The tool you created for cutting the squish is quite ingenious. I'm a toolmaker/ machinist and was taught that the fastest way to get the job done CORRECTLY is the right way to do it.
Being a Machinist/Tool & Die guy... We have our preferred machining processes... and with those comes the "do's and don'ts" BUT, we also say, "if it gets the job done, nobody got hurt and no equipment was damaged... who cares!" Let the haters hate. Like you said, it works for you, you're consistent and able to repeat the quality. Your saws tell the true story. Great job man. I'm digging the shorter videos.
absolutely my man... i actually really appreciate the skill and patience it takes to do legit machining... i just dont like when people rub everyones face and act like if you aint doing it like them its not quality... you totally get what im saying... it just makes people nervous to try this stuff because they are worried about being "hacks" obviously i am not afraid to show people how i do things lol... these younger guys tell me all the time it helps to know they can go about it other ways... hell before i had a lathe i did it with wood dowels in my vise and twisted the cylinder back and forth for an hour to get it done lol
Thanks for showing us how you do your squish . that's a very effect and easy way of doing it for sure as a CNC grinder we call it lapping to make the surface uniformed . I don't know why anyone would say your using your plunge indicator wrong it doesn't matter what number you start on . keep them coming buddy
To be a hack you’d just do a little porting and say it’s built. It doesn’t matter how you do it as long as your constant and have happy customers I’d say your doing alright man love the vids
I went to Walmart but you can get them on eBay or Amazon if you like to order stuff but I got a 3ft tripod/one handed grip/self stick for like $7 and it made a world of diffofor me and just makes it all way easier. Thanks for sharing.
Where I stand on people who refuse to think outside the proverbial box, and be open minded to how and what others are doing. It's simple, work smarter, are work yourself to death beating the dead horse, and see which one gets all the work doing whatever it is you do. If something works, and like the gentleman whose a machinist said, if it ain't hurting no one, isn't destroying the equipment, and it works plus 150% more efficient on time from start to finish. That's a no brainers all day long, and didn't even need overtime to go back, and clean it up afterwards. That's money in the bank, and the retirement fund is growing by leaps and bounds too Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Preformance!! Learned that, long time ago as a kid, based my career on that bit of knowledge, and rarely ever let me down, and the few times it slipped a little, was due to errors of others above me, that I had no control over. Great job
I've ran wiseco pistons in the past great piston! Good job on your machining! It's always best to match up piston with squish band there's a bunch of little tips and tricks got to do all the small stuff to make a great build all the small stuff add up to Great gains! That's why if you're a decent porter The build isn't cheap$$$$ As they say you get what you pay for!!!
I’m waiting on a wiseco for my 461 from CCC specialities. I’ve had a wiseco in my 371xp for two years now and it sings while pulling a 36inch. You do great work, love watching!
Very nice! I came up with a way to cut squish and base in the same setup on a mill, but it is still time consuming to set up and dial in. Really dig what you've shown here and I think I'm going to try it this way when I do my 261 soon.
Good videos start to comming John, Staying with the channel... Still reminding you for a Broken 260 of a customer, nd please made the same thing with porting video and numbers please! I am in a middle of a 260 project and have machine shop as well and will be highly apreciated. In anyway I cant be your client, as I am 10000 kms from you 😎
Great video John! I'm hooked in your channel so the length doesn't matter much to me, but I def get the shorter videos because a lot of times I won't watch other peoples long videos. Plus I see the advantage if I'm working on my stuff I can go right to the video that goes with what I'm doing! Love it man, thanks!
Hell yea bro good shit I wish I had the tools to do stuff like this I'm really into two stroke engines and I do builds on bike's my next build is gna be Frankenstein build I want to put a 460 Stihl piston and Jug on my hundred cc
Re someone saying that #'s didn't match..made me think of a Q that I'd LOVE your opinion on: What do you think of using a depth-gauge on a loose cylinder, to do measure port times? For instance, let's say I put my timing wheel on and get my exhaust timing, I do it 3X or more and am beyond confident with it, but I don't feel like un-doing the carb so INSTEAD I simply remove my cylinder/jug from the saw, I use my depth gauge and my knowledge of the LENGTH of 1degre (because you can just take your 40mm stroke, multiply X2 for 1 full revolution, and therefore 80mm / 360deg is your mm-per-degree to relate vertical distances on the cylinder wall to degrees-of-rotation of crankshaft) I understand there's dwell at TDC @ BDC but I guess I figure that, since those are "midway" through the durations of exahaust & intake, respectively, that they almost 'don't matter' since they're split evenly, each 'event' (exhust at TDC, intake at BDC) gets one of these 'top-or-bottom of piston movement' moments so they'd "balance out" if that makes sense! I love the idea of doing things this way, but I'm having a little difficulty getting precision between my depth-gauge, and my timing wheel (and I know it's not the tools) so am not sure what I'm missing (am, of course, accounting for squish/etc if doing depth-measurements, honestly I usually just get exhaust timing from the wheel, and then base everything off of that by vertical measurements on cylinder-wall, and converting those vertical measurements into degrees of crankshaft rotation I think the 40mm stroke of a 660 means about 8thous " for 1deg, right on-the-money for the 3deg alteration in timing you suggest from dropping the jug in the last video :) ) Thanks again for posting these, your content was always kinda "interesting" but honestly I had trouble telling if you were legit or not so I probably only saw like half-dozen of your vids, seeing you posting "the meat & taters" content like this is awesome, really hope you put out a "2-Stroke Function in Chainsaws" video using your cut-away, that thing is so well-made...had thought of splitting a chipped-plating 660 jug I had to have my own split-case, but didn't feel like making the room in my tiny setup, *but* yours is so nice I literally just took a screenshot of your model and did a high-res color print, have it on the wall by where I work I love it!!!
i only take what i need to meet my angles i dont need to have a real precise number because i get my nuimbers by machining the base... every piston is identical and every squish is the same angle... i might have to take 5 thow plus or minus out of the base and im good to go... if you werent doming the piston tho you would want to determine what you are taking out but you can figure that out with a bit of thinking its not too hard... good question tho i will definitely talk about it next video
@@johnscustomsaws thanks I’m building a saw mill saw it’s a 066 and using a pre made dome piston just needing to know if I’d be ok to just cut the base thanks
Stupid question! Will just cleaning the casting faults, roughing the intake and polishing exhaust matching everything of course give you a decent increase at all?
Hey John, keep the videos coming. What is your opinion on heat treating a piston? Have you ever done it? (450 in the oven for 4 hours, water quench) I seen this on another channel.
@@fabzacres-blackcat the old iron horse treats his pistons with a Marlboro vapor deposition treatment as well as heat treating at 450f to reduce stresses.
@@johnscustomsaws Hey John, here is the link to the video of The Ironhorse explaining how and why. Skip to 26:42 th-cam.com/video/8Wz0BrL7a80/w-d-xo.html
@@johnscustomsaws I saw some auto-tuner youtube where, in the intro, a guy is using a handheld propane torch on a connecting rod. I went to Reddit and posted to /r/metallurgy asking about this, and was STRONGLY urged to *stay FAR away* from anything like that (IE you'd need to know a good deal of the specific metallurgy of the piston to even begin), honestly how often is piston-alloy the problem? Pistons of modern material (ie aluminum w/ a good deal of siliica/silicate, this addition basically revolutionized modern 2 strokes) allow about 3,500 feet/minute speeds before problems, and 4k/min before material failures (Jennings, in the 2-stroke book, says that you basically do 'woods porting' at up-to 3,500 FPM, and - for racing stuff, where you'll swap rings often enough and all that - that you live in the 3,500->4k FPM land, and that that land is plagued with failure but is the optima) BUT I should mention that, on a 660 for instnace, the 3500 FPM safe line lets you run the saw 13.3k RPM redline, with death (4k FPM) when operating at 15,300 RPM. Obiouosly it's not guaranteed death, there's examples of >4k FPM operation, but generally speaking it's where 2-strokes break-down. Thankfully even "faster OEM's" like Stihl are well-within boundaries for piston-materials (so far as I can tell!!! As an anecdote, I do have 2 saws whose pistons' windows are VERY aggressively ported, both for flow to the lowers, for aerodynamics, and for increased bottom-end displacement to match the big bore jug...have also done 54mm 660's with "flowed window" pistons....and no failures yet! Would almost be embarrassed to show them because most would expect they'd fail immediately, I promise they do not!! Oh and I carve oil-feed holes into them, there's usually one on each of the piston-pin bosses anyways, but adding more - and accentuating the one that's there - greatly increases oil to the upper/small-end bearing of connecting rod!)
I ported a 661 the homebrew way; base gasket delete and no machining. Stock Stihl top end. Opened up intake and lowers but changed no numbers, brought exhaust from 100 to 97 (opening sooner.) That saw freaking screams. I have never had a saw respond to porting work like that one did.
@@WildAcresFarms I'll have to give it a shot, the machining is what was worrying me. I dont need another road to go down where I buy a lathe etc etc and spend 10k porting a saw for fun haha
Oh man so many questions lol How do you know how much of the squish band needs cut? It's it just trial and error or is there a general rule to follow like the squish band is relative to the size of the bore? How long once you got the cylinder set up and started turning by hand does it take to cut the squish? And last one.. For now lol.. Would you be interested in doing a video showing what tools and bits you prefer and why for porting? I would be interested in that and I'm sure others would as well. And good job on the TH-cam success I'm really liking all the info and badass videos
i will go over it in the next video in detail my man... i wanted to get a rise out of the guys that hate that i dont do stuff their way lol... its actually very simple and works great so i will go over it in detail my man
Thanks for all the info. Part 1 you commented on the plastics at the end of the video….were you going to touch on that again or is there truly nothing we can do about cleaning up old plastics?
i recently found a crazy method for cleaning them i will talk about it but a guy commented on the video and i was amazed... he uses hair treatment with hydrogen peroxide or something and it totally restores the white plastics... the orange i have a couple methods but its just a lot of elbow grease honestly
it does have a slight angle... its just a bit off from the angle i want... but you are correct... i say "flat" because its easier to explain what i am going for
Hey brother I recently made my own pop up for my 50cc motor and I think it came out good but literally got nothing to compare it to so I'm not sure if I went in far enough or to far like I was thinking I did. How do you decide how far to pop it.
Thank You for the detailed overview much appreciated, by the way is your lathe a three phase 240-480 or single phase? I have been looking at some coming up on the auction block. Thank You
The tool you created for cutting the squish is quite ingenious.
I'm a toolmaker/ machinist and was taught that the fastest way to get the job done CORRECTLY is the right way to do it.
You are awesome. I love the no nonsense way you do things and deal with the bad eggs in the comments.
Love the videos John, great information.
Awesome video and work!
Best regards!
Being a Machinist/Tool & Die guy... We have our preferred machining processes... and with those comes the "do's and don'ts" BUT, we also say, "if it gets the job done, nobody got hurt and no equipment was damaged... who cares!" Let the haters hate. Like you said, it works for you, you're consistent and able to repeat the quality. Your saws tell the true story. Great job man. I'm digging the shorter videos.
absolutely my man... i actually really appreciate the skill and patience it takes to do legit machining... i just dont like when people rub everyones face and act like if you aint doing it like them its not quality... you totally get what im saying... it just makes people nervous to try this stuff because they are worried about being "hacks" obviously i am not afraid to show people how i do things lol... these younger guys tell me all the time it helps to know they can go about it other ways... hell before i had a lathe i did it with wood dowels in my vise and twisted the cylinder back and forth for an hour to get it done lol
Thanks for showing us how you do your squish . that's a very effect and easy way of doing it for sure as a CNC grinder we call it lapping to make the surface uniformed . I don't know why anyone would say your using your plunge indicator wrong it doesn't matter what number you start on . keep them coming buddy
I can appreciate the extra care that you put into your work. Your an absolute professional. Thank you for sharing.
To be a hack you’d just do a little porting and say it’s built. It doesn’t matter how you do it as long as your constant and have happy customers I’d say your doing alright man love the vids
I went to Walmart but you can get them on eBay or Amazon if you like to order stuff but I got a 3ft tripod/one handed grip/self stick for like $7 and it made a world of diffofor me and just makes it all way easier. Thanks for sharing.
Where I stand on people who refuse to think outside the proverbial box, and be open minded to how and what others are doing.
It's simple, work smarter, are work yourself to death beating the dead horse, and see which one gets all the work doing whatever it is you do.
If something works, and like the gentleman whose a machinist said, if it ain't hurting no one, isn't destroying the equipment, and it works plus 150% more efficient on time from start to finish.
That's a no brainers all day long, and didn't even need overtime to go back, and clean it up afterwards.
That's money in the bank, and the retirement fund is growing by leaps and bounds too
Proper
Planning
Prevents
Piss
Poor
Preformance!!
Learned that, long time ago as a kid, based my career on that bit of knowledge, and rarely ever let me down, and the few times it slipped a little, was due to errors of others above me, that I had no control over.
Great job
I've ran wiseco pistons in the past great piston! Good job on your machining! It's always best to match up piston with squish band there's a bunch of little tips and tricks got to do all the small stuff to make a great build all the small stuff add up to Great gains!
That's why if you're a decent porter
The build isn't cheap$$$$
As they say you get what you pay for!!!
Haha 😆what a dork 🤦🏻♂️ I love it… good job man I was like idk at first. but the skits are turning out it be pretty good 👍🏼 your the shit John.
Pistons do need love..🤙🏻🪓🤪..nice work John
I’m waiting on a wiseco for my 461 from CCC specialities. I’ve had a wiseco in my 371xp for two years now and it sings while pulling a 36inch. You do great work, love watching!
wow i didnt know they made a 461 wiseco... i better hit Dave up loil
Great vid John.
I do work on my pistons.
I'm a firm believer that small changes give big gains.
my man!!! pistons need love too lol
Very nice! I came up with a way to cut squish and base in the same setup on a mill, but it is still time consuming to set up and dial in. Really dig what you've shown here and I think I'm going to try it this way when I do my 261 soon.
You mention Wisco Pistons, I had a Harly engine shop and used Wisco Angle-top pistons, the pistons were Jewels.
Thanks again mate.
High quality vid.
Loving it 👊
Dang gettin all fancy with these backdrops and stuff. Remember us little people when you’re all famous and what not.
Good tips btw👍🏻
Your awesome man. Great video.
Great production. Looking real professional on the videoing
SKOL🍺
Yea that is a bad ass hat looks clean and professional but still sweet at the same time
Good videos start to comming John,
Staying with the channel...
Still reminding you for a Broken 260 of a customer, nd please made the same thing with porting video and numbers please!
I am in a middle of a 260 project and have machine shop as well and will be highly apreciated. In anyway I cant be your client, as I am 10000 kms from you 😎
Good video JOHN
Boom perfect timing. Break time!
Great video John! I'm hooked in your channel so the length doesn't matter much to me, but I def get the shorter videos because a lot of times I won't watch other peoples long videos. Plus I see the advantage if I'm working on my stuff I can go right to the video that goes with what I'm doing! Love it man, thanks!
thats a very good job . you did
I just realized you are creating a dodge hemi piston from a stock stihl. Seemed to work well for dodge.
Hell yea bro good shit I wish I had the tools to do stuff like this I'm really into two stroke engines and I do builds on bike's my next build is gna be Frankenstein build I want to put a 460 Stihl piston and Jug on my hundred cc
Time is money 💰
Very nice.
I sand cut my sqish bands too I don't have 4 jaw setup to do bore cut style
That was sweet
Awesome Vid! I really want to try this myself 🙃 (u can buy a broken 460 real cheap in the near future 😅)
lol... send it bud... only way you are gonna know... at least record it haha... but no you will be fine my man
Re someone saying that #'s didn't match..made me think of a Q that I'd LOVE your opinion on: What do you think of using a depth-gauge on a loose cylinder, to do measure port times? For instance, let's say I put my timing wheel on and get my exhaust timing, I do it 3X or more and am beyond confident with it, but I don't feel like un-doing the carb so INSTEAD I simply remove my cylinder/jug from the saw, I use my depth gauge and my knowledge of the LENGTH of 1degre (because you can just take your 40mm stroke, multiply X2 for 1 full revolution, and therefore 80mm / 360deg is your mm-per-degree to relate vertical distances on the cylinder wall to degrees-of-rotation of crankshaft) I understand there's dwell at TDC @ BDC but I guess I figure that, since those are "midway" through the durations of exahaust & intake, respectively, that they almost 'don't matter' since they're split evenly, each 'event' (exhust at TDC, intake at BDC) gets one of these 'top-or-bottom of piston movement' moments so they'd "balance out" if that makes sense!
I love the idea of doing things this way, but I'm having a little difficulty getting precision between my depth-gauge, and my timing wheel (and I know it's not the tools) so am not sure what I'm missing (am, of course, accounting for squish/etc if doing depth-measurements, honestly I usually just get exhaust timing from the wheel, and then base everything off of that by vertical measurements on cylinder-wall, and converting those vertical measurements into degrees of crankshaft rotation I think the 40mm stroke of a 660 means about 8thous " for 1deg, right on-the-money for the 3deg alteration in timing you suggest from dropping the jug in the last video :) )
Thanks again for posting these, your content was always kinda "interesting" but honestly I had trouble telling if you were legit or not so I probably only saw like half-dozen of your vids, seeing you posting "the meat & taters" content like this is awesome, really hope you put out a "2-Stroke Function in Chainsaws" video using your cut-away, that thing is so well-made...had thought of splitting a chipped-plating 660 jug I had to have my own split-case, but didn't feel like making the room in my tiny setup, *but* yours is so nice I literally just took a screenshot of your model and did a high-res color print, have it on the wall by where I work I love it!!!
What is that mandrel? Solid steel rod with sandpaper on top? Awsome saws and videos dude! 👍
Love your videos keep them coming. Just curious how do you determine how much you need to cut out of the squish band ? Thanks
i only take what i need to meet my angles i dont need to have a real precise number because i get my nuimbers by machining the base... every piston is identical and every squish is the same angle... i might have to take 5 thow plus or minus out of the base and im good to go... if you werent doming the piston tho you would want to determine what you are taking out but you can figure that out with a bit of thinking its not too hard... good question tho i will definitely talk about it next video
@@johnscustomsaws thanks I’m building a saw mill saw it’s a 066 and using a pre made dome piston just needing to know if I’d be ok to just cut the base thanks
Stupid question! Will just cleaning the casting faults, roughing the intake and polishing exhaust matching everything of course give you a decent increase at all?
Hey John, keep the videos coming. What is your opinion on heat treating a piston? Have you ever done it? (450 in the oven for 4 hours, water quench) I seen this on another channel.
@@fabzacres-blackcat the old iron horse treats his pistons with a Marlboro vapor deposition treatment as well as heat treating at 450f to reduce stresses.
@@fabzacres-blackcat th-cam.com/video/8Wz0BrL7a80/w-d-xo.html Watch this, skip to 26:42
i have never heard of this but now i am interested... where did you see this method... i might have to try it
@@johnscustomsaws Hey John, here is the link to the video of The Ironhorse explaining how and why. Skip to 26:42 th-cam.com/video/8Wz0BrL7a80/w-d-xo.html
@@johnscustomsaws I saw some auto-tuner youtube where, in the intro, a guy is using a handheld propane torch on a connecting rod. I went to Reddit and posted to /r/metallurgy asking about this, and was STRONGLY urged to *stay FAR away* from anything like that (IE you'd need to know a good deal of the specific metallurgy of the piston to even begin), honestly how often is piston-alloy the problem? Pistons of modern material (ie aluminum w/ a good deal of siliica/silicate, this addition basically revolutionized modern 2 strokes) allow about 3,500 feet/minute speeds before problems, and 4k/min before material failures (Jennings, in the 2-stroke book, says that you basically do 'woods porting' at up-to 3,500 FPM, and - for racing stuff, where you'll swap rings often enough and all that - that you live in the 3,500->4k FPM land, and that that land is plagued with failure but is the optima) BUT I should mention that, on a 660 for instnace, the 3500 FPM safe line lets you run the saw 13.3k RPM redline, with death (4k FPM) when operating at 15,300 RPM. Obiouosly it's not guaranteed death, there's examples of >4k FPM operation, but generally speaking it's where 2-strokes break-down. Thankfully even "faster OEM's" like Stihl are well-within boundaries for piston-materials (so far as I can tell!!! As an anecdote, I do have 2 saws whose pistons' windows are VERY aggressively ported, both for flow to the lowers, for aerodynamics, and for increased bottom-end displacement to match the big bore jug...have also done 54mm 660's with "flowed window" pistons....and no failures yet! Would almost be embarrassed to show them because most would expect they'd fail immediately, I promise they do not!! Oh and I carve oil-feed holes into them, there's usually one on each of the piston-pin bosses anyways, but adding more - and accentuating the one that's there - greatly increases oil to the upper/small-end bearing of connecting rod!)
Stoked for this video series!! I cant wait to buy a new 661 and completely destroy it trying to replicate your work! haha... But seriously great vids.
I ported a 661 the homebrew way; base gasket delete and no machining. Stock Stihl top end. Opened up intake and lowers but changed no numbers, brought exhaust from 100 to 97 (opening sooner.) That saw freaking screams. I have never had a saw respond to porting work like that one did.
@@WildAcresFarms I'll have to give it a shot, the machining is what was worrying me. I dont need another road to go down where I buy a lathe etc etc and spend 10k porting a saw for fun haha
Oh man so many questions lol
How do you know how much of the squish band needs cut? It's it just trial and error or is there a general rule to follow like the squish band is relative to the size of the bore?
How long once you got the cylinder set up and started turning by hand does it take to cut the squish?
And last one.. For now lol..
Would you be interested in doing a video showing what tools and bits you prefer and why for porting? I would be interested in that and I'm sure others would as well.
And good job on the TH-cam success I'm really liking all the info and badass videos
i will go over it in the next video in detail my man... i wanted to get a rise out of the guys that hate that i dont do stuff their way lol... its actually very simple and works great so i will go over it in detail my man
Thanks for all the info. Part 1 you commented on the plastics at the end of the video….were you going to touch on that again or is there truly nothing we can do about cleaning up old plastics?
i recently found a crazy method for cleaning them i will talk about it but a guy commented on the video and i was amazed... he uses hair treatment with hydrogen peroxide or something and it totally restores the white plastics... the orange i have a couple methods but its just a lot of elbow grease honestly
Thank you sir!
Why wouldn’t you soften the edge on top of the dome?
So is the squish band flat actually? I thought it was angled up a bit
it does have a slight angle... its just a bit off from the angle i want... but you are correct... i say "flat" because its easier to explain what i am going for
Pistons need love too 😂
How does a lot of blowdown say 30 degrees or more impact the way the saw runs in relation to 24 degrees of blowdown?
John have you tried one of the wiseco pop up pistons for the 661?
Hey brother I recently made my own pop up for my 50cc motor and I think it came out good but literally got nothing to compare it to so I'm not sure if I went in far enough or to far like I was thinking I did. How do you decide how far to pop it.
So what’s the price for a 562?
Are you or is there ever a chance for me to get you to do my work saws for my tree care.need big saws done
Hi John did ever think of
Ceramic coating the pistons
Just a suggestion
If it works an the saw runs badass that's what counts. So to hell with who ever says BS.
Hey bro, what’s the best way to get in contact with you?
At it again taking poor Bellas back drop slash blanket. Boy you better hope you got some good treats or toys pull this one over.
Thank You for the detailed overview much appreciated, by the way is your lathe a three phase 240-480 or single phase? I have been looking at some coming up on the auction block.
Thank You
Go 3 phase, so much more possibiliries...
Boom
How can I contact you for saw work?
Hat sawrus
🥰🥰👀👀👀👀💪💪💪💪💪😝😝🤗
!!!!BLASPHEMY!!!! 🤣
First you swear to God? Then you say Jesus?🇨🇦🇺🇸