the theme that apoears on 1:40 called? I loved that song the first time i played the oceanviee motel segment but i never knew the song name
I have no idea tbh, it's just something I found in the audio files for Control. My assumption is that it's a rendition or edit of some other song... when I run it through Shazam, it brough it the song "DATT" by an artist named mikuni, but the arrangement sounds a bit different between these two versions.
I just wanna say I love your videos, even if you make my head hurt because I’m trying to think too hard about stuff 😂 I kinda figure though that the Alan Wake II DLC’s will take inspiration from Control’s DLC’s, with one focused on adding lore and sequel-hook material(Foundation), and another to link more directly to the next Remedy game(AWE). I feel this is sorta obvious from the leaked(?) names of AWII’s DLC’s being “Night Springs” and “Lake House”, but who knows really? As an aside, we know we’re getting Remasters of Max Payne 1 & 2…wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t intend to more closely link those to the other games like they did with AW Remastered Edit: Since I’ve got my brain-juices going, I just had a couple of thoughts…could we consider the events of Control a “dark reflection” of Quantum Break? Not a one-to-one, because ripples on the “water” can distort the reflection, but there’s some odd flips between the two. QB ends up focusing on the construction of the polyhedron-shaped Countermeasure, while Control focuses on getting to the polyhedron-shaped “Hedron”, only for it to be torn apart almost because Polaris insisted that Jesse go to it. Then you have Hatch being virtually omnipresent in QB’s story and world, and yet only a single mention in dialogue in Control. Also, I’m starting to believe that the Dark Place is as much defined by imagination as it is perception, and I mean that quite literally: an ocean can look like a lake if viewed from far away, or by something massive. Likewise, it’s easy to mistake a spiral for a loop if you’re not looking at it from the right perspective. What else could we, or the characters, learn from or about the Dark Place by shifting their perspective on it?
@ailihele2489 gonna be weird to see him so much thinner 😂 I wonder if they'd get his original actor again, or if they'll go for someone new who would both look and sound like Barry in real life. But thin. I'm also interested to see if they bring back Sarah, seems likely. *GAAASSSP* what if that other comment here about having Control 2 be dual protagonist, with the other being Sarah investigating Blessed stuff outside the Oldest House is true... but then also have her reuniting with Barry :O (obviously a huge stretch, but hey)
I can’t quite remember the conditions that trigger it, but you get it by interacting with him while he’s sleeping in his containment chamber. Did you finish the DLC missions? That might have something to do with it.
How they are AWE's,There are AUE ( Altered Universe Events ，There are a series of codes , I how ever just started to play control 2 days ago ,which was the 11 of August , Control came out about 4 yrs ago however I was aware when it came out although I couldn't afford it on day 1, I was born on the 4th day of the 11 month
Jesse(surname Faden) is Fading into the actual Reality ,Alan Wake is Waking into alternate realities Open the Door- Endless Possibilities Door's is apart of these Fractions/Fractures "Because he wants to Break the Quantum of Time ,But he needs to Control it ...😅 WI -World Interference --√Interfererence of Worlds There are OOP( Objects of Power) and they are also POP(People of Power) ,Peoples interactions with objects to obtain power. Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with the above It's just speculation of thought
You know what i hope they do? Control 2.....and not Quantum Break 2. I'm sorry, but i heard a lot of these theories and connections, and i'm sure there will be many easter eggs and maybe sidequests that go into that direction, but the main part of Control should not be a warped continuation of Quantum Break. The Board, Polaris, the Former, the Hiss, the Oldest House, Jesse's past... and other new stuff like this, new AWE's etc. that's what Control 2 should be about. Also i really hope they don't do multiple characters here. I think it was great in AW2, but a game with slow gameplay etc. like AW lends itself way better to that than an Jedi Simulator like Control. I hope it is Just Jesse here. I'm sure Breaker, Door Alan and Saga will be Characters in Control 2 in one form or the other, but i really hope they are not the main focus. (at least not with the stories they bring over from their games) If there is a game that will go all out on crossing all stories etc. and give us the insides that you seem to hope for about QB etc. i actually think the Multiplayer game could be the one for it. I'm pretty sure they want to pack way more story in a multiplayer game than what people normally would expect. And Shawn Ashmore could be something of the lead there maybr as Breaker. The different dimensions etc. would also work great with different stages of a Multiplayer. game. Well, whatever, like i said, i just hope that Control 2..the sequel to in my opinion Remedys best game is allowed to just be Control 2 and isn't dragged down by trying to be something that it shouldn't be, and that quite frankly also wouldn't make any sense for people other than us who aren't watching Theory videos about this stuff on TH-cam:)
Remedy has gone to great lengths to protect their individual IPs and let each one shine for what it is. I think that whatever QB stuff might show up in Control 2 would very much be secondary to the main story.
tbh he won't be in any future games. he was eating a breakfast sammy with a runny egg and there is egg all over his hands and it's grossing him out and he needs to take some time for himself
24:33 and also, John Mirror's girlfriend from max Payne. Don't forget the Pink Flamingo my friend!! "She has dyed her hair red" ...and even the Red Dress Women from Matrix. The one that makes you distract from the reality/simulation.
I wonder about the setting of Control 2 because the setting of the first game was so important. The entirety of Control was in The Oldest House and that was fine because it is huge. But I don't think they can pull that off in another game.
idk how you could focus on Remedy games for this long and not know Control references not only personal autonomy but also control of reality both in the forces fighting for it and the FBC's control of our approach to understanding the absurd forces of the universe ie the Tennyson Report
@@JohnPatron-j5lhaha it's all good, I'm mostly joking. Control definitely touches on those themes, but it's also so widely open to interpretation that I can never tell what was the intention of the creators and what was something I just picked up on myself
@@HiddenMachineGaming For sure, I never wanna shoehorn my interpretation over anyone else’s (unless someone’s way off base, then arguing is fun) but, yeah, there are for sure explicit references to all of those themes within the game and Control is honestly just a very elegant summation of everything that’s going on not only in Control but in the most Remedy games. Love the work you do, I really enjoyed this video.
The salt flat is known for being a lake that's a perfect mirror when rain fills it with water, and Cauldron Lake is also described as a mirror So there's the connection to Alan Wake 2
2:50 Yeap. Script. I thought it could be 3 scripts for the 3 acts that the game will have? Get stock looping from Alan that Acts need to be done 3 times before escaping form.
I have one thing to point out: the game states The Hiss killed Polaris, but Darling states that Polaris wasn't a helper, but a catalyst that changed Jesse, herself, into a being on par with her, and her mental self, Jess Polaris, represents that new aspect of her. 😁 (Remember, when Hedron/Polaris was killed, all the HRAs stopped working, until Jesse had her breakthrough and manifested her OWN Resonance they could amplify, instead 😁 ) So, while I agree "two powerful are beings active in reality," I'd argue that JESSE is one of them, not Hedron/Polaris. 🤔
@Valzer__ there's an excellent breakdown on how much Jungian thought is in Control(even Polaris appears as a mandala). And the concept of attaining one's "true self" is a Jungian idea that fits Jesse's arc, so far, very well, so I really got the feeling that they didn't fuse, but her time with Polaris help her find her Jungian Self: Jesse Polaris. I mean, I guess it could have gone from "Jesse and Polaris" to "Jesse and a Jesse/Polaris hybrid," but I really didn't get that impression. 😁 I hope Control 2 gives us more, and clarifies the whole "Are Jesse and Dylan one person, divided?" hinted mystery.
It cannot be connected to Quantum Break, Remedy would be sued into oblivion. Why this keeps coming up makes no sense. You spent so long talking about something that cannot be connected and didn’t by even mention Ahti?
@@HiddenMachineGaming I literally just got it today, and a really weird thing happened in game…. So I’m playing the normal game on Hard difficulty as I started a new play through, not the final draft, just the base game. Anyways, I got to the part where you begin playing as Alan, and got to the Subway, when you go down the stairs, now there is a TV there and if you interact with the TV, it starts the DLC, NO:1 Fan… I haven’t seen that picked up on any other channel. So I’m going to wait to play the rest of the DLC as they must pop up in the base game too, because I assume there will be more TV’s to interact with as the story progresses. Anywho… let me apologise for the time of my comment above, I had a pretty rough day yesterday, and was just frustrated at another quantum break conversation with the Alan Wake 2.
Aplogies if this was already mentioned in the comments, but...
The concept art - those being pages/paper - new Alan Wake Manuscript sounds like the most straightforward explanation for what they are.
Also - with the Blessed Organization trying to deliver power to not just the board altered item, but THE Board attached to The Oldest House - and given Chester Bless is, most likely, a villan (just as The Board is hinted to be "evil"), it feels like The Board/Black Pyramid is either an aspect of, or IS the true essence of The Dark Presence trying to access the Remedy connected reality via the Threshold of the Oldest House. I think if Alan failed to de-couple Scratch from himself, Scratch Wake would've just been an agent to ultimately accomplish the overall goal of bringing The Board into physical being in the Remedy-verse/to break the Black Pyramid out of the prison of "the light place" that is the astral plane (accessed most directly via the oldest house, just like the dark place is accessed most directly via Cauldren Lake). Maybe Chester Bless is the dark presences' "back up" vessel, and Control 2 will be the story of the Hiss backed Bless bringing The Board into "reality" and the "heros" of the Remedy-verse uniting to either stop, or reverse that outcome. I also think this will all be framed with a Ragnarok/literal Norse God mythology playing out, but I don't have that angle quite cyphered out yet.
🙂
P.S.
The Former is Alan after the bullet of light - de-coupled from The Board/Dark Presence - ejected from the Black Pyramid when Scratch Wake was no longer a viable vessel to assist with Bringing The Dark Presence into the Remedy-verse... Maybe.
2:26 my guess is it’s FBC staff or civilian who are now covered in something like how you’d cover a corpse at a crime scene. The paper is what I’d assume to be notes on the body. Who they were. When they were discovered. Notes on the current status of their body.
Hatch in his letter from Quantum Break says he found a time anomaly in a cave - in Alan Wake 2 Night Springs DLC, we see Door's origin play out this same exact way: finding an anomaly in a cave. Peak storytelling connection.
I loved that part!
@@HiddenMachineGaming me too!! Such good attention to detail!!!
You always hit some wild timing, I believe Remedy just hinted at some new AW2 Night Springs DLC info on their youtube channel. Great work as always❤️
Many thanks! It was a real thrill to see that update from Remedy, I didn't expect anything to happen until next month
25:44 Alan Wake 2: "This is the ritual to lead you on. Your friends will meet him when you are gone"
The documents might be personnel files for those 3 people.
Food for thought.
I was thinking the same thing! Looks like multiple pages are attached.
@@HiddenMachineGaming probably different examinations on the affected agents, maybe even reports on the specific AWE??? Or other AWEs that are similar?
@@mr.radovic702 I wonder if someone placed them there as a threat to the FBC, as if someone obtained some leaked documents and put them on display there
@@HiddenMachineGaming hmmmm, maybe an FBC experiment gone awry, mayhaps?
I hope Remedy get 'Control' of Quantum Break again and release it on PS5. I'd love to have the platinum trophy to go with the others.
Here's what I think happen in Control 2:
The Hiss and Chester Bless would team up, The AWE within The Oldest House would leak out and take a portion of New York, we would play as both Jesse and a couple of field agents outside the O.H. and and possibly have about 2-3 expansions that would involve Alan Wake and Tim Breaker/Jack Joyce
this makes so much sense
@ilovesteakandfries it would be like SCP foundation + Batman arkham city
If you look closely at Logan's drawings you can see the Former.
Yes!
At the start of the video, I think you are right that those three floating figures are being weighted down, but the uncanny aspect of the image is that It appears they are weighted down by sheets of paper. The the tautness and straight perpendicular lines of the rope, and the clear sense of upward motion being restrained, looks exactly like you originally interpreted it ... Except that it's not heavy stone holding them down but paper. So why is that paper so heavy? Altered item?
Hmmm, I see what you mean! Weird!
Considering Lance Reddick bless his soul was supposed to play Mr Door, makes obviouse sense that they got to make those connection
Hope for Remedy to regain the rights to quantum break so that they can make a more direct link
Started this video as a sceptic but after hearing the theories and the links I'm leaving a true believer
Mission accomplished
I think that Control 2 can have a dual protagonist system like in Alan Wake 2 where you would have Jesse dealing with the board and the former, and then you can have an agent outside of the oldest house (Maybe Sarah?) investigating the blessed, and these two narratives would come together in the end
Aiden Gillen would be cool as Chester Bless but Dominic Monaghan( William Joyce) would be cool too.
Yes! I would love that
19:15 “we can see she didn’t die” - not sure if that is your interpretation or you simply forgot the details of the timeline: the Beth you see in the end of the game has not yet even met Jack and she’s not frozen in time, she just experiences one of the initial stutters. She does meet him that night, then helps him kidnap Dr. Amaral, then gets transported to 1999, helps William Joyce with building his countermeasure and then, yes, actually dies in 2010 after Jack travels there to get the countermeasure. So Jack is not misinterpreting anything: by the time this interview happens, Beth is no longer there because she died “relatively speaking” 6 years ago, because Jack chose to not introduce a time paradox by snatching her from before she even meets him in the first place, similarly to how Serene chooses to not do anything about stopping the End of Time because he already saw it, but Jack does leave a possibility of traveling back in time once again and saving Beth in a different timeline in a different universe similar to how he ends up saving William even though he thought he saw him die. This paradox of choice and interpretation and the idea of multiple realities existing at the same time is one of the core themes of the game.
Great point, I think I misinterpreted that!
Awesome video. I never thought about the taking 'Control' of Jesse herself concept.
On another note, it's crazy that some of the important characters from Control has already spiraled into the story of Alan Wake, I wonder if it'll be the same but reverse in Control 2.
Thank you! I think we'll definitely see some of those AW characters in Control 2
All this talk about meta-narratives has me thinking I'll disappear...Mr. Door says accompanied by the sound of the angel lamp and the sight of flickering lights.
In terms of the "red headed woman", I just want to point out that Beth Wilder is ALSO technically a "red-headed woman". Her hair colour is auburn, which is a variety of red hair. The colour grading in the game can obscure that sometimes, but in the TV show, it's much clearer. At 30:02 and 32:45 you can definitely see it. That's auburn. Red. So yes, she doesn't look like Pippi Longstockings, but it is technically red hair. So Breaker could be referring to Beth as well.
So basically: ... Nobody puts Beth Wilder in the corner!!! ;)
Totally! I may have been unclear, but I tried to imply that the reason he was looking for Jesse in the first place is because he was originally searching for Beth
@@HiddenMachineGaming I see! Well you are forgiven!! :D Beth Wilder approves!
@@UberNoodle Lol… they were being polite by downplaying your lack of comprehension. They made the Faden and Wilder connection right as they presented the whiteboard. You are forgiven for your arrogance.
22:51 and during "We Sing" mission, their is written in the floor "shifter" in front of the wall of TVs
Yes! That was a real confirmation moment for me
Wild theory here… What if the main Antagonist of Control 2 is a Hiss-corrupted/controlled Warlin Door? As Door is the master if many worlds and can access every reality, a Hiss-corrupted Warlin Door would be very very very bad for the Remedy Multiverse because he could spread the Hiss to every universe. Amd the only people whom stand a chance against a Hiss-controlled Warlin Door are the FBC, Jesse and Dylan Faden (I think Dylan will be a playable character), Tim Breaker/Jack Joyce, and yes even Alan Wake. I have a feeling the Hiss is still very much a threat, and that Warlin Door will be a major antagonist in Control 2. Why not be a Hiss-controlled Warlin Door?
A hatch is usually an opening on a flat surface. Like so ____ but put a mirror next to it at a 45 degree angle \ and it becomes standing | a door.
Mirror the name MARTIN and it looks like WARLIN. Yes you flip the m and it's w, but you can also flip the t and the closest letter to that is an L.
god i HOPE we see aidan gillen again. loved him in quantum break
Fingers crossed
:::Spoilers:::
If you haven’t figured it out yet: the FBC is a manifestation of Zane’s writings; and “the oldest house” I believe is meant to be (Odin’s Horse) or Yggdrasil the world tree… with the area inside the “house”, being Asgard.
Ahti, was hired to protect the house: He originally lived in Watery, and you visit his residence in Alan Wake 2; it’s the cabin stuck in the loop at coffee world (Nightless Night, Same Lake’s movie, explains this, and how he was hired)… In Norse Mythology: he is sometimes represented as a talking squirrel, or the keeper of Yggdrasil; who maintains and protects the world tree, essentially a Janitor.
The Plot: is based heavily on Norse Mythology, meaning based on what happened in the first game, we most likely know what will happen in the 2nd… Northmoor is quite obviously a representation of Surtr; caste in fire with his tightening headband; and will bring about Ragnarok…
My guess is… Trench was never a true director, I believe Trench and the Board stopped Ragnarok by encasing Northmoor in the NSC2; and I think this is the reason for the events of Control… I think Northmoor reached out to Dylan via the astro-plane as “the Former” director, explaining that the FBC needed to be destroyed: which is why the hiss was released; eventually causing the NSC2 to fail, and Northmoor to bring about Ragnarok…
I think Trench knew something like this was going to happen: which is why he was searching for a strong enough replacement to be able to fight Northmoor directly, or at least be able to keep him in the NSC2 indefinitely… I think this also explains his obsession with the slide projector; he thought he’d be able to “control” it, and become powerful enough to become a true director…
I also think the Hiss would have most likely never been able to break into “the oldest house”; if it hadn’t been for the mining of Black Rock, which weakened Yggdrasil’s barriers between Realms…
The last thing I’ll leave you with is… In Norse Mythology symbolism is very important, and travel using Yggdrasil(Odin’s horse) is usually done by using symbols of the place your trying to get to… this sounds an awful lot like the “Oceanside Motel”; which allows transit between different realms (games), via the symbols on the doors…
I loved every minute of this video, great details, very important video...
I think there will be three playable characters. Jesse, Dylan and Dr. Casper Darling.
As always amazing video and theories.
I would love to play as dr darling omg
the notes on 34:03 (i thought this was from some random person in cauldron lake area that we never meet, but apparently this too was Tim?) makes me wonder if polyhedrons with 'different number of sides' represent the 'same type' of entity/concept in these multiple worlds that remedy created.
The Countermeasure seems to be a regular dodecahedron, Hedron seems to be polyhedron with a lot of triangular faces(i dont know the exact name), and the one Tim saw in the sky he distinctly notes as an octahedron(drawn right beside it). Then at the bottom of the note we see various other regular polyhedrons including things simliar to the countermeasure(second last) and Hedron (last). Not to mention 'hedron' is the literal generic name(idea) for these type of structures.
What characteristic is such a name/structure supposed to represent in this world(in line with names like Door/Hatch/Wake etc. which reflect a literal meaning very closely attached to the character it belongs to) ? Is there some similar structure/shape/entity we can find in the Max Payne universe?
Coming back to this and just now seeing Polaris is a spiral. Damn.
Yes!
I had actually suddenly realised about the email Barry says about Chester Bless before you brought it up... didn't he mention about Bless saying it was good for Barry to have joined them, and that something bad would've happened to him if he had stayed in New York? Perhaps something like, i don't know, what that concept art teases?? 👀 if anything this more hints that we'll see a Barry return in the future. Whether in C2 or AW3 or something else.
Just recently finished Control and it was great. Def looking forward to a sequel. Never did play Ala Wake though so bought that and am playing that at the moment., among a couple other games.
Sounds interesting and I'm really looking forward to Control 2 bc the first one is my favourite Remedy game. But what about Ahti? Did you forget about him? I mean,he plays a significant role in Control and Alan Wake 2,and he's also a supernatural entity...
Ahti is a really interesting one. He's guided us from Control to Alan Wake 2. But I wonder if his character would eventually faded away like Zane did. Ahti seems to be really worry during the event of Alan Wake 2.
Hard to say much about Ahti, he's always there, but it's hard to say how actively involved he will be. I feel like he tries to present himself as if he is taking a very passive role in things, which might be misleading.
@@HiddenMachineGaming maybe he'll connect everything in Control 2 or a DLC,who knows🤷🏻♂️
best shared universe ever created
Indeed
Let’s say The Board is a collective of consciousness across all reality like Tim and Alan or Jesse but maybe not just Tim maybe The Board is also True Thomas Zane and “The Former” refers to Zane appearance before being replace hence why it looks so similar to the Diver.
Banished because it was self serving and manipulative just like Tom in Alan Wake 2
I hope control 2 tackles the backrooms in some way. liminal space and the backrooms weren't talked about until during the pandemic. i hope we get something like that.
Plenty of liminal spaces in Control, but I could Control 2 leaning into it even harder
@@HiddenMachineGaming Yeah but in 2019 people didn't really talk about liminal space or know what it was. i was hoping they could just do a straight up backrooms level/mission.
Plot twist Remedy basically made things up as they went along and they watch theory videos like this as inspiration.
Oh, like FNAF
Hopefully they explain the hints about Jessie and Dylan being the same person at one point. Even in the story he doesn’t get brought up UNTIL they meet Polaris, and how polaris speaks to him too… and darling being led by hedron into the dark place? So confused lol
So confused indeed! The Jesse/Dylan connection is so curious
I hope not. "Stephen King once wrote..." and all that
Remedy could do a war of two worlds storyline with the casts of Quantum Break and Control fighting over resources in order to stop the time apocalypse in Quantum Break. Or the time apocalypse already happened and Jesse has to deal with the refugees.
There is definitely room for different factions to form with the current cast of characters we have developing!
16:01 Lovely description of someone trap in the Lake - inside the Dark Place. Endless Nightmare? Endless Nigth? Yötön Yö? Versions of me? Looping?
Forever and never
If Beth is a shifter then I'm slightly more ok with her getting popped in qb lol would love to play as Beth in a qb sequel.
Would love to see a game that connects Control, Quantum and Wake.
Same
before i watch this video i want to share kind of a stoned thought a had a few days ago thinking on this topic. i was thinking about alan wake and his "Para Utilitarian" abilities. I was wondering if the line at the end of the game where Alan described himself as the "master of many worlds" might be a hint that they are planning on upping that characters power scaling to be on the same level as Jesse. I had a few images flying around my head of Alan in the Oldest House using darkness themed powers to beat on enemies. That's just a random thought though.
Yes! That line, and the way he kinda smiled while delivering it, really made me wonder what sort of new powers he had acquired at that point. Definitely seems like there is a whole lot more for us to learn about Alan Wake going forward!
This may sound weird but whats the theme that apoears on 1:40 called? I loved that song the first time i played the oceanviee motel segment but i never knew the song name
I have no idea tbh, it's just something I found in the audio files for Control. My assumption is that it's a rendition or edit of some other song... when I run it through Shazam, it brough it the song "DATT" by an artist named mikuni, but the arrangement sounds a bit different between these two versions.
@@HiddenMachineGaming thanks bro
Well I think night springs confirmed theirs a mutiverse or something like that
I just wanna say I love your videos, even if you make my head hurt because I’m trying to think too hard about stuff 😂
I kinda figure though that the Alan Wake II DLC’s will take inspiration from Control’s DLC’s, with one focused on adding lore and sequel-hook material(Foundation), and another to link more directly to the next Remedy game(AWE). I feel this is sorta obvious from the leaked(?) names of AWII’s DLC’s being “Night Springs” and “Lake House”, but who knows really?
As an aside, we know we’re getting Remasters of Max Payne 1 & 2…wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t intend to more closely link those to the other games like they did with AW Remastered
Edit: Since I’ve got my brain-juices going, I just had a couple of thoughts…could we consider the events of Control a “dark reflection” of Quantum Break? Not a one-to-one, because ripples on the “water” can distort the reflection, but there’s some odd flips between the two. QB ends up focusing on the construction of the polyhedron-shaped Countermeasure, while Control focuses on getting to the polyhedron-shaped “Hedron”, only for it to be torn apart almost because Polaris insisted that Jesse go to it. Then you have Hatch being virtually omnipresent in QB’s story and world, and yet only a single mention in dialogue in Control.
Also, I’m starting to believe that the Dark Place is as much defined by imagination as it is perception, and I mean that quite literally: an ocean can look like a lake if viewed from far away, or by something massive. Likewise, it’s easy to mistake a spiral for a loop if you’re not looking at it from the right perspective. What else could we, or the characters, learn from or about the Dark Place by shifting their perspective on it?
We’re getting the wheeler we deserve!
Chester Bless is absolutely going to be the villain. We need to save our boy Barry
PROTECT BARRY
Petition for barry to make his return with control 2!
@ailihele2489 gonna be weird to see him so much thinner 😂 I wonder if they'd get his original actor again, or if they'll go for someone new who would both look and sound like Barry in real life. But thin.
I'm also interested to see if they bring back Sarah, seems likely. *GAAASSSP* what if that other comment here about having Control 2 be dual protagonist, with the other being Sarah investigating Blessed stuff outside the Oldest House is true... but then also have her reuniting with Barry :O (obviously a huge stretch, but hey)
Really hoping I get to play Quantum Break 2 before this decade 🤞
Me2
heyyy ! I love your videos ! May i ask if there are any AW2 spoilers in here because i havent played it yet lol ?
Thank you! There are some Alan Wake 2 spoilers, yes.
32:40 translation executives in the production company were too dumb to get the idea so they phrased it as the gamers won’t get it.
How do you get that scene with bearded Dylan and the salt flats? I beat Control twice, but don’t think I’ve ever seen that
I can’t quite remember the conditions that trigger it, but you get it by interacting with him while he’s sleeping in his containment chamber.
Did you finish the DLC missions? That might have something to do with it.
@@HiddenMachineGaming I did, but I don’t think I interacted with him after doing that, I’ll give it a try
How they are AWE's,There are AUE ( Altered Universe Events ，There are a series of codes , I how ever just started to play control 2 days ago ,which was the 11 of August , Control came out about 4 yrs ago however I was aware when it came out although I couldn't afford it on day 1, I was born on the 4th day of the 11 month
Jesse(surname Faden) is Fading into the actual Reality ,Alan Wake is Waking into alternate realities
Open the Door- Endless Possibilities
Door's is apart of these Fractions/Fractures "Because he wants to Break the Quantum of Time ,But he needs to Control it ...😅
WI -World Interference --√Interfererence of Worlds
There are OOP( Objects of Power) and they are also POP(People of Power) ,Peoples interactions with objects to obtain power.
Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with the above
It's just speculation of thought
Great video.
Thank you!
Those MANUSCRIPTS are connected to the hiss... HMMMMMMMMM?
Hmmmmmm indeed
Wait they're fucking paper weights
Hahahaha
Thanks for another great video
Thank you for watching!
You know what i hope they do? Control 2.....and not Quantum Break 2. I'm sorry, but i heard a lot of these theories and connections, and i'm sure there will be many easter eggs and maybe sidequests that go into that direction, but the main part of Control should not be a warped continuation of Quantum Break. The Board, Polaris, the Former, the Hiss, the Oldest House, Jesse's past... and other new stuff like this, new AWE's etc. that's what Control 2 should be about.
Also i really hope they don't do multiple characters here. I think it was great in AW2, but a game with slow gameplay etc. like AW lends itself way better to that than an Jedi Simulator like Control. I hope it is Just Jesse here.
I'm sure Breaker, Door Alan and Saga will be Characters in Control 2 in one form or the other, but i really hope they are not the main focus. (at least not with the stories they bring over from their games)
If there is a game that will go all out on crossing all stories etc. and give us the insides that you seem to hope for about QB etc. i actually think the Multiplayer game could be the one for it. I'm pretty sure they want to pack way more story in a multiplayer game than what people normally would expect. And Shawn Ashmore could be something of the lead there maybr as Breaker. The different dimensions etc. would also work great with different stages of a Multiplayer. game.
Well, whatever, like i said, i just hope that Control 2..the sequel to in my opinion Remedys best game is allowed to just be Control 2 and isn't dragged down by trying to be something that it shouldn't be, and that quite frankly also wouldn't make any sense for people other than us who aren't watching Theory videos about this stuff on TH-cam:)
Remedy has gone to great lengths to protect their individual IPs and let each one shine for what it is. I think that whatever QB stuff might show up in Control 2 would very much be secondary to the main story.
But what about Charlie Wincott?
tbh he won't be in any future games. he was eating a breakfast sammy with a runny egg and there is egg all over his hands and it's grossing him out and he needs to take some time for himself
24:33 and also, John Mirror's girlfriend from max Payne. Don't forget the Pink Flamingo my friend!! "She has dyed her hair red"
...and even the Red Dress Women from Matrix. The one that makes you distract from the reality/simulation.
Yes! I didn't bring those up because I was trying to stay focused, but we are on the same wavelength here
I need more Aiden
I wonder about the setting of Control 2 because the setting of the first game was so important. The entirety of Control was in The Oldest House and that was fine because it is huge. But I don't think they can pull that off in another game.
Yeah, feels like they'd have to do something totally different, but I can't even envision what that might be
Have the outside and the inside of the oldest house maybe something like dragon age inquisition where’s their different places.
13:51 Hello Mr. Door.
Who Is MEYER?!
Elton Meyer, but tbh I don't think we ever learn anything about them
idk how you could focus on Remedy games for this long and not know Control references not only personal autonomy but also control of reality both in the forces fighting for it and the FBC's control of our approach to understanding the absurd forces of the universe ie the Tennyson Report
yeah fuck me i guess
@@HiddenMachineGaming the tone was more lighthearted than that, but I also got a touch of the special brain, so apologies
@@JohnPatron-j5lhaha it's all good, I'm mostly joking. Control definitely touches on those themes, but it's also so widely open to interpretation that I can never tell what was the intention of the creators and what was something I just picked up on myself
@@HiddenMachineGaming For sure, I never wanna shoehorn my interpretation over anyone else’s (unless someone’s way off base, then arguing is fun) but, yeah, there are for sure explicit references to all of those themes within the game and Control is honestly just a very elegant summation of everything that’s going on not only in Control but in the most Remedy games. Love the work you do, I really enjoyed this video.
Great video nevertheless!
Thank you!
The salt flat is known for being a lake that's a perfect mirror when rain fills it with water, and Cauldron Lake is also described as a mirror
So there's the connection to Alan Wake 2
Ah, great info, thank you!
A lake, that’s not a lake.
2:50 Yeap. Script. I thought it could be 3 scripts for the 3 acts that the game will have? Get stock looping from Alan that Acts need to be done 3 times before escaping form.
16:21 Control and Master of Many Worlds?
Exactly what I was thinking!
I have one thing to point out: the game states The Hiss killed Polaris, but Darling states that Polaris wasn't a helper, but a catalyst that changed Jesse, herself, into a being on par with her, and her mental self, Jess Polaris, represents that new aspect of her. 😁 (Remember, when Hedron/Polaris was killed, all the HRAs stopped working, until Jesse had her breakthrough and manifested her OWN Resonance they could amplify, instead 😁 )
So, while I agree "two powerful are beings active in reality," I'd argue that JESSE is one of them, not Hedron/Polaris. 🤔
They fused into one being making Jesse op.
@Valzer__ there's an excellent breakdown on how much Jungian thought is in Control(even Polaris appears as a mandala). And the concept of attaining one's "true self" is a Jungian idea that fits Jesse's arc, so far, very well, so I really got the feeling that they didn't fuse, but her time with Polaris help her find her Jungian Self: Jesse Polaris. I mean, I guess it could have gone from "Jesse and Polaris" to "Jesse and a Jesse/Polaris hybrid," but I really didn't get that impression. 😁 I hope Control 2 gives us more, and clarifies the whole "Are Jesse and Dylan one person, divided?" hinted mystery.
34:20 And that's Polaris
i just noticed, tenet fully ripped off quantum break
I’ve gotta check that out
I’ve got a feeling the bored are not all good. And this is fighting them
Board.
It cannot be connected to Quantum Break, Remedy would be sued into oblivion. Why this keeps coming up makes no sense.
You spent so long talking about something that cannot be connected and didn’t by even mention Ahti?
Did you happen to play the Night Springs DLC yet?
@@HiddenMachineGaming I literally just got it today, and a really weird thing happened in game…. So I’m playing the normal game on Hard difficulty as I started a new play through, not the final draft, just the base game. Anyways, I got to the part where you begin playing as Alan, and got to the Subway, when you go down the stairs, now there is a TV there and if you interact with the TV, it starts the DLC, NO:1 Fan… I haven’t seen that picked up on any other channel. So I’m going to wait to play the rest of the DLC as they must pop up in the base game too, because I assume there will be more TV’s to interact with as the story progresses.
Anywho… let me apologise for the time of my comment above, I had a pretty rough day yesterday, and was just frustrated at another quantum break conversation with the Alan Wake 2.
We were lucky with Alan Wake 2. But sweet baby got their grubby hands all in control 2
That's a very paranoid sounding take!
Quantum break sucked
lol I liked it, but I do think it’s Remedy’s least coherent game
@@HiddenMachineGaming I found the mechanics to very limiting
I'm pretty sure quantum break is not gonna be touched at all but we'll see