An Architect Reviews the 600i - Star Citizen
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ย. 2024
- In this unusual approach to doing a review, I employ my skills as a professional Architectural designer to critically examine and critique the newly released Origin 600i. This video is not meant to be negative, but is instead meant to provide positive feedback while viewing the new ship both inside and out. You might also learn a thing or two about design language!
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Music by Epidemicsound.com
morph, you should be featured in the sc community spotlight for the most polite criticism in a videogame, good job!
Agreed!
TheCommander1000 moo
Like the comment for agreement!
ikr most videos are terrible. I'm angry too though, but that's just because I'm jaded by the game timeline and the excuses. For example, CR once said he didn't want too many ships in the game in order to make them easily identifiable... obviously that idea was thrown out once they discovered how much money they could make!
TheCommander1000 agreed and i would add that its not only polite but constructive the best kind of criticism
You should draw an example of your perfect 600i interior
Foreshadowing
th-cam.com/video/Ws_AlHguB8g/w-d-xo.html
I feel like the 600i could do almost everything the 890 Jump does if only it were organized better.
probably why they won't
@@NosightTactics yes they will, and they are! CIG is already working on it.
It will now be doing everything the 890j can between the two variants. Which honestly, I'm cool with. Want a focus on one touring or exploring only? Go with either 600i module. Want both? Get the jump.
They saw Oblivion with Tom Cruise and went crazy.
thegrimyeaper thats what I thought
Its a great movie.
That movie has some gorgeous designs. Maybe not practical or confortable, but surely beautiful.
@@theviniso If I won the lottery, I would build a home that looked just like the one from Oblivion. Glass bottom pool and all!
I totally agree with you. But I would also mention the serious trip hazards in the bridge. The floor is not flat and has catch points and angles everywhere.
Samantha Glume thats a good point
That's a general issue in SC designs. All stations, habitats and ships have very dangerous uneven floors.
he's an architect, not an engineer. Architects and sensible design don't Always mix XD
This bugs be so much! Changes in level are good, they make they can break up the space and make it feel more dynamic, but what they have done is not different levels, they have just tried to make the floor, well something to look at not walk on.
Changes in level need to be well defined, then the rest needs to be flat, but that doesn't mean it can't be luxurious.
Go to Levsky, find a personal injury and accident lawyer and sue the company you bought the ship from.
The ship feels like they had everything appropriately sized when it was ~60m and they just took the slider scaled it all up when it grew to 90m when they realized they couldn't fit the components in the initial size. It just made the whole interior feel awkward. It should have been delayed and reworked instead of being released like it was.
Damn this video is well made, the music and editing really goes together with the game and ship, aswell as your professional commenting. I can feel that you know what you're talking about!
Almost 2 years later, I am still hoping this ship's interior gets updated.
It will be
@@UpperKS
It will?
@@horstmeier512 yes, they've said in the future once more important things are handled they will be returning to the 600i to incorporate things they learned from the 890J and beyond.
@@UpperKS Do you have a source for that? I can see the 600i getting gold-standard in Q1-22, but I'm not sure that means rework.
@@MarwinKellers i can't remember when it is off hand, i believe it was either John Crewe or Mark Abent who said it the following year after the 600i release. I'm thinking somebody will reference it when the 600i gold standard pass starts in a bit.
1. As former Navy I actually loved the berthing lol. You should see what one looks like on an actually ship.
2. Just figured out where the captains quarters bathroom is because of this video LOL.
Oh yeah, Im right there with ya. But at least we had those mini shower curtains on our racks to give us the illusion of privacy. The poor crew on this ship dosent have even that and Im pretty sure they have to hot bunk too. I simply cannot believe this thing flys with a crew of four (plus the skipper)
Yeah the bed arrangement seems off. There is one for the Navigation officer, co-pilot and both astrologers but.... Where does the engineer(s) sleep? I guess he/they just sleep on the engines because he/they are a grease monkey?
What about the VIP and their staff? I dont know if Morph forgot to show us a spot but I didnt see a cabin for them.
yeah there's absolutely no way there can be 4 crew members onboard. so there's 2 extra seats in the cockpit, so im assuming there's at least 2 people other than the captain that can drive the ship. Yes, they can have multiple jobs, but still, somebody has to be piloting at most times, and the captain isn't gonna do that. Also, you have 2 seats for science people, you need a bartender or something, maybe a chef, somebody to clean up, mechanics/engineers, ect. 0 chance theres 4 crewmembers
This ship should have about 6 crew + the captain. Don't forget you'd have a bartender and a cleaning person for the VIP guests.
The VIP guest area needs more plants! And, yes, the internal area needs to be better utilized. And the Ideas for the Engineer stations on the bridge and changes to the Science stations/area is also spot on.
Only problem I really have with this ship is that it has to small a crew. If they bumped it up a class they could have max 5-7 crew (+2 engineer and +2 remote gunners/science crew) and a lot more equipment aboard.
This is EXACTLY what I'm worried about when I make a large ship in Space Engineers. A pleasing hull shape is fine, but people are going to be spending a lot more time with the interior. If the crew keeps metaphorically bumping their heads, the grinders will be out in no time.
people are spending more time worrying about not getting mauled to death by clang himself
I agree. The interior is what you'll mostly see. How you use the space and light it is huge.
And another important factor in SE. Quick escape routes! If you can't run out at full pelt when the deck is at an angle then it's a death trap.
Design from the inside. That always helps me.
From the perspective of an industrial product designer: I totally agree with all of the things you said. There is so much wasted space which by alot of people is seen as "luxury". There are 2 things that I hate most about the 600i. The cockpit being number 1. As you said its so empty, they could fit some engineering stations in the back, and even if they dont want that, which i could understand, there is enough room for a couch on either side of the door with a table infront of them, or something similar. I imagine the owner of the ship wanting to be able to sit there aswell. The second thing is the mega couch in the back of the ship. Have you seen that thing?! I was waiting for you to sit your character on it and go into 3rd person. It looks rediculus. It fits like 30 people on there... Would have been better if they split it up in booths or something similar, or just put a variety of chairs there, maybe even raise the floor back up a little and make the middle part a dance floor. I agreed with the bar position. It would have been better towards the rear. It would open up the spacve infront of the bar/door and people sitting at the bar could actually look outside.
Anyways, i know this video is a year old, and i have not been in one of these yet in game so i have no clue if anything has been changed yet.
Nope nothing has changed
Subscribed, now I have to come here for all the ship walkthroughs!
same
I guess that means that I will have to do some more ships huh XD
Indeed, get on it ;D
+
Please do, sir. Your insights where great to have here. Nice video, keep up the great work!
Thoroughly enjoyed your critique. Tried for half the video to find fault. When you started talking about the ship's most serious design flaw at +7:20 , finally withdrew my scrutinizing gaze and let the last half of the video take me through the inside of one's head who creates spaces for humans. You get design. Very well done.
@@AIVacation Damn dude, who pissed in your corn flakes?
Questionable use of space. Ships keep getting bigger in this game so as to accommodate all the systems and to make areas navigable, which is fine. This ship however, is roomy for no reason. It needs to feel luxurious, not vacant.
to many roomy is luxurious.
Exactly: vacant is not luxurious just a massive disconnect that made me think 🤢
Just imagine a big expensive hangar and with a $100000 sofa right in the middle with the table 100ft away on the other side.
Yea, no luxury at all.
I agree, there is oooo much wasted and underutilised space
The problem with this and so many of star citizen's ships is the backwards design process, prioritizing form over function, which in turn is a product of poor direction and essentially letting artists not consulting with engineers or architects (at the very least they needed to be educated in logical design process, like working out how something will WORK before designing how it LOOKS...) like how the engines should work (even if its fictional) before the engines get designed, otherwise you don't get a unified design language between engines on different ships, leading to player ultimately not knowing how something is supposed to work or what it even is.
In the case of the 600i, the ship doesn't know what it is... Is it designed to just be a pleasure yacht, take (paying?) passengers or have a permanent crew and be a useful ship? Because there isn't the facilities for all of them at the same time. As pointed out in the video, the most obvious example of this is the crew quarters... For some reason in CIG world, the captain is treated like royalty (fair enough, as the player(s) will usually be the captain, but it also sort of makes sense in lore), where as the crew, even on a luxury ship, are treated like enlisted personnel in the navy with little privacy.
This might make sense in a yacht, where space is so limited that the crew might have a couple tiny cabins with bunks, but if that is the case, why is there only a bed for the captain, what if he wanted to take family or guests.
Similarly, if the ship was intended more like a small cruise/passenger ship for paying passengers, where would they sleep?
Both of these scenarios would need completely separate facilities for crew and guests, so the crew would also need a galley, mess and common areas of their own.
To fix this the current crew quarters need to be split up into smaller cabins with a common space/galley/mess, there is plenty of space here so pretty straight forwards. The other question is accommodation for guests, for this the giant area at the back under the glass ceiling could be much better utilized for passenger cabins with a panoramic space view. You would also need to increase the size of the facilities to accommodate all the passengers at once, like the dining table and tv screen.
The other more different case, treating the ship more like any other functional ship in the verse, I would refer to the serenity from firefly, you for this you wont need the extra passenger cabins but the main crew ones need to be larger as the crew are employees who work full time WITH as much as FOR the captain, and would demand more from their living spaces as it is their home, not just a deployment. This basically means less disparity between the captain's and crew's quarters.
It would also mean that you wouldn't need multiples of the facilities, however the common spaces would need expanding, such as enough space around the table for the whole crew to eat together. This might also double as the meeting area (unless they wanted to include a conference room at the rear instead of that silly gigantic bench). But it does mean that the whole of the ship should be more functional in general, with less wasted space, as befits a working ship, but that doesn't mean it can't be luxurious, but it does have to be more efficient.
that was exctly what i got from this ship as well, its main function is to "look pretty", without actually achieving anything of note, its supposed to be an exploration vessel, but has no real logic behind it, it has very large recreational areas(that dont make sense, like 2 chairs extremely close to a big screen, close to a pool table).
the ship has no real idea of what its for, nor even how many people are meant to be there, its just a random bunch of rooms, like a house from one of those reality shows nobody watches anymore, but with even less functionality.
Marcos Danilo well its not just this ship, its the mentality that puts wings on a space ship before atmospheric flight is even a thing.
Then when it's added on it has to be made for all ships regardless of wings and so the system barely makes sense.
Or a worse culprit is modelling a spaceship after an f1 car just because it looks cool.
ITS FICTIONAL LOL
Immersion derps just don't get its a SCIFI SPACE SHIP game!! SCIFI = fiction, fantasy. I want space ships not fucking airplanes in space. this derper is going to have a fit with the alien ships...
Ser Garlan Tyrell there are two different versions of this ship. This is the exploration vessel if I’m correct. It makes sense for this vessel to not feature the luxury passenger quarters but more functional crew quarters. The touring version of this ship will probably feature the kind of luxury passenger quarters you were wondering about. Just my two cents.
I'm sorry, but I detect 0 w4stedspace in this video.
har har. Glad to see you in the comment section w4sted, hope to see you outside of it too :P
Lol
colab incoming i hope
iTB Ozveta more group survival or general SE content??
Morphologis if you do an architectural review of a ship again where there is poor usage of space, you have to do it with w4sted. Just have him in the background following you around.
Initial Reaction to Title: An artitect reviews a Spaceship? That's like an Auto Technician reviewing a Cruise Liner.
After Video's Enlightment: The 600i is really just an inefficient living space with a warp drive attached.
I don't think the initial reaction part of this comment makes sense. Why would you compare the video to a Auto technician reviewing a Cruise ship? A more logical comparison would be, well, an architect reviewing a yacht, which isn't far fetched at all. Also, an engineer would still have logical grounds to do an expert review of ships, whether its a regular luxury Cruise liner, or a sci-fi space yacht disguised as an exploration vessel, although, admittedly, a Car technician probably shouldn't do an expert review of any of those two. But your mind jumping to the conclusion that an architect shouldn't review a sci-fi spaceship seems strange, especially seeing as it is the role of the spaceship to provide a habitable well designed living space for long periods of time, which, of course, is something architects excel at, since you know, they _design_ those things (I don't mean they design spaceships, but they design the interiors for buildings and homes, and even real ships, which, due to the way ships are designed in the sci-fi universe of SC, would fall into the realm of things an architect would design). Anyways, this concludes today's episode of dude from fictional space empire who can't aim overthinks a joke.
@@imperialsnowtrooper7579 , I think the idea was that "reviewing a spaceship" doesn't sound like the creator is about to critique the use of space or aesthetics in a roleplaying sense, but more like talking about the power systems and how the weapons are placed or how good it is at being a freighter vs a combat vs an explorer ship, comparing stats and numbers. Saying that he is an architect up front does hint that the aesthetics and living design are the subject, but most reviews of video game vehicles I've seen elsewhere are typically unrelated to the materials of the interior and color temperature
So there is a lot of w4stedspace :p
Edit: thanks everyone for the likes
Clever
Nice! XD
And their going to use this crappy layout for the 890 Jump, oh no please, get someone else on the project CIG.
I neither deny or confirm this statement.
@Josip Pavlov Glad my fellow humans do not pass these opportunities XD
One of my biggest issued with the 600 series is there is no airlock to use for eva.
You do, the gravlift elevator is sealed from the rest of the ship. The whole elevator is an airlock.
@@therinwhitten Needs a real airlock like the 400i.
One more thing I would mention about the captain cabin at the end of the video (12:35) is that
Who (the hell) would sleep while opening window to the sun ?
To make it sound, there should be an ability to close the window or some innovative sunlight filtering mirror.
they are going to add an opacity function to that area later on.
ChaseFixes well thats cool. Im looking forward to it.
Opacity function will come. I imagine it'll be like a welding mask. Going Dark on command. What I don't get is why anyone thinks it'd a good idea to have a window that can only see the inside of your outer hull. That's like having a window on my house that only shows the insulation. For clarity I'm talking about the lower sides of the captains quarters window.
You can always tell the ship to turn around. You are, after all, the captain :P
The Capt. Cannot smash😳
"Hi guys. I'm Morphologis, and today I thought we would do something special. As many of you know I did a video 30 years ago on the 600i. Well 3 months ago Musk Technologies released the 600-Interstellar, the latest in personal interstellar travel, with Elon himself claims the 600i and my original video on it was his inspiration. For those of you who are new, Yes, I am a practicing architect in New Taiwan, on Alpha Centauri III..."
?
@@zionholmberg9404 i don't get it either... or how 109 people understood that
@@syndan9245 Think many years to the future, and read it again.
What an inspiring comment :)
It's a Star Citizen release date joke
I bought this ship and so very much agree with all the points you made. The parts that really stand out to be were indeed the bar that is clearly the wrong way. If the bar was the other way the seats would also be facing the window and the view and not facing the back wall. I wish they had done away with the pool table and done a grand dining table that people could sit and either roleplay a meal or maybe having a meeting. I so agree also about your point about the engineering areas and the access to them being from the the lounge area. I do like the bedroom although I would not have the bed on the raised area next to the window. You sleep in a bed with your eyes closed so I don't see the value of a window. I would of have the desk or seating up there so the captain or VIP guest can enjoy the view while doing some work or chatting with guests. I think your also so right about the bridge area and how so much is not used. I also think there are too many trip hazards on the floor. In the event of an emergency its a health and safety nightmare :-) This video was my first introduction to your channel and it was wonderful to hear a profession talk about the use of space.... even more so that I agreed so much. I hope that someone does hear your advice and does act on some of the very good points you made.
Thank you for your continued review of ships. As a draftsman from AutoCad single digit versions, I too appreciate how the Original style evokes luxury and use of space and visuals. I would point out that if we use the yacht model, the 600i would be the today equivalent of a super yacht and would probably include a paid captain. With that in mind, a captain’s quarters immediately available to the bridge is customary.
The 400i is a classic yacht for an owner/captain with guest/crew. The 600i is the next step up that is also used as moneymaker by catering to VIP guests or charters while the owner is busy with the career that bought the yacht. The 890i would then be the mega yacht/small cruise ship which would also have a captain’s quarters immediately accessible to the bridge.
I have been disappointed with this ship's interior from the moment I saw it. I really wish they'd either hire a luxury boat architect or heavily pull inspiration from online-pictures of luxury yachts. Wide open spaces should not be used everywhere. Interior-space needs to be human scaled and intimate. CGI, please please do the 890J right and also consider a redo of the interiors of the Origin 600 variants.
Although the wasted space in the back, the front of the cockpit is the most beautiful thing i've ever seen. Imagine the view while you approach an ocean planet or even a gas giant, you're one with the cosmos, nothing in between, absolutely mesmerizing...
Let's face it: 600i and the Hammerhead need *slight* reworks.
rework retaliator first
What's wrong with the Hammerhead?
The 600i is gorgeous.
Slight, rip out about half the interior and redesign it with the goal to make the entire ship come together as well as the captains quarters and garage does.
@@lunamaria1048 Thats all it is
So happy this showed up in my recommended videos, fun to watch and informative. Hope they tweak the design a bit to fit your insight on the design.
7:40 to be honest if I saw an engineer having to go into that room I'd be a little worried.
That is a beautiful ship, and I agree with everything you said. I'm a game/VR dev, 29 years in the biz. The crew bunks are especially spartan, and definitely need some kind of privacy (even if the walls can be reconfigured to open the space).
Some of the fixed seating doesn't look practical, so some kind of swiveling movement (to get closer or push away from the surfaces) would be nice.
Very much agreed on the science section. The seats facing away from each other don't make sense, even if they're using comms to talk. People generally like to talk to each other when they talk, or just to exchange non-verbal cues. If the seats are together, then it should be easier for the occupants of said seats to face each other. I would imagine the Captain could talk to crew via comms too, but visually the wall still seems confusing and unnecessary.
"Things fitting elegantly"
Wonderful review! Thank you for doing this. I love your perspective on the ship
I like this new format
This is fantastic to watch, I never thought I'd find myself watching a video like this, but I love it.
Do more reviews of the ships . this is great stuff .
For the exploration version things, they need to change are
1- Remove the Explore room and change it to the captains quarters as well as make its size a little smaller
2- Get the explore area to be behind the large space in the back of the bridge
3- No need for a bar on an exploration vessel and make it a small hanger for a 100i
4- Change the previous captains quarters to a small med bay.
5- change the cargo design to a ramp because the railing really limit its true size.
I think you nailed it. No private crew rooms. I would kill someone after about a week. SC likes this barracks style bunk quarters just like in the Starfarer. Crew morale on any ship is crucial. Studies show that private space is no longer just a luxury but an absolute necessity during long duration travel. If I were on this ship, I would hope they keep that armory door locked.
Don't forget the blessed Starfarer's habitation deck here. Her crew also have an open barracks bunk room with a mismatched number of lockers, but at least their bathroom doors shut. The captain of that vessel, however, has no privacy at all. The office and adjoining bed alcove and personal bath are all open and unlockable and lead directly off of the crew mess area. So between smells, noise, depressurization risks, and lack of privacy, a Starfarer's captain is rarely going to have such a restful sleep. Back in her concept sale days she'd been shown with a much brighter office concept with a brilliant fish tank that sold not a few ships. Hopefully that ship gets an iteration that brings back some of that feel down the line.
Back to this 600I review video. I LOVED having him go over the ship this way. He was, if anything, a little more kind to the design choices than I feel I'd have been, but its exactly the kind of criticism CIG should seek out from somebody. Somebody to sanity check the designs before they get all the way through the design pipeline and release a vessel with as many flaws as the 600i ended up with.
Spent 6 months living with my work mates in one open space, both female and male several times over the course of 12 years. Not an issue, you get used to it after a few days, and there’s always a way to get. Little privacy. Normally in the shower, or with headphones on.
Yes there will be times you get annoyed with each other, but the vast majority of the time, you just get on with it.
The point is, with all that space, not giving more privacy is almost a statement of contempt.
This video as a whole felt so advanced, high tech, and high quality. From the soundtrack, to the game, to the high quality individual commentating it.
Absolutely *adore* this video, man! Made me feel like an architect for the future myself! Even though its not my passion, being the avid futurist that i am, i have a huge degree of respect for architects of all fields. ^_^
I'm wondering if you may have mistaken the purpose of this vessel, if it's used as a yacht then I agree with your appraisal, although I'm no architect. I think this ship was made by someone like Richard Branson, with an explorer bent. It's a thing of beauty and visually opulent as we can all see. As an explorer, the privacy issues nearly all go away because there is so much open space and therefore separation is achieved; with the exception of the sleeping quarters which are a privacy disaster... The scanner station seats probably rotate if desired. Anyone aboard has the option to talk to anyone else without the crudeness of having to actually move location, I imagine. Thumbs up for your review.
the main problem is that, this ship doesnt know what its trying to do, how many people is this ship supposed to carry, counting crew and vips. cant it even handle vips?
the hangar is also incredibly bad design, too many things, not enough good space. things like the suits shouldnt be in there, but in the armory, or at the very least, a separate location,
the room has some sort of hard separation, but its still not enough, there's too many crossed paths, and unoptmized divisions.
CIG should bring you on as a design consultant. I've watched all of your videos so far including your new 890 jump video. Almost everything you're saying is spot on. Keep up the great work.
You forgot to mention the entire back half of the ship has 0 sinks... Where the heck am I supposed to wash my hands before and after a meal?
Don’t you need to wash you’re hands more than just that?
Or are you one of those people
Absolutely love the your format and execution! A perspective uncommon to most but provides clarity to what we all feel when we utilize these spaces. You have found a niche here and I hope you exploit it fully with an entire series on past and future ships. I will be utilizing your reviews before buying ships in the future and look forward to future episodes.
Being an architect and engineer myself, I came to a very similar conclusion to you. This ship is very poorly implemented, and shows a massive gaping whole in CIG’s current skill set. They consistently lack an understanding of space and function. The ships are being designed as levels, rather than functional working vehicles/spaces. This is not the only ship that has flaws, it is a consistent issue among the fleet of ships already designed by CIG, and it is a little concerning when it is one of the major/key elements of the game. The key to a solution is Function then Form, it is clear Form is taking a much larger role in the designs and the outcome is suffering due to this misguided approach to design.
"Designed as 'levels' "... You mean like in the gameplay map sense? Yeah, that's the idea I'm getting from this ship specifically, but also to a lesser extent with earlier ones (the couple large ones there are active in game at this point). Somebody "in charge" of the basic layout of these vessels, seems fixated on ONLY the... playability(?) of the spaces/passageways/layout, in terms of using it as a first-person-shooter map, rather what the vessel in question should normally be used for.
Yes, designed as levels for FPS purposes not for actual ship function. That's the problem you encounter when programmers are tasked with attempting to design real world objects whom have little or no experience and don't have even the basic concepts of design mastered.
Yeah this is probably the problem of trying to design the ships to be able to attack them FPS style.
I remember when I was in the navy and how I thought about it "This place would suck in an FPS" because you had one large corridor and you reached everything from this corridor. No sideways and no hiding places.
yeah, level design vs realism. i thought the same stuff about the ship, still not sure if that's meant to be the captains quarters or the VIP bedroom. thought the same about the engineering sections being accessed from passenger areas. i'd like to see more separation from crew/passenger areas especially on larger ships. also the games ships could do with far more engineering sections/crawl spaces whilst keeping the rest of the ship more believable.
The "ships as levels" approach actually makes sense, except for one fact: you'll spend much more time *using* the ship than *being attacked in* or *attacking in* it. So, basically, they're designing with a priority on a less frequent aspect of gameplay.
Then again, it isn't entirely wrong to give more prevalence to the FPS portion, because perfectly designed ships would make FPS an awful experience, while designing with FPS in mind makes living in the ship just a less-than-ideal experience. However, I think the compromise they reached still goes too far towards the "ship as level" side. I remember walking around a Starfarer and thinking "hell, this would be a pain to operate comfortably".
Thank you, some very solid points on layout aspects and design ideas. I hope CIG watch this and reconsider on their future ship design decisions.
I know that this is maybe just dreams, but GOD this game looks awesome
Le Rotoculteux and you need a beastly pc to run it decently
One unintended consequence of having a glass floor under the engineering workstation seats on the upper floor (behind the glass wall near the holographic planet/orb) is that the crew working in the garage bay below the engineering stations could easily look up the clothes of the crew members sitting in their chairs or standing at their stations on the floor above the garage (a.k.a... up-skirting). I think the engineering station crew would probably end up putting cardboard panels below their chairs to prevent any creepy mechanics in the garage bay from getting a sneak-peak.
There are quite a few privacy concerns on the 600i, I'm glad you pointed them out. The lack of any sort of dividers or privacy-curtains in the sleeping quarters immediately made me think the same thing you pointed out in this video, that I would go *insane* from having *zero* alone time on years-long voyages. It would be especially irritating after a work shift, and would force all crew members to hear and see their crew-mates sleeping, having sex, farting, belching, etc... in their bunks while they try, probably unsuccessfully, to get some sleep. I think there would be a lot of crew morale problems and probably a lot of inter-crew fights and arguments on the 600i on any mission longer than about a week, lol. Great video, with an excellent critical analysis! Keep up the fantastic work! :)
i don't mind the 600i but my inner pirate/outlaw just sees target practice and loot of course :P
loot? not really, you would have more luck will a hull series ship (where you just rip off all the containers once it is disabled). only reason i could see a criminal attack a 600i is for finding hostages to blackmail their friends and family (ingame ofc) - for the target practice thing, if somebody is dumb enough to fly into pirate space without having security feel free to teach them the right way (and i am a lawful player btw)
Well my inner space cop or whatever will be glad to shoot your ship down
Great work on and thanks for the very informative and contructive video! Looking forward to the next one!
"Although the crew cubbies for where the crew members sleep is extremely well designed -- is extremely exposed to the rest of the crew members. What this means is that in long haul flight -- they'll have to be exposed to each other not only on duty, but off duty. Imagine having to live with your coworkers face to face all the time for months on end. I imagine without any privacy it would kind of start to get on your nerves."
I can confirm that it sucks more than a shop vac set to 11 in lieu of a fluffer. Hooya Navy deployments.
I appreciate your comment
And in this case, that wasted space in the middle could have been used for walls, to create individual rooms. There is no other purpose for that space.
Please do more of these. Fantastic tribute to the awesome (but sometimes flawed) work of the ship designers :).
OMG, i fell in love with the music. Can you tell me the name of the soundtrack you used to review this ship? (I'm going to subscribe)
MePeTeR91 i asked him the same thing on private message and in the comments, almost a year ago, he doesn’t answer.
Its a shame, i really wanted to know the name of that song/music. Curious i saw your reply while i was rewatching this video for the music 😂זיק סוד
MePeTeR91 maybe we can search for it together? Two is better than one :)
I created a discord so we can share our findings - discord.gg/RJjXJmW
Edgar Hopp - We'll Return
edgar hopp
6:22 The glass separation wall still allows the sense of one large room while shielding occupants of both rooms from potential noise disturbance.
Just imagine an easter-egg where you just cruise with your friends after visiting a tropical planet and suddenly systems start failing and a xenomorph starts hunting you and your crew on the ship.
TH-cam randomly suggested this video to me even though I don't even own star citizen. But you gave me a great introduction into architecture and what to think about. That was very interresting, thank you!
"This engineering space is very well designed."
In the background: Doors clipping into the wall.
That's a technical issue. Not design.
you got a new subscriber! your reflections on this are empathic and down to earth at the same time - you reason using common sense, yet your top priority is the well-being of a user/crewman/client.
seeing as i'm the type that tends to over-engineer everything i do; hearing you put into your own words the points that i couldn't express myself, felt like you managed to broaden my view - and thus you help me see the essense in my own initial reflections, essentially (and maybe ironically) narrowing my impressions down to their core components.
in shorter terms: you made it clearer for me to understand why i liked or disliked these parts of the ship that i've seen, and soaked in, and paced through on my own.
you are a credit to your profession, keep it up!
edit: also, your voice over technique is really good; both your voice itself and the intonation that you choose works really well to make a connection to your audience and convey your arguments.
Good video and thanks for sharing. However I need to point out a few Obvious and critical points you may have missed about the type of ship this actually is. It's a 'Luxury Yacht', which means that even though yes it will have a Captain, they would be part of the Crew, and therefore sleep, eat and essentially live below decks in a vessel such as this. The Front bedroom/bathroom area would be for the 'Owner' of the vessel ( Not the Captain ) and the larger and more personal spaces All used by the 'Owner' and their Guests ( Not the Crew ) . I would be really interested to hear feedback from actual Luxury Yacht Owners on this ship, people who use this type of vessel in our time today and see what they thought of the design if they were to live with it.
I think one major criticism about the design of this vessel is that unlike today's luxury Sea going Yachts, there is not enough 'distinction' between the Crew and Passenger areas on the whole. There also seems to be No space at all for 'Guest passengers' which I can only assume means that the owner does not intend to carry guests at all and this may only be used for Business trips etc between systems or even within a Star system on a short trip.
The ship does require 'Defences' because of the nature of the potentially hostile universe which it lives in and the danger of potential attack. However in a Luxury Yacht such as this, I do this that the Weapons, such as the exterior Gun turrets, could have been done more subtly rather than having guns so prominent over the panoramic rear observation area. The Decks on a vessel such as this need to be totally divided into Crew and Owner/Guest areas so that they do not overlap as much as possible. Otherwise the sense of personal luxury is diluted or lost.
Experiences ( seems inappropriate to call Star Citizen a 'Game' as such, it's more and immersive open universe 'Next Level' experience ) have reached the stage where traditional Games 'Level Designers' may have reached their limits and actual 'Architects' who are professionally trained to design such spaces are brought in as advisors to the design team within studios. I am not belittling Level Designers at all, I have personally worked with some of the very best in the industry, however a collaboration between Architects and Level Designers / Designers on projects like this may go a long way to generally improving the overall design practicality within an experience such as this.
The next step for experiences such as Star Citizen will be VR and full emersion, so it will become more critical that 'Design' and especially interior design are approached in a more 'Real World' sense rather than a 3D Game sense moving forward.
Luckily, I am uniquely positioned within the industry to help make this happen.
Game Film HUB don't forget this is the exploration version of the ship. The touring version will follow and contain guest quarters. From what I have seen with decent privacy
Yes I understand that there will be different variations of the ship, but it will take a radical re design to include guest accommodation to this design. The main point people are getting wrong about this ship is that they seem to think the large bedroom at the front has anything to do with the captain, which it does'nt. It would be very strange if on a sea-going luxury yacht the captain had the master bedroom and not the owner of the vessel :-)
True enough. Though if you take this exploration variant into account I expect this version to be owned by some absurdly wealthy 'adventurer' that treats it like their own personal plaything.
Or to put it differently, the 'captain' and the 'owner' are the same person, whether or not this person is suited to being the captain of a ship, because they see themselves as a proper adventurer, rather than what they really are. (a person with so much money they can just 'buy' an adventure and hire a few people to go along with whatever hare-brained idea they come up with.)
I do get your point about the apparent lack of adaptability to other roles though. I do have to wonder where things would end up in the other variants...
I had a few issues that you didn't catch or touch on if you did:
- There is no restroom for the guests/bar patrons. Being a military guy and later a college dorm rat, I will tell you that mixing alcohol and lack of toilets is an invitation for drunks to get creative. Likely the reason for the lack of potted plants.
- You did catch the lack of crew privacy when there would be plenty of room to box them into their own little state rooms - or - give them some more amenities in their common area.
- They had stairs present, but the ship was arbitrarily divided in half by lifts. I would knock out the rear lift and figure out a way to work a stairway from the bar area down to the toilet area. This would give some logical flow when moving about the ship.
- Storage rooms with no practical use. I expected a tiny sick bay at the very least.
- You did catch the strange direction and placement of the crew station chairs in the scanning station.
- The glass ceiling divider over the cargo bay needs to go. I'd hate to try to load something awkward and end up hitting a glass ceiling that had no purpose in being there.
- Besides the optional cargo lift, there are no other exits for the ship besides the front one-man lift. With the engine placement, it looks like they wanted to put an airlock and ramp out the rear but dropped the idea for some reason. This would be a practical way to load up the party guests straight into the entertainment area, and shuffle them back off when you want to leave.
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My educated guess is that the 3D Artist(s) stuck a little too much to the 2D Concept drawings.
For the crew quarters two small walls in the center. Kind of like double sided storage lockers with a gap in the center. This would provide a space for equipment and personal belongings while preventing you from seeing the other two crew across the room. The way the beds are positioned and spaced already prevents you from seeing the person on the same wall as you. The small space in the center would allow easy access moving between the two sides without walking all the way around the center piece and it would create a sense of separation for the two people on the same sides. Meaning they wouldn't have to share their locker space or sinks with their fellows.
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With the IAE 2950 and sale in full swing, I was considering getting this for its Buyback Token to future proof possible desires for it later on. Something that always stuck with me about this review is the scanning section you discuss at 3:20 and how the chairs face away from each other. Although I can't imagine what was going through the designer's head when they made that choice, my opinion only differs from your thoughts slightly.
Because the hologram is the focus of this room, I would face the two scanning stations toward the hologram. Making them slightly canted toward each other while giving them the best view of the display. It makes it even easier for them to look at each other while giving them the best view of this large and detailed display they are working with. Importantly, it creates a composition that keeps the focus in the main feature of the room.
Just something that I keep coming back to every time I see this ship. That and how far away those bar stools are from the bar, along with everything else that is so stretched out you have to wonder if it was designed for creatures with arms as long as they are tall.
in addition to the bar: its facing the wrong way...
you have to go around it to be in front of it, first silly thing xD
and you then have the window to look out behind you, and have to stare at a wall oO wtf?
and on a sidenote: whats with that creep window in the floor? i dont have anything particular against it, hehe :D having a female bartender doing her thing in a miniskirt, and watching her :X ^^
but who came up with that, and why is it in the game? xD
need more of this!!! :D
nice video! :)
The floor window under the bar is weird as fuck. Literally no reason to be there.
I am going to start studying architecture in a few month and you got me really hyped even more now :D
The captain bed is in front of a Window if i am a port olisar banging with my golddigger i would like It to get opaque or dark...
why would you park a luxury ship in a public place for something like that?
Jel Nirin cause im rich and i want to swing It in front of ppl
in that case there is no need for dark windows...
Yes but what if i Just want to flash it in a Batman style?
Im sure we get a button to push to make it blackout. But I also thought about my bed being flaunted in space being a problem in some situations
I really liked this review and is the first SC video I've seen in a few months. Please make more of these.
now ik this sounds super nit - picky, but i dont like the color of the lights in the forward section of the ship, just too bright for my tastes
I'm hopeful we'll be able to control or customise the lights at some point - dimm them or change colours.
I don't like the dark hallways and stairways between rooms. I always have to use the flashlight walking around to really see any of the cool art and details in there. Those areas just seem too dark compared to the rest of the ship.
This is reaaally cool, calm and interesting to watch! Fully enjoyed that vid! ;D
Great video, enjoyable to listen to your interpretation of their work. However, my issue with SC is....FINISH THE GAME! COMPLETE DEVELOPMENT AND RELEASE THE GAME ALREADY!!
Holy moly, this is one of the best presentations about ... any design, really! Thank you!
ALL the ships are a large waste of space. The one positive example is the Redeemer, which was designed by fans. The contrast to all the other ships is glaring
The Redeemer actually has a huge amount of design flaws and uses its space even more poorly. Everything is crammed in and doesn't fit any of the metrics now for player space or component space. It's as if it was built like other games when they just cheat spaces and sizes and nothing has to fit together realistically.
Hence it's so low down on the priority list as it needs a full rework.
Didn't think I'd enjoy this video but you, Sir, have become my default go-to for ship walkthroughs from here on out. Keep them coming, please.
You've never been on board a nimitz-class aircraft carrier. The only time you ever get any privacy pretty much when you're taking a shower. Lol
This is the future in a fantasy world with a billion UEC ship that was designed by the best architects Origin has to offer.
And it's not for soldiers, it's for really really rich people.
Ever seen a bunk bed on a private yacht other than for the cheaper crew? No? Thought so.
BaronZ when I was in Dubai I got to be on a rich sheeks yacht. I've got to do a lot of stuff being in the United States Navy.
BaronZ but the bit with no privacy IS for the crew. This ISNT a luxury yacht, but a Exploration ship converted by a Luxury company. Therefore why would you expect the crew to have complete privacy. Personally I think it looks great
But the crew doesn't consist of minimum wage waitresses, cooks and ordinary seamen... you have highly skilled scientists, engineers, pilots and maybe some entertainers / service personell but the ones for billionaires that aren't cheap either.
The crew quarters *look* just as luxurious as the rest of the ship, but they aren't. I bet you've never been on a boat before. Being confined to so little amount of space for the better part of maybe multiple years can make you go insane if you don't have a way to close a door and shut everyone out. Not having that option is like having a Starfarer with a tiny tank - it makes the entire thing utterly useless.
I think using a cruise ship as a parallel might be more on-point, but this still holds true for "luxury" yachts as well.
For those who haven't been on a craft like this before, Sr. crew have more privacy (up to a single occupant room), but even that is more based on the crew member'e specific role on-staff. Jr roles do actually tend to have a double berth (bunkbed) style, but it is still a private space in that it's a single room with bunks or twin beds which normally have a curtain or sliding panel for a bit more privacy (or at least the illusion of it). Some vessles do have separate rooms for Jr Staff, but these "rooms" are glorified closets with mat bunks (an image search for "cruise ship staff bunk" for reference → tinyurl.com/yd9kvjsr)
The original Constellation crew bunks were a good example of this. What I'm more surprised by, is these ships are not designed with a shift based crew in mind. Hot bunking should be more of a thing in SC, especially on these types of "exploration" craft.
Any craft designed with long range, unsupported operation should be expected to have crews operating at all times, even if it's just a skeleton crew, there should be activity expected 24/7 to keep her running safely and with the most reliability.
To answer your question, yes, I've been on cruise ships, down to small runabouts/cubbies, including both civilian yachts and military vessles :)
But at the end of the day, Chris Roberts still focuses on the "Rule of Cool" in his design approach.
I'm an architect in California and have been wanting to make critique videos just like this but have been too busy. Subbed! I get so frustrated with their design choices sometimes. These issues are likely to be compounded when you consider they haven't really fleshed out a lot of the mechanics/stations that are supposed to be included with these ships. They need to look at these things in plan view and picture how they would flow through the ship with the intended role in mind.
Love this series. I’m just glad that I didn’t pledge for this ugly blob of sheer boorish design (or lack there of). I’ve just never liked this ship. I always skip right past it during PTU testing because, what am going to do with this,,, thing.
But that’s one of the many beautiful things about Star Citizen. There’s something for everyone.
That ship is AMAZING. Design language is awesome and actually is very consistent across Origin. ALL of their ships seem to be big on wasting space - even the 100i. But its just amazing that this ships has so much feeling of "size"
The landing gear is awful...
Yea tard design, along with 90% of the rest of the ship
Which citizen?
Fantastic video, and superior design ideas. Please do more!!
If a review is clearly biased, you should put it in the title. You remind me of an old boss I had who told me there was nothing that I did that didn't need improvement.
Ridiculous, reviews are inherently biased because they're always based on the opinion of the reviewer. Please don't tell me that you've been reading reviews up until this point assuming that they weren't opinions.
@@Morphologis some reviews are based on facts
And are ultimately opinion. You are either stating facts, which isn't a review, it's an explanation; or you're stating your opinion about that particular topic which would be a review. Every single review, no matter how based on facts, is biased and ultimately an opinion piece.
I just discovered your reviews for Star Citizen ships. That's a fooking great job ! Love this ! Keep going like this !
Dude, love your walkthroughs. I don't play videogames but I love star ships. Some channels just talk about the outside of the ship and ignore the interior but you are so detailed in your reviews. You got a new fan.
Another architect here. Neil Denari's work was the obvious inspiration for this ship. Also, Thom Tenery concept artist for Oblivion is a former architect who left the profession for games and movie industries. The same story is with Tron's concept artist David Levy.
As a newly practicing Architect this is kinda inspirational and gives me a new perspective. Subscribed! Hehe!
It has been a long time since I last enjoyed this much a very first video from a youtuber I have never seen before.
Really interesting. Level Design and architecture sure share a lot in common since they both have the job to give purpose to space, to make it look nice and to put an emphasis on affordance.
Love your professional walk throughs. I’m learning a lot about well designed space
The 600i is my favorite ship, but it needs some more work. They need to remove the cargo out of the bottom of the ship and put it in the large unused room next to the scanning stations. Then turn one of the rooms into a medical bay and the other in personal ship storage; e.g. food spare parts... Your spot on with the bar(needs 2-3 more seats at the bar and 2 more seats at the dining table) and since it's a luxury ship, it wouldn't hurt if the chairs at the tables/bar would slide back and forth and had backs on them. The crew quarters could use some retractable privacy pods (or large retractable doors on pods), better lighting and removal of the dam fog in the crew quarters. The bridge needs two more seats to operate the remote turrets and the captains door needs a lock/unlock function (door should not be automatic). And since the ship will be having guest, a guest bathroom wouldn't hurt or even better, redesign the crew quarters in a way that would allow guest to use that bathroom without intruding into the crews private space. i.e. separate crew quarters with each having their own door.
3:59 Another problem I see is those almost hidden steps down to the middle seating area, tripping hazard.
6:20 That separation wall can be good for stopping audio, so you can concentrate on the pool game while someone else looks att some action movie or something on the screen some meters away.
11:00 ish, If the space toilet was reduced then 3 maybe 4 toilets/shower-combination could be installed, because currently just 1 person at the toilet also locks up the shower (& the opposite).
In terms of the crew space... (US Navy Veteran)
Something as simple as a curtain to separate the bunks from the main room can provide enough privacy to keep your sanity. in the middle of the space could include a small card table.
for the science room the crew would be wearing space suits meaning that they would have radio comms even in close proximity, so that could explain the design choice there.
Also the area in the back of the sleeping area are NOT sleeping cubicles but rather escape pods so the area is designed to allow the crew as much speed and room to run too them in an emergency should the ship be about too blow up(probably a reason why there is a lot of dead space in the ship.
I really like your video and thought with the absolute majority of your constructive critique that I intuitively shared it, when I first walked through the 600i, even though I couldn't voice them in such a professional manner.
The waste of space seems really like a false idea of luxury when all it often creates is just a feeling of emptiness or even decadence and putting something to waste. The crew quarters felt weird open spaced and while I understand that not everything, that works for games or movies has to work for reality and vice versa as the importance there lies on creating a feeling when you enter that area I also felt it is strange that the engineering section was so dark. This is a place to work after all and lighting without having to refer to a flashlight would seem rather important.
The rear party and relaxation area was what really confused me. First theres this impression of space and view which blows you away but everything appears rather non-functional. The bar area, the huge gap between the round seating area and the rectangular table. You wonder why this table is even there, except perhaps to portray statues or decorations when it is so far out of reach and you have an area for your drinks right behind the seats. An open area or a round table, with a hologram or purely for decoration perhaps with plants or water might have been a better choice. Then there's the eating table with it's weirdly fixed chairs which has an interesting design end but on the other hand is only useable by three persons where only two face each other and one always has to endure a feeling of being left out for the sake of the table having an interesting, unconventional design.
Your pointing out of the weird overlap of relaxation and work areas also was spot on. Why does the crew have such a restrooms area (and the only escape pods if i remember correctly except for some for the bridgecrew) when the party area doesn't seem to have any toilets at all. Are the guests, which are in the entire focus of such a luxury ship, supposed to walk through the crew cabins to use the crew restrooms and in an case of emergy have to go down with the ship while the crew instinctively will use the next escape pods they will find?
There's a lot of stuff that feels rather awkward about this ships design process.
I had a conversation recently with someone who bought this ship which I found rather interesting. In his vision he thought of the Explorer never as a party ship or for guests but as a ship that houses a team of scientists/specialists, that is rather close with each other, perhaps even friends, much like in famous series such as Firefly. The whole rear area is just a much more luxurious relaxation area than in explorarion ships of manufacturers.
Thus there's no problem with crewmen having to cross that rear section to reach the engineering section or with people having to cross the crew quarters to reach the toilets as everyone is part of the crew on that ship.
It's a rather interesting point of view to me which absolutely makes sense. Who wouldn't prefer some sort of almost Star Trek esque luxury and recreation during his long journeys through space. Even the very open crew quarters now make sense to me, as during my time in the army I had to share a tiny room with 3 other people for months and we became best friends during this time. Nowadays a place to shut off from the rest of the world is clearly seen as luxury but it also can be an opportunity to get to know people better and really feel like part of a team. I still think it would be preferable to turn this huge crew room into a hallway with separate quarters which allow a tiny bit of individualization but after seeing it from his perspective I can live much better with this design choice from CIG.
Yet there's still the Touring.. and to me the touring is still a smaller version of the 890 for inviting guests and travelling space in style and luxury, where the hired crew sections absolutely have to be separated from the owner and guest section. Thus I still stand to the critique of my first post in regard of this ships version.
Actualy you make a lot of sense, you give very good ideas. I think the same about some things (like crew quarters) but you gave me ideas about things new.
I enjoyed the video. Thank you
Fantastic video! CIG should seriously hire you as a consultant during the concept and design of their ships.
Melted my Connie for it. I feel similar regarding crew quarters, and do hope they address that in the future. Thank you for the solid videos
After looking at multiple walkthroughs if 5is ship, I just realized that in the crew quarters there might be some sort of curtain that blocks off each persons area. You can kinda see the guide on the floor for where the curtain would be attached to the ground. Although, it doesn’t really look like there is any guide on the ceiling. Seems like a good idea to add in.
The separation wall in between to pool and the rest of room makes actually a lot of sense, unlike other things. I would actually argue for a glass doors. It should muffle the sound of the pool play for those wanting to converse at the chairs outside.
i totally agree on your opinion that the ship's space isn't effectively used...it could need some more furniture or seperations for either more comfort or privacy.
there's a quote saying "form follows function" but in the 600i it seems, most of the interior was designed the other way around.
for the crewquarters for example, i could imagine a narrow hallway leading to the seperate quarters for each crewmember and each room having not just a bed but also a small workplace or area to chat with your guests (maybe a colleague coming by) and a "window" so that you don't start to feel too much claustrophobic by beeing surrounded by walls.
that way the space would be utilized much more effectively while still having a luxurious look if it uses the same design language and materials.
allthough it's still a beautiful ship
The crew quarters i would divide in 4 cabins with corridor in the center, and the bathroom i would reduce, and make a mini kitchen / dinner / relaxation area for sure, and add some much needed windows down there.
I know I’m late to these videos.. but I’ve never played this game, I’m not an architect, but everything you point out is well thought out and articulated clearly. I see the points you make and happily agree with them.
If I tried to review the design without influence from you, I’m afraid I simply say, “wow! Look at that. Cool huh. And there’s a place! And a thing! And a bathroom! What a great ship!” Lol.
But you open my eyes to so much more detail, that’s possible with these ships, and the potential that great design can reach.
I think that the main use for all the open space is to let the ship owner add things he wants his luxury cruise ship to have. We know there are fish tanks, trophy cases, drink dispensers. The lower bar might be for guests only so they dont have to be disturbed by the crew on break so instead they have a drink machine in the cockpit. Could also keep your collection of snowglobes in the cockpit on a trophy case. These ships are suppose to feel like our own so while from the factory it might feel empty you're suppose to fill it in with things that you want on it to give it more of the "this is my ship" feel as opposed to being the same 600i everyone else has.