Modular, direct to AC support via a piecemeal scalable-basis to lower the consumption of high draw appliances is an outstanding hack! Thanks for sharing.
Hello Brad. Your video reminded me of my first array I set up using the older M-215 Micro-Inverters back in 2013. I bought 6 250 watt Sharp panels and matched them with 6 Enphase M-215 inverters. It produced about 1200 watts in good sun. I connected my trunk cable to my old hot tub disconnect box. and protected the cable at 20 amps. I loved it so much I doubled it, then doubled it again, then didn't like how I was pushing the excess power to the utility, so I made plans and installed a large array on my roof. The city approved plans allowed me to apply for Net metering with the utility. Which then they will recognize the excess power I sent them. (Note that, without an approved net metering agreement with utility, your home and meter will allow power to be pushed to grid if your own home doesn't need it. But, they do not recognize the power that you send them. The meter will flat line rather than spin backwards so to speak. In other words, it looks like you're using no power to them, even though you might be sending the grid a few hundred watts. So it's best to use all you produce otherwise you are donating power as a gift. Of course it is highly recommended to draw a array permit plan up and go through the process of applying for net metering)
The meter might keep spinning as you push it back to the grid. The meter might spin at the speed your system pushing the electricity back. So you want to slow down the spinning rather than try to push back if you dont have the bi-directional meter.
Any idea on how to make this work on a Pentair easy touch control system with a variable speed pump? The pump always has power to it (both line and loads hooked to the line side of relay). Because of the variable speed pump, it is designed to be hooked up that way. Does the inverter only allow solar power to flow when there is an amperage draw or just sensing 120/240?
Great stuff, thanks for sharing, so can you power up the micro inverters I got some IQ 6+ and 7 + and would like to power them up when the sun goes down or during power outages using one of my battery banks with an all in one inverter unit. Wonder if this is possible, it nice t be able to use the freaking PV system when the power is out!
My new system is 31 405-watt Q Cell panels and 31 Enphase IQ8A Inverters, they offer a "SunLight Backup" mode. An interesting option for a "grid-tied" system.
How did you extend the MC4 connector from the AC side to the meter? I'm considering the IQM+, but it seems like you need to buy separate MC4 connectors. I really dislike how companies use proprietary cables, forcing you to spend extra.
I'm very interested in a practical and not too expensive grid-tie inverter with limiter. I have a 2,000 watt Sunglow grid tie with limiter and it works like a charm. Even when I'm producing all the solar power that I am consuming, it still allows 5 watts of grid power in so as not to tip off the power company that I'm doing something I'm not supposed to be doing. The drawback is that it is a max of 2,000 watts. I've been looking for a 4,000 watt grid tie with limiter that is easy to program. I never thought about using individual micro inverters. I'm going to keep an eye on your channel.
Thanks! Could do the same thing with the outdoor condenser unit on an air conditioner. Just hook it up to the back side of the contactor so they only produce when the compressor starts.
@@Roll2Videos I have one micro inverter that starts producing in seconds. I think they can be setup to look for the hub/gateway, probably by default they do not, and thus why the one starts so fast. But I can't verify this until I get a working hub, I guess that's the only way to get into configure the inverters.
I actually have same setup for my pool pump but I’m using older enphase inverters and I have it wires in on the line side of the timer so ones my pool pump stops the inverter keep feeding the house so keeps power bill down a bit.
@@BradCagle I do export some times ones the pool pumps stop working and I’m not using much in the house, so then the power company gets free power for me but that’s fine with me I just want to make my pool pump running for free.
@@AlekseyK86you gotta be careful, some dumb meters will capture import and export power and you’ll end up paying the power company for the power you’re giving them
Hi I am off grid, I have a anker solex f3800 I 6 panels connected to it to charge but losing a ton of power over the cable, I have a set of 13 panels/micros (m250) after playing with them and speaking to nphase, they said, "the inverters will only produce when they can sample" So my thought was to get a iq7+ just like you did, allow it to start producing and after it started, connect the rest of my m250, and sending to the solex's input, to start it's battery charging, I'll be losing a little bit of power over the conversions but not a lot over a cable that's my thoughts please leave any suggestions or comments you might think about
Can you use solar panel optimisers in offgrid system? I have 4kw panels feeding 24v into Victron 150/100 mppt, into AGM battery bank then into 3000w low frequency inverter. I have a mix of different panels and want to stop the lowest producing panel drag down the rest of array with it. Cheers
Will this work with the regular IQ7 or IQ8 inverters, or does it have to be the plus variants? I'm interested in doing almost the same thing as you are, but with my mini split ac units. Thank you.
I use 4- 400 watt panels straight to a 90 volt dc motor the pump is a aqua flo a series it is all brass, has the C56 frame 5/8 input shaft. using it for 5 years now, sunup to sundown 1 hp.
I'll add this tidbit of info. You can buy used panels and used Enphase micros on the internet for cheap. The older micros like M-215 or M-250 work great, But some cities won't accept the older ones on permitted arrays. I just installed an array at my rental. I had a bunch of extra M-215 inverters, but the city said I had to use Enphase IQ-7 or IQ-8 newer type inverters. So I bought 24 used IQ-7 inverters and did it that way. The IQ line uses a different trunk cable also. Older M type Trunk cable uses a neutral and a ground in addition to the 2 hots for the 240 volts. The newer IQ cable just has the 2 hot wires for 240. Also, the LED on the inverters is helpful. Blinking red means they are not producing. Blinking amber means producing, but not reporting to an Envoy (envoys report each panels production to your phone and Enphase) Blinking green when it is producing and also talking to an Envoy.
@@tclaffey Regardless of whether a used Enphase inverter is still registered under another Enphase account or not, as soon as it is powered to 240 volts and has sun, it will begin to produce power. But as far as monitoring that inverter under your own Enphase enlighten account, after your envoy searches for micros connected, to then add them to your account if they are still registered to another, you would need to call Enphase and request those inverters to be released from previous accounts. I had to do this a few times, and they are pretty cooperative about it. They will sometimes scan to see how long it’s been since that micro has produced, and if it shows it’s been inactive for two or three or six months, it’s kinda obvious to them that it’s been removed from the previous system. Then you’re able to add it to your own and enlighten the system and monitor production. Note that I’ve never had to request the releasing of micros in the IQ line. I’ve only experienced requesting M series inverters to be released, but I imagine it works in the same way. You just explain to Enphase customer service that you bought a group of used inverters online and you wanted to now add them to your system. The easy way to know whether it’s still registered or not under another system occurs when you go to place the inverter on your graphics grid and it won’t be allowed to reside there. That’s when you know you have to call them and unassigned it. If the graphics allow you to place the inverter there then the inverter is already unassigned from previous owner and you don’t have to make the call.
The way I understand it once the envoy-s is up and in "California rule 21" mode it will throttle the micro inverters to zero out the consumption from the grid. Be cool if it works like I think it will! Jehu Garcia had a power wall by his ac condenser at one point that would kick on any time the condenser unit did for a similar setup. But I think he was primarily doing load shifting away from peak rates not using solar.
That'd be sweet if it does! We'll see if you can nab another gateway :) Be super sweet If I could figure Powerline Communication protocol, and have a Pi do it, I haven't found much.
Is it possible to charge with micro-inverter 48V LiFePO4 batteries using 48V LiFePO4 AC charger? Which AC charger to use? Is it even a good idea? For example as an installation on balconies in apartments. Or is it better to use conventional solar MPPT that are designed for this. I know that micro-inverters are designed as Grid-tie inverters ... Thank you for your answer.
Yes, this is typically done with an AC coupled inverter. These type of inverters will run backwards, and charge 48v battery bank from the micro inverters, when the bank is full it uses Frequency Shifting to slow down the production from the micro inverters.
Yes, as soon as Enphase micro inverters see 240 volt, they will start producing within about 5 minutes.All the gateway provides is the ability to see which individual panel / inverter is producing via a computer or your cell app. But the gateway is not necessary for them to operate. As this poster demonstrated, you can take an amp reading and times it by your voltage (usually 240) and see what that one panel is producing. Or, you can go to your utility meter and see the change in kWh delivered or received.
Each panel will need a micro-inverter. Then each micro plugs into an Enphase trunk cable. Depending on the wattage of panel and type of Enphase inverter, you can have up to around 16 panels / inverters per trunk cable. Each trunk cable should be protected at 20 amps.
So I hooked a string inverter (LV-6048) into my main panel. It's a split-phase. This inverter is able to power the whole panel with no problem. I've ran all sorts of equipment such as lights, a TV, video game console, EV Charger, etc. Everything works perfectly. With the panel up and running, I connected my Enphase IQ7 microinverter into the panel hoping it sees LV-6048 power as grid power. Well, surprisingly, it worked! The IQ7 moved from red blinking light to orange. However -- when I put a load on the panel, the IQ7 does NOT contribute in terms of power output. Only LV-6048 power is used. I'm able to confirm this via my clamp meter on the IQ7 cable. LV-6048 is connected into the panel via a 50-AMP double pole breaker. My IQ7 is connected via a 30-AMP double pole breaker. Not sure if that matters?
my experience with grid tie inverters, is IF your making more power then the motor or what ever takes and you turn the breaker off, The grid tie inverter still thinks its on the grid and keeps producing
Apparently the iq8 can do off grid ac power direct so u can hook up to a power lead can u help me out trying to find something that can do AC directly from solar without grid tie and batterys
I was thinking maybe the timer runs a relay and when it's time to turn the pump on the grid power would be utilized to run only the coil of the relay which could then allow the solar power system to power the pump. I'm still learning about micro inverters. Do you think this is possible using only the microinverter and a relay?
@@FTOTF1 It's not necessary. All you need to do is hook it up like I have on the timer. The micro inverter does not produce anything unless is senses the grid. The grid provides the micro inverter the AC frequency. Without the grid there is no frequency to sync to, and thus the micro inverter will not start. So it can literally be connected directly to the pump, and it will not try to run it until the grid is present, which happens when the timer is on. Thanks
But how to make it start if grid is not present? especially if being in an off grid situation? as I want to be able to run my pump directly form the solar panel and micro inverter.
2 Silly questions: (1) How do you make these work if your home is single phase? I live in an old home and only have have 1 hot 1 neutral coming form the pole, instead of 2 hots. 2 hots would give me 240V in my panel, but I only have 120V throughout the whole house. (2) If the grid is active, and your solar is active as well, how does the house know to use solar instead of grid power? How does the house pick which power to use?
enphase doesn’t support 120v, but there are string inverters that do assuming you’re synced to the grid, your house will just pull power and if you need more than solar makes it comes over the meter. it has to do with resistance and impedance, it will get the local power first and any more power it will pull from the farther away source (a power plant somewhere)
This video is bs!!! I tried it! Had the exact same inverter And let it sit for 35 minutes, waiting for an amber light to come on, and nothing!!! So now I have to return the inverter and find a different solution
Sorry, the hub is not working because you don't know what you're doing. Please take this down anybody who uses this will destroy their equipment as you did. Nothing about this is right. Sorry dude try cutting grass.
Modular, direct to AC support via a piecemeal scalable-basis to lower the consumption of high draw appliances is an outstanding hack! Thanks for sharing.
Hello Brad. Your video reminded me of my first array I set up using the older M-215 Micro-Inverters back in 2013. I bought 6 250 watt Sharp panels and matched them with 6 Enphase M-215 inverters. It produced about 1200 watts in good sun. I connected my trunk cable to my old hot tub disconnect box. and protected the cable at 20 amps. I loved it so much I doubled it, then doubled it again, then didn't like how I was pushing the excess power to the utility, so I made plans and installed a large array on my roof. The city approved plans allowed me to apply for Net metering with the utility. Which then they will recognize the excess power I sent them. (Note that, without an approved net metering agreement with utility, your home and meter will allow power to be pushed to grid if your own home doesn't need it. But, they do not recognize the power that you send them. The meter will flat line rather than spin backwards so to speak. In other words, it looks like you're using no power to them, even though you might be sending the grid a few hundred watts. So it's best to use all you produce otherwise you are donating power as a gift. Of course it is highly recommended to draw a array permit plan up and go through the process of applying for net metering)
The meter might keep spinning as you push it back to the grid. The meter might spin at the speed your system pushing the electricity back. So you want to slow down the spinning rather than try to push back if you dont have the bi-directional meter.
Very clever idea. Made me wonder if something similar could be done by trying into the load side of an AC condenser contactor?
Any idea on how to make this work on a Pentair easy touch control system with a variable speed pump? The pump always has power to it (both line and loads hooked to the line side of relay). Because of the variable speed pump, it is designed to be hooked up that way. Does the inverter only allow solar power to flow when there is an amperage draw or just sensing 120/240?
Did successfully you enable the Power Export Limiting? What grid profile did you have to use?
Great stuff, thanks for sharing, so can you power up the micro inverters I got some IQ 6+ and 7 + and would like to power them up when the sun goes down or during power outages using one of my battery banks with an all in one inverter unit. Wonder if this is possible, it nice t be able to use the freaking PV system when the power is out!
You will need a battery with more capacity than your solar system and a ac coupling inverter.
Very helpful information, today i contacted solar panel with iq7 and I didn’t get any power, now I know why?!👍
Thanks
My new system is 31 405-watt Q Cell panels and 31 Enphase IQ8A Inverters, they offer a "SunLight Backup" mode. An interesting option for a "grid-tied" system.
Are you adding batteries since you already have the system controller
How did you extend the MC4 connector from the AC side to the meter? I'm considering the IQM+, but it seems like you need to buy separate MC4 connectors. I really dislike how companies use proprietary cables, forcing you to spend extra.
I'm very interested in a practical and not too expensive grid-tie inverter with limiter. I have a 2,000 watt Sunglow grid tie with limiter and it works like a charm. Even when I'm producing all the solar power that I am consuming, it still allows 5 watts of grid power in so as not to tip off the power company that I'm doing something I'm not supposed to be doing. The drawback is that it is a max of 2,000 watts. I've been looking for a 4,000 watt grid tie with limiter that is easy to program. I never thought about using individual micro inverters. I'm going to keep an eye on your channel.
What a great idea! You come up with some really cool stuff.
Thanks! Could do the same thing with the outdoor condenser unit on an air conditioner. Just hook it up to the back side of the contactor so they only produce when the compressor starts.
@@BradCagle Very smart, It will be interesting to see the connection time reduced with the hub setup
@@Roll2Videos I have one micro inverter that starts producing in seconds. I think they can be setup to look for the hub/gateway, probably by default they do not, and thus why the one starts so fast. But I can't verify this until I get a working hub, I guess that's the only way to get into configure the inverters.
Is it possible to add more microinverters and panels to the same load at the same connection point??
I actually have same setup for my pool pump but I’m using older enphase inverters and I have it wires in on the line side of the timer so ones my pool pump stops the inverter keep feeding the house so keeps power bill down a bit.
Nice. So your house is always using all the power, and you never export anything?
@@BradCagle I do export some times ones the pool pumps stop working and I’m not using much in the house, so then the power company gets free power for me but that’s fine with me I just want to make my pool pump running for free.
@@AlekseyK86you gotta be careful, some dumb meters will capture import and export power and you’ll end up paying the power company for the power you’re giving them
Hi I am off grid, I have a anker solex f3800
I 6 panels connected to it to charge but losing a ton of power over the cable, I have a set of 13 panels/micros (m250) after playing with them and speaking to nphase, they said, "the inverters will only produce when they can sample"
So my thought was to get a iq7+ just like you did, allow it to start producing and after it started, connect the rest of my m250, and sending to the solex's input, to start it's battery charging, I'll be losing a little bit of power over the conversions but not a lot over a cable that's my thoughts please leave any suggestions or comments you might think about
Can you use solar panel optimisers in offgrid system? I have 4kw panels feeding 24v into Victron 150/100 mppt, into AGM battery bank then into 3000w low frequency inverter. I have a mix of different panels and want to stop the lowest producing panel drag down the rest of array with it. Cheers
Will this work with the regular IQ7 or IQ8 inverters, or does it have to be the plus variants?
I'm interested in doing almost the same thing as you are, but with my mini split ac units. Thank you.
This will work with any micro inverter.
@@BradCagle thanks. I'll get a couple and see what happens.
I use 4- 400 watt panels straight to a 90 volt dc motor the pump is a aqua flo a series it is all brass, has the C56 frame 5/8 input shaft. using it for 5 years now, sunup to sundown 1 hp.
That's awesome!
My old pump was all brass like that. My only problem going DC with solar only like you have would be overnight freezing temps.
Thanks for the vid, what solar panel is that?
I think it's an old 305w 72cell Jinko
How can I get 120v from the 240v enphase?
Victron autotransformer
Sir, is there any AC output on the output of microinverter? Thanks
Yes, Enphase takes the DC from each panel and coverts it to AC 240 Volts.
I'll add this tidbit of info. You can buy used panels and used Enphase micros on the internet for cheap. The older micros like M-215 or M-250 work great, But some cities won't accept the older ones on permitted arrays. I just installed an array at my rental. I had a bunch of extra M-215 inverters, but the city said I had to use Enphase IQ-7 or IQ-8 newer type inverters. So I bought 24 used IQ-7 inverters and did it that way. The IQ line uses a different trunk cable also. Older M type Trunk cable uses a neutral and a ground in addition to the 2 hots for the 240 volts. The newer IQ cable just has the 2 hot wires for 240. Also, the LED on the inverters is helpful. Blinking red means they are not producing. Blinking amber means producing, but not reporting to an Envoy (envoys report each panels production to your phone and Enphase) Blinking green when it is producing and also talking to an Envoy.
What's the process to reuse an old Microinverter? Do you need to clear the serial from the original site?
@@tclaffey Regardless of whether a used Enphase inverter is still registered under another Enphase account or not, as soon as it is powered to 240 volts and has sun, it will begin to produce power. But as far as monitoring that inverter under your own Enphase enlighten account, after your envoy searches for micros connected, to then add them to your account if they are still registered to another, you would need to call Enphase and request those inverters to be released from previous accounts. I had to do this a few times, and they are pretty cooperative about it. They will sometimes scan to see how long it’s been since that micro has produced, and if it shows it’s been inactive for two or three or six months, it’s kinda obvious to them that it’s been removed from the previous system. Then you’re able to add it to your own and enlighten the system and monitor production. Note that I’ve never had to request the releasing of micros in the IQ line. I’ve only experienced requesting M series inverters to be released, but I imagine it works in the same way. You just explain to Enphase customer service that you bought a group of used inverters online and you wanted to now add them to your system. The easy way to know whether it’s still registered or not under another system occurs when you go to place the inverter on your graphics grid and it won’t be allowed to reside there. That’s when you know you have to call them and unassigned it. If the graphics allow you to place the inverter there then the inverter is already unassigned from previous owner and you don’t have to make the call.
@@MrJeffoff thanks for that info much appreciated
The way I understand it once the envoy-s is up and in "California rule 21" mode it will throttle the micro inverters to zero out the consumption from the grid. Be cool if it works like I think it will! Jehu Garcia had a power wall by his ac condenser at one point that would kick on any time the condenser unit did for a similar setup. But I think he was primarily doing load shifting away from peak rates not using solar.
That'd be sweet if it does! We'll see if you can nab another gateway :) Be super sweet If I could figure Powerline Communication protocol, and have a Pi do it, I haven't found much.
@@BradCagle I was doing some research on this a few months back. Will share some links (though I did not get into prototyping yet).
@@icarus901 Great!, send the links to bradcagleyt@gmail.com, youtube won't let you post them in the comments. Thanks
Rule 21 and constant export are different. Gateway can do no export
Is it possible to charge with micro-inverter 48V LiFePO4 batteries using 48V LiFePO4 AC charger? Which AC charger to use? Is it even a good idea? For example as an installation on balconies in apartments. Or is it better to use conventional solar MPPT that are designed for this. I know that micro-inverters are designed as Grid-tie inverters ... Thank you for your answer.
Yes, this is typically done with an AC coupled inverter. These type of inverters will run backwards, and charge 48v battery bank from the micro inverters, when the bank is full it uses Frequency Shifting to slow down the production from the micro inverters.
Is this only for grid tied? Im doing off grid.
Yes, you need grid for this. Thanks
so these micro inverters can work without the gateway?
Yes
Yes, as soon as Enphase micro inverters see 240 volt, they will start producing within about 5 minutes.All the gateway provides is the ability to see which individual panel / inverter is producing via a computer or your cell app. But the gateway is not necessary for them to operate. As this poster demonstrated, you can take an amp reading and times it by your voltage (usually 240) and see what that one panel is producing. Or, you can go to your utility meter and see the change in kWh delivered or received.
Great hack. Can these be paralleled to add more panels and get more power?
Each panel will need a micro-inverter. Then each micro plugs into an Enphase trunk cable. Depending on the wattage of panel and type of Enphase inverter, you can have up to around 16 panels / inverters per trunk cable. Each trunk cable should be protected at 20 amps.
So I hooked a string inverter (LV-6048) into my main panel. It's a split-phase. This inverter is able to power the whole panel with no problem. I've ran all sorts of equipment such as lights, a TV, video game console, EV Charger, etc. Everything works perfectly.
With the panel up and running, I connected my Enphase IQ7 microinverter into the panel hoping it sees LV-6048 power as grid power. Well, surprisingly, it worked! The IQ7 moved from red blinking light to orange. However -- when I put a load on the panel, the IQ7 does NOT contribute in terms of power output. Only LV-6048 power is used. I'm able to confirm this via my clamp meter on the IQ7 cable.
LV-6048 is connected into the panel via a 50-AMP double pole breaker. My IQ7 is connected via a 30-AMP double pole breaker. Not sure if that matters?
my experience with grid tie inverters, is IF your making more power then the motor or what ever takes and you turn the breaker off, The grid tie inverter still thinks its on the grid and keeps producing
Would this trick work with an A/C condenser?
Yes, if it is 240 volts. The Enphase inverter sees the voltage present and then starts producing.
May be a flow switch on the pump that will only allow MI to hook up on real flow.
Apparently the iq8 can do off grid ac power direct so u can hook up to a power lead can u help me out trying to find something that can do AC directly from solar without grid tie and batterys
What maximum watts can support by a single micro inverter?
They come in different wattage varieties. I think the largest one I've seen was over 700w
@@BradCagle better to choose hoymiles 😂😂
Iw ould put that thing on a transfer switch. If pump goes on use city power to hold relay/ transfer switch to run the solar
I'm not sure I follow?
I was thinking maybe the timer runs a relay and when it's time to turn the pump on the grid power would be utilized to run only the coil of the relay which could then allow the solar power system to power the pump. I'm still learning about micro inverters. Do you think this is possible using only the microinverter and a relay?
@@FTOTF1 It's not necessary. All you need to do is hook it up like I have on the timer. The micro inverter does not produce anything unless is senses the grid. The grid provides the micro inverter the AC frequency. Without the grid there is no frequency to sync to, and thus the micro inverter will not start. So it can literally be connected directly to the pump, and it will not try to run it until the grid is present, which happens when the timer is on. Thanks
But how to make it start if grid is not present? especially if being in an off grid situation? as I want to be able to run my pump directly form the solar panel and micro inverter.
may i request the schematic diagram using microinverter?
Bro,get a variable speed pump. I run my 1 1/2 hp pump and draw about 225 watts for most of 18 hrs a day. Keeps my 30,000 gal pool crystal clear.
Yeah, I need one bad! Thanks :)
2 Silly questions:
(1)
How do you make these work if your home is single phase? I live in an old home and only have have 1 hot 1 neutral coming form the pole, instead of 2 hots. 2 hots would give me 240V in my panel, but I only have 120V throughout the whole house.
(2)
If the grid is active, and your solar is active as well, how does the house know to use solar instead of grid power? How does the house pick which power to use?
enphase doesn’t support 120v, but there are string inverters that do
assuming you’re synced to the grid, your house will just pull power and if you need more than solar makes it comes over the meter. it has to do with resistance and impedance, it will get the local power first and any more power it will pull from the farther away source (a power plant somewhere)
Great
If you do your system like that then the cost would be lowered to at least 1/3 cuz you dont need the hub
Lastly, All Enphase M series and Q series will go dead if they see no power present. Instant shut down for safety.
This video is bs!!!
I tried it!
Had the exact same inverter
And let it sit for 35 minutes, waiting for an amber light to come on, and nothing!!!
So now I have to return the inverter and find a different solution
Sorry, the hub is not working because you don't know what you're doing. Please take this down anybody who uses this will destroy their equipment as you did. Nothing about this is right. Sorry dude try cutting grass.
I take it down immediately 🤣 Thanks
Can you go into further details on what exactly he did wrong?