Huge Drama in the Smash Community | Asmongold Reacts
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ย. 2022
- Video by Ludwig Mogul Mail • Huge Drama in the Smas...
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35:50 Fun story: I worked with a company once, where we had a sudden case with a customer that sold "modified products". Lots of lawyers involved, very expensive case. This came about because one of our sales representatives had been talking to a customer (a small local chain of stores), who had these small fun christmas stickers that fit just perfect on an otherwise blank spot on the pack, but gave it an overall more festive look. The sales rep took this to the marketing team, but the one who received it quickly disregarded it as too cumbersome to do on our production, as it would be too late at that point to get it before christmas, and we didn't want christmas themed products on the shelves after new year anyway. So it was shelved until the following year, and not talked about again, until almost half a year later. The head of marketing, not involved in the talks so far, stumbled upon the files on the sharepoint server, which was labelled "modified products". The original marketing person filing this had left the company for a promotion elsewhere and not knowing what "modified" meant, apparently sent the head of marketing into a panic. He talked to legal, and they quickly pulled together a cease and desist to send to the customer. When the customer responded that this had been given the thumbs up by the sales rep, the sales rep was fired within the week, and the customer was put on a sales freeze until "investigations had been done thoroughly".
Because it blew up internally, someone decided to just privately contact the old marketing employee and ask for a quick written statement on what he remembered about this "modified product", (something that PROBABLY should have been done BEFORE the customer was ever contacted) it got clarified to be about a sticker on the packaging, and nothing else. This started the entire process of trying to make amends with the now rather angry customer, dealing with an employment lawsuit from a very angry employee who had been fired as a knee jerk reaction without due process, and a newfound loss of confidence in the entire management, who had messed up to tremendously because of their lack of composure and communication ability.
It was a huge shitshow, and and all because somehow, the people in these high paid management positions have the impulse control of a toddler.
Wow, totally avoidable drama!
Imagine if twitch or individual streamers had to get broadcasting licenses for every game they play, it would kill streaming as we know it. Nintendo treats these events like it's some exclusive T.V. licensing deal and kills an entire esport community.
It wouldn't really kill it, if there was a proper way to apply. It is their IP, they have they right to it.
@@yololoyo7379 this. If you think North American governments are behind the times, you’ve never experienced Japanese government and customs. The technology and pace of tech growth is leaving Japan in the dust in terms of understanding streaming and things of that nature
I agree
@@2Poor4UserName Ahh, so you're the kind to insult anybody you don't agree with, not actually provide any points, and try to pressure people socially. I think its scummy to try and profit off of the hard work of others, without at least working out a deal with them.
@@Xetttt are you saying you don't see it as scummy?
It's nuts that Nintendo didn't squash this Dr. Alan like a bug, for threatening other people and organizations on their behalf - he was acting as if he spoke for them, and most organizations get super pissed when someone who does not actually represent them acts like he does.
Who knows how many shares this guy holds at Nintendo
@@Lunaire.- Don't even have to be shares. Since the smash world tour was unlicensed nintendo was likely seeing no money from it but likely got money from panda to have a licensed tourney.
One can only assume those at Nintendo aware of Alan's doings don't really mind. They can just kick him off the boat when they please.
They might, Face important for the Japanese. If more and more comes to light that having an official relationship with Dr. Alan is going to make them look bad. They will shut that down too. But they are always going to be slow to react, it also might not matter if the allegations are true or not. If it will negatively effect their reputation to be involved. That's it.
@@TheBlackSage7 I don't see why they couldn't just license it then? I'm sure a deal could have been made that woul have been preferable to an outright shutdown.
“Why though?”
Nintendo…. “We don’t need to explain ourselves to anyone. People will continue to buy our products no matter what we do.”
What makes it even funnier is that kids nowadays don't give a shit about Nintendo, they were born after their golden age. It's the manchildren that keep throwing money at them, even though they get shit on by the company constantly, but they're trapped in a nostalgia bubble.
@@ne0nmancer i just like nintendo games, plain and simple idk why your so mad .
@@amplifysenpai3175 I also like some of them, i don't like giving them money.
@@JayceCH. Yep, i won't give my money to someone who stabs me in the back at every turn. No matter the quality of the product they deliver.
@@birdbig6852 Read the comment above yours, i don't care about the quality of the product (which is completely subjective, and i won't argue with you on that because you're clearly biased) if the company is managed by assholes who shut down fan projects, fan tournaments and try to profit from every content creator that is advertising their game for free. You do you buddy, but if i gave them money, it would be the same as supporting the aforementioned practices i hate.
They did seek a license and had a year long discussion with Nintendo where they were strung along for the whole time and Nintendo was telling them the opposite of what was happening.
@@davidpowers9178 What profits?
Yeah I think he realized that further into the video
@@Luminousreign People have been begging nintendo to license a tournament for about 15 years now.
There is no tooth fairy, there's no easter bunny and there's no nintendo license.
@@Luminousreign Yeah, you're right. They should've sought the license five years ago on September the 16th at exactly 13:00 in the afternoon and met them personally in front of the Cerulean Tower Tokyu Hotel while dressed in kimonos. Mate, let's call a spade and spade and call an ass an ass. If somebody told me, "Well, our Filipino business partners are two days late to the business meeting because they're not feeling up to it these days, but I suppose that can't be helped since it's part of the culture", I'd slap them and said fellow business-oriented countrymen of mine across the cheek and sit them down for a storm of words. You can't just boil down every bad decision & response a Japanese business makes as "a cultural thing". You're giving Japanese folk a bad rep doing that. This is just Nintendo (and the related parties) pulling an oopsie and should be recognized as such.
@@Luminousreign Even then, that's still 5 years of requesting a licence and not getting it... Nintendo sucks in this regard, and that's just that.
It’s hard for people outside of the smash community to understand the culture within, its a gaming community that has been self regulating itself for over 20 years against all odds it really is quite incredible - this is a very serious problem with very serious implications for probably the most dedicated gaming fans I have ever heard of
"self regulating"
@@Legend-bq7lt lol yeah, but honestly, they did no worse than any other publicly traded/officially curated company or organization. How many similar controversies have you seen in official organizations? A lot.
Self regulating... That's precisely the motherload of the problem. Between half of the FGC being troglodytes that didn't accept Smash back in the day, in response Smash treating itself like a sort of Apple in the FGC and Nintendo being the biggest self absorbed douchebag in the industry, it just didn't evolved into the accepted and standarized formula that every other fighting game uses, and that's why it has come to this situation where some weasel can come and ruin the party for everyone. Imagine Sony trying to do that shit with EVO, hell would be let loose.
It's baffling, a year and a half old from a niche anime fighter series like Guilty Gear Strive has a better baseline on competitive than a 5 year old bestselling game from a 20 year old very successful franchise like Smash. Everyone and their mother can run a tournament on every other game without thinking about being set up by the parent company of the game. It's just plain sad and it would be nice if Sakurai had a word with Nintendo over this, he being a former competitive KOF player.
Nintendo doesn't trust your self-regulation with manchildren getting too intimate with actual children.
@@rayray0987 for real. A lot of people forgetting about 2020 when all that smash news came out at once with an alarming amount of people.
I don't play smash but this is tragic for the scene poor people man I wish something happened and this gets sorted out
It gets sorted when people stop pretending Nintendo has any authority to stop it. Literally Nintendo has no legal grounds to stand on at all to stop people from streaming or playing their game. Once you buy the product it literally isn't up to them how you use it.
@@DeathmetalPersian I wish that worked like that but they know their stuff better than us for sure man
@@striker7729 it does work like that. If everyone on my street buys a copy of call of duty and I rent out a hall for a huge LAN party I don't need to call Activison and beg for permission. The literally only reason this event was canceled was because they lost their ad revenue from sponsors who pulled out as soon as Nintendo pulled out. The actual tournament COULD have still happened but they canceled it to save money. It has literally nothing to do with Nintendo preventing the event, and everything to do with the event organizers wanting compensation.
@@DeathmetalPersian huge difference between running a small LAN and running a global event worth millions. Nintendo are well known as a litigious company. Sure you can attempt to run a non-licensed event but if Nintendo come at you trust me when I say you don’t have enough money to fight them. Nintendo will go 💯💯
@@DeathmetalPersian I can't speak on ultimate but for melee vgbc/SWT was never supported by nintendo or any sponsors that were affiliated with nintendo afaik ,so I don't think you know exactly what you're talking about. In general smash TO's get most of their kick back from stream viewership and tournament entrees its why were still grassroots at large. It has everything to do with Nintendo preventing the event because they've demonstrated before they will c&d an event like big house 9 or evo 2013 if they feel it breaches their clause. Also you're right they cancelled it to save money but thats not where it ends, if they did decide to go through with running an unlicensed event which Nintendo does have grounds to shut it down or pursue legal action which would cost god knows how much for gimr and vgbc as a whole.
Asmon, your opening statement within the first 3 minutes was very well put, my dude. I'm glad to see some truths spoken.
Yeah I hadn't really given it much thought until his statement on it. But yeah copyright law is really messed up and Nintendo abuses it more than any company in the world besides maybe Disney. If you put this game out into the world, and charge money for it, people should be able to freely do with it what they want. That $$ that you paid for your legitimate copy of this game should give you some sort of ownership to the gameplay thats played on it.
Its like if you bought a Kitchenaid mixer and used it to make bread on your monetized youtube channel, and then Kitchenaid hit you with a C&D. Copyright law is fucked. Nintendo needs to chill out on this shit. We love your game, us playing your game will make viewers want to play melee. Then when they realize how dogshit base melee is without all community improvements on the games performance, they will probably buy Ultimate. Which has a much easier barrier of entry and online support without needing a rom.
Its a win win for nintendo but they are so blinded by wanting to protect the image of their games in a competitive context that it just kills the entire empire they built.
@@helchin93 it’s not really Nintendos fault either, Japan has WORSE copyright laws then here, and to the Japan Nintendo, those are normal, there’s a reason why Nintendo of America is trying to handle the copyright over here rather than the Japan Nintendo.
The issues with the laws go both ways. One: the laws are complex and idiotic and two: they are different in different countries.
It could have been something as simple as lawyers in Japan saying after case X was ruled this way and created X precedent, "If you allow this unlicensed, you will lose the right to control the broadcasting use of the game". Remember the same laws that help companies also end up forcing them to do things they probably wouldn't really care to do just to keep the rights to their own creations and properties.
I do think the whole thing sucks, but if someone tried to bring them to court they have an easy out. They could simply say that they can still run their event, they just can't broadcast it.
He didn't speak any truths, he said "it's an idea not really property" than said it's digital thing which isn't all that intellectual property extends to. Besides, he was saying the concept of intellectual property is "a digital thing, it's not really property, it's not real" even though it is, it covers the execution of ideas in a work, not the ideas themselves but still. Maybe he should actually learn about this stuff before talking?
He didn't actually speak any truths though. He says that "it's a digital thing, it's not really property, it's not real" despite the fact that it is. It protects the execution of ideas for a work, digital or no, and it being digital by definition means it's no longer an idea. When somebody says "it's their intellectual property" he says "I disagree with that" showing he doesn't know how this works.
Regarding the usage of masks as a way to cancel STW (51:30), the Panda Cup approved major tournament Lost Tech City did not have a mask requirement for the venue. So it wouldn’t have been shut down because of a lack of mask requirement. Additionally, they were both hosted in Texas so regional guidelines would have been the same for both LTC and SWT.
A lack of regional policy wouldn't necessarily be Nintendo's "Partner policy guideline". If Nintendo wants all of their partner's to have the mask requirement, that could easily be enough to be a health/safety violation.
That doesn't mean it couldn't be weaponised by lying about it.
Also you have to understand that Panda has contacts. If Panda stated we need an investigation on SWT, it would get done. If SWT stated you need to investigate Panda it may not get done. Contacts have alot of power in these situations.
If Nintendo cares about safety, they should clean up the game’s shared content section. I don’t understand how they leave that up.
This video could have been better if it was asmon reacting to charlie's reaction of mugal mail's smash commentating on the medium article...
Hey bro , on my TH-cam channel i do food reviews while I’m super high 😈
Mugal mail LOL
10:30 That'll cost up to 50,000 Euro in Germany. Fun fact: Killing a wasp is punishable in Germany, between 5-50,000 Euro, and for hard reoffenders even jail.
Shame I poisoned an entire nest that bled into the inner parts of a windowframe 3 years ago with all the larvae inside it too and ripped it out to the open street. I even watched some ants dragging them off to their nest.
Might get me a life sentence and a documentation as a serial killer.
Do you mean wasps or bees because i can understand the latter (cuz bes are fuckin important for ecosystem as a whole) but like... wasps??... those things kill bees....
@@sinkarcho wasps
It would also be a shame if the entirety of team panda got blacklisted from events over this...
I would be more shame if the entirety got doxed because of it...
@@Pocket_Crab they already stream, it would be more effective to try to encourage their talent to leave the team
Thanks for covering this asmon, it really does help!
Alot of truth here on how things are and how things should be. The ones hurt the most by these kinds of anti-community moves are the small event organizers and the local communities themselves.
Glad you picked this one up. I think Nintendo's community dept needs a serious wake up call. As to why Nintendo does this kind of crap. Maybe they think they are the Disney of video games.
nintendo fans are the same ppl who go to disney parks KEK
Unlike Disney, they have the quality product to back it up. DIsney seems to have it until you look at the decaying rot inside the product.
@@nickhewes6860 You mean the one that had ALL the characters from SMASH in the past few decades plus newbies like Kazuya and Sora? That one? As bad as you think it is, it basically had quantity for quality and they all played well. They are at least consistent. I cant say the same for Disney with all of their stuff being even shoddier than some of Nintendo's lackluster products.
The chatter with the bug bug spray pepe and asmons face was GOLD xDD
So glad a bunch of adjacent content creators are bringing more attention to this situation. Thanks Asmon
As a melee player, thanks for giving this some extra exposure.
This kinda stuff happens with the US gov, people wanna start a company in an industry and are choked out by the big boys. If they don't wanna play ball with them, the corps lobby for regulations to ensure no one has a chance to rise up as competition
Allen really dropped the ball, he could have advocated for all large tournaments to get the Nintendo green light and made a great name for himself and the brand.
I don't have a dog in the fight but this seems pretty shady
@@a1pha_star unless Nintendo had intent, this could very easily be Alan's fault alone. If you maintain the right levels of communication that others don't have access to and use that, Nintendo could have been played a fool.
Best they can do is sue Nintendo for money lost as they said they would not cancel the event, then you do all your expenses and then they say your cancelled.
Video games require input to function and therefore are fundamentally different than films or shows. Broadcasting games should fall under free speech as an individuals actions in it are unique.
That being said this won't change until people stand up to nintendo lawyers.
Nintendo is too big to fail. In both senses of the statement. They can rest on their laurels...for now. However, they don't really exist in a void anymore. And for those of us who didn't get invested when they released the Switch, Nintendo functionally doesn't exist at all. They're being left behind.
Thank you for talking about this!
As an active Melee player and fan of Asmongold, thank you for talking about this topic.
My only guess to Nintendo's logic is that they are a company which caters hardcore towards the hearts of young children. Competative gaming tournaments breed high levels of toxicity and that isn't always the way Nintendo wants their games to reach people.
I think this ridiculous, but that's the only thing I could even think of from Nintendo's POV
Plus the controversy in the smash community in regards to pedos
Smash fans try to not behave like an abused wife that keeps going back their abusive spouse challenge (Impossible, nintendo said he'd be better next year)
So trueee
If your spouse is rich, that different though
Lmfao they do it every time too 🤣
It was not possible for them to obtain a license because Nintendo ghosted them after saying they were cool then shut them down two weeks before
I wonder if they could request a list of what "health and safety laws" were violated and who conducted the inspection/investigation? Not sure if it would matter or not, or if the info would be voluntarily given to begin with
I agree 100% about of releasing a game and people being able to make content around it, like Tournaments... which are in essence alike Streaming those games on YT or Twitch, taking a screenshot and making a Meme out of it...
The bridge situation. Lol
Panda running straight to bankruptcy with this move.
thx for spreading the info
there´s some dota 2 streamers that had to wait 15 minutes to broadcast the matches, it was insane sometimes the match was already over and they were at mid game. I dont think that the stream of one championship should be monopolize
I just find it funny that Nintendo historically does something shitty right before they drop a new trailer or Nintendo direct
Asmon: "You can't just say something and then go back on it."
The U.S. Government: "Allow me to introduce myself"
Any Japanese company does not care about "the day before Thanksgiving"
Yeah I don't see why that is made out to be a huge deal. It was supposed to be that huge Worldwide Tournament and no one outside of the US cares about Thanksgiving.
@@sindri1447 Projecting...only you are seceretly weirded out by it
You're going to be really disappointed that Nintendo of US exists. Not like everybody that works for Nintendo is Japanese lmao
From a marketing perspective, it’s ideal for businesses to take customer sensitivities into account.
Given that US customers dwarf Japanese customers in terms of raw numbers, it’s not a bad idea to shift the schedule of the announcement.
It’s not about being nice. It’s about maintaining a positive global brand image.
And that is why things get negative attention
1:35 as someone who developed a fan game to a minor community, I cannot stress how true that is
I'm sure the contract saids that the players have to show up. Now what I hope happens is that they show up and just let the clock run out.
It never ceases to impress me whenever Asmon gets diction with his vocabulary whenever getting serious about something considering... Everything. Lol.
Love the guy.
In court of law, if you have not shown attempts at setting a precidence in the past then your ability to do so in the future is harder. So they are setting precidence now, just in case they wanted to again in the future, where upon they'll be able to throw around more legal weight.
That take on releasing a game and companies not having a say in whether people can make a tournament or not is exactly my whole opinion on this whole ridiculous debacle. It is just fucking true our transaction with the initial provider of. The product in this case being Smash was already purchased after that anything anyone chooses to do with the game is their business and Nintendo should have zero say regarding it.
you CAN host a tournament without Nintendo's permission. you just can't broadcast the gameplay footage without a license
@@butterdubs2267 That's still stupid as fuck. Because then what the hell is the line drawn at where it's okay to record footage of a game or not? Nintendo and really no other company should have the power to say people can't broadcast their games after said games have already been released and fully established as fully launched games. That's just fucking completely asinine it is what it is.
@@butterdubs2267 I get it with launch embargos and stuff like that, most companies do that, and there's an actual reason. Nintendo is the only company that makes anyone that wants to broadcast/record ANY game, even almost 40 yo games, pay them for the privilege, it's just bullshit.
@@butterdubs2267 Like they arent making enough money launching shitty, expensive and underperforming consoles (that only sell because exclusives). They just NEED to milk content creators and tournament organizers, even when they can only benefit from the broadcasting.
Thing is yeah it's fine if for instance Nintendo ask for exclusive events but it's not okay that they either don't run any events or 1 a year and it being super shitty filled with boatload of spattoon ads
For those two aren’t smash players, its probably not a mask issue. There were multiple tournaments in Texas including a major that counted as both a panda circuit and SWT, masks were not worn.
This is how competitive TF2 died. TFTV blackmailed and extorted the smaller grassroots organizations in the game and also tried to kill Highlander to force everyone to play 6s.
It was bad and they even launched harassment campaigns against their detractors.
The grandma comment had me laughing so hard
My man with the electric fly swatter
It is not right that Nintendo is to blame.
They should not only listen to Panda's side of the story, but they should also find out more about the people around them.
The part where the president of Panda is threatening not to participate in other tournaments should be investigated further, and those tournaments should not be supported by Nintendo.
Thanks for covering this asmon
I don't get it. SWT's document clearly states they failed to get the proposal in on time in 2022. NIntendo started to slow comms with them after that. Isnt the obvious answer that nintendo didn't like that the original proposal? Making this about Panda Global is like, burying the lead. The fact is that Nintendo and them did not come to an agreement the first time, and SWT moved forward without a license.
2 things that’s aren’t really mentioned they were running the tournament the whole time they were waiting for the reply from Nintendo and as for the thanksgiving it’s a world wide event, world being the key part
over 24 hours later since this happened, neither panda nor the Alan has given any form of response to it. kinda hard to hold off coming to assumptions at this point
On one hand, it sucks to see this. On the other, excellent alternatives get a bigger spotlight. Rushdown Revolt is now gonna shine hard
@@SleepyFawn it's at least on people's minds a bit due to being featured at Dreamhack, and matching Smash Ultimate's prizepool
If someone would to have the money to fight them can Nintendo actually win the case? I 100% agree though, if you produce a system then you should have no say in how the public wants to play it, if they want to do an event then they can. Now they should be able to say if they can or can't record it, save art, sell merchandise etc....
I wonder if there'd be some promissory estoppel violation by Nintendo. I'm obviously not a lawyer, but if Nintendo really did give the Smash World Tour a reasonable expectation that they were completely fine to operate so long as they didn't mod their games, then that alone should be contract enough. Especially so if there were multiple conversations to that effect. Even without a formal contract, just that understanding from prior dealings would be enough to establish promissory estoppel. I don't know how much of that the Smash World Tour has written down (either as notes, emails, recordings, etc), but if they do, they could very easily sue Nintendo for violation of promissory estoppel for damages.
Unfortunately, with the way the court works, any resolution of such a lawsuit would likely take years (especially so if Nintendo wants to continually delay it), so it wouldn't be the fastest resolution ever, but it would definitely be a resolution.
It's absolutely terrible that this happened, and I'm near certain that PG had something to do with this because I don't think there'd be any reason for Nintendo to go back on their promise like this.
VGBC lawyered up just to write that statement, they say so in the start of the full medium article. They're just trying not to get sued for telling the truth.
Did you get a new MIC Asmon? Some reason this video sounds better than most.
i mean, im not surprised nintendo shut the event down, i mean, they used to strike channels that did walkthroughs of their games, or specifically let's plays, non commentary walkthroughs was apparently fine, but the second you start altering or as they put it "stole their ip for your own monetary gain" then it was bad, yes, they saw let's players, essentially free publicity, as a bad thing, because they made some money, and they felt that it would remove sales from them
edit, i suspect that alan brought up a potential covid outbreak might occur, or some shit like that
What about Nintendo using the word licence. Surely that word is a specific thing usually only granted by governments because the application of such has an effect on the application of legal laws. Going this route if i'm right could ban Nintendo from being allowed to have a thing called a licence
I always have fun just sitting and listening to Asmon speaking and explaining things so thoroughly and with honesty, differentiating emotional and logical responses
Sick bro
It's a Japanese company mentality. Face is very important. It's uncomfortable to have someone that could be supposedly showing Nintendo products in a poor light. So they feel much more comfortable when they control all of the elements that go into something large and public facing. They aren't being evil, it's just a culture clash issue. There are of course other problems that result from this however.
Because part two of this, is that you respect your seniors and elders. It turns Bureaucracy into this draconian effort to get anything approved and moved up the chain. You have to get your senior to approve of something, and the issue common with that is the fact that now you have this huge slow divide between the ones actually making the decisions, and the people involved with these kinds of events. That's not to mention that if someone along the chain thinks that it's a bad idea, or is backwards thinking, or doesn't see the merit or profit. They say no, and those under them HAVE to obey their senior. Full stop. They are senior and they are to be respected and listened to. They have their reasons etc... This isn't a problem exclusive with Nintendo. There have been attempts to change the government, to streamline processes. To get rid of old paper documents, legal seals, filing cabinets that fill and clutter offices. But nothing gets done to change any of that due to the older seniors that refuse to change.
As I understand it, it is not about hosting a tournament, but rather broadcasting it
True but I think his point about overreaching IP could still apply regardless
And? They've been broadcasting for years with no issues. People have been livestreaming for years with no issue. It's ridiculous to try to enforce these restrictions now.
@@nine9nine9 It's Nintendo, the word ridiculous is synonymous.
@@nine9nine9 Most likely scenario is Panda asked Nintendo to enforce those restrictions as a way to hold a monopoly over any Smash-related tournament stream.
this the slippery slope effect, soon companies may even start to charge streamers license fee, or require a cut of the profit they make playing the game.
Pull out of Panda events last minute. That will sort this mess out
Trying schedule a spay next month. My cat is like doing this every morning
1:00 they charge commission and it is actually quite lucrative
for them, think NBA for video games.
All I hear is that nintendo is going to spend more money on advertising and trust on some areas
When the Karen walks around the neighborhood telling kids to stop having fun and selling lemonade
0.00001 Seconds later nintendo fans will give all of their worldly possessions to nintendo once more.
Just like Blizzard fans haha
I don't know how nintendo's "you must be licensed" would hold up in court ... if people that each purchased a game come together to play said game for money that's not a trademark or copyright infringement ... advertising a trademark have boundaries ... but they can't stop people whom purchased their product from using it with other people
U gotta look up I.P Law. Just cause u buy the product doesn't mean u own the I.P
Now for compensation the tournament can go on and the purple legend will be added in Smash as a playable character
It might be a good idea to subtitle key videos like stuff covering this situation subtitled in Japanese. I remember that was a request with Square Enix, maybe it would help Nintendo.
Said as someone who has no ability to translate myself.
here's something about a cease-and-desist that people overlook as long as you have not received a cease-and-desist letter this letter could affect one person or that group you just need a new person or group to take up the cause after all they can't stop everybody if one letter is all it takes to kill your fun then you didn't want it that badly in the first place
That might make sense a lot of times, but Nintendo is notorious for being the masters of cease and desist. To the point they even cease and desist TH-camrs when they make transformative content. They’ve been shutting down the smash scene for decades now bro. Also you gotta Factor in the fact that these are all grass roots orgs so it’s the community taking massive Ls on things they don’t even make money on. The smash scene does it out of love
You are absolutely correct asmond, not sure what Nintendos goal is with these things especially for long term. Can't pinpoint it for the life of me
When you're buying a game you're buying the licence to play the game be that digital or physical and think once you pay once like a one-time purchase you can do what you want with the game that doesn't break certain copyright laws like modifying it and trying to resell it but if you want to record said game or stream or make a tournament out of it you should be allowed to because at that point it's free marketing for the game company but no most companies just want all the money from you even if you bought let's say 100 games from Nintendo. If I ever was a CEO of a game company I'd let you have a tournament because it brings the community together and does great things although executives don't see that they rather see their bank account have extra 00000s.
Tournaments and positive celebration is (FREE) PR and marketing exposure of their IP. I dont understand why Nintendo wouldnt be allowing or even encouraging free marketing like tournaments.
This type of thing, is probably a non-internet savvy boomers who made a decision - based on a cold-hard understanding of copyright and IP laws. Without consideration if individual human beings (customers) down that line.
The thing that concerns me about this is that the whole boycott panda thing is going to have an adverse affect on people who had nothing to do with any of these i.e. the panda players. All you have to do is look at the likes of eSams twitter and TH-cam community post to see he had no idea any of this was going to happen and yet he could suffer a backlash from this all due to Fat Tonys, sorry I mean Dr Alan's actions
The barrier of innovation is dependant on the reward
It's always the "Family Friendly" companies that are the most messed up
Do keep in mind, of course, that in addition to their IP, Smash also means having to protect the IP of, like, 20 companies. Including Disney.
Let me get this straight for the subjects that Asmon mentioned around 35:30 . Japanese companies (especially the big ones) do not acknowledge the community and think they are the center of the universe. If they make anything, they think they completely own it.
If there is money to be made where they can have more control over, they will take it.
It gets worst when it comes to Japanese game development companies. They are essentially the USA pharmaceutical companies except they don't make meds, they make video games.
So, in Japan that is mostly the reason why there aren't community driven tournaments here. The community acknowledges that even if they put all the effort of advertising the tournament to attract people, it is up to the company to say it is "OK" to even run them.
And because Japanese society mostly consists of hive minded people, if ANY of those companies doesn't acknowledge the tournament, the players will not even play in the tournament. So it is kind of understandable where Nintendo is coming from when they cancelled the tournament organized by BTS (not saying it was OK)
I wish the suits in these companies acknowledges the value of the community and stop being such a PITA to deal with, but that how it goes. They believe they are essentially GODS of their own creation, and the community cannot do anything to alter its values.
EDIT: I'm not saying it was like this forever, but these kind of behavior has been seen ever since the companies have became over confidence in themselves and power.
And then you have cases like Konami, which is BOTH a japanese game maker AND a pharmaceutical company, for both the worst of both worlds
It's funny how Nintendo is made to look bad.
We should dig deeper into the part where Panda's CEO is threatening other competitions and
that convention should not be supported by Nintendo.
Nintendo had the final say and they are the ones with the power to shut down events. They are not victims in this by being manipulated by Alan, they're corporate bullies who strung along their competition under the guise that they were collaborators. For a year they promised not to shut down the SWT, that their licensing deal with Panda was not exclusive, and that SWT should continue investing and financing their events. Nintendo is the one who pulled the plug at the last minute which financially fucks over not only the people running SWT, but all of the hundreds of competitors who bought flights and hotels (presumably fans of Nintendo who have bought their products and games for years) and even the spectators in this case traveling from all over the world to see this event that was supposed to happen. If Nintendo doesn't want people to broadcast their IP, fine. Say it up front and stop the event in its tracks. To pussyfoot around for a year and pull the plug when it would financially cripple hundreds if not thousands of people is at best absolutely reckless, and at worst a cruel punishment aimed at their most devoted fanbase for trying to promote their brand. Nintendo is disgusting.
could they not have continued with the tournament without broadcasting it? turn it into a fan convention with no official logos and what not like lots of other unsanctioned conventions do. or were they relying on the streaming revenue to pay for more than the cost of refunding everything?
If the courts haven't already ruled on this, do it anyway and dare them to see you there.
They are trying to monopolize this event, gain all revenue, and the worst part is that they(CEO Alan) weren't there from the beginning. They weren't part of the grassroots, they didn't help to create the scene, they just got there when it was already popular. That is next level bullshit
PS when I say they I'm not talking about the whole panda crew, just the CEO Alan
You sell the game in order for people to play. That's the end of the transaction. If they play it together with their grandparents, in a tournament or on the moon is none of your business. If you buy a car you can race it on a track if you want to. It's your car.
In other news I almost bought a switch after work. Then I saw the price tag for all the nintendo ip games. Game is 5 years old? Doesnt matter still $60. Thats kinda crazy.
Imaging paying for nintendo games.
Nintendo can do whatever they want because they know there will negligible repercussions. People will still play, buy and stream their games and systems so why should Nintendo change their ways or practices?
I also wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo wasn't seeing any money from SWT but was probably getting a cut from PWT which was probably the deal for them to get licensed.
So is it the end of Super Smash and the true beginning of MultiVersus?
If they misrepresented to Nintendo what was going on to get them shut down, that would be an easy lawsuit.
Has smash tournaments happened in the past?
Never seen Asmon in a hoodie before. The end times are nigh
I search for Asmongold, I get a WoW ad, and I've never played WoW.
Must be tied to his name xD
Hopefully this sets a precedent and people finally realize that the current copyright laws have too much BS on them and give way too much power to copyright holders to the point where you can't even make non profit fan projects without risking yourself getting sued into oblivion or even hold a tournament for a 20+ year old video game without a license.
This nonsense has to stop.
If I was a player who was contracted to play in the Panda tournament I would throw every game by running off the edge of the map and urge every other player to do the same.
I have two words, "Underground Tournaments"
seems like they could get with lawyers and find a way to make the event happen legally.
my guess is that this is all over money, for all parties involved, not just 1.
why dont they just tell Nintendo that "with respect you have no say in these affairs, thank you"
I don't understand Nintendo at all. I know Smash sold well and all, but *by God* it would sell much better and be 15x more active if they actually implemented anything like a modern fighter netcode. I live in europe. There's tens of thousands of Smash fans here (small group), but we don't have that many local tournaments for obvious reasons. Therefore, I can't even play Smash against others, since the online system dates from the 90's. Such a disappointment.
Imagine if this Smash Community event was for charity and then Nintendo comes in and shuts them down. Imagine the implications that would have on the reputation of Nintendo when you got one guy shutting down other people running their own Super Smash Bros. Tournament events.