Depends if you’re trying to do an objective comparison! For a usual circumstance do what you like, but if I’d tried to change mic positions for the subjective “best” tone I’d never hear the end of it
I’ve owned a 2/12 redback cab for 9 months now and in 40 years of playing and owning many different speakers and configurations. The Redback is the best speaker I have ever owned.
I am running the Alnico/V30 in an Engl 2x12. It's brutal!!! Creamback H/Alnico: Something is missing..hard to describe ;) Testing g12H30/Alnico . Nur I am in love with the v30 again as Combo speaker especially. Alnico Sounds great alone,using the treble boost on the 906 Sennheiser is perfect!
The coolest thing about this setup is now you can get the alnico sound with many amps in a 1x12 or even have a stereo 2x12 and use two 50 watt amps, could even have one g12h75 creamback and one of these and have a vintage delicious sound without two many cabs.
Even for people who are just after vintage tones could use a VOX AC30 (which can put out over 33 watts when cranked), a JTM45 or even a Twin through a 1x12 and get gorgeous vintage tones. I was actually suprised how much I liked the alnico for distorted stuff in this clip, i tend to like alnico for jangly cleans and greenbacks and g12h30s for distorted tone but it sounded great especially blended.
BTW I have played in a stereo setup with Celestion Creams in 2x12 cabs for some time and they were a bit stiff at first but after 15 hours of band practice they mellowed and sounded great. I never really thought they were awesome enough to be that expensive and I reinstalled one G12H30 Anniversary and one Greenback (all well broken in) in each cabinet and I actually think the sound has improved. It's like the Creams were smooth and full but the Greenback/G12H30 setup is more - alive - somehow for the music I'm playing (ZZ TOP Tribute) and the volume levels we play seems to suit the smaller wattage speakers better
Really liked the bright yet not harsh attack of the Alnico Cream. Though, I also liked the fatness of the V30. Killer in-depth video. Thanks for posting! :)
I dug that as well. I'm wondering what the alnico cream mixed with a C-90 aka Black Shadow would sound like in studio or live for that matter. Been looking for 2 speakers to mix in with my mesa cabs also my cabs i use in studio and the alnicos just might be it.
I spoke just a little too soon with the comment I left on the Redback video just a moment ago. The AlNiCo Cream, like the AlNiCo Blue has got amazing treble extension, but without the harshness in the midrange of the Creambacks. The Redback seems amazingly neutral, almost high fidelity. The Vintage 30 has that definite mid pushed presence. I think of the combinations, I liked the AlNiCo Cream and Redback best, then the Cream and the Vintage 30 second. Really great demo! Now I'm having an ever harder time deciding between the AlNiCo Cream, the Vintage 30, and the Redback. Maybe I need a 3x12 with all three of them! :D
Say, Adam - An excellent comparison! No doubt about it, my clear preference is for the appropriately-named Cream, particularly due to its smoothness, typical of AlNiCo's silken, non-gritty character. What I'd really like to hear now is Celestion's four AlNiCo models-in pairs, if possible, so the Blue can be included as a benchmark, in the configuration most familiar to guitarists. If you currently have access to only single units of any of them, hearing the Blue, Ruby, Gold and Cream "cone-to-cone" would be grand. Cheers!
Alnico Cream, when your speaker costs more than your first Epiphone and Crate amp in 1998. Worth every penny though. Love mine. It tames obnoxious highs without robbing tone.
Yeah that Cream 90 watt with the Vintage 30 sounds great! I think thats going to be the ones I choose for my 2x12 Marshall cabinet. Now I need to start saving up $500 my wife doesn't see.
Janeen Clark , absolutely. I've been running Celestion Alnicos exclusively since my first one. You really can't go back once you've played them. You get too spoiled on how awesome they sound when driven by a proper tube amp.
great review thank you, I am getting my dislike of the Vintage 30 confirmed yet again :-) My main speakers are Greenbacks and G12H30 Anniversary, they always end up sounding most natural to my ears. That Redback is even uglier sounding than the Vintage 30 but the Creamback G12H75 takes the price for sounding absolutely terrible!! I just pulled one out af a cabinet because I didn't like the way it takes overdriven sounds and I can hear why here
I'm disappointed with h75 as well :( It exegarats all unwanted noise of touching, sliding strings while playing. It gives a bad feel... It is not balanced at all. It made me to do some temporary voicing mods to my amplifier, but I'm going back to v30. Then I will think about alnico cream or just single greenback with a simple reactive attenuator resistor/coil network inside a cab to protect the speaker from 65W amp.
Man I wish I’d got here sooner. Been struggling with a new modded JMP I picked up and now I know why. I’ve got a Redback and in the comparison I can see why I’m struggling. It’s all hiss and no growl compared to the V30 and the Alnico Cream and that’s what I’ve been struggling with... such a useful and informative vid. Btw what amp where you using?
Currently using red backs. Love these speakers. When the 30’s go to shit when hit with volume, the red back just gets bettter. It’s like a green back with endless headroom.
The breakup making it sound great is a very personal assessment. Why do some guitarists use a full stack? To spread the speaker load on the same output, limiting cone breakup? Just because it’s something you like, doesn’t mean it’s something everybody likes.
martyfriedman666 I should’ve been more clear. The upper mid range is what makes the greenback great imo. The red back possesses this upper mid that I’ve always loved in the greenback.
My amp Line 6 DTX25 combo amp speaker is a: CELESTION (backback) G12H-90, 12-Inch 90W 8ohm. My extension speaker cab is a: CELESTION G12H-75 Creamback, 12-Inch 75W 16ohm guitar speaker. Together they sound as good as any of the many different speakers I’ve used throughout the years. I also run that extension with a Mesa Recto-verb 25 and it delivers a thicker warmer all tube tone than even my 412 celestion greenies pushed by a vintage Ampeg VT-22 100watt. It sounds that good. The creambacks are excellent for classic rock and darker. Then turn around and get great warm jazz tones.
I have never seen professional studio engineers mic a speaker placing it on the cone. They always offset the the mic center to outer edge. Better tone!
Yep, 90 watter all the way. The fact that I'm already running this in an extension is clearly coloring my judgement - you could say my judgement is cream-colored (bad-dum tish)
For everything I've heard, I didn't like the cream for a high powered blue replacement....because it kinda of lacks that crang and boxiness and was a bit too smooth....well it seems with gain those non blue characteristics make it amazing, I love alnicos for low gain, never thought I would for high gain but here it slays the rest of them. Three years on I wonder if you could compare all the alnicos now offered.
I have a Gold but I don't like it that much on its own and I'm limited to a 1x12 enclosure. I like the Cream a lot in this video, but I like that Redback too.
I like ceramic speakers and alnico pickups. I can always dial in the sound of an alnico when the amp has a ceramic speaker...but it's hard to get the chime and sparkle on the cleans when the amp has an alnico speaker. Alnico speakers are all about that mid hump response you get that overdive thick without relying on pedals. But hey....who doesn't have tons of pedals?
I took off yammering about my crap below instead of adding: the Alnico cream and the vint 30 would be my choices. But...all are great. All a matter of taste. Great demo👍
Great video! I recently bought a Sheriff 22 from Victory (a JTM45 based amp). I coupled to a 1x12 creamback. I love the punchy cleans and clarity, and round midranges. However, I feel like when I move to high gain the top end is too spicky. Do you think that the Alnico Creamback would help in this regard? Thank you!!
To me this IS something you CAN EQ. When I installed a gold replacing a greenback I was able to cut back highs, presence and response on the amp vs with greenback. Because the Alnico has better response and before I was trying to help the speaker where it lacked. Might just be you need to reEQ for new speaker.
are you really recording in the center of the speakers? it gets really hard and trebly when I do that, I always end up a couple of inches from the edge about an inch inside the speaker
These will work fine with any wattage head, the rating is just a maximum for heat capacity. These are sensitive speakers, they’d be good even with a 1W output section
Great sounding speaker. Might not be worth the price upgrade if your amp has tone controls. I feel like the only guitar player that knows how to use tone controls.
Lol. If only it were that simple. Speakers are the final filter of your sound and each has their own inherent filtered signature based on their construction, etc. long story short you cant eq what a speaker doesn’t respond to.
Yes development has pressed on. But the harmonic richness comes at the expense of an over-saturated bass region. which suits heavy mixes but not so much other genres. The problem with all alnico based speakers is the articulation in the bass region, The transient detail exhibits less clarity, hence makes it more difficult to perceive low level detail and dynamic range. Two variables that are of no importance for higher gain genres but count wherever you need 'depth' to be perceived. So yes, some genres benefit from the progress made but other genres seek a different types of improvements. My point is that it is not easy to generalize and embrace new technology as an universal improvement. Further, as sound engineer you are obliged to care about pure 'audibility' and the "compression range" a given audio track offers you. The Vintage 30s are easier to compress because they appear to sound more transient, hence offer you more headroom as compared to the pre-compressed alnicos. In the audio world an increase in dynamic range and everything that comes with it is usually conidered 'progress'. The addition of 'crunch' or 'harmonic distortion' is something that usually originates from 'preamps' which are either to be categorized as transparent or coloring. Their transformers, capacitors and resistors are the main reason we are looking at a clearer audio picture today. which again is something not everybody appreciates. Science does what it always has done, it moves ahead which does not necessarily mean progress. But thanks for your review and point of view !
Fiasco Seven , I couldn't agree less. The headroom before breakup on the Alnico Cream far exceeds the headroom in the Vintage 30. Let's not confuse efficiency with lack of headroom. It's not even close. The transient response of Alnico vs Ceramic is negligible at best. If you have supporting test data that proves otherwise, I'd like the link. Perceived difference in transient response might be some artificial audible byproduct of the Alnico touch responsiveness, or ability to express subtleties that ceramics just cannot. Playing through a good Celestion Alnico, not some generic brand, is a revealing experience akin to removing the proverbial blanket. You lose nothing, and gain clean, pure unadulterated sound. To imply otherwise is preposterous.
Oh my god the Cream absolutely destroys the V30 as far as I’m concerned. Which is perfect because I’ve been looking for an alternative speaker for my Mark IV combo to complement the EVM-12L. 6:03 sweet jesus listen to that chime! Sounds three dimensional compared to the others.
Wich Combo you Like best for Metal/Rock. Alnico Cream + v30/g12H30/Greenback 25M China or creamback H? 😀 Getting a used alnico two years old for 200€ Euros!
2:33 I'm gonna have to disagree hard. Listen, I'm not listening with my wallet, but I got a 78 T1221 that is easily my best speaker. It's a recone, so not original, and I have no idea where they come from, by it wasn't the first recone speaker I've seen with a 1777 recone that is done locally. All I know is that it sounded better than the WGS Green Beret it came attached to, and like a million times better than the modern G12M that was in my Vox. When they were demoed at the electronics outlet A/B, I could EASILY tell which one sounded superior, and when I put it in my Vox, it was like my Vox sounded like I wanted. It pains me to listen to stock G12M's now. I haven't used a Pulsonic T1221 that's in amazing condition, but I have no doubt that my vintage T1221 is better than any other greenback I've heard. Not saying that some modern materials don't have their own thing going on vs classic paper cones, but I think it's safe to say that just because things have changed doesn't mean they're better.
I’m thinking of replacing my Greenback 1x12 with a Alnico Cream to go with my Friedman Runt 20, my Greenback is a bit too harsh and lacks low end warmth, do you think the alnico cream with warm and smooth my tone up? Great video’s btw, thanks.
Hey- in my experience the Alnico Cream is very mid-forward with a clear high end. If it’s low warmth you’re after maybe the Redback is the speaker of choice- check out the video we made on that speaker
Good work lad,,nice and concise in this context...i have a alnico cream back,it never disappoints, your viewers might want to check out the celestion 15" (linebacker ?) Loads of fruity growl...
thanks for your time!!!! this was a great video...I have two alnico cream, and love then so much because I can play in lower volumes with quality! ZERO BEE SOUND....hahahahahaa
Don’t see why not! It’s a 12 inch Celestion speaker, so it should be a straight swap. Is the C2 the 1 or 2 speaker model? Also make sure the impedance you’re switching out is the same as the old speaker
@@adamsteelproducer itnis a voxac30c2 with greenback 30watt with 8 ohm resistance. I am looking for a speaker with similar tone as the intro of your video that could replace the current ones on my amp :)
The voicing of this is unreal, i´ve never heard anything like it. The cut and articulation. Only thing in between me and that speaker is the 300€ price tag, lol. Thank you for taking the time to reply and for making these awesome videos :)
IR recorded music to my ears sound the same. Tube amps have different character, tone, voice and feel, modelers don't. The sound of this speaker comparison using modelers makes them sound basically the same.
With Alnico speakers we never know what kind of magnet is used to manufacture them. It's just incomprehensible! When you buy a guitar pickup you always know if it's an Alnico 2, 3, 4, 5 or 8, but unfortunately never for a speaker... why? On the other hand, the Vintage 30 has nothing to do with the sound of Alnico speakers. It just sounds lifeless!
What? Alnico is exactly what it says, the magnet is iron core with AlNiCo, that is to say aluminium, nickel and Cobalt in the alloy. What is there not to know? And with ceramic magnet speakers do you know the exact chemical composition there as well? Perhaps nobody asks because they sound great so why get any more technical than necessary as the layman... I’m sure if you asked they would tell you, all the specs are freely available on websites
I Web-searched to discover which number AlNiCo is used for speaker magnets, and from what I could gather, it is almost invariably AlNiCo V. Take a gander at this 1945 magazine advertisement: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Jensen_ad_for_Alnico_5_speakers.jpg, as well as those found here: www.jensentone.com/advertisement-archives. Evidently, "If it ain't broke...".
""...and understanding of speaker design is light years ahead of what it was..." Sorry, where the heck did you get this ? Material choice is definitely better but the science is pretty much the same. What has changed in design is that computer modelling has made it faster and easier/better. But the understanding/science is pretty much the same, i.e. Thiele/Small parameters remain the staple of speaker design.
Of course the science is the same, but understanding through computer modelling means no need to prototype hundreds of times in the design stage to get a desired result
Wow, these sound very good, but once again, you're paying big bucks for the ALNICO. These seem to be running $299.00 presently, doing a quick check online.
Well.... Alnico as a material is rare and expensive (which is why Celestion started making Ceramic speakers in the first place) plus they’re all handmade in England in small runs, so that’s where the price increase comes in
@@adamsteelproducer Gotcha. Probably worth the investment in your studio situation. I have two Jensen AlNiCo PR-10s in my early 2000's Fender "Custom" Vibrolux Reverb amp, and they sound very good. So, I hear you. I think I will probably just use the Celestion G12T-75s and 70 Eighty speakers I have now in some other amps/cabs, rather than upgrade to anything of a different ilk. The Celestion G12T-100 sounds very fat to my ears listening to tone tests, might buy one for a Traynor YCV40 combo I have. Also, I see the new Celestion Century Vintage 12 Neo's are pretty affordable at the moment if I want to lighten and jazz up a lighter live rig. Perhaps even the YCV40... TBD, no rush. Thanks for the great videos at any rate!
For me the Celestion Alnico Cream is the clear winner.
It does pop in the mix better but I wonder if it's just how it was mixed
Didn’t change the mix between speakers though!
@@adamsteelproducer is that against the rules? Can't move the mic an inch or the mix police will arrest you?
Depends if you’re trying to do an objective comparison! For a usual circumstance do what you like, but if I’d tried to change mic positions for the subjective “best” tone I’d never hear the end of it
@@adamsteelproducer Just pointing out how silly this all is.
I’ve owned a 2/12 redback cab for 9 months now and in 40 years of playing and owning many different speakers and configurations. The Redback is the best speaker I have ever owned.
I even prefer the Alnico Cream to every combination of speakers. Great sound.
I liked the Alnico Cream...and in 2x12 combo comparison I prefer the Alinco Cream with Vintage 30...
Great review...keep rockin 🤘
Blackvash 23: yes, those are an excellent combo.
That combo was killer, filled out some of the parts I find to be thin in a v30 while still stayed defined.
I am running the Alnico/V30 in an Engl 2x12.
It's brutal!!!
Creamback H/Alnico: Something is missing..hard to describe ;)
Testing g12H30/Alnico .
Nur I am in love with the v30 again as Combo speaker especially.
Alnico Sounds great alone,using the treble boost on the 906 Sennheiser is perfect!
The coolest thing about this setup is now you can get the alnico sound with many amps in a 1x12 or even have a stereo 2x12 and use two 50 watt amps, could even have one g12h75 creamback and one of these and have a vintage delicious sound without two many cabs.
Exactly! Imagine something like a Mesa Mark IV combo with an alnico Sound? Previously unthinkable!
Even for people who are just after vintage tones could use a VOX AC30 (which can put out over 33 watts when cranked), a JTM45 or even a Twin through a 1x12 and get gorgeous vintage tones. I was actually suprised how much I liked the alnico for distorted stuff in this clip, i tend to like alnico for jangly cleans and greenbacks and g12h30s for distorted tone but it sounded great especially blended.
BTW I have played in a stereo setup with Celestion Creams in 2x12 cabs for some time and they were a bit stiff at first but after 15 hours of band practice they mellowed and sounded great. I never really thought they were awesome enough to be that expensive and I reinstalled one G12H30 Anniversary and one Greenback (all well broken in) in each cabinet and I actually think the sound has improved. It's like the Creams were smooth and full but the Greenback/G12H30 setup is more - alive - somehow for the music I'm playing (ZZ TOP Tribute) and the volume levels we play seems to suit the smaller wattage speakers better
Really liked the bright yet not harsh attack of the Alnico Cream. Though, I also liked the fatness of the V30. Killer in-depth video. Thanks for posting! :)
I've never liked the upper mids of V30's. That alnico cream sounds great
Man that alnico cream mixed with the G12k100 sounded really sweet...tightened the low end and the alnico midrange was coming through really nicely
I dug that as well. I'm wondering what the alnico cream mixed with a C-90 aka Black Shadow would sound like in studio or live for that matter. Been looking for 2 speakers to mix in with my mesa cabs also my cabs i use in studio and the alnicos just might be it.
DEFINITELY!! Love the cream w/ anything, but this combo was special.
I spoke just a little too soon with the comment I left on the Redback video just a moment ago. The AlNiCo Cream, like the AlNiCo Blue has got amazing treble extension, but without the harshness in the midrange of the Creambacks. The Redback seems amazingly neutral, almost high fidelity. The Vintage 30 has that definite mid pushed presence. I think of the combinations, I liked the AlNiCo Cream and Redback best, then the Cream and the Vintage 30 second. Really great demo! Now I'm having an ever harder time deciding between the AlNiCo Cream, the Vintage 30, and the Redback. Maybe I need a 3x12 with all three of them! :D
Say, Adam - An excellent comparison! No doubt about it, my clear preference is for the appropriately-named Cream, particularly due to its smoothness, typical of AlNiCo's silken, non-gritty character. What I'd really like to hear now is Celestion's four AlNiCo models-in pairs, if possible, so the Blue can be included as a benchmark, in the configuration most familiar to guitarists. If you currently have access to only single units of any of them, hearing the Blue, Ruby, Gold and Cream "cone-to-cone" would be grand. Cheers!
Alnico Cream, when your speaker costs more than your first Epiphone and Crate amp in 1998. Worth every penny though. Love mine. It tames obnoxious highs without robbing tone.
Wow! Thanks for for that; much needed. I was surprised how much I didn't care for the Alnico Clean...the combos are real ear openers!
The Alnico cream will go beautifully with my DV-77. Cheers, Adam!. 😊
Anything alnico dominates. The blue back in an AC30 omg heaven on earth
Yeah that Cream 90 watt with the Vintage 30 sounds great! I think thats going to be the ones I choose for my 2x12 Marshall cabinet. Now I need to start saving up $500 my wife doesn't see.
the alnico has like a low mids thing going on that sounds just bassy enough without being that flubby bass! sounds great! Im sold lol!
+Janeen Clark right now I'm thinking the same thing- until either I change my mind or Celestion come up with the next level!
Fane Ascension A60
Janeen Clark , absolutely. I've been running Celestion Alnicos exclusively since my first one. You really can't go back once you've played them. You get too spoiled on how awesome they sound when driven by a proper tube amp.
@@adamsteelproducer Have you ever demoed a speaker that isn't a Celestion?
Not yet! I’ve got a Warehouse Reaper ready to go but haven’t got round to it yet
That was GREAT! I really like the combination of the Alnico Cream and the V30.....I think I will do the same in my next cab! Thanks!!
great review thank you, I am getting my dislike of the Vintage 30 confirmed yet again :-) My main speakers are Greenbacks and G12H30 Anniversary, they always end up sounding most natural to my ears.
That Redback is even uglier sounding than the Vintage 30 but the Creamback G12H75 takes the price for sounding absolutely terrible!! I just pulled one out af a cabinet because I didn't like the way it takes overdriven sounds and I can hear why here
I'm disappointed with h75 as well :( It exegarats all unwanted noise of touching, sliding strings while playing. It gives a bad feel... It is not balanced at all. It made me to do some temporary voicing mods to my amplifier, but I'm going back to v30. Then I will think about alnico cream or just single greenback with a simple reactive attenuator resistor/coil network inside a cab to protect the speaker from 65W amp.
Thanks for this I was going to get h75 cream backs, the alnico cream back sounds amazing. Redback is awesome also.
$299 for one ? , does this sound about right ? Great video so much good info, Peace !
Man I wish I’d got here sooner. Been struggling with a new modded JMP I picked up and now I know why. I’ve got a Redback and in the comparison I can see why I’m struggling. It’s all hiss and no growl compared to the V30 and the Alnico Cream and that’s what I’ve been struggling with...
such a useful and informative vid.
Btw what amp where you using?
Currently using red backs. Love these speakers. When the 30’s go to shit when hit with volume, the red back just gets bettter. It’s like a green back with endless headroom.
Like a greenback with endless headroom......so none of the cone breakup that makes the greenback sound great? lol
The breakup making it sound great is a very personal assessment. Why do some guitarists use a full stack? To spread the speaker load on the same output, limiting cone breakup?
Just because it’s something you like, doesn’t mean it’s something everybody likes.
martyfriedman666 I should’ve been more clear. The upper mid range is what makes the greenback great imo. The red back possesses this upper mid that I’ve always loved in the greenback.
Live in a gig situation. The Celestine ALnCo cream 90 is surprisingly amazing.
My amp Line 6 DTX25 combo amp speaker is a:
CELESTION (backback) G12H-90, 12-Inch 90W 8ohm.
My extension speaker cab is a:
CELESTION G12H-75 Creamback, 12-Inch 75W 16ohm guitar speaker. Together they sound as good as any of the many different speakers I’ve used throughout the years.
I also run that extension with a Mesa Recto-verb 25 and it delivers a thicker warmer all tube tone than even my 412 celestion greenies pushed by a vintage Ampeg VT-22 100watt. It sounds that good. The creambacks are excellent for classic rock and darker. Then turn around and get great warm jazz tones.
Alnico with the vintage 30 seems to be the ones I prefer. Thanks !
Gotta say, I actually like the V30 best for the metal tone you're using.
I still think the v30 sits better in the mix for heavy tone. But for cleans the cream back totally wins for me
I have never seen professional studio engineers mic a speaker placing it on the cone. They always offset the the mic center to outer edge. Better tone!
The mic is offset.
Cream all the way.
Yep, 90 watter all the way. The fact that I'm already running this in an extension is clearly coloring my judgement - you could say my judgement is cream-colored (bad-dum tish)
Alnico Cream sounds like a dream...so smooth.
For everything I've heard, I didn't like the cream for a high powered blue replacement....because it kinda of lacks that crang and boxiness and was a bit too smooth....well it seems with gain those non blue characteristics make it amazing, I love alnicos for low gain, never thought I would for high gain but here it slays the rest of them. Three years on I wonder if you could compare all the alnicos now offered.
I have a Gold but I don't like it that much on its own and I'm limited to a 1x12 enclosure. I like the Cream a lot in this video, but I like that Redback too.
Cue Zephyr really?! I've never heard anyone complain that they don't like the cold so that's strange to hear. What don't you like about it?
I like ceramic speakers and alnico pickups. I can always dial in the sound of an alnico when the amp has a ceramic speaker...but it's hard to get the chime and sparkle on the cleans when the amp has an alnico speaker. Alnico speakers are all about that mid hump response you get that overdive thick without relying on pedals. But hey....who doesn't have tons of pedals?
Thanks for this video, the comparisons between other speakers were really useful. Great format.
They are both amazing speakers to be clear
I got both AL90W & V30. Alnico for clean. For dist. V30 (UK made)...
I took off yammering about my crap below instead of adding: the Alnico cream and the vint 30 would be my choices. But...all are great. All a matter of taste. Great demo👍
Great video! I recently bought a Sheriff 22 from Victory (a JTM45 based amp). I coupled to a 1x12 creamback. I love the punchy cleans and clarity, and round midranges. However, I feel like when I move to high gain the top end is too spicky. Do you think that the Alnico Creamback would help in this regard?
Thank you!!
To me this IS something you CAN EQ. When I installed a gold replacing a greenback I was able to cut back highs, presence and response on the amp vs with greenback. Because the Alnico has better response and before I was trying to help the speaker where it lacked. Might just be you need to reEQ for new speaker.
I have 2..... 2x12 cabs, both fitted with a redback and alnico cream 🤘🏻
Great info! I have been shopping speakers for a couple of cabinets and this was all the info I needed. Thank you!
i liked the alnico cream with the g12k the most
You didn't include the G12H-75 in the combination section with the Alnico Cream. :(
+Cody Baggett because I didn't have one that matched the impedance
If you like the Alnico Cream, check out a Tone Tubby GMC. No affiliation.
Underneath, somewhere, drowning under those effects, once was a guitar sound!
Super clear kommen
Fantastic demo. Excellent.
are you really recording in the center of the speakers? it gets really hard and trebly when I do that, I always end up a couple of inches from the edge about an inch inside the speaker
Maybe you’re getting too much treble from the amp to begin with then. I’m not in the center, I’m at the edge of the dust cap
With these work with a lower wattage amp? Like 25w head? Or do you really need a 100w head to push the speaker?
These will work fine with any wattage head, the rating is just a maximum for heat capacity. These are sensitive speakers, they’d be good even with a 1W output section
Awesome thanks
James Murphy , you might as well get the Celestion Gold at that lower wattage. Much better match.
How’s that ‘58 LP special you got online?
I..... don’t have a guitar like that. Where did you get that info from
Alnico Cream + Vintage 30 in a 2x12 combo is very good !
Great sounding speaker. Might not be worth the price upgrade if your amp has tone controls. I feel like the only guitar player that knows how to use tone controls.
I’m pretty sure tone controls and speaker character are nothing alike....
Lol. If only it were that simple.
Speakers are the final filter of your sound and each has their own inherent filtered signature based on their construction, etc. long story short you cant eq what a speaker doesn’t respond to.
Can you do a video comparing the V30 with a Hesu Demon speaker?
+Luke Norman send me a Hesu Demon or get them in contact with me and we'll see!
Yes development has pressed on. But the harmonic richness comes at the expense of an over-saturated bass region. which suits heavy mixes but not so much other genres. The problem with all alnico based speakers is the articulation in the bass region, The transient detail exhibits less clarity, hence makes it more difficult to perceive low level detail and dynamic range. Two variables that are of no importance for higher gain genres but count wherever you need 'depth' to be perceived. So yes, some genres benefit from the progress made but other genres seek a different types of improvements. My point is that it is not easy to generalize and embrace new technology as an universal improvement.
Further, as sound engineer you are obliged to care about pure 'audibility' and the "compression range" a given audio track offers you. The Vintage 30s are easier to compress because they appear to sound more transient, hence offer you more headroom as compared to the pre-compressed alnicos.
In the audio world an increase in dynamic range and everything that comes with it is usually conidered 'progress'. The addition of 'crunch' or 'harmonic distortion' is something that usually originates from 'preamps' which are either to be categorized as transparent or coloring. Their transformers, capacitors and resistors are the main reason we are looking at a clearer audio picture today. which again is something not everybody appreciates. Science does what it always has done, it moves ahead which does not necessarily mean progress. But thanks for your review and point of view !
Fiasco Seven , I couldn't agree less. The headroom before breakup on the Alnico Cream far exceeds the headroom in the Vintage 30. Let's not confuse efficiency with lack of headroom. It's not even close. The transient response of Alnico vs Ceramic is negligible at best. If you have supporting test data that proves otherwise, I'd like the link. Perceived difference in transient response might be some artificial audible byproduct of the Alnico touch responsiveness, or ability to express subtleties that ceramics just cannot. Playing through a good Celestion Alnico, not some generic brand, is a revealing experience akin to removing the proverbial blanket. You lose nothing, and gain clean, pure unadulterated sound. To imply otherwise is preposterous.
vin 30 seems better overall in mix and I like the mix of both best
Wonder what the 1x12 Alnico Cream would sound like in a Dumble style amp…?
Oh my god the Cream absolutely destroys the V30 as far as I’m concerned. Which is perfect because I’ve been looking for an alternative speaker for my Mark IV combo to complement the EVM-12L.
6:03 sweet jesus listen to that chime! Sounds three dimensional compared to the others.
Wich Combo you Like best for Metal/Rock.
Alnico Cream + v30/g12H30/Greenback 25M China or creamback H? 😀
Getting a used alnico two years old for 200€ Euros!
When you were combining speakers at the end was it @ 8 or 16 ohm ?
Celestion Red and G12 both appear to have scooped mids,.... the Vintage 30 a bit less. The Alnico Cream comes off as high fidelity.
2:33
I'm gonna have to disagree hard. Listen, I'm not listening with my wallet, but I got a 78 T1221 that is easily my best speaker. It's a recone, so not original, and I have no idea where they come from, by it wasn't the first recone speaker I've seen with a 1777 recone that is done locally. All I know is that it sounded better than the WGS Green Beret it came attached to, and like a million times better than the modern G12M that was in my Vox. When they were demoed at the electronics outlet A/B, I could EASILY tell which one sounded superior, and when I put it in my Vox, it was like my Vox sounded like I wanted. It pains me to listen to stock G12M's now.
I haven't used a Pulsonic T1221 that's in amazing condition, but I have no doubt that my vintage T1221 is better than any other greenback I've heard. Not saying that some modern materials don't have their own thing going on vs classic paper cones, but I think it's safe to say that just because things have changed doesn't mean they're better.
I’m thinking of replacing my Greenback 1x12 with a Alnico Cream to go with my Friedman Runt 20, my Greenback is a bit too harsh and lacks low end warmth, do you think the alnico cream with warm and smooth my tone up?
Great video’s btw, thanks.
Hey- in my experience the Alnico Cream is very mid-forward with a clear high end. If it’s low warmth you’re after maybe the Redback is the speaker of choice- check out the video we made on that speaker
Hop Pole Studios ok thanks I’ll check it out.
I do like how smooth the cream sounds though.
Thanks
Alnicos seem to love Friedmans. I’m really digging my gold with my BE50 and have a cream on order. Can’t go wrong with a cream.
Sounds amazing. But so expensive.
Awesome video man
great comparison. next time please include clean tone. cheers!
Check out the 6 hour Celestion video if you want clean comparisons! They’re all there
@@adamsteelproducer I just saw it! It was amazing. Thanks 👍
In a 2x12 all of the other speakers subtracted from the Alnico Cream, so 2 Alnico Cream would be best.
try the cream with aG10 gold
Very informative, thank you
Good work lad,,nice and concise in this context...i have a alnico cream back,it never disappoints, your viewers might want to check out the celestion 15" (linebacker ?) Loads of fruity growl...
I’ve got the Fullback, should do a video on that soon!
thanks for your time!!!! this was a great video...I have two alnico cream, and love then so much because I can play in lower volumes with quality! ZERO BEE SOUND....hahahahahaa
Can you fit one of these on a Vox AC30C2 without damage to the amp itself?
Don’t see why not! It’s a 12 inch Celestion speaker, so it should be a straight swap. Is the C2 the 1 or 2 speaker model? Also make sure the impedance you’re switching out is the same as the old speaker
@@adamsteelproducer itnis a voxac30c2 with greenback 30watt with 8 ohm resistance.
I am looking for a speaker with similar tone as the intro of your video that could replace the current ones on my amp :)
Best sounding speaker in this comparison
The music's in the midrange.
Alnico cream CREAMS all the other speakers. There's simply no comparison.
The Cream has so much character. The Vintage 30 just kind of sounds like generic rock at this point.
One other question... A bit late I know, but what amp did you use for the demo?
At this point I’m struggling to remember? But for heavier stuff usually a Peavey 6505, and cleaner and blues stuff a Peavey Windsor
how do these compare to the wonderful Fane Ascencion A90 ?
I don’t know! I might reach out to Fane and see if there’s anything we can do
Ooh my pants! Damn, that is nice!
+monstercadaver I know right? It's replaced the vintage 30 for me most of the time, I just like that extra mid richness, it sits so well in a mix
The voicing of this is unreal, i´ve never heard anything like it. The cut and articulation. Only thing in between me and that speaker is the 300€ price tag, lol.
Thank you for taking the time to reply and for making these awesome videos :)
alnico cream was way more organic wow
Tone Fingerz ...organic. I agree. Great summation.
IR recorded music to my ears sound the same. Tube amps have different character, tone, voice and feel, modelers don't. The sound of this speaker comparison using modelers makes them sound basically the same.
Has anyone compared the different impedances 8 vs 16 ohms in sound?
With Alnico speakers we never know what kind of magnet is used to manufacture them. It's just incomprehensible! When you buy a guitar pickup you always know if it's an Alnico 2, 3, 4, 5 or 8, but unfortunately never for a speaker... why? On the other hand, the Vintage 30 has nothing to do with the sound of Alnico speakers. It just sounds lifeless!
What? Alnico is exactly what it says, the magnet is iron core with AlNiCo, that is to say aluminium, nickel and Cobalt in the alloy. What is there not to know? And with ceramic magnet speakers do you know the exact chemical composition there as well? Perhaps nobody asks because they sound great so why get any more technical than necessary as the layman... I’m sure if you asked they would tell you, all the specs are freely available on websites
I Web-searched to discover which number AlNiCo is used for speaker magnets, and from what I could gather, it is almost invariably AlNiCo V. Take a gander at this 1945 magazine advertisement: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Jensen_ad_for_Alnico_5_speakers.jpg, as well as those found here: www.jensentone.com/advertisement-archives. Evidently, "If it ain't broke...".
""...and understanding of speaker design is light years ahead of what it was..."
Sorry, where the heck did you get this ? Material choice is definitely better but the science is pretty much the same. What has changed in design is that computer modelling has made it faster and easier/better. But the understanding/science is pretty much the same, i.e. Thiele/Small parameters remain the staple of speaker design.
Of course the science is the same, but understanding through computer modelling means no need to prototype hundreds of times in the design stage to get a desired result
What amplifier did you use ??
Good point, it's on some of the other videos - I used a Peavey 6505+
Thanks !! 6505+ is a little thin sounding... But with alnico cream 90w it sounds full, warm, ballsier !!
Yeah, the Redback is really good at making the 6505 sound thick, and combined with the Alnico Cream it’s an amazing combo
@@adamsteelproducer yes it sound good !! Have you make some impulses ?
Very interesting. I liked the Cream Alnico best, and the G12H Redback least. Combined: 2 Cream Alnico best, and Cream Alnico/V30 second best.
The G12H is a lot duller sounding than the rest in this review.
super cream
All the promising explanation...then fuzz. What's the point of demo'ing the speaker if you're hearing over the top distortion?
05:33
05:53
06:30
06:49
Your alnico cream has a hole in it?
Not that I know of...?
@@adamsteelproducer Just looks like theres a hole in the speakers rim on the lower side.
Wow, these sound very good, but once again, you're paying big bucks for the ALNICO. These seem to be running $299.00 presently, doing a quick check online.
Well.... Alnico as a material is rare and expensive (which is why Celestion started making Ceramic speakers in the first place) plus they’re all handmade in England in small runs, so that’s where the price increase comes in
@@adamsteelproducer Gotcha. Probably worth the investment in your studio situation. I have two Jensen AlNiCo PR-10s in my early 2000's Fender "Custom" Vibrolux Reverb amp, and they sound very good. So, I hear you. I think I will probably just use the Celestion G12T-75s and 70 Eighty speakers I have now in some other amps/cabs, rather than upgrade to anything of a different ilk. The Celestion G12T-100 sounds very fat to my ears listening to tone tests, might buy one for a Traynor YCV40 combo I have. Also, I see the new Celestion Century Vintage 12 Neo's are pretty affordable at the moment if I want to lighten and jazz up a lighter live rig. Perhaps even the YCV40... TBD, no rush. Thanks for the great videos at any rate!
Vintage 30 is more 80's style
my ears must be jacked alnico cream and vintage 30 sound the same to me , ugh !
8:46 . 9:00
AlNiCo
5:33
Hearing the spike in the 30 is enough to make you want to get as far away from it as possible. Never ever been a fan.
need some American speakers
Let me when American companies put out speakers this good. So far not so much.