I agree with this view at lower weight classes but at upper weight classes it is a different story. Takedowns at the upper weight classes in BJJ are super important and I think judo would be worth it in that case
I believe that the martial arts that require reflexive compound movements should be learned first as there is a window of learning them and internalizing them in your youth and then you can go to the more thought out martial arts like bjj. As it happens with judo making it quite hard for adults to learn how to be effective and almost automatic in throws and breaking falls I see that in striking it happens the same. I see that is easier to teach boxers how to grapple than it is to teach grapplers how to be effective in striking as their movements seem to be very robotic and delayed as you don't have any time to think your actions and they need to flow out as a reflexive almost automatic action
From what i see and understand, if you havent been exposed to a variety of movements patterns through sports by the time your in teens, itll be very very hard to acquire certain skills later. Genetics have to be factored in as well
To me, this is more a criticism of the scoring system in BJJ. A scoring system for any sport martial art should at least have some relationship to the actual martial application. Otherwise, it shouldn't even be called a martial art anymore. A throw can be decisive in a real fight. It is the whole match in Judo. But it is only 2 points in BJJ? And that is only if you stay on top for 3 seconds? Back control is nothing in Judo or a street fight. Yet it is 4 points in BJJ. It is a superior position to be in, but back control does not end a real fight. This rift between the sport scoring and the value on the street will eventually water down BJJ as a real martial art, as it has for other martial arts.
It is indeed a criticism of the scoring system in BJJ. If a take down isn't worth much and is only scored if you have control for seconds, then it's not worth the effort in the beginning. The practitioners aren't going to be really motivated to grind to build throw knowledge and ability. I an experience trying to teach a BJJ blue belt some throws but he wasn't about learning Sumi Gaeshi and the other sutemi that land you in either guard or mount. He saw it quicker and more beneficial to him to essentially pull guard or grab and fall.
Some ideas: Adapt throws for bjj instead of doing them the same way you would in judo; identify how you can land in positions where it is easier to transition to control and submission. Also adapt grips starting with standing, focus on grips which lead to control and your best submissions after landing on the ground. Come up with creative (and quick 😅) ways of countering the guard pull. Learn basics of judo/bjj first, and how to escape bad positions before incorporating into your personal combat plan.
That is such an easy answer. OF COURSE, judo is worth to BJJ. I’ve commented here many times. Learn how to thrown or take down someone is incredible important. Judo has many techniques that can be used efficiently. In addition to it you learn how to fight standing, what is very difficult and incredible physically demanding. Also, the advantage of taking someone down brings a great advantage. The justification that you throwing someone might put you in a danger position it is not valid in my view, any attack potentially put you in a danger position, but the psychological predominance over the opponent that understands that YOU are danger is half of the way to victory. Summarizing, BE DANGEROUS. No fear of ground fight, no fear standing.
hmmm. Well - yes all atacks are dangerous but youre using the "zooming out" trick on this one. There are certainly "less dangerous" attacks with lesser "risk". Foot sweeps and ashi waza seem to be a bit less dangerous then full blast seois or tomoenages Some advantages wrestling holds (imo) is that you are using a bit more of attacks where you standing chest to chest
Unadulterated Truth. These two men are truth seekers, not marketeers & profiteers pushing an "industry" for lucre. That's why I support these two men's channels.
Question for ya OG! From a fellow O.G. If a decent Blue Belt stopped training BJJ for 4-5 years and got a Judo Black Belt: How much better at BJJ would he be when he returned? A better blue belt? Purple? Maybe even brown belt level? If he never quit BJJ he’d likely be a brown or even black belt. Thanks for the insight!!
BJJ players are not all guard players!! Many are better top players and the stand up is a lot of wrestling….I wrestle judo players and rarely get thrown… unless I play Judo with them … then I get launched!!! 😂😂
I wish I had started with Judo rather than BJJ six and a half years ago. I have been training Judo during open mats with the Judokas at our place 3x week after my rolling rounds for the last year and it’s been amazing!
Judokas transitioning to BJJ is not like you said “because of fun or injuries” sure there may be cases for injuries but mainly Judokas transitioning to doing BJJ is because of the ground fighting that BJJ specialises in.
The way to make judonthrows count for more in bjj, be mean with them... Go for the violent finisher throw... A good o goshi that goes really hard and land on them but didengage... He will have to stand up, then repeat... Untill they cant breath because of the busted ribs... But you have to be evil with it...
@@flaminminigod if he sits to guard without pulling you down you just stand arms on your waist, 3 feet aeay and look at the referee until he makes him stand, if he tries pulling guard, i have a secret forbidden technique that works well... Try to get into halfguard and press their nuts until castration... Its not allowed but disuades them from trying that again
you should Check out Dan the Wolfman Theodore MMA fighter trained 35 years & Boxer Bryant Perrella. I love Sambo & Greco Roman Wrestling I trained in & Systema Boxing & Tangsoodo. God bless 🙏👍🥋🥊🥊
I wish they had something just called grappling. It would combine all of them: wrestling, bjj, and judo and any other new/old grappling strategies that work. It would eliminate the vulnerabilities of trying to learn two different systems and smooth out the holes. So many wrestlers are dominating mma. I just don't get why more mma schools don't teach wrestling to adults. A very good wrestler that is just blue belt in bjj can be very dangerous if you put them in mma. I rolled with them the good ones are fucking strong. I usually end up on my back. Not always a good thing when you actually doing mma, although it isn't so much a problem with just pure bjj because no one is striking you.
I do not know but judo has something that really attracts me, I only do bjj and I am a white belt one strip, so I only know to tie my belt and gained a lot of wrist strength from all the tapping. The only thing I am not that sure about is if I can keep up with training both (one day bjj the other judo in an alternate fashion) and also hitting the gym, lol.
It’s possible but you’d need to structure it properly. Watch this vid, i touch on a rules of thumb on how to manage your trainings. th-cam.com/video/mx3ERAQun8M/w-d-xo.html Osu🙏🥋🙇♂️
I'm in the worst scenario now. I'm Brown belt in Judo and White belt (2 stripes) in BJJ. In my First BJJ match I tried to apply Judo in the standing game, but It was very hard. In Judo my position Is not so straight and I fall down too much. I'm rigid in both disciplines, but I love both! ❤😂
@@OGFITNESS he evaded my takedowns with fixed arms continuosly for almost three minutes, but at the end, when we went to the ground, he strangled me with his forearm. :(
@@OGFITNESS yes, I manage it well. But I'm not esplosive in takedowns and I don't believe to finish the entire action with a firm decision. It was an experience! ;)
Chadi is not saying what your saying. It seems like your (OG) too concerned with making Judo seem superior….neither is superior…they are from the same family… the martial artist makes the art….
I agree with this view at lower weight classes but at upper weight classes it is a different story. Takedowns at the upper weight classes in BJJ are super important and I think judo would be worth it in that case
I believe that the martial arts that require reflexive compound movements should be learned first as there is a window of learning them and internalizing them in your youth and then you can go to the more thought out martial arts like bjj. As it happens with judo making it quite hard for adults to learn how to be effective and almost automatic in throws and breaking falls I see that in striking it happens the same. I see that is easier to teach boxers how to grapple than it is to teach grapplers how to be effective in striking as their movements seem to be very robotic and delayed as you don't have any time to think your actions and they need to flow out as a reflexive almost automatic action
From what i see and understand, if you havent been exposed to a variety of movements patterns through sports by the time your in teens, itll be very very hard to acquire certain skills later. Genetics have to be factored in as well
To me, this is more a criticism of the scoring system in BJJ. A scoring system for any sport martial art should at least have some relationship to the actual martial application. Otherwise, it shouldn't even be called a martial art anymore. A throw can be decisive in a real fight. It is the whole match in Judo. But it is only 2 points in BJJ? And that is only if you stay on top for 3 seconds? Back control is nothing in Judo or a street fight. Yet it is 4 points in BJJ. It is a superior position to be in, but back control does not end a real fight. This rift between the sport scoring and the value on the street will eventually water down BJJ as a real martial art, as it has for other martial arts.
It is indeed a criticism of the scoring system in BJJ. If a take down isn't worth much and is only scored if you have control for seconds, then it's not worth the effort in the beginning. The practitioners aren't going to be really motivated to grind to build throw knowledge and ability. I an experience trying to teach a BJJ blue belt some throws but he wasn't about learning Sumi Gaeshi and the other sutemi that land you in either guard or mount. He saw it quicker and more beneficial to him to essentially pull guard or grab and fall.
They work so well together
Some ideas: Adapt throws for bjj instead of doing them the same way you would in judo; identify how you can land in positions where it is easier to transition to control and submission. Also adapt grips starting with standing, focus on grips which lead to control and your best submissions after landing on the ground. Come up with creative (and quick 😅) ways of countering the guard pull.
Learn basics of judo/bjj first, and how to escape bad positions before incorporating into your personal combat plan.
That is such an easy answer. OF COURSE, judo is worth to BJJ. I’ve commented here many times. Learn how to thrown or take down someone is incredible important. Judo has many techniques that can be used efficiently. In addition to it you learn how to fight standing, what is very difficult and incredible physically demanding. Also, the advantage of taking someone down brings a great advantage. The justification that you throwing someone might put you in a danger position it is not valid in my view, any attack potentially put you in a danger position, but the psychological predominance over the opponent that understands that YOU are danger is half of the way to victory. Summarizing, BE DANGEROUS. No fear of ground fight, no fear standing.
hmmm.
Well - yes all atacks are dangerous but youre using the "zooming out" trick on this one.
There are certainly "less dangerous" attacks with lesser "risk".
Foot sweeps and ashi waza seem to be a bit less dangerous then full blast seois or tomoenages
Some advantages wrestling holds (imo) is that you are using a bit more of attacks where you standing chest to chest
Judo and BJJ use to be the art but their completely different now
Didnt Jigoro Kano also say in his book that if you focus mostly on groundwork..
your standing techniques will be hindered.
Hi - could you maybe name the title of that book youre referring to?
That makes sense
@@captainkirk7513 ill try to find it, osu!
Unadulterated Truth. These two men are truth seekers, not marketeers & profiteers pushing an "industry" for lucre. That's why I support these two men's channels.
Your support is truly appreciated, thank you
Appreciate the support brother! Osu!
Question for ya OG! From a fellow O.G.
If a decent Blue Belt stopped training BJJ for 4-5 years and got a Judo Black Belt: How much better at BJJ would he be when he returned? A better blue belt? Purple? Maybe even brown belt level?
If he never quit BJJ he’d likely be a brown or even black belt.
Thanks for the insight!!
BJJ players are not all guard players!! Many are better top players and the stand up is a lot of wrestling….I wrestle judo players and rarely get thrown… unless I play Judo with them … then I get launched!!! 😂😂
I wish I had started with Judo rather than BJJ six and a half years ago. I have been training Judo during open mats with the Judokas at our place 3x week after my rolling rounds for the last year and it’s been amazing!
Judokas transitioning to BJJ is not like you said “because of fun or injuries” sure there may be cases for injuries but mainly Judokas transitioning to doing BJJ is because of the ground fighting that BJJ specialises in.
Theres that too
The way to make judonthrows count for more in bjj, be mean with them... Go for the violent finisher throw... A good o goshi that goes really hard and land on them but didengage... He will have to stand up, then repeat... Untill they cant breath because of the busted ribs... But you have to be evil with it...
I mean what if he doesn’t stand up and just sits to guard
@@flaminminigod if he sits to guard without pulling you down you just stand arms on your waist, 3 feet aeay and look at the referee until he makes him stand, if he tries pulling guard, i have a secret forbidden technique that works well... Try to get into halfguard and press their nuts until castration... Its not allowed but disuades them from trying that again
Okay psycho
you should Check out Dan the Wolfman Theodore MMA fighter trained 35 years & Boxer Bryant Perrella. I love Sambo & Greco Roman Wrestling I trained in & Systema Boxing & Tangsoodo. God bless 🙏👍🥋🥊🥊
I wish they had something just called grappling. It would combine all of them: wrestling, bjj, and judo and any other new/old grappling strategies that work. It would eliminate the vulnerabilities of trying to learn two different systems and smooth out the holes. So many wrestlers are dominating mma. I just don't get why more mma schools don't teach wrestling to adults. A very good wrestler that is just blue belt in bjj can be very dangerous if you put them in mma. I rolled with them the good ones are fucking strong. I usually end up on my back. Not always a good thing when you actually doing mma, although it isn't so much a problem with just pure bjj because no one is striking you.
I do not know but judo has something that really attracts me, I only do bjj and I am a white belt one strip, so I only know to tie my belt and gained a lot of wrist strength from all the tapping. The only thing I am not that sure about is if I can keep up with training both (one day bjj the other judo in an alternate fashion) and also hitting the gym, lol.
It’s possible but you’d need to structure it properly. Watch this vid, i touch on a rules of thumb on how to manage your trainings.
th-cam.com/video/mx3ERAQun8M/w-d-xo.html
Osu🙏🥋🙇♂️
americans thinks that judo is only stand up?? NO, judo is more ground than stand up, its called judo ne waza, and that was teached to Gracie brothers.
The average BJJ bliue will destroy the average Judo black belt on the ground
I'm in the worst scenario now. I'm Brown belt in Judo and White belt (2 stripes) in BJJ. In my First BJJ match I tried to apply Judo in the standing game, but It was very hard. In Judo my position Is not so straight and I fall down too much. I'm rigid in both disciplines, but I love both! ❤😂
Interesting, what happened?
@@OGFITNESS he evaded my takedowns with fixed arms continuosly for almost three minutes, but at the end, when we went to the ground, he strangled me with his forearm. :(
@@daviderusso1238 hmmm… you didnt manage to establish kumi kata dominance?🤔
@@OGFITNESS yes, I manage it well. But I'm not esplosive in takedowns and I don't believe to finish the entire action with a firm decision. It was an experience! ;)
The same old nonsense about judo vs Brazilian jujitsu; they are both jujitsu and the same.
haha '
How are they the same?
Chadi is not saying what your saying. It seems like your (OG) too concerned with making Judo seem superior….neither is superior…they are from the same family… the martial artist makes the art….
I dont think so