Should there be sport climbing in the Peak District? This route doesn't exactly look desperate. It looks frictional as hell. In The Lakes there's a good chance someone would have abseiled down and chopped any such bolt so that only proper climbers would climb the crag.
@@samradcliff3 Quarries are man-made environments and are sometimes hard to protect. But the Lakes ethic has always been to climb trad if possible and take your gear with you when you go for environmental reasons. The alternative is that crags all over the country end up littered with lines of bolts. Also, trad requires the leader to find the route and stay on it, using just the basic instructions in the guide book. This means that you develop a feel for the grades - whether you are on the correct route. That helps make you "rock savvy" rather than simply following a line of bolts, and asks you to stay in balance and composed while placing gear. Otherwise climbing just degenerates into outdoor climbing walls.
@davidredshaw448 I agree with you on the ethics of trad climbing and the value of that style of climbing. Why a crag is bolted or not is more complicated than if it's in the lakes or not. As you mentioned local ethics, rock type, lack of natural protection, and developer preferences all feed into it, and there are always lots of opinions. I pointed out there are plenty of bolted cliffs in the lakes, so it is not some ethically superior area that only allows trad. You have a clear bias for trad, and that's great 👍
@@samradcliff3 Many moons ago, not long after the fall of Communism, I was climbing on Shepherds Crag in Borrowdale and there was an international women's meet taking place. I was going up on a route next to the British woman who had organised it and she was saying that the East European girls who there that day were terrific technical climbers but she said that today they are all over the place because they've never done trad before.
Where is this?
Rubicon, at water-cum-jolly in the Peak District
@@samradcliff3thank you. 👍🏻
Should there be sport climbing in the Peak District? This route doesn't exactly look desperate. It looks frictional as hell. In The Lakes there's a good chance someone would have abseiled down and chopped any such bolt so that only proper climbers would climb the crag.
@@davidredshaw448 😂 Interesting take on it. What's your take on the dry tooling crags in the lakes? Or Chapel Head? Or the Slate Quarries?
@@samradcliff3 Quarries are man-made environments and are sometimes hard to protect. But the Lakes ethic has always been to climb trad if possible and take your gear with you when you go for environmental reasons. The alternative is that crags all over the country end up littered with lines of bolts. Also, trad requires the leader to find the route and stay on it, using just the basic instructions in the guide book. This means that you develop a feel for the grades - whether you are on the correct route. That helps make you "rock savvy" rather than simply following a line of bolts, and asks you to stay in balance and composed while placing gear. Otherwise climbing just degenerates into outdoor climbing walls.
@davidredshaw448 I agree with you on the ethics of trad climbing and the value of that style of climbing. Why a crag is bolted or not is more complicated than if it's in the lakes or not. As you mentioned local ethics, rock type, lack of natural protection, and developer preferences all feed into it, and there are always lots of opinions. I pointed out there are plenty of bolted cliffs in the lakes, so it is not some ethically superior area that only allows trad. You have a clear bias for trad, and that's great 👍
@@samradcliff3 Many moons ago, not long after the fall of Communism, I was climbing on Shepherds Crag in Borrowdale and there was an international women's meet taking place. I was going up on a route next to the British woman who had organised it and she was saying that the East European girls who there that day were terrific technical climbers but she said that today they are all over the place because they've never done trad before.
@@davidredshaw448 😂