Philosopher John Rawls tried to formulate this simple idea (a variation of "you cut the cake. I choose which piece is mine") into a theory of social justice by asking the question "What social structure would one design if, after the system was in place, one's place in the system was assigned at random?"
They aren't, that's the point I was going for. This was in reply to a post (that isn't currently showing up in this thread) that said cops are atheist slavers - and offered nothing more than that bold claim.
@@78musiksphere I think so, too. Everytime he was asked why he thought something, he resorted to empty platitudes that didn't have any real meaning, let alone a connection to the context. It was memorized indoctrination all the way down. he actually answered something a few times without using bible quotes and actually got an answer out that remotely grazed the topic. But when that was pointed out, he immediately back peddled. Scary stuff.
Friends, please keep your spouses, children, relatives and friends away from people like this caller. He would enslave them if he could, and use the Bible, and his extreme absence of humanity, to commit horrible depravities.
@@maynardmckillen9228 It makes me wonder, if society fell for some reason, how would people like this behave. A lot of people would happily do evil things given the chance.
Slavery is a great system! If you are the master, that is - the master gets to make the slave do whatever he likes whilst only providing him with the most basic necessities in return! Just make sure that the slave doesn't decide to cut your throat in the night...
@kojut2707 I've always been of that opinion, too. It just reads like a prime example of that old saying "history is written by the victors." If the Bible is somehow true (despite being _incredibly_ unlikely) and it's an either/or choice, I'll just reserve my ticket downstairs now, thanks. The god of the Bible is a dick. A vastly abusive, genocidal egomaniac with a penchant for petty tantrums that have global effects. Among many other things.
As someone who was viciously beaten by a drunk father as a child I can tell you that there is no good side to it. It causes fear, anxiety, hatred, and distrust.
As someone who was beaten by parents becasuse bible says so, I can confirm. It gave me dissociative disorder, PTSD, depression, anxiety and suicidal thoughts, so much good stuff (sarcasm). Seeing people like that caller defending abuse drives me crazy.
Reading your 2 stories makes mine sound not so bad I only got spanked once in school and I learned to keep my mouth shut and obey and I'm not saying this as a good thing I'm saying it's how I learned to survive
@@danielfegley2735 I understand why you would think that compared to our stories, but this isn’t a “Let’s compare our wounds” or “Let’s play who had it harder” kind of thing. Talk about what you’ve been through if it’s bothering you enough to want to talk about it. All instances of assault, especially those against a child are unforgivable and even ones that seem completely mild and innocent to some can cause PTSD in others.
@@durendin Especially since it wasn't just slavery, but post civil war, all the segregation, not to mention the anti-miscegenation, were being propped up using the Bible. And even now, white supremacists use the Bible to justify their bigotry.
Sadly there are a lot who think this way and not just with religion. I had a debate with a guy who said "Slavery didn't seem that bad. All meals and necessities were provided which is great, so what's the big problem?". I didn't get upset, just asked would he be my slave and how much for his daughter. He immediately got angry, but, I reminded him I'd take care of his necessities and meals. He still didn't take the deal for some reason.
It was good to see Forrest getting angry like this, expressing the anger and frustration that I was feeling too. What a f*cking horrible human being that caller is!
@@darinb.3273 Because Forrest is usually very genial, but when this type of trash calls in and demonstrates how horrible the Bible can be, he lets his outrage show.
It was well earned. The guy said he was a loser. What kind of adult can’t come up with an idea of what the word “truth” means? He was so afraid that everyone was looking for some gotcha that he could barely communicate beyond grunting.
I noticed at 8:37 the second the words "just because somebody might get hurt..." Leave the callers mouth, Forrest's face instantly drops and from that point onwards in the video I've never seen Forrest look so disgusted. Hes usually so smiley even when dealing with people like evolution deniers. The contrast is crazy. I think that is the moment he gave up with the call.
I like how he denied the Quran because that's not his god. Yeah it is dude, same deity. I can at least chalk it up to him not knowing the connection of the Abrahamic religions, as that's entirely possible. But yeah, when you grow up in a specific religion, it's difficult to even realize you can't see the Forrest for the trees. (pun most definitely intended)
@@brianemerson6116 A friend of mine travelled a lot and has been all around the globe. He met people everywhere. He said the country with the most stupid people is America. Yes, he is so right. It is not home of the brave, it is home of the dumb.
@gregsanich5183 Well, I'm assuming that they're specifically referring to Christianity, which has had a long and infamous history of both defending and denouncing slavery as it sees fit at the time. The Bible can be interpreted to say almost anything you want if you tilt your head and squint in just the right way. It's been that way ever since it was written. It's a tool of thought and behavior control, for whoever is in power at any given moment.
Forrest Valkai is so triggered and outraged it made me feel like I didn't have to be. Thank you Forrest for carring that cross for us. You are my savior sir.
I totally agree! I just wanted to add that I appreciate how much patience, grace and strength Kenneth showed by going on and engaging with William for as long as he did.
I would not want combat with an intellectual powerhouse like Forrest. Kenneth is pretty cool too and keeps William to task. So much easier being Atheist.
Yes it is and we've already seen the hideous results of their votes. Critical thinking in this country has plummeted to its lowest point since Joe McCarthy was running amok.
For William justifying slavery through "making real working man", the classic question of Dillahunty: "would you be my slave under biblical law?" would have been perfect
Actually, I think it has to be more visceral. My question to him would be, "so, you'd be ok with me owning you and your whole family? Sold off the women for profit and made real men out of the the rest of you by working you extra hard and with vicious discipline?"
@@Maggisoo His ability to conjure up an original thought was breathtakingly inadequate. He just kept regurgitating indoctrination over and over. He couldn't even understand the concept of truth. The brain rot has settled in deep.
Mans sticks by his values "we can have a nice polite conversation but the moment you wanna use that to try and justify bigotry we're gonna have a problem"
Every time you talk about beating kids, I go tell my children how much I love them and that they're doing a great job. I tell them that all the time, but this crap makes my being ache. Thank you for telling these people off
I was forced to listen to psychopaths like William multiple times every week of my life that I could remember until I was finally given the choice @ the age of 16. to never set foot into another evil place that teaches such mindless babbling people who regurgitate what the people that believe that book written, to give ignorant goat herders thousands of years ago, that had no clue where the sun went to at night. Some helpful hints how to live a little better life, than a book taken as fact and belief in your fairy god fearmonger. Must we stay static in the teachings of some Basic Instructions Bettering Lacking Earthlings? I see the usage of "heathen" in that book as something completely different than how I hear or read people claiming what a heathen is now. As far as I can see from the evidence around me is that as a species of hominin, we have evolved and expanded our intelligence, and the ways in which we can get access to just about anything one needs an answer to, and how, even if I was a goat farmer at this time, I certainly do know, or have access to, innumerable things more than the people that book was written for. Why should I care what is written in that book, any more than all other books of fiction, Fairy tales, Folk lore, similes, allegories, legends? I've read plenty of great books. Just because the authors changed the first sentence from, "Once upon a time". To, "In the beginning". didn't make that make believe book, into being. Real, or meaningful. I've been around so many church people like William. They should not be allowed to have children. I care not about the wants of adults when it comes to children. That man is the product of child abuse. No matter at what age.
@@Clem.H.Fandango It is an inconvenient truth that nobody talks about. That 30% on the left side of the bell curve. They'll likely NEVER understand any of these concepts. It lends credence to the hypothesis that maybe, just maybe, religion IS INDEED necessary...you know...for the left side of that curve. This also is an excellent explanation for the GOP.
@@geelee1977 You're saying they're so dim if they didn't have a fear of disappointing God or eternal hell fire and without a 2000 year old collection of questionable manuscripts to guide them, they would have no moral compass at all? Just raping and killing without regard?
@@geelee1977 I think Seneca expressed a similar thought when he stated. Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful.
Forrest really strongly resembles those first few episodes of Dillahunty way back in like 2003 or something, so polite and willing to give the benefit of the doubt...
This was scary. I like how Matt always asks proponents of Biblical slavery whether they would like to be slaves under this system. I wish they had asked this moron whether he’d like to be a slave and beaten at will as long as he didn’t die. I feel like taking a shower after watching this.
@@Edmond347 what's even scarier is some of these idiots actually say they would live as slaves with Matt being their master, they are so muddled in their thinking, so corrupted by their religion they have lost their humanity.
On slavery: “Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you’d have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.” ~ Steven Weinberg, Nobel Laureate in physics. THAT is how you get people to justify slavery.
Atheism religion is a belief system based on faith ,not facts...The Lord Savior Jesus Christ came to relieve humans from religion...it's religion who provided the drive to kill Jesus.
I disagree and would definitely say any sort of cult or ideological indoctrination can do that. (Politics, etc can also do that) But yeah I agree with the sentiment of the statement at least. Very powerful quote.
As much of an immoral piece of shit as that caller was, he is likely that way because he is a victim of his religion, made to feel existential dread when confronted with the reality of what it has forced him to become. I like Forrest but I think Kenneth's approach here was much more admirable and it gave me a whole ton of respect for him. We should not shy away from these conversations exactly because of how disturbing they are. It's important to reveal them and make examples of them, but also to reach out and try to pull these people back to reality. Blowing them off as a lost cause just ensures they stay lost.
Seems like he's always a little bit sassy. It's when he gets _angry_ that things get serious. I've never heard him tell someone to fuck off quite like 16:03
Starting at 12:46 William starts to clarify that he determines truth according to the promise that comes with it, making him the perfect mark for every crazy conman and scammer out there.
William doesn't need truth. He has the Bible that he can use to make his own truth. You think the earth is a globe? You can use the Bible to say its actually flat. You think whites are superior? Sure, the Bible can help you with that. The Bible is SO useful.🙄
Kenneth tried to appeal to the hopeful remains of an empathetic human behind the brainwashing. I’ve seen it work on this show before, but this is someone who seems to have completely turned to stone and there’s nothing that can be done.
Speechless! I didn’t know there was another level to this kind of madness. I have heard people defend stupid shit and you always sense they’re a bit confused but William isn’t and that’s scary.
"Slavery is just work." This level of ignorance towards the endless historical suffering of millions of slaves is deeply disgusting. Whenever I'm hearing this kind of obviously delusional BS, I feel that I'm getting very angry. No matter if left or right, theist or atheist, the answer "Slavery is evil" obviously should be self-evident. "Owning human beings as property is just smart." What a disgusting little man.
Dear caller: might I suggest that in this conversation you are clinging to a few central credos: my god is a loving god; my bible was written by my god; my god neither makes mistakes nor lies nor offers contradictions. And so you find yourself in the position of defending slavery, among other atrocities described in your bible. Can you not see the corner into which you have painted yourself?
@Something Something Dark Side yeah. It’s called wage slavery and it’s why general strikes and union organizing should be happening non stop right now.
@Something Something Dark Side at the same time, you are not owned by your employer. They can not sell you to another company or rip your child from your arms to sell to their buddy to r*pe. They can not beat you and you can leave at the end of the day. Do not seek to minimize chattel slavery.
@Something Something Dark Side I’ve had many minimum wage jobs, bud. They are not comparable, at ALL. I’m not going to argue with you about this any more than I will waste my life arguing with a holocaust denier. You need a serious history lesson and unless you’re willing to pay me, I suggest you check out perhaps the Crash Course on American and African American history. You can find an entire awesome series here in TH-cam, US history section hosted by the wonderful John Green (brother of SciSchows Hank Green!)
I love kenneth patience, but in this particular case i really think he should have leave Forrest destroy this piece of sh*t, trying to rationate with him was looking impossible since the first minute of the call.
Kenneth's patience was incredible. I was with Forrest at the point of giving up on this toxic example of a human being (which is rare, because I often think Forrest has far more patience than I do). The annoying part was how close Kenneth seemed to get to reaching William... before William crossed some potential cognitive dissonance and fell back to the quotes or platitudes that his pastor/priest tells him in church.
Matt Dillahunty has literally asked callers if they would be his slave under the rules in the bible, for some reason none of the callers accepted. i wonder why...?
@@MaleINTP now that you mention it i think i did see that one. and went to talk heathens video too. but i honestly don't remember her name or anything. thxs for the reminder.
Why would a person NEED to be? That is a really DUMB question to ask. To ask such a question proves beyond doubt the one asking has no clue what was going on because said person has picked a few verses or a single chapter and then proceeds to ask REALLY DUMB questions.
"Beating your slaves is a good thing." Christian love in a nutshell. Only mindless adherence to a deity could get people to jump through hoops to try to defend slavery as a good thing.
No Christians say that. Masters are duty bound to make their servants productive so they can contribute to society. This is why if servants recover within three days your actions are justified. However they have to fully recover in that time period or it is a punishable offense.
@@mrfarts5176 Come on! Read the Bible! It talks about going to surrounding nations to essentially get people as spoils of war. That is NOT indentured servants. The Bible talks about killing everyone EXCEPT girls who are still virgins. What do you think that was for? Maybe you can sleep at night telling yourself it's not slavery, but you are fooling yourself.
@@mrfarts5176 I haven't heard of an indentured servant that you can go out and buy from a market- and then pass them on to your children. And keep any children born from there wives....and also there wives. The Bible does mention indentured servitude, but it also specifically condones the act of slavery in and of itself. You also just heard a Christian say that in this video above- and can hear it in several other calls from the channel.
"Because it's nonsense feelgood words coming out of the mouth of a fascist." So true here. So true from unfortunately too many people these days. Thank you Forrest for nailing it!
@Technic Wow. What a bogus statement. The part of "not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance" is complete BS and if you think that's a true statement, then read the Bible. Read the claims made by Jesus himself, and the words attributed through God throughout the entire 66 +/-books. What you find is it being very clear that 1) God has his own chosen people, everyone else be damned. 2) God wipes out huge swaths of people (which is genocide, btw), both by his own hands as well as using people to do so, and 3) states very clearly multiple times that very few people will come to know God, with the vast majority left receiving punishment or torment in some ways (of which are not exactly clear, depending on what verses you are reading). So no, "the Lord", God I presume you are referring to, is not patient. That's terribly clear. Not wanting everyone to perish is not a goal of his at all. And he seems to have little interest in everyone coming to repentance. He clearly picks and chooses, and it doesn't seem to be based on anything except his own whim. You can't tell me that the Bible heroes like David, Solomon, Samson, Noah and many others, led lives that we can be proud of. I mean, David is a perfect example of a disgusting human being that was so selfish and self-righteous that he felt he could do anything and get away with it. I am more moral than David, and you probably are too, but not in God's eyes. David is the freakin' King and best example of one of his people, except for maybe Jesus who is claimed to be God, so whatever. Bottom line is, your god either doesn't exist, which explains things perfectly. Or your god is an extremely weak god, and not only doesn't keep promises or move quickly, he basically has little to no power to do anything. Or your god is a monster and does not deserve worship, but instead deserves contempt and dismissal. Or I guess your god may have created us, but doesn't have a clue, and that almost seems plausible. I certainly don't accept your god having any of the omni attributes, as they would not only self-contradict, but he certainly doesn't act like he has any of those things, unless of course this is all part of his plan, and in that case, his plan is garbage. So, what do you think?
@@seekeroftruth6728 it's doubtful that William in Florida's mind is going to get changed, and certainly not by one phone call. Being told that their views are not only wrong, but they are disgusting and fascists, is sometimes a good thing. People often let bad behavior and ideas slide because they don't want to rock the boat or because it means they might not be liked so much. Everyone has a different approach, and sure we can criticize Forrest for not being patient enough with this caller, and I might agree with you on that. I get very frustrated with Matt Dillahunty these days, and I really respect his perspective and intellect on many subjects. I find him to be way more brash, impatient and short-fused than I think a show host should be. I get why he's that way - he's heard so many dumb arguments that if one sounds like a dumb argument he's heard before, he jumps on the caller and tells them to stop wasting his time with the same old crap. I don't think that makes for a compelling show in my opinion. I enjoy those who have more patience and have a more meaningful conversation, even if the conversation doesn't actually end up going anywhere because the theist who calls in has nothing much to offer except false claims and bad ideas. As for the audience, there's so much content out there that if this is the only video they ever watch, and it doesn't change their mind or their life, then that's fine. I wouldn't expect that anyway. I would hope it would take more than a TH-cam video to change a mind.
@@smequals I hear you and agree with most of that. In this specific case, you could literally hear the caller shut down and go into defense mode. Add you're right, he may never change his mind, but so many theists have been brainwashed into thinking that Atheists are evil, arrogant, (fill in the blank), and are doing the devil's work. Showing them that we can be thoughtful, compassionate people that are open to honest conversation seems to catch them off guard and often disarms their preconceived notions (about us anyways).
@@seekeroftruth6728 I agree. I also think that everyone's got their own way of doing things, and I don't subscribe to the "you catch more flies with honey" mentality. I wish someone would have said, "dumbass, your idea is stupid" a few more times in my life than actually happened. And honestly, not everyone is good at having a nuanced and thoughtful conversation, nor is everyone receptive to that. Sometimes calling a fascist a fascist is the best you're going to do. I believe if the best we can do is nitpick each other's approach, we really don't get there. I'm not going to be the best diplomat, but I might plant a seed in what I say so that when someone hears the same thing, but in a different way, it finally resonates with them. Maybe William from Florida has never considered that his viewpoint is fascist, or he may not even know what the word means. Maybe he even took 10 seconds and looked up the definition of the word, after being called one on the air. We may never know, but I think it's important to always keep in mind that there is no perfect way when it comes to this kind of thing. We think there is, and it's often either our way or the way of someone we highly respect or admire (which makes our way the second-best way, close to the perfect way but not quite). The reality is that a calm conversation and a slap in the face are both effective sometimes with some people, but not all the time with everyone.
It's simple. William is convinced that he'd be one of the slave owners in biblical times, so therefore slavery is fine. If he understood that he'd most likely be one of the slaves, he'd have a different opinion.
@Technic the field mouse may be fast, but the owl does not sleep at night. The cobbler mends shoes, but wears his hands thin… it’s easy to manifest an unjustified sense of importance with words, theists love to inject suggestion and emotion into their spiels, only to try veil utter nonsense.
@Technic what I said did have meaning Technic, deep and important meaning actually… if the message didn’t come to you your brain was closed to it because your brain has been poisoned with religious programming. It’s *YOU* who needs saving, but only you can free yourself - don’t let your brain sleep! Turn it on, look under the veil of lies you’ve been feed Technic, they’re easy to see if you’d only look with a turned on brain and an honest heart. I care about you Technic and want to help! I don’t want you to waste your life away on these middle-eastern religious lies. Thankfully it’s not too late for you, cast away your poisonous iron age thinking that rots your mind. And walk into the real world, you’ll see the truth and will celebrate in it. I’ll keep thinking and hoping for you Technic, or whatever your real name is. This isn’t sarcasm, I truely hope you can one day see the fallibility of your belief.
@Technic you ran, but like the owl I won’t give up on you Technic. I hope you’ll find the truth and cast away a religious programming that has clouded your mind. There’s still hope, you need to know that.
@@norswil8763 Honestly there's no hope for people like @Technic. He is forever lost in his "faith" hamster wheel hoping he will reach the most elusive of all destinations: the false promises of an ancient book. His prayers are not only useless for us but also for him in his on religion circle (supposing that it's true). If his god knows the future and his will is always done, then intercessory prayer is utterly meaningless.
@@thegoldavenger.3829 🤣 Well OBVIOUSLY it's not true! Just like real slaves aren't unappreciative jerks for leaving their 'masters', that's why it's so ridiculous! 😘
I've never seen Forrest this way, he's usually very smiley even if he has an ignorant person on the line, but he was just done with this person, like he wanted to just call him all the expletives he could but maintained slight composure im proud of him, because I would have just hung up
Williams uses the bible as a comfort blanket everytime he feels scared about having an honest conversation. He turns to the bible for answers that are not there. This is the result of living in an echo chamber for decades.
The fact that he kept saying "servant" instead of "slave" even after being corrected is a dead giveaway that deep down he does realize the problems with slavery. He just feels compelled to defend it because the Bible condones it and he is hopelessly brainwashed into believing that the Bible is the true word of god and is a good book.
Kenneth was right on the money when he called out how scared the caller was to have the conversation. Like an animal backed into a corner, fighting at any cost to not be destroyed - because those are the stakes for a deeply religious person confronting the reality of their beliefs. I have so much respect for Kennith's attempt to keep the caller in that corner and force him to face the harm his religious causes him. Hopefully one day he can find his way out.
I've never seen angry Forrest before. I've seen annoyed and irritated Forrest. I don't remember angry Forrest. I can't blame him. The frustration was very high. Kenneth's patience was incredible.
Remember the fried eggs commercial? "This is your brain on drugs." We need an update with William as Exhibit A: "This is your brain on faith." That's some brain rot he's got!
absolutely, because he has this really weird thing where he thinks that beating people and making their lives miserable makes them stronger people, he doesn't live in reality.
I think he must be a troll. No one can be that relaxed about these things. Most Christians are not twisted psychopaths, they squirm when trying to defend slavery.
William is a deep dive into the mind of someone who is really into Jesus. Combining the worst of religious beliefs with the worst of toxic masculinity.
I don't think he is really into Jesus, afaik Jesus is portrayed as a gentle compassionate soul, who engaged with everyone, didn't judge and held all mankind as equal. There seems to be a uniquely american form of 'Christianity ' that is about hate, othering and superiority. Even i can see they're not Christian they're (imo) bigots cherry picking biblical quotes. Pretty sure that caller either has or wants a white hood btw. He seems to have that mental ability to put people into a 'lower' bracket than him.
There is a saying by Mark Twain "You cannot argue with a stupid person ,they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." We just witnessed that lol
I almost appreciate the guys honesty in letting us know how horrible he is. Dude got asked is it okay to own a slave and literally just came right out and said 'I think its smart.' Wow
18:07 THANK YOU FORREST THANK YOU A TON! You answered exactly what I was yelling at the screen, I couldn't hear it because Kenneth also spoke over, but I could sorta read the lips! Thank you for answering "So now you know what WE feel!" ALL THE TIME! The lack of insight these people have is astonishing! But thanks to Forrest, and also Thanks to Kenneth you are a perfect pairing in this show.
@@Grand_Theft_Autobot Then invite him down, put him on a boat, take him into international waters, and beat him every couple days while forcing him to work the fishing nets all day and night. Show him how awesome biblical slavery can be.
Being raised cult religiously I had internalized abusive thoughts so badly that when I first heard adult men (the power keepers) speak against this type of mindset I felt physically shook. And it just never gets old. I love these videos.
Kenneth your attempt to maintain patience and good faith was so admirable. Like I am blown away with how you handled yourself. Because I was right there with Forrest yelling at the tv.
Why in 2022 are we still discussing this? As a black American person it's horrifying, unsettling and devastating that we can't all agree that slavery was a bad thing. The only reason we should be talking about it is how it happened we stopped because it was inhumane and downright wrong and we are trying to progress from it.
Wow, this guy is actually a real monster. Ready to sacrifice his and anyones humanity to make them "work". Forrests ending remarks are absolutely 100% on point. Thank you for showing how religion can turn people into moral monsters.
These conversations never get anywhere because one side argues from heart and feelings and the other uses reason and verifiable evidence. There will never be a meeting of minds.
I'm not sure we can unequivocally make that statement historically. But it would certainly be a relative rarity compared to the average experience of a slave and likely be more associated with the ancient world and the Ottoman empire where a slave could be educated and entrusted with great power/position as opposed to the American South. But either way, slavery is a vile practice regardless of whether those with nothing can look at a particular slave and be envious or not.
@@sypherthe297th2 Exactly. Some people would have preferred the lives of specific people who happened to be slaves, but it would be extremely rare that the slavery would be a reason for that.
The obvious question to ask him would be: "Have you been beaten by your parents as a disciplinary method? Were you told over and over again, that the beating was for your own good?" I suspect he is the survivor of abusive parents. It would takd hours and hours of therapy to heal.
And I always thought Forrest was Mr Nice guy, I feel for you with this one. Kenneth's masterly deconstruction of the caller's flawed arguments was amazing.
![เป็นไปได้ไหม - WanMai [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/_6lZ6b3_7Vo/mqdefault.jpg)
It’s easy to defend slavery as long as you always imagine yourself as the master.
WHITEY KNOWS BEST
Philosopher John Rawls tried to formulate this simple idea (a variation of "you cut the cake. I choose which piece is mine") into a theory of social justice by asking the question "What social structure would one design if, after the system was in place, one's place in the system was assigned at random?"
Wow. Now that's something real to ponder.
Very, very concise and well said.
@@macroman52 Damn big brain
My favourite thing about being an atheist is I've never had to try and defend slavery.
Law enforcement officers arresting individuals is atheistic human approved slavery...
I've never once felt like setting someone on fire for all eternity because they didn't believe in my original anime character.
By that logic teachers who keep children in detention are also slavers.
Try harder.
@@CPCGamer I would like for you to describe the ways in which teachers are parallel to biblical slavers.
They aren't, that's the point I was going for.
This was in reply to a post (that isn't currently showing up in this thread) that said cops are atheist slavers - and offered nothing more than that bold claim.
"Being owned as property and beaten is for the good"
This has to be the most evil caller I have ever heard call in. He's a sociopath.
pity his family members and his horrible upbringing
I don’t believe he has the capacity to truly think through what he is saying.
@@78musiksphere
I think so, too.
Everytime he was asked why he thought something, he resorted to empty platitudes that didn't have any real meaning, let alone a connection to the context. It was memorized indoctrination all the way down.
he actually answered something a few times without using bible quotes and actually got an answer out that remotely grazed the topic. But when that was pointed out, he immediately back peddled.
Scary stuff.
Just ask him if he happened to be the slave, do he think what the Bible says about slave is good and OK?
Or he is doing it on purpose just to be a jerk, but he did seem to be for real
People like William ensure that there will always be plenty of atheists.
Even the Bible doesn't condone owning someone as hard as William got owned.
you made me laugh BlueOcean thanks!
Damn, that is well said!
Holy fuck dude, nailed it
Dammit that was so good 😠😠😠 I'm shook, you got me so good
Correct! William, won't be recovering after a day or two from this vicious ass beating! 🤣
This man by himself represents everything that is wrong with religion.
Friends, please keep your spouses, children, relatives and friends away from people like this caller. He would enslave them if he could, and use the Bible, and his extreme absence of humanity, to commit horrible depravities.
This man is obviously white
@@maynardmckillen9228 Please do
@@maynardmckillen9228 It makes me wonder, if society fell for some reason, how would people like this behave. A lot of people would happily do evil things given the chance.
The slavery caller is how I define "evil"! It's remarkably harmonious with a certain anti-democracy movement which is gaining momentum in the world!
The fact that ANYONE tries to defend slavery is just reprehensible...
To borrow the Christian nomenclature defending slavery isn't being the devil's advocate, it's just being the devil
Slavery is a great system! If you are the master, that is - the master gets to make the slave do whatever he likes whilst only providing him with the most basic necessities in return! Just make sure that the slave doesn't decide to cut your throat in the night...
@@risky_busine55 Ngl, I think that's insulting the devil.
@@asherikamichaela8425you're 100%right. Biblical devil is actually the good guy.
@kojut2707 I've always been of that opinion, too. It just reads like a prime example of that old saying "history is written by the victors." If the Bible is somehow true (despite being _incredibly_ unlikely) and it's an either/or choice, I'll just reserve my ticket downstairs now, thanks. The god of the Bible is a dick. A vastly abusive, genocidal egomaniac with a penchant for petty tantrums that have global effects. Among many other things.
As someone who was viciously beaten by a drunk father as a child I can tell you that there is no good side to it. It causes fear, anxiety, hatred, and distrust.
As someone who was beaten by parents becasuse bible says so, I can confirm. It gave me dissociative disorder, PTSD, depression, anxiety and suicidal thoughts, so much good stuff (sarcasm). Seeing people like that caller defending abuse drives me crazy.
Reading your 2 stories makes mine sound not so bad I only got spanked once in school and I learned to keep my mouth shut and obey and I'm not saying this as a good thing I'm saying it's how I learned to survive
@@danielfegley2735 I understand why you would think that compared to our stories, but this isn’t a “Let’s compare our wounds” or “Let’s play who had it harder” kind of thing. Talk about what you’ve been through if it’s bothering you enough to want to talk about it. All instances of assault, especially those against a child are unforgivable and even ones that seem completely mild and innocent to some can cause PTSD in others.
If beaten for no reason at all, what have you learned?
❤
"F off fascist." Absolute best answer to a person like this.
Yes !
the fact that he sometimes has to switch "slave" for "servant" just to make it palatable for him to say is so painfully telling
Forrest is as calm and polite as a person can be. It takes a special kind of stupid to draw this level of anger out of him.
Yeah and not just stupidity, he's patient with stupid people, it takes actual violent levels of stupidity. Cruelty disguised as stupidity.
It ain't just stupidity, cruelty plays in
William sounds like a liberal or democrat
@@americanpatriot8426 Describe the "sound" of a liberal person
@@americanpatriot8426 what are you talking about?
The visible disgust on Forrest's face the entire time is exactly how everyone should feel about this
As a black man listening to this YT guy literally force himself to believe my ancestors deserve this shit make me wanna pop his top!
as a white European I have the same feeling about the barbary slave masters
"A Black Christian is a black person with no fucking memory." - Chris Rock, 1989
@@durendin Especially since it wasn't just slavery, but post civil war, all the segregation, not to mention the anti-miscegenation, were being propped up using the Bible.
And even now, white supremacists use the Bible to justify their bigotry.
This caller…this caller!! I can’t even!
As a HUMAN BEING...
This is also a great example of what child indoctrination does to people.
It is nothing less than mental cruelty and should be illegal
This shit gets drilled into their heads so many times, that they can't comprehend anything outside of religion.
@@Gerryjournal Let's call it what it is. Grooming.
I’m glad that I got out of this shit. I really hate religion right now.
This is a prime example of why access to education should be a basic human right
And why birth control should be used
Sadly there are a lot who think this way and not just with religion. I had a debate with a guy who said "Slavery didn't seem that bad. All meals and necessities were provided which is great, so what's the big problem?". I didn't get upset, just asked would he be my slave and how much for his daughter. He immediately got angry, but, I reminded him I'd take care of his necessities and meals. He still didn't take the deal for some reason.
Yeap. It's called cognitive bias.
How he gonna get mad?
I wish they would have asked this caller the same question
LMAOO the hypocrisy
If the masters hot enough I’d be down. I’ve always had a sex slave fantasy 😂…
All jokes aside, owning slaves is f***** up… unless it’s consensual 😅.
They have no choice. They cannot admit to themselves that the book has something that evil, so they have to find a way to justify it.
I think in Williams case he would happily own slaves today.
It was good to see Forrest getting angry like this, expressing the anger and frustration that I was feeling too. What a f*cking horrible human being that caller is!
Why?
@@darinb.3273 Because Forrest is usually very genial, but when this type of trash calls in and demonstrates how horrible the Bible can be, he lets his outrage show.
@@darinb.3273 Why what?
@@darinb.3273 try watching the video bro.
@@FlushDesert22 Read the main comment starting this thread and give an answer to why Forest's anger is good, and why the caller is a horrible person.
I’m not sure I’ve ever seen Forrest more disgusted at a caller.
Yeah when he started talking over Kenneth, who was keeping the usual style, you could just tell how fucking done he was with the caller
It was well earned. The guy said he was a loser.
What kind of adult can’t come up with an idea of what the word “truth” means? He was so afraid that everyone was looking for some gotcha that he could barely communicate beyond grunting.
I noticed at 8:37 the second the words "just because somebody might get hurt..." Leave the callers mouth, Forrest's face instantly drops and from that point onwards in the video I've never seen Forrest look so disgusted. Hes usually so smiley even when dealing with people like evolution deniers. The contrast is crazy. I think that is the moment he gave up with the call.
I think the most recent caller got him to that point too
Forrest's "Fuck off Fascist" is the most honest response to a caller like this I can imagine.
“I believe the Bible so the Bible is true because I feel the Bible true so the Bible is true” wonderful argument.
‘Look, look, it says it’s true so it MUST be’… 🤦🏾♀️
"My Favourite Wizard has a Magical Book"
I like how he denied the Quran because that's not his god. Yeah it is dude, same deity. I can at least chalk it up to him not knowing the connection of the Abrahamic religions, as that's entirely possible. But yeah, when you grow up in a specific religion, it's difficult to even realize you can't see the Forrest for the trees. (pun most definitely intended)
Where does he say that?
@@martinsoukup562 throughout the entire video, try listening for once fk nut
It is one of the saddest call-ins ever and it explains a lot about religion
And the state of the country as well.
@@brianemerson6116 A friend of mine travelled a lot and has been all around the globe. He met people everywhere. He said the country with the most stupid people is America. Yes, he is so right. It is not home of the brave, it is home of the dumb.
@@brianemerson6116 Both of these comments are disturbingly true.
@gregsanich5183 Did you hear nothing wrong in that?
@gregsanich5183 Well, I'm assuming that they're specifically referring to Christianity, which has had a long and infamous history of both defending and denouncing slavery as it sees fit at the time. The Bible can be interpreted to say almost anything you want if you tilt your head and squint in just the right way. It's been that way ever since it was written. It's a tool of thought and behavior control, for whoever is in power at any given moment.
If mental gymnastics were an Olympic discipline, William would take the gold medal easily.
Forrest Valkai is so triggered and outraged it made me feel like I didn't have to be. Thank you Forrest for carring that cross for us. You are my savior sir.
I totally agree! I just wanted to add that I appreciate how much patience, grace and strength Kenneth showed by going on and engaging with William for as long as he did.
This cant get enough likes
*worships in atheist*
@@drwexan7684 Time to do our daily Worship of Atheism! *proceeds to do nothing*
I would not want combat with an intellectual powerhouse like Forrest. Kenneth is pretty cool too and keeps William to task. So much easier being Atheist.
People like this can vote and it’s terrifying
Yes - it is terrifying.
People like this vote republican
Yes it is and we've already seen the hideous results of their votes. Critical thinking in this country has plummeted to its lowest point since Joe McCarthy was running amok.
I don't know about everyone else, but this guy? This type of guy? Is scary asf😳 There's millions of them out there and they vote... and follow orders.
For William justifying slavery through "making real working man", the classic question of Dillahunty: "would you be my slave under biblical law?" would have been perfect
Actually, I think it has to be more visceral. My question to him would be, "so, you'd be ok with me owning you and your whole family? Sold off the women for profit and made real men out of the the rest of you by working you extra hard and with vicious discipline?"
Matt would have hung up after 1 Minute. This caller is completely delusional.
@@Maggisoo His ability to conjure up an original thought was breathtakingly inadequate. He just kept regurgitating indoctrination over and over. He couldn't even understand the concept of truth. The brain rot has settled in deep.
Also, women were slaves too. Many of them sex slaves. Some forced to marry the man who killed her family.
Would William choose to become someone's slave forever?
Forrest: “FUCK OFF”. This made my day!!
You pissed off the wrong scientist 😂😂😂😂😂😂
My thoughts exactly!
Mans sticks by his values "we can have a nice polite conversation but the moment you wanna use that to try and justify bigotry we're gonna have a problem"
LOL
Forrest..... I like Spores, Mould's and fungus
Lol, true dat.😂
FORREST says “Fuck off”?? Oh, I’ve gotta watch this again!!
Every time you talk about beating kids, I go tell my children how much I love them and that they're doing a great job.
I tell them that all the time, but this crap makes my being ache.
Thank you for telling these people off
This is the first time I've seen Forrest being this mad and I'm enjoying every second of it 😂
Ikr. And I don't blame him one bit. William deserves a biblical slave beating. Maybe it would make him a "real" man.
Same
@@thefourthwritedjentleman3643 same
@Margie Smith "Theres always hope for a breakthrough."
If only that were true.
The absolute disgust on his face is priceless 😂
I have become pretty convinced that some people are simply not intelligent enough to have conversations like these. William is one of those people.
I was forced to listen to psychopaths like William multiple times every week of my life that I could remember until I was finally given the choice @ the age of 16. to never set foot into another evil place that teaches such mindless babbling people who regurgitate what the people that believe that book written, to give ignorant goat herders thousands of years ago, that had no clue where the sun went to at night. Some helpful hints how to live a little better life, than a book taken as fact and belief in your fairy god fearmonger.
Must we stay static in the teachings of some Basic Instructions Bettering Lacking Earthlings? I see the usage of "heathen" in that book as something completely different than how I hear or read people claiming what a heathen is now.
As far as I can see from the evidence around me is that as a species of hominin, we have evolved and expanded our intelligence, and the ways in which we can get access to just about anything one needs an answer to, and how, even if I was a goat farmer at this time, I certainly do know, or have access to, innumerable things more than the people that book was written for.
Why should I care what is written in that book, any more than all other books of fiction, Fairy tales, Folk lore, similes, allegories, legends? I've read plenty of great books.
Just because the authors changed the first sentence from, "Once upon a time". To, "In the beginning". didn't make that make believe book, into being. Real, or meaningful.
I've been around so many church people like William. They should not be allowed to have children. I care not about the wants of adults when it comes to children.
That man is the product of child abuse. No matter at what age.
You're right. Some times "I'm sorry, you're just too stupid to talk to." is all you can say.
@@Clem.H.Fandango It is an inconvenient truth that nobody talks about. That 30% on the left side of the bell curve. They'll likely NEVER understand any of these concepts. It lends credence to the hypothesis that maybe, just maybe, religion IS INDEED necessary...you know...for the left side of that curve. This also is an excellent explanation for the GOP.
@@geelee1977 You're saying they're so dim if they didn't have a fear of disappointing God or eternal hell fire and without a 2000 year old collection of questionable manuscripts to guide them, they would have no moral compass at all? Just raping and killing without regard?
@@geelee1977 I think Seneca expressed a similar thought when he stated.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false,
and by rulers as useful.
Now Forrest knows why Matt is the way Matt is.
Forrest will need to repeat this scenario for at least another decade or so to truly level the playing field ... but this is a nice start.
Forrest really strongly resembles those first few episodes of Dillahunty way back in like 2003 or something, so polite and willing to give the benefit of the doubt...
Matt is the way , the truth and the life
No one comes on the line but by him
AMEN !!
Maybe Voltaire was right: "He who can make you believe in absurdities can make you commit atrocities." 😖
this makes me scared that people like William exist in America, imagine having him as a neighbour
Or employer.
Or your government official.
honestly him existing at all is scary. probably because i dont live in america
This was scary. I like how Matt always asks proponents of Biblical slavery whether they would like to be slaves under this system. I wish they had asked this moron whether he’d like to be a slave and beaten at will as long as he didn’t die. I feel like taking a shower after watching this.
@@Edmond347 what's even scarier is some of these idiots actually say they would live as slaves with Matt being their master, they are so muddled in their thinking, so corrupted by their religion they have lost their humanity.
On slavery: “Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you’d have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.” ~ Steven Weinberg, Nobel Laureate in physics.
THAT is how you get people to justify slavery.
Atheism religion is a belief system based on faith ,not facts...The Lord Savior Jesus Christ came to relieve humans from religion...it's religion who provided the drive to kill Jesus.
I disagree and would definitely say any sort of cult or ideological indoctrination can do that. (Politics, etc can also do that)
But yeah I agree with the sentiment of the statement at least. Very powerful quote.
Yeah. But this quote is about religion.
@@Skydv2005 yes religion can definitely do that. As this caller demonstrated quite clearly.
I CURE ATHEISM!!! 10 MINUTES OR LESS!!!!
The best own here would have been "have you ever been a slave William? No? Then how will you ever be a real man?"
He is slavishly devoted
hahhahahahahahahahaha 👏👏👏👏
I was expecting to hear Matt's famous question: "Would you accept being my slave under bible's conditions?"
Excellent point
Good one! 👍
The simple fact alone that he said you have to beat a kid to make him a man is horrifying. I hope he never has children
I’m pretty sure that would require procreation, which I think is way way out of this guy’s ballpark.
@@PetersPianoShoppe I hope that's true. Hopefully no woman would ever sleep with him.
“Listen, I know you are scared to death to have an honest conversation about this” - thanks for calling him out Kenneth
As much of an immoral piece of shit as that caller was, he is likely that way because he is a victim of his religion, made to feel existential dread when confronted with the reality of what it has forced him to become. I like Forrest but I think Kenneth's approach here was much more admirable and it gave me a whole ton of respect for him. We should not shy away from these conversations exactly because of how disturbing they are. It's important to reveal them and make examples of them, but also to reach out and try to pull these people back to reality. Blowing them off as a lost cause just ensures they stay lost.
Forrest is such a nice and genuine person, so you know stuff is serious when he starts getting sassy.
Seems like he's always a little bit sassy. It's when he gets _angry_ that things get serious. I've never heard him tell someone to fuck off quite like 16:03
“That’s such a stupid unnecessary thing, to talk about truth.”
Slavery Man just said the quiet part out loud.
Starting at 12:46 William starts to clarify that he determines truth according to the promise that comes with it, making him the perfect mark for every crazy conman and scammer out there.
“Why would I care about truth”
That’s called psychotic detachment.
This mentality is LITERALLY what defines a PSYCHOPATH or a SOCIOPATH. I hope his family & local law enforcement know about this guy.
Also known as Fundamentalism.
William doesn't need truth. He has the Bible that he can use to make his own truth.
You think the earth is a globe? You can use the Bible to say its actually flat. You think whites are superior? Sure, the Bible can help you with that. The Bible is SO useful.🙄
Well indentured servitude is better than modern incarceration. The Bible supports indentured servitude not slavery.
@@mrfarts5176 Nice attempt at trolling, but must try harder next time
The fact that Forrest was this upset says a lot. Kenneth has insane patience. This caller is disgusting.
absolutely
I thought they both had the patience of a saint...oh hang on!
Shout out to Kenneth for keeping calm as a cucumber, that dude has so much patience, it's inspiring.
Kenneth tried to appeal to the hopeful remains of an empathetic human behind the brainwashing. I’ve seen it work on this show before, but this is someone who seems to have completely turned to stone and there’s nothing that can be done.
I found his patience grating tbh. He should've told that utter POS off.
I love how Forrest was just done with this caller.
This guy is detached from reality on a psychotic level.
William, like many, is not a thinker. He is a repeater of what was told to him. One day he may wake up. Maybe not.
Considering what he told them, how slim it looks is a definite when it comes to indoctrination.
Probably not.
How about we enslave William first, and then see how good of a worker that makes him.
I’ve heard so many Theist try and say slavery and worker for an employer are the same thing.
Also trying to compare pets to slaves lol 😂
Yeah ...his brain is mush
Kenneth works so hard on this call. If he's volunteering as a host, he should be paid double.
Since volunteers don't get paid, double nothing? 🤣🤣🤣
@@johntuel2375 Went to reply to say just that 🤣 that’s a hell of a thanks
Speechless! I didn’t know there was another level to this kind of madness. I have heard people defend stupid shit and you always sense they’re a bit confused but William isn’t and that’s scary.
"Slavery is just work." This level of ignorance towards the endless historical suffering of millions of slaves is deeply disgusting. Whenever I'm hearing this kind of obviously delusional BS, I feel that I'm getting very angry. No matter if left or right, theist or atheist, the answer "Slavery is evil" obviously should be self-evident.
"Owning human beings as property is just smart." What a disgusting little man.
Dear caller: might I suggest that in this conversation you are clinging to a few central credos: my god is a loving god; my bible was written by my god; my god neither makes mistakes nor lies nor offers contradictions.
And so you find yourself in the position of defending slavery, among other atrocities described in your bible. Can you not see the corner into which you have painted yourself?
@Something Something Dark Side yeah. It’s called wage slavery and it’s why general strikes and union organizing should be happening non stop right now.
@Something Something Dark Side at the same time, you are not owned by your employer. They can not sell you to another company or rip your child from your arms to sell to their buddy to r*pe. They can not beat you and you can leave at the end of the day. Do not seek to minimize chattel slavery.
@Something Something Dark Side I’ve had many minimum wage jobs, bud. They are not comparable, at ALL.
I’m not going to argue with you about this any more than I will waste my life arguing with a holocaust denier. You need a serious history lesson and unless you’re willing to pay me, I suggest you check out perhaps the
Crash Course on American and African American history. You can find an entire awesome series here in TH-cam, US history section hosted by the wonderful John Green (brother of SciSchows Hank Green!)
I think if he were in my presence making those statements, I would be justified in beating him. To teach him a lesson, you know.
Extremely admirable patience Kenneth, wow. Huge props for somehow keeping this unfortunate simpleton mostly on track.
I love kenneth patience, but in this particular case i really think he should have leave Forrest destroy this piece of sh*t, trying to rationate with him was looking impossible since the first minute of the call.
Kenneth's patience was incredible. I was with Forrest at the point of giving up on this toxic example of a human being (which is rare, because I often think Forrest has far more patience than I do).
The annoying part was how close Kenneth seemed to get to reaching William... before William crossed some potential cognitive dissonance and fell back to the quotes or platitudes that his pastor/priest tells him in church.
@@sonochamp Forrest is relatively new at the call in thing. Maybe he didn't realize just HOW bad these believers are.
@Technic which lord? from which religion?
"why would i care about truth?" That should have been the end of the conversation.
i give the guys a lot of credit for talking with William as long as they did. Matt would have shut him down within a few minutes.
I thought they nailed it with the football analogy..
@@Krocodillian Oh for sure it was good i just hate when hosts let stuff like that slide over and over. Like i get it's good entertainment though.
Yup. William keeps changing the word "slave" to "servant" to make it seem more acceptable. Thanks for catching him.
"Would you be my slave under the rules of Exodus 21?" We should ask them this more often.
Matt Dillahunty has literally asked callers if they would be his slave under the rules in the bible, for some reason none of the callers accepted. i wonder why...?
@@hellshade2 I remember a woman that said yes. He sent her to talk heathen.
@@MaleINTP now that you mention it i think i did see that one. and went to talk heathens video too. but i honestly don't remember her name or anything. thxs for the reminder.
Why would a person NEED to be? That is a really DUMB question to ask. To ask such a question proves beyond doubt the one asking has no clue what was going on because said person has picked a few verses or a single chapter and then proceeds to ask REALLY DUMB questions.
@@hellshade2 Gman’s answer to that question was hilarious. He said, “Yes, I’d be your slave, as long as you’d pay me.” 😂🤣😂
"Beating your slaves is a good thing." Christian love in a nutshell. Only mindless adherence to a deity could get people to jump through hoops to try to defend slavery as a good thing.
No Christians say that. Masters are duty bound to make their servants productive so they can contribute to society. This is why if servants recover within three days your actions are justified. However they have to fully recover in that time period or it is a punishable offense.
@@mrfarts5176 That doesn't matter, owning another human being as property is still immoral.
@@FlushDesert22 Well owning a person might be immoral under some circumstances. However, the Bible is referencing indentured servitude.
@@mrfarts5176 Come on! Read the Bible!
It talks about going to surrounding nations to essentially get people as spoils of war. That is NOT indentured servants.
The Bible talks about killing everyone EXCEPT girls who are still virgins. What do you think that was for?
Maybe you can sleep at night telling yourself it's not slavery, but you are fooling yourself.
@@mrfarts5176 I haven't heard of an indentured servant that you can go out and buy from a market- and then pass them on to your children. And keep any children born from there wives....and also there wives. The Bible does mention indentured servitude, but it also specifically condones the act of slavery in and of itself. You also just heard a Christian say that in this video above- and can hear it in several other calls from the channel.
Forrest nailed it..."then you're fucking evil" and then hearing William back away from his creepy opinion was both funny and incredibly scary
"Because it's non-sense feel-good words coming out of the mouth of a fascist." got me yelling.
@@Gortall it was "stock church answers" that got me, that nailed it in for me
The atheists don’t believe slaves have objective natural rights.
@@damonkenny7818 Say that again?
@@Gortall Atheists don’t believe in natural rights for human beings. They believe in subjective legal fictions.
Forrest is UTTERLY done with this guy. Wow.
"Because it's nonsense feelgood words coming out of the mouth of a fascist."
So true here. So true from unfortunately too many people these days.
Thank you Forrest for nailing it!
@Technic Wow. What a bogus statement. The part of "not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance" is complete BS and if you think that's a true statement, then read the Bible. Read the claims made by Jesus himself, and the words attributed through God throughout the entire 66 +/-books. What you find is it being very clear that 1) God has his own chosen people, everyone else be damned. 2) God wipes out huge swaths of people (which is genocide, btw), both by his own hands as well as using people to do so, and 3) states very clearly multiple times that very few people will come to know God, with the vast majority left receiving punishment or torment in some ways (of which are not exactly clear, depending on what verses you are reading).
So no, "the Lord", God I presume you are referring to, is not patient. That's terribly clear. Not wanting everyone to perish is not a goal of his at all. And he seems to have little interest in everyone coming to repentance. He clearly picks and chooses, and it doesn't seem to be based on anything except his own whim. You can't tell me that the Bible heroes like David, Solomon, Samson, Noah and many others, led lives that we can be proud of. I mean, David is a perfect example of a disgusting human being that was so selfish and self-righteous that he felt he could do anything and get away with it. I am more moral than David, and you probably are too, but not in God's eyes. David is the freakin' King and best example of one of his people, except for maybe Jesus who is claimed to be God, so whatever.
Bottom line is, your god either doesn't exist, which explains things perfectly. Or your god is an extremely weak god, and not only doesn't keep promises or move quickly, he basically has little to no power to do anything. Or your god is a monster and does not deserve worship, but instead deserves contempt and dismissal. Or I guess your god may have created us, but doesn't have a clue, and that almost seems plausible. I certainly don't accept your god having any of the omni attributes, as they would not only self-contradict, but he certainly doesn't act like he has any of those things, unless of course this is all part of his plan, and in that case, his plan is garbage. So, what do you think?
He wasn't wrong, but his emotional outburst derailed the conversation. That's not how you change minds. Kenneth has a MUCH better approach.
@@seekeroftruth6728 it's doubtful that William in Florida's mind is going to get changed, and certainly not by one phone call. Being told that their views are not only wrong, but they are disgusting and fascists, is sometimes a good thing. People often let bad behavior and ideas slide because they don't want to rock the boat or because it means they might not be liked so much.
Everyone has a different approach, and sure we can criticize Forrest for not being patient enough with this caller, and I might agree with you on that. I get very frustrated with Matt Dillahunty these days, and I really respect his perspective and intellect on many subjects. I find him to be way more brash, impatient and short-fused than I think a show host should be. I get why he's that way - he's heard so many dumb arguments that if one sounds like a dumb argument he's heard before, he jumps on the caller and tells them to stop wasting his time with the same old crap. I don't think that makes for a compelling show in my opinion.
I enjoy those who have more patience and have a more meaningful conversation, even if the conversation doesn't actually end up going anywhere because the theist who calls in has nothing much to offer except false claims and bad ideas. As for the audience, there's so much content out there that if this is the only video they ever watch, and it doesn't change their mind or their life, then that's fine. I wouldn't expect that anyway. I would hope it would take more than a TH-cam video to change a mind.
@@smequals I hear you and agree with most of that. In this specific case, you could literally hear the caller shut down and go into defense mode. Add you're right, he may never change his mind, but so many theists have been brainwashed into thinking that Atheists are evil, arrogant, (fill in the blank), and are doing the devil's work. Showing them that we can be thoughtful, compassionate people that are open to honest conversation seems to catch them off guard and often disarms their preconceived notions (about us anyways).
@@seekeroftruth6728 I agree. I also think that everyone's got their own way of doing things, and I don't subscribe to the "you catch more flies with honey" mentality. I wish someone would have said, "dumbass, your idea is stupid" a few more times in my life than actually happened. And honestly, not everyone is good at having a nuanced and thoughtful conversation, nor is everyone receptive to that. Sometimes calling a fascist a fascist is the best you're going to do. I believe if the best we can do is nitpick each other's approach, we really don't get there. I'm not going to be the best diplomat, but I might plant a seed in what I say so that when someone hears the same thing, but in a different way, it finally resonates with them. Maybe William from Florida has never considered that his viewpoint is fascist, or he may not even know what the word means. Maybe he even took 10 seconds and looked up the definition of the word, after being called one on the air. We may never know, but I think it's important to always keep in mind that there is no perfect way when it comes to this kind of thing. We think there is, and it's often either our way or the way of someone we highly respect or admire (which makes our way the second-best way, close to the perfect way but not quite). The reality is that a calm conversation and a slap in the face are both effective sometimes with some people, but not all the time with everyone.
It's simple. William is convinced that he'd be one of the slave owners in biblical times, so therefore slavery is fine. If he understood that he'd most likely be one of the slaves, he'd have a different opinion.
Slavery’s fine, as long as you’re not the slave. I smell circumstantial morality.
@Technic the field mouse may be fast, but the owl does not sleep at night. The cobbler mends shoes, but wears his hands thin… it’s easy to manifest an unjustified sense of importance with words, theists love to inject suggestion and emotion into their spiels, only to try veil utter nonsense.
@Technic what I said did have meaning Technic, deep and important meaning actually… if the message didn’t come to you your brain was closed to it because your brain has been poisoned with religious programming. It’s *YOU* who needs saving, but only you can free yourself - don’t let your brain sleep! Turn it on, look under the veil of lies you’ve been feed Technic, they’re easy to see if you’d only look with a turned on brain and an honest heart. I care about you Technic and want to help! I don’t want you to waste your life away on these middle-eastern religious lies.
Thankfully it’s not too late for you, cast away your poisonous iron age thinking that rots your mind. And walk into the real world, you’ll see the truth and will celebrate in it.
I’ll keep thinking and hoping for you Technic, or whatever your real name is. This isn’t sarcasm, I truely hope you can one day see the fallibility of your belief.
@Technic you ran, but like the owl I won’t give up on you Technic. I hope you’ll find the truth and cast away a religious programming that has clouded your mind. There’s still hope, you need to know that.
@@norswil8763 Honestly there's no hope for people like @Technic. He is forever lost in his "faith" hamster wheel hoping he will reach the most elusive of all destinations: the false promises of an ancient book. His prayers are not only useless for us but also for him in his on religion circle (supposing that it's true). If his god knows the future and his will is always done, then intercessory prayer is utterly meaningless.
Just imagine 2000 years from now people arguing about just how good of a friend Ron was to Harry
And how Dobby was such an immoral ungrateful little jerk for not staying with his owners. Hermione Tubman.
@@evientually I realize this is a joke but Dolby was the sweetest house elf ever you take that statement back lmao
@@thegoldavenger.3829 🤣 Well OBVIOUSLY it's not true! Just like real slaves aren't unappreciative jerks for leaving their 'masters', that's why it's so ridiculous! 😘
@@evientuallyI think it had something to do with a sock. 😂
Friendist and Anti-friendist parties.
I've never seen Forrest this way, he's usually very smiley even if he has an ignorant person on the line, but he was just done with this person, like he wanted to just call him all the expletives he could but maintained slight composure im proud of him, because I would have just hung up
William is a scary horrible person and should be on a watch list of some sort
Just put him on ALL watch lists. I'm sure he fits
Agreed. I wish we could get the FBI to investigate this POS.
@Technic meaningless irrelevant drivel on the level of a bot comment
you're gonna need to place about 30% of the U.S. population on that list
Sounds pretty fascist my guy
Williams uses the bible as a comfort blanket everytime he feels scared about having an honest conversation. He turns to the bible for answers that are not there. This is the result of living in an echo chamber for decades.
The fact that he kept saying "servant" instead of "slave" even after being corrected is a dead giveaway that deep down he does realize the problems with slavery. He just feels compelled to defend it because the Bible condones it and he is hopelessly brainwashed into believing that the Bible is the true word of god and is a good book.
Kenneth was right on the money when he called out how scared the caller was to have the conversation. Like an animal backed into a corner, fighting at any cost to not be destroyed - because those are the stakes for a deeply religious person confronting the reality of their beliefs. I have so much respect for Kennith's attempt to keep the caller in that corner and force him to face the harm his religious causes him. Hopefully one day he can find his way out.
Thanks guys for speaking out against hitting children or adults! SO important.
The fact that someone like Willian exists is very scary.
Scariest thing is that there are numerous people in congress right now who agree with him. MTG for example
half of Americans and some elected officials are like this
I love angry Forrest. This was such a great clip; you guys did such a good job of exposing the irrationality and the frustration it brings.
I've never seen angry Forrest before. I've seen annoyed and irritated Forrest. I don't remember angry Forrest. I can't blame him. The frustration was very high. Kenneth's patience was incredible.
I don't often see Forrest get this heated and disgusted with someone. It really takes someone of despicable moral character to bring that out of him.
Remember the fried eggs commercial? "This is your brain on drugs." We need an update with William as Exhibit A: "This is your brain on faith." That's some brain rot he's got!
If this guy owned slaves, he for sure would beat them without mercy.
absolutely, because he has this really weird thing where he thinks that beating people and making their lives miserable makes them stronger people, he doesn't live in reality.
not only his slave, but for his child. poor guy
@@baxi3838_SG I very much hope that no woman would let William within 500 feet of them for reproductive purposes.
Only if they got uppity though................ How does a person of any moral character try to justify slavery?
I think he must be a troll. No one can be that relaxed about these things. Most Christians are not twisted psychopaths, they squirm when trying to defend slavery.
First time ever someone could take the smile of excitement out of Dr. Valkai's face.
Does he have a doctorates? Never heard that
@@moe5177 ph.D in biology.
Idc, the point is the smile on the face! He took mine away too!
Don't forget William can vote for presidency . William can drive on the same road as us .
Reproduce
Hold up. Indentured servitude is not slavery. Most slavery references were bad translations.
@@mrfarts5176 oh so it is ok to beat your "indentured servants" since they are not "slaves" by modern context. I can not sleep at night.
@@mrfarts5176 nope. It's slavery. And the beatings weren't bad translations.
@@mrfarts5176 Nope.
I love how passionate Forrest is.
Lmao, “I know that you are scared to death to have an honest conversation about this but we’re going to try it.” Thank you for that part.
I hope William doesn't hold a position of authority in his work place because if he does, I pity his employees
William is a deep dive into the mind of someone who is really into Jesus. Combining the worst of religious beliefs with the worst of toxic masculinity.
Yep yep yep yep yep
Yeah is so sad, this dude really believes all the non sense. 95% of christians dont are as devout as this guy
@@kentonbaird1723 He might not have any issues with black people. He didn't say anything racist.
@@kentonbaird1723 I’ll bet I know how he feels about us black folk.
I don't think he is really into Jesus, afaik Jesus is portrayed as a gentle compassionate soul, who engaged with everyone, didn't judge and held all mankind as equal. There seems to be a uniquely american form of 'Christianity ' that is about hate, othering and superiority. Even i can see they're not Christian they're (imo) bigots cherry picking biblical quotes.
Pretty sure that caller either has or wants a white hood btw. He seems to have that mental ability to put people into a 'lower' bracket than him.
what an absolutely delightful chap William is... how incredibly charming and rightous he sounds... must be those wondeful christian values he holds.
There is a saying by Mark Twain "You cannot argue with a stupid person ,they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."
We just witnessed that lol
I almost appreciate the guys honesty in letting us know how horrible he is. Dude got asked is it okay to own a slave and literally just came right out and said 'I think its smart.' Wow
18:07 THANK YOU FORREST THANK YOU A TON! You answered exactly what I was yelling at the screen, I couldn't hear it because Kenneth also spoke over, but I could sorta read the lips! Thank you for answering "So now you know what WE feel!" ALL THE TIME! The lack of insight these people have is astonishing! But thanks to Forrest, and also Thanks to Kenneth you are a perfect pairing in this show.
Forrest being extremely savage in this video gives my life meaning.
This guy needs to seriously be put on a watch list. I wouldn’t she surprised if he has someone against their will in his basement
I wish they had delivered Matt's "Would you be my slave under biblical law?"
And if William said no, he’s simply admitting that he’s not a real man, but instead a loser, right?
@@boblangford5514 Quite.
And also a hypocrite.
And if he had been asked that, I predict he would have happily said "Sure!" because his head is so empty thanks to his religious indoctrination.
@@Grand_Theft_Autobot Then invite him down, put him on a boat, take him into international waters, and beat him every couple days while forcing him to work the fishing nets all day and night. Show him how awesome biblical slavery can be.
Yes! I thought the same.
Being raised cult religiously I had internalized abusive thoughts so badly that when I first heard adult men (the power keepers) speak against this type of mindset I felt physically shook. And it just never gets old. I love these videos.
Kenneth your attempt to maintain patience and good faith was so admirable. Like I am blown away with how you handled yourself. Because I was right there with Forrest yelling at the tv.
I'm SO happy you both, and this atheist community exist. Makes me feel so much better about living in this city/state/country.
Why in 2022 are we still discussing this? As a black American person it's horrifying, unsettling and devastating that we can't all agree that slavery was a bad thing. The only reason we should be talking about it is how it happened we stopped because it was inhumane and downright wrong and we are trying to progress from it.
BuT iT cREateS wOrk FoR PEoplE
Because Christianity exists. Bottom line really.
If they admit that slavery is wrong, they have to admit that their precious moral God is wrong.
@@jquest99 Ding ding ding
Because people still insist on follow a bronze age book to the letter.
Wow, this guy is actually a real monster. Ready to sacrifice his and anyones humanity to make them "work".
Forrests ending remarks are absolutely 100% on point. Thank you for showing how religion can turn people into moral monsters.
Forrest was actually dying in this one, and I would like to thank him for being a normal persons representation.
Holy cow, I’ve never seen Forrest get this angry.
These conversations never get anywhere because one side argues from heart and feelings and the other uses reason and verifiable evidence. There will never be a meeting of minds.
"William, what does it mean for something to be true?"
"Everlasting, um, everlasting life, the truth, Holy Spirit..."
Makes sense.
Yeah, I see his reasoning there... Based on evidence... Right...
9:50 no slave has ever been viewed as a winner. No person ever looked at a slave like wow he is crushing it, I want his life
I'm not sure we can unequivocally make that statement historically. But it would certainly be a relative rarity compared to the average experience of a slave and likely be more associated with the ancient world and the Ottoman empire where a slave could be educated and entrusted with great power/position as opposed to the American South.
But either way, slavery is a vile practice regardless of whether those with nothing can look at a particular slave and be envious or not.
@@sypherthe297th2 Exactly. Some people would have preferred the lives of specific people who happened to be slaves, but it would be extremely rare that the slavery would be a reason for that.
William’s mommy and daddy were definitely brother and sister.
And definitely beat him
The only question is "would you be ok to be *my* slave for a greater good?"
His answer would be "no", and that's the end of the discussion.
I feel like puking and crying at th same time! How does Kenneth keep so calm for such a long time. This guy is too far gone!
man, kenneth. so impressed at your level-headedness and tact. forrest’s anger was also warranted. so awesome.
Such a little man who is really scared to think for himself. 😔
I don't think he know how to (think).
The obvious question to ask him would be: "Have you been beaten by your parents as a disciplinary method? Were you told over and over again, that the beating was for your own good?"
I suspect he is the survivor of abusive parents. It would takd hours and hours of therapy to heal.
And I always thought Forrest was Mr Nice guy, I feel for you with this one. Kenneth's masterly deconstruction of the caller's flawed arguments was amazing.
Kenneth’s patience’s is ASTOUNDING. Matt would have hung up on this guy video would’ve been no longer than 9 minutes. I would have hung up too lmao