TH-cam enabled automatic closed captioning for this video and when the engine first starts, the closed caption simply states at 21:20, "[Music]." Exactly!
I bought a Jkson listeroid new but I've nevet bothered to set it up because i found a lovely original Lister 6/1 and preferred to rebuild that. The quality of the engineering is vastly superior to the Indian machine. The compression valve reduces load on the engine which the Indian machines dont have. Altogether a far more civilised engine. But you've done a great job on that Metro to get it going. Congrats.
I am glad I come across your video I have a engine and st gen just like it.After listen to what you found on your engine. I believe I will slow down and check it over good before I run it.I picked it up in 2007 and never did anything with it. Thank you for slowing me down.
If this video helped one person set up their generator and avoid costly mistakes, then it is completely worth the effort. Thank you for letting me know!
i have the same Metro 6/1 engine which i finally got running after it sat for a long time inside.... it runs well....i can't start it by myself so i have added a 12 volt motor starter pulley arrangement that works pretty well.....i have the generator (5 KW) which is bigger than necessary but it works....there was some initial difficulty because i had positioned the generator too far away from the flywheel and the belt tended to wander i'm old and frail now and the engine scares me so i built a protective sturdy 2 by 2 wood cage around it so that there is no chance of accidentally falling into the moving parts which would be lethal.... i also attached a long tripwire to the cutoff lever so that i could kill the engine from several feet away in case it ever showed a tendency to instability or runaway they recommend this engine be firmly bolted to a heavy concrete pad outside somewhere....my engine is in a small wooden shed bolted onto 4 by 6 treated wood timbers which are on a rubber mat which sits on a reinforced base of 2 by 4s on top of 3/4 inch plywood .... that all protects the shed and the engine this engine isn't for everybody...its heavy and imposing and dangerous and you need to be alert and careful all the time with it .... its a great hobby engine for teaching/learning basic diesel operation because you can overhaul every bit of the engine by yourself....it sounds perfectly lovely when in operation with a deep throaty chug chug chug that i could listen to all day with pleasure
Have you completed a more permanent setup for this? It may help long term reliability to mount the muffler away from the engine with a flex line in between the engine and the muffler (like they do with all cars) and if you are using that larger JD air filter...mount that on the wall with a rubber air intake hose (spiral wire reinforced) so the vibrations don't work at the pipe end in the head... The original way of muffling the exhaust was to lead it into a 55 gallon drum filled with large rocks and set in the ground (with a stack leading out and roof height) to really dissipate the sounds... There used to be lead lined anti vibration acoustic mat available that may help quieten down the valve train clacking...but it really does sound like a mechanical symphony... I have heard rumours that "air compressors" are now being imported.... with an injection pump being separately available for after import utility...😁😁
The permanent setup does have flex lines for the intake and exhaust. The setup in this video is not rigid, so I could get away with it. the whole exhaust system was gravity-mount with no fasteners so it worked okay. I have heard about the 55 galln drum muffler and was temped to try it, but didn't I used two chambers and baffles. (old 20-pound propane tanks!)
The free-standing radiators cool through convection to the air in the shop, doing the same job without the fan. But it really isn't much heat! The engine doesn't burn enough fuel to generate enough waste heat to amount to much. In the summer, that's great, but in the winter, it still stays cool in the shop.
What is your fuel consumption under load? Curious about the low RPM efficiency when compared to the higher RPM Diesel engines. Nice job on this generator setup
I wish I had a good answer for you. I've never done a good "static" analysis of it. I have it connected to my house and the load from that is continually variable. I've never just hooked up a 3kW resistive load and let it run for 6 hours to measured the fuel consumption. The 2 gallon fuel tank on the engine runs my house all day, but sometimes the house is drawing power for just a few computers and lights, and sometimes it's running the water pump, furnace and microwave. From what I've read, (take that for what it's worth) the fuel consumption is comparable to a same-output 1800RPM diesel in most load ranges (somewhat less at lower loads) and a bit superior to 3600RPM engines.
The fuel consumption is about 1 quart of fuel per kw hour running on #2 diesel - air cooled 3600 rpm engines burn about 1/3 of a gallon per kw an hour -
As for the air filter its more than sufficient for normal conditions - when mount saint helen was blowing they changed the air intake breathers to what were used on 500 hp atationary engines - also to bushings instead of roller bearings on the mains - roller bearings dont hold up well in sand areas so we replace them with bushing kits - In many cases we replace the oem govenor spring with a diffrent spring - the oem spring works well enough - at 650 to 850 RPMs - but at lower RPMs we use a spring with diffrent tention - the blow back is turmed by pass return fuel - Most of the fuel filters we used were simply a 3 inch pipe nipple with a screan on the bottom with a rag or toilet paper for a fuel filter - There used to maintain voltage on pipelines in the old oilfields - its to cancel electrolises - Newer fields use Arrow and Ajax engines in the US - be sure the key wedge is driven in tight ive seen them work loose at times - After 50 yrs my grandfather said he had nothing bad about those engines - If the engine was set up with a oil filter we used synthetic oil because we never changed the oil - On locomotives or many of the engines used in the oil fields and ships - the oil is never changed - just the filters - The make up oil acts as a oil change - they learned that during WW2 - I just use synthetic oil in every thing - with my service pick up trucks i just changed engines out at 500 thousand miles and rebuilt them and put the oil back in them -
Since these engines are 1.4L displacement I think a larger than needed exhaust system might cut down on the whooshing sound of the exhaust pipe, that and Diesels like free air flow anyhow
Nice build, I'm watching your/this video and one thing I didn't catch the first time was the horse stall mat being slicker than expected, which might be because of the silicone mold release that is used in the manufacturing process. When I use this mat, I glue it to a 1 foot plywood base, and found that it helps to scrub the mat with acetone and a wire stainless steel brush, now the glue sticks good.
I was wondering about that, too, but never went further investigating it. My mom has a working farm, and has some horse mats that have been out in the weather for 15 years. They are still just as slippery as this new one, so I figured it was probably just the rubber compound that these are made of, but never went to work with any solvents to find out for sure.
I found it with good luck and timing on Craigslist. They've been illegal for US import since (I think) 2009. For some reason, they don't meet modern Tier 4 emissions standards...! However, any that are already in the US, can still be used/repaired/etc. I was just in the right place, right time.
I wish I could. These engines are banned from import into the US now. (For some reason they don't meet Tier 4 emissions compliance...!) But you can still get them, and the generator head is available easily from lots of sources. I'd recommend this site listerengine.com/smf/ for more education, questions and leads. There is an Indian-import forum on that site filled with people who know a lot more than I do!
The are both the same, and should align opposite the position of the piston, that is, when both counterweights are at the 12:00 position, the piston should be at the very bottom of the stroke. The counterweights are to act against the force of the piston, connecting rod and crankshaft offset.
@@justinpoirier5285 my weights are 12 and 6 o’clock….I’m going to add weight to offset the 6 o’clock….to confirm my suspicion…plus a mat…should stop the dance routine…I had it bolted to cement…but the vibes are too violent.
Not at all. The engine and generator head were a package deal and came with a good number of spare parts. The original owner bought it for Y2K and was planning a veggie oil fuel system. Life got in the way, and he sold it to me for just around $3,200. I probably have another $500-$700 into it with the steel frame, replaced parts and decking the cylinder head, which was a bit out square from the factory.
Trying to put mine together! Would you mind if I messaged you somehow for some advice, I’m new to diesel engines and I’m not sure what some of my hardware is for. I have the general idea, there are just a few things I’m not sure about.
I dont know how much you have been running your engine - i do know if youd pulling 3 kw at some point you will eather have connecting rod bearing failures or you will brake the crank shaft - Im a forth generation generator and water pump tech - also i worked the the offshore and remote mountain oil and gas industry for yrs - There millions of those engined in service around the world - Many use 7% pilot fuel to ignight fuel gas as a spark plug does - others are set up to run on crude oil - they use a steel piston and run at 250° and use transformer oil for coolant - Oil engines have to be preheated to 180° to start and need the compression change over valve to reduce compression after starting - Also the hp is reduces 25% at full load - when there converted to oil engines there fuel efficency is 15:1 at 650 rpms and around 18:1 at 500 rpms - On diesel at 180° water it 4:1 efficency - i have 1000s of hours of run time on mine - i live in the rural south huricanes and ice storms can knock the power out for up to 8 months at times - It 416 watts per hp in put with a 12OV 60HZ genrator head - with 110V 50HZ its 333 watts per HP in put - with 12 to 48 volts DC its about 320 watts per HP - you loose around a hp to the belt drive - You can push more out the.engine but you will have failures to deal with - you would be better off adjusting the compression and timing and running it at 850 RPMs as a 8 HP engine - it will run up to 5 yrs 24/7 at 850 with out rebuilding it - Mine is set up at 500 RPM as a oil engine - running on oil there derated 25% - I would say to have a spare crank if your using it as a prime mover and pulling more than 50% continues - cranks do brake some times - most of the parts for those engines are inexpencive -
Great video. fm South Africa. It amazing what old time engineering is very applicable today. Great job.
Thank you! I appreciate that!
Your start list was easy to follow…I’m adding your horse pad….great tip….
Thank you for going thru the oil check list…mine has not been fired since purchase…
Check the inside of the engine for casting sand or other similar contamination. They don't often give them a thorough cleaning before they ship.
A couple of years late here, but I love these engines. Letting them run is a very relaxing experience
TH-cam enabled automatic closed captioning for this video and when the engine first starts, the closed caption simply states at 21:20, "[Music]." Exactly!
I bought a Jkson listeroid new but I've nevet bothered to set it up because i found a lovely original Lister 6/1 and preferred to rebuild that. The quality of the engineering is vastly superior to the Indian machine. The compression valve reduces load on the engine which the Indian machines dont have. Altogether a far more civilised engine. But you've done a great job on that Metro to get it going. Congrats.
I am glad I come across your video I have a engine and st gen just like it.After listen to what you found on your engine. I believe I will slow down and check it over good before I run it.I picked it up in 2007 and never did anything with it. Thank you for slowing me down.
If this video helped one person set up their generator and avoid costly mistakes, then it is completely worth the effort. Thank you for letting me know!
i have the same Metro 6/1 engine which i finally got running after it sat for a long time inside.... it runs well....i can't start it by myself so i have added a 12 volt motor starter pulley arrangement that works pretty well.....i have the generator (5 KW) which is bigger than necessary but it works....there was some initial difficulty because i had positioned the generator too far away from the flywheel and the belt tended to wander
i'm old and frail now and the engine scares me so i built a protective sturdy 2 by 2 wood cage around it so that there is no chance of accidentally falling into the moving parts which would be lethal.... i also attached a long tripwire to the cutoff lever so that i could kill the engine from several feet away in case it ever showed a tendency to instability or runaway
they recommend this engine be firmly bolted to a heavy concrete pad outside somewhere....my engine is in a small wooden shed bolted onto 4 by 6 treated wood timbers which are on a rubber mat which sits on a reinforced base of 2 by 4s on top of 3/4 inch plywood .... that all protects the shed and the engine
this engine isn't for everybody...its heavy and imposing and dangerous and you need to be alert and careful all the time with it .... its a great hobby engine for teaching/learning basic diesel operation because you can overhaul every bit of the engine by yourself....it sounds perfectly lovely when in operation with a deep throaty chug chug chug that i could listen to all day with pleasure
Where would I get one of these engines? I have been looking for something similar, and just can't find anything that is worth fixing.
9:55 Love the "sight tube" on fuel level.
Have you completed a more permanent setup for this?
It may help long term reliability to mount the muffler away from the engine with a flex line in between the engine and the muffler (like they do with all cars)
and if you are using that larger JD air filter...mount that on the wall with a rubber air intake hose (spiral wire reinforced) so the vibrations don't work at the pipe end in the head...
The original way of muffling the exhaust was to lead it into a 55 gallon drum filled with large rocks and set in the ground (with a stack leading out and roof height) to really dissipate the sounds...
There used to be lead lined anti vibration acoustic mat available that may help quieten down the valve train clacking...but it really does sound like a mechanical symphony...
I have heard rumours that "air compressors" are now being imported....
with an injection pump being separately available for after import utility...😁😁
The permanent setup does have flex lines for the intake and exhaust. The setup in this video is not rigid, so I could get away with it. the whole exhaust system was gravity-mount with no fasteners so it worked okay. I have heard about the 55 galln drum muffler and was temped to try it, but didn't I used two chambers and baffles. (old 20-pound propane tanks!)
Your correct on them being sold as air compressors - along with a conversion kit to a diesel engine -
You could run the cooling water through a radiator then power a fan from one the flywheels to heat the workshop.
The free-standing radiators cool through convection to the air in the shop, doing the same job without the fan. But it really isn't much heat! The engine doesn't burn enough fuel to generate enough waste heat to amount to much. In the summer, that's great, but in the winter, it still stays cool in the shop.
Excellent work Justin!!
What is your fuel consumption under load? Curious about the low RPM efficiency when compared to the higher RPM Diesel engines. Nice job on this generator setup
I wish I had a good answer for you. I've never done a good "static" analysis of it. I have it connected to my house and the load from that is continually variable. I've never just hooked up a 3kW resistive load and let it run for 6 hours to measured the fuel consumption. The 2 gallon fuel tank on the engine runs my house all day, but sometimes the house is drawing power for just a few computers and lights, and sometimes it's running the water pump, furnace and microwave. From what I've read, (take that for what it's worth) the fuel consumption is comparable to a same-output 1800RPM diesel in most load ranges (somewhat less at lower loads) and a bit superior to 3600RPM engines.
General rule of thumb,1/10 of a uk gallon per kwh
The fuel consumption is about 1 quart of fuel per kw hour running on #2 diesel - air cooled 3600 rpm engines burn about 1/3 of a gallon per kw an hour -
As for the air filter its more than sufficient for normal conditions - when mount saint helen was blowing they changed the air intake breathers to what were used on 500 hp atationary engines - also to bushings instead of roller bearings on the mains - roller bearings dont hold up well in sand areas so we replace them with bushing kits -
In many cases we replace the oem govenor spring with a diffrent spring - the oem spring works well enough - at 650 to 850 RPMs - but at lower RPMs we use a spring with diffrent tention - the blow back is turmed by pass return fuel -
Most of the fuel filters we used were simply a 3 inch pipe nipple with a screan on the bottom with a rag or toilet paper for a fuel filter -
There used to maintain voltage on pipelines in the old oilfields - its to cancel electrolises -
Newer fields use Arrow and Ajax engines in the US - be sure the key wedge is driven in tight ive seen them work loose at times -
After 50 yrs my grandfather said he had nothing bad about those engines -
If the engine was set up with a oil filter we used synthetic oil because we never changed the oil -
On locomotives or many of the engines used in the oil fields and ships - the oil is never changed - just the filters -
The make up oil acts as a oil change - they learned that during WW2 -
I just use synthetic oil in every thing - with my service pick up trucks i just changed engines out at 500 thousand miles and rebuilt them and put the oil back in them -
Thank you for this wealth of information! Real experience is something that I can never learn from a book!
@@justinpoirier5285 👍
Since these engines are 1.4L displacement I think a larger than needed exhaust system might cut down on the whooshing sound of the exhaust pipe, that and Diesels like free air flow anyhow
..and have the muffler near the end of the pipe .. not the beginning.
Nice build, I'm watching your/this video and one thing I didn't catch the first time was the horse stall mat being slicker than expected, which might be because of the silicone mold release that is used in the manufacturing process.
When I use this mat, I glue it to a 1 foot plywood base, and found that it helps to scrub the mat with acetone and a wire stainless steel brush, now the glue sticks good.
I was wondering about that, too, but never went further investigating it. My mom has a working farm, and has some horse mats that have been out in the weather for 15 years. They are still just as slippery as this new one, so I figured it was probably just the rubber compound that these are made of, but never went to work with any solvents to find out for sure.
where did you get this? I want one!
I found it with good luck and timing on Craigslist. They've been illegal for US import since (I think) 2009. For some reason, they don't meet modern Tier 4 emissions standards...! However, any that are already in the US, can still be used/repaired/etc. I was just in the right place, right time.
Nice narration! Easy machine to operate. Can you guide one on some resources to obtain one of these set up’s? A link? Thanks again! 💯👍
I wish I could. These engines are banned from import into the US now. (For some reason they don't meet Tier 4 emissions compliance...!) But you can still get them, and the generator head is available easily from lots of sources. I'd recommend this site listerengine.com/smf/ for more education, questions and leads. There is an Indian-import forum on that site filled with people who know a lot more than I do!
If your still looking let me know - I'll contact a manufacturer in India and pass on how to obtain one -
Can you check your flywheel counter weight location?
Are they on the same side or counter to each other…?
The are both the same, and should align opposite the position of the piston, that is, when both counterweights are at the 12:00 position, the piston should be at the very bottom of the stroke. The counterweights are to act against the force of the piston, connecting rod and crankshaft offset.
@@justinpoirier5285 my weights are 12 and 6 o’clock….I’m going to add weight to offset the 6 o’clock….to confirm my suspicion…plus a mat…should stop the dance routine…I had it bolted to cement…but the vibes are too violent.
I think the space heater on the left was not turned all the way to high..
You're right! I didn't notice that until I was editing the video and realized I missed a click when turning it on. Whoops!
Very cool, Would you be open to saying how much this engine cost?
Not at all. The engine and generator head were a package deal and came with a good number of spare parts. The original owner bought it for Y2K and was planning a veggie oil fuel system. Life got in the way, and he sold it to me for just around $3,200. I probably have another $500-$700 into it with the steel frame, replaced parts and decking the cylinder head, which was a bit out square from the factory.
@@justinpoirier5285 wow, that is intense. Pretty awesome machine though.
Great video thanks for posting
Thank you for the kind words and encouragement!
🎉thank you for your good work
Thank you for the kind comment!
Nicely done.
Thank you! I appreciate that!
Trying to put mine together! Would you mind if I messaged you somehow for some advice, I’m new to diesel engines and I’m not sure what some of my hardware is for. I have the general idea, there are just a few things I’m not sure about.
Smarter folks than me hang out at listerengine.com. That's where I go with my questions!
Great video!!!
Hey, thanks! Look! My video has a comment! I'm "trending" now!
@@justinpoirier5285 now you have two subscribers :)
@@joeryan6834 I can see I'm well on my way to quitting my day job!
Another subscriber!!!!!
Welcome to the madhouse!
I dont know how much you have been running your engine - i do know if youd pulling 3 kw at some point you will eather have connecting rod bearing failures or you will brake the crank shaft -
Im a forth generation generator and water pump tech - also i worked the the offshore and remote mountain oil and gas industry for yrs -
There millions of those engined in service around the world -
Many use 7% pilot fuel to ignight fuel gas as a spark plug does - others are set up to run on crude oil - they use a steel piston and run at 250° and use transformer oil for coolant -
Oil engines have to be preheated to 180° to start and need the compression change over valve to reduce compression after starting -
Also the hp is reduces 25% at full load - when there converted to oil engines there fuel efficency is 15:1 at 650 rpms and around 18:1 at 500 rpms -
On diesel at 180° water it 4:1 efficency -
i have 1000s of hours of run time on mine - i live in the rural south huricanes and ice storms can knock the power out for up to 8 months at times -
It 416 watts per hp in put with a 12OV 60HZ genrator head - with 110V 50HZ its 333 watts per HP in put - with 12 to 48 volts DC its about 320 watts per HP - you
loose around a hp to the belt drive -
You can push more out the.engine but you will have failures to deal with - you would be better off adjusting the compression and timing and running it at 850 RPMs as a 8 HP engine - it will run up to 5 yrs 24/7 at 850 with out rebuilding it -
Mine is set up at 500 RPM as a oil engine - running on oil there derated 25% -
I would say to have a spare crank if your using it as a prime mover and pulling more than 50% continues - cranks do brake some times - most of the parts for those engines are inexpencive -
Vented to atmosphere ? That's not california emmisions.
Sounds like real POS.
Ha! Yeah, "Tier 4 compliance" wasn't really the top worry of the day in the 1920s! But, haters will be haters...