If I were to take a complete guess on Dan's tier based on what I currently know, he'd probably be A. But remember, we don't actually know a new character's tier for a while, since it depends on the totality of their matchups which haven't been explored yet.
I agree based on feel. He has the 'feel' of an A tier, but his matchup chart will demonstrate where he really lies. I expect low A or high B since he struggles with a few rough zoning matchups, like zeku and dhalsim. Zeku being a pretty good character that a lot of people use doesn't help him there. Surprisingly Sagat is not that difficult for him, I'd guess it's about even from my experience. Sagat cant bully him with high shot like he can other characters, since VS1 clears under it reliably
These characters got nerfed to the point that they're 1 foot out of the game... BUT the game is VERY BALANCE!! WTF??? 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤬🤬🤬 That makes zero sense after every balance patch to characters who've been consistantly being nerfed to that point and Dhalsim is 1 of those characters.
we love you Bafael. Thank you for all your hard work and care with these high quality videos. Also stop trying to pretend Sakura isn’t way better than that, we can hear it in your voice.
i was so excited for dan. after playing 300+ matches, i think i like blanka more. ty dan for teaching me neutral and cross cut dp but im ready to do random blanka balls and slides again.
I’m really impressed with just how balanced of a mechanic V-shift seems to be. Good job Capcom. I hear Tokido is trying out Balrog and with -4 being such a meme, I have a feeling Balrog is going to be the new complained about character. Also, pour one out for Juri and Gill mains. They barely got any buffs to their kits when could use some shake ups while lots of other low tiers got some nice buffs or cool tools.
It is pretty funny seeing people freak out at Juri's capabilities with the influx of new players, even though most of the cool stuff is things that she already had lmao. New VS2 stuff is super sick at least.
Blessed by baf Thanks for the awesome insights. Really helps someone like me who can *feel* what's good or bad about character but cant explain it. You're a gem
Slowly but surely v shift will be a very core part of sfv imo, the highest level is starting to use it really effective and makes the matches very interesting!
Don't really play sf5 anymore, but I always appreciated the videos you would put out. And a still do; I still find them enjoyable to watch even though I won't get any use out of it. Every community needs a guy like you.
Similar to Kolin's hail you could've mentioned how Ibuki's VS2 and Gil VT2 are noticeably worse now thanks to vshift. I would say all type of meaty projectile type setup that hits after setting up for oki are worse now. There's also the fact that all characters that have a parry can punish vshift break really hard if the opponent does it on light or medium buttons. So that's another thing to keep in mind.
Thanks for all the hard work, first and foremost! And yeah, as someone that's stuck with the game through thick and thin, right now feels like the game is in a really, really good spot, and I don't have nearly as many "Exceptions" that I have to apply when saying I really enjoy playing the game. I'm also glad that VShift is turning out to just be a good defensive option that works in conjunction with V-Reversal, while both having their uses. If they could just fix the online issues, we'd be golden.
This is why we respect bafael, he actually is willing to think critically. I agree with this placement she isn’t this op character y’all make her out to be. She is a really solid high tier character with some good matchups but who is also extremely predictable and linear in her approach.
I don't think my char loses to Cammy so I'm sure that affects my perception of her strength. She does hold up nicely against everyone and she has entertained a lot of success basically since release
@@LeChina predictable? You can't predict mixups, and she puts you in safe mixups constantly with her incredible frame trap and throw game, specially if you don't have a 3f. She gets in really easy, her neutral is scary af and she has a jump mixup with her divekick. She's an extremely complete character and v-shift greatly enhances her gameplan (basically, you can't v-break on her since her pressure is based on lights and throws, and her v-shift is great because of her outstanding whiff punish buttons and super fast CA). She's top this season, mark my words.
I’m a Juri main and I kinda agree with the placement. I’m not into resource management characters like juri but I’m just happy she’s viable in a sense. Hope that in coming patches will make her more viable. If Juri is loved by the community purely based on personality capcom should make her at least high tier. On another note those juri costumes are fire can’t wait to try em out.
Great video and series Baf. Dhalsim, while he benefits pretty well from v shift defensively, also suffers from it offensively quite a bit, while also receiving fairly significant nerfs in the patch, so I think he's the character in the worst place in the current season, which is a shame considering he already wasn't very popular. I do agree that almost every if not every character is viable right now, which is very nice. While I'm not a fan of V-Shift personally for how much it hurt heavy/guard break based mixups, it has been a valuable equalizer, which is nice. Dan is a super sick character, and a lot of the changes this patch are really fun and interesting ones. I'm looking forward to seeing where things go from here. EX Donkey > DP finally works in the corner after 3000 years, it's a good sign of things to come.
Most of the tier list I agree although I do see a lot of people punishing Akuma for his nerfs, it is too early to tell if this is it but I do see Akuma players struggle more with the Character. And Personally, I can't see Vega being the worst character in the game. Last season I remember Ultra David naming him the worst character just for him to show up in events and multiple CPT high placements, he has a command grab, really good neutral buttons, and only a few characters benefit more from V-shift as much in neutral as in defense. Still, I agree the game is really balanced so he (and the rest of the cast) is still viable, and the rise this game has had from its original version is outstanding. Thanks for all the videos.
Great series, tbh you helped my match up knowledge so much from just a bit of info. I'm surprised you thing Ed is bottom third. I'm no Ed expert, but he seems strong and able to deal with V-shift well
Damn, if I had known you were going to post a follow up video, I would've posted the extra 2 paragraphs of Alex stuff I know of. Falke is probably going to be sleeper top tier this time around. She seems like a genuinely new character with the air FB buffs. They'll probably adjust Ryu VT2 next patch. The damage extension+oki he gets from that follow up is insane for a 2 bar trigger and being a character that's not low health.
I’m a mega casual so I don’t really understand a lot of what is being said but this is still very helpful and informative. I would like to get better and my favorite character is Nash which sucks he’s low tier but still favorite nonetheless
Awesome material as always baf. These patch list videos truly helps players of all skill levels to better understand patch notes. I agree making a tier list now is kind of suspect given that the meta hasn't had much time to develop. But your aware of this and your actual tier list looks solid. That being said, damn Ryu and Honda in top 1/3? And I know you said ask me in a few months, but do you like the direction SFV took with Dan's gameplay? And is who is better. Blanka Chan or Saikyo Boy?
Okay, for G you should have put him higher because his cancels give him ways to do multi-layered mixups where you can fuck over vshift without giving up a grab option Very powerful
I see a lot of folks still put Chun way high up and I'm not sure I get why. I feel like the heavy kick legs oki going away (not just on neutral confirms but also vs1 juggles) as well as st lk being unusable as an aa (giving her an aa blind spot) have made her noticeably worse. She appreciates v shift but I don't see the buffs to vs2 mattering enough to compensate.
because there is no character so good that they win despite any failings of the player, tier lists are most often a measure of what tools a character has and how effective those tools are against the rest of the cast menat is hard, but you can learn and be OD in time.
really think your placement of seth is excessively low. character still has some of the best grounded neutral, safe buffers and no real need to hit confirm, 2 amazing v-skills and at least one amazing v-trigger (VT2 is still debatable). axe kick becoming less braindead does hurt the character, but it is still a viable tool for changing their jump arc and fucking with characters who are reliant on commital button anti-airs rather than DPs. combined with the fact that their ground game didn't see ANY nerfs whatsoever, i think it's excessive to say that seth is "way worse" in this version. character is probably still top 5 at worst imho.
I wish they did more with this update. I thought this would be the season Capcom would just go all out on SFV, giving more options for all characters to play with, but instead only some characters like Ryu and Sagat got that treatment. Akuma V-Trigger 2 and V-Skill 2 still useless. Urien V-Skill 1 and V-Trigger 2 still useless. Nash still doesn't have an invincible reversal. They took out Akuma's cool side switch combo. This is probably gonna be the last big update SFV will ever get, so this makes me a bit upset.
enjoyed watching all your videos on the new patch even if you accidently left some stuff out. I do have one question, what's up with the sloth slide you used in all these videos?
I used this image as my twitch icon for a long time: i.imgur.com/xEscT4o.jpg Combine the fact that I have no webcam, a lot of people all suddenly told me they saw me as a sloth. So I usually use a drawing of a sloth to represent me whenever I'm giving my direct opinion/take on something
@@Bafael ah ok, yeah. I do remember that. I remember watching a clip of your stuff on EventHubs a long while back. I thought maybe there was a bit of an inside joke behind it or something.
i feel like v-shift should have more recovery when its used. I think their goal here was to add an additional layer to hit/throw where spending vbar gets you out for free for the most part on hit but loses to throw but its rather hard to get a punish mid screen when you pick the throw option in anticipation of vshift and to stay safe on offense. Early thoughts here but this really hurts a lot of oki for certain characters that rely on it
I think if you could whiff a throw and still punish a v-shift it would utterly fail to be a good reversal option. It has to be good against the core mixup in general to justify its cost.
i give u props for making a tier list this early, i also like the fact that there is no C or D category wich makes sense now that every character is viable imo, but i have to question why u would put ryu so high, because while he received big damage buffs, ryu still suffer from the same bad mus
I never understood why Chun-li was always ranked so highly. I never see her place high in tournaments, I never see her in ranked, I never see her in Battle Lounges, and from my own limited experience playing with her or against friends who main her, she needs to work MUCH harder to get about the same results as the rest of the cast. I wonder what I'm missing, maybe I'd just need to watch a few high-level Chun-li players to get a better idea. Well, nevertheless, which I'm glad that overall more characters are viable and we should get more variety, I just wish this applied in my lower ranking too because now it's Ryus fucking everywhere, lol.
her activate combos and super are insane, and everything else about her is fantastic? By 'work harder' do you mean she can't jump? Because she has ch. fwd mp, ex-legs, and single hit confirm low to get conversions from neutral. 15 frame dash into a rapid-cancel special cancel 3f low, and conversions from oppressive normals once she pops v-trigger.
@@AlexanderKeithWhite Well, activate combos got nerfed way back by adding two stages of scaling on trigger. Sure she can _kinda_ get around that by having multi hits specials but it's nothing that no one else can't do. Hell, Ryu's new VT2 can get 400+ without any EX bar. By "work harder" I mean that those conversions rely on super strict timings and sometimes an incredibly precise charge management. You need VERY good execution skills to pull these off with little gain *compared* to other characters with similar gameplan. Like I said, maybe I've never ran into a skilled Chun-li player to see how good it really is, but for a supposedly high-tier character I don't see anyone playing her ever outside of Ortiz, lol.
I just don’t like the fact it’s heavy punch and medium kick to do V-shift, with the way my buttons are set up that is square and circle on a PS4 remote.
Personally I would made Cody king of the midtiers (or A in this case) due to his sheer damage output and V2 Robbery, but lack of good answers defensively except for V-shift/break. But that's just me, I will admit I am incredibly biased.
I’m a Sakura main myself, so I look to you for a lot of insight for the character. As a shoto, what makes her worse than Ryu, Sagat (not a true shoto I know, but close enough), and Kage though? Akuma I get, but I’d like to understand your thoughts on her compared to the others
A worse fireball and worse anti airs to cover that fireball is a little reason. I think also, she's not deep and she can't gimmick you, she has to win fair and square while chars like Akuma still have some flexibility and robbery even now. Sakura has great normals but I think she has to win off them rather than specials or trigger. Sakura may be sleeper S tho lol.
@@Bafael Makes sense to me, and I can see how Sagat and Ryu get more reward for playing “fair and square” like her, while Kage has dirtier stuff like Akuma. Think there are any new bad matchups for her this season?
Hey I'm new to sf and I love your channel. I have to ask though, I main cody and I dont know how to do a Hpunch into ex zonk knuckle. Holding down ex zonk disables all the punch buttons so I cant really combo into it lol. Great vid btw
Blanka got a lot of buffs but I don't think any single buff really significantly helped him. He's one of the hardest chars to place cuz he has a few "top tier" things and a lot of Blanka mains swear he's sleeper top tier. But he hasn't had much success yet. I can see him being mid A if people took him more seriously.
@Bafael, how do you have cammy mid/high mid this patch and last patch? I'm not even doubting it, because my 'feel' that she's top tier is based a lot on ignorance. I don't really understand what her weaknesses are, where her strengths seem pretty overwhelming (oki, mobility, conversion, poke, vt, super). Does she have a slew of bad matchups or do you feel that her kit is deficient in either utility or reward when compared to Akuma Rashid Urien?
I just feel that she's one dimensional, and while she usually has a super optimal way to play there's similarly an optimal way to play against her. I think on paper her trigger is really good for conversions but in practice it just forces the opponent to take two throws. Once you know when you're allowed to press after blocking different divekicks, it's kind of hard for her to really push a mixup, and besides the divekick she doesn't have much else.
The only significant nerf I see for Chun is HK legs having worse okizeme, but she still has oki on spinning bird kick. I think she's still overall better than before HK legs knocked down, and back then I maybe would have had her in high A or low S. Her neutral is very strong against most chars, and I think she's hard to counterpick while being strong against many chars herself.
@@Bafael thanks for taking the time to reply! Your breakdown makes sense. I see some saying she's also one of the characters who benefits most from V-shift. What are your thoughts on that?
@@Saxandfifths yeah ex legs is a super reliable and safe thing to do after vshift, it'll get the punish regardless of range and if there wasn't enough time to punish you're only -2. It's very good there.
Baf, can you explain your new position for Falke? I'm thinking of picking her up this season and would like to hear your reasoning behind her placement
I play falke casually and I just feel like she's one of the premier defensive chars this season. A lot of chars really seem to struggle vs her in neutral. She's got really solid anti airs and can put up a very slow safe wall with her great buttons. The low strong buff is very nice and obnoxious this season while her triggers are the best they've been. She's got more reliable confirms, higher damage, better mixup... Basically every part of her kit has gotten better every patch and now I think she's well rounded with some really strong areas against chars who can't move in well against her.
I’m surprised you think Seth suffered so much; Axe Kick went from insane to a reasonable tool and he can’t fake throw loop but most everything else was about the same. I guess V Shift was your reasoning; it does allow you to OS his turn stealing.
Yes, because the starters for it all seem to be incredibly spacing specific. Every setup I've seen requires basically the corner and a dizzy to get it going.
Why seth so low? He lost a lot but after playing him a bit I still think he's top tier. The axe kick pressure is gone but he still has so many options especially with v trigger 1.
Aegis is just as good on hit lol. And because you have to go neutral to vshift, stuff like cr lk or cr mk bouncing opponent off the mirror ends up being a mixup when trying to escape it. But I think uriens high placement isn't dependent on his aegis overall even though I do think it is worse in the new system
I lose badly against Sakura with my (plat) Akuma so I would really like to know about why you think Akuma is a bad match up for Sakura so that I can figure out what I have been doing wrong. I try to play the neutral but she seem to have a much better neutral in general, especially with that damned LK of hers whiff punishing everything as well as some of my normals that are usually safe on block
Sakura's walk speed is the best in the game, easy to get shimmied by her, whiff moves against her etc. As for getting punished on block, you need to learn some frame data to learn when you'll get punished for using a specific move in a given matchup
Street Fighter V is in a good spot now. I may dare say that it's a "good" Street Fighter with the addition of the V-Shift mechanic. It still lacks creative expression through the combo system and still feels stale at times but, I can't in good conscience say that this game is bad anymore. If Capcom could maybe add some more robust combo options and address the netcode, this game could actually go down as one of the better SF games but... I'm not gonna hold my breath on that. Either way, I like the game a lot more than I did 5 years ago.
@@Demon_Curse Invincible back dashes actually pissed a lot of players off, along with the insane amounts of option selects in the game. Most of the SF community's complaints about SF4 resulted in SF5. I personally didn't like SF4 but, I thought it was a good game. Also according to Gunfight(who was living in Japan at the time)Japan hated Street Fighter 4 toward the end of its life span referring to it as "yabaigemu" or "Shitty Game" in English. I think both games have flaws but, the FGC always hates the current version of Street Fighter while the previous version is look back fondly upon even though it was shitted on at the time.
Never mind the netcode in SFV lol. It's already too late. Let's just hope SFVI have better netcode or no fix comes out since it's IP power is too strong for Capcom to care since people will still buy SF, regardless if the online unplayable or playable.
Honda is a huge winner of the patch, but I think he still has too many bad matchups to be considered top third of the cast. I main him though so very biased take lol.
it looks so weird to have seth even close to a bottom half of a tier list even if I shouldn't be taking too seriously. IDK I just hope the characters perception switches from ez wins char to ez to play character.
![SAFEPLANET - ดาวเคราะห์ [ THE PLANET ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4X1XL3I_k3c/mqdefault.jpg)
If I were to take a complete guess on Dan's tier based on what I currently know, he'd probably be A. But remember, we don't actually know a new character's tier for a while, since it depends on the totality of their matchups which haven't been explored yet.
I agree based on feel. He has the 'feel' of an A tier, but his matchup chart will demonstrate where he really lies. I expect low A or high B since he struggles with a few rough zoning matchups, like zeku and dhalsim. Zeku being a pretty good character that a lot of people use doesn't help him there. Surprisingly Sagat is not that difficult for him, I'd guess it's about even from my experience. Sagat cant bully him with high shot like he can other characters, since VS1 clears under it reliably
@@yikes6758 dan doesnt strugle against sagat? Huh, thats neat considering dan's story
These characters got nerfed to the point that they're 1 foot out of the game... BUT the game is VERY BALANCE!! WTF??? 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤬🤬🤬 That makes zero sense after every balance patch to characters who've been consistantly being nerfed to that point and Dhalsim is 1 of those characters.
As a non SFV player, the SF community is really lucky to have you. No one else puts in the work like this, god bless.
There’s a couple I could name but your on the right track😉
I really don't want to undervalue some of the other content creators out there, but Bafael s*** really is 10/10 s***.
Oh hey, my Birdie combo route got mentioned! That’s validating. Great series Baf!
Nice find bud! Congrats
That was you? Sick. Where did you show your combo originally?
The list of *Viable* characters definitely got a buff
the youtuber we need not the one we deserve
Yeah something like that
Bafael, you're a treasure to the SF5 community. Thanks for all your hard work
we love you Bafael. Thank you for all your hard work and care with these high quality videos. Also stop trying to pretend Sakura isn’t way better than that, we can hear it in your voice.
What? Bafael missed a couple thing while pumping out a gajillion videos in, like, a week? So he IS human after all!
Ryu
Rayoo
raiyu
This is the path of my destiny
From Streets
go beyond the battle
happy to be one of the 5 Alex players that told you what you missed :D
i was so excited for dan. after playing 300+ matches, i think i like blanka more. ty dan for teaching me neutral and cross cut dp but im ready to do random blanka balls and slides again.
@@Joseph-zw6wm hehe
@@Joseph-zw6wm hehe
@@Joseph-zw6wm hehe
@@Joseph-zw6wm eating glue can be fun
Thanks for the awesome work! it's crazy how much characters have change in this season! take care Bafael! Yo da man! take care!
Thank you for all this coverage my guy
I’m really impressed with just how balanced of a mechanic V-shift seems to be. Good job Capcom.
I hear Tokido is trying out Balrog and with -4 being such a meme, I have a feeling Balrog is going to be the new complained about character. Also, pour one out for Juri and Gill mains. They barely got any buffs to their kits when could use some shake ups while lots of other low tiers got some nice buffs or cool tools.
It is pretty funny seeing people freak out at Juri's capabilities with the influx of new players, even though most of the cool stuff is things that she already had lmao. New VS2 stuff is super sick at least.
Honestly the -4 buff was really unnecessary. Everything else was cool though
@@cuhloudy don’t let Brian hear you say that
Thank you so much for all of these videos, really looking forward to everything you put out later! We’re really lucky to have content like this.
Blessed by baf
Thanks for the awesome insights. Really helps someone like me who can *feel* what's good or bad about character but cant explain it. You're a gem
Best informative sfv content in my opinion.. Keep it up.. Birdie main showing luv and Respect 🙏🏽
Slowly but surely v shift will be a very core part of sfv imo, the highest level is starting to use it really effective and makes the matches very interesting!
Don't really play sf5 anymore, but I always appreciated the videos you would put out. And a still do; I still find them enjoyable to watch even though I won't get any use out of it. Every community needs a guy like you.
Super in depth while also considering and trying to answer as many possibilities as possible. Another great vid baf.
Great video series man
Please make a video on how to counter enemy V-shifts, as the shifting metagame seems complex. With respect.
u are literally the hardest working sf channel. ty for all the content and insight
Similar to Kolin's hail you could've mentioned how Ibuki's VS2 and Gil VT2 are noticeably worse now thanks to vshift. I would say all type of meaty projectile type setup that hits after setting up for oki are worse now.
There's also the fact that all characters that have a parry can punish vshift break really hard if the opponent does it on light or medium buttons. So that's another thing to keep in mind.
Thanks for all the hard work, first and foremost!
And yeah, as someone that's stuck with the game through thick and thin, right now feels like the game is in a really, really good spot, and I don't have nearly as many "Exceptions" that I have to apply when saying I really enjoy playing the game. I'm also glad that VShift is turning out to just be a good defensive option that works in conjunction with V-Reversal, while both having their uses.
If they could just fix the online issues, we'd be golden.
I'm not even a huge SFV fan, but these were really well done, fantastic job my dude!
That cammy placement is nothing short of criminal.
This is why we respect bafael, he actually is willing to think critically. I agree with this placement she isn’t this op character y’all make her out to be. She is a really solid high tier character with some good matchups but who is also extremely predictable and linear in her approach.
@@LeChina Most of the people who complain about Cammy just don't understand her so they get blown up a lot.
No way. Cammy clearly needs more buffs.
I don't think my char loses to Cammy so I'm sure that affects my perception of her strength. She does hold up nicely against everyone and she has entertained a lot of success basically since release
@@LeChina predictable? You can't predict mixups, and she puts you in safe mixups constantly with her incredible frame trap and throw game, specially if you don't have a 3f. She gets in really easy, her neutral is scary af and she has a jump mixup with her divekick. She's an extremely complete character and v-shift greatly enhances her gameplan (basically, you can't v-break on her since her pressure is based on lights and throws, and her v-shift is great because of her outstanding whiff punish buttons and super fast CA).
She's top this season, mark my words.
I’m a Juri main and I kinda agree with the placement. I’m not into resource management characters like juri but I’m just happy she’s viable in a sense. Hope that in coming patches will make her more viable. If Juri is loved by the community purely based on personality capcom should make her at least high tier.
On another note those juri costumes are fire can’t wait to try em out.
Great video and series Baf. Dhalsim, while he benefits pretty well from v shift defensively, also suffers from it offensively quite a bit, while also receiving fairly significant nerfs in the patch, so I think he's the character in the worst place in the current season, which is a shame considering he already wasn't very popular. I do agree that almost every if not every character is viable right now, which is very nice. While I'm not a fan of V-Shift personally for how much it hurt heavy/guard break based mixups, it has been a valuable equalizer, which is nice. Dan is a super sick character, and a lot of the changes this patch are really fun and interesting ones. I'm looking forward to seeing where things go from here.
EX Donkey > DP finally works in the corner after 3000 years, it's a good sign of things to come.
Thanks for all the hard work, Baf. Loved the whole series. 👍🏿
Loved this series, man. Lots of info about the new stuff.
Glad to hear how much you’re enjoying the game baf. It really does feel like a good time to be a fighting game player
Such a deluxe quality overview!
Thank you for your work Baf!
Most of the tier list I agree although I do see a lot of people punishing Akuma for his nerfs, it is too early to tell if this is it but I do see Akuma players struggle more with the Character. And Personally, I can't see Vega being the worst character in the game. Last season I remember Ultra David naming him the worst character just for him to show up in events and multiple CPT high placements, he has a command grab, really good neutral buttons, and only a few characters benefit more from V-shift as much in neutral as in defense. Still, I agree the game is really balanced so he (and the rest of the cast) is still viable, and the rise this game has had from its original version is outstanding. Thanks for all the videos.
Great series, tbh you helped my match up knowledge so much from just a bit of info.
I'm surprised you thing Ed is bottom third. I'm no Ed expert, but he seems strong and able to deal with V-shift well
Damn, if I had known you were going to post a follow up video, I would've posted the extra 2 paragraphs of Alex stuff I know of. Falke is probably going to be sleeper top tier this time around. She seems like a genuinely new character with the air FB buffs. They'll probably adjust Ryu VT2 next patch. The damage extension+oki he gets from that follow up is insane for a 2 bar trigger and being a character that's not low health.
loved these patch note vids tysm!
Now I'm kinda excited for the next patch right at the tail end of the game's life, they are sure to go aboslutely bonkers
Great vid Baf! Cant wait for the Dan vid!
The VS2 tc for Necalli into stomp is cool, lets him get his super off if you want to confirm a K.O.
Thanks for everything Baf.
Zeku is S tier for sure, that young zeku st.lk into ex slide is huge and v-shift helps young zeku a lot
I’m a mega casual so I don’t really understand a lot of what is being said but this is still very helpful and informative. I would like to get better and my favorite character is Nash which sucks he’s low tier but still favorite nonetheless
Super helpful video as usual
I also enjoyed this series and hope to see some new vids on the upcoming DLC, if you have the interest and time for them.
Awesome material as always baf. These patch list videos truly helps players of all skill levels to better understand patch notes.
I agree making a tier list now is kind of suspect given that the meta hasn't had much time to develop. But your aware of this and your actual tier list looks solid.
That being said, damn Ryu and Honda in top 1/3?
And I know you said ask me in a few months, but do you like the direction SFV took with Dan's gameplay?
And is who is better. Blanka Chan or Saikyo Boy?
It’s fascinating to come back to this and see Cammy as mid tier when she became almost universally considered the best character in the game.
I wish Vega got better but overall, I really like this balance patch.
Wow, Ryu is S-tier, now.
And the best character in the game according to Bafael, is the character I have the most trouble using.
This is awesome!!
Okay, for G you should have put him higher because his cancels give him ways to do multi-layered mixups where you can fuck over vshift without giving up a grab option
Very powerful
I see a lot of folks still put Chun way high up and I'm not sure I get why. I feel like the heavy kick legs oki going away (not just on neutral confirms but also vs1 juggles) as well as st lk being unusable as an aa (giving her an aa blind spot) have made her noticeably worse. She appreciates v shift but I don't see the buffs to vs2 mattering enough to compensate.
Man legit put my main Vega at last, did him dirty 😭
Vega is useless; sad but true.
Menat so high, yet i keep struggling to use her effectively. i dont even know what's her best V-Skills and V-Triggers lol
because there is no character so good that they win despite any failings of the player, tier lists are most often a measure of what tools a character has and how effective those tools are against the rest of the cast menat is hard, but you can learn and be OD in time.
Ily you baf
really think your placement of seth is excessively low. character still has some of the best grounded neutral, safe buffers and no real need to hit confirm, 2 amazing v-skills and at least one amazing v-trigger (VT2 is still debatable). axe kick becoming less braindead does hurt the character, but it is still a viable tool for changing their jump arc and fucking with characters who are reliant on commital button anti-airs rather than DPs. combined with the fact that their ground game didn't see ANY nerfs whatsoever, i think it's excessive to say that seth is "way worse" in this version.
character is probably still top 5 at worst imho.
Honestly curious as to why you put Ed there. As I've seen Ed placed in so many different sports for so many people to be honest
I wish they did more with this update. I thought this would be the season Capcom would just go all out on SFV, giving more options for all characters to play with, but instead only some characters like Ryu and Sagat got that treatment.
Akuma V-Trigger 2 and V-Skill 2 still useless. Urien V-Skill 1 and V-Trigger 2 still useless. Nash still doesn't have an invincible reversal. They took out Akuma's cool side switch combo. This is probably gonna be the last big update SFV will ever get, so this makes me a bit upset.
enjoyed watching all your videos on the new patch even if you accidently left some stuff out. I do have one question, what's up with the sloth slide you used in all these videos?
I used this image as my twitch icon for a long time: i.imgur.com/xEscT4o.jpg
Combine the fact that I have no webcam, a lot of people all suddenly told me they saw me as a sloth. So I usually use a drawing of a sloth to represent me whenever I'm giving my direct opinion/take on something
@@Bafael ah ok, yeah. I do remember that. I remember watching a clip of your stuff on EventHubs a long while back.
I thought maybe there was a bit of an inside joke behind it or something.
i feel like v-shift should have more recovery when its used. I think their goal here was to add an additional layer to hit/throw where spending vbar gets you out for free for the most part on hit but loses to throw but its rather hard to get a punish mid screen when you pick the throw option in anticipation of vshift and to stay safe on offense. Early thoughts here but this really hurts a lot of oki for certain characters that rely on it
I think if you could whiff a throw and still punish a v-shift it would utterly fail to be a good reversal option. It has to be good against the core mixup in general to justify its cost.
Can you do a break down of The new Kof the same way to did this?
youre the best baf
i give u props for making a tier list this early, i also like the fact that there is no C or D category wich makes sense now that every character is viable imo, but i have to question why u would put ryu so high, because while he received big damage buffs, ryu still suffer from the same bad mus
I never understood why Chun-li was always ranked so highly. I never see her place high in tournaments, I never see her in ranked, I never see her in Battle Lounges, and from my own limited experience playing with her or against friends who main her, she needs to work MUCH harder to get about the same results as the rest of the cast. I wonder what I'm missing, maybe I'd just need to watch a few high-level Chun-li players to get a better idea.
Well, nevertheless, which I'm glad that overall more characters are viable and we should get more variety, I just wish this applied in my lower ranking too because now it's Ryus fucking everywhere, lol.
her activate combos and super are insane, and everything else about her is fantastic? By 'work harder' do you mean she can't jump? Because she has ch. fwd mp, ex-legs, and single hit confirm low to get conversions from neutral. 15 frame dash into a rapid-cancel special cancel 3f low, and conversions from oppressive normals once she pops v-trigger.
@@AlexanderKeithWhite Well, activate combos got nerfed way back by adding two stages of scaling on trigger. Sure she can _kinda_ get around that by having multi hits specials but it's nothing that no one else can't do. Hell, Ryu's new VT2 can get 400+ without any EX bar.
By "work harder" I mean that those conversions rely on super strict timings and sometimes an incredibly precise charge management. You need VERY good execution skills to pull these off with little gain *compared* to other characters with similar gameplan.
Like I said, maybe I've never ran into a skilled Chun-li player to see how good it really is, but for a supposedly high-tier character I don't see anyone playing her ever outside of Ortiz, lol.
Lol, Charlie got buffed but still remains in the last Non-Dan tier.
I think you forgot to mention that Nash got some buffs to his V-Skill 2. Ex-scythe now does 180 damage.
Well_Done
I just don’t like the fact it’s heavy punch and medium kick to do V-shift, with the way my buttons are set up that is square and circle on a PS4 remote.
The baf abides.
Personally I would made Cody king of the midtiers (or A in this case) due to his sheer damage output and V2 Robbery, but lack of good answers defensively except for V-shift/break. But that's just me, I will admit I am incredibly biased.
I hope this means you'll be recording more sakura matches, I'd love to see how the buffs feel for you in practice
I’m a Sakura main myself, so I look to you for a lot of insight for the character. As a shoto, what makes her worse than Ryu, Sagat (not a true shoto I know, but close enough), and Kage though? Akuma I get, but I’d like to understand your thoughts on her compared to the others
A worse fireball and worse anti airs to cover that fireball is a little reason. I think also, she's not deep and she can't gimmick you, she has to win fair and square while chars like Akuma still have some flexibility and robbery even now. Sakura has great normals but I think she has to win off them rather than specials or trigger. Sakura may be sleeper S tho lol.
@@Bafael Makes sense to me, and I can see how Sagat and Ryu get more reward for playing “fair and square” like her, while Kage has dirtier stuff like Akuma. Think there are any new bad matchups for her this season?
@@mattiroquai64 Hard to say yet.
Alex beats mika? I think that’s up in the air still.
Hey I'm new to sf and I love your channel. I have to ask though, I main cody and I dont know how to do a Hpunch into ex zonk knuckle. Holding down ex zonk disables all the punch buttons so I cant really combo into it lol. Great vid btw
You only have to hold down 2 punches to do EX zonk lol, so you can hold down LP+MP.
@@Bafael ooooh shit thanks lol. I'm still tryna make it to silver lmao. This is the first street fighter I've tried in so it's hard but fun
@@Bafael any recommendations for doing this on pad? I kinda struggle with certain claw grips n stuff depending on the button combo
@@ADxTygon you can map lp+mp as your macro instead of all 3 punches.
@@Bafael thats a really good idea! i dont really ever rebind controls for fighting games so i hadnt considered it, thanks
I thought Blanka got buffed a lot? It's weird to see him in the "Around the same" category, but I don't really play the game so...
Blanka got a lot of buffs but I don't think any single buff really significantly helped him. He's one of the hardest chars to place cuz he has a few "top tier" things and a lot of Blanka mains swear he's sleeper top tier. But he hasn't had much success yet. I can see him being mid A if people took him more seriously.
@@Bafael I thought the buffs were much better than that, at least what I saw from HiFight's video led me to believe that
I still think yall are sleeping on zeku. I think young zeku getting a good ass defensive option while getting some good buffs def makes him top tier
Please what's your favorite Honda skin/color?
I wish SF5 had good netcode, because then I would play it.
@Bafael, how do you have cammy mid/high mid this patch and last patch? I'm not even doubting it, because my 'feel' that she's top tier is based a lot on ignorance. I don't really understand what her weaknesses are, where her strengths seem pretty overwhelming (oki, mobility, conversion, poke, vt, super). Does she have a slew of bad matchups or do you feel that her kit is deficient in either utility or reward when compared to Akuma Rashid Urien?
I just feel that she's one dimensional, and while she usually has a super optimal way to play there's similarly an optimal way to play against her. I think on paper her trigger is really good for conversions but in practice it just forces the opponent to take two throws. Once you know when you're allowed to press after blocking different divekicks, it's kind of hard for her to really push a mixup, and besides the divekick she doesn't have much else.
@@Bafael thank you. I've been saying this for years and everybody just "but pros say she's top tier" without any real explanation.
Hey, can you give some insight as to why you have Chun so high? I figured her placement would be lower after her recent nerfs.
The only significant nerf I see for Chun is HK legs having worse okizeme, but she still has oki on spinning bird kick. I think she's still overall better than before HK legs knocked down, and back then I maybe would have had her in high A or low S. Her neutral is very strong against most chars, and I think she's hard to counterpick while being strong against many chars herself.
@@Bafael thanks for taking the time to reply! Your breakdown makes sense. I see some saying she's also one of the characters who benefits most from V-shift. What are your thoughts on that?
@@Saxandfifths yeah ex legs is a super reliable and safe thing to do after vshift, it'll get the punish regardless of range and if there wasn't enough time to punish you're only -2. It's very good there.
Baf, can you explain your new position for Falke? I'm thinking of picking her up this season and would like to hear your reasoning behind her placement
I play falke casually and I just feel like she's one of the premier defensive chars this season. A lot of chars really seem to struggle vs her in neutral. She's got really solid anti airs and can put up a very slow safe wall with her great buttons. The low strong buff is very nice and obnoxious this season while her triggers are the best they've been. She's got more reliable confirms, higher damage, better mixup... Basically every part of her kit has gotten better every patch and now I think she's well rounded with some really strong areas against chars who can't move in well against her.
Honda in S? I know his buffs give him insane damage, but did he get anything to help him out in matchups he struggled in previously?
I think a lot of his buffs help him everywhere and I think he was a sleeper char before, idk if matchups are gatekeeping him though.
You’re great
Hey Baf, it has been a few months. What do you think of Dan during season 5 SFV?
He's fine, prob mid tier but maybe low end. His neutral with VS2 is very strange and strong, and I think a lot of people underrate him.
@@Bafael Gotcha. Thanks.
hey baf you should check out the new infinite meter glitch in second impact
Oh shit Ryu is in S-tier wow.
U didn’t know?
@@JSHADEGAMES nah I really thought he would be at least A-/A tier, but S‽ hmmmm...
I’m surprised you think Seth suffered so much; Axe Kick went from insane to a reasonable tool and he can’t fake throw loop but most everything else was about the same. I guess V Shift was your reasoning; it does allow you to OS his turn stealing.
Tbh I don't think Seth's mixup is all that good without dive kick and a pseudo throw loop propping it up.
Hey Baf, do you think it's possible for Dan to be a relatively balanced character in this game if they leave his infinite in?
Yes, because the starters for it all seem to be incredibly spacing specific. Every setup I've seen requires basically the corner and a dizzy to get it going.
Why seth so low? He lost a lot but after playing him a bit I still think he's top tier. The axe kick pressure is gone but he still has so many options especially with v trigger 1.
6:45 Urien is not that high with V shift nerfs to his Aegis
Aegis is just as good on hit lol. And because you have to go neutral to vshift, stuff like cr lk or cr mk bouncing opponent off the mirror ends up being a mixup when trying to escape it. But I think uriens high placement isn't dependent on his aegis overall even though I do think it is worse in the new system
I lose badly against Sakura with my (plat) Akuma so I would really like to know about why you think Akuma is a bad match up for Sakura so that I can figure out what I have been doing wrong.
I try to play the neutral but she seem to have a much better neutral in general, especially with that damned LK of hers whiff punishing everything as well as some of my normals that are usually safe on block
Akuma does everything Sakura can do but better. She doesn't have a distinct gameplan like in SF4 with tatsu loops.
Sakura's walk speed is the best in the game, easy to get shimmied by her, whiff moves against her etc. As for getting punished on block, you need to learn some frame data to learn when you'll get punished for using a specific move in a given matchup
Street Fighter V is in a good spot now. I may dare say that it's a "good" Street Fighter with the addition of the V-Shift mechanic. It still lacks creative expression through the combo system and still feels stale at times but, I can't in good conscience say that this game is bad anymore. If Capcom could maybe add some more robust combo options and address the netcode, this game could actually go down as one of the better SF games but... I'm not gonna hold my breath on that. Either way, I like the game a lot more than I did 5 years ago.
All it took was for Capcom to add a SF4 mechanic.
@@Demon_Curse Invincible back dashes actually pissed a lot of players off, along with the insane amounts of option selects in the game. Most of the SF community's complaints about SF4 resulted in SF5. I personally didn't like SF4 but, I thought it was a good game. Also according to Gunfight(who was living in Japan at the time)Japan hated Street Fighter 4 toward the end of its life span referring to it as "yabaigemu" or "Shitty Game" in English. I think both games have flaws but, the FGC always hates the current version of Street Fighter while the previous version is look back fondly upon even though it was shitted on at the time.
Never mind the netcode in SFV lol. It's already too late. Let's just hope SFVI have better netcode or no fix comes out since it's IP power is too strong for Capcom to care since people will still buy SF, regardless if the online unplayable or playable.
Honda is a huge winner of the patch, but I think he still has too many bad matchups to be considered top third of the cast. I main him though so very biased take lol.
it looks so weird to have seth even close to a bottom half of a tier list even if I shouldn't be taking too seriously. IDK I just hope the characters perception switches from ez wins char to ez to play character.
Better start grinding the Menat matchup.
Why is Seth that low? I don't think Seth is worse than Kage or Sakura
as an ibuki main she doesn't feel S tier anymore :(
"Ive been enjoing sf5 lately"
Plays sf3 for the previous 9 videos*
xD
*looks at Blanka*
wut