I have enormous respect for Jacob's openness and constructive criticism to the sport the he and we all love. So articulate and objective. He is one of the greatest and he proves it though everything he does.
Well said. Bring back hard STEEP climbing in the WCs. When is the last time you saw a sustained 45° or steeper problem in the WCs. All problems do not need 2 or 3 dynos. Challenge every style!
@@supernoodles908 i am talking about lead you big dumb. The lead was worth half the points and it was just steep. And the power boulder was also steep as fuck while we are at it
@@thenayancat8802but why do you think that the new style has so many viewers? Do you think 4k video streaming and a huge influx of new people to climbing that don't know different styles have nothing to do with it? It's a question of do you want climbing to be spectacle focused or technical focused because if your argument is "more people watch someone that will jump 10 meters without their arms tearing out of their sockets" then that's what you will get. Also, with that, more injuries... So maybe it's our job to educate "the vast majority of people watching climbing" what climbing is and what it can do
@@assaqwwq > why do you think that the new style has so many viewers? It is much much much more easy to see what's happening when climbers are doing big moves between large and aesthetic holds than when they are slowly moving between microcrimps on a 45 degree board. Even as a climber (albeit a very weak and average one), I can't tell the difference between a v10 and a v15 boulder on real rock most of the time. > Do you think 4k video streaming and a huge influx of new people to climbing that don't know different styles have nothing to do with it? You're putting the cart before the horse here mate. Do you think they just decided to punt a shitload of money on production for the sake of it? > It's a question of do you want climbing to be spectacle focused or technical focused because if your argument is "more people watch someone that will jump 10 meters without their arms tearing out of their sockets" then that's what you will get. Do you think that the current style of world cup boulders is not technical in nature...? lol
@@thenayancat8802 you seem like a thoughtful guy since you put in so much time to read and respond to what I said ... so I'm a bit confused as to why it didn't make sense to you... the shitload of money came after tho... first the capitalists need to see theres a market, otherwise... where profit? Most cameras today can do 4k.. even some phones, so I don't see why you think "people couldn't tell what was happening on the screen, and then the capitalists came and fixed it all for us, now all bow to them" I mean I guess some people believe that so maybe you do too... and before we go to the next point, you by accident or on purpose, skipped the part where the "new style" of climbing is more prone to injuries, so again, if you think "money decides everything" then we should remove all guardrails and just let the people break every bone in their bodies... which I would think you and most people would not want... Surely you understand what I mean by techical... I am not saying it's easy, or that it can't be trained, but you definitely can tell the difference between a roof climb with a mono crimp into a double knee bar (which can double as a rest) from a pogo triple paddle lache... Nobody is saying take the jumps away, keep your jumps! but like show that these people can hold tension... I mean... every time there's a crack at a competition, 9/10 people fall on their asses, while Adam stops to have picnic on the route... Just look at terranova, a climb that is "old school techinical" and nobody can repeat it after Adam did it as a kid... Some variety is healthy, and we should not let the capitalists dictate what is and isn't a good climber.
So good that a top athlete speaks up and tells his opinon. Thank you for it! It is actually wierd, that others don't do it, like is there a disadvantage or punishment for it? Nowadays top climbers are less of a role model as they could be, especially that they can reach so many people easier than ever.
So true and in so many ways. I mean, just looking at how the climbing generation took a stand against war in the 60s ("valley uprising"), bringing back the connection with rock also in competition as this sport is so rooted in nature could really speak up for climate change I feel.
I really like the idea "sports climbing should be nearer to (outdoor) rock climbing". Even if I never climbed outdoors, I imagine myself being faced with some nature problem.
The interviewer’s question about potentially two bouldering disciplines reminds me of bodybuilding a bit. Open bodybuilding became so removed from “classic” physiques of the golden era that they came out with “classic physique” as a category that values aesthetics + muscle mass versus absolute muscle mass. I think a “classic” bouldering category could actually be really interesting.
Just a side note, Jakob's English has improved in the last few years. Hasn't been bad before but as a teacher I can't help but notice some significant improvements :D
Mr Consistent. Congratulations on another competition season. Always love hearing top climbers opinions. I'd like to see team medals as they have in gymnastics. Much talent goes unrecognized. Again I love your enthusiasm for our sport
Very agreeable points, especially regarding style changes and ambiguity of placements in competitive bouldering. Needless to say new school looks cool, it has wow factor and for the viewer it's exciting to see a climber stick that one move nobody else did it builds suspense. But from a competitors point of view, it can be frustrating and distracts from having a level playing field. I really love the Legends Only event, it feels like the best balance between exhibition and competition, if that was the format i would be way more into competitive climbing.
Great and brave words Stephan. Thanks for standing up for rock climbing and the core of what makes us climbers. Lets hope the powers that be are listening and we can see our sport blossom how it should and not become a freak show of crazy moves.
I feel like the issues Jakob is pointing out are true for male bouldering, while I feel like the female field is more consistent and has bigger stars than its male counterpart
I think it's worse for women. The amount of times Ai Mori couldn't even start a boulder that other women could just reach to is a joke. I'm so mad at Matt for not making a big deal out of this.
@@ljp3639 ai is my favorite female climber and I agree with you, she's not a boulderer and people need to stop using her as an example. She simply lacks the raw power, brooke does not
@@mrmonsterhunter808thank you I love seeing comments like this because I 100% agree. Ai is an absolutely incredible climber but she is not powerful in a dynamic way at all. And being the smallest on top of that is what gets her, not just height!
More shared experience and open conversations like this are only ever a positive for the art/sport. I wholeheartedly agree with everything he said. Modern gyms are lacking in etiquette and don't prioritise the climbing over selling you stuff, feeding you and over charging you for the 'Experience'. I want to drink coffee and pull hard with my friends. Simple.
Spot on, I want to see who is the strongest and most technical on hard climbing problems , not jumpy / balance stuff. Hope Jakobs statement has some inpact on this
Thanks a lot Jakob ❤ very interesting interview! Concerning the evolution of climbing, I think the new styles is visually interesting. but in climbing gyms with amateurs, I don’t find it that amazing because people aren’t always well-guided. IMO, dynamic problems are extremely harsh and traumatic for the body. Especially for people new to this sport. That being said, having them is important for competition as they challenge climbers in unique and demanding ways.
I don't like this new style of climbing when climbing myself. But I don't hate them in competition. But I think that we really need more variety in the competition. Jakob explained imo really good why we need more variety in the competitions
IMO Colin Duffy's top of Boulder 4 was a highlight of the Paris Olympics and it lead to a dramatic showdown in the lead for the bronze medal. As a spectator, and a fan of competitive bouldering, I think some of those kinds of problems make the sport more interesting and dramatic to watch. Plenty of old school boulders to be done outside, if that's what you're looking for.
Great honesty here! Sounds like the hold shapers could be double dipping as route setters with making money as a key driving point. Not sure but if it’s true, when money wolves come in, the spirit of any endeavor gets lost in what it could be, on the alter of how much can we make.
I never thought about the size of the holds having such a profound impact. I guess companies have a financial interest in selling bigger and more complex holds. At the same time that is maybe not what the sport should be focussing on, or at least not exclusively. In my view, many great boulders can be set with low budget, relatively small holds. On the other hand, I like volumes giving the wall a different shape and making everything a bit more 3D. For me, a good boulder is about the moves, not the wall itself. And that is very abstract, requiring experienced and creative routesetters.
I feel the IFSC Championship should be more important. At the moment, each world cup seems quite isolated, and athletes' success is measured in WC medals usually. I would LOVE to see a season-long fight fpr the title across multiple world cups. They could very easily do this by giving some bigger prize money to the winner and display standings before/after each event. Following IFSC would be so much more exciting! On a different but related note: re do the whole website and app to get access to all the info. It's difficult to find the times of the comps and standings etc
I heard some routesetter saying that static crimpy boulders do not separate athletes anymore, and that's why they aren't proposed that much in comps. I don't really get that. Plus semi static moves on crimps or big lockoffs could be pretty spectacular imo.
That's what's happening in Spain. Even though not even 20% of the gym climbers go rock climbing the restrictions and prohibitions are piling up like crazy.
Very well said, both the rule and the risk. Sound doable also to spread rule+risk to new climbers when we are at the rock and when we see they are not aware.
Jacob is right in many things - especially of IFSC practics quality but competition climbing wont be anymore same like rock climbing and its not a problem for really strong climbers of new era :D
I will be the captain-obvious, but climbing is unique in terms of how you are competing. In all the other sports, you are kind of doing the same thing. Tennis, football, volleyball, basketball, swimming, etc. You name it. It is always something repetitive. Competition climbing is unique because the route is always different (kind of like surfing, where the wave is always kind of different). Now, the point is that climbing in general has never been this hype before. It is great. But it is changing. The moment you involve many many people in something, that thing will start changing. Jakob has a point, but he is coming from a "previous generation" perspective. Yes, it is not about "new school" vs. "old school". It is about generations. For many generations, climbing was about outdoors, on real rock. After many generations, it has become what it is now, and at some point, it will converge to a format.
Interesting insights. But it’s not really what his opinion is (everybody knew that) it’s rather that he is talking about it so openly and calling ppl out. I think he is really thinking about it from an athletes perspective, who grew up and developed during the „old school“ WC-Circuit. When he says that he thinks his vision would be better and more interesting to watch, he just assumes that the majority of viewers think the same. I think the same - because Iam a outdoor focused rockclimber who was socialised in the „old“ system like Jakob was. But truth is: We are a minority after the Bouldering-boom. Implementing old school would prbly be viewed as boring by the majority of grossing/paying viewership. We could only change that by socialising a bunch of newer gym climbers with our old world. By doing that, we would make „old school“ in comps attractive again. But tbh: although I would enjoy that from a watching standpoint, I don’t want that to happen. We already have massive amounts of problems with landowners, government regulations and much more because of the small percentage of gym-socialised people pouring over to real climbing. Embracing that would prbly be more harmful than good. Because, quite frankly, the masses would be too much, even if we educate most of them properly. The diversion of the community is protecting the environment and hopefully our chances of still accessing most rocks in the future. I personally think the community is too big to have one singular direction. I would always trade not being able to enjoy the comps as much for a prolonged/safe opportunity to access most crags like they are, unharmed by masses of ppl. It is already too much rn and I for sure don’t wanna support that trend further. Let them stay in gyms and make the competitions more like their thing. It’s fine, 30 ppl less who climb some Bleau-Classic with sandy shoes.
Also second note, why is there no crack climbing in comps? Isn’t that a massive discipline that isn’t really represented? Doesn’t that require massive intricacies to get right? I think we could see a different group of leaders in climbing.
I totally understand why the massive lache into paddle dyno exists. It’s fun for the audience. I assume it’s WAY harder for non climbers to see the fun and struggle with shit low friction crimps on steep overhang… I do miss it sincerely though
I am so far from being a professional, but even in my local gym I always prefer static boulders over any dynos. It is good to jump from time to time, but 90% of boulders must be body tension-based.
Personally I enjoy the unpredictability of boulder finalist rosters, otherwise I grow bored seeing the same names over and over. I like watching different climbers with different styles. I enjoy lead as well, but the differences between the two is what makes them both worthwhile to watch.
Fully agree on the world cups becoming more random in their results except Janja because she's a few levels ahead of the rest. I am under the impression that routesetting for competitions has become less about testing the participant's skills in different ways and more about cooking up the craziest dynamic coordination jumps. Hugely impressive when they go, but less suited to determining the best climber and comps are saturated with them making it boring to watch.
Beware that if the comps become formulaic, while it drives up the marketing, creativity in the sport will suffer. It's what happened to WC DH mountain biking 😢
I think his point about making the problems in boulder competitions differ from each other is correct, however I don't agree with his randomness in the problems themselves. Each and every problem is random to a degree, sure some setters can replicate a certain move, but that's true across all styles and not just dynos. As for the randomness in athletes who progress to semis or finals, that in itself is exactly what competition is about. Who will progress through semis and finals and who will win? Alot of the female competitions where Janja Garnbret was in, you are almost certain who is going to win. In my opinion, each competition would challenge the climbers in different styles AND create some sort of randomness as to who's going to progress.
I think top climbers need to be advocates for their sport in this way. There’s way to much hesitancy to say anything negative - we need the open dialogue that isn’t blindly positive all the time. If you had that, top athletes would hold much more influence over the sport.
if you think about formula 1, a problem it has is that the same person wins all the time. I think it's awesome that more people have access to finals. I don't want to see the same old faces
Thats because in F1 its 90% the car and 10% the driver. Put the drivers that regularly place last in the best car and vice versa and the "bad" drivers would regularly podium and the stars would have 0 points
Good to see that elite pros really starve and crave for more outdoor like problems. Hope setters throw in more proper steep cracks with all those book openers, paddles, tea cups, ring locks, stacks and other cool stuff with their endless variety and possibilities. Can't be even more old-school new school.
Climbing gradually became circus tricks. This started off as a way to try and split the field and avoid ties. It then took on a life of its own. It makes for more injuries and certainly more luck.
I strongly disagree with this take on comp bouldering. I understand the desire to have a climbing competition more dedicated to pure overhung crimp-strength, but I find the current Boulder World Cup format much more compelling. World cup bouldering is a mix of strength, power, coordination, and route-reading ability, a very different skill-set than top-end out-door bouldering. If we had comp boulders which were just steep overhung crimp-fests, then of course athletes like Simon Lorenzi, Will Bosi, Sean Bailey, and Aidan Roberts would dominate. I just don't find this possibility more interesting or compelling than the current bouldering style. I think that an important caveat is that 'best boulderer' is a truly subjective take, and it's ultimately arbitrary which mix of skills we choose to test in competitive bouldering. That being said, the outdoor V-grades have primarily tracked a single skillset, which is pulling/crimp/finger strength. If you want to find out who has the greatest crimp strength by watching them pull on boards in a competition, fine. I don't. I'd rather see athletes tackle climbs in a variety of styles in a short time-window. I can find out the absolute limit of human crimping capacity when the new Mellow video drops.
I agree, I like more modern competitions more, they just do ridiculous stuff, even though I like to climb classic crimpy, pinchy stuff. And I don't get his complaint about the consistency in results. If the competition isn't testing only pure finger strength but also reading skills, dynamic skills etc, the winner will be the best at that. It's not like consistency in the podium is assuring you that the "real" best won. If the game was fair, the winner would have been the best, full stop. But yeah, I'd like one of the boulders of the competition to be an old school 45° crimpy board, why not
I used to watch competition bouldering religiously. Recently I have lost interest completely. Big crazy dynos are fun to watch a couple times but quickly feel gimmicky, stale and completely alien to the sport I love and practice.
Do people not think that the variability in bouldering is more the fact that the field is just extremely close, and thus the final is inherently much more open. Who wants to see the exact same group in finals every time, that gets boring.
This conversation applies to less than 1% of climbers ,whether they climb indoors or out. Spectating competitions is a very poor substitute for getting out into nature and climbing on real rock.
It's a very good substitute because you can watch climbing competitions without driving for hours or even flying to another place, potentially paying for a place to stay, waiting for good weather and having the money to pay for all of that.
Let’s see some crack climbing with some sustained jamming, too, since we’re talking about neglected climbing styles and keeping it closely related to rock climbing.
The business model of the hold manufacturers dictates the direction climbing takes. Big holds = increased financial gains, which leads to the specific style of coordination moves and dynos. Simple as that. Money drives everything these days...
Well said! Sadly, I don't think the ifsc is listening to climbers as much as they should, they are trying to make a spectacle because they think they will attract more eyes with flashy boulders, "betraying" their regular viewers! It will turn into a vicious circle of organizers trying to outdo the previous competition! It's all about the money, and not even money athletes will get! As he said, certain countries are regularly getting to organize cups, but it's almost always half empty stands and lausy organization! "It's to promote the sport,...but then we end up in SA or some other shady country
The ethos of climbing goes well with friendly competitions within a community. Luckily watching the world cups that's a lot of the time what it feels like with athletes cheering each other on and being happy for each other and discussing betas.
Competition is nothing. Ppl will remember who did the hardest routest/boulders... no one cares who get a WC win or olymic medal 20 years ago. So go outside 😁
I have enormous respect for Jacob's openness and constructive criticism to the sport the he and we all love. So articulate and objective. He is one of the greatest and he proves it though everything he does.
Well said. Bring back hard STEEP climbing in the WCs. When is the last time you saw a sustained 45° or steeper problem in the WCs. All problems do not need 2 or 3 dynos. Challenge every style!
The olympics was just a steep wall
@@matejnovosad9152there was literally a slab boulder problems
@@supernoodles908 i am talking about lead you big dumb. The lead was worth half the points and it was just steep. And the power boulder was also steep as fuck while we are at it
@@supernoodles908 They can and should do both (and they usually do). Slab is a huge part of climbing ESPECIALLY outside.
Screw dynos in general. There are very cool parkour competitions if people are interested in that.
I would go absolutely mental if the old school proper crimp roof style comes back! every world cup i would watch live with friends!!
I don't think you and your friends outnumber the audience of the current style
@@thenayancat8802but why do you think that the new style has so many viewers?
Do you think 4k video streaming and a huge influx of new people to climbing that don't know different styles have nothing to do with it?
It's a question of do you want climbing to be spectacle focused or technical focused because if your argument is "more people watch someone that will jump 10 meters without their arms tearing out of their sockets" then that's what you will get.
Also, with that, more injuries... So maybe it's our job to educate "the vast majority of people watching climbing" what climbing is and what it can do
@@assaqwwq > why do you think that the new style has so many viewers?
It is much much much more easy to see what's happening when climbers are doing big moves between large and aesthetic holds than when they are slowly moving between microcrimps on a 45 degree board. Even as a climber (albeit a very weak and average one), I can't tell the difference between a v10 and a v15 boulder on real rock most of the time.
> Do you think 4k video streaming and a huge influx of new people to climbing that don't know different styles have nothing to do with it?
You're putting the cart before the horse here mate. Do you think they just decided to punt a shitload of money on production for the sake of it?
> It's a question of do you want climbing to be spectacle focused or technical focused because if your argument is "more people watch someone that will jump 10 meters without their arms tearing out of their sockets" then that's what you will get.
Do you think that the current style of world cup boulders is not technical in nature...? lol
@@thenayancat8802 you seem like a thoughtful guy since you put in so much time to read and respond to what I said ... so I'm a bit confused as to why it didn't make sense to you...
the shitload of money came after tho... first the capitalists need to see theres a market, otherwise... where profit? Most cameras today can do 4k.. even some phones, so I don't see why you think "people couldn't tell what was happening on the screen, and then the capitalists came and fixed it all for us, now all bow to them" I mean I guess some people believe that so maybe you do too...
and before we go to the next point, you by accident or on purpose, skipped the part where the "new style" of climbing is more prone to injuries, so again, if you think "money decides everything" then we should remove all guardrails and just let the people break every bone in their bodies... which I would think you and most people would not want...
Surely you understand what I mean by techical... I am not saying it's easy, or that it can't be trained, but you definitely can tell the difference between a roof climb with a mono crimp into a double knee bar (which can double as a rest) from a pogo triple paddle lache...
Nobody is saying take the jumps away, keep your jumps! but like show that these people can hold tension... I mean... every time there's a crack at a competition, 9/10 people fall on their asses, while Adam stops to have picnic on the route... Just look at terranova, a climb that is "old school techinical" and nobody can repeat it after Adam did it as a kid...
Some variety is healthy, and we should not let the capitalists dictate what is and isn't a good climber.
I agree with Fred-oz3tw. Definitely more "old school" problems needed.
superb representative for the sport
Jakob on DNA let's goooooo!
Hope he will livestream!
Jakob is so passionate yet so eloquent, always a pleasure to listen!
So good that a top athlete speaks up and tells his opinon. Thank you for it! It is actually wierd, that others don't do it, like is there a disadvantage or punishment for it? Nowadays top climbers are less of a role model as they could be, especially that they can reach so many people easier than ever.
So true and in so many ways. I mean, just looking at how the climbing generation took a stand against war in the 60s ("valley uprising"), bringing back the connection with rock also in competition as this sport is so rooted in nature could really speak up for climate change I feel.
Alex Megos speaks up too especially about sustainability issues at the world cups.
Nice insight on the future of climbing, well said!
As a French, your first try of "Seb Bouin" was perfect, you nailed it! 👍
Your English is really good for a french person
I really like the idea "sports climbing should be nearer to (outdoor) rock climbing".
Even if I never climbed outdoors, I imagine myself being faced with some nature problem.
The interviewer’s question about potentially two bouldering disciplines reminds me of bodybuilding a bit. Open bodybuilding became so removed from “classic” physiques of the golden era that they came out with “classic physique” as a category that values aesthetics + muscle mass versus absolute muscle mass. I think a “classic” bouldering category could actually be really interesting.
Such a good interview, I agree 100% 👏👏
Im stoooked to see him on DNA! 🤩 Get it done Jakob! 💪
+1 for all the thougts/explanations by another climbing loving Austrian. Awesome interview. Thx.
Fantastic honesty, what an excellent insight. Big love Jakob
Just a side note, Jakob's English has improved in the last few years. Hasn't been bad before but as a teacher I can't help but notice some significant improvements :D
Mr Consistent. Congratulations on another competition season. Always love hearing top climbers opinions. I'd like to see team medals as they have in gymnastics. Much talent goes unrecognized. Again I love your enthusiasm for our sport
Great interview! Thanks for sharing this!
Amazing insight into the heart of the sport. Thanks Jakob!
Jakob is on point. I couldn't agree more on what he said.
And good luck with DNA, history is made on the rock not on plastic.
Really interesting .
I think he’s absolutely right.
🗽 Greetings from Austria to Jakob Schubert. One of the greatest climbers of our time. 🙏
.
Great input. Thank you for sharing!
Nice criticism! I would love to see waaaay more board climbing competition. Like moonboard masters or tensionboard problems!
That would be awesome and also it would be magnet for ppl because they could later mybe try same problems
Very agreeable points, especially regarding style changes and ambiguity of placements in competitive bouldering.
Needless to say new school looks cool, it has wow factor and for the viewer it's exciting to see a climber stick that one move nobody else did it builds suspense.
But from a competitors point of view, it can be frustrating and distracts from having a level playing field. I really love the Legends Only event, it feels like the best balance between exhibition and competition, if that was the format i would be way more into competitive climbing.
Best and clearer interwiew ever. Bring back the ruckus!
Great and brave words Stephan. Thanks for standing up for rock climbing and the core of what makes us climbers. Lets hope the powers that be are listening and we can see our sport blossom how it should and not become a freak show of crazy moves.
I feel like the issues Jakob is pointing out are true for male bouldering, while I feel like the female field is more consistent and has bigger stars than its male counterpart
I think it's worse for women. The amount of times Ai Mori couldn't even start a boulder that other women could just reach to is a joke. I'm so mad at Matt for not making a big deal out of this.
@ u do know that Brooke an Ai are 3cm apart or so, the difference isn’t height per Se, of course that’s a factor, buts it’s leg strength
@@ljp3639 ai is my favorite female climber and I agree with you, she's not a boulderer and people need to stop using her as an example. She simply lacks the raw power, brooke does not
@@mrmonsterhunter808thank you I love seeing comments like this because I 100% agree. Ai is an absolutely incredible climber but she is not powerful in a dynamic way at all. And being the smallest on top of that is what gets her, not just height!
Can’t wait to see you back on DNA !!!
Great words, is totally right, hope federations take note
More shared experience and open conversations like this are only ever a positive for the art/sport. I wholeheartedly agree with everything he said. Modern gyms are lacking in etiquette and don't prioritise the climbing over selling you stuff, feeding you and over charging you for the 'Experience'. I want to drink coffee and pull hard with my friends. Simple.
Spot on, I want to see who is the strongest and most technical on hard climbing problems , not jumpy / balance stuff. Hope Jakobs statement has some inpact on this
The jumpy balance stuff is very technical and strength demanding too, otherwise anyone could do it
He's so right about the competition's route setting.
Grande obbiettività. Grande equilibrio....un vero campione.
Go off Jakob, my climbing king
Incredible guy!
complete agree with Jakob
Thanks a lot Jakob ❤ very interesting interview!
Concerning the evolution of climbing, I think the new styles is visually interesting.
but in climbing gyms with amateurs, I don’t find it that amazing because people aren’t always well-guided.
IMO, dynamic problems are extremely harsh and traumatic for the body. Especially for people new to this sport.
That being said, having them is important for competition as they challenge climbers in unique and demanding ways.
I don't like this new style of climbing when climbing myself. But I don't hate them in competition. But I think that we really need more variety in the competition.
Jakob explained imo really good why we need more variety in the competitions
IMO Colin Duffy's top of Boulder 4 was a highlight of the Paris Olympics and it lead to a dramatic showdown in the lead for the bronze medal. As a spectator, and a fan of competitive bouldering, I think some of those kinds of problems make the sport more interesting and dramatic to watch. Plenty of old school boulders to be done outside, if that's what you're looking for.
Great honesty here! Sounds like the hold shapers could be double dipping as route setters with making money as a key driving point. Not sure but if it’s true, when money wolves come in, the spirit of any endeavor gets lost in what it could be, on the alter of how much can we make.
cool video! schubert living legend
Gosh! What a likeable and great guy!!
legend
We have here in Cork old school boulder wall with features, not just flat panels, is pretty cool to climb loads of footwork.
Nice that Jakob is mentioning the elephant in the room in climbing
His actions are gonna change the sport i believe in him !
I never thought about the size of the holds having such a profound impact. I guess companies have a financial interest in selling bigger and more complex holds. At the same time that is maybe not what the sport should be focussing on, or at least not exclusively. In my view, many great boulders can be set with low budget, relatively small holds. On the other hand, I like volumes giving the wall a different shape and making everything a bit more 3D. For me, a good boulder is about the moves, not the wall itself. And that is very abstract, requiring experienced and creative routesetters.
Someone has to say it clearly, thank you jacob
The greatest climber ever in competitions spoke a setters should listen.
Such a nice lad 👏🏻👏🏻👍🏻
So cool to hear you are going to try dna
I feel the IFSC Championship should be more important. At the moment, each world cup seems quite isolated, and athletes' success is measured in WC medals usually.
I would LOVE to see a season-long fight fpr the title across multiple world cups. They could very easily do this by giving some bigger prize money to the winner and display standings before/after each event. Following IFSC would be so much more exciting!
On a different but related note: re do the whole website and app to get access to all the info. It's difficult to find the times of the comps and standings etc
I heard some routesetter saying that static crimpy boulders do not separate athletes anymore, and that's why they aren't proposed that much in comps. I don't really get that. Plus semi static moves on crimps or big lockoffs could be pretty spectacular imo.
Leave No Trace - climbing needs to get this right or be risked getting kicked off the rock as climbing grows in popularity.
That's what's happening in Spain. Even though not even 20% of the gym climbers go rock climbing the restrictions and prohibitions are piling up like crazy.
Very well said, both the rule and the risk.
Sound doable also to spread rule+risk to new climbers when we are at the rock and when we see they are not aware.
I'd love to see some "old school" steep, hard boulders in WCs.
Jacob is right in many things - especially of IFSC practics quality but competition climbing wont be anymore same like rock climbing and its not a problem for really strong climbers of new era :D
I will be the captain-obvious, but climbing is unique in terms of how you are competing. In all the other sports, you are kind of doing the same thing. Tennis, football, volleyball, basketball, swimming, etc. You name it. It is always something repetitive. Competition climbing is unique because the route is always different (kind of like surfing, where the wave is always kind of different). Now, the point is that climbing in general has never been this hype before. It is great. But it is changing. The moment you involve many many people in something, that thing will start changing. Jakob has a point, but he is coming from a "previous generation" perspective. Yes, it is not about "new school" vs. "old school". It is about generations. For many generations, climbing was about outdoors, on real rock. After many generations, it has become what it is now, and at some point, it will converge to a format.
Yes! Finally someone trying DNA!!
I hope, they listen carefully. please... / respect to Jakob
Interesting insights. But it’s not really what his opinion is (everybody knew that) it’s rather that he is talking about it so openly and calling ppl out.
I think he is really thinking about it from an athletes perspective, who grew up and developed during the „old school“ WC-Circuit. When he says that he thinks his vision would be better and more interesting to watch, he just assumes that the majority of viewers think the same. I think the same - because Iam a outdoor focused rockclimber who was socialised in the „old“ system like Jakob was. But truth is: We are a minority after the Bouldering-boom. Implementing old school would prbly be viewed as boring by the majority of grossing/paying viewership. We could only change that by socialising a bunch of newer gym climbers with our old world. By doing that, we would make „old school“ in comps attractive again.
But tbh: although I would enjoy that from a watching standpoint, I don’t want that to happen. We already have massive amounts of problems with landowners, government regulations and much more because of the small percentage of gym-socialised people pouring over to real climbing. Embracing that would prbly be more harmful than good. Because, quite frankly, the masses would be too much, even if we educate most of them properly.
The diversion of the community is protecting the environment and hopefully our chances of still accessing most rocks in the future. I personally think the community is too big to have one singular direction. I would always trade not being able to enjoy the comps as much for a prolonged/safe opportunity to access most crags like they are, unharmed by masses of ppl. It is already too much rn and I for sure don’t wanna support that trend further. Let them stay in gyms and make the competitions more like their thing. It’s fine, 30 ppl less who climb some Bleau-Classic with sandy shoes.
Also second note, why is there no crack climbing in comps? Isn’t that a massive discipline that isn’t really represented? Doesn’t that require massive intricacies to get right? I think we could see a different group of leaders in climbing.
14:10 Lets get it! All forms of climbing? That includes aid climbing! Competition aid climbing when? :)
Also what would that even look like?
Can't wait to see you in DNA :-)
What should improve substantially are the prize money amounts in the World Cups, as they are among the lowest of any professional sport that exists
I totally understand why the massive lache into paddle dyno exists. It’s fun for the audience. I assume it’s WAY harder for non climbers to see the fun and struggle with shit low friction crimps on steep overhang… I do miss it sincerely though
I am so far from being a professional, but even in my local gym I always prefer static boulders over any dynos. It is good to jump from time to time, but 90% of boulders must be body tension-based.
There is no must for style wise in boulder. It depends on what gym climbers want, setting should be based on that to a large degree
@@colemantrebor6574 sure, business is business. However, the parkour style causes more injuries.
Personally I enjoy the unpredictability of boulder finalist rosters, otherwise I grow bored seeing the same names over and over. I like watching different climbers with different styles. I enjoy lead as well, but the differences between the two is what makes them both worthwhile to watch.
Fully agree on the world cups becoming more random in their results except Janja because she's a few levels ahead of the rest.
I am under the impression that routesetting for competitions has become less about testing the participant's skills in different ways and more about cooking up the craziest dynamic coordination jumps. Hugely impressive when they go, but less suited to determining the best climber and comps are saturated with them making it boring to watch.
Beware that if the comps become formulaic, while it drives up the marketing, creativity in the sport will suffer. It's what happened to WC DH mountain biking 😢
I think his point about making the problems in boulder competitions differ from each other is correct, however I don't agree with his randomness in the problems themselves. Each and every problem is random to a degree, sure some setters can replicate a certain move, but that's true across all styles and not just dynos. As for the randomness in athletes who progress to semis or finals, that in itself is exactly what competition is about. Who will progress through semis and finals and who will win? Alot of the female competitions where Janja Garnbret was in, you are almost certain who is going to win. In my opinion, each competition would challenge the climbers in different styles AND create some sort of randomness as to who's going to progress.
I think top climbers need to be advocates for their sport in this way.
There’s way to much hesitancy to say anything negative - we need the open dialogue that isn’t blindly positive all the time.
If you had that, top athletes would hold much more influence over the sport.
I heard something about participants are not allowed to talk about the Olympics at all. Or there is a time window? Is that true?
There is a time window, during the olympics anything about the olympics gets copyright striked
if you think about formula 1, a problem it has is that the same person wins all the time. I think it's awesome that more people have access to finals. I don't want to see the same old faces
Thats because in F1 its 90% the car and 10% the driver. Put the drivers that regularly place last in the best car and vice versa and the "bad" drivers would regularly podium and the stars would have 0 points
Good to see that elite pros really starve and crave for more outdoor like problems. Hope setters throw in more proper steep cracks with all those book openers, paddles, tea cups, ring locks, stacks and other cool stuff with their endless variety and possibilities. Can't be even more old-school new school.
Climbing gradually became circus tricks. This started off as a way to try and split the field and avoid ties. It then took on a life of its own. It makes for more injuries and certainly more luck.
Ondra, Schubert and Megos all have hoarse voices... is chalk causing some respiratory problems?
Anyone know what casual shoes he's wearing, I like the look of them?
Take a screenshot zoom in and put it in Google, it normally finds it for you :)
"Someone say something controversial" is hilarious
Sohta Amagasa catching strays 🤣
the interviewer has a very pleasant voice!
I strongly disagree with this take on comp bouldering. I understand the desire to have a climbing competition more dedicated to pure overhung crimp-strength, but I find the current Boulder World Cup format much more compelling. World cup bouldering is a mix of strength, power, coordination, and route-reading ability, a very different skill-set than top-end out-door bouldering. If we had comp boulders which were just steep overhung crimp-fests, then of course athletes like Simon Lorenzi, Will Bosi, Sean Bailey, and Aidan Roberts would dominate. I just don't find this possibility more interesting or compelling than the current bouldering style.
I think that an important caveat is that 'best boulderer' is a truly subjective take, and it's ultimately arbitrary which mix of skills we choose to test in competitive bouldering. That being said, the outdoor V-grades have primarily tracked a single skillset, which is pulling/crimp/finger strength. If you want to find out who has the greatest crimp strength by watching them pull on boards in a competition, fine. I don't. I'd rather see athletes tackle climbs in a variety of styles in a short time-window. I can find out the absolute limit of human crimping capacity when the new Mellow video drops.
I agree, I like more modern competitions more, they just do ridiculous stuff, even though I like to climb classic crimpy, pinchy stuff.
And I don't get his complaint about the consistency in results. If the competition isn't testing only pure finger strength but also reading skills, dynamic skills etc, the winner will be the best at that. It's not like consistency in the podium is assuring you that the "real" best won. If the game was fair, the winner would have been the best, full stop.
But yeah, I'd like one of the boulders of the competition to be an old school 45° crimpy board, why not
He's saying there's need for more diversity, not having coordination dynos and one slab! It's like you didn't listen
Yeah bring back the physical hard stuf to at least a proper ratio. It should be more around 50% of the boulder than 25% I think.
Remove the "Electric" boulder and replace it with a "Classic" theme. Prioritize sequence complexity and high body position risk.
I used to watch competition bouldering religiously. Recently I have lost interest completely. Big crazy dynos are fun to watch a couple times but quickly feel gimmicky, stale and completely alien to the sport I love and practice.
Do people not think that the variability in bouldering is more the fact that the field is just extremely close, and thus the final is inherently much more open. Who wants to see the exact same group in finals every time, that gets boring.
This conversation applies to less than 1% of climbers ,whether they climb indoors or out. Spectating competitions is a very poor substitute for getting out into nature and climbing on real rock.
It's a very good substitute because you can watch climbing competitions without driving for hours or even flying to another place, potentially paying for a place to stay, waiting for good weather and having the money to pay for all of that.
Let’s see some crack climbing with some sustained jamming, too, since we’re talking about neglected climbing styles and keeping it closely related to rock climbing.
The business model of the hold manufacturers dictates the direction climbing takes. Big holds = increased financial gains, which leads to the specific style of coordination moves and dynos. Simple as that. Money drives everything these days...
Well said! Sadly, I don't think the ifsc is listening to climbers as much as they should, they are trying to make a spectacle because they think they will attract more eyes with flashy boulders, "betraying" their regular viewers! It will turn into a vicious circle of organizers trying to outdo the previous competition! It's all about the money, and not even money athletes will get! As he said, certain countries are regularly getting to organize cups, but it's almost always half empty stands and lausy organization! "It's to promote the sport,...but then we end up in SA or some other shady country
richtiger Macher.
Maybe if all he wants is steep 45 body tension problems he could join the moonboard comps.
New boulder comp rule:
2 board style problems!!!!
Agree. I stopped watching comps 3 years ago. That’s is not climbing anymore. Are so boring.
The comps look like Ninja Warrior and not bouldering/climbing.
I'd go further and say that the ethos of climbing does not fit well with competition and competitiveness... It is about cooperation and community
The ethos of climbing goes well with friendly competitions within a community. Luckily watching the world cups that's a lot of the time what it feels like with athletes cheering each other on and being happy for each other and discussing betas.
I disagree. Outside rock climbing and indoor bouldering are different sports. There is a lot of crossover but they are different.
I totally agree! You lose out on stars, and it becomes a Fugazi sport! There's nobody to follow.
why is he sitting so far from the interviewer?
Nope; one discipline…just do better
Competition is nothing. Ppl will remember who did the hardest routest/boulders... no one cares who get a WC win or olymic medal 20 years ago. So go outside 😁