Disagreed. I actually hope its a different timeline/reboot cuz then it would be less confusing imo. Its as simple as, in this timeline dogs managed to survive and evolved from whatever killed off humans, they got smaller and smaller until we got our 3 dogs. In this timeline, Olimar meets Moss and tries to escape but because of Moss, met his demise. He turned into a leafling, but before he did he sent out an S.O.S. for help, which caused a bunch of people to start exploring this unknown planet. Then the game just happens at a different part of the world. Then thats just it. The Pikmin 3 trio dont come because they didnt happen to partner up yet, as it happens during the time Pikmin 1 would. I dont think its too confusing or complicated UNLESS i think about it like its not a reboot. I try doing that and not everything lines up, but as a reboot i feel its all easy to explain.
I can all-but guarantee if you asked any of the Pikmin writers/producers/directors whether or not 4 is a retcon, they'd say something like "really it's up to the players, ya know" This reeks of "who is Bowser Jr's mother" talk. You will never get a straight forward answer because Nintendo does NOT CARE about continuity. In fact, they might just outright hate it for some reason.
If I am not mistaken, I think that at some point in Pikmin 3, the characters can have a discussion about how greedy Koppaians are with their food and that they are worried that even if they return successfully, that history might repeat itself, so maybe the upcoming food crisis mentioned in Pikmin 4 is a different one from the one from Pikmin 3. Considering how often history repeats itself in this series (crash landings, debts, Louie being Louie) it is at least my head-canon, even if I am misremembering this conversation
They do say that. However, given what Olimar says, and that they never talk about a food crisis that happened before, it's safe to say it isn't different food crisises or something
I feel like the Yorke, Nelle, and Don Bergman were originally going to be Alph, Brittany, and Charlie but it was changed since otherwise Pikmin 3 wouldn't be their first time going to PNF-404
@@flamsey FLAMSEY THE ROCK PIKMIN SITUATION MAKES ABSOLUETLY NO SENSE, BECAUSE ALL PIKMIN TYPES HAD LIGHTER COLORS IN PIKMIN 3 THEN IN 4 AND THAT PROMO ART FOR P3 AND HEY! PIKMIN SHOW ROCK PIKMIN WITH DARKER COLORS! ALSO WHY WOULD OLIMAR A GUY WHO DOES SCIENTIFIC WORK THINK THAT ROCK PIKMIN ARE NEW BECAUSE OF THERE COLOR?! ( also flamsey the garden website, it has stuff that shows pikmin 3 happened before pikmin 4)
Personally, I think of Pikmin 4 as an alternate timeline rather than a reboot. I don't really see it as a bad thing either, it allows them to explore neglected concepts like the bad ending of Pikmin 1, and lets old enemies like the waterwraith reappear in a way that makes sense.
In many ways it feels like an alternate version of pikmin 2 to me. SPOILERS Like it seems to refrence pikmin 2 alot with things like the stuff they did with Louie. and some caves feel like different versions of the pikmin 2 caves. Like for example Engulfed castle/submerged castle hole of hero's/cavern for a king Gluttons kitchen/plunder palace
Good Job, I personally buy it being post-2 pre-3, since the Japanese website refences the events of 3 in a very specific way, Louie IS IN THE GAME, a group of Koppaites refence the in-sighting incident of 3 as being on-going, Olimar refers to the title theme from 3 playing from a treasure as being foreboding as if signling future troubles for him, Olimar has a dream about the events about of Pikmin 2 and etc.
Since Koppai hasn't suffered from the overpopulation crisis yet, this must be before Pikmin 3. Louie doesn't remember Olimar's face very well, so it's before 2. But then, it MUST be after 1, or otherwise he would have known about the pikmin during Pikmin 1. But there's nothing between Pikmin 1 and 2: Pikmin 2 follows exactly where Pikmin 1 left off. This is why I think Pikmin 4 is a reboot of Pikmin 1, story-wise.
I really want to believe it isn't a reboot, but everything makes so much more sense from the reboot perspective. All of the Pikmin 3 deluxe stuff would make sense. Louie's log about the golden pikpik carrots really makes more sense to be foreshadowing for the events of Pikmin 2 (which haven't happened yet in this timeline). Even the log about the Cupid's Grenade could be explained, as Schnauz wrote the naming AI for the Pikmin 4 ship, so it would make sense that in the Pikmin 2 timeline he wrote the AI for that ship as well (meaning that it knew the poetry because Schnauz had heard it before and programmed it into the ship). Olimar's dialogue in the Shipwreck Tale makes more sense if that was his first time on the planet, as does the dialogue in the intro where he talks about "discovering" pikmin.
I personally feel like the events of olimar's crash have 2 alternate realities, one which is the the events of pikmin 1 and the other is were olimar meets Moss, which eventually results in olimar not escaping the planet.
You don't say shit like this in fiction lmao when you wanna prove that there is even a split timeline THERE SHOULD BE TIME TRAVELLINGS WICH DONNT HAPPEN IN PIKMIN SINCE ITS HARD SCI FI LMAP
I feel like it’s a scenario of a fork in the road where it’s like "What would happened if Olimar did or didn’t escape PNF-404?" When he does escape it leads to the timeline of Pikmin 2 while if he doesn’t, it leads to the timeline of Pikmin 4 where Pikmin 2 does not exist in that timeline, then both lead back to Pikmin 3. If there’s any flaws to my theory then go ahead and explain why.
I'd like to think that as well Pikmin 2 is the least fitting game in this timeline, plus in a voyage log Olimar states that he had a dream in which the company he works for went bankrupt thanks to an employee which we know was Louie
I don't think that's the case, not only does 4 allude to other games like 1 and 2, but also it's not a matter of retelling an alternate outcome of 1, because in this game, Olimar does not fail, it's because of Moss that he has to go back and fail, the key difference here is Moss. I think it's either between 2 and 3, or after 3.
@@GlockensphealHow ? Olimar never bought back the Dolphin to make my knowledge,Louie states that he wants to eat golden pikpik carrots but didn't find a way yet,Koppai's famine didn't happen yet and Louie's logs suggest it's the first time he saw Pikmins.
I hate the way its so confusing like its a reboot and its not?? Like in the data files Louie says: "got sick of nana's cookies so i tried eating the creatures. they were pretty yummy." But Louie has already tried eating the creatures on PNF-404 in pikmin 2 and 3. And Olimar also isn't familiar with what the pikmin do unlike in pikmin 3.. of course this could just be gameplay stuff for new players to understand more behind the characters but its just so confusing. Besides if Olimar was familiar with all the pikmin (not ice and glow) it wouldn't spoil anything so why couldn't they just make it so Olimar is familiar with all the pikmin just like in pikmin 3. idk
People are overthinking this way too much, the game acts like 2 and 3 haven't happened so they didn't happen, the reason 4 is a alternate version of Pikmin 1 is because it allows them to naturally and easily include Olimar in the story
Olimar talks about discovering pikmin in the opening cutscene and in the logs sounds like he's discovering everything for the first time. I also remember a conversation with the Koppaites talking about how their planet is suffering from overpopulation and may enter a food crisis soon, meaning this game would likely be before Pikmin 3. The shipwreck tale seems to me like a not so accurate portrayal of what Olimar saw based on the lack of caves or pikmin types other than the main three Edit: oh, you talked about all of that in the video. I still believe it's an alternate scenario in which the bad ending if the first game takes place, with Moss being an excuse for it to happen even if Olimar fully repaired his ship
I personally think that there’s evidence to imply Pikmin 4 taking place right after Pikmin 1 and before Pikmin 2 as well. First of all, Olimar’s Shipwrecked Tale. Since he already seems well versed with the main 3 Pikmin in this mode, and he had 15 days of oxygen to get all his parts instead of 30, it can be inferred that Pikmin 1 canonically was a 15 day ordeal for Olimar, with him crashing before even leaving PNF-404 for a second time. This would make the 15 days in Olimar’s Tale make more sense as well as him being to the planet twice by then. For Piklopedia entries, all enemies in Pikmin 2 share their entries in 2 and 4, but some of these entries didn’t make sense even back then. The waterwraith’s entry in particular was physically impossible in 2, as only 3 people ever encountered it back then. I also think the series going 1-4-2-3 allows for the Plasm Wraith to fundamentally work a bit more seamlessly, as the reason that it exists is because Olimar returned in the golden ship to build up money to rebuy dolphin which he couldn’t afford after 2, it’s unlikely he would’ve gotten it back for the events of 4 in time to lose it again. The timeline for Dolphin would make sense then. Louie’s timeline would also make sense. Him not remembering Olimar would be because he never worked with him one-on-one yet. The Golden Carrots would be him plotting out his plans in 2. Louie’s reactions in Pikmin 2 (running away from the Pikmin, his weirdness in the first cutscene as well as the entirety of Titan Dweevil and the King of Bugs) would also add up. A regression of Louie’s personality from 2 to 4 to 3 can also be seen. This would also give the planet enough time to change a bit from 1 to 2, and also give space for species like the Sovereign Bulblax and the Progg to go virtually extinct. In Pikmin 2 Olimar also has a nightmare of becoming a Pikmin (once an Olimin reference but now a Leafling reference). This can be inferred to be a nightmare of what once happened, or just a nightmare of worst case scenarios. It’s pretty much confirmed that Olimar has a strong sixth sense in terms of dreams and gut feeling. The only two parts that I struggle to explain are Schnauz’s item entries and Olimar’s confusion about certain Pikmin. My logic is that the comments on Rock and Yellow Pikmin are throwaway lines that shouldn’t be looked deeper into, which happens in series’ like this. The gyroid bust and Cupid grenade are hard to argue for, though I’m sure an argument can be made. Imo I think the only confusion with Pikmin 4’s timeline spot really is just whether it takes place before 2 or after, and I think both are sound and have plenty of argument.
This is true but you have to consider also that he hadn't discovered Purples and Whites before 2 so the dialog with that wouldn't make sense, as well as ultra spicy spray
Hmm you raise some very interesting points. There’s so much evidence for it both being a reboot and main canon game. It’s frustrating, but at the same time it gets us really thinking to see how it fits.
@@flamsey that’s true. I think a lot of the issues with where 4 fits on the timeline stem from Olimar just consistently forgetting about most of the Pikmin themselves. While I don’t think it’s a reboot I honestly can see why so many people do, just with how Miyamoto’s team writes games.
I think the most important factor in this discussion is where Pikmin 2 falls on the timeline. Following what you said, Louies log and the presidents bad dream log could be dismissed as old information. However, one other detail that contradicts the place of Pikmin 2 on the timeline is Olimar and Louies relationship in Pikmin 4. In Louies Pikmin 4 logs he frequently mentions that he cant remember Olimars face. This makes little sense as if Pikmin 2 had already occurred he would most likely know Olimar's face very well. Additionally, in Pikmin 4 Olimar says to the player that this was his first break from work in awhile similar to how he was on vacation when he crashed in the original Pikmin. Overall, we won't really know until the next Pikmin title whether or not Pikmin 4 is a reboot.
This game is likely the alternate dimension that pikmin 2’s challenge mode exists in. People seem to forget that there were already 2 dimensions in the pikmin timeline. This would appear to be pikmin 1 for that dimension.
according to the 66th entry in olimar's voyage log, pikmin 2 could be just a nightmare, and thus not canon. it says: "Last night, I dreamt that one of my subordinates made a terrible mistake that put the company in a huge amount of debt. Too big for Hocotate Freight to pay back quickly... This is why I never take on debt. Anyway, when in woke up, i burst into a fit of
@@somerandomguy-3102 That is possible because of the vaugeness of the log. We don't really know exactly how much the bad dream covers in terms of Pikmin 2. However Louies log about eating Pik Pik carrots suggests that the dream log is simply foreshadowing Louies eventual mistake and therefore the events of Pikmin 2. Which would also place Pikmin 4 before Pikmin 2.
I do believe it’s a new timeline, there’s even a tidbit in Olimar’s‘s diary where he dreams about his company being bankrupt because of Louie and he’s like „Thank god it’s just a dream“
Thank you for making this video! Getting tired of seeing the "Pikmin 4 is a reboot" comments. Great work! Edit: Also holy crap, that part about the Gyroids being popular in Hocotate is really interesting. I have a theory that the theme of the Gyroids was originally going to have a more prominent role in the game. The Gyroids are based on Japanese Haniwa and are in part just ONE of the thematic inspirations behind the original Glow Pikmin Concept Art Design. To explain more I'd have to take you down the rabbit hole of Glow Pikmin Original Design.
5:51 Re-Watch the intro cutscene for Pikmin 3. This planet was very clearly undiscovered, and no Koppaite had ever been there. It states an unmanned ship detected what they named PNF-404. Alph, Brittney, and Charlie have connections to the Koppaites in this game and would certainly know about this planet and the pikmin. This game directly contradicts events we saw in Pikmin 3. It instead implies an alternate Pikmin 3 will take place as a fun nod while also keeping previous world building. This is the strongest evidence for this being an alternative timeline in my view. Additionally, the references to previous games all are in the form of tongue and cheek implications. Olimar heard Pikmin 3 music and thinks, "Huh, why do I have a weird sense of something bad?" Louie talks about wanting to eat Golden Pikpik carrots and the irony of Olimar finding the idea of his company going into debt over missing cargo laughable, and even the description of Cupids Grenade being "I read it somewhere" rather than, "I read a sales pitch from Hocotate" implies its just fun references for long time fans. I believe this game is a retelling/reboot. Which I really dont like since it would be more fun to have the 4 games directly connected. It is especially frustrating because it wouldn't have required many changes to be connected. Have Olimar's crash clearly be another by having him say he reunited with Pikmin and once again crashed on this planet rather than be discovered. And have the Koppaites mention the events of Pikmin 3 having occured.
This is a Pikmin 3 prequel. There are thousands of alien species in the universe, how are they suppose to know what Pikmin are or that they can help them? As said by other castaways and even the Rescue Corps, they didn't just read the entire voyage log, only snippets. The Koppaites heard about treasure and came over in a rush. To the Koppaites in 4, the Pikmin might be creatures that came from Giya, Hocotate, Ohri, Nijo, etc. Also there are hundreds of thousands of planets out there, how would the SPERO even know to search PNF-404? Obviously because the Koppaites knew the planet was rumored to have edible matter, fruits containing Piktamin U specifially, for them and went to the planet to investigate these claims.
@@flamsey I'm pretty sure they sent a lot of SPEROs around the universe to analyze planet per planet until they found one that had edible matter, that's what it looks like in the intro cutscene for Pikmin 3
@@flamsey They'd check as many of them as possible, starting with the ones closest to their planet, that they don't already know of, of course. Though that's only my interpretation, they may have indeed heard rumors about PNF-404 and decided to check it when all hope was lost, but they could still have just, not done that and just found it by pure luck
Spoilers for pikmin 4 late game: In pikmin 2, Louie's first job working for Hocotate Freight was to deliver the golden pikpik carrots. In pikmin 4, one of his logs reveals he's never tasted them before, and wants to try them. This alone proves that pikmin 4 is a reboot.
@@MrHomelessHobos I am not saying whether it makes sense or not, as anyone can jump to those conclusions. I just wanted to call out how this dude didn't even see the video and commented on a point the video already addressed.
Log #73 is a very very strange one. It's the only one that's short, completely written in a color. While %61 is another out of order, they're the only two.. Next up, we have his logs for the caves that he states he explored them with Moss and sometimes specific pikmin types. In shipwreck mode, he never explores a single cave. When...did he do this? He also has notes on all pikmin types other than glowmin, but he also never discovers anything but the primary 3 types in his mode.
Remember that Olimar's Shipwreck Tale as we play it in Pikmin 4 is literally just Olimar telling us his story- he probably left a lot of those parts out to just tell the main parts of the story. (Also it makes more sense from a gameplay perspective, as Olimar's Shipwreck Tale is basically a retelling of Pikmin 1- hence him only having the 3 original Pikmin types).
Even though I don't agree that Pikmin 4 happens before Pikmin 3 (I just think they all happened chronologically with their numbers, 1234) I'm at least glad that it's not a reboot
Pikmin Devs are the same crazy ass that redubbed Olimar because what he said in his language and ours didn't mean what it meant, change one specifically useless line because Olimar isn't supposed to know human and lots of other thing the only one that don't care is you lmao
It definitly plays after Pikmin 3 and no different Timeline Bullshit! Its confirmed that the Devs planned to put Alph, Brittany and Charlie in Pikmin 4 most likely because they need Food Supplies again for there Planet after Pikmin 3 took place but they were Scapped and replaced by Family Members of them thats a pretty cool idea aswell! I think many People are confused because it seems in the Pikmin 3 Ending the Crew of the Drake saved there Planet but it was most likely there first Food Supply! Its also Possible they returned to PNF-404 because they have seen Olimars SOS-Signal and tried to rescue him once again it was a little bit of a Mistake to Scrap them from the Original Concept of the Datafiles
Yeah, I think it's an alternate dimension. We know that alternate dimensions exist in Pikmin thanks to the wraith entries and the ship in Pikmin 2 (particulary when you obtain the key that unlocks multiplayer).
@@flamsey Perhaps? It's worth noting that Pikmin 2 Challenge Mode would have to transpire AFTER the events of Pikmin 4, as it's implied in Pikmin 4 that Olimar and Louie never commanded Pikmin together. It would make sense if the events of Pikmin 2 challenge mode are the Pikmin 4 dimension's equivalent of the President sending them back to collect treasure. Despite this, I don't think challenge mode has much to do with lore relevance, from what I've seen, other than the fact it confirms there are alternate dimensions in Pikmin (along with the Water and Plasm wraith). If you really wanted to put on the tinfoil hat, you could imagine that the Battle Modes in prior games are a result of alternate versions of the captains encountering each other in caves. Lol
You could also conclude that the events of challenge mode in Pikmin 3 are a timeline where Alph, Brittany, and Charlie never lost their cosmic drive key, hence why they're able to put so much focus and planning into collecting fruit. And if you wanted to be REALLY crazy, you could say that the events of "Defeat Enemies!" mode take place in an alternate dimension where Koppaites feast on flesh rather than fruit, but that's like Game Theory levels of speculation. Lol
Nah, I still strongly feel like a lot of this is reaching, and that the evidence present in Pikmin 4 points to the events of Olimar's Shipwreck Tale being a reimagining of Pikmin 1 - but the game strongly hints that Pikmin 2 is still going to happen (Louie himself admits in some of his text in 4 that he's actively *waiting* for Hocotate Freight to deliver some Golden PikPik Carrots so that he can eat them- and as such, Pikmin 2 hasn't happened yet, but is going to soon). And, like you say- Pikmin 3 is an obvious followup to the events of Pikmin 4. This also makes sense as to why Olimar states in that game that he's been to this planet two times before- once in Pikmin 4 (reimagining the events of 1) and once in Pikmin 2 (which hasn't happened yet as of Pikmin 4). Olimar's Shipwreck Tale, while different to Pikmin 1, also hits all of the major story beats of 1 - crashing, collecting ship parts, and fighting each of the bosses- including Emperor Bulblax (this big elder version now known as Sovereign Bulblax in Pikmin 4). All that's really added is Olimar meeting Moss, and going back to the planet to help her after she started to get sick in space, starting the events of Pikmin 4. One of Olimar's treasure notes also states how he had a perfect pilot's record and didn't have to take a piloting exam until this happened, and is upset that he'll now have to take one- meaning this is his first big space accident.
Interesting. Though a lot would change if Pikmin 4 is a prequel to Pikmin 2. Purples and Whites wouldn't be undiscovered, and the ship would know about the White Pikmin's poison ability. Ship would know about the Waterwraith Olimar's "report" would definitely mention Red Pikmin fire resitance Ultra-Spicy Spray would be undiscovered The upgrades the ship created itself in Pikmin 2 (Scorch Guard, Anti-electrifier, Rush Boots, etc) would've already existed apparently. Louie would not be shocked when he first encounters Pikmin Olimar wouldn't have gone to any of the areas in Pikmin 2. This only happened because that's the area he crash-landed in in Pikmin 1. Olimar would not recognize the Perplexing Pool, Wistful Wild, or the Awakening Wood as places he's been before.
About the piloting exam, I mean, it wasn't Olimar’s fault he crashed in Pikmin 1, it was the autopilot's as stated in the manual, and also nobody knew that Louie fell out of his cockpit in Pikmin 2.
I think the whole situation is just a result of Nintendo’s haphazard and loose approach to things, the timeline is likely linear, Pikmin 1, 2, 3 then 4. but Nintendo is kinda inconsistent on whether or not they like clear continuity in their games, sometimes they do, sometimes they don’t. There’s likely multiple people working on each game with wildly different views on this stuff, which would be the cause of the inconsistency and vague non-answers.
Personally i thought that the louie log means that if louie ever encounter the same situation he did in pikmin 2, he will do it *AGAIN* because he doesnt regret what he did. Also how are golden pikpik carrots his favorite food if he never tried them before ? He doesnt seem to be the type of person who would have enough money to afford But your idea works too. Also, originally i was really confident that it wasnt a reboot, but seeing how they handle other nintendo timelines and how often time they dont really pay much attention to continuity i'd be more careful, hell they could do the same thing they did with the zelda timeline where they split it, then somehow later combine it again...because thats...possible ? i still do think though that it's not a reboot, just dont be surprised if its other wise.
You probably need to look into the Japanese version for clarity, this could be some localization tomfoolery. Wouldn't be the first time that happen. And if that's not really the case, this is simply just Nintendo's method of being inconsistent with their game's story and lore as perusual. Not to mention Pikmin has always been Miyamoto's passion project for years, the same man who tends to stray alway from story elements and dislike RPG games. I wouldn't be surprised if Pikmin 4 has various retcons from the past games.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure in the Spanish translation the music box doesn't mention anything about warning Olimar of future events, but rather that the song sounded familiar to Olimar
Playing Pikmin 4 all the way to the end I feel it’s less of a reboot and more of a “fallen hero” timeline like Zelda. Big spoilers: A koppaite mentions how the planet is going into a food crises which means it has to be before pikmin 3, not only that but also because olimar talks about everything as if it were all new *and* in one of his logs he dreamed the events of pikmin 2. (Commented this to share my thoughts before going into the video)
Olimar doesn't really talk like everything is new. It's just that it's not logical for someone to rewrite every single study you wrote of things differently. And in olimar adventure he was probably trying to make the story more interesting with some of the stuff he said in Pikmin one because he's telling it to a new recruit and it is known that people most of the time when telling a story try to make their story more interesting. (Don't think I'm angry, I'm just explaining from a realistic point of view.)
Also for the Piklopedia entry for the music box that play the main theme of Pikmin 3. Olimar says: "Strange...Despite it's calming tones, something about this melody makes my palm sweat and send shivers down my spine. It's as if it's sending me a warning about unexpected troubles in the future..." So the the events of Pikmin 3 definetly didn't happen yet.
@@tarlaihopehe absolutely does though? literally in his first 2 logs he talks about not knowing what the onions are and naming the pikmin. That’s not how you would realistically talk about these things. Plus these logs aren’t essays, he’s writing them for himself. They aren’t being shown to the president if Louie’s logs are anything to go off of.
personally i also agree because olimar mentions bulbmin in the startle spores piklopedia logs which he meets in and only in 2 and for those saying that pikmin 2 was a dream it is not because otherwise olimar wouldn't mention bulbmin since otherwise he wouldn't know they exist and wouldn't have mentioned it also the pileated snagret and burrowing snarrow are mentioned which of course we see the pileated snagret but the burrowing snarrow was only really talked about in the events of pikmin 1 also as we see in olimars shipwreck tale olimar doesn't go in any caves meaning all cave logs he writes are either from 2 or you could argue once he was a leafling he explored them but we only see him near dandori caves unless he has explored normal caves which is pretty unlikely in my opinion although could be the case also with 3 and the rock pikmin i believe it is just the lighting so all in all i am happy thinking that pikmin 4 hasn't broken the timeline
Personally the way I see Pikmin 4 is like, it isn't a reboot nor is it s continuation of 3 or before 3, but simply a timeline split, Olimar acts as if he never found Pikmin before, and even if his dialogue could be interpreted as he found those onions but with a diff design, onions have never been exactly consistent in the series and I don't think its something to analyze much, all the logs u can find in the game is him DISCOVERING Pikmin behaviour, just like Pikmin 1, the events of his crash landing are also the same so the Pikmin 1 video in the site could very well be the start of Pikmin 1 and the start of Olimar's adventure in 4 since it would be the same events. He has the S.S Dolphin which was sold during Pikmin 2, and while he could totally buy the ship back, him acting as if he never saw the pikmin before makes me throw this idea out. The way i see the timeline is that it splits the second Olimar crashes in the planet, in Pikmin 1 he never finds Moss and makes it out alive, in Pikmin 4 not only he finds Moss but he sends a SOS signal which reaches the Rescue Corp + he ends up being turned into a leafling. The main thing confusing people is Louie but in my eyes this has a pretty simple explanation, yes it is said multiples times Louie is a new employee who has never been sent to a mission beforehand but it is not IMPOSSIBLE for Olimar and Louie to have interacted before Olimar took off, the reason I think Louie appears in 4 is due to the SOS signal, in Louie's logs he explains how he was sent to find Olimar by the President, however Louie barely remembers how Olimar looks, this adds up with the idea that they only interacted a bit in Hocotate, in the pikmin 1 timeline his first mission instead of finding Olimar is taking care of the golden pikpik carrots which leads to him and Olimar joining various "adventures" together in 2 and 3 while in 4 he is NEVER SENT to take care of em cause he was sent to find Olimar. It is also worth mentioning how Koppai's overpopulation problem and lack of food resources is downright mentioned in 4 as if its gonna happen, just not yet, which makes sense since this is at the start of the timeline anyways. As for some of the nods to 2 i think those are just nothing more than cute nods, it is also NEVER NOT stated that Olimar didnt crash before pikmin 1, seeing how he ALWAYS crashes I feel he just doesnt have the greatest of lucks. To put it short, Pikmin 4 is not a reboot or a continuation but just a timeline split, kinda like Zelda, the main timeline would be Pikmin 1's good ending > Pikmin 2 > Pikmin 3 while the other timeline would be an altered Pikmin 1 > Pikmin 4, this helps to not make the last 3 games irrelevant plot wise while explaining inconsistencies + it explains why in the interview they it feels like they treat Pikmin 4 as "its own universe", cause its a diff timeline. Hope this is clear enough lol. I dont CARE that much this is just fun speculation but this just makes more sense to me, good video btw!
@@flamseytranslation error. They got the version on hocotate mixed up with the one olimar found. Also, of course the shipwreck tale doesn’t have the same areas from 1? They aren’t gonna remake those for a side mode. Plus the music clearly implies these areas are meant to be a stand in for the pikmin 1 levels
@@flamsey What exactly is there to explain with the gyroid bust? The way it's worded in pikmin 2 it seems they already had gyroids there that were popular. In no way does it seem olimar needs to discover them in pikmin 2 for them to be a trend on hocotate. It's far easier and makes more sense to believe this is a different timeline where the meteor sends olimar in a different direction
@@flamsey to be fair, from a development stand point i feel they wouldn't just remake all the areas, Who knows really maybe Olimar did Crash in the same area and explored away, we never TRULY know where he exactly crashed in 4. The gyroid is like the one thing kinda messing with my vision tbh, gyroids are popular in hocotate if memory serves and after re-reading the notes, It kinda seems to imply gyroid busts are already a thing in Hocotate anyways? so they could always have their own bust, Pikmin 4 has a lot of contradictory stuff honestly, wish they were clearer with this stuff
4 could still come after 3 depending on how much time has taken place between the two, the seeds the first group brought back may not have matured fully to bear fruit and such yet, leaving Koppai still on the verge of a crisis until that happens.
3:50 my theory would be that he actually wrote the AI for the pikmin 2 ship, in pikmin 2's timeline. Just in this timeline he is able to recite what he'd say directly instead of through the ship's AI.
Olimar crash lands on the planet in 1. The events of Pikmin 1 happen. He completes the objective in 14-15 days. When leaving, he crash lands but falling asteroids again and meets Red Pikmin. When he encounters Yellow and Blue, that is not discovery, but shock, shock to find these creatures again. He meets moss, and falls down again, turning into a leafling. Olimar catalogs his adventure in 1 and 4 as one big event, either for simplicity or for the most likely reason, to avoid trouble. He is the star pilot at Hocotate freight, the Presidents go to man. So for him to realize he not only crashed lands once, but TWICE would lead to him loosing his job. This might be why he never catalogs Purples, Whites, and so on because they would realize that he crashed landed enough times to discover a entire ecosystem. Also, he had fifteen days to find 30 ship parts, he doesn't have time to send everything to Hocotate freight. Also also, it is possible that Olimar lost the logs after leaflifying, since they were not important compared to Dandoi. Meanwhile, the President send Louie to meet up with Olimar, who along the way, takes a bite out of the water wraith, and joining forces with the Umibozu, the supernatural force that pulls the captains to the planet, which is why he loses self control and eats the pikpik carrots in Pikmin 2. Anyway, Louie is saved, and everyone goes home, with Olimar taking longer because he is in the dolphin, while Louie gets there first, does the job, puts the company in dept, Pikmin 2. Pikmin 3 happens, with either the siblings or children of the Koppi group going to the planet. Now, this poses several questions. Why did they not recognize who Olimar was and who Louie was? They were never introduced to Olimar, so he would be a mystery. Louie was not recognized because A. there main mission was to find food, food that was not shared and turned into pure energy. You really think the Koppi people would care about some random jerk when they are starving to death? Also even if they knew what Louie looks like, they would have no way of knowing he is there or who he is. Alph, Brittany, and Charlie had no connection with their family. Aunt Bea and Grandfather Drake never called them, and knew nothing about what the journey was like for them until they came back. Koppi cares about food, so any other detail about Olimar and Louie would be deemed useless, and anyone who did know would not be able to help Charlie and Gang stop him. Pikmin 3 plays out and all the lore with that, modern timeline. That's it.
I think it's dumb that they named the game Pikmin 4 since it's not a sequel to Pikmin 3 but rather a prequel so it makes more sense it being called Pikmin 2,5
FNAF 2 was called FNAF 2 despite being the prequel to FNAF 1, and FNAF 4 was a prequel to FNAF 2 despite being named 4. Tarzan II was a prequel despite being named as a sequel. Little Nightmares II was a prequel to Little Nightmares. Yoshi's Island's full title is "Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island", and it's a prequel to the Mario games at that point. Metal Gear Solid 3, one of the greatest games made in media, is also a prequel despite its name. This is uncommon, but still around, in multimedia today. Nothing special.
I don’t get why I don’t see anyone else pointing this out: pikmin 4 came after pikmin 3; pikmin 3’s canon ending is the neutral ending, so Kopaii is heading back towards a critically low food supply
@@gay4sswhovian ok let me break this down for you; the neutral ending of pikmin 3 says that kopai may not be able to sustain itself off of the seeds brought back. So, if they fail to do so, then they'd be heading towards another food crisis, and that **Second** food crisis is the one from pikmin 4. Nothing says its Kopai's **First** food crisis in pikmin 4
My headcanon is that Olimar has crashlanded on a compleatly different side of PNF-404. Or it's a split timeline that's an alt route to the bad ending of 1.
Imo I believe it takes place after two and before 3 due to a line saying how much the koppites eat it’s bound for a food shortage and also some of the items which are in 1/2/4 but not 3 (Swarm Trumpet and Plucking Whistle) would make sense on why 4 takes place before two. Probably a stretch but still
My personal headcanon rn is similar to the dragon break totk theaory, where multiple timlines run concurrently and converge at a certain point. I think pikmin 1 + 2 AND pikmin 4 both lead to the pikmin 3 give or take a few contradictions. The first two games occupy their own timlines adjacent to 4, but the events of both timelines all lead to the same events occurring in pikmin 3
I like to assume these three things, because it's funnier: * Olimar bought back the SS Dolphin with a raise the President gave him through the massive riches-boost in Pikmin 2 * He's pretending it's the first time he crashed on the planet to save face, because it'd be embarassing to have crashed there *three times* * Louie is planning to eat Golden Pikpik carrots AGAIN despite the hot water it landed him in last time * The reason Louie acts so weird is because he ate so many poisonous animals it permanently altered his brain chemistry
Honestly i think this is just a retelling of the first Pikmin game, and then Pikmin 2 happens and so on. Louie talking about wanting to eat golden Pik Pik carrots, and one of Olimars log entries talking about a Nightmare about his Company going into debt.
Before watching: Copium lets see if i change my mind after this. Edit: Nope, you're trying way to hard to stretch out to make these connections make sense but theres just too many contradictions that dont work, placing it somehow between the events before and in between the first 3 games. It only makes sense if they started over while only keeping some elements consistant to pay respect to its history. I get it, you all hate the idea of a reboot but you have to accept what they made.
So it's another example of Nintendo of America's translators "punching up" vague Japanese phrasing. This is so commonplace that characterization and character origin stories in games like Fire Emblem are night and day different. I'm actually amazed how many people immediately latched onto the Pikmin 4 English translation like it was the be-all end-all source when really we desperately need someone willing to do a deep dive into the Japanese version.
but some of these logs make it seem like olimar has met the pikmin for the first time. this cant have happened before pikmin 1 because louie is here. if anything it just seems like nintendo just stucj random elements from the other pikmin games together because refferences.
Olimar already knew about the pikmin, he didn’t have louie in his “olimar’s shipwrecked tale” and olimar always gets the bad ending in the side mode unlike pikmin 1.
fun fact: according to the 66th entry in olimar's voyage log, pikmin 2 could be just a nightmare. it says: "Last night, I dreamt that one of my subordinates made a terrible mistake that put the company in a huge amount of debt. Too big for Hocotate Freight to pay back quickly... This is why I never take on debt. Anyway, when in woke up, i burst into a fit of laughter!"
@@flamsey Issue: Olimar has the SS Dolphin which he doesn’t have in and is still relenting the loss of in 3 (and before anyone talks about the SS Dolphin name in 3, the Hocotate ship’s JP name is the Dolphin Unit 1, leading to a chance of it being a legitimate mess up on the translators side for the subs of the logs) the logic here if it is in mainline in the most commonly assumed placement is that he gained it back from all devouring black hole loansharks, crashed onto pnf-404 AGAIN, Repaired it AGAIN, crashed AGAIN immediately after and got saved a month later after being a dandori obessed lunatic only to have to deal with louie being annoying AGAIN while louie completely forgot he ate golden pikpik carrots and what his main co worker looks like for some reason… before losing it for a second time to a debt. sorry but i find it hard to believe that and just find that it complicates things over “its just a reboot or an alternate timeline where olimar met a dog.”
I’m pretty sure thats supposed to be irony. No one besides Louie knows the truth of what happened to the golden pikpik carrots so Olimar having a nightmare about Louie causing the debt and just laughing it off is supposed to be ironic.
@@ApolloDawn85 I like that interpretation, but to me it more so seems to be suggesting that the whole debt in general never happened and he finds it amusing that louie could cause one, but really it could work both ways, as in he dreamt that louie could've gotten them into another debt
Nice video bro The only reason why I don't believe it is because of the way Olimar talks about the Pikmin in the intro cutscene like if he just met them for the first time, aswell as the addition of the dog (Moss screwed up the possibility of that cutscene being just Pikmin 1), he even describe why he named them 'Pikmin'. There's also the Shipwreck Tale, basically a retelling of Pikmin 1 (but with the dog as a plus) until Olimar crashes and is turned into a leafling (which them proceed for the rest of the story in Pikmin 4). And that's why your theory doesn't work for me, if Pikmin 4 is the first time Olimar crashed (given his reaction), and he couldn't return to Hocotate, this means Pikmin 2 didn't happened yet, because Olimar never discovered about the treasures in PNF-404 in Pikmin 1 and never warned the president about it. Like, in Pikmin 2 the rest of Hocatate discover PNF-404 because of the treasures Olimar bring back, while in Pikmin 4 they only know about it because Olimar is lost. My only theory for why this happens is just... Nintendo being Nintendo and forgetting continuity, really disappointing, honestly. I think originally Pikmin 4 was going to be a straight up sequel from where Pikmin 3 left off, this would explain why some details points to it, but the project sitted for so long they just decided to reintroduce the series to new players and reboot it as a new universe (probably the same thing that happened twice with the Star Fox franchise, unfortunately). The only thing I hope is that Nintendo finally gives continuity in this new setting, it would be a great chance to remake Pikmin 2 and 3 with an even greater plot than they had originally (I think this can happen given the references made in 4 to 3 and 2). Sorry for bad english grammar, me not native speaker.
Another thing is that the third koppait talks about Charlie as a duck obsessed person. And a weird thing is that they say their planet will soon be starving because they don't cultivate, they just eat what they find (I'm playing the french version so maybe the english one doesn't mention it)
It's impossible for it to be the same story because koppites visit pnf 404 in pikmin 4 before the food crisis, but in Pikmin 3 the food crisis is happening while they discover it, not to mention it's a completely different trip of adventurers that go
My take: Pikmin 1 = story rewritten Pikmin 2 = a dream Pikmin 3 = after pikmin 4 We never see Olimar find the first red Onion on Pikmin 4 so the impact site being on the webpage makes sense. Not to mention the first cutscene which literally show us Olimar encountering the Pikmin for the first time.
@@flamsey It doesn’t really need to be the same one. They didn’t made the impact site playable so it would just be best to place a cutscene from Pikmin 1 since the events would basically play out the same way. They didn’t want to bring back the separated onions so they probably just decided to give it a new look that would look good with all onions fused. Theres also the possibility that Nintendo didn’t give a fuck about the story line and continuation. I can see this being a thing since Miyanoto is a big part of this game and they have already done this with Zelda. They just make the game and then try to join the puzzle pieces later.
Thankyou! I been arguing with people about this since the gamecame out. Tje creators themselves literally say it's a not a reboot it takes place a few years after pikmin 3s events. They literally say that in their interview articles
@@flamsey yo youtube keeps deleting my reply I dont know why. >:( it's an article their is part 1 through 3. It's in part 2. I guess jsut type in pikmin 4 Nintendo interview with the creators. It should pop up. When I post the link TH-cam deletes it
With the AMOUNT of times Olimar crashed on PNF-404, I'm willing to believe that he suffers from memory loss due to the crashes. Hence why he keeps forgetting about the Pikmin time after time.😂
I actually thought that it wasn’t a reboot because miamto said that “you don’t have to know what happens in the other games to play it” and the trio who were taken by Louie The Green one says that he used to have a coworker who loved rubber ducks so that’s Charily and I think the Blue one said that he has a cousin called Alph
Possible relationships between characters doesn't cause 4 to not be a reboot or a different timeline. The characters exist, yet certain things haven't happened yet. If 4 is between 2 and 3, then the characters obviously exist, but the events of 3 obviously did not happen yet. If 4 is just a "what if", the characters still exist since it's still the same world and universe all around, just a different timeline. The green character who knows Charlie doesn't prove 4 to be a sequel, all it does is prove that 4 is in fact in the same universe, with the same planet and for the most part, it's an easter egg for older Pikmin fans.
No offense but I think you’re overthinking this. So the shipwreck tale is in my opinion supposed to be the very first time olimar came to the planet as the events leading up to the crash are exactly the same. So Pikmin 1 did get a soft reboot but aside from the locations and the addition of moss, it is the same story that includes both endings in Pikmin 1 as canon ( if you find all the parts in time). Pikmin 2 still technically happened but only as a dream with Louie’s entry in Pikmin for about the golden carrots just being an nod to Pikmin 2. And as you mentioned Pikmin 3 takes place after Pikmin 4. I think the dream aspect works well as it would explain why the onions look so different because it was olimar’s subconscious recreating it from memory after all the onion in Pikmin 4 has the more organic bulb from the first 2 games but has the flexible tentacle legs from Pikmin 3. A subconscious trying to replicate this could explain the differences. I do admit this doesn’t explain why the onion looks different in Pikmin 3 if that is after 4.
I think it's a time warp He always crashes on the planet because the planet doesn't let him leave I believe in the Umibozu theory. The Umibozu keeps him on the planet because he wants to keep Olimar, the captain of a ship that came too near. Whenever Olimar manages to escape, he brings him back immediately by either rewinding time or using Louie for his schemes who's somehow rooted to the planet, as he doesn't want to leave it and even visits it all by himself for unknown reasons when he finds Moss and immediately befriends her. Louie manages to tame giant enemies like the Titan Dweevil and the Ancient Sirehound. Usually, dweevils and dogs are not hostile, but Louie somehow makes them dangerous with dark mysterious powers. Why do the Sirehound's eyes glow in such a deep scary red color before it is defeated and why is the Titan Dweevil black before he loses his weapons and becomes harmless? Why do his eyes pulsate in funky colors? Parasitic infestation? Louie knows what happens when you eat the Waterwraith. Has he eaten it and got possessed by the Umibozu that the Waterwraith clearly is based on? Why does Louie eat the golden pikpik carrots? So Olimar has to come back to the planet. Why does Oatchi grow a leaf? So it can't leave with the crew that has Olimar. Did you also know that the Waterwraiths would ONLY attack Olimar in the Bully Den challenge in Pikmin 2? It doesn't care about Louie at all. Also, what is it with the Goolix? Just like the Waterwraith and the Plasm Wraith, they are all fluid and leave no corpse when they die, but goop. Are they linked to each other? The Goolix leaves blue goop when it dies. Do you know what other enemy leaves blue goop when it dies? The Titan Dweevil. What's that mysterious ship crashing on the planet at the end of Pikmin 3's credits? It's Olimar. Once again. Seeking for ship parts or paying another debt. He will never see his family again.
I feel like theres a lot of coping here. Its most likely an alternative timeline or just takes place after 1's bad ending. The Rock Pikmin and onion things are quite the stretch imo
@@Yoshizuyuner I don't even care what the story might be now, I just feel like this video has a few things that don't entirely make sense. But whatever, trying to reason with people online is a waste of time
@@Alexgodofwar5662 I'm not braindead I know what it is. This video has a lot of things in it that are really looking for ties to other things, like the rock Pikmin and onion things I mentioned. I'm using common sense to realize that, just maybe, these things are a bit farfetched. And I'm using critical thinking to realize that this theory makes little sense on how it placed 4 in the timeline since it's kinda thrown in there haphazardly. If you think differently than me, that's fine I don't care, I just had an opinion that I wanted to share
This is one thing I kinda don't like about the Nintendo community, every Nintendo game they find some inconsistency and immediately assume it's a reboot or wants to totally re work the timeline.
In Louie's golden pikpik note, he doesn't have his helmet so it's likely that he thought it on hocotate also he has been on the planet before because he doesn't have recipes for the pikmin and knows how to use them. If it was his first time he would have eaten every pikmin in sight and not know how onions work.
It is a retelling why would there be another “food epidemic” for Alph Brittany and Charlie. And for Louie if you notice he does not ‘remember’ Olimar, that’s because Pikmin 2 has yet to happen, which is also hinted at the fact that in Olimar’s Voyage Log #66 he mentions a dream he had in which Louie causes Hocotate to be in debt. Louie not remembering Olimar, not having yet to eat the golden pik pik carrots means this is an entirely different timeline/universe. Or…..a reboot. Not to also mention it’s strange that Olimar did not know about the other Pikmin yet, meaning challenge mode or Olimars Shipwreck Tale, really is a different retelling of Pikmin 1 except Olimar never left PNF-404. So again either this is a reboot or just some other timeline.
I think it's a soft reboot, changes things, but basically the same things happening, olimar still only gets the red yellow and blue as seen, given this; pikmin 4, what we are doing, takes place after pikmin 1, pikmin 2 happens when they get home from the planet, louies diologue with #20 note telling us his plan outright and it being the direct cause of pikmin 2, followed by pikmin 3, it doesn't change much story wise, but it does change things.
I don’t mind if people want to theorize how Pikmin 4 fits in with other games narratively, but I’m sick and tired of Pikmin fans (especially the subreddit) trying to force the whole “Pikmin 2 was a dream,” “Pikmin 1 is retconned”, etc. Fans are too caught up in their own obsession of “continuity” while I can guarantee you Nintendo does not care. This is the same franchise where Earth in Pikmin 2 looked like our current Earth while Earth in Pikmin 3 looks like Earth billion of years in the future. Nintendo seriously could not care about lore and continuity.
The way I see it is that people are just trying to grasp at straws to make pikmin 4 fit the main timeline because of how awaited the game was so even though it really sucks we just gotta come to terms that pikmin 4 is just not cannon
with all this talk of where it is on the timeline, I for one still go with it being after 3. While there is not much to go off of for this the main things I have found are: there's a conversation between Collin and Olimar where it's mentioned that Olimar is famous for his adventures but Olimar gets upset about this due to said adventures being caused by his ship crashing. While not outright saying how many times this has happened it has happened enough for word to get around hence why everybody came to the planet because it was Olimar's logs A good amount of Olimar talking about treasures is him saying how he is now middle aged, worn out from working so long, and wanting to see his family to the point he is about to just throw caution to the wind an ask his boss for a promotion or more time off even if it risk being fired and finally how 3 and 4 focus on other characters besides olimar. 5 could have it where after having enough Olimar talks to the president and gets fired and then your player steps in as a replacement and after winding up on PNF 404 again Olimar eventually arrives there as well to save you/help out since he knows the planet well resulting in him getting his job back and hopefully promoted. again yes I know the timeline is wonky about where and when this is but still if it's no exact saying where in the timeline it is then it could still be a continuation after 4
@@flamsey I'm pretty sure in the Spanish translation the music box doesn't mention anything about warning Olimar of future events, but rather that the song sounded familiar to Olimar, so it could be something added to the English translation and not be what it said in the og notes about the treasure in Japanse
One other thing that caught my eye was that during one of the nights during the Olimar side mode, Olimar talks about how he crashed by another meteor and that perhaps he could’ve avoided it, but that another force may be at play forcing him to the planet. The way he phrases it makes it feel like he’s crashed on the planet because of a meteor at least once before (which would be an accident) and that he feels like he could’ve seen it coming this time but still hit it.
I'm sorry but I can't be convinced by this at all. You interpret the various lines (both from the developers and in-game) with a wild bias towards your own theory. Various of Olimar's logs are based off of his pikmin 1 ones (especially the ones where he talks about his family, the nightmare where the pikmin carry him to the onion, and the "I am so very tired" line) All other lines referencing pikmin 2 and 3 events CLEARLY reference them as not having happened yet. The appraiser that designed the appraising A.I has similar ideas about an object as the A.I space ship with apprasial capabilities? No way. All evidence clearly points towards pikmin 4 taking place after a pikmin 1 bad ending, although with the events of pikmin 1 being altered in various ways (For example Moss, which is the factor that dooms Olimar to the bad ending.)
i like to imagine that pikmin 4 takes place in a diverging timeline, where if olimar crashes in the Impact Site, it goes 1 -> 2 -> 3. but if he crashes in the sun speckled terrace we get 4 and potentially the other future games. i always wanted to see what happens after olimar's comeback in 3. maybe I could make a fangame about it if I knew how to code.
"Yeah, these are just new onions that's why Olimar doesn't recognize them" - That's a huge stretch. They just look different for the sake of looking different. Nintendo probably just wants them to look "New and modern!". The onion in 3 was obviously supposed to look modern, thus the whole non-organic vibe. People didn't like the non-organic look, thus they changed it again. "Why not the old onions?" - because they wanted something new. The old onions are a bit outdated and might not go well with modern graphics, they might've also just wanted to go a fully organic route for the onion. Besides. If Olimar already knows Pikmin, and is only surprised by the different looks and the fact they merge, why is he still acting surprised by blues and yellows? Olimar is smart enough to think "Oh, these are probably blue Pikmin!" and not be surprised that there are in fact blue onions. "Crash landing obviously refers to Pikmin 1" - So Olimar also saying that its the first time he crash landed on pnf-404 doesn't exist, or? Treasures - Again, references. With a hint of laziness. Most people who will play 4 haven't even touched 2. Many in the Pikmin fandom haven't even touched 2 and most have certainly not read the treasure logs. Pikmin had references in most games to previous games, so it's not a surprise there are references in 4. Dialoge - It doesn't sound like Olimar wants to talk about the space bunny incident. It just sounds like he talks about his job. It's a joke that Olimar misunderstood what Collin wanted. "The log about the PikPik carrots is just old" - why should it be in the game, with no timestamp or anything else like a log saying "Yeah, Olimar and I (Louie) were on pnf 404", if it's just an old log? Every player who doesn't know about older games is just going to assume Louie is planning to do that, and not that it already happened. Ok I won't mention more, but. You argue the same way people argue that Pikmin 4 is a sequel to 3. The same exakt way. "That's just an assumption", "Event x already happened", "It's just another food crisis!!!!" etc. etc. The same exakt way. Arguments about 4 not being a new timeline/a reboot/whatever are all just speculation, while arguments regarding 4 being a dif timeline/reboot/whatever are mostly based on what we have. Koppai is not in a food crisis yet, Louie wants to steal pikpik carrots, Olimar doesn't know the Pikmin or planet etc. etc. No assuming, just what we straight up got from the game. Pikmin 4 is a mess, especially with devs not straight up saying its a sequel, a reboot or somewhere inbetween. If it were inbetween, they'd say it, and not go "Yeah, whatever people think". Nintendo doesn't care about continuity. They want money. Pikmin games don't really need continuity to work, so it's fine if they just randomly decide to have 4 be a reboot or just a game with no coherent story fitting to previous game.
@@flamsey No arguments? Btw., Olimar DOES say he is on an unknown planet. It wouldn't be an unknown planet if it were after 1 or 2. So the wording of the other dude was maybe a bit off, but he wasn't completely mistaken.
Hmm, I think a lot of the points you made were really stretching it. I disagree with your point, though with how aggravatingly vague Nintendo was about it I can’t say you’re wrong. Particularly Olimar’s first encounter with yellow Pikmin, that’s definitely not some little joke he was making, he’s not really the kind of guy to do that, and it just did not sound at all like a joke. Also, Miyamoto saying that the games never sold well, REALLY makes it sound like he wanted a complete reboot. (But again, it’s vague so ugh, who knows) The website is very interesting, I’ll give you that. Olimar left behind the Dolphin in Pikmin 4, he couldn’t have ‘bought it back’ in Pikmin 3. Also I think him saying it’s his second time on the planet is definitely talking about 1 and 2 as separate times since they had totally different reasons for being there. But this one could easily be retconned Also I SWEAR the Koppaites in 3 mention the planet is uncharted… As for Schauz’s notes, it could just be Nintendo throwing in a fun little reference, but it could go either way. I don’t think Olimar’s note is talking about Pikmin 1 at all, he’s probably been hit by a meteor before. He said it was an emergency landing, not a crash landing, big difference. If Louie’s notes on the PikPik carrots is old, why is it at the end after brand, fresh notes? Yeah Olimar’s are weirdly out of order but that could just be him sorting them or something. And besides Louie’s aren’t. Also how do you explain Olimar’s notes about dreaming about Pikmin 2? Surely he would have mentioned something about it “happening again” Overall I just think Olimar’s general tone about everything screams that this is his first time on the planet. You can make theories by explaining all the little stuff without outright contradicting something but when you look at the big picture, it just seems REALLY, really unlikely. But at least there is something we can all agree on, screw Nintendo for making the timeline so confusing. It really hurt the game. But still thank you Nintendo for giving us Pikmin 4 at all so…
@@flamsey Yeah that was my point, he was genuinely like “whoa yellow Pikmin? I’ve never seen these what do they do?” We have to remember that this is Olimar retelling the story, he’s probably skipping over bits of him being interested by new types because the rescue corps already know what they do.
@@flamsey hmm, true true Isn’t there another voyage log from him without his helmet that was definitely written during 4 though? There might not be but I swear there was…
It might still be a reboot. If it was, this implies that PNF-404 became a popular tourist spot before Olimar crash landed. If it wasn't, the gap between 3 and 4 and the reappearance of the Dolphin may be explained by the Pikmin Short Movies, where Olimar salvages trillions of Pokos from a collapsed excavator(probably enough to buy back the ship).
Pikmin 4 is probably a reboot in the timeline, there's honestly no getting around that, but it's far from being a reboot of the world building of PNF-404. 4 goes out of it's way to tell you that creatures from previous games still exist on the planet, we just dont see them in-game. Remember, we are in a completely different part of the planet from the previous 3 games, so we can only observe the creatures in the area we're exploring. Joustmites are still part of the Burrow-nit Family, Munge Dweevils existed at one point, Sovereign Bulblaxes could be what the P1 Emperor actually was, etc. The game takes place on the same planet with the same creatures, flora, and fauna, Olimar just happened to crash in the Rescue Command Post instead of The Impact Site.
i still have some reservations about all this. the game begins with olimar having a partially-rebuilt dolphin in a retelling of pikmin 1 with a different set of areas and of course the addition of moss, and if pikmin 2 really did happen beforehand then the dolphin shouldn't be here at all- he would have already been back to hocotate, where the ship would then be taken from him im fine if nintendo doesnt really care to uphold continuity but the decisions they make regarding koppai and the trio from pikmin 3 feel almost,,, disrespectful? we get a batch of 3 koppaites who are clearly meant to call back to alph brittany and charlie and yet come across like dollar store ripoffs, when it would have been just as easy to justify them specifically being here too, a little like a certain other someone and that other someone is louie, whos inclusion honestly totally baffles me. its decently likely that the president got olimar's SOS too and told louie to go look for him but at no point does the game explain how he even gets there (wouldn't we have seen the pink ship?) and he just goes on to obstruct the player and the rest of the rescue force because, thats just what he does now the game wants so badly to be like pikmin 2 and its not just the cave system. it quite literally directly follows the events of pikmin 1 (soon after the 30 day limit on olimar's life support gives up and he becomes a leafling), and then theres all this implication that pikmin 3 is yet to occur, due to multiple references to koppaites suffering from overpopulation that will some day lead to a food crisis i still absolutely love pikmin 4, i have my holdups about some of the gameplay direction and im having an absolute blast getting every possible platinum medal and finding out just how quickly and efficiently overworlds can be cleared, but i dont think the story decisions reflect an avoidance of continuity but something of a rolling back of it and i hope this doesnt continue to be the case in the future because the pikmin storyline honestly rules
All this is thrown out the window with the intro animated cutscenes and olimarta first logs, he states its his first time here, and its his first time encountering anything on this planet. Im sorry, you cant use logs and skip OLIMARS GUIDES!!!
Finally someone with this opinion ✊. Im beginning to whatch this and just wanna say that tehnically pikmin 4 could be after 2 but before 3 because olimar knows louie And there is no koppai crisis. And i have a feeling that pikmin will become fnaf with its lore sometime im the future
Thank you, so many people insist it's a reboot like it's an absolute fact when there's so much evidence that olimar's been there before like for example several piklopediua entries referencing species that only showed up in previous games, the lore about the Bulborb being renamed, and going back to references to previous species.. olimar's notes on the horned cannon beetle continue the implications throughout the series that the armoured cannon beetle species has become increasingly sparse and endangered since some time after pikmin 1
I don't get why people like.... care, Legend of Zelda and Mario reboot with practically every game, only a few genuine sequels existing in the franchises and no one goes nuts over that. just seems a little weird to go like "oh no now pikmin 2 didn't happen in this fictional timeline!" like... pikmin 2 still exists, you can pay it on the switch why do you care about the fictional continuity?
I never thought it was a reboot... If they want to reboot it, they can go on and say it. All of these contradicting errors.. can just be errors. I think the people engaging in the argument care more about this than Nintendo
Pikmin 4 is masterpiece I’m planning 100% the game that tells you this game is amazing I pour hours and hours to pikmin 4 this game wasn’t my first pikmin game the 3rd was my first but buy pikmin 4 you won’t regret it now here is my reasons first the caves are very good they are so many unique caves also it just fits pikmin 4 really well and oatchi is welcome edition to pikmin 4 and they add night expeditions that was just great idea to add glow pikmin are just so unique to other pikmin types also ice pikmin are weird and no one want ice pikmin but they are good pikmin type surprisely I enjoy how they were used in the game I could go on but we would be here for hour lol but just Buy pikmin 4 where we could get a pikmin 5 and again you won’t regret and I know it
Voyage log #20 might be the biggest piece of evidence that this takes place before pikmin 2 to me. Isn't it odd how you get this log right after beating the last boss? And two, LDS might have happened right before louie arrived on the planet. Its possible that the president sent him in the hocotate ship to find olimar so he can have his two best employees back on the job to repay the debt
Which cannon is accurate, Pikmin 3 or Pikmin 3 Deluxe? Apparently, as you said, there are contradictions in Pikmin 3 Deluxe. I never played the Deluxe version. I don't wanna deal with those worse controls. Haha!
Even if it’s not a reboot, I still don’t like how unnecessarily confusing Nintendo made the timeline here. There is no reason it had to be like this
Then there's the loz timeline. Not even NINTENDO THEMSELVES knows it, and they are the ones who made it!
Classic Nintendo and their aversion to storytelling.
Disagreed. I actually hope its a different timeline/reboot cuz then it would be less confusing imo.
Its as simple as, in this timeline dogs managed to survive and evolved from whatever killed off humans, they got smaller and smaller until we got our 3 dogs.
In this timeline, Olimar meets Moss and tries to escape but because of Moss, met his demise. He turned into a leafling, but before he did he sent out an S.O.S. for help, which caused a bunch of people to start exploring this unknown planet. Then the game just happens at a different part of the world. Then thats just it.
The Pikmin 3 trio dont come because they didnt happen to partner up yet, as it happens during the time Pikmin 1 would.
I dont think its too confusing or complicated UNLESS i think about it like its not a reboot. I try doing that and not everything lines up, but as a reboot i feel its all easy to explain.
I imagine it's a "what if?" type thing. What if Olimar managed to get more help?
Wait until you see the zelda timeline.
I can all-but guarantee if you asked any of the Pikmin writers/producers/directors whether or not 4 is a retcon, they'd say something like "really it's up to the players, ya know"
This reeks of "who is Bowser Jr's mother" talk. You will never get a straight forward answer because Nintendo does NOT CARE about continuity. In fact, they might just outright hate it for some reason.
I don't think they don't care Miyamoto seems paranoid and wants to make sure this game sells well
@flamsey not a reboot just redesigns for onions
@@flamseyalso idea If onion get a onion seed maybe to fuse with the same color of onion?
@@skistorm739wdym I don't understand. What's an onion seed
@@flamsey if their pikmin have a seed as a fail safe from extinction
If I am not mistaken, I think that at some point in Pikmin 3, the characters can have a discussion about how greedy Koppaians are with their food and that they are worried that even if they return successfully, that history might repeat itself, so maybe the upcoming food crisis mentioned in Pikmin 4 is a different one from the one from Pikmin 3.
Considering how often history repeats itself in this series (crash landings, debts, Louie being Louie) it is at least my head-canon, even if I am misremembering this conversation
They do say that. However, given what Olimar says, and that they never talk about a food crisis that happened before, it's safe to say it isn't different food crisises or something
that is true@@flamsey
I feel like the Yorke, Nelle, and Don Bergman were originally going to be Alph, Brittany, and Charlie but it was changed since otherwise Pikmin 3 wouldn't be their first time going to PNF-404
@@flamsey FLAMSEY THE ROCK PIKMIN SITUATION MAKES ABSOLUETLY NO SENSE, BECAUSE ALL PIKMIN TYPES HAD LIGHTER COLORS IN PIKMIN 3 THEN IN 4 AND THAT PROMO ART FOR P3 AND HEY! PIKMIN SHOW ROCK PIKMIN WITH DARKER COLORS! ALSO WHY WOULD OLIMAR A GUY WHO DOES SCIENTIFIC WORK THINK THAT ROCK PIKMIN ARE NEW BECAUSE OF THERE COLOR?! ( also flamsey the garden website, it has stuff that shows pikmin 3 happened before pikmin 4)
@@levyguerra2208 again like I said the third party that worked on the port didn't know Pikmin 4 was a prequel
I like how the explanation for munge to venom dweevils is just "there used to be purple ones"
Personally, I think of Pikmin 4 as an alternate timeline rather than a reboot. I don't really see it as a bad thing either, it allows them to explore neglected concepts like the bad ending of Pikmin 1, and lets old enemies like the waterwraith reappear in a way that makes sense.
Exactly
Pikmin 4 happened after Pikmin 3 and you ain’t changing my mind
@@WhitePikm1n okay..? I didn't say your opinion was invalid lol, I was just sharing my personal take
In many ways it feels like an alternate version of pikmin 2 to me.
SPOILERS
Like it seems to refrence pikmin 2 alot with things like the stuff they did with Louie.
and some caves feel like different versions of the pikmin 2 caves.
Like for example
Engulfed castle/submerged castle hole of hero's/cavern for a king
Gluttons kitchen/plunder palace
@@WhitePikm1nNigga nobody was going against your opinion
Good Job, I personally buy it being post-2 pre-3, since the Japanese website refences the events of 3 in a very specific way, Louie IS IN THE GAME, a group of Koppaites refence the in-sighting incident of 3 as being on-going, Olimar refers to the title theme from 3 playing from a treasure as being foreboding as if signling future troubles for him, Olimar has a dream about the events about of Pikmin 2 and etc.
.. a dream where he laughs off the idea as ridiculous.
Louie existing doesn't mean it has to be after 2. Louie didn't pop into existence in-universe during Pikmin 2.
Since Koppai hasn't suffered from the overpopulation crisis yet, this must be before Pikmin 3. Louie doesn't remember Olimar's face very well, so it's before 2. But then, it MUST be after 1, or otherwise he would have known about the pikmin during Pikmin 1. But there's nothing between Pikmin 1 and 2: Pikmin 2 follows exactly where Pikmin 1 left off. This is why I think Pikmin 4 is a reboot of Pikmin 1, story-wise.
@@syweb2considering how much of a horror creature Louie is, I could believe he manifested into existence just before 2 lol
@@syweb2 Yes but before Pikmin 2 Louie didn't know Olimar and he didn't join hocotate freight until just a little before 2
I really want to believe it isn't a reboot, but everything makes so much more sense from the reboot perspective. All of the Pikmin 3 deluxe stuff would make sense. Louie's log about the golden pikpik carrots really makes more sense to be foreshadowing for the events of Pikmin 2 (which haven't happened yet in this timeline). Even the log about the Cupid's Grenade could be explained, as Schnauz wrote the naming AI for the Pikmin 4 ship, so it would make sense that in the Pikmin 2 timeline he wrote the AI for that ship as well (meaning that it knew the poetry because Schnauz had heard it before and programmed it into the ship). Olimar's dialogue in the Shipwreck Tale makes more sense if that was his first time on the planet, as does the dialogue in the intro where he talks about "discovering" pikmin.
No it doesn't lmao it's just that y'all are lazy and don't understand how fiction work
I personally feel like the events of olimar's crash have 2 alternate realities, one which is the the events of pikmin 1 and the other is were olimar meets Moss, which eventually results in olimar not escaping the planet.
Which results in a parallel to 1's bad ending, which begs the question... will we get an Original Universe Pikmin 4?
i think so too
I thought of that too
@@Skeleton_Dork * Hey Pikmin lurks in the background *
You don't say shit like this in fiction lmao when you wanna prove that there is even a split timeline THERE SHOULD BE TIME TRAVELLINGS WICH DONNT HAPPEN IN PIKMIN SINCE ITS HARD SCI FI LMAP
I feel like it’s a scenario of a fork in the road where it’s like "What would happened if Olimar did or didn’t escape PNF-404?" When he does escape it leads to the timeline of Pikmin 2 while if he doesn’t, it leads to the timeline of Pikmin 4 where Pikmin 2 does not exist in that timeline, then both lead back to Pikmin 3. If there’s any flaws to my theory then go ahead and explain why.
I'd like to think that as well
Pikmin 2 is the least fitting game in this timeline, plus in a voyage log Olimar states that he had a dream in which the company he works for went bankrupt thanks to an employee which we know was Louie
I don't think that's the case, not only does 4 allude to other games like 1 and 2, but also it's not a matter of retelling an alternate outcome of 1, because in this game, Olimar does not fail, it's because of Moss that he has to go back and fail, the key difference here is Moss.
I think it's either between 2 and 3, or after 3.
I don't think this is a theory no more, it's clearly stated this is cannon
@@GlockensphealHow ? Olimar never bought back the Dolphin to make my knowledge,Louie states that he wants to eat golden pikpik carrots but didn't find a way yet,Koppai's famine didn't happen yet and Louie's logs suggest it's the first time he saw Pikmins.
I hate the way its so confusing like its a reboot and its not??
Like in the data files Louie says: "got sick of nana's cookies so i tried eating the creatures. they were pretty yummy."
But Louie has already tried eating the creatures on PNF-404 in pikmin 2 and 3. And Olimar also isn't familiar with what the pikmin do unlike in pikmin 3.. of course this could just be gameplay stuff for new players to understand more behind the characters but its just so confusing.
Besides if Olimar was familiar with all the pikmin (not ice and glow) it wouldn't spoil anything so why couldn't they just make it so Olimar is familiar with all the pikmin just like in pikmin 3. idk
Choosing to believe this because I really hate the idea of Pikmin 4 being a reboot.
People are overthinking this way too much, the game acts like 2 and 3 haven't happened so they didn't happen, the reason 4 is a alternate version of Pikmin 1 is because it allows them to naturally and easily include Olimar in the story
Olimar talks about discovering pikmin in the opening cutscene and in the logs sounds like he's discovering everything for the first time. I also remember a conversation with the Koppaites talking about how their planet is suffering from overpopulation and may enter a food crisis soon, meaning this game would likely be before Pikmin 3.
The shipwreck tale seems to me like a not so accurate portrayal of what Olimar saw based on the lack of caves or pikmin types other than the main three
Edit: oh, you talked about all of that in the video. I still believe it's an alternate scenario in which the bad ending if the first game takes place, with Moss being an excuse for it to happen even if Olimar fully repaired his ship
I personally think that there’s evidence to imply Pikmin 4 taking place right after Pikmin 1 and before Pikmin 2 as well.
First of all, Olimar’s Shipwrecked Tale. Since he already seems well versed with the main 3 Pikmin in this mode, and he had 15 days of oxygen to get all his parts instead of 30, it can be inferred that Pikmin 1 canonically was a 15 day ordeal for Olimar, with him crashing before even leaving PNF-404 for a second time. This would make the 15 days in Olimar’s Tale make more sense as well as him being to the planet twice by then.
For Piklopedia entries, all enemies in Pikmin 2 share their entries in 2 and 4, but some of these entries didn’t make sense even back then. The waterwraith’s entry in particular was physically impossible in 2, as only 3 people ever encountered it back then. I also think the series going 1-4-2-3 allows for the Plasm Wraith to fundamentally work a bit more seamlessly, as the reason that it exists is because Olimar returned in the golden ship to build up money to rebuy dolphin which he couldn’t afford after 2, it’s unlikely he would’ve gotten it back for the events of 4 in time to lose it again.
The timeline for Dolphin would make sense then. Louie’s timeline would also make sense. Him not remembering Olimar would be because he never worked with him one-on-one yet. The Golden Carrots would be him plotting out his plans in 2. Louie’s reactions in Pikmin 2 (running away from the Pikmin, his weirdness in the first cutscene as well as the entirety of Titan Dweevil and the King of Bugs) would also add up. A regression of Louie’s personality from 2 to 4 to 3 can also be seen.
This would also give the planet enough time to change a bit from 1 to 2, and also give space for species like the Sovereign Bulblax and the Progg to go virtually extinct. In Pikmin 2 Olimar also has a nightmare of becoming a Pikmin (once an Olimin reference but now a Leafling reference). This can be inferred to be a nightmare of what once happened, or just a nightmare of worst case scenarios. It’s pretty much confirmed that Olimar has a strong sixth sense in terms of dreams and gut feeling.
The only two parts that I struggle to explain are Schnauz’s item entries and Olimar’s confusion about certain Pikmin. My logic is that the comments on Rock and Yellow Pikmin are throwaway lines that shouldn’t be looked deeper into, which happens in series’ like this. The gyroid bust and Cupid grenade are hard to argue for, though I’m sure an argument can be made.
Imo I think the only confusion with Pikmin 4’s timeline spot really is just whether it takes place before 2 or after, and I think both are sound and have plenty of argument.
I thought 1 and 2 happened back to back
This is true but you have to consider also that he hadn't discovered Purples and Whites before 2 so the dialog with that wouldn't make sense, as well as ultra spicy spray
Hmm you raise some very interesting points. There’s so much evidence for it both being a reboot and main canon game. It’s frustrating, but at the same time it gets us really thinking to see how it fits.
@@flamsey that’s true. I think a lot of the issues with where 4 fits on the timeline stem from Olimar just consistently forgetting about most of the Pikmin themselves. While I don’t think it’s a reboot I honestly can see why so many people do, just with how Miyamoto’s team writes games.
Sorry but no. There is not a gap time between 1 and 2. Pikmin 2 starts when Olimar return from pnf 404
I think the most important factor in this discussion is where Pikmin 2 falls on the timeline. Following what you said, Louies log and the presidents bad dream log could be dismissed as old information. However, one other detail that contradicts the place of Pikmin 2 on the timeline is Olimar and Louies relationship in Pikmin 4. In Louies Pikmin 4 logs he frequently mentions that he cant remember Olimars face. This makes little sense as if Pikmin 2 had already occurred he would most likely know Olimar's face very well. Additionally, in Pikmin 4 Olimar says to the player that this was his first break from work in awhile similar to how he was on vacation when he crashed in the original Pikmin. Overall, we won't really know until the next Pikmin title whether or not Pikmin 4 is a reboot.
This is all true. Louie is dumb that's what I would say
My head cannon is pikmin 4 is a parallel reality where Moss is an X factor that changes things up
This game is likely the alternate dimension that pikmin 2’s challenge mode exists in. People seem to forget that there were already 2 dimensions in the pikmin timeline. This would appear to be pikmin 1 for that dimension.
according to the 66th entry in olimar's voyage log, pikmin 2 could be just a nightmare, and thus not canon. it says: "Last night, I dreamt that one of my subordinates made a terrible mistake that put the company in a huge amount of debt. Too big for Hocotate Freight to pay back quickly... This is why I never take on debt. Anyway, when in woke up, i burst into a fit of
@@somerandomguy-3102 That is possible because of the vaugeness of the log. We don't really know exactly how much the bad dream covers in terms of Pikmin 2. However Louies log about eating Pik Pik carrots suggests that the dream log is simply foreshadowing Louies eventual mistake and therefore the events of Pikmin 2. Which would also place Pikmin 4 before Pikmin 2.
I do believe it’s a new timeline, there’s even a tidbit in Olimar’s‘s diary where he dreams about his company being bankrupt because of Louie and he’s like „Thank god it’s just a dream“
Thank you for making this video! Getting tired of seeing the "Pikmin 4 is a reboot" comments. Great work!
Edit: Also holy crap, that part about the Gyroids being popular in Hocotate is really interesting. I have a theory that the theme of the Gyroids was originally going to have a more prominent role in the game. The Gyroids are based on Japanese Haniwa and are in part just ONE of the thematic inspirations behind the original Glow Pikmin Concept Art Design. To explain more I'd have to take you down the rabbit hole of Glow Pikmin Original Design.
5:51
Re-Watch the intro cutscene for Pikmin 3. This planet was very clearly undiscovered, and no Koppaite had ever been there. It states an unmanned ship detected what they named PNF-404.
Alph, Brittney, and Charlie have connections to the Koppaites in this game and would certainly know about this planet and the pikmin.
This game directly contradicts events we saw in Pikmin 3. It instead implies an alternate Pikmin 3 will take place as a fun nod while also keeping previous world building.
This is the strongest evidence for this being an alternative timeline in my view.
Additionally, the references to previous games all are in the form of tongue and cheek implications. Olimar heard Pikmin 3 music and thinks, "Huh, why do I have a weird sense of something bad?" Louie talks about wanting to eat Golden Pikpik carrots and the irony of Olimar finding the idea of his company going into debt over missing cargo laughable, and even the description of Cupids Grenade being "I read it somewhere" rather than, "I read a sales pitch from Hocotate" implies its just fun references for long time fans.
I believe this game is a retelling/reboot. Which I really dont like since it would be more fun to have the 4 games directly connected. It is especially frustrating because it wouldn't have required many changes to be connected.
Have Olimar's crash clearly be another by having him say he reunited with Pikmin and once again crashed on this planet rather than be discovered. And have the Koppaites mention the events of Pikmin 3 having occured.
This is a Pikmin 3 prequel. There are thousands of alien species in the universe, how are they suppose to know what Pikmin are or that they can help them? As said by other castaways and even the Rescue Corps, they didn't just read the entire voyage log, only snippets. The Koppaites heard about treasure and came over in a rush. To the Koppaites in 4, the Pikmin might be creatures that came from Giya, Hocotate, Ohri, Nijo, etc. Also there are hundreds of thousands of planets out there, how would the SPERO even know to search PNF-404? Obviously because the Koppaites knew the planet was rumored to have edible matter, fruits containing Piktamin U specifially, for them and went to the planet to investigate these claims.
@@flamsey I'm pretty sure they sent a lot of SPEROs around the universe to analyze planet per planet until they found one that had edible matter, that's what it looks like in the intro cutscene for Pikmin 3
@@JoziGlitzh yeah. And how'd they know which planets to check? There are millions.
@@flamsey They'd check as many of them as possible, starting with the ones closest to their planet, that they don't already know of, of course. Though that's only my interpretation, they may have indeed heard rumors about PNF-404 and decided to check it when all hope was lost, but they could still have just, not done that and just found it by pure luck
Spoilers for pikmin 4 late game:
In pikmin 2, Louie's first job working for Hocotate Freight was to deliver the golden pikpik carrots. In pikmin 4, one of his logs reveals he's never tasted them before, and wants to try them. This alone proves that pikmin 4 is a reboot.
Hmm, looks like someone didn't see the video.
3:04 here.
@@EtrnlCntrYeah but that reasoning makes no sense. His only proof is literally based on knowledge he just made up.
@@MrHomelessHobos I am not saying whether it makes sense or not, as anyone can jump to those conclusions. I just wanted to call out how this dude didn't even see the video and commented on a point the video already addressed.
@@EtrnlCntr Fair enough, do you have any recipes for good guacamole?
avocado
Log #73 is a very very strange one. It's the only one that's short, completely written in a color. While %61 is another out of order, they're the only two.. Next up, we have his logs for the caves that he states he explored them with Moss and sometimes specific pikmin types. In shipwreck mode, he never explores a single cave. When...did he do this? He also has notes on all pikmin types other than glowmin, but he also never discovers anything but the primary 3 types in his mode.
Remember that Olimar's Shipwreck Tale as we play it in Pikmin 4 is literally just Olimar telling us his story- he probably left a lot of those parts out to just tell the main parts of the story. (Also it makes more sense from a gameplay perspective, as Olimar's Shipwreck Tale is basically a retelling of Pikmin 1- hence him only having the 3 original Pikmin types).
@@Stathioolimar's shipwreck isn't a retelling of one
Him having the original 3 means nothing as there is no actual order to find the pikmin
Even though I don't agree that Pikmin 4 happens before Pikmin 3 (I just think they all happened chronologically with their numbers, 1234) I'm at least glad that it's not a reboot
Honestly I think that the developers just don’t care and did whatever they want both implying that pikmin 1-3 did happen and that they did not
Pikmin Devs are the same crazy ass that redubbed Olimar because what he said in his language and ours didn't mean what it meant, change one specifically useless line because Olimar isn't supposed to know human and lots of other thing the only one that don't care is you lmao
It definitly plays after Pikmin 3 and no different Timeline Bullshit! Its confirmed that the Devs planned to put Alph, Brittany and Charlie in Pikmin 4 most likely because they need Food Supplies again for there Planet after Pikmin 3 took place but they were Scapped and replaced by Family Members of them thats a pretty cool idea aswell!
I think many People are confused because it seems in the Pikmin 3 Ending the Crew of the Drake saved there Planet but it was most likely there first Food Supply! Its also Possible they returned to PNF-404 because they have seen Olimars SOS-Signal and tried to rescue him once again it was a little bit of a Mistake to Scrap them from the Original Concept of the Datafiles
Yeah, I think it's an alternate dimension. We know that alternate dimensions exist in Pikmin thanks to the wraith entries and the ship in Pikmin 2 (particulary when you obtain the key that unlocks multiplayer).
That's possible. Maybe it's even the alt dimension that pikmin 2 challenge mode takes place in?
maybe it’s an alternate dimension but not an alternate timeline
@@flamsey Perhaps? It's worth noting that Pikmin 2 Challenge Mode would have to transpire AFTER the events of Pikmin 4, as it's implied in Pikmin 4 that Olimar and Louie never commanded Pikmin together. It would make sense if the events of Pikmin 2 challenge mode are the Pikmin 4 dimension's equivalent of the President sending them back to collect treasure.
Despite this, I don't think challenge mode has much to do with lore relevance, from what I've seen, other than the fact it confirms there are alternate dimensions in Pikmin (along with the Water and Plasm wraith).
If you really wanted to put on the tinfoil hat, you could imagine that the Battle Modes in prior games are a result of alternate versions of the captains encountering each other in caves. Lol
You could also conclude that the events of challenge mode in Pikmin 3 are a timeline where Alph, Brittany, and Charlie never lost their cosmic drive key, hence why they're able to put so much focus and planning into collecting fruit. And if you wanted to be REALLY crazy, you could say that the events of "Defeat Enemies!" mode take place in an alternate dimension where Koppaites feast on flesh rather than fruit, but that's like Game Theory levels of speculation. Lol
@@WhitePikm1nthere is no real difference between the two and alternate timeline would mean it's a reboot
nintendo seems to love being vague with storyline, if we get another game, im sure it wont be this easy to say its not a reboot :(
Nah, I still strongly feel like a lot of this is reaching, and that the evidence present in Pikmin 4 points to the events of Olimar's Shipwreck Tale being a reimagining of Pikmin 1 - but the game strongly hints that Pikmin 2 is still going to happen (Louie himself admits in some of his text in 4 that he's actively *waiting* for Hocotate Freight to deliver some Golden PikPik Carrots so that he can eat them- and as such, Pikmin 2 hasn't happened yet, but is going to soon). And, like you say- Pikmin 3 is an obvious followup to the events of Pikmin 4. This also makes sense as to why Olimar states in that game that he's been to this planet two times before- once in Pikmin 4 (reimagining the events of 1) and once in Pikmin 2 (which hasn't happened yet as of Pikmin 4). Olimar's Shipwreck Tale, while different to Pikmin 1, also hits all of the major story beats of 1 - crashing, collecting ship parts, and fighting each of the bosses- including Emperor Bulblax (this big elder version now known as Sovereign Bulblax in Pikmin 4). All that's really added is Olimar meeting Moss, and going back to the planet to help her after she started to get sick in space, starting the events of Pikmin 4. One of Olimar's treasure notes also states how he had a perfect pilot's record and didn't have to take a piloting exam until this happened, and is upset that he'll now have to take one- meaning this is his first big space accident.
Interesting. Though a lot would change if Pikmin 4 is a prequel to Pikmin 2.
Purples and Whites wouldn't be undiscovered, and the ship would know about the White Pikmin's poison ability.
Ship would know about the Waterwraith
Olimar's "report" would definitely mention Red Pikmin fire resitance
Ultra-Spicy Spray would be undiscovered
The upgrades the ship created itself in Pikmin 2 (Scorch Guard, Anti-electrifier, Rush Boots, etc) would've already existed apparently.
Louie would not be shocked when he first encounters Pikmin
Olimar wouldn't have gone to any of the areas in Pikmin 2. This only happened because that's the area he crash-landed in in Pikmin 1.
Olimar would not recognize the Perplexing Pool, Wistful Wild, or the Awakening Wood as places he's been before.
About the piloting exam, I mean, it wasn't Olimar’s fault he crashed in Pikmin 1, it was the autopilot's as stated in the manual, and also nobody knew that Louie fell out of his cockpit in Pikmin 2.
I think the whole situation is just a result of Nintendo’s haphazard and loose approach to things, the timeline is likely linear, Pikmin 1, 2, 3 then 4. but Nintendo is kinda inconsistent on whether or not they like clear continuity in their games, sometimes they do, sometimes they don’t.
There’s likely multiple people working on each game with wildly different views on this stuff, which would be the cause of the inconsistency and vague non-answers.
Personally i thought that the louie log means that if louie ever encounter the same situation he did in pikmin 2, he will do it *AGAIN* because he doesnt regret what he did. Also how are golden pikpik carrots his favorite food if he never tried them before ? He doesnt seem to be the type of person who would have enough money to afford
But your idea works too.
Also, originally i was really confident that it wasnt a reboot, but seeing how they handle other nintendo timelines and how often time they dont really pay much attention to continuity i'd be more careful, hell they could do the same thing they did with the zelda timeline where they split it, then somehow later combine it again...because thats...possible ?
i still do think though that it's not a reboot, just dont be surprised if its other wise.
They aren't that expensive individually, it's just that Louie ate a shit ton of them that day that ended up in catastrophic consequences
@@Josuh Idk, they're made out of literal gold, or maybe they just look like gold, actually
You probably need to look into the Japanese version for clarity, this could be some localization tomfoolery. Wouldn't be the first time that happen.
And if that's not really the case, this is simply just Nintendo's method of being inconsistent with their game's story and lore as perusual. Not to mention Pikmin has always been Miyamoto's passion project for years, the same man who tends to stray alway from story elements and dislike RPG games. I wouldn't be surprised if Pikmin 4 has various retcons from the past games.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure in the Spanish translation the music box doesn't mention anything about warning Olimar of future events, but rather that the song sounded familiar to Olimar
@@JoziGlitzhthe Japanese version does tho
Great video man, I don't know if it is just for me, but the background music seems very loud compared to your voice.
Playing Pikmin 4 all the way to the end I feel it’s less of a reboot and more of a “fallen hero” timeline like Zelda. Big spoilers:
A koppaite mentions how the planet is going into a food crises which means it has to be before pikmin 3, not only that but also because olimar talks about everything as if it were all new *and* in one of his logs he dreamed the events of pikmin 2. (Commented this to share my thoughts before going into the video)
Olimar doesn't really talk like everything is new. It's just that it's not logical for someone to rewrite every single study you wrote of things differently. And in olimar adventure he was probably trying to make the story more interesting with some of the stuff he said in Pikmin one because he's telling it to a new recruit and it is known that people most of the time when telling a story try to make their story more interesting. (Don't think I'm angry, I'm just explaining from a realistic point of view.)
Except it also retcons one with olimars shipwreck tale and him meeting moss.
Also for the Piklopedia entry for the music box that play the main theme of Pikmin 3. Olimar says: "Strange...Despite it's calming tones, something about this melody makes my palm sweat and send shivers down my spine. It's as if it's sending me a warning about unexpected troubles in the future..." So the the events of Pikmin 3 definetly didn't happen yet.
@@tarlaihopehe absolutely does though? literally in his first 2 logs he talks about not knowing what the onions are and naming the pikmin. That’s not how you would realistically talk about these things. Plus these logs aren’t essays, he’s writing them for himself. They aren’t being shown to the president if Louie’s logs are anything to go off of.
@@Youarewhatyoueatsonic those are the logs of Pikmin 1 what's the point of rewriting is study, he is literally using is old logs in Pikmin 4.
personally i also agree because olimar mentions bulbmin in the startle spores piklopedia logs which he meets in and only in 2 and for those saying that pikmin 2 was a dream it is not because otherwise olimar wouldn't mention bulbmin since otherwise he wouldn't know they exist and wouldn't have mentioned it also the pileated snagret and burrowing snarrow are mentioned which of course we see the pileated snagret but the burrowing snarrow was only really talked about in the events of pikmin 1 also as we see in olimars shipwreck tale olimar doesn't go in any caves meaning all cave logs he writes are either from 2 or you could argue once he was a leafling he explored them but we only see him near dandori caves unless he has explored normal caves which is pretty unlikely in my opinion although could be the case also with 3 and the rock pikmin i believe it is just the lighting so all in all i am happy thinking that pikmin 4 hasn't broken the timeline
Personally the way I see Pikmin 4 is like, it isn't a reboot nor is it s continuation of 3 or before 3, but simply a timeline split, Olimar acts as if he never found Pikmin before, and even if his dialogue could be interpreted as he found those onions but with a diff design, onions have never been exactly consistent in the series and I don't think its something to analyze much, all the logs u can find in the game is him DISCOVERING Pikmin behaviour, just like Pikmin 1, the events of his crash landing are also the same so the Pikmin 1 video in the site could very well be the start of Pikmin 1 and the start of Olimar's adventure in 4 since it would be the same events. He has the S.S Dolphin which was sold during Pikmin 2, and while he could totally buy the ship back, him acting as if he never saw the pikmin before makes me throw this idea out. The way i see the timeline is that it splits the second Olimar crashes in the planet, in Pikmin 1 he never finds Moss and makes it out alive, in Pikmin 4 not only he finds Moss but he sends a SOS signal which reaches the Rescue Corp + he ends up being turned into a leafling. The main thing confusing people is Louie but in my eyes this has a pretty simple explanation, yes it is said multiples times Louie is a new employee who has never been sent to a mission beforehand but it is not IMPOSSIBLE for Olimar and Louie to have interacted before Olimar took off, the reason I think Louie appears in 4 is due to the SOS signal, in Louie's logs he explains how he was sent to find Olimar by the President, however Louie barely remembers how Olimar looks, this adds up with the idea that they only interacted a bit in Hocotate, in the pikmin 1 timeline his first mission instead of finding Olimar is taking care of the golden pikpik carrots which leads to him and Olimar joining various "adventures" together in 2 and 3 while in 4 he is NEVER SENT to take care of em cause he was sent to find Olimar. It is also worth mentioning how Koppai's overpopulation problem and lack of food resources is downright mentioned in 4 as if its gonna happen, just not yet, which makes sense since this is at the start of the timeline anyways. As for some of the nods to 2 i think those are just nothing more than cute nods, it is also NEVER NOT stated that Olimar didnt crash before pikmin 1, seeing how he ALWAYS crashes I feel he just doesnt have the greatest of lucks.
To put it short, Pikmin 4 is not a reboot or a continuation but just a timeline split, kinda like Zelda, the main timeline would be Pikmin 1's good ending > Pikmin 2 > Pikmin 3 while the other timeline would be an altered Pikmin 1 > Pikmin 4, this helps to not make the last 3 games irrelevant plot wise while explaining inconsistencies + it explains why in the interview they it feels like they treat Pikmin 4 as "its own universe", cause its a diff timeline. Hope this is clear enough lol. I dont CARE that much this is just fun speculation but this just makes more sense to me, good video btw!
Ok but you can't explain the gyroid bust. And that's not how a timeline split works. He crashes in entirely different areas
@@flamseytranslation error. They got the version on hocotate mixed up with the one olimar found. Also, of course the shipwreck tale doesn’t have the same areas from 1? They aren’t gonna remake those for a side mode. Plus the music clearly implies these areas are meant to be a stand in for the pikmin 1 levels
@@flamsey What exactly is there to explain with the gyroid bust? The way it's worded in pikmin 2 it seems they already had gyroids there that were popular. In no way does it seem olimar needs to discover them in pikmin 2 for them to be a trend on hocotate. It's far easier and makes more sense to believe this is a different timeline where the meteor sends olimar in a different direction
@@flamsey to be fair, from a development stand point i feel they wouldn't just remake all the areas, Who knows really maybe Olimar did Crash in the same area and explored away, we never TRULY know where he exactly crashed in 4. The gyroid is like the one thing kinda messing with my vision tbh, gyroids are popular in hocotate if memory serves and after re-reading the notes, It kinda seems to imply gyroid busts are already a thing in Hocotate anyways? so they could always have their own bust, Pikmin 4 has a lot of contradictory stuff honestly, wish they were clearer with this stuff
4 could still come after 3 depending on how much time has taken place between the two, the seeds the first group brought back may not have matured fully to bear fruit and such yet, leaving Koppai still on the verge of a crisis until that happens.
3:50 my theory would be that he actually wrote the AI for the pikmin 2 ship, in pikmin 2's timeline. Just in this timeline he is able to recite what he'd say directly instead of through the ship's AI.
Olimar crash lands on the planet in 1. The events of Pikmin 1 happen. He completes the objective in 14-15 days. When leaving, he crash lands but falling asteroids again and meets Red Pikmin. When he encounters Yellow and Blue, that is not discovery, but shock, shock to find these creatures again. He meets moss, and falls down again, turning into a leafling. Olimar catalogs his adventure in 1 and 4 as one big event, either for simplicity or for the most likely reason, to avoid trouble. He is the star pilot at Hocotate freight, the Presidents go to man. So for him to realize he not only crashed lands once, but TWICE would lead to him loosing his job. This might be why he never catalogs Purples, Whites, and so on because they would realize that he crashed landed enough times to discover a entire ecosystem. Also, he had fifteen days to find 30 ship parts, he doesn't have time to send everything to Hocotate freight. Also also, it is possible that Olimar lost the logs after leaflifying, since they were not important compared to Dandoi. Meanwhile, the President send Louie to meet up with Olimar, who along the way, takes a bite out of the water wraith, and joining forces with the Umibozu, the supernatural force that pulls the captains to the planet, which is why he loses self control and eats the pikpik carrots in Pikmin 2. Anyway, Louie is saved, and everyone goes home, with Olimar taking longer because he is in the dolphin, while Louie gets there first, does the job, puts the company in dept, Pikmin 2. Pikmin 3 happens, with either the siblings or children of the Koppi group going to the planet. Now, this poses several questions. Why did they not recognize who Olimar was and who Louie was? They were never introduced to Olimar, so he would be a mystery. Louie was not recognized because A. there main mission was to find food, food that was not shared and turned into pure energy. You really think the Koppi people would care about some random jerk when they are starving to death? Also even if they knew what Louie looks like, they would have no way of knowing he is there or who he is. Alph, Brittany, and Charlie had no connection with their family. Aunt Bea and Grandfather Drake never called them, and knew nothing about what the journey was like for them until they came back. Koppi cares about food, so any other detail about Olimar and Louie would be deemed useless, and anyone who did know would not be able to help Charlie and Gang stop him. Pikmin 3 plays out and all the lore with that, modern timeline. That's it.
I think it's dumb that they named the game Pikmin 4 since it's not a sequel to Pikmin 3 but rather a prequel so it makes more sense it being called Pikmin 2,5
game hater
FNAF 2 was called FNAF 2 despite being the prequel to FNAF 1, and FNAF 4 was a prequel to FNAF 2 despite being named 4. Tarzan II was a prequel despite being named as a sequel. Little Nightmares II was a prequel to Little Nightmares. Yoshi's Island's full title is "Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island", and it's a prequel to the Mario games at that point.
Metal Gear Solid 3, one of the greatest games made in media, is also a prequel despite its name.
This is uncommon, but still around, in multimedia today. Nothing special.
I don’t get why I don’t see anyone else pointing this out: pikmin 4 came after pikmin 3; pikmin 3’s canon ending is the neutral ending, so Kopaii is heading back towards a critically low food supply
It's not sine the food crisis DIDNT HAPPENED YET
@@gay4sswhovian ok let me break this down for you; the neutral ending of pikmin 3 says that kopai may not be able to sustain itself off of the seeds brought back. So, if they fail to do so, then they'd be heading towards another food crisis, and that **Second** food crisis is the one from pikmin 4. Nothing says its Kopai's **First** food crisis in pikmin 4
My headcanon is that Olimar has crashlanded on a compleatly different side of PNF-404. Or it's a split timeline that's an alt route to the bad ending of 1.
You sir are one of the few people who understands
Imo I believe it takes place after two and before 3 due to a line saying how much the koppites eat it’s bound for a food shortage and also some of the items which are in 1/2/4 but not 3 (Swarm Trumpet and Plucking Whistle) would make sense on why 4 takes place before two. Probably a stretch but still
Took the words out of my mouth oh my god, sad that a lot of ppl in the comments simply say they don’t think so, never elaborate and leave :(
My personal headcanon rn is similar to the dragon break totk theaory, where multiple timlines run concurrently and converge at a certain point. I think pikmin 1 + 2 AND pikmin 4 both lead to the pikmin 3 give or take a few contradictions. The first two games occupy their own timlines adjacent to 4, but the events of both timelines all lead to the same events occurring in pikmin 3
I like to assume these three things, because it's funnier:
* Olimar bought back the SS Dolphin with a raise the President gave him through the massive riches-boost in Pikmin 2
* He's pretending it's the first time he crashed on the planet to save face, because it'd be embarassing to have crashed there *three times*
* Louie is planning to eat Golden Pikpik carrots AGAIN despite the hot water it landed him in last time
* The reason Louie acts so weird is because he ate so many poisonous animals it permanently altered his brain chemistry
Most of what you said is basically what happened in the actual game
Honestly i think this is just a retelling of the first Pikmin game, and then Pikmin 2 happens and so on. Louie talking about wanting to eat golden Pik Pik carrots, and one of Olimars log entries talking about a Nightmare about his Company going into debt.
Before watching: Copium
lets see if i change my mind after this.
Edit: Nope, you're trying way to hard to stretch out to make these connections make sense but theres just too many contradictions that dont work, placing it somehow between the events before and in between the first 3 games. It only makes sense if they started over while only keeping some elements consistant to pay respect to its history.
I get it, you all hate the idea of a reboot but you have to accept what they made.
I mean maybe you're right but I have a feeling that at least pikmin 3 is still canon
So it's another example of Nintendo of America's translators "punching up" vague Japanese phrasing. This is so commonplace that characterization and character origin stories in games like Fire Emblem are night and day different. I'm actually amazed how many people immediately latched onto the Pikmin 4 English translation like it was the be-all end-all source when really we desperately need someone willing to do a deep dive into the Japanese version.
I've talked to some Japanese fans and they also aren't sure
but some of these logs make it seem like olimar has met the pikmin for the first time. this cant have happened before pikmin 1 because louie is here.
if anything it just seems like nintendo just stucj random elements from the other pikmin games together because refferences.
Olimar already knew about the pikmin, he didn’t have louie in his “olimar’s shipwrecked tale” and olimar always gets the bad ending in the side mode unlike pikmin 1.
ok? i dont understand what you mean
@@flamsey I’m not refuting your claims I’m backing them up
fun fact: according to the 66th entry in olimar's voyage log, pikmin 2 could be just a nightmare. it says: "Last night, I dreamt that one of my subordinates made a terrible mistake that put the company in a huge amount of debt. Too big for Hocotate Freight to pay back quickly... This is why I never take on debt. Anyway, when in woke up, i burst into a fit of laughter!"
Old log probably. It's just letting the player know that Olimar knew who was really behind the debt...
@@flamsey Issue: Olimar has the SS Dolphin which he doesn’t have in and is still relenting the loss of in 3 (and before anyone talks about the SS Dolphin name in 3, the Hocotate ship’s JP name is the Dolphin Unit 1, leading to a chance of it being a legitimate mess up on the translators side for the subs of the logs)
the logic here if it is in mainline in the most commonly assumed placement is that he gained it back from all devouring black hole loansharks, crashed onto pnf-404 AGAIN, Repaired it AGAIN, crashed AGAIN immediately after and got saved a month later after being a dandori obessed lunatic only to have to deal with louie being annoying AGAIN while louie completely forgot he ate golden pikpik carrots and what his main co worker looks like for some reason… before losing it for a second time to a debt.
sorry but i find it hard to believe that and just find that it complicates things over “its just a reboot or an alternate timeline where olimar met a dog.”
@@flamseywhat does "old log" mean? it doesn't matter how old it is, this nightmare still happened
I’m pretty sure thats supposed to be irony. No one besides Louie knows the truth of what happened to the golden pikpik carrots so Olimar having a nightmare about Louie causing the debt and just laughing it off is supposed to be ironic.
@@ApolloDawn85 I like that interpretation, but to me it more so seems to be suggesting that the whole debt in general never happened and he finds it amusing that louie could cause one, but really it could work both ways, as in he dreamt that louie could've gotten them into another debt
Nice video bro
The only reason why I don't believe it is because of the way Olimar talks about the Pikmin in the intro cutscene like if he just met them for the first time, aswell as the addition of the dog (Moss screwed up the possibility of that cutscene being just Pikmin 1), he even describe why he named them 'Pikmin'.
There's also the Shipwreck Tale, basically a retelling of Pikmin 1 (but with the dog as a plus) until Olimar crashes and is turned into a leafling (which them proceed for the rest of the story in Pikmin 4).
And that's why your theory doesn't work for me, if Pikmin 4 is the first time Olimar crashed (given his reaction), and he couldn't return to Hocotate, this means Pikmin 2 didn't happened yet, because Olimar never discovered about the treasures in PNF-404 in Pikmin 1 and never warned the president about it. Like, in Pikmin 2 the rest of Hocatate discover PNF-404 because of the treasures Olimar bring back, while in Pikmin 4 they only know about it because Olimar is lost.
My only theory for why this happens is just... Nintendo being Nintendo and forgetting continuity, really disappointing, honestly.
I think originally Pikmin 4 was going to be a straight up sequel from where Pikmin 3 left off, this would explain why some details points to it, but the project sitted for so long they just decided to reintroduce the series to new players and reboot it as a new universe (probably the same thing that happened twice with the Star Fox franchise, unfortunately).
The only thing I hope is that Nintendo finally gives continuity in this new setting, it would be a great chance to remake Pikmin 2 and 3 with an even greater plot than they had originally (I think this can happen given the references made in 4 to 3 and 2).
Sorry for bad english grammar, me not native speaker.
Another thing is that the third koppait talks about Charlie as a duck obsessed person.
And a weird thing is that they say their planet will soon be starving because they don't cultivate, they just eat what they find
(I'm playing the french version so maybe the english one doesn't mention it)
That's what the us version of 3dx said, or that they are bad at cultivating I think
It's impossible for it to be the same story because koppites visit pnf 404 in pikmin 4 before the food crisis, but in Pikmin 3 the food crisis is happening while they discover it, not to mention it's a completely different trip of adventurers that go
What??? No that doesn't make sense I don't get what you're saying. Yorke, Nelle and Dobbs were looking for treasure not fruit.
@@flamsey they were still there and they were still koppites, In pikmin 3 no koppites have gone to the planet before alph and friends
I respect you trying to find reasons why it isnt a reboot, despite everyone saying you are just coping (it isnt a reboot lol)
My take:
Pikmin 1 = story rewritten
Pikmin 2 = a dream
Pikmin 3 = after pikmin 4
We never see Olimar find the first red Onion on Pikmin 4 so the impact site being on the webpage makes sense. Not to mention the first cutscene which literally show us Olimar encountering the Pikmin for the first time.
It's not the same Onion or the same area as the first cutscene lol
@@flamsey It doesn’t really need to be the same one. They didn’t made the impact site playable so it would just be best to place a cutscene from Pikmin 1 since the events would basically play out the same way. They didn’t want to bring back the separated onions so they probably just decided to give it a new look that would look good with all onions fused. Theres also the possibility that Nintendo didn’t give a fuck about the story line and continuation. I can see this being a thing since Miyanoto is a big part of this game and they have already done this with Zelda. They just make the game and then try to join the puzzle pieces later.
also um... the pictures in the voyage logs of olimar could have just been updated so that there wont be any confusion if anyone else finds the onions
Thankyou! I been arguing with people about this since the gamecame out. Tje creators themselves literally say it's a not a reboot it takes place a few years after pikmin 3s events.
They literally say that in their interview articles
Which article
@@flamsey yo youtube keeps deleting my reply I dont know why. >:( it's an article their is part 1 through 3. It's in part 2.
I guess jsut type in pikmin 4 Nintendo interview with the creators. It should pop up. When I post the link TH-cam deletes it
With the AMOUNT of times Olimar crashed on PNF-404, I'm willing to believe that he suffers from memory loss due to the crashes. Hence why he keeps forgetting about the Pikmin time after time.😂
The music was a bit too loud in the video
I actually thought that it wasn’t a reboot because miamto said that “you don’t have to know what happens in the other games to play it” and the trio who were taken by Louie The Green one says that he used to have a coworker who loved rubber ducks so that’s Charily and I think the Blue one said that he has a cousin called Alph
Possible relationships between characters doesn't cause 4 to not be a reboot or a different timeline.
The characters exist, yet certain things haven't happened yet.
If 4 is between 2 and 3, then the characters obviously exist, but the events of 3 obviously did not happen yet.
If 4 is just a "what if", the characters still exist since it's still the same world and universe all around, just a different timeline.
The green character who knows Charlie doesn't prove 4 to be a sequel, all it does is prove that 4 is in fact in the same universe, with the same planet and for the most part, it's an easter egg for older Pikmin fans.
The blue one is Yorke and Alph is his younger brother
Somewhere in Pikmin 3 Alph confirms that he is one of 15 siblings, and Yorke's id card says he's one of Drake's grandchildren
No offense but I think you’re overthinking this. So the shipwreck tale is in my opinion supposed to be the very first time olimar came to the planet as the events leading up to the crash are exactly the same. So Pikmin 1 did get a soft reboot but aside from the locations and the addition of moss, it is the same story that includes both endings in Pikmin 1 as canon ( if you find all the parts in time). Pikmin 2 still technically happened but only as a dream with Louie’s entry in Pikmin for about the golden carrots just being an nod to Pikmin 2. And as you mentioned Pikmin 3 takes place after Pikmin 4.
I think the dream aspect works well as it would explain why the onions look so different because it was olimar’s subconscious recreating it from memory after all the onion in Pikmin 4 has the more organic bulb from the first 2 games but has the flexible tentacle legs from Pikmin 3. A subconscious trying to replicate this could explain the differences. I do admit this doesn’t explain why the onion looks different in Pikmin 3 if that is after 4.
I think it's a time warp
He always crashes on the planet because the planet doesn't let him leave
I believe in the Umibozu theory. The Umibozu keeps him on the planet because he wants to keep Olimar, the captain of a ship that came too near.
Whenever Olimar manages to escape, he brings him back immediately by either rewinding time or using Louie for his schemes who's somehow rooted to the planet, as he doesn't want to leave it and even visits it all by himself for unknown reasons when he finds Moss and immediately befriends her. Louie manages to tame giant enemies like the Titan Dweevil and the Ancient Sirehound. Usually, dweevils and dogs are not hostile, but Louie somehow makes them dangerous with dark mysterious powers. Why do the Sirehound's eyes glow in such a deep scary red color before it is defeated and why is the Titan Dweevil black before he loses his weapons and becomes harmless? Why do his eyes pulsate in funky colors? Parasitic infestation? Louie knows what happens when you eat the Waterwraith. Has he eaten it and got possessed by the Umibozu that the Waterwraith clearly is based on? Why does Louie eat the golden pikpik carrots? So Olimar has to come back to the planet. Why does Oatchi grow a leaf? So it can't leave with the crew that has Olimar. Did you also know that the Waterwraiths would ONLY attack Olimar in the Bully Den challenge in Pikmin 2? It doesn't care about Louie at all. Also, what is it with the Goolix? Just like the Waterwraith and the Plasm Wraith, they are all fluid and leave no corpse when they die, but goop. Are they linked to each other? The Goolix leaves blue goop when it dies. Do you know what other enemy leaves blue goop when it dies? The Titan Dweevil.
What's that mysterious ship crashing on the planet at the end of Pikmin 3's credits? It's Olimar. Once again. Seeking for ship parts or paying another debt. He will never see his family again.
Audio levels and mic sound is awful in this video. Becomes almost unwatchable
Ok I'll try better next time
Although I’m still on the edge with flying pikmin snd rock pikmin being reintroduced i like to think pikmin 4 takes place in the main timeline
I feel like theres a lot of coping here. Its most likely an alternative timeline or just takes place after 1's bad ending. The Rock Pikmin and onion things are quite the stretch imo
i feel like your the one who is coping for a better story
@@Yoshizuyuner I don't even care what the story might be now, I just feel like this video has a few things that don't entirely make sense. But whatever, trying to reason with people online is a waste of time
Dude do you know what critical thinking and common sense is?
@@Alexgodofwar5662 I'm not braindead I know what it is. This video has a lot of things in it that are really looking for ties to other things, like the rock Pikmin and onion things I mentioned. I'm using common sense to realize that, just maybe, these things are a bit farfetched. And I'm using critical thinking to realize that this theory makes little sense on how it placed 4 in the timeline since it's kinda thrown in there haphazardly. If you think differently than me, that's fine I don't care, I just had an opinion that I wanted to share
This is one thing I kinda don't like about the Nintendo community, every Nintendo game they find some inconsistency and immediately assume it's a reboot or wants to totally re work the timeline.
besides zelda what other examples of nintendo fan community doing that are there?
More proof that pikmin 2 has already happened is that olimar knows louie, as he only met him after pikmin 1
In Louie's golden pikpik note, he doesn't have his helmet so it's likely that he thought it on hocotate also he has been on the planet before because he doesn't have recipes for the pikmin and knows how to use them. If it was his first time he would have eaten every pikmin in sight and not know how onions work.
It is a retelling why would there be another “food epidemic” for Alph Brittany and Charlie. And for Louie if you notice he does not ‘remember’ Olimar, that’s because Pikmin 2 has yet to happen, which is also hinted at the fact that in Olimar’s Voyage Log #66 he mentions a dream he had in which Louie causes Hocotate to be in debt. Louie not remembering Olimar, not having yet to eat the golden pik pik carrots means this is an entirely different timeline/universe. Or…..a reboot. Not to also mention it’s strange that Olimar did not know about the other Pikmin yet, meaning challenge mode or Olimars Shipwreck Tale, really is a different retelling of Pikmin 1 except Olimar never left PNF-404. So again either this is a reboot or just some other timeline.
I think it's a soft reboot, changes things, but basically the same things happening, olimar still only gets the red yellow and blue as seen, given this; pikmin 4, what we are doing, takes place after pikmin 1, pikmin 2 happens when they get home from the planet, louies diologue with #20 note telling us his plan outright and it being the direct cause of pikmin 2, followed by pikmin 3, it doesn't change much story wise, but it does change things.
I don’t mind if people want to theorize how Pikmin 4 fits in with other games narratively, but I’m sick and tired of Pikmin fans (especially the subreddit) trying to force the whole “Pikmin 2 was a dream,” “Pikmin 1 is retconned”, etc. Fans are too caught up in their own obsession of “continuity” while I can guarantee you Nintendo does not care. This is the same franchise where Earth in Pikmin 2 looked like our current Earth while Earth in Pikmin 3 looks like Earth billion of years in the future. Nintendo seriously could not care about lore and continuity.
Pikmin 4 kinda replaces Pikmin 1 on the timeline.
The way I see it is that people are just trying to grasp at straws to make pikmin 4 fit the main timeline because of how awaited the game was so even though it really sucks we just gotta come to terms that pikmin 4 is just not cannon
with all this talk of where it is on the timeline, I for one still go with it being after 3. While there is not much to go off of for this the main things I have found are:
there's a conversation between Collin and Olimar where it's mentioned that Olimar is famous for his adventures but Olimar gets upset about this due to said adventures being caused by his ship crashing. While not outright saying how many times this has happened it has happened enough for word to get around hence why everybody came to the planet because it was Olimar's logs
A good amount of Olimar talking about treasures is him saying how he is now middle aged, worn out from working so long, and wanting to see his family to the point he is about to just throw caution to the wind an ask his boss for a promotion or more time off even if it risk being fired
and finally how 3 and 4 focus on other characters besides olimar.
5 could have it where after having enough Olimar talks to the president and gets fired and then your player steps in as a replacement and after winding up on PNF 404 again Olimar eventually arrives there as well to save you/help out since he knows the planet well resulting in him getting his job back and hopefully promoted.
again yes I know the timeline is wonky about where and when this is but still if it's no exact saying where in the timeline it is then it could still be a continuation after 4
I get where you're coming from, but Olimar does say that he feels the Pik3 theme is a warning for the future, and that's pretty on the nose
@@flamsey I'm pretty sure in the Spanish translation the music box doesn't mention anything about warning Olimar of future events, but rather that the song sounded familiar to Olimar, so it could be something added to the English translation and not be what it said in the og notes about the treasure in Japanse
One other thing that caught my eye was that during one of the nights during the Olimar side mode, Olimar talks about how he crashed by another meteor and that perhaps he could’ve avoided it, but that another force may be at play forcing him to the planet. The way he phrases it makes it feel like he’s crashed on the planet because of a meteor at least once before (which would be an accident) and that he feels like he could’ve seen it coming this time but still hit it.
Send me them on TWITTER NOW. That's crazy!
I'm sorry but I can't be convinced by this at all.
You interpret the various lines (both from the developers and in-game) with a wild bias towards your own theory.
Various of Olimar's logs are based off of his pikmin 1 ones (especially the ones where he talks about his family, the nightmare where the pikmin carry him to the onion, and the "I am so very tired" line)
All other lines referencing pikmin 2 and 3 events CLEARLY reference them as not having happened yet.
The appraiser that designed the appraising A.I has similar ideas about an object as the A.I space ship with apprasial capabilities? No way.
All evidence clearly points towards pikmin 4 taking place after a pikmin 1 bad ending, although with the events of pikmin 1 being altered in various ways (For example Moss, which is the factor that dooms Olimar to the bad ending.)
You don’t just have 20 years of build up and then throw it all away
Seriously tho thanks for making this I’m so glad to see people think this game isn’t a reboot
I mean… this happens all the time?.. I dunno what your trying to say with this
@@Youarewhatyoueatsonicnot all the time
The fuck you mean
i like to imagine that pikmin 4 takes place in a diverging timeline, where if olimar crashes in the Impact Site, it goes 1 -> 2 -> 3. but if he crashes in the sun speckled terrace we get 4 and potentially the other future games.
i always wanted to see what happens after olimar's comeback in 3. maybe I could make a fangame about it if I knew how to code.
Pikmin 4 is part of the "Hey!" timeline
"Yeah, these are just new onions that's why Olimar doesn't recognize them" - That's a huge stretch. They just look different for the sake of looking different. Nintendo probably just wants them to look "New and modern!".
The onion in 3 was obviously supposed to look modern, thus the whole non-organic vibe. People didn't like the non-organic look, thus they changed it again. "Why not the old onions?" - because they wanted something new. The old onions are a bit outdated and might not go well with modern graphics, they might've also just wanted to go a fully organic route for the onion.
Besides. If Olimar already knows Pikmin, and is only surprised by the different looks and the fact they merge, why is he still acting surprised by blues and yellows? Olimar is smart enough to think "Oh, these are probably blue Pikmin!" and not be surprised that there are in fact blue onions.
"Crash landing obviously refers to Pikmin 1" - So Olimar also saying that its the first time he crash landed on pnf-404 doesn't exist, or?
Treasures - Again, references. With a hint of laziness. Most people who will play 4 haven't even touched 2. Many in the Pikmin fandom haven't even touched 2 and most have certainly not read the treasure logs. Pikmin had references in most games to previous games, so it's not a surprise there are references in 4.
Dialoge - It doesn't sound like Olimar wants to talk about the space bunny incident. It just sounds like he talks about his job. It's a joke that Olimar misunderstood what Collin wanted.
"The log about the PikPik carrots is just old" - why should it be in the game, with no timestamp or anything else like a log saying "Yeah, Olimar and I (Louie) were on pnf 404", if it's just an old log? Every player who doesn't know about older games is just going to assume Louie is planning to do that, and not that it already happened.
Ok I won't mention more, but. You argue the same way people argue that Pikmin 4 is a sequel to 3. The same exakt way.
"That's just an assumption", "Event x already happened", "It's just another food crisis!!!!" etc. etc.
The same exakt way.
Arguments about 4 not being a new timeline/a reboot/whatever are all just speculation, while arguments regarding 4 being a dif timeline/reboot/whatever are mostly based on what we have.
Koppai is not in a food crisis yet, Louie wants to steal pikpik carrots, Olimar doesn't know the Pikmin or planet etc. etc. No assuming, just what we straight up got from the game.
Pikmin 4 is a mess, especially with devs not straight up saying its a sequel, a reboot or somewhere inbetween. If it were inbetween, they'd say it, and not go "Yeah, whatever people think".
Nintendo doesn't care about continuity. They want money. Pikmin games don't really need continuity to work, so it's fine if they just randomly decide to have 4 be a reboot or just a game with no coherent story fitting to previous game.
Ok
Plus if I’m not mistaken, olimar in the first few seconds of the game says the planet hasn’t been discovered yet.
@@Youarewhatyoueatsonic your mistaken
@@flamsey No arguments? Btw., Olimar DOES say he is on an unknown planet.
It wouldn't be an unknown planet if it were after 1 or 2.
So the wording of the other dude was maybe a bit off, but he wasn't completely mistaken.
@@CrunchCrunchCrunchyCrunch OK unknown. Yeah unknown to literally everyone except people from Hocotate.
Hmm, I think a lot of the points you made were really stretching it. I disagree with your point, though with how aggravatingly vague Nintendo was about it I can’t say you’re wrong.
Particularly Olimar’s first encounter with yellow Pikmin, that’s definitely not some little joke he was making, he’s not really the kind of guy to do that, and it just did not sound at all like a joke. Also, Miyamoto saying that the games never sold well, REALLY makes it sound like he wanted a complete reboot. (But again, it’s vague so ugh, who knows)
The website is very interesting, I’ll give you that.
Olimar left behind the Dolphin in Pikmin 4, he couldn’t have ‘bought it back’ in Pikmin 3. Also I think him saying it’s his second time on the planet is definitely talking about 1 and 2 as separate times since they had totally different reasons for being there. But this one could easily be retconned
Also I SWEAR the Koppaites in 3 mention the planet is uncharted…
As for Schauz’s notes, it could just be Nintendo throwing in a fun little reference, but it could go either way. I don’t think Olimar’s note is talking about Pikmin 1 at all, he’s probably been hit by a meteor before. He said it was an emergency landing, not a crash landing, big difference.
If Louie’s notes on the PikPik carrots is old, why is it at the end after brand, fresh notes? Yeah Olimar’s are weirdly out of order but that could just be him sorting them or something. And besides Louie’s aren’t.
Also how do you explain Olimar’s notes about dreaming about Pikmin 2? Surely he would have mentioned something about it “happening again”
Overall I just think Olimar’s general tone about everything screams that this is his first time on the planet. You can make theories by explaining all the little stuff without outright contradicting something but when you look at the big picture, it just seems REALLY, really unlikely.
But at least there is something we can all agree on, screw Nintendo for making the timeline so confusing. It really hurt the game.
But still thank you Nintendo for giving us Pikmin 4 at all so…
You never got all 30 parts in Shipwreck Tale lmao. Also it wasn't a joke for him, it was a genuine question
Olimar dreaming Pikmin 2 is how he knows that Louie did it
Louie isn't wearing a helmet in that voyage log... just something to think about
@@flamsey Yeah that was my point, he was genuinely like “whoa yellow Pikmin? I’ve never seen these what do they do?”
We have to remember that this is Olimar retelling the story, he’s probably skipping over bits of him being interested by new types because the rescue corps already know what they do.
@@flamsey hmm, true true
Isn’t there another voyage log from him without his helmet that was definitely written during 4 though? There might not be but I swear there was…
It might still be a reboot. If it was, this implies that PNF-404 became a popular tourist spot before Olimar crash landed.
If it wasn't, the gap between 3 and 4 and the reappearance of the Dolphin may be explained by the Pikmin Short Movies, where Olimar salvages trillions of Pokos from a collapsed excavator(probably enough to buy back the ship).
Its important to note, olimar only sees the original three pikmin in pikmin four. He probably has no clue who the rest are.
He would have seen the Rock Pikmin at the base camp , or at least the onion segment
@@Skeleton_Dork have many times have you taken your pikmin out on base?
Uh, no. He literally wrote logs about all the Pikmin types...
@@JoziGlitzh yeah but that's bs cus he doesn't see half of those in the shipwreck tale
Pikmin 4 is probably a reboot in the timeline, there's honestly no getting around that, but it's far from being a reboot of the world building of PNF-404. 4 goes out of it's way to tell you that creatures from previous games still exist on the planet, we just dont see them in-game. Remember, we are in a completely different part of the planet from the previous 3 games, so we can only observe the creatures in the area we're exploring. Joustmites are still part of the Burrow-nit Family, Munge Dweevils existed at one point, Sovereign Bulblaxes could be what the P1 Emperor actually was, etc. The game takes place on the same planet with the same creatures, flora, and fauna, Olimar just happened to crash in the Rescue Command Post instead of The Impact Site.
I think Pikmin 1&2 being one thing in his mind makes sense since he didn’t get to be back home for even a day
i still have some reservations about all this. the game begins with olimar having a partially-rebuilt dolphin in a retelling of pikmin 1 with a different set of areas and of course the addition of moss, and if pikmin 2 really did happen beforehand then the dolphin shouldn't be here at all- he would have already been back to hocotate, where the ship would then be taken from him
im fine if nintendo doesnt really care to uphold continuity but the decisions they make regarding koppai and the trio from pikmin 3 feel almost,,, disrespectful? we get a batch of 3 koppaites who are clearly meant to call back to alph brittany and charlie and yet come across like dollar store ripoffs, when it would have been just as easy to justify them specifically being here too, a little like a certain other someone
and that other someone is louie, whos inclusion honestly totally baffles me. its decently likely that the president got olimar's SOS too and told louie to go look for him but at no point does the game explain how he even gets there (wouldn't we have seen the pink ship?) and he just goes on to obstruct the player and the rest of the rescue force because, thats just what he does now
the game wants so badly to be like pikmin 2 and its not just the cave system. it quite literally directly follows the events of pikmin 1 (soon after the 30 day limit on olimar's life support gives up and he becomes a leafling), and then theres all this implication that pikmin 3 is yet to occur, due to multiple references to koppaites suffering from overpopulation that will some day lead to a food crisis
i still absolutely love pikmin 4, i have my holdups about some of the gameplay direction and im having an absolute blast getting every possible platinum medal and finding out just how quickly and efficiently overworlds can be cleared, but i dont think the story decisions reflect an avoidance of continuity but something of a rolling back of it and i hope this doesnt continue to be the case in the future because the pikmin storyline honestly rules
All this is thrown out the window with the intro animated cutscenes and olimarta first logs, he states its his first time here, and its his first time encountering anything on this planet. Im sorry, you cant use logs and skip OLIMARS GUIDES!!!
It's Hey! Pikmin 3D, That's what it is
Timeline for me is 1 -> 2 -> 4 -> 3 -> Hey! (If that games even canon)
Finally someone with this opinion ✊. Im beginning to whatch this and just wanna say that tehnically pikmin 4 could be after 2 but before 3 because olimar knows louie And there is no koppai crisis. And i have a feeling that pikmin will become fnaf with its lore sometime im the future
Thank you, so many people insist it's a reboot like it's an absolute fact when there's so much evidence that olimar's been there before like for example several piklopediua entries referencing species that only showed up in previous games, the lore about the Bulborb being renamed, and going back to references to previous species.. olimar's notes on the horned cannon beetle continue the implications throughout the series that the armoured cannon beetle species has become increasingly sparse and endangered since some time after pikmin 1
I don't get why people like.... care, Legend of Zelda and Mario reboot with practically every game, only a few genuine sequels existing in the franchises and no one goes nuts over that. just seems a little weird to go like "oh no now pikmin 2 didn't happen in this fictional timeline!"
like... pikmin 2 still exists, you can pay it on the switch why do you care about the fictional continuity?
3:04, that is an image from the last area of pikmin 4, which does not exist in pikmin 2. they never went there in 2.
Yeah I'm also sure thought bubbles actually exist too😊
I took that log about Louie possibly eating the carrots being Olimar fearing that history would repeat itself with his company once again.
I never thought it was a reboot... If they want to reboot it, they can go on and say it. All of these contradicting errors.. can just be errors. I think the people engaging in the argument care more about this than Nintendo
I actually think that pikmin 4 is a reboot but a new timeline
aLtErNaTe ReAlItY
Nintendo already debunked that
Pikmin 4 is masterpiece I’m planning 100% the game that tells you this game is amazing I pour hours and hours to pikmin 4 this game wasn’t my first pikmin game the 3rd was my first but buy pikmin 4 you won’t regret it now here is my reasons first the caves are very good they are so many unique caves also it just fits pikmin 4 really well and oatchi is welcome edition to pikmin 4 and they add night expeditions that was just great idea to add glow pikmin are just so unique to other pikmin types also ice pikmin are weird and no one want ice pikmin but they are good pikmin type surprisely I enjoy how they were used in the game I could go on but we would be here for hour lol but just Buy pikmin 4 where we could get a pikmin 5 and again you won’t regret and I know it
Voyage log #20 might be the biggest piece of evidence that this takes place before pikmin 2 to me.
Isn't it odd how you get this log right after beating the last boss? And two, LDS might have happened right before louie arrived on the planet. Its possible that the president sent him in the hocotate ship to find olimar so he can have his two best employees back on the job to repay the debt
Good theory, but also Louie doesn't have access to his voyage log at that point so it has to be a log that was written before we got ahold of it
Which cannon is accurate, Pikmin 3 or Pikmin 3 Deluxe? Apparently, as you said, there are contradictions in Pikmin 3 Deluxe. I never played the Deluxe version. I don't wanna deal with those worse controls. Haha!
I talk about them in the video! Lol
@@flamsey I mean, I know what you said. I played the Wii U version, the original version. In my eyes, that is the cannonical version.
@@nickk3077 It is. Obviously parts of the port were mistakes but that doesn't make the entire port non-canon.
i remember your profile. its from the pikmin 1 mini book that in the disc holder thinngy. I loved thos drawings