He stated "I would rather know the truth than to be happy". I have always lived by that myself, but it suddenly struck me that as I grow older I increasingly realize the value of happiness. If it is indeed true that we have no immortal soul, does happiness not become even more valuable?
Why to believe that Truth must to be incompatible with Happinnes ?? Truht is unhappy when/where one nurtured falsehood and one get no chances to had a life in Truth ... If You are Truthfull, You are Happy ... Of course, Your unhappiness is the untruthfulness that is not in You ...
I think we find ourselves in a uniquely human conundrum. It's hard to believe that we go through all that we do only to die and have it all just vanish. We want it to mean something, to have everlasting value, to have made a difference, to be able to observe and participate. It is sobering to watch someone die and realize everything they ever were as a conscious entity is gone. It's hard to accept and believe. But we exist in a vacuum of knowledge. We have little grasp of consciousness, and none at all of "the afterlife". So we fruitlessly grasp at theories, beliefs, traditions, rituals, trying to tease out a thread and a hope because we want it so bad and have nothing but the abyss of ignorance to work with. If there is anything that is everlasting, it's the perennial human struggle against existential nihilism.
Maybe we have to disengage ourselves from wondering in a linear time ('what will become of us', 'where are we coming from'), and remove time from the equations that define us. To find our values interacting beyond the lifespan, and then us into them. Maybe as part of a bigger entity and intelligence background field.
@@thoel1 Well yes, that line of thinking is one of many conjectures. And that's all we really have and may ever have... simply conjectures of what ifs and maybes.
No meaning has meaning. Non-existence exists. Luke Skywalker is in no way real but he can be referred to in a logical way concerning his effect on Americans in the 20th Century. Dead people are still real even though they don't exist. People like Albert Einstein and William Shakespeare are still shaping this world in magnificent ways. I could argue they're more real than I am. In a hundred years nobody will know who I am but Batman and Jesus will still be here, so how are they less real? It seems to me I'm the one who's not real. If presentence of existence is necessary for reality I'm a dust mite and they're cleaning the floor. Their non-existence is bigger than my existence in any real way, no matter how you measure it. Animal Chin is real. And I've see him. And that's a true statement even though his existence is negated by the physically and realistically true statement that Animal Chin is not real. The concept of Animal Chin, in it's non-existence, has an existence. A non-existent thing is simply in a class: non-existent things. The USS Enterprise is real, for example. It's a real member of the class of non-existent things. So are Dracula and Superman. Point is all mustache people are crab people. lol, no, not the South Park kind, the other kind.
Ehm. My life was awesome until I heard about the afterlife. First I made the best out of this life, now I work for the future and avoid the pit. Nihilism is a struggle, but working for heaven and avoiding the pit is a bigger struggle, not a bandage!
Why... It makes ZERO progression in any logical order as one would do if they were actually looking for truth. This KuhnHole jumps all over the place, and outrageously lies about claiming he believes NO ONE he interviews. Every single atheist, theist, and every shade in between he claims is bullshyt. He's a dishonest lying prick trying to fein objectivity
@@TasteMyStinkholeAndLikeIt Well, if you are looking for truth then the answer is this : There is no truth, at least no truth that would satisfy your mortal soul, and that is the truth! But, as i already pointed out, you don't like that truth, so, try to imagine this : every new episode that you watch on this channel begins with intro which states the truth which i've just told you...how many viewers would open new uploaded videos, knowing the truth? It must be very boring being God, that is to say knowing the answer to every question, musten't it?
@@odiupickusclone-1526 The name of the channel is "closer to truth," and one could be reasonably interpret that as meaning each video is a progression towards truth. When you learn math, you don't start with Calculus, then learn addition and subtraction, then learn algebra, then learn multiplication/division. This idiotic channel is all over the place, making ZERO forward progress. What is the point of interviewing idiots who are easily disproven AFTER you've interviewed someone who has demonstrated clearly that they are on to something. And your first sentence gave away the indisputable fact that you've never taken a class in logic. It also betrays the fact that your rodent brain is incapable of discerning and evaluating 'evidence' of existing truth, as well as your ignorance of an astounding mountain of evidence and logically sound arguments that indeed do point to a truth. The problem with the intellectually disabled like yourself is that you have zero interest in truth or facts. You have a calcified fossilized brain that is already settled in the tiny bit of nonsense it manages to hold. The unforgiveable problem with TH-cam is that it allows any 6 year old on earth with an internet connection to create an account and pose as an adult in comments. There is ZERO vetting on the part of TH-cam. Anyone can comment on anything regardless of their knowledge or intellect. Ideally it would be a punishable crime for people to spread their stupidity and ignorance on TH-cam, or anywhere else for that matter. I imagine you'd be serving quite a long time behind bars in that society though.
@@TasteMyStinkholeAndLikeIt I personally like to think his tendency to contradict or deny the people he interviews is a way to provoke the audience and perhaps even himself to think about different concepts much more thoroughly. It's also a good way to bring a different dynamic with this type of content so its easier to keep a viewer occupied with a subject having them ponder things from all angles instead of him just being a yesman to everyone he interviews.
I 100% agree with the definition of Keith Ward for what a soul is, and I am one of those traditional Muslims, I never knew that some Christians also have this kind of understanding. thank you closer to the truth.
From a quick search of the bible (say the KJV) for the words mortal and immortal - it is obvious that man is mortal, not immortal. Only God is immortal. Job 4:17 - Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker? 1 Timothy 6:16 - Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. 1 Timothy 1:17 - Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen. 2 Timothy 1:10 -: But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel: Romans 6:12 - Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Romans 8:11 - But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. 1 Corinthians 15:53 - For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1 Corinthians 15:54 - So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. etc. The bible teaches that God made Adam out of the dust of the earth and then breathed his 'life' into him and he became a' living' soul. It teaches the dead 'sleep in death' throughout. Dead = dead. When we die - our bodies return to dust, and our spirit returns to God who gave it. That is why after Adam sinned he was banished from the garden of Eden with a flaming sword and cherubim guarded the 'way of the tree of life'. If he had partook of it (as a sinner) he would have received eternal life right then and become an 'immortal' eternal sinner. Unredeemable. That proves man does not have eternal life or immortality - that's what we need still. When we die - we await resurrection - when the two parts (material and immaterial (come together and we are made alive again) the righteous with a new glorified body. The bible teaches that immortality is only possible for those made righteous at the resurrection who have it imputed to them (because of faith in Christ's finished work on the cross alone) - he was the only perfect sinless man. Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:36 - He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. john 10:28 - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. john 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Agree but some how those memories 'runs' faster and faster in hope into death for at least get a chance to die again ... the sorrowing issue arise when/where those memories never reach their corpses and death's bodies ...
Rajarshi Karmakar sort of, yes. If your brain right now was reverted to the state it was in when you were born and stayed that way I would say you had become brain dead and pull the plug ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What about a radio transmitter transmitting radio waves to a radio? Before we discovered that radio waves existed, we thought that it was impossible! We can't naturally sense them in any way. What if our brain acts like a type of transmitter to our consciousness/soul? It is possible to think and make decisions in a pseudo way because computers can but they are not conscious.
Love this channel. These are questions I have been asking ever since I can remember. And even though we can't prove an answer in a philosophical sense, it's hard to go through life without searching and asking these questions and trying to find an answer
@@thomasridley8675 Exactly, on top of that : I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.
Absoulute oblivion seem fine to me. Why is anybody so afraid of death??? Did you suffer the past billions of years before you were born??? Then, you won't suffer the next billions. I suffer now, unemployed and about to lose my home to some crappy bank.
Most humans simply believe what they’re raised with. If you could change their country of birth, their convictions would be different too. The mind is programmed. Unless you’re a seeker. Reality does not exist in the mind of common people. Wishful thinking becomes their personal reality.
Interesting tour, I liked to hear all the views. I get the impression that lots of the concepts were born out of fear of having to let our ego go when we die. Those who proudly say yes death is the end, no immortal soul, but then want to have their loophole with a come-back resurrection are just as scared.
Worst about souls is, there's so many of them, most dead souls must have came from neanderthals and cannibals. Imagine eternity with those people, can't even die again or force them to go away.
The best argument I ever heard about the subject was by Sean Carroll, and it goes like this: "Life, or consciousness, is not a substance like water or air; it is a process like fire. When you put out the flame on a candle the flame doesn't go anywhere, it simply stops. And that is what happens when we die." What I would add is that in an infinite Universe, the possibility of the same process to continue is also infinite. Some call it "reincarnation", but it's more like waking up after a very long and far away sleep, causally completely disconnected from the previous realm. That being said, in an infinite Universe, death would be Einsteinian/relativistic. Meaning, for everyone else around, we would die, and for them death would be as real as it gets, simply because they would all witness it. But, from the point of view of the one who actually died in that scenario, when the process continues, for them it would seem like they just woke up, completely oblivious of their own death, while at the same time witnessing other processes stop, thus being convinced that death is real.
What's a "Foo King As Soul"? I've had several people tell me they think I'm a "Foo King As Soul". I have no idea what a foo king is, much less one "as soul".
@@user-gk9lg5sp4y The only reason it could be undesirable would be if it became inherent unpleasant for some reason (e.g. unbearably extreme temperature or immobile or in perpetual physical pain etc). Arguments to the effect of "You'd get bored" are lame. Boredom can be overcome. Nothingness can't.
It is not. God created man from the dust, blew spirit into it's nostrils and the man 👉became👈 a living soul. A soul is what you are when you're alive, a soul is what you have for dust you are and to dust you shall return. The spirit goes back to God who gave it. The spirit is not you it's God's breath of life wich has turned the dust man into a living soul (human being).
Which makes it even dumber than Western religion. It's just as irrationally magical but with none of the benefits. That's like believing there are invisible immaterial hardware stores. What's the point?
My definition of a souls is...an accurate description of behavior of something. If our accurate description of behavior is about a person, that description is information that can survive death. In this sense, it is immortal. Thank you CTT.
A soul is a person, the individual. It occupies a material body temporarily and moves on to another body after physical death after some time in the afterlife. It's called reincarnation. It is an impossibility to become nothing. One would have to be where there is no eternity. Impossible, eternity is infinite, beginningless, and everywhere.
Even if we assume a materialist view on consiousness.... that the material universe produced our individual feeling of consious experience. What are the odds of this happening only one time, given the boundless nature across time and space of the universe?
If would argue that consciousness has happened billions of times, in each human and in som advanced animals. If assuming materialism, consciousness are unlikely without life. We have really no idea how common life is in the universe so consciousness is even more difficult to guess.
But what I can’t understand is why we are souls can’t remember before we went in our body how are we supposed to remember when we leave our body . If there is no remembrance before matter how is there supposed to be a remembrance after matter.
Maybe there's a veil that prevents us from remembering so that we can focus on our present life, and said veil is lifted after we pass on, so we we can reflect on the life we just lived.
Well most certainly I don’t want to sound like an atheist . but what I think we need to do is really understand consciousness and our existence . is it that our minds play tricks on us because of the fears of the unknown after death and before life , could our Conscious minds see our fears as sort of a mirage seeing water in a desert when there is not.
It makes sense to me that you can't remember previous lives. Your soul is the immortal part. Your self, your personality, your mentality, your memories, are all mortal, and are "flushed" at death. I for one am glad I won't carry all of those encumberments into the next life --that is, if my belief is true. Perhaps your soul carries with it the lessons that really matter --about love and kindness for example, but not the multiplication tables.
The world always works in the most efficient way. Whatever its purpose is, throwing away a being that wasn't doing much on a small planet but accumulate experience would be 100% inefficient and a waste of time and energy. So, obviously we are doing something here besides shoving dust around, as any explanation would require something that outlasts a human life. Not knowing what exactly is going on here does not negate the basic statement that something is going on here that is not 100% useless, and that something that we know nothing specific about is the soul. Although we actually do know a lot about it: it has free will, memory and a first-person view.
Having studied molecular biology, I can guarantee you that the world does not work in the most efficient way. The waste of cellular systems is considerable.
@DOC TOR I agree, but I was referring to the specific group of individuals described in the bible who were willing to sacrifice their very life for Jesus without him even being present...Without some kind of afterlife; with or without a soul, their belief in some kind of reward wouldn't be justified... They believed they could live again...So, going back to the immortal soul, if it is not a biblical teaching, and the followers of Jesus had a strong conviction they could live again, because some of them perhaps witnessed Jesus bringing people back to life, what survives death? How is the "self " preserved, if there's no soul?
As always, I love your discussions, Robert. Humans identify themselves as physical creatures, so it's understandable that many scientists are hardcore materialists. But if you put your hand on a sheet of photographic film on top of a metal discharge plate, the resulting photograph will show an energy field around the hand that is invisible to our senses - a Kirlian photograph. To account for phenomena in the observable universe that seemingly defy the laws of physics as we understand them, string theory posits between 10 and 26 dimensions. If extra dimensions exist, isn't it possible and even reasonable that there are dimensions of the human person that lie beyond our physical senses? Could this be the basis for ESP, souls, ghosts, transmigration and similar phenomena? Perhaps you could bring some string theorists into the conversation, and ask them.
And what else would we do? Not ask at all? Not imagine anything? Not even wonder? Even if we cannot answer them, it is in our nature to ask and to wonder why and how and if. It's OUR purpose. An innate part of who we are as thinking, feeling conscious beings. And in that sense, it has its advantages.
If it is true that when we die and there’s nothing else, no further journey, then why do I still find myself worrying about it!!. I have never looked for answers more than I have these last 5 years, and what have I found?. I don’t know any more than you, but intuition just seems to tell me there is more than this, isn’t there!??
Appeal to the fact that there are truths that are beyond the scope of Reason makes sense. What does not make sense is to pretend that these truths are accepted by Reason.
As a neurophysiologost, I would think that you would be aware of the multiple M.D. documented NDE anecdotes that show OOBE as a real, and objectively verifiable, phenomenon.
"I desperately don't want to believe in anything I can't touch, so I'll find a bunch of people from different backgrounds who believe as I do, then present it as, see, I must be right." Sad that some people want to believe that you die and that's it.
They are living in the matrix & if they don’t bring them selves to a higher vibrations that same soul he don’t believe is immortal he’ll be A lost soul in A dark place .
Is it not wanting to believe in an afterlife or not wanting to believe something false. Because I want an afterlife, im just having trouble finding evidence
Instead of "souls," we should say "conscious personality," the very first principle of reality. Eternal, having a spiritual body (and very beautiful one at that!).
The soul is the living entity and it is eternal, as Krishna says in the Bhagavid-gita: " Material nature consist of three modes__ goodness, passion, and ignorance. When the eternal living entity comes in contact with nature, O mighty- armed Arjuna, he becomes conditioned by these modes."
I love the idea of immortal souls. But I don't HAVE a soul -- rather, I AM a soul. Else, who is the "I" that "has" the soul? Is the "soul" just some other thing that someone has -- and when they die, the soul leaves them? However, as much as I like the idea, there's no consistent, reproducible evidence for it. It remains something that folks like to believe for several reasons, pretty much all of them emotional reasons.
We know how cells are broken down into molecules when we die. I experience that our thoughts are more than electricity and chemicals in our nervous system, they form a whole something sort of building block - part of all our thoughts When we die but sometimes during our life these building blocks can be transferred from person to person / new baby. this is the process of reincarnation. A person is build up from more than one source of building blocks. Immortal means here that these building blocks are ‘remembered’ or stay closer together. Teh danger is that the same psychological problems are repeated over and over again.
Every statement about souls or afterlife in the video were assertions made by people who have no more information about that any other human that has ever existed. The plural of anecdote is not data. The plural of guessing is not fact. The plural of inference is not deduction. The plural of assertion is not evidence
True, but all knowledge starts with an idea - an exploration or description that we can at least see as coherent and that takes into account all the facets. Then we can try to support that idea - to show that it's true - which of course is where it all falls apart.
madmax2976 - Ideas might be based on a correct or incorrect interpretation of the evidence. Humans are predisposed to assign agency. Our best current resource is the scientific method. We should make sure the facts actually lead to the conclusion and be sure we are not starting with a presupposed idea and twisting the facts to agree with it. If the fact don’t confirm the idea it should be abandoned. Pardon if that’s what you were referring to.
@@jmaniak1 Sure, I'm just saying it doesn't hurt to engage in phase 1 so to speak: Can we make sense of this? Can we frame it coherently while incorporating all the parts? We have to start with something that at least gets us that far, then we can go to phase 2, phase 3, etc., coming up with real things we can test and verify and confirm. And when we can't - which is usually the case with these kinds of subject - we're just left with agnosticism and maybe a dash of hope.
madmax2976 - yes, unfortunately I think too many stop before the testable and repeatable phase because they find something that feels good. In the end there may be many questions we will never have the answers to. I’m not always comfortable saying I don’t know but sometimes it’s the only answer and we continue searching.
In this period of mankind we went beyond the physical into "virtual" which may be a crude form of non materialism. Is it possible that this realm can go beyond to mind, consciousness or spirituality. . . .to something we do not understand yet? I am not a religious person but the finality of death seems brutal so some of us cling on to the hope of something beyond
Finding soul in mental projection means granting immortality to mind. Who can see the one who see all. That's why it becomes null in the game of mental projection.
The immortal soul has been mixed up over the centuries with the spark of life; the spirit...There are some biblical references where the spirit, the spark of life making the inanimate matter animate, "goes back to God" after death... Some interpretations suggested it to be the evidence for afterlife in heaven...
The Biblical authors are clear that a "living soul" is dependent on "the breath of life in it's nostrils" to exist. If it loses that, it will "perish". (Kind of like what the county coroner would tell you.) But they go on to tell you to "seek after glory and honor, immortality and eternal life, whereunto you are called". (If you had/were an "immortal soul', you would possess immortality, rather than needing to seek after it.) Basically the missing ingredient is the Spirit of God, which could not enter the defiled vessel that is man; but the redemptive work of Christ changed this. If you want to pretend you are naturally or intrinsically immortal, leave the Bible on the shelf. It doesn't support that illusion.
@@tomashull9805 Theoretically, "hell" is just a metaphor for a state of disharmony with God, others, creation, and self within the soul; the reason it's inescapable is that the will ultimately atrophies and disintegrates. This is a way of excusing God, because he doesn't send you somewhere to be tortured forever, you simply are eternal and choose that which torments you until choice is no longer possible.. But such rationalizations are unnecessary if you merely distinguish between Greek philosophy and Hebrew monotheism.
@@tomashull9805 Doesn't matter, they just regurgitate heresy or go entirely apostate because the heresy makes no sense. You have to use a tool called "audience relevance", what would Scripture have meant to those to whom it was addressed, by those who wrote it? None of the above were Greek philosophers or Gnostic mystics. They were Hebrews who thought in terms of "Sheol" where the dead abide in darkness, silence and inactivity. Not in punishment or reward. Life after death meant a resurrection, which would result in eternal life for the Godly, and a second death for the wicked. "Hell" is a misbegotten concept confusing various Biblical terms and metaphors. Look at the verses they quote at you to scare you with the prospect of fiery eternal torment: "Whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have everlasting life" "The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." "He that has the Son has life. He that has not the Son has not life." Apparently, this "Jesus" character has to hook you up with immortality before you can live forever; otherwise, at some point you cease to live at all. The idea of living forever on your own, in a place or condition of unending torture, is a non sequitur.
Yes, that is a good question. All creatures that have ever lived are made of the same stuff, i.e., atoms and molecules of C, N, O, H, P, etc. If H. sapiens have an afterlife, than all other creatures should as well. What about a bacterium that died billions of years ago? Is its soul or essence floating around somewhere in the ether? What about a monkey that lived 10 million years ago? What about a Neanderthal that lived 100,000 years ago? Where is its soul now? Me thinks the whole idea of an immortal soul for any creature, including H. sapiens, is simply childish nonsense.
The soul is the energy that animates you and in so doing affects and alters the fields and their orientation. When the fields are perfectly aligned, the souls come together in bliss.
Beautiful and poetic way to perceive it. However, it has absolutely no evidence 😔 I think life is likely more chemical reactions/metabolism in concert with plenty of carbon, water, etc. to keep it going. Think of our bodies as mobile hot springs able to acquire what it needs to sustain the conglomeration of cells that constitute you. The soul/consciousness is likely emergent like so many other things. We don't know if it transcends into some naturalistic quantum realm upon death... Or simply ceases to be. However, it's selfish to expect or want to exist for eternity... And likely tied to the self preservation circuit in the mind.
Chemistry is particles. Particles are waves. I see energy as those waves moving in the fields. Its Newtons 3rd law (equal and opposite reaction). The wave / particle gets deflected and its field disoriented.
What resonates with me is We reincarnate in many bodies until we realize who we are, a spiritual being, and all our aspect are integrated and whole. Thats support reap and sow. Some evil people lived and died without punishment. Coz i dont believe you die once in physical world and gets punished in spiritual. You cant judge a physical and punish spiritual because they are in different world. It's unfair. And you cant punish a spiritual, it has no form. So it needs to relive again. It supports Unconditional Love of God. The chances God gives. That every soul comes from God, and ONLY ends in God. Alpha and Omega. Life is not a test or audition, it is a game. Like a puzzle, you need to realize something. Game because game is more fun. And God is Joy. Thats the message of Jesus (Yeshua), remember who you are. You are God's children. That what you do to your brothers you do to God, you do to yourself, because we are all connected in spiritual world. Scientifically, Is there an immortal soul? Is there an immortal energy? (Reference reading: Laws of Thermodynamics)
The big problem with the 'soul' concept is one of identity - How do you retain an identity without a physical presence? You should explore that (if you ever read these comments.)
I think we are immortal we keep coming back, we don't make to eternity, I hope eventually we all make throng brighter side, in this life and the next one estay in the light.
What's so wrong with non-existence? We've all tried existence and, honestly, it's not that great, is it? Losing all the worries, insecurities, embarrassments, pains etc, of existence could be a blessed (sorry) relief.
Wow..."the consciousness is so obvious (implied as a separate from brain)...how anyone can deny it"..."look around, ground looks obviously flat around us, how can anyone deny earth is flat". And some theologians call scientists arrogant. Simply wow. Are we supposed to rely on human perceptions for understanding reality? Time and again we have found human perceptions are error prone.
@@SandipChitale I did! A very delightful read! My comment above was meant to be a parody of creationists when they say that natural selection is "ramdom". But that assertion of creationists - just like every other they make - is spurious.
During near death experience when brain shut down his functioning , they still counscious and awareness about their resuscitation by doctors , this prove that counscious is independent entity from brain .
@@gure1686 Remember near death experience (NDE) is NOT after death experience. Total death is not an instantaneous process, parts of the body are alive over that process. And sometimes this process of death is stopped and that is when we have NDE. It is true that the legal definition of death is at an arbitrary instant when the doctor writes it down to be. Also note in dreams we can be skiing on Alps, or during a drug trip (LSD, DMT) people experience all kinds of weird experiences because of chemical imbalance in brain. Sometimes near death there is hypoxia, lack of oxygen in the brain. That causes hallucinations. None of this IMO says anything about consciousness being something separate from brain. Have you seen free standing consciousness anywhere? I have not.
Soul is consciousness in body / human, similar to awareness is consciousness in the mind. The soul connects the human body / whole person to conscious experience of reality, so that the whole person participates in conscious reality. The soul likely returns to consciousness / God at death of body, which may be called immortality.
It's interesting to note that the Bible view and the views of Philip Clayton also have the same point: God does remember everything we were and are, he knows our deep thoughts and emotions, along with each atom of our bodies (Psalm 139:15,16), which together make up our personality, our soul that is an inseparable living and breathing being (Genesis 2:7). The Bible says, every soul belongs to God (Ezekiel 18:4) and he, as the Greatest Programmer and Designer, longs to bring them back to life, especially those ones, who long to listen and obey his word of love (Job 14:14, 15). These verses state that God longs to see the work of his hands alive again. There's nothing impossible for the Almighty. And apostle Paul stated the same in Acts 24:15 - he believed in "resurrection of the righteous and unrighteous". This view is supported throughout the Bible, the Old and New Testament. Even Jesus cited Psalm 37:29 telling that the meek ones will possess the earth and will live forever on it (Matthew 5:5) and he stated multiple times of the resurrection in the final day that is yet to come (John 11:23-25). Martha, the sister of Lazarus who was resurrected by Jesus, stated the same (John 11:24). The true Christian hope based on the Bible is the resurrection of living beings on Earth in accord with God's original design to make a global Paradise (Genesis 1:28 "And God blessed them: and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth".).
It doesn't matter what explanation you happen to arrive at with regard to reality. The simple fact of existence forces ones hand. Whatever the fundamental cause of it, divine or mundane, that thing must be acausal. Accepting that, one must necessarily accept everything else. The personality and memories of an individual, ( the soul ) must therefore, exist immaterially, regardless of the presence of it's likeness in any given material medium.
Orthodox Judaism does hold by the idea of an immortal soul and re-incarnation. You interviewed a conservative Rabbi whose view Orthodox Jews do not follow. There is an old classic work Shaarei Gilgulim, which deals with reincarnation of souls, and it is well known that the Arizal was able to discern who people had been in their previous lives. I would suggest that you learn more about your roots from an orthodox group such as Lubavitch and then most of the questions you have would become self evident. Also look at near death accounts, of which there are many on the Internet to see the process involved. Look especially at Robert Schwartz who explains that we plan our lives before birth and agree to the main challenges we will face here, which are pre-determined, in order to provide an appropriate level of spiritual challenge. He states that each person has a number of spiritually advanced souls assigned to him in the next world to assist him in that endeavour. Also there are a number of possible different Realms we can go to, not just the one we are familiar with here. G-D is immortal and so are our souls.
Robert presents his work as a search for truth. I admire the form and the substance of his search: it is elegant and it discusses powerful ideas. He's been doing that for a while. I like to invite Robert to share with his viewers a summary of the main ideas appear clear to him so far. Something solid and true like the Pythagoras theorem in mathematics. An episode where he is interviewed.
that is odd in those videos the religious philosophers or the theologians dont talk about "spirit". In Christian theology, the human is constituted of 3 parts, not 2. Human is composed of body, soul and spirit. I think the soul according to new testament is mortal (mind attached to the world) while spirit is immortal (mind attached to the "heaven")
4 ปีที่แล้ว +1
Let me put the old Jewish concept in simple words- "You live and you die, with nothing more." That may be an eternal pleasure for the life given. However, it can also just be "human thought". Even an atheist can have this human thought and say, "You live and you die, with nothing more." So, the Jewish philosopher's concept may not be really exclusive, because everybody knows what death is.
i Think the immortal part , is the communality in all views that might come from the simplicity of our essence, the lighter your essence is the easier it is to retransfer into something else without the same identity .. enlightened beings have walked the earth, mostly focusing on spirituality and the soul, in my view a spiritual essence is very light in terms of weight , it doesn't take much to move it around, i think that's why spiritualism have survived and taken many forms, because it doesn't require an specific identity, many people inherit spiritual essence and carry it out in different ways .. the way i see it we are made of body, soul and spirit each one correlating to the image of god, which is the holy trinity .. Again i am an atheist and just try to make sense out of things out of an specific premises, i am not a believer, i am just proposing a theistic point of view: continuing .. i think the Soul is heavier it requires a lot more effort to keep a soul alive and it usually identifies with an defined identity in a level lower, the body is the subject in which those higher levels involve themselves with in order to create experience, As i see experience is the learning process , of soul and spiritual development .. as for how they correlate to the divine or the biblical God, I think the spirit is the identity of the holy spirit, the soul God as the Father, and the body Maybe the Son or lower form in which subjects itself to the aspects of existence for the purpose of experience. Each individual as creations in God Image as the bible says, carries within those 3 aspects, of body , soul and spirit .. The way the body Interacts with those aspects of our created existence is through the brain and the mind .. again experience , a learning process for the development of soul and spirit.
There cannot be just energy and matter, but a third party conservator , like a ribbon of fabric into which the designs of events are woven by their parley of matter and energy having an attachment to a background which seems as a void or empty space, but is being embroidered by the weave of matter and energy leaving a trail of data memory explaining every event and every force behind every event as it attaches to a third party of empty voids , however the voids are something else of another condition that takes responsibility to remember all that ever came and went through these empty places. This is an artistic technique to capture the image of what the artist saw in his mind.
I like the program and topic. I disagree with the basic premise of the speaker, that consciousness arises our of matter. If youve read any of the literature from Science and Non Duality, you may be aware that there is no evidence that consciousness arises from matter. You dont need to postulate an immortal soul to also postulate the primacy of consciousness. Delving deep into that possibility, one begins to see (to know) that even in this “appearance” of being an ego (individual, autonomous soul), one is actually, and timelessly always just consciousness, and that you’ve never not been that. Study Vedanta.
@@Tardis216 A near-death experience provides evidence that cannot be transferred to our fellow men. The reason is characterized by trying to find "shared truths". Here we try, using Reason, to find common truths. I value near-death experiences, but unfortunately they do not contribute to a rational dialogue, for the moment.
@@guillermobrand8458 There is a possibility for reasoning, I think. Some physicists think consciousness is fundamental. I know they are right (I had a NDE myself). It is interesting to keep an eye/ear on what people like David Chalmers and Donald Hoffman have to say about consciousness. And I think that Erik Verlinde is on the right track too. He's developing a new theory, based on emergence. Based on what I experienced during my NDE I expect them to be representatives of brakethroughs in physics, where consciousness is fundamental and the cause of all matter.
There's a problem that exists in that people assume immortality of the soul would mean they would maintain being "themselves" (that is, this particular being of this particular time) forever. But isn't it just a lack of imagination that prevents us from identifying with what it's like to be someone else...or even to be a tree? We should abandon the domination of "self" identity and learn to identify with the universal spiritual Source of all life-force that IS truly immortal.
So, if you cut the corpus collosum, you have a person with two different sets of experience, one for the left hemisphere and one for the right, and those can develop with different memories and conflicting motivations. So how many immortal souls are there here before and after the corpus collosum is cut? And what if we then reconnect them, how many now? The idea of the soul as distinct from the body is demolished by this fact. When two people communicate, that communication is an analogue of communication between the two hemispheres via the corpus collosum. So when two people communicate is there a unitary experience of that as we have a unitary experience of our two hemispheres? There is a word for this unitary conscious experience born from communication. It’s called an egrigore. We are all egrigores. In fact this is the structure of consciousness.
If we take the approach that humanity is part of a simulation, a human being could be viewed as a tool whose purpose is to share its life experiences with whomever is in charge of the simulation. In such a framework the soul is simply a conduit to pipe that information out. When a human being dies, its conduit is disconnected from the simulation, hence the soul dies along with the simulated Body. When a new being is born, a new connection i.e. soul is created. The number of souls or connections is only limited by the processing power of the simulation.
All human development has come from intuition (the eureka moment) the heart knows more than the brain can even imagine. In my experience it, the heart is never wrong but the brain/ego is easily fooled.
There is a fundamental misconception right at the beginning of this episode that the "western religious tradition" is that the soul is separate from the body, leaves the body at death, etc. This is neither the Christian nor the Jewish tradition, as explained by Christian and Jewish scholars during the show.
So the last person he talks to sounds like he believes we live on basically in gods mind of us, like in his memory which unlike ours is something actually that is actually more than just passing thoughts. Something outside of time and is of literal substance. Maybe not atoms, but something. This to me makes total sense. Especially if you give any credence to NDE’rs. Many of them say they experienced this oneness with the universe and understood everything there is to know. And could feel what the other person felt that you have had any communication or experience with. If you had cause that person pain or something that’s what you would experience from their perspective. So I guess what I’m saying is that we don’t have a soul within us but, being in Gods memory, or his mind, if you will, has that same effect and value. It make sense when you think of the scriptures that said The God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob is the God of the living , not the dead. Those individuals are in effect alive bcoz of being in Gods mind or memory. Which translate to actually living there at the very moment of there death till now and ofcourse eternally. That’s why Paul said as well to be absent from the body is to be with the lord. It all makes sense to me now. The thing we should concern ourselves with is how do we make sure we remain in Gods memory. Is it something we earn here on earth? Or is it automatic at death? I believe God sending his son Jesus here to redeem us shows there’s requirements that must be meant first to avail ourselves of this opportunity and gift. He ,is the conduit.
When you are asleep, dreams are your reality, difficult to discern what is real or not ... Same with life, it is only a dream compared to the afterlife, which is the ultimate reality. A reality where you're experiences are not confined to 5 physical senses.....
If the definition of a soul is something only you can have wouldn’t position and history of interaction be the only two things that are always different between two things. A basic example would be two dots that have identical structure but will always have a difference in distance you can just not eliminate. with that logic you can say humans are just hiveminds of “souls” like how you would consider individuals making up a society an organism.
If I may, Plato was right, spirit is real, and this man's problem with the idea of an immortal soul is essentially that he is wholly enamoured with his corporal body. When his flesh has melted from his bones, which in turn finally rot and crumble, do you suppose his spirit will be willing and able to serve the merciful powers? Or will it seek only to rest with the remnants of his body? I believe for such souls eons will pass by unnoticed, as they shall be wakened only in the final redemption, when matter is made energy. Of course, it's entirely unreasonable to suppose that someone who has never personally encountered a thing might understand the actual nature of the thing they speculate does not exist. Surely, they think, they could not be so unlucky and others must be lying. But it seems entirely ironic when the truly ignorant, those without even the foggiest notion of the actual nature of the subject, believe they can help enlighten others to "understand" that the thing which exists but of which they have no understanding, does not exist. This is actually prototypical of a great failing of "western thought". A lack of humility is ultimately at fault. It is mistakenly believed that a single human individual is the apex summit of existence and possible understanding. The limitations inherent to a single individual human are ignored and denied. What is incomprehensible to that individual is declared to be meaningless, what is unknown declared to be nonexistent. Of course, this is a silly mistake. But it corrupts "western thought" at a profound and foundational level. It lies at the heart of nihilism with essentially the ludicrous proposition "because the world is incomprehensible to me, it is meaningless". ( or, "the ultimate meaning of existence is completely beyond my grasp, therefore I shall insist that there is no such ultimate meaning"). The immodesty also lies as the root justification of philosophoc postmodernism, here, "because I can know, that ultimately there is no way I can determine what is true instead of not true, I therefore declare that the concept of truth is meaningless, and there is no such thing as the truth, every narrative is equally true". While such a philosophical "foundation" might help assuage feelings of guilt from those persuaded to the efficacy of deceit, it is entirely unhealthy to human wellbeing in the large context. Yes, we think we need to deceive others in order to take advantage of them, to cheat on sex partners, to profit, to defend capitalism, imperialism and other forms of systematized human exploitation, to get funding for science research, we stretch and manipulate and "create" "the truth".
AND I think Western culture needs a renaissance, where, as a culture, we wholesale abandon the "justifiability" of deceit in order to "get ahead", abandon the idea that some people must be preditors and some prey, abandon the idea that everything is essentially a competition where the strongest thrive while the weakest must suffer or perish. We must instead embrace the idea that we are all small contributors to a much greater whole and larger, albeit fundamentally unknowable purpose. - where we have respect for and seek cooperation with, and to assist one another. -where guile goes unrewarded, and fairness, justice and equity are regarded as socially vital as are healthy diets. -where the truth is revered and misdirection is scorned. Ok, yeah, in some ways becoming more like the Chinese, but not necessarily genetically, - complementary, harmonious yet non-convergent. Yeah, well, we need to do something like this, because, in case you haven't noticed, we're basically getting flushed. And time is of the essence, but mass hunger will probably provide sufficient impetus to get things started.
I wish they would have explained further why they believe Christian and Jewish religion does not support the idea of an immortal soul. It seems all Jesus spoke about was eternal life and not focusing on this life or this world. I can’t understand how they justify those statements about Christianity and I would like to understand it better. Otherwise, I love this channel and am so glad to have found it! Such awesome topics covered, very interesting!
Wait! I thought Ed Feser had definitively proven that humans have immortal souls and can spend eternity in heaven, which will provide them so much bliss they won't care that their pets Fido and Fluffy don't have that privilege. Are you saying that Feser's word games and convoluted logic puzzles aren't convincing anyone but Thomist cultists? I'm shocked!
If there is any understanding to be gleaned for a Western mind, then it must grapple with the meaning of the saying "what does it profit a man to gain the whole world but lose his own soul". How does this question clarify the concept of soul? First off, how does one lose one's soul? Is the soul like a watch? Can we give it away? Secondly do we possess our own soul? If we own it or possess it then who owns it, who gives it away? This implies that the mind is different from the soul. Thirdly it is said "when the soul leaves the body, the body dies". If we give away our soul do we die? Or can we live with someone else owning our soul, and only relinquish it when we die? What would life be like with someone else owning our soul? Would it be like a robot or would our "will" be owned by someone else? Is soul connected to will, howso? Finally if we do possess our own soul why would we ever give it away? How could we ever give it away? If the soul and will and mind are separate, which has jurisdiction over the others? What would the will and mind be like with someone else owning their soul? What would the soul be like without a will and mind?
The funny thing about souls is that their proponents never really accurately define what a soul is. How convenient. In Buddhism there is no soul but there is consciousness. That consciousness is unborn, undifferentiated, composed of light and devoid of duality. In Buddhism all sentient beings are composed of light and possess the potential to become Buddha. "Luminous beings we are. Not this crude flesh." This is our true state of existence and if we don't have the awareness of it now at some point in the future we will. Buddhism accepts that past, and future are not in fact real. That the only thing that is real is this eternal present moment. Quantum Mechanics says the same thing.
Yes, the common mistake is to be wondering in a linear time ('what will become of us?', 'where are we coming from?', but time seems to be an emergent property. Unfortunately Buddhism is also speaking about a start and an end on everything, I never heard them say that past and future are not real. The eternal present is mostly a 'new age' philosophy deduction. I'm feeling that removing time from the equation is the key to better understand our nature.
The Soul is from Plato and Hell is from Dante. Neither come from religious writing. The ability of humans to have abstract thought is a great temptation. Because I can imagine what I know does not exist, I can also believe what I can imagine does exist. In short if I can create a word for something, then that something very likely exists.
I cant believe you cant find out the exact value of human senses and human thought as we are looking forward to our future life from our present time. You can sensely find out what they might exactly feel at the same time they are living right now. You will find there devine soul finally and just do nothing.
The moment of the conciousness departing the physical body is somewhat incomprehensible by word.Ir is like finding oneself in another place without a minute struggle-as it was designed to be so yet isnmore frightening than death itself because it undermines all applied reasoning.
![เป็นไปได้ไหม - WanMai [Performance Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Eh5hItD4Mr0/mqdefault.jpg)
A human dies twice.
The first time, when the heart stops beating.
The second time, when people stop say your name.
He stated "I would rather know the truth than to be happy". I have always lived by that myself, but it suddenly struck me that as I grow older I increasingly realize the value of happiness. If it is indeed true that we have no immortal soul, does happiness not become even more valuable?
Why to believe that Truth must to be incompatible with Happinnes ??
Truht is unhappy when/where one nurtured falsehood and one get no chances to had a life in Truth ...
If You are Truthfull, You are Happy ... Of course, Your unhappiness is the untruthfulness that is not in You ...
No Jesus
No peace
Know Jesus
Know peace
@@jayworldjs lol
Real happiness is the outcome of following the Truth
I think we find ourselves in a uniquely human conundrum. It's hard to believe that we go through all that we do only to die and have it all just vanish. We want it to mean something, to have everlasting value, to have made a difference, to be able to observe and participate. It is sobering to watch someone die and realize everything they ever were as a conscious entity is gone. It's hard to accept and believe. But we exist in a vacuum of knowledge. We have little grasp of consciousness, and none at all of "the afterlife". So we fruitlessly grasp at theories, beliefs, traditions, rituals, trying to tease out a thread and a hope because we want it so bad and have nothing but the abyss of ignorance to work with.
If there is anything that is everlasting, it's the perennial human struggle against existential nihilism.
Maybe we have to disengage ourselves from wondering in a linear time ('what will become of us', 'where are we coming from'), and remove time from the equations that define us. To find our values interacting beyond the lifespan, and then us into them. Maybe as part of a bigger entity and intelligence background field.
@@thoel1 Well yes, that line of thinking is one of many conjectures. And that's all we really have and may ever have... simply conjectures of what ifs and maybes.
No meaning has meaning. Non-existence exists. Luke Skywalker is in no way real but he can be referred to in a logical way concerning his effect on Americans in the 20th Century. Dead people are still real even though they don't exist. People like Albert Einstein and William Shakespeare are still shaping this world in magnificent ways. I could argue they're more real than I am. In a hundred years nobody will know who I am but Batman and Jesus will still be here, so how are they less real? It seems to me I'm the one who's not real. If presentence of existence is necessary for reality I'm a dust mite and they're cleaning the floor. Their non-existence is bigger than my existence in any real way, no matter how you measure it. Animal Chin is real. And I've see him. And that's a true statement even though his existence is negated by the physically and realistically true statement that Animal Chin is not real. The concept of Animal Chin, in it's non-existence, has an existence. A non-existent thing is simply in a class: non-existent things. The USS Enterprise is real, for example. It's a real member of the class of non-existent things. So are Dracula and Superman. Point is all mustache people are crab people. lol, no, not the South Park kind, the other kind.
Ehm. My life was awesome until I heard about the afterlife.
First I made the best out of this life, now I work for the future and avoid the pit.
Nihilism is a struggle, but working for heaven and avoiding the pit is a bigger struggle, not a bandage!
you nailed it 👌
This channel should have 20 million subs.
Why... It makes ZERO progression in any logical order as one would do if they were actually looking for truth.
This KuhnHole jumps all over the place, and outrageously lies about claiming he believes NO ONE he interviews. Every single atheist, theist, and every shade in between he claims is bullshyt. He's a dishonest lying prick trying to fein objectivity
@@TasteMyStinkholeAndLikeIt Well, if you are looking for truth then the answer is this : There is no truth, at least no truth that would satisfy your mortal soul, and that is the truth! But, as i already pointed out, you don't like that truth, so, try to imagine this : every new episode that you watch on this channel begins with intro which states the truth which i've just told you...how many viewers would open new uploaded videos, knowing the truth? It must be very boring being God, that is to say knowing the answer to every question, musten't it?
@@odiupickusclone-1526
The name of the channel is "closer to truth," and one could be reasonably interpret that as meaning each video is a progression towards truth.
When you learn math, you don't start with Calculus, then learn addition and subtraction, then learn algebra, then learn multiplication/division.
This idiotic channel is all over the place, making ZERO forward progress. What is the point of interviewing idiots who are easily disproven AFTER you've interviewed someone who has demonstrated clearly that they are on to something.
And your first sentence gave away the indisputable fact that you've never taken a class in logic.
It also betrays the fact that your rodent brain is incapable of discerning and evaluating 'evidence' of existing truth, as well as your ignorance of an astounding mountain of evidence and logically sound arguments that indeed do point to a truth. The problem with the intellectually disabled like yourself is that you have zero interest in truth or facts.
You have a calcified fossilized brain that is already settled in the tiny bit of nonsense it manages to hold.
The unforgiveable problem with TH-cam is that it allows any 6 year old on earth with an internet connection to create an account and pose as an adult in comments.
There is ZERO vetting on the part of TH-cam. Anyone can comment on anything regardless of their knowledge or intellect.
Ideally it would be a punishable crime for people to spread their stupidity and ignorance on TH-cam, or anywhere else for that matter.
I imagine you'd be serving quite a long time behind bars in that society though.
@@TasteMyStinkholeAndLikeIt I personally like to think his tendency to contradict or deny the people he interviews is a way to provoke the audience and perhaps even himself to think about different concepts much more thoroughly. It's also a good way to bring a different dynamic with this type of content so its easier to keep a viewer occupied with a subject having them ponder things from all angles instead of him just being a yesman to everyone he interviews.
Best channel in youtube
I love this show for giving multiple ideas and perspectives equal time to air their views without making it confrontational.
Hi Ghost.... It's obvious that you are happy where you are. This stuff is intellectually and spiritually retarded !!!!
Nothing new here.
I 100% agree with the definition of Keith Ward for what a soul is, and I am one of those traditional Muslims, I never knew that some Christians also have this kind of understanding. thank you closer to the truth.
From a quick search of the bible (say the KJV) for the words mortal and immortal - it is obvious that man is mortal, not immortal. Only God is immortal.
Job 4:17 - Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
1 Timothy 6:16 - Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
1 Timothy 1:17 - Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
2 Timothy 1:10 -: But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
Romans 6:12 - Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Romans 8:11 - But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
1 Corinthians 15:53 - For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1 Corinthians 15:54 - So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. etc. The bible teaches that God made Adam out of the dust of the earth and then breathed his 'life' into him and he became a' living' soul. It teaches the dead 'sleep in death' throughout. Dead = dead. When we die - our bodies return to dust, and our spirit returns to God who gave it. That is why after Adam sinned he was banished from the garden of Eden with a flaming sword and cherubim guarded the 'way of the tree of life'. If he had partook of it (as a sinner) he would have received eternal life right then and become an 'immortal' eternal sinner. Unredeemable. That proves man does not have eternal life or immortality - that's what we need still. When we die - we await resurrection - when the two parts (material and immaterial (come together and we are made alive again) the righteous with a new glorified body. The bible teaches that immortality is only possible for those made righteous at the resurrection who have it imputed to them (because of faith in Christ's finished work on the cross alone) - he was the only perfect sinless man.
Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:36 - He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
john 10:28 - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
john 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Reencarnation without memory persistance is the same as death.
Agree but some how those memories 'runs' faster and faster in hope into death for at least get a chance to die again ... the sorrowing issue arise when/where those memories never reach their corpses and death's bodies ...
Maybe you will remember all memories after you die
If you can't remember about your childhood then you were dead before according to your view
Gary Oldman Yes, you must be correct. Logically it couldn’t be any other way. At least that’s the way I think of it.
Rajarshi Karmakar sort of, yes. If your brain right now was reverted to the state it was in when you were born and stayed that way I would say you had become brain dead and pull the plug ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What about a radio transmitter transmitting radio waves to a radio? Before we discovered that radio waves existed, we thought that it was impossible!
We can't naturally sense them in any way.
What if our brain acts like a type of transmitter to our consciousness/soul?
It is possible to think and make decisions in a pseudo way because computers can but they are not conscious.
Closer To Truth attracts me (being an atheist) even with theological topics ;-)
Me also
Love this channel. These are questions I have been asking ever since I can remember. And even though we can't prove an answer in a philosophical sense, it's hard to go through life without searching and asking these questions and trying to find an answer
@@angelabierman567 True, however all roads lead to the pesimistic answer to the problem of evil.
At this rate. The sun will die before we get too the last episode of closer too the truth. Which will be
' we didn't find any '
@@thomasridley8675 Exactly, on top of that :
I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.
there is no show quite like this show.great.
I can’t think of a better heaven than eternal sleep! Experience simply gets old.
What if there's experience that you have never experienced and that you can't even conceive of in your current state of consciousness?
I think, eternal sleep is not enough. I think, if someone can make heaven heavenly (and not old) then that's God.
Absoulute oblivion seem fine to me. Why is anybody so afraid of death??? Did you suffer the past billions of years before you were born??? Then, you won't suffer the next billions. I suffer now, unemployed and about to lose my home to some crappy bank.
Fear of death (as any kind of irrational fear) is indoctrinated by society as a mean for self-preservation of the current power structures.
Most humans simply believe what they’re raised with. If you could change their country of birth, their convictions would be different too. The mind is programmed. Unless you’re a seeker.
Reality does not exist in the mind of common people. Wishful thinking becomes their personal reality.
'A place in divine presence ...' is the Closest To Truth! - Philip Clayton.
Alleluia!!!!!
Fantasy is the closest to truth?
Interesting tour, I liked to hear all the views.
I get the impression that lots of the concepts were born out of fear of having to let our ego go when we die. Those who proudly say yes death is the end, no immortal soul, but then want to have their loophole with a come-back resurrection are just as scared.
Worst about souls is, there's so many of them, most dead souls must have came from neanderthals and cannibals. Imagine eternity with those people, can't even die again or force them to go away.
The best argument I ever heard about the subject was by Sean Carroll, and it goes like this:
"Life, or consciousness, is not a substance like water or air; it is a process like fire.
When you put out the flame on a candle the flame doesn't go anywhere, it simply stops.
And that is what happens when we die."
What I would add is that in an infinite Universe, the possibility of the same process to continue is also infinite.
Some call it "reincarnation", but it's more like waking up after a very long and far away sleep, causally completely disconnected from the previous realm.
That being said, in an infinite Universe, death would be Einsteinian/relativistic. Meaning, for everyone else around, we would die, and for them death would be as real as it gets, simply because they would all witness it.
But, from the point of view of the one who actually died in that scenario, when the process continues, for them it would seem like they just woke up, completely oblivious of their own death, while at the same time witnessing other processes stop, thus being convinced that death is real.
People have been shouting, "You are soul," at me for years. My wife assures me they mean something else.
I can't imagine anything worse than being immortal. If you want to be immortal you don't understand the concept of infinity
@@user-gk9lg5sp4y Satre's Huis Clos examines some reasons why your point is so true.
What's a "Foo King As Soul"? I've had several people tell me they think I'm a "Foo King As Soul".
I have no idea what a foo king is, much less one "as soul".
@@user-gk9lg5sp4y The only reason it could be undesirable would be if it became inherent unpleasant for some reason (e.g. unbearably extreme temperature or immobile or in perpetual physical pain etc).
Arguments to the effect of "You'd get bored" are lame. Boredom can be overcome. Nothingness can't.
@@user-gk9lg5sp4y Miss the joke?
Man is the embodied breath of life, this embodied breath of life is the seat of consciousness, and language.
Soul is like energy which will never disappear and will remain forever and it is the essence of our body. God will preserve this soul in His way.
It is not.
God created man from the dust, blew spirit into it's nostrils and the man
👉became👈 a living soul.
A soul is what you are when you're alive, a soul is what you have for dust you are and to dust you shall return.
The spirit goes back to God who gave it.
The spirit is not you it's God's breath of life wich has turned the dust man into a living soul (human being).
Having an immortal soul doesn’t mean you keep family and friends, in eastern philosophy you forget everything that happened in each lifetime
Which makes it even dumber than Western religion. It's just as irrationally magical but with none of the benefits.
That's like believing there are invisible immaterial hardware stores. What's the point?
Yep, that person is dead, extinct like the dodo. Bruno and Spinoza had similar ideas in the west.
what wonderful conventions!!!! Thank you mate !!!!! Christian here
My definition of a souls is...an accurate description of behavior of something. If our accurate description of behavior is about a person, that description is information that can survive death. In this sense, it is immortal. Thank you CTT.
A soul is a person, the individual. It occupies a material body temporarily and moves on to another body after physical death after some time in the afterlife. It's called reincarnation. It is an impossibility to become nothing. One would have to be where there is no eternity. Impossible, eternity is infinite, beginningless, and everywhere.
Why do you think so?
Your memory is a huge portion of who you are, so if no memory continues then you have in effect indeed died. Point blank!
When everyone who knew you dies, then it is like you in never existed
During an episode of memory loss then you are dead and regained memory then alive again; I think not. There appears to be more to it than memory.
@@ventrust7507 Background awareness
@@ventrust7507seems like a ship of Theseus scenario
Even if we assume a materialist view on consiousness.... that the material universe produced our individual feeling of consious experience. What are the odds of this happening only one time, given the boundless nature across time and space of the universe?
If would argue that consciousness has happened billions of times, in each human and in som advanced animals.
If assuming materialism, consciousness are unlikely without life. We have really no idea how common life is in the universe so consciousness is even more difficult to guess.
God of the gaps.
But what I can’t understand is why we are souls can’t remember before we went in our body how are we supposed to remember when we leave our body . If there is no remembrance before matter how is there supposed to be a remembrance after matter.
I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.
Maybe there's a veil that prevents us from remembering so that we can focus on our present life, and said veil is lifted after we pass on, so we we can reflect on the life we just lived.
Well most certainly I don’t want to sound like an atheist . but what I think we need to do is really understand consciousness and our existence . is it that our minds play tricks on us because of the fears of the unknown after death and before life , could our Conscious minds see our fears as sort of a mirage seeing water in a desert when there is not.
It makes sense to me that you can't remember previous lives. Your soul is the immortal part. Your self, your personality, your mentality, your memories, are all mortal, and are "flushed" at death. I for one am glad I won't carry all of those encumberments into the next life --that is, if my belief is true. Perhaps your soul carries with it the lessons that really matter --about love and kindness for example, but not the multiplication tables.
I Also Believe in Higher Dimensions .. which i think is a big part of the mystery of the universe.
Brilliant video essay. One of Robert Kuhn’s very best.
Our immortal soul is what consciousness becomes when consciousness leaves human form.
There is no immoral soul. It's just wishful thinking.
The world always works in the most efficient way. Whatever its purpose is, throwing away a being that wasn't doing much
on a small planet but accumulate experience would be 100% inefficient and a waste of time and energy. So, obviously we are doing something here besides shoving dust around, as any explanation would require something that outlasts a human life. Not knowing what exactly is going on here does not negate the basic statement that something is going on here that is not 100% useless, and that something that we know nothing specific about is the soul. Although we actually do know a lot about it: it has free will, memory and a first-person view.
Having studied molecular biology, I can guarantee you that the world does not work in the most efficient way. The waste of cellular systems is considerable.
If the doctrine of immaterial soul is not biblical where did the idea of afterlife come from? If a soul doesn't survive, what does?
@DOC TOR I agree, but I was referring to the specific group of individuals described in the bible who were willing to sacrifice their very life for Jesus without him even being present...Without some kind of afterlife; with or without a soul, their belief in some kind of reward wouldn't be justified... They believed they could live again...So, going back to the immortal soul, if it is not a biblical teaching, and the followers of Jesus had a strong conviction they could live again, because some of them perhaps witnessed Jesus bringing people back to life, what survives death? How is the "self " preserved, if there's no soul?
As always, I love your discussions, Robert. Humans identify themselves as physical creatures, so it's understandable that many scientists are hardcore materialists. But if you put your hand on a sheet of photographic film on top of a metal discharge plate, the resulting photograph will show an energy field around the hand that is invisible to our senses - a Kirlian photograph. To account for phenomena in the observable universe that seemingly defy the laws of physics as we understand them, string theory posits between 10 and 26 dimensions. If extra dimensions exist, isn't it possible and even reasonable that there are dimensions of the human person that lie beyond our physical senses? Could this be the basis for ESP, souls, ghosts, transmigration and similar phenomena? Perhaps you could bring some string theorists into the conversation, and ask them.
For some reason, all i hear is 'if this is true...'.
We are pretty good at imagining all kinds of answers for the unknown.
And what else would we do? Not ask at all? Not imagine anything? Not even wonder? Even if we cannot answer them, it is in our nature to ask and to wonder why and how and if.
It's OUR purpose. An innate part of who we are as thinking, feeling conscious beings.
And in that sense, it has its advantages.
@@robbierude9833
Yes, we don't like not having an answer for everything. Even if we have to create an uninformed, but feel good answer.
I'm a Christian and I agree with you. Nothing is true until there is evidence.
@@antiNuetron ✔️
If it is true that when we die and there’s nothing else, no further journey, then why do I still find myself worrying about it!!. I have never looked for answers more than I have these last 5 years, and what have I found?. I don’t know any more than you, but intuition just seems to tell me there is more than this, isn’t there!??
Appeal to the fact that there are truths that are beyond the scope of Reason makes sense. What does not make sense is to pretend that these truths are accepted by Reason.
Truths are accepted by intuition. Reason is a by product of intuition and not always right. Intuition is always right.
Excellent video, thanks for posting, much appreciated. I love your work Dr. Kuhn. A+
Very thought provoking.
As a neurophysiologost, I would think that you would be aware of the multiple M.D. documented NDE anecdotes that show OOBE as a real, and objectively verifiable, phenomenon.
Scientific atheism functions as just another religion. And just like in religion, to divert from dogma is to commit heresy.
"I desperately don't want to believe in anything I can't touch, so I'll find a bunch of people from different backgrounds who believe as I do, then present it as, see, I must be right." Sad that some people want to believe that you die and that's it.
They are living in the matrix & if they don’t bring them selves to a higher vibrations that same soul he don’t believe is immortal he’ll be A lost soul in A dark place .
Is it not wanting to believe in an afterlife or not wanting to believe something false. Because I want an afterlife, im just having trouble finding evidence
@@spectrepar2458 If heaven is a place outside of the physical universe, then you won't see any physical evidence.
@@ronaldmorgan7632 ok so what about other evidence
I love this channel!
Instead of "souls," we should say "conscious personality," the very first principle of reality. Eternal, having a spiritual body (and very beautiful one at that!).
The soul is the living entity and it is eternal, as Krishna says in the Bhagavid-gita: " Material nature consist of three modes__ goodness, passion, and ignorance. When the eternal living entity comes in contact with nature, O mighty- armed Arjuna, he becomes conditioned by these modes."
I love the idea of immortal souls. But I don't HAVE a soul -- rather, I AM a soul. Else, who is the "I" that "has" the soul? Is the "soul" just some other thing that someone has -- and when they die, the soul leaves them?
However, as much as I like the idea, there's no consistent, reproducible evidence for it. It remains something that folks like to believe for several reasons, pretty much all of them emotional reasons.
Thanks for this one Dr Kuhn
We know how cells are broken down into molecules when we die.
I experience that our thoughts are more than electricity and chemicals in our nervous system, they form a whole something sort of building block - part of all our thoughts
When we die but sometimes during our life these building blocks can be transferred from person to person / new baby.
this is the process of reincarnation. A person is build up from more than one source of building blocks.
Immortal means here that these building blocks are ‘remembered’ or stay closer together.
Teh danger is that the same psychological problems are repeated over and over again.
Every statement about souls or afterlife in the video were assertions made by people who have no more information about that any other human that has ever existed. The plural of anecdote is not data. The plural of guessing is not fact. The plural of inference is not deduction. The plural of assertion is not evidence
True, but all knowledge starts with an idea - an exploration or description that we can at least see as coherent and that takes into account all the facets. Then we can try to support that idea - to show that it's true - which of course is where it all falls apart.
madmax2976 - Ideas might be based on a correct or incorrect interpretation of the evidence. Humans are predisposed to assign agency. Our best current resource is the scientific method. We should make sure the facts actually lead to the conclusion and be sure we are not starting with a presupposed idea and twisting the facts to agree with it. If the fact don’t confirm the idea it should be abandoned. Pardon if that’s what you were referring to.
@@jmaniak1 Sure, I'm just saying it doesn't hurt to engage in phase 1 so to speak: Can we make sense of this? Can we frame it coherently while incorporating all the parts? We have to start with something that at least gets us that far, then we can go to phase 2, phase 3, etc., coming up with real things we can test and verify and confirm. And when we can't - which is usually the case with these kinds of subject - we're just left with agnosticism and maybe a dash of hope.
madmax2976 - yes, unfortunately I think too many stop before the testable and repeatable phase because they find something that feels good. In the end there may be many questions we will never have the answers to. I’m not always comfortable saying I don’t know but sometimes it’s the only answer and we continue searching.
Hi, jamaniak1 -- I deeply appreciate your comments. I've heard your point expressed differently, but rarely (ever?) so well. Thanks, Dan
In this period of mankind we went beyond the physical into "virtual" which may be a crude form of non materialism.
Is it possible that this realm can go beyond to mind, consciousness or spirituality. . . .to something we do not understand yet?
I am not a religious person but the finality of death seems brutal so some of us cling on to the hope of something beyond
Finding soul in mental projection means granting immortality to mind. Who can see the one who see all. That's why it becomes null in the game of mental projection.
The immortal soul has been mixed up over the centuries with the spark of life; the spirit...There are some biblical references where the spirit, the spark of life making the inanimate matter animate, "goes back to God" after death... Some interpretations suggested it to be the evidence for afterlife in heaven...
The Biblical authors are clear that a "living soul" is dependent on "the breath of life in it's nostrils" to exist. If it loses that, it will "perish". (Kind of like what the county coroner would tell you.) But they go on to tell you to "seek after glory and honor, immortality and eternal life, whereunto you are called". (If you had/were an "immortal soul', you would possess immortality, rather than needing to seek after it.) Basically the missing ingredient is the Spirit of God, which could not enter the defiled vessel that is man; but the redemptive work of Christ changed this.
If you want to pretend you are naturally or intrinsically immortal, leave the Bible on the shelf. It doesn't support that illusion.
@@Nunya_Bidness_53 if one has an immortal soul, why would he need redemption? That's why hell, limbo and purgatory were made up...
@@tomashull9805 Theoretically, "hell" is just a metaphor for a state of disharmony with God, others, creation, and self within the soul; the reason it's inescapable is that the will ultimately atrophies and disintegrates. This is a way of excusing God, because he doesn't send you somewhere to be tortured forever, you simply are eternal and choose that which torments you until choice is no longer possible..
But such rationalizations are unnecessary if you merely distinguish between Greek philosophy and Hebrew monotheism.
@@Nunya_Bidness_53 What would 99% of Christians tell you what hell means to them?
@@tomashull9805 Doesn't matter, they just regurgitate heresy or go entirely apostate because the heresy makes no sense.
You have to use a tool called "audience relevance", what would Scripture have meant to those to whom it was addressed, by those who wrote it? None of the above were Greek philosophers or Gnostic mystics. They were Hebrews who thought in terms of "Sheol" where the dead abide in darkness, silence and inactivity. Not in punishment or reward. Life after death meant a resurrection, which would result in eternal life for the Godly, and a second death for the wicked. "Hell" is a misbegotten concept confusing various Biblical terms and metaphors.
Look at the verses they quote at you to scare you with the prospect of fiery eternal torment:
"Whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have everlasting life"
"The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
"He that has the Son has life. He that has not the Son has not life."
Apparently, this "Jesus" character has to hook you up with immortality before you can live forever; otherwise, at some point you cease to live at all. The idea of living forever on your own, in a place or condition of unending torture, is a non sequitur.
I love how religion always uses words like truth, education, facts and knowledge. This is all part of the indoctrination process.
Our souls are code. Our bodies are avatars. God(s) are the coder(s).
21:50 - put that into context of where Neuralink could go. By that definition, Elon is potentially making a divine ledger.
I wish Lawrence had asked Keith if all sentient beings had souls, or just humans.
Yes, that is a good question. All creatures that have ever lived are made of the same stuff, i.e., atoms and molecules of C, N, O, H, P, etc. If H. sapiens have an afterlife, than all other creatures should as well. What about a bacterium that died billions of years ago? Is its soul or essence floating around somewhere in the ether? What about a monkey that lived 10 million years ago? What about a Neanderthal that lived 100,000 years ago? Where is its soul now? Me thinks the whole idea of an immortal soul for any creature, including H. sapiens, is simply childish nonsense.
The soul is the energy that animates you and in so doing affects and alters the fields and their orientation. When the fields are perfectly aligned, the souls come together in bliss.
Beautiful and poetic way to perceive it. However, it has absolutely no evidence 😔 I think life is likely more chemical reactions/metabolism in concert with plenty of carbon, water, etc. to keep it going. Think of our bodies as mobile hot springs able to acquire what it needs to sustain the conglomeration of cells that constitute you. The soul/consciousness is likely emergent like so many other things. We don't know if it transcends into some naturalistic quantum realm upon death... Or simply ceases to be. However, it's selfish to expect or want to exist for eternity... And likely tied to the self preservation circuit in the mind.
Chemistry is particles. Particles are waves. I see energy as those waves moving in the fields. Its Newtons 3rd law (equal and opposite reaction). The wave / particle gets deflected and its field disoriented.
I wouldn't wanna live for eternity but who wouldn't wanna be there when the universe gets it right.
Some things are beyond measurement and human understanding.
What resonates with me is We reincarnate in many bodies until we realize who we are, a spiritual being, and all our aspect are integrated and whole. Thats support reap and sow. Some evil people lived and died without punishment. Coz i dont believe you die once in physical world and gets punished in spiritual. You cant judge a physical and punish spiritual because they are in different world. It's unfair. And you cant punish a spiritual, it has no form. So it needs to relive again. It supports Unconditional Love of God. The chances God gives. That every soul comes from God, and ONLY ends in God. Alpha and Omega. Life is not a test or audition, it is a game. Like a puzzle, you need to realize something. Game because game is more fun. And God is Joy. Thats the message of Jesus (Yeshua), remember who you are. You are God's children. That what you do to your brothers you do to God, you do to yourself, because we are all connected in spiritual world. Scientifically, Is there an immortal soul? Is there an immortal energy? (Reference reading: Laws of Thermodynamics)
The big problem with the 'soul' concept is one of identity - How do you retain an identity without a physical presence? You should explore that (if you ever read these comments.)
Excellent video. Thank you for sharing it with us :)
I seem to remember that in one of his Meditations in First Philosophy, Descartes says that he can survive without his body.
I think we are immortal we keep coming back, we don't make to eternity, I hope eventually we all make throng brighter side, in this life and the next one estay in the light.
What's so wrong with non-existence? We've all tried existence and, honestly, it's not that great, is it? Losing all the worries, insecurities, embarrassments, pains etc, of existence could be a blessed (sorry) relief.
It would be an insult to Eternity to have so many grossly flawed people with immortal souls.
Wow..."the consciousness is so obvious (implied as a separate from brain)...how anyone can deny it"..."look around, ground looks obviously flat around us, how can anyone deny earth is flat". And some theologians call scientists arrogant. Simply wow. Are we supposed to rely on human perceptions for understanding reality? Time and again we have found human perceptions are error prone.
"Look at the complexity of life; how can anyone deny that it was created by a god? It surely wasn't a mere product of blind chance!"
@@danielfelipe1606 Read Richard Dawkins's Blind Watchmaker.
@@SandipChitale I did! A very delightful read! My comment above was meant to be a parody of creationists when they say that natural selection is "ramdom". But that assertion of creationists - just like every other they make - is spurious.
During near death experience when brain shut down his functioning , they still counscious and awareness about their resuscitation by doctors , this prove that counscious is independent entity from brain .
@@gure1686 Remember near death experience (NDE) is NOT after death experience. Total death is not an instantaneous process, parts of the body are alive over that process. And sometimes this process of death is stopped and that is when we have NDE.
It is true that the legal definition of death is at an arbitrary instant when the doctor writes it down to be.
Also note in dreams we can be skiing on Alps, or during a drug trip (LSD, DMT) people experience all kinds of weird experiences because of chemical imbalance in brain. Sometimes near death there is hypoxia, lack of oxygen in the brain. That causes hallucinations.
None of this IMO says anything about consciousness being something separate from brain. Have you seen free standing consciousness anywhere? I have not.
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not religious anymore. Too much to confuse one's mind.
Soul is consciousness in body / human, similar to awareness is consciousness in the mind. The soul connects the human body / whole person to conscious experience of reality, so that the whole person participates in conscious reality. The soul likely returns to consciousness / God at death of body, which may be called immortality.
indeed we are One with the universal Soul the Omnipresence the ATMAN we are a microcosm of the infinite soul.
It's interesting to note that the Bible view and the views of Philip Clayton also have the same point: God does remember everything we were and are, he knows our deep thoughts and emotions, along with each atom of our bodies (Psalm 139:15,16), which together make up our personality, our soul that is an inseparable living and breathing being (Genesis 2:7). The Bible says, every soul belongs to God (Ezekiel 18:4) and he, as the Greatest Programmer and Designer, longs to bring them back to life, especially those ones, who long to listen and obey his word of love (Job 14:14, 15). These verses state that God longs to see the work of his hands alive again. There's nothing impossible for the Almighty. And apostle Paul stated the same in Acts 24:15 - he believed in "resurrection of the righteous and unrighteous". This view is supported throughout the Bible, the Old and New Testament. Even Jesus cited Psalm 37:29 telling that the meek ones will possess the earth and will live forever on it (Matthew 5:5) and he stated multiple times of the resurrection in the final day that is yet to come (John 11:23-25). Martha, the sister of Lazarus who was resurrected by Jesus, stated the same (John 11:24). The true Christian hope based on the Bible is the resurrection of living beings on Earth in accord with God's original design to make a global Paradise (Genesis 1:28 "And God blessed them: and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth".).
It all depends how one see himself, either he is a body with a soul, or a soul with a body.
Naturalism leads to the yet unexplained sensation of mind.
Theology leads to everything unexplained!
It doesn't matter what explanation you happen to arrive at with regard to reality.
The simple fact of existence forces ones hand.
Whatever the fundamental cause of it, divine or mundane, that thing must be acausal.
Accepting that, one must necessarily accept everything else.
The personality and memories of an individual, ( the soul ) must therefore, exist immaterially, regardless of the presence of it's likeness in any given material medium.
Orthodox Judaism does hold by the idea of an immortal soul and re-incarnation. You interviewed a conservative Rabbi whose view Orthodox Jews do not follow. There is an old classic work Shaarei Gilgulim, which deals with reincarnation of souls, and it is well known that the Arizal was able to discern who people had been in their previous lives. I would suggest that you learn more about your roots from an orthodox group such as Lubavitch and then most of the questions you have would become self evident. Also look at near death accounts, of which there are many on the Internet to see the process involved. Look especially at Robert Schwartz who explains that we plan our lives before birth and agree to the main challenges we will face here, which are pre-determined, in order to provide an appropriate level of spiritual challenge. He states that each person has a number of spiritually advanced souls assigned to him in the next world to assist him in that endeavour. Also there are a number of possible different Realms we can go to, not just the one we are familiar with here. G-D is immortal and so are our souls.
Robert presents his work as a search for truth. I admire the form and the substance of his search: it is elegant and it discusses powerful ideas. He's been doing that for a while. I like to invite Robert to share with his viewers a summary of the main ideas appear clear to him so far. Something solid and true like the Pythagoras theorem in mathematics. An episode where he is interviewed.
I find nothing comforting in the idea of an immortal soul. Think about living forever. It's horrifying!
According to you
that is odd in those videos the religious philosophers or the theologians dont talk about "spirit". In Christian theology, the human is constituted of 3 parts, not 2. Human is composed of body, soul and spirit. I think the soul according to new testament is mortal (mind attached to the world) while spirit is immortal (mind attached to the "heaven")
Let me put the old Jewish concept in simple words- "You live and you die, with nothing more." That may be an eternal pleasure for the life given. However, it can also just be "human thought". Even an atheist can have this human thought and say, "You live and you die, with nothing more." So, the Jewish philosopher's concept may not be really exclusive, because everybody knows what death is.
It's stupid
@@firstal3799 Give me more words. I don't understand your comment.
i Think the immortal part , is the communality in all views that might come from the simplicity of our essence, the lighter your essence is the easier it is to retransfer into something else without the same identity .. enlightened beings have walked the earth, mostly focusing on spirituality and the soul, in my view a spiritual essence is very light in terms of weight , it doesn't take much to move it around, i think that's why spiritualism have survived and taken many forms, because it doesn't require an specific identity, many people inherit spiritual essence and carry it out in different ways .. the way i see it we are made of body, soul and spirit each one correlating to the image of god, which is the holy trinity .. Again i am an atheist and just try to make sense out of things out of an specific premises, i am not a believer, i am just proposing a theistic point of view: continuing .. i think the Soul is heavier it requires a lot more effort to keep a soul alive and it usually identifies with an defined identity in a level lower, the body is the subject in which those higher levels involve themselves with in order to create experience, As i see experience is the learning process , of soul and spiritual development .. as for how they correlate to the divine or the biblical God, I think the spirit is the identity of the holy spirit, the soul God as the Father, and the body Maybe the Son or lower form in which subjects itself to the aspects of existence for the purpose of experience. Each individual as creations in God Image as the bible says, carries within those 3 aspects, of body , soul and spirit .. The way the body Interacts with those aspects of our created existence is through the brain and the mind .. again experience , a learning process for the development of soul and spirit.
Is soul an immaterial backup of person’s brain which is constantly synchronizing with it?
There cannot be just energy and matter, but a third party conservator , like a ribbon of fabric into which the designs of events are woven by their parley of matter and energy having an attachment to a background which seems as a void or empty space, but is being embroidered by the weave of matter and energy leaving a trail of data memory explaining every event and every force behind every event as it attaches to a third party of empty voids , however the voids are something else of another condition that takes responsibility to remember all that ever came and went through these empty places. This is an artistic technique to capture the image of what the artist saw in his mind.
I like the program and topic. I disagree with the basic premise of the speaker, that consciousness arises our of matter. If youve read any of the literature from Science and Non Duality, you may be aware that there is no evidence that consciousness arises from matter. You dont need to postulate an immortal soul to also postulate the primacy of consciousness. Delving deep into that possibility, one begins to see (to know) that even in this “appearance” of being an ego (individual, autonomous soul), one is actually, and timelessly always just consciousness, and that you’ve never not been that. Study Vedanta.
people talking to each other about things they can't prove except for everybody agreeing whether they're true or not. Meanwhile, life goes on
And?
Immortal souls? Dont tell the government. Immortal taxation will be next.
Please talk to Dr Stephen Meyer if you want truly sound answers
There is more than one good reason why humans believe in the immortality of the Soul, but there is no good evidence to believe it.
Until one has had a near death experience oneself. BUt then it is knowledge, not belief.
@@Tardis216 A near-death experience provides evidence that cannot be transferred to our fellow men. The reason is characterized by trying to find "shared truths". Here we try, using Reason, to find common truths. I value near-death experiences, but unfortunately they do not contribute to a rational dialogue, for the moment.
@@guillermobrand8458 There is a possibility for reasoning, I think. Some physicists think consciousness is fundamental. I know they are right (I had a NDE myself). It is interesting to keep an eye/ear on what people like David Chalmers and Donald Hoffman have to say about consciousness. And I think that Erik Verlinde is on the right track too. He's developing a new theory, based on emergence. Based on what I experienced during my NDE I expect them to be representatives of brakethroughs in physics, where consciousness is fundamental and the cause of all matter.
Clever
@@Tardis216 facebook.com/guillermo.b.deisler/posts/10221889971174371
There's a problem that exists in that people assume immortality of the soul would mean they would maintain being "themselves" (that is, this particular being of this particular time) forever. But isn't it just a lack of imagination that prevents us from identifying with what it's like to be someone else...or even to be a tree? We should abandon the domination of "self" identity and learn to identify with the universal spiritual Source of all life-force that IS truly immortal.
So, if you cut the corpus collosum, you have a person with two different sets of experience, one for the left hemisphere and one for the right, and those can develop with different memories and conflicting motivations. So how many immortal souls are there here before and after the corpus collosum is cut? And what if we then reconnect them, how many now?
The idea of the soul as distinct from the body is demolished by this fact.
When two people communicate, that communication is an analogue of communication between the two hemispheres via the corpus collosum. So when two people communicate is there a unitary experience of that as we have a unitary experience of our two hemispheres?
There is a word for this unitary conscious experience born from communication. It’s called an egrigore. We are all egrigores. In fact this is the structure of consciousness.
If we take the approach that humanity is part of a simulation, a human being could be viewed as a tool whose purpose is to share its life experiences with whomever is in charge of the simulation. In such a framework the soul is simply a conduit to pipe that information out. When a human being dies, its conduit is disconnected from the simulation, hence the soul dies along with the simulated Body. When a new being is born, a new connection i.e. soul is created. The number of souls or connections is only limited by the processing power of the simulation.
All human development has come from intuition (the eureka moment) the heart knows more than the brain can even imagine. In my experience it, the heart is never wrong but the brain/ego is easily fooled.
There is a fundamental misconception right at the beginning of this episode that the "western religious tradition" is that the soul is separate from the body, leaves the body at death, etc. This is neither the Christian nor the Jewish tradition, as explained by Christian and Jewish scholars during the show.
So the last person he talks to sounds like he believes we live on basically in gods mind of us, like in his memory which unlike ours is something actually that is actually more than just passing thoughts. Something outside of time and is of literal substance. Maybe not atoms, but something. This to me makes total sense. Especially if you give any credence to NDE’rs. Many of them say they experienced this oneness with the universe and understood everything there is to know. And could feel what the other person felt that you have had any communication or experience with. If you had cause that person pain or something that’s what you would experience from their perspective. So I guess what I’m saying is that we don’t have a soul within us but, being in Gods memory, or his mind, if you will, has that same effect and value. It make sense when you think of the scriptures that said The God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob is the God of the living , not the dead. Those individuals are in effect alive bcoz of being in Gods mind or memory. Which translate to actually living there at the very moment of there death till now and ofcourse eternally. That’s why Paul said as well to be absent from the body is to be with the lord. It all makes sense to me now. The thing we should concern ourselves with is how do we make sure we remain in Gods memory. Is it something we earn here on earth? Or is it automatic at death? I believe God sending his son Jesus here to redeem us shows there’s requirements that must be meant first to avail ourselves of this opportunity and gift. He ,is the conduit.
When you are asleep, dreams are your reality, difficult to discern what is real or not ...
Same with life, it is only a dream compared to the afterlife, which is the ultimate reality. A reality where you're experiences are not confined to 5 physical senses.....
In order for something to have value it must be finite. Nothing unlimited is precious, including life.
How do we know consciousness cannot be reduced to particles or fields or something more fundamental? We don’t know much about consciousness.
If the definition of a soul is something only you can have wouldn’t position and history of interaction be the only two things that are always different between two things. A basic example would be two dots that have identical structure but will always have a difference in distance you can just not eliminate.
with that logic you can say humans are just hiveminds of “souls” like how you would consider individuals making up a society an organism.
If I may, Plato was right, spirit is real, and this man's problem with the idea of an immortal soul is essentially that he is wholly enamoured with his corporal body. When his flesh has melted from his bones, which in turn finally rot and crumble, do you suppose his spirit will be willing and able to serve the merciful powers? Or will it seek only to rest with the remnants of his body? I believe for such souls eons will pass by unnoticed, as they shall be wakened only in the final redemption, when matter is made energy.
Of course, it's entirely unreasonable to suppose that someone who has never personally encountered a thing might understand the actual nature of the thing they speculate does not exist. Surely, they think, they could not be so unlucky and others must be lying. But it seems entirely ironic when the truly ignorant, those without even the foggiest notion of the actual nature of the subject, believe they can help enlighten others to "understand" that the thing which exists but of which they have no understanding, does not exist. This is actually prototypical of a great failing of "western thought". A lack of humility is ultimately at fault. It is mistakenly believed that a single human individual is the apex summit of existence and possible understanding. The limitations inherent to a single individual human are ignored and denied. What is incomprehensible to that individual is declared to be meaningless, what is unknown declared to be nonexistent.
Of course, this is a silly mistake. But it corrupts "western thought" at a profound and foundational level. It lies at the heart of nihilism with essentially the ludicrous proposition "because the world is incomprehensible to me, it is meaningless". ( or, "the ultimate meaning of existence is completely beyond my grasp, therefore I shall insist that there is no such ultimate meaning"). The immodesty also lies as the root justification of philosophoc postmodernism, here, "because I can know, that ultimately there is no way I can determine what is true instead of not true, I therefore declare that the concept of truth is meaningless, and there is no such thing as the truth, every narrative is equally true". While such a philosophical "foundation" might help assuage feelings of guilt from those persuaded to the efficacy of deceit, it is entirely unhealthy to human wellbeing in the large context. Yes, we think we need to deceive others in order to take advantage of them, to cheat on sex partners, to profit, to defend capitalism, imperialism and other forms of systematized human exploitation, to get funding for science research, we stretch and manipulate and "create" "the truth".
AND I think Western culture needs a renaissance, where, as a culture, we wholesale abandon the "justifiability" of deceit in order to "get ahead", abandon the idea that some people must be preditors and some prey, abandon the idea that everything is essentially a competition where the strongest thrive while the weakest must suffer or perish. We must instead embrace the idea that we are all small contributors to a much greater whole and larger, albeit fundamentally unknowable purpose. - where we have respect for and seek cooperation with, and to assist one another. -where guile goes unrewarded, and fairness, justice and equity are regarded as socially vital as are healthy diets. -where the truth is revered and misdirection is scorned. Ok, yeah, in some ways becoming more like the Chinese, but not necessarily genetically, - complementary, harmonious yet non-convergent.
Yeah, well, we need to do something like this, because, in case you haven't noticed, we're basically getting flushed. And time is of the essence, but mass hunger will probably provide sufficient impetus to get things started.
I wish they would have explained further why they believe Christian and Jewish religion does not support the idea of an immortal soul. It seems all Jesus spoke about was eternal life and not focusing on this life or this world. I can’t understand how they justify those statements about Christianity and I would like to understand it better.
Otherwise, I love this channel and am so glad to have found it! Such awesome topics covered, very interesting!
Wait! I thought Ed Feser had definitively proven that humans have immortal souls and can spend eternity in heaven, which will provide them so much bliss they won't care that their pets Fido and Fluffy don't have that privilege. Are you saying that Feser's word games and convoluted logic puzzles aren't convincing anyone but Thomist cultists? I'm shocked!
If there is any understanding to be gleaned for a Western mind, then it must grapple with the meaning of the saying "what does it profit a man to gain the whole world but lose his own soul".
How does this question clarify the concept of soul? First off, how does one lose one's soul? Is the soul like a watch? Can we give it away? Secondly do we possess our own soul? If we own it or possess it then who owns it, who gives it away? This implies that the mind is different from the soul. Thirdly it is said "when the soul leaves the body, the body dies". If we give away our soul do we die? Or can we live with someone else owning our soul, and only relinquish it when we die? What would life be like with someone else owning our soul? Would it be like a robot or would our "will" be owned by someone else? Is soul connected to will, howso?
Finally if we do possess our own soul why would we ever give it away? How could we ever give it away? If the soul and will and mind are separate, which has jurisdiction over the others? What would the will and mind be like with someone else owning their soul? What would the soul be like without a will and mind?
The funny thing about souls is that their proponents never really accurately define what a soul is. How convenient. In Buddhism there is no soul but there is consciousness. That consciousness is unborn, undifferentiated, composed of light and devoid of duality. In Buddhism all sentient beings are composed of light and possess the potential to become Buddha. "Luminous beings we are. Not this crude flesh." This is our true state of existence and if we don't have the awareness of it now at some point in the future we will. Buddhism accepts that past, and future are not in fact real. That the only thing that is real is this eternal present moment. Quantum Mechanics says the same thing.
Yes, the common mistake is to be wondering in a linear time ('what will become of us?', 'where are we coming from?', but time seems to be an emergent property. Unfortunately Buddhism is also speaking about a start and an end on everything, I never heard them say that past and future are not real. The eternal present is mostly a 'new age' philosophy deduction. I'm feeling that removing time from the equation is the key to better understand our nature.
The Soul is from Plato and Hell is from Dante. Neither come from religious writing. The ability of humans to have abstract thought is a great temptation. Because I can imagine what I know does not exist, I can also believe what I can imagine does exist. In short if I can create a word for something, then that something very likely exists.
Why do u never distinguish between claims n evidence of a claim??
I cant believe you cant find out the exact value of human senses and human thought as we are looking forward to our future life from our present time. You can sensely find out what they might exactly feel at the same time they are living right now. You will find there devine soul finally and just do nothing.
The moment of the conciousness departing the physical body is somewhat incomprehensible by word.Ir is like finding oneself in another place without a minute struggle-as it was designed to be so yet isnmore frightening than death itself because it undermines all applied reasoning.